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Microsoft Chrome Windows

Microsoft's New Windows Prompts Try To Stop People Downloading Chrome (theverge.com) 224

Posted by msmash from the new-lows dept.
Microsoft has never been a fan of Windows users downloading Chrome instead of using Edge, but the company has now stepped up its campaign to keep people using its built-in browser. From a report: Windows 10 and Windows 11 have both started displaying new prompts when people navigate to the Chrome download page, in an effort to discourage people from installing Google's rival browser. These new prompts, spotted by Neowin, include messages like:

"Microsoft Edge runs on the same technology as Chrome, with the added trust of Microsoft."
"That browser is so 2008! Do you know what's new? Microsoft Edge."
"'I hate saving money,' said no one ever. Microsoft Edge is the best browser for online shopping."
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Microsoft's New Windows Prompts Try To Stop People Downloading Chrome More

Microsoft's New Windows Prompts Try To Stop People Downloading Chrome

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  • Easy solution (Score:5, Insightful)

    by CaptAubrey ( 6299102 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @10:45AM (#62039327)

    Don't use Windows. I gave up on that crap software 3 years ago.

    • I gave up on it around 2005. Windows 2000 was the last real good Windows OS as far as I can tell. XP/Vista ushered in the DRM/Trusted computing area, also the OS became dumbed down for non-techie people and they started really using it as means of foisting other MS products onto end users.
      • It was pretty obvious when Mickeysoft made the conscious decision to never show any useful error messages. "Error #324f2a38bc". WTF does that mean? (Obviously that was random.) Hell, their own XBox software for Windows can't find an external drive.

      • Re:Easy solution (Score:5, Insightful)

        by LVSlushdat ( 854194 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @11:26AM (#62039565)

        AND, don't forget, stealing your data, and hiding behind a 1000 page EULA that NOBODY reads. But if you DO read it, you'd run screaming.. A friend of mine who is a lawyer, read the whole thing and his comment after finishing? RUN.. RUN FAST.. ANYTHING BESIDES WINDOWS.. His law office is now on Linux with ONE system on a heavily castrated Windows for things that Linux/Wine doesn't do well.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by Rhipf ( 525263 )

          And how much commercial software does this lawyer friend of yours use?
          Has he/she read the EULA for each of those as well?
          I'm sure if a lawyer were to fully read most of the EULA out there there would be reasons for them to conclude "RUN.. RUN FAST.. ANYTHING BESIDES..."

          • Re:Easy solution (Score:4, Interesting)

            by kbonin ( 58917 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @02:42PM (#62040533)
            (sigh) The Windows EULA gives them permission to scan your network, read your files on your systems and any file shares accessible to them, upload anything they learn or want to examine up to their systems, delete anything they want from your systems with no warning or notice, and upload telemetry whose scope can include every button you press on your keyboard and URL you ever click on. Anyone approving the Windows EULA is foolishly presuming it doesn't mean exactly what it says.

        • Re:Easy solution (Score:5, Interesting)

          by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @11:49AM (#62039681) Homepage Journal

          Did your lawyer friend happen to mention exactly what spooked him? Would be interesting to know the specific issues because presumably all law firms are affected.

          FWIW the EULA is here: https://www.microsoft.com/en-u... [microsoft.com]

          It's not quite 1000 pages, but it is around 5,800 words and judged by various online tools to require college level education to fully understand.

          I'm wondering if there might be a GDPR complaint in here. I can't really make one because the UK regulator is useless and we are out of the EU now, but on the face of it I'd say that the telemetry stuff fails to meet the "informed consent" standard because it's unintelligible and not specific enough.

        • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

          by fahrbot-bot ( 874524 )

          ... with ONE system on a heavily castrated Windows ...

          So you switched it from a mechanical (ball) mouse to an optical mouse? :-)

      • I stopped using Windows with Windows 3.11, I had used Linux, Solaris, Mac OS X, back to Linux with some stints with Free and OpenBSD. For the past Decade I had mostly been on Windows ( I do tinker around with the new Linux distros to keep up from time to time )

        It isn't due to any sort of Love for Microsoft, or my inability to do what I do in Linux. But just due to the fact Microsoft has been offering free as in no extra money from me upgrades for a while, Windows has been running very stable for a while

      • Windows 2000 was the last real good Windows OS as far as I can tell.

        Absolutely. Once Microsoft got their act together and fixed the issues with six updates (yes, that is both snarky and serious). Never had a problem with 2K. It just worked and allowed one to work without getting in the way.

        I recently converted to Mint and have no issues with it so can't see myself going back to Windows except while I'm at work.
      • I miss Win2000 as well. I held on to that OS till I had too many things no longer supported/able to run on it. Windows jumped the shark with XP...

    • Re:Easy solution (Score:4, Funny)

      by Ostracus ( 1354233 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @10:49AM (#62039353) Journal

      Ah, an Apple user. I recognize the personality anywhere.

    • Don't use Windows. I gave up on that crap software 3 years ago.

      If it wasn't for Windows being the better desktop platform for games, we could easily consider the other platforms.

      For software development and deployment I am happy to keep to my Mac desktop + Linux server combo. Apple has their walled garden on their 'i' devices, but the desktop is still open.

      • Re:Easy solution (Score:5, Interesting)

        by sarren1901 ( 5415506 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @11:47AM (#62039669)

        You may be amazed at how many games on Steam run on Linux natively, no wine installation required. I'm sure if you wanted the latest AAA game, then you would still be stuck on a console or Windows, but there is a LOT of great games you can buy from Steam that work on Windows flawlessly.

        I've been dabbling with Linux since the mid 90s but since I was addicted to gaming on Windows, it was nearly impossible to switch outside of dual booting. I hate to admit it but it wasn't until they EOLed Win7 that I decided I was done.

        Ironically, what really forced me over the edge in a fit of anger was MS itself. I had downloaded the latest updates but wasn't ready to restart the computer to apply them. I then decided to use the built in disk clean up tools to try and free up some space. Apparently, the updates were flagged as temporary and unneeded. Windows deletes these updates as part of this effort.

        I restart the computer later and the next time it goes to boot, gets stuck permanently at just before the login screen. Decided instead of wasting time rebuilding my Windows environment I would just shift over to Linux.

        Definitely made easier by the fact that I don't play brand new games anymore. Then I realized just how many options were on Steam and never looked back.

        Also it was made easier by the fact that I already ran the Mozilla suite and open office. Using applications that run on multiply platforms definitely makes the platform less important.

        • Re: (Score:3)

          by lsllll ( 830002 )

          My fit of rage moment came around 2001 when I kept receiving threatening letters stating the Microsoft was giving all users who had pirated their software time to legally purchase licenses before coming and suing them. I was legal with my copy of Windows NT Server 4.0 and SQL server for my business as well as my workstations and MS Office, but the letters kept annoying the shit out of me. So I decided to convert my desktop and server to Linux (tried many flavors over the years) and have ran free software

    • As soon as someone ports a real CAD package I'll switch.

      • Out of [genuine] curiosity, what's missing from available options? Or would the list of what's not missing be shorter?

    • Frankly, it's just such a clunky mess these days. Apart from all the nags all the time and the fact that if you turn the fucking off for a week, you come back and there 20 updates that need to be applied, it's just become terrible. The UI workflow is bad.

      I actually pine for the days of Windows 2000. That was peak Windows. A clean and simple UI, very responsive and predictable. I've abandoned Windows for personal use. I have a Mac and I use a Pi as a test bed server. I have an old dual quad-core Dell Xeon se

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by thegarbz ( 1787294 )

      Don't use Windows. I gave up on that crap software 3 years ago.

      Even easier solution: Just ignore it. It takes literally 1 second to ignore the prompt. If I had to add up all the prompts or things to ignore over the past decade from Windows it would still collectively be less time than it takes to install a Linux distro, let alone get proficient at it, find alternatives for all software etc.

      Your "easy solution" is actually incredibly time consuming and onerous. Good on you (and me, I also run Linux on several desktops), but most people have better things to do.

  • What about firefox? (Score:3)

    by ickleberry ( 864871 ) <web@pineapple.vg> on Thursday December 02, 2021 @10:49AM (#62039355) Homepage
    Does it have any nag screen before you install that?

    • Chrome has a severe problem in that it's being pushed on unsuspecting people and installed too easily. I often have to uninstall Chrome from my mom's computer, because a lot of products are "bundled" with Chrome and when you're accustomed to click "yes" whenever there's a popup, Chrome is installed. Antivirus packages do this, IT and malware scammers use Chrome. Just having a popup that says "are you sure you want this, it's not your default browser?" would be helpful.

      I don't think Chrome is a bad browse

      • I should add that I've seen Chrome installed by default with anti-malware, so that you have to know how to opt out of it with a tiny checkbox that's easy to overlook. And I have overlooked this myself in the past.

  • HAHAHA (Score:5, Funny)

    by waspleg ( 316038 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @10:52AM (#62039371) Journal

    "Microsoft Edge runs on the same technology as Chrome, with the added trust of Microsoft."

    Holy shit! Is it April already?

  • Saving money (Score:5, Insightful)

    by mwvdlee ( 775178 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @10:52AM (#62039373) Homepage

    "'I hate saving money,' said no one ever. Microsoft Edge is the best browser for online shopping."

    Edge is a browser that comes bundled with a $100+ operating system.
    So.... what's the best way to save money?

  • with the added trust of Microsoft (Score:5, Informative)

    by Trailer Trash ( 60756 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @10:54AM (#62039389) Homepage

    "with the added trust of Microsoft"

    *chuckle*

    • Hey... why not get the trust of knowing google wrote the code... then microsoft built on top of that. Edge needs to open source so that facebook and apple can add things into the browser too... then we can have the perfect browser for privacy!

  • I don't want either (Score:5, Informative)

    by Viol8 ( 599362 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @10:56AM (#62039397) Homepage

    Edge is no doubt full of security holes and chrome is a virus that infiltrates its way into the OS and insists - on linux anyway - with having part of it run with root privs. Feck that. I'll stick with Firefox even though it seems to be a minority browser now.

    • and chrome is a virus that infiltrates its way into the OS and insists - on linux anyway - with having part of it run with root privs.

      I'm no fan of Chrome or Google but I have to use Chrome at work (at least for certain things) on my Linux machine. I have Chrome running right now and just checked, I don't see any chrome processes running as root. Source?

      • Re: (Score:3)

        by Viol8 ( 599362 )

        Look for the browser parent process , its probably got sandbox in its name somewhere.

        • Re:I don't want either (Score:5, Informative)

          by Junta ( 36770 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @12:21PM (#62039875)

          Just verified that at least at a glance, you won't see root owned processes normally.

          However, it does have a setuid root application:
          $ ls -lh /opt/google/chrome/chrome-sandbox
          -rwsr-xr-x 1 root root 204K Nov 10 21:37 /opt/google/chrome/chrome-sandbox

          I replaced that binary with something to let me know if it is called, and at least in my install, I didn't see it called in a quick test. It may be that it is used if an older kernel is in play and it has to resort to setuid to get access to features it wants to employ to sandbox the browser. It may be that I didn't perform any action that would undice it.

          So the short of it is that yes, google has a setuid root binary installed but it *might* not use it when paired with a newer kernel. There is at least a plausible justification for it (e.g. users weren't allowed to do things like 'chroot' before, but with modern kernels you can, so long as you unshare user namespace first).

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      Do you have a reference for this claim that Chrome needs root privs to run on Linux? I couldn't find anything except some very old posts from 2009 about it needing root to install, but not to run. The current state seems to be that it installs entirely in /opt/google/chrome and does not require elevated privileges to run, but correct me if I'm wrong.

      • Re: (Score:3)

        by Viol8 ( 599362 )

        It uses (or did, maybe things have changed) a sandbox process that requires root privs.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Junta ( 36770 )

        If your kernel is older than 3.10, then it will need root to run:
        https://chromium.googlesource.... [googlesource.com]

        The same developments that enabled users to do user namespaces and pretend to be root also enabled Chrome to skip root for their sandbox if the kernel is new enough.

        However, it will still have:
        $ ls -lh /opt/google/chrome/chrome-sandbox
        -rwsr-xr-x 1 root root 204K Nov 10 21:37 /opt/google/chrome/chrome-sandbox

        Even if no longer used. It's probably time for them to remove the setuid sandbox, since supporting kerne

  • Microsoft has done a good job of dumping everything in IE that made it universally despised by the web developer community. Edge is a decent browser. But they need to attract users to Edge through desirable features and performance, and not try to pressure them. That is not going to work, and will just result in embarrassing news coverage like this.
  • If Microsoft isn't careful, they'll be labeled as a monopoly.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by nuggz ( 69912 )

      Unlike Apple, who doesn't even let you install alternate browsers on your iOS device.

      • So that Edge browser I installed on my iPhone isn't actually installed? Seems to work just fine...

  • Windows 10+ is essentially malware, by any commonly used definition prior to its own release.

    Chrome is also malware by most reasonable definitions. (Being careful to distinguish Chrome from Chromium)

    We have notoriously bad actors; treating each other unsurprisingly badly. I say its a big who cares

    • I don't think Chrome qualifies because it doesn't use surreptitious means to get you to install it. If software zips up my HDD and sends it to a website, it's only malware if that's not its purported use or if it is doing it without my knowledge.

  • "Microsoft Edge runs on the same technology as Chrome, with the added trust of Microsoft."

    So with no added benefit then

    "That browser is so 2008! Do you know what's new? Microsoft Edge."

    If your browser is based on the same tech as Chrome, its just as 2008 as Chrome is.

    "'I hate saving money,' said no one ever. Microsoft Edge is the best browser for online shopping."

    If you are corp fishing for users, yes. Not so much for me.

  • I want an OS, not an overlord

  • The usual "MS Feature" question (Score:3)

    by Opportunist ( 166417 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @11:09AM (#62039473)

    Can I turn it off, and if, how?

    (I feel like I post that exact message now every day, could we please get it as part of TFS, I can't believe I'm the only one where this question pops up like a reflex every time MS announces some new "feature")

    • For the moment you can but just wait for the next [cough][cough] update from MS. This will probably be blocked so do it while you can but remember you WILL do as Nanny Microsoft tells you.
      you have been assimilated into the MS Borg.

  • Lift your rival's source code, give it a slight makeover (including switching out the search engine), ship it by default with the operating system and then use it to stop users from exercising free choice to use the rival anyway.

    I see a lawsuit brewing. Not that Google has clean hands, but this sort of thing draws the ire of regulators and monopolies commissions.

  • "Added Trust"? (Score:3)

    by nagora ( 177841 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @11:14AM (#62039507)

    I supposed technically you can add a negative.

  • Our engine sucked so we used Googles', but we want out spyware on top if it - so pick our browser!

  • The more things change, the more they remain the same. I'm old enough to remember arguments of "better experience", "improved security" when MS tied IE to Windows. That lead to a lawsuit, a judgment an overturn on appeal, and a mess. Just don't use Windows is the only remedy [wikipedia.org]

       

  • The line "with the added trust of Microsoft." is particularly funny.

  • On the one hand... (Score:3)

    by aerogems ( 339274 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @11:35AM (#62039607)

    Hand 1: Chrome is a slimy little bastard full of Google tracking tech
    Hand 2: This just smacks of Microsoft circa late 1990s
    Hand 3: Edge is built on Chromium, presumably just replacing Google tracking tech with Microsoft tracking tech
    Hand 4: At least Firefox and Vivaldi are still around

  • I mean does it have to be enough to pull them into the lead in order to be called anti-competitive. Lets face it microsoft kept everything that they were ruled as anti-competitive with in the netscape vs IE days, and now... they seem to be just going off the walls crazy. So.. if I'm not mistaken in order to simply set google chrome as the main page. First open edge, go to google's download page. Press OK to get past microsofts "please give us a chance" messages. Download chrome, install chrome. Chrome pops

  • Years ago Microsoft got slammed for this kind of anti competitive behavior? One huge problem today is too many lobbyists that talk congress, lawmakers and regulators into giving tech a pass.

    • I wonder if MSFT is testing the waters. Their monopoly status is far less clear today than it was during their antitrust escapades. I've never seen a Windows machine at my office, and we've never had contractors who had any issues working in our Mac-centric development environment. A few of us use Linux, but Windows is kind of a non-starter.

  • All They Have To Do Is Sit And Wait (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Voyager529 ( 1363959 ) <voyager529@ya[ ].com ['hoo' in gap]> on Thursday December 02, 2021 @12:04PM (#62039743)

    There are plenty of people who feel Google is creepy, slow, bloated, and so forth. While Firefox remains an alternative, having Edge as an option as well is probably a good thing. At its core, Edge isn't a bad browser.

    The problem is that Microsoft doesn't seem content with people discovering this on their own, by merit of just being a good browser. When I start Edge for the first time, can I type in a URL? No. I have to answer 20 questions first. Can I just browse normally? No, it forces me to create a profile. It has a bunch of other nags that need to be disabled so that my browsing isn't interrupted by my browser. And it still does the annoying thing where it requires me to specify "http://" before an IP address, lest it assume I'm trying to do a bing search for 192.168.1.1. Oh, and any time there's something "new" they want to tell me, it creates a new tab halfway through my typing the website into the address bar and stealing focus.

    The "aggressive browser" market is already cornered with Chrome. Let Edge serve the user, and the market share will grow naturally as people see it as being principally different than IE6. however, Microsoft isn't content with this growth strategy. Instead, they try to shove it down everyone's throat, at a level they'd cry foul over if Google pulled this crap on Android for users who install Edge on their phone, or if Apple pulled this crap on OSX for Mac users.

    And thus, Microsoft makes the browser so obnoxious, that the reasons to dislike it don't have to be a matter of "standards compliance" or "being annoying to code for" that made IE6 loathed by web designers. The more of these reasons they add, the less undesirable it is to just use Chrome.

    I disliked Steve Ballmer and his chair throwing antics...but the Balmer era of Microsoft didn't seem hellbent on annoying its users.

  • The word "added" is suffering some serious trauma there.

  • My elders would have taken this right to court. The fools who run the government now have no teeth and the company is doing things they never dreamed of in the first place.

  • Microsoft Should Focus on the Default User Market (Score:3)

    by eepok ( 545733 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @01:41PM (#62040205) Homepage

    They're not going to convince knowledgeable Firefox or Chrome users that Edge is better. Just stop. It looks desperate.

    All Microsoft needs to do is rebrand Edge. First, change the name. Internet Explorer was a GREAT name for Default users. They saw the word "Internet", thinking "that's where I want to be" and then they see "Explorer" and think "I want to explore!".

    "Edge" is just way to abstract. It says nothing to the Default user and there are not good connotations with the term-- On edge... looking over the edge... the edge of a knife... The Edge from U2.

    And then there's the icon-- a breaking wave. They should have kept the Internet Explorer "e" so that Default users would just gravitate to the blue "e" they knew that could get them to their email.

    Edge should be the ultra-reliable, super-safe browser you can tell your granny to use without having to worry about installing plug-ins.

  • All of this ... (Score:3)

    by PPH ( 736903 ) on Thursday December 02, 2021 @03:04PM (#62040629)

    Makes me love lynx even more.

    --
    Have gnu, will travel.

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