Windows 11 Setup Warns That You Aren't 'Entitled' To Updates On Unsupported PCs (arstechnica.com) 131
An anonymous reader quotes a report from Ars Technica: The Verge has spotted an apparently new warning message in the Windows 11 Setup app that explicitly warns users of the dangers of installing Windows 11 on unsupported hardware -- you may run into "compatibility issues," your PC "won't be entitled to receive updates," and that "damages to your PC due to lack of compatibility aren't covered under the manufacturer warranty." This is all stuff that we've heard from Microsoft before, but it's the first time that this policy has appeared during the Windows 11 setup process rather than in media reports. Once you click through this foreboding warning message, the Windows 11 installation is apparently allowed to proceed.
I've tried and failed to recreate this screen on multiple unsupported Windows 10 systems of different vintages, both with builds downloaded through the Insider program and installs directly from a manually downloaded Windows 11 ISO file. I also haven't seen any firsthand reports of it outside of the Verge report. This doesn't mean it isn't happening -- Microsoft is always rolling out different updates to different groups of people at different times -- just that I can only speculate as to when you will actually see this message and what it means. My guess is that it is eventually intended to replace another screen currently shown when you attempt a manual install of Windows on an unsupported system, one that totally blocks the upgrade if you don't meet Windows 11's processor, TPM, or Secure Boot requirements. The only way to get around that screen and proceed with installation for current builds of Windows 11 is to implement some registry edits that disable the system checks. This new screen would keep the checks in place while allowing people to perform the kind of manual, officially unsupported installs that the company has begrudgingly decided to allow.
I've tried and failed to recreate this screen on multiple unsupported Windows 10 systems of different vintages, both with builds downloaded through the Insider program and installs directly from a manually downloaded Windows 11 ISO file. I also haven't seen any firsthand reports of it outside of the Verge report. This doesn't mean it isn't happening -- Microsoft is always rolling out different updates to different groups of people at different times -- just that I can only speculate as to when you will actually see this message and what it means. My guess is that it is eventually intended to replace another screen currently shown when you attempt a manual install of Windows on an unsupported system, one that totally blocks the upgrade if you don't meet Windows 11's processor, TPM, or Secure Boot requirements. The only way to get around that screen and proceed with installation for current builds of Windows 11 is to implement some registry edits that disable the system checks. This new screen would keep the checks in place while allowing people to perform the kind of manual, officially unsupported installs that the company has begrudgingly decided to allow.
Slashdot has become like broadcast TV (Score:2, Flamebait)
Re: (Score:2)
The editors have given up any pretense of giving a shit and since Dicedot remains profitable (or they'd be unemployed) turning it into Yahoo was obviously the wise corporate move.
Thanks for the warning (Score:4, Insightful)
Comment removed (Score:4, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
With Ubuntu you can go back to the latest LTS version, in the hope that the kernel devs eventually get around to fixing the bug. In general, Linux kernel developers are pretty reluctant to kick stuff out of the kernel. For example, Phoronix wrote in February that the floppy driver got a fix for a long-standing issue: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Linux-Floppy-Driver-In-2021 [phoronix.com].
With Windows and its mandatory updates, you have less leeway to do something equivalent.
Now it is true that
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Agreed.
No one is forcing the upgrade, and no one is blocking the rollback to Win 10 if you don't like it. Somehow, this is controversial.
MS has created an upgrade path that allows users of Win 7, Win 8/8.1, and Win 10 to upgrade to and run Win 11 for free. Somehow, this is controversial.
MS is allowing users to upgrade to/install Win 11 on almost anything they want, but are alerting the user that their installation on older hardware may have issues, and that future fixes or updates may not be supported on yo
Re: (Score:3)
The whole point of running monopoly ware is the idea that it supports everything. Get rid of that and you might as well buy a Mac or run Linux.
Doesn't matter what the Lemming excuses are.
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
It feels silly. At work it's a maintenance nightmare to support all our old hardware, but the customers actually PAY us so we will take their money and support it. Microsoft (and others) seem to think "screw your money and maintenance fees, you must upgrade or go away!" It used to be that you at least pretended that the customer was always right, it's just good business because you don't want to keep as many of your customers as is feasible. But these days i see a lot of companies that just fail to unde
Re: (Score:2)
What are you talking about?
Microsoft offers extended support for a fee - Need to run Win XP for some business reason, MS will take your money and provide security updates to you - but in almost every case, it's cheaper to upgrade than remain on Win XP, but if, for example, you produce medical equipment that can not be upgraded off WinXP MS will sell you bespoke support services.
Win 10 has several more years of support (2024?), no one is being pushed to upgrade, so I don't understand where your "screw your m
Re: (Score:2)
We're supporting some hardware for 20 years. With paid support of course.
Of course (Score:4, Insightful)
And driver problems. And always a special version specific train wreck in store.
Re: (Score:2)
It's Windows after all
It's an OS update. Claiming incompatibilities are introduced with Windows is laughably ignorant.
Re: (Score:2)
It's Windows after all
It's an OS update. Claiming incompatibilities are introduced with Windows is laughably ignorant.
Windows 10 was a disaster with audio drivers. It had a tendency to rename audio drivers to the first driver it found, then name all the others to that, appending a serial number.
Vista dropped support for many existing and working peripherals. I had a group forced to purchase all new printers and scanners after forcing a switch to Vista. No drivers, nor would there be. They had to do this because the suits couldn't be wrong, rather than go back to XP.
Every time an updated OS came out, things were abandon
Re: (Score:2)
A strange story given that Microsoft termed XP support after Vista was taken offline. Then again, one can never underestimate the ability of "IT Directors" to fail at IT and direction.
Re: (Score:2)
Msot IT managers are beholden to Microsoft. Its the old "no one ever got fired for buying IBM" mentality replaced by "no one ever got fired for using Microsoft marketing materials as an IT business plan."
Re: (Score:2)
Msot IT managers are beholden to Microsoft. Its the old "no one ever got fired for buying IBM" mentality replaced by "no one ever got fired for using Microsoft marketing materials as an IT business plan."
It's also job security for them and their people. I wasn't even IT, but I supported our Macs because the "real IT" people were afraid of them. I didn't have much to do in that arena, but ended up getting sucked into Windows support too. They had a frickin' Army of Windows support Techs.
Re: (Score:2)
A strange story given that Microsoft termed XP support after Vista was taken offline. Then again, one can never underestimate the ability of "IT Directors" to fail at IT and direction.
Vista drivers were obsoleting good peripherals from the get-go. It wasn't a support issue. That was a sub-thread of the reason that people stayed on XP long after they should have moved.
And it made them distrust W7, an actual decent OS.
Re: (Score:2)
Yeah, unfortunately the failures of microsoft and hardware makers to adequately support vista did carryover at least to the early days of windows 7. The driver model was the same for most devices, but even hardware well in-support during 2005 often never got a decent vista driver, and by the time 7 arrived the product was EOL.
It would be nice if there was a bit more transparency on driver model changes. More recently there's been elimination of support for drivers from the initial release and ~2017 era in
Re: (Score:2)
More recently there's been elimination of support for drivers from the initial release and ~2017 era in newer windows 10 sub-releases, and I wouldn't be surprised if this impacts some device classes but not others.
And that's just plain bad. This makes it difficult to perform tasks that should be 2 minutes worth of work. Not every solution should require a new computer and new peripherals and new drivers.
Re: (Score:2)
Not just decent fast machines but relatively new machines. I know there are people who think you should dump your computers in the landfill every two years, but seriously most sane companies keep computers at least 5 years, and many keep it longer. Replacing computers is immensely expensive to companies, but on costs of equipment but also employee downtime.
If your PC works well, there is no reason to upgrade it.
Re: (Score:2)
Not just decent fast machines but relatively new machines.
Otherwise known as machines missing modern hardware expected of any computer sold in the past 5 years.
I know there are people who think you should dump your computers in the landfill every two years
Windows 10 support will continue through to 2025. Your computer will likely end up in the landfill after 10 years anyway.
I suspect you are a millennial or you may remember a time where an upgrade for Windows came almost exclusively with a new PC purchase. Instead your post smells of the usual entitled whining. How *DARE* they not support your old hardware with their new OS. Who do they think they are! I wan
Re: (Score:2)
Not just decent fast machines but relatively new machines. I know there are people who think you should dump your computers in the landfill every two years, but seriously most sane companies keep computers at least 5 years, and many keep it longer. Replacing computers is immensely expensive to companies, but on costs of equipment but also employee downtime.
If your PC works well, there is no reason to upgrade it.
I have a three year old i5 HP Envy with touchscreen that fell off the W11 cliff. Which is nuts.
I'm not buying a new Windows machine to replace a machine that was heading towards 1K after only 3 years.
I determine computer costs by total use price. 300 bucks a year is outlandish.
BTW, my Macs cost a bit more. But they don't fall off the OS update cliff so soon. My last one lasted 10 years at 2K which is, shall we say - quite a bit cheaper.
Re: (Score:2)
Windows 10 was a disaster with audio drivers.
So was when Mac introduced the MIDI panel. So was Linux when it upgraded to Pulse Audio. To a degree, so was Android when it split audio paths into different endpoints.
Vista dropped support for many existing and working peripherals.
Indeed. Many OSes have. Including Mac and Linux itself. The only difference is time. As for "dropping support" Windows didn't actually drop anything. Vendors did (same applies to other OSes too). There's no reason your 90s era piece of hardware can't work right now on Vista or 10. You just need to talk to the manufacturer. You said it yoursel
Re: (Score:2)
Anyway, regarding to compatibility with old systems Windows has most of the time been better than MacOS (which has always required pretty recent hardware to run the latest version). Linux? Yeah, it's great at
Re: (Score:2)
MacOS is pretty good in this regard. The latest Bug Sur works just fine on a MacBook Pro 2015, and claims to work on the late 2013 models as well.
Re: (Score:2)
MacOS is pretty good in this regard. The latest Bug Sur works just fine on a MacBook Pro 2015, and claims to work on the late 2013 models as well.
The cutoff is mid 2011. That's not too bad a support length. I do have a core 2 duo (talk about old) 27 inch iMac that was too nice to toss, but a pain to keep on MacOS. So I turned it into a Linux machine. Works a trick.
Re:Of course (Score:4, Informative)
This is not a praise of Windows by any means -- but have you actually seen a "not supported" driver problem on Windows?
Yes, tons. And it's frequently for something that has no reason to not work like a printer or scanner that speaks a protocol that is supported by drivers which do work on Windows, but the driver has actually not only not been instructed to work with it, but literally been instructed not to support it. I've gotten several printers and scanners this way cheap from windows users who upgraded to a new PC with new windows and found that their existing stuff won't work with it.
Windows not only has the same driver problems as Linux, it has special problems caused by unbounded capitalism.
Re: (Score:2)
In 90%+ of those cases it is a matter of the manufacturer of the printer/scanner/etc. not writing new drivers for a new version of Windows. I guess Microsoft could purchase every printer and scanner on the market and hack together their own drivers though.
Re: (Score:2)
In 90%+ of those cases it is a matter of the manufacturer of the printer/scanner/etc. not writing new drivers for a new version of Windows. I guess Microsoft could purchase every printer and scanner on the market and hack together their own drivers though.
Apple does. I don't know if they buy the machines, but they write their own drivers.
Bad? Good? Well, the drivers for Windows are all over the place. Apple's have a consistency.
Re: (Score:2)
Apple's have a consistentency because they control both the hardware and software. Microsoft don't.
Which by the way is a solid reason to buy Apples. I like consistency. Consistency allows me to concentrate on my work, not fussing with the computer.
Some years back the Windows guys and gals would brag about how they had w huge choice of cards and hardware to use on their Windows machines.
Now they use that as an excuse for why they have problems.
Re: (Score:3)
I have an HP Laserjet 2100tn printer. It's a great printer, but it's pretty old (1998). It worked just fine with Windows 10 at first, then Microsoft took away that driver for no apparent reason.
You know the dialog where you select a manufacturer and printer model? There's a button on there that will update the list from Windows Update. A few years ago, in Windows 10 that list included both a PCL5 and PCL6 driver for the HP Laserjet 2100. They just randomly decided to take it away. I had around ten
Re: (Score:2)
I have an HP Laserjet 2100tn printer. It's a great printer, but it's pretty old (1998).
If you bought that printer on the same day a child was born, that child would likely be a senior in college today - it's an old printer.
A printer made in 1998 is 23 years old - it's great that it still works - but at some point soon it may make sense to contemplate a new printer.
I just replaced our personal workhorse printer, a Dell 3115 all-in-one/multi-function workgroup printer I bought at a university surplus sale. We ran it for 9 years, but the toner started leaking/smearing on the pages. I found a gr
Re: (Score:2)
Your HP Laserjet 2100tn is supported by the HP Universal Printer Driver
Thanks for that. I'll give it a try later.
at some point soon it may make sense to contemplate a new printer.
I did try to replace that printer about 10 years ago. The new printer was significantly faster and less prone to jamming during large jobs. Sounds great, right?
There was an outright rebellion. Apparently, no one really liked the way photos came out when their job included them. (I think it was the dithering it used. I remember it looking like Bayer ordered.) This lead to a general discontent with the new printer, then outright hatred. I put the 2100 back in ser
Re: (Score:2)
If anyone else wants their HP Laserjet 2100tn printer to keep working, I've found that it works fine with the HP Laserjet 3050 PCL5 driver.
Your Laserjet 2100tn speaks PCL5 and if you have the proper DIMM installed, PostScript. And probably at least one more language. I forget because I got rid of mine :) So all you need is a proper PPD and a generic driver. This is a great reason to only buy printers with standard interfaces, especially if you are going to run Windows.
Re: (Score:2)
Windows has Generic Printer Drivers that will support older printers, maybe the software won't support every feature of a particular printer, but if your printer supports postscript or other popular page definition languages.
Re: (Score:2)
In 90%+ of those cases it is a matter of the manufacturer of the printer/scanner/etc. not writing new drivers for a new version of Windows.
In only a small percentage of cases is that the actual problem. In most cases (and in the vast majority of cases when it comes to scanners and printers) it's the manufacturer deliberately choosing not to support the old hardware even though the new driver could support it because the new hardware speaks the same protocol as the old hardware. In fact, sometimes the new hardware is just a cost-reduced version of the old hardware, but in a new case.
In many cases the old driver would actually work, but they als
Re: (Score:2)
It's Windows after all, Every new release is loaded with incompatibilities. And driver problems.
Cue the "Year of Linux Desktop is finally here".
Make no mistake - I could care less about adoption rate. I think that's just a meme to trigger Windows users.
It's not like Linux where if you carefully research whether the hardware is supported and/or recompile the kernel to get it to work (for example, WiFi cards), then drivers are just perfect.
When was the last time you installed Linux on anything? The last time I had a driver problem was over a decade ago.I've installed it on dozens of different brands and models.
But if you want to, we can talk about how badly Windows 1.0 stinks! 8^)
This is not a praise of Windows by any means -- but have you actually seen a "not supported" driver problem on Windows?
Yes, I have. I was doing a number of dual boot laptop computers. Windows 10 and Ubuntu Mint. One of the requirements was a USB to RS232 adapter on each.
I
Re: (Score:2)
That's the thing about Linux. It's go out and load the driver aspect means that older drivers of competent equipment don't just go away. They stay in the repo, for people to get as they need.
Your example assumes the driver was written for linux - there is a lot of older hardware that never had a Linux driver, one popular example was scanners, another were the so-called "win printers" that relied on the connected PC to render the page for the printer. At one time, they were ubiquitous, not so any more.
Your serial adapter issue coincides with shifts in the electronic component market - Prolific chips were so popular that clones were being sold to OEMs, who put clone parts in their devices, once P
Re: (Score:2)
When was the last time you installed Linux on anything?
Maybe ~6 years ago. Not recently, but much less than 10 years. I got a Dell server and tried to get external WiFi card to work on a couple of flavors of Linux. Went through a bunch of discussion forums, from research it seemed like this card was a supported model, followed instructions to recompile the kernel (possibly not correctly) and gave up on WiFi working on Linux.
Yes, I have.
I guess both experiences are possible and that's why there is disagreement. Personally, I have never seen Windows outright not support a de
Re: (Score:2)
When was the last time you installed Linux on anything?
Maybe ~6 years ago. Not recently, but much less than 10 years. I got a Dell server and tried to get external WiFi card to work on a couple of flavors of Linux. Went through a bunch of discussion forums, from research it seemed like this card was a supported model, followed instructions to recompile the kernel (possibly not correctly) and gave up on WiFi working on Linux.
Did you possibly do the install without internet access? Since you mentioned the wifi card. That can make for a problem.
Re: (Score:2)
You had to use an older driver - at one point the Prolific driver was modified to detect clone chips and not support them. (Many Mfg were unaware they used clone chips.)
Re: (Score:2)
This was before the shift from prolific to FTDI chips, so a really competent adapter was abandoned - drivers on Linux, nothing on Windows. They had to get me all new adapters to replace working adapters.
I vaguely remember getting an old "staples" serial adaptors working on Windows but there was a trick to it. You had to force it for the hardware or change an inf or something from some other package.
Interesting - I did not know about that.
Re: (Score:3)
Linux has generic chip-level drivers, one for prolific and one for FTDI, if Linux can detect the chip in use, there's no need for a vendor-specific driver.
Re: (Score:2)
Linux has generic chip-level drivers, one for prolific and one for FTDI, if Linux can detect the chip in use, there's no need for a vendor-specific driver.
This was before that. And I have had no trouble with either Prolific or FTDI chip.
Now there were some pirated Prolific chips out there, which was what caused Windows and MacOS to abandon them. But that was a few years after my experience.
Now when I place a USB-Serial adapter, I use terminal to get the Vendor and product number. and set it up that way.
Now this might be a Linuxy attitude on my part, but if a working non-pirated Prolific chip will still work, there's no reason to abandon the drivers
Re: (Score:2)
Translation:
I have this one edge cast where I tried to install windows on a computer with an obsolete adapter that I got out of the bargin bin
You gonna have to stop right there, sissy spineless coward. I answered the specific question asked. I was given the adapters to implement a customer's needs, and they would work on the linux side, not the Windows side.
I provided an example as asked. If you want more, go to the Vista debacle with lotsa peripherals that were obsoleted overnight. Now go away, child, let the adults talk.
Old PC's can't handle being one louder (Score:2)
Sounds reasonable? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
I have zero issues with any software vendor clearly and upfront declaring supported hardware and following "you are on your own" with anything else.
Bullshit. It's none of MS's business what you're running it on, if you can get it to run. You paid money for Windows, and that includes updates unless MS are offering you a discount.
Re: (Score:2)
Bullshit. It's none of MS's business what you're running it on, if you can get it to run. You paid money for Windows,
If you PURCHASED windows 11 for your old PC and it doesn't work, microsoft can and should tell you fuck off. If it 'just works' or you can get it working that's fine. Fill your boots. But don't call them if it doesn't work and expect to be told anything other than to buy new hardware if you want support.
and that includes updates unless MS are offering you a discount.
You mean like a 100% discount?
If you claimed a FREE upgrade from windows 10 to windows 11 for hardware they said wasn't supported, you've got even LESS of leg to stand on if it doesn't work. Again, if it 'j
Re: (Score:2)
I tried telling paying customers to fuck off, and boy did they and their lawyers get mad. Even had my CEO come down and have some stern words with me. I told him to fuck off too, so here I am able to post on Slashdot 24/7!
Re: (Score:2)
Your paying customers got their lawyers after you for refusing to support them after they bought your product and belligerently insisted on deploying it in a way you indicated up front was unsupported, and that you told them you would not support them if they did it, they then ignored the advice and did it anyway.
I expect the customers lawyers told him that he had no winnable case, and that he would lose, but it makes sense that he told them to go after you anyway. He's already demonstrated he doesn't liste
Re: (Score:2)
> But why exactly should anyone be on the the hook for support for a free upgrade you installed on something they said wasn't supported in the first place?
Microsoft told everybody that Windows 10 was going to be the last version of Windows, and that it was going to be a rolling upgrade, and that there would be no versions after Windows 10. This enticed certain people to purchase Windows 10. At some point they will stop supporting Windows 10 now that they have changed their mind and are doing a Windows 11
Re: (Score:2)
Suppose that Windows 11 were simply named windows 10, 21H2 instead. Getting into an argument fixating on the "10" vs "11" is a distraction.
The deployment and acquisition method is pretty much exactly the same, as any of the other major releases, and its free to anywone with windows 10. So its just another rolling release of windows, albeit they called it '11' instead of "10 21H2" because: marketing.
Do you accept that?
Moving on, and setting aside the irrelevant name change:
Firstly, each rolling release has A
Re: (Score:2)
Here's the thing. If you purchased Windows 11, then you bought a license to Windows 11 which includes support and updates until 10 years in the future.
If your computer meets the requirements of Windows 11 an
Re: (Score:2)
Bullshit. It's none of MS's business what you're running it on, if you can get it to run. You paid money for Windows,
If you PURCHASED windows 11 for your old PC and it doesn't work, microsoft can and should tell you fuck off. If it 'just works' or you can get it working that's fine. Fill your boots. But don't call them if it doesn't work and expect to be told anything other than to buy new hardware if you want support.
That's fine and right etc. What we're talking about is running it successfully on 11-year-old hardware and then not being given the updates you've paid the same amount for as everyone else.
You mean like a 100% discount?
If you claimed a FREE upgrade from windows 10 to windows 11 for hardware they said wasn't supported, you've got even LESS of leg to stand on if it doesn't work.
MS doesn't give anything away for free. But, regardless, this conversation is predicated on it already working. You are having a different argument with the voices in your head.
Re: (Score:2)
What we're talking about is running it successfully on 11-year-old hardware and then not being given the updates you've paid the same amount for as everyone else.
You were told up front it wasn't supported on that hardware, and you correct that short coming you can have the updates you paid for.
A company i work with sells a product. The price includes updates, remote installation, and remote support.
But its supported on Windows versions that are actively supported by microsoft, and we don't expend resources supporting EOL operating systems. We used to support Windows 7, but stopped when it went EOL. Today, customers who installed it on 7 originally may still have it
Re: (Score:2)
They can have their updates, but its up to them to provide a system that can run them.
They can opt not to, but then they're on their own.
I see a similar deal with Microsoft.
No. MS is saying that they can't have the updates at all. Why is this hard to follow?
Re: (Score:2)
No. MS is saying that they can't have the updates at all.
They can have the updates after they provision a supported PC to run them.
Same as the company I described that will provide updates and support after you provision a supported PC.
Why is this hard to follow?
Indeed!
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Bullshit. It's none of MS's business what you're running it on, if you can get it to run.
Indeed. It's none of MS's business if you have problems either. You're on your own.
Re: (Score:2)
I have zero issues with any software vendor clearly and upfront declaring supported hardware and following "you are on your own" with anything else.
Bullshit. It's none of MS's business what you're running it on, if you can get it to run. You paid money for Windows, and that includes updates unless MS are offering you a discount.
Why do you think MS "cares" what you run it on? They are saying "Just because it will run on your 10 year-old computer, don't come looking for help if there's a problem - we're telling you it is unsupported."
You can not buy Win 11, it is not for sale, and it has not been released in final form yet.
Win 10 will be supported until 2024, no one is being forced to upgrade as long as Win 10 is supported.
That you bought a computer back in 2010 that ran Win 7 does not obligate MS to support that hardware on every s
Re: (Score:2)
Why do you think MS "cares" what you run it on? They are saying "Just because it will run on your 10 year-old computer, don't come looking for help if there's a problem - we're telling you it is unsupported."
You can not buy Win 11, it is not for sale, and it has not been released in final form yet.
Win 10 will be supported until 2024, no one is being forced to upgrade as long as Win 10 is supported.
That you bought a computer back in 2010 that ran Win 7 does not obligate MS to support that hardware on every subsequent update/major release of WIndows into the future.
Win 11 has well-publicized system requirements, any system that doesn't meet the stated requirements is classified "unsupported" and your problem with that is what, exactly? For comparison, Apple macOS only supports hardware of a more recent vintage, enforcing hard-stops when an install on an unsupported system is attempted, they don't enable installation on unsupported hardware at all - MS is allowing the install, but saying you're installation is "unsupported". It's what may Apple OS X/macOS users wish Apple would do for their older hardware.
Try reading the actual message from MS. It says that you will not be entitled to updates if they don't officially support the hardware even if you get Windows to install. This has nothing to do with "obligat[ing] MS to support that hardware" AT ALL.
This is not about getting support with installing the damn thing on your ancient hardware, it's about MS saying that they are going to block updates even if the OS is actually working fine, just because it's not on the official list
That's not their call to make.
Windows (Score:3)
C'mon, Microsoft has cranked out a shitty OS just about every other time they release one. Win7 and Win10 were reasonable, so they are definitely due to crank out a crapper. I'm steering clear of Windows 11 for a good long while if not forever. Never touched Vista or 8.
Re: (Score:2)
Many people say that windows 8 is good once you work around the fact that it ships with a shit interface... I haven't touched it either. haven't even seen it actually. I did try win10 on a laptop briefly though... what fucking garbage that is.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Yes, I liked Windows 8.1. Despite the hate for the UI, overall it improved in a lot of ways. For the exact same machine, it was faster and used less memory than Windows 7. Even the full boot (not the hybrid suspend fast-boot that is the default) was faster than a Windows 7 boot, so they really made some good efforts at cleaning that up.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
I suppose I consider the Server OSs separately since most people don't run those as a Desktop.
If we consider that Windows 95 started the evolution away from DOS:
95 (meh, okay at the time), 98 (decent), ME (junk), XP (decent), Vista (junk), 7 (decent), 8 (junk), 10 (decent for its stability and driver inclusion)
11 is bound to be a dog. Certainly, stupid policies will help. Really they just need to make a trimmed down version that will run on anything - if you want/need to punish yourself with old hardware f
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Windows 95 had stability issues. It was a revolution but it was messy. I can remember once installing Windows 95 from 25 floppies, it was painful. 98 was more stable.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
OMG Shock! (Score:2)
This is outrageous, we all know other companies support updates on unsupported hardware /sarcasm.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Having an OS preinstalled doesn't make one dependent. I have yet to find a machine I haven't been able to install Linux on, that includes my Surface Pro 3 which would be running Linux right now if it didn't have absolutely shit touch support.
Most people aren't "dependent" on Microsoft. They chose to use it because they are familiar with it and it works for them.
Also what does support have to do with dependency? Please tell me that alternative you propose who will offer me support and updates on unsupported
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Why limit yourself to a box store? That's cherry picking isn't it? I mean you can buy machines with Linux preinstalled from Acer, Dell and HP, you can also go to any SI and get a PC without an OS installed and install what you want.
Is a box store somehow magically the only place that sells computers for you? If so you have far bigger problems than Windows.
Bring choice into the marketplace. (Score:2)
Time for competition (Score:2)
The time seems to be ripe for a commercial competitor that runs on the same hardware as Windows. Not Linux, but a product with a real company behind it, not Red Hat.
Re: (Score:2)
Are you hoping someone will resurrect BeOS [operating-system.org]?
Re: (Score:3)
You mean like OS/2, aka "half an operating system"?
Windows isn't popular because it's a good operating system -- leaving aside whether or not it actually is, that's not why people flock to it. It's because of all the software written for it (games for most people, but that's not the only thing), much of it exclusive to the platform. There may be equivalents in other OSes, but do they use the same data format? Will people run into some crucial restriction like virtual instruments that are hard coded to run o
Not entitled? (Score:2)
If someone is not entitled to receive updates because their system is more than five minutes old, Microsoft is not entitled to sucking up the person's personal information.
Re: (Score:2)
Your comment has nothing to do with this article (I know, "Welcome to /.!")...
Win 11 is a free update available to Win 10 users (even those that upgraded to Win 10 from Win 7 or Win 8/8.1). This article announces that MS is letting people install the free Win 11 Upgrade on unsupported equipment, MS is simply warning the user that their installation is "unsupported" and that future updates and patches may not be available to fix issues that may arise.
Win 10 is supported thru 2024, Win 11 hasn't even been off
Good old MicroCrap, always a problem (Score:2)
Never a solution. Good to see you can still depend on some things!
Great, no more hoops to jump through (Score:3)
I prefer no updates anyway. Rebooting my PC in my absence and closing all applications (whether data is saved or not) should have sparked major outrage but apparently Microsoft can get away anything these days. Would be using Linux if I hadn't been able to turn that shit off.
people will not care (Score:2)
For the ave home users of W11, this will just be another screen to ignore. Unless they are prompted 10 times a day, they will say "Just ignore the screen"
They have been trained by MS to ignore popups when they are prompted by the "Allow access" warnings, which is just ignore. Will be no different to them
Geeks don't need to care and plebs won't anyway. (Score:2)
Enthusiasts will remain effectively undisturbed, a few vocal niche whingers (as always) excepted and those may be ignored.
W10 EOLs in 2025 which is ample time for anyone wanting a workaround to manage it.
There will be no mass switch to Linux because everyone with a use case for Linux already self-selected and runs it.
The rest actively dislike anything not Windows and can run without updates (common and of no real importance outside businesses who can afford new hardware anyway) which despite all the autsper
Warranty? What warranty? (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Bill is still an employee of Microsoft, as a "Technical Advisor". I don't know about his latest vaccine involvements, but so far all "gratis" drugs he granted to african countries had a pretty nasty string attached: they were contingent on enacting a law to forbid local drug production that could possibly compete with US patents. The amounts granted were also calculated by US retail prices, which are orders of magnitude worse than actual costs of making them.
So tracking chips in vaccines or not, I'd recom
Re: (Score:2)
Bill is still an employee of Microsoft, as a "Technical Advisor". I don't know about his latest vaccine involvements, but so far all "gratis" drugs he granted to african countries had a pretty nasty string attached: they were contingent on enacting a law to forbid local drug production that could possibly compete with US patents.
Wow, imagine that - "forcing" third-world countries to honor patents on US drugs. Are we really expecting Sierra Leone to build world-class pharma factories to produce knock-offs of patented medicines?
The amounts granted were also calculated by US retail prices, which are orders of magnitude worse than actual costs of making them.
So what, do you understand what you wrote? They give free medicines to third-world countries and want credit for the "US retail price" of the medicines they gave away? So what? They want to claim they gave Sierra Leone $45 Million US worth of anti-malarial and HIV/AIDS treatments. What does the cost of product
Re: (Score:2)
You mean, there's any upside for a person who's not a shareholder of the relevant company to evergreening medical patents?
And the "US retail price" is usually massively higher than that in civilized countries (UE, Canada, ...) even for stuff from the same company. So Gates could have bought the very same drug in a country in the US, and thus ship tens or hundreds more doses for the same price -- if he didn't have an agenda. Or, if he really cared about helping people in Africa rather than his golf buddies
Re: (Score:2)
They aren't stopping you from doing what you want with your computer. All they are doing is letting you know that if you want to install Windows 11 on your computer that you accept the responsibility that it may not be updated. As the summary states, the warning doesn't stop you from installing Windows 11 it just informs you that you may not get updates.
Microsoft isn't giving you permission to do anything just informing you what the consequences of your actions will be.
Are you equally upset with Apple becau
Re: (Score:2)
The platform that is supposed to "support everything" is trying to treat you like a Linux user.
Re: (Score:2)
You're the kind of guy that likes to fuck hookers without a condom.
No I am the kind of guy that doesn't fuck hookers (with or without a condom). Just like I am the kind of guy that doesn't install Windows on an unsupported computer without accepting the consequences.
No one is forcing you to install Windows 11 on your computer (Windows 7, 8 or 10 will most likely run just fine if you HAVE to have Windows).
I'm confused what does that have to do with Microsoft letting you roam free on the internet without protection?
What that has to do is that AC was complaining that Microsoft wasn't allowing them to "do what i want with it" (it being their computer). Well guess what Apple doesn't all
Re: (Score:2)
If no-one fucks hookers, then why is it a rather profitable business? Granted, it is also filled with unsavory characters that have no problem hurting others to make them make bank.
Wait, that sounds like how most businesses operate in the U.S.
At least Microsoft is now warning you during installation. Some might see that as a kindness. I would rather see this as creating a valid loophole in Microsoft's future legal defense fights. If the user is clearly warned during installation, it is more or less his/her
Re: (Score:2)
it's your computer, you're free to run different software on it. you're even free to run unsupported, buggy, and easily exploited software on YOUR computer.
if you're running a business, then the decision on what is appropriate becomes more complex than simple personal taste.
Re: (Score:2)
You have no idea what you're talking about (I know, "Welcome to /.!").
Win 10 has 3 more years of support, Win 11 is only available as a free, "pre-release" upgrade, no one is "required" to upgrade.
MS simply said they have clearly-stated System Requirements, and any install that doesn't meet their System Requirements is considered "unsupported" and alerts the user to that reality when Win 11 is installed.
People with systems that don't meet Win 11 System Requirements should remain on Win 10 thru 2024 - choosi
Re: (Score:2)