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The Military

Anti-Russian Railway Workers in Belarus Reportedly Sabotaged All Rail Traffic to Ukraine (msn.com) 153

Posted by EditorDavid from the military-training dept.
"Belarusian railway workers have reportedly cut off all rail connections between their country and Ukraine," reports Germany's public broadcaster DW: Ukrainian railway chief Olexander Kamyshin thanked Belarusian railway workers for this claimed act of sabotage on Saturday. "As of today, I can say there is no rail traffic between Belarus and Ukraine," Kamyshin was quoted as saying by Ukraine's Unian news agency. Kamyshin said that he would not give further details.

Franak Viacorka, advisor to exiled Belarusian opposition leader Sviatlana Tsikhanouskaya, tweeted about the incident and said that it had been confirmed by Belarusian railway workers, while declining to provide details.

Although Russia has moved many of its troops and military equipment into Ukraine through Belarus, Belarusian leader Alexander Lukashenko has not committed Belarusian troops to the offensive.
A Ukrainian online newspaper claims that "There is no longer a railway connection between Ukraine and Belarus, so the Russian occupiers will not be able to deliver Russian equipment by rail from Belarus," citing the longer televisied remarks of Ukrainian railway chief Olexander Kamyshin: "I believe that these people will be able to prevent Belarusian Railways from transporting military convoys to Ukraine," Kamyshin added.

"Currently, the railways are out of order", Kamyshin confirmed, "so Russian equipment from Belarus will not be able to be delivered."
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Anti-Russian Railway Workers in Belarus Reportedly Sabotaged All Rail Traffic to Ukraine More

Anti-Russian Railway Workers in Belarus Reportedly Sabotaged All Rail Traffic to Ukraine

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  • "Not now, not now! I can't be bothered with some stupid railway issue when open-source developers are considering sanctioning updates to their software! [slashdot.org] This is serious!"

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by hey! ( 33014 )

      Authoritarian countries often get their priorities wrong. Look at Russia, a country that has twice the number of tanks as the US, but not enough trucks to allow those tanks to operate further than 90 miles from a railhead. Russia has 10 supply brigades each operating roughly 400 trucks, so that's about 4000 supply trucks. In contrast the US military operates over 150,0000 supply trucks. After the beating Russian supply lines have taken it's no wonder that their offensives have ground to a halt.

      Authorita

      • The cynic in me says that today's Russian Army is designed to fight in low-intensity conflicts only, and that, should it become necessary to directly confront another semi-powerful nation militarily, its intention has always been to do so with nukes.

        I hope I'm wrong.

        But if I were a bastard that cared nothing about innocent life, that would probably be my strategy as well.

  • Russian army logistics is highly rail dependent. Their war fighting strategy depends on capturing and using enemy rail. For this their BTGs have railway repair groups attached as its expected a withdrawing enemy blows up tracks. These groups will repair the sabotage.

    • How long will that take?

      • That's kind of the problem. The longer it takes Russia to take Ukraine the more damage the sanctions will do and the more weapons will be shipped into Ukraine. Also, and I don't know how true this is, but there are rumors that Poland is getting nervous that Russia May attack them in the future and in Poland May step into Ukraine directly. If they do that they're probably taking NATO with them.

        Basically Putin's on the clock and he needs to wrap this up. Which is why he's attacking civilians directly and

        • NATO is a defense pact.
          If a NATO country is attacking another country, or e.g. going to Ukraine to help them, there is no obligation by NATO to help/join them.

          • NATO entered Afghanistan under Article 4. In case you were wondering.

            • NATO entered Afghanistan under Article 4. In case you were wondering.

              Article 4 does not obligate any member to take military action. Many NATO countries did not participate in the Afghan operation.

              Article 5 is binding: "An attack against one is an attack against all." But it is only triggered when a NATO country is attacked, not when it is the attacker.

            • NATO entered Afghanistan under Article 4. In case you were wondering.

              NATO invoked Article 5 [history.com] in relation to invading Afghanistan.

        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by Aaaarrrggh ( 8470263 )

          Also, and I don't know how true this is, but there are rumors that Poland is getting nervous that Russia May attack them in the future and in Poland May step into Ukraine directly.

          You are parottng actual Russian propaganda that peddles fear of Polish forces occupying west Ukraine. Those rummors are just coming from paid trolls. It plays on a fact that it is somehow logical for uninformed that Poland should have some claims to west Ukraine, with Lwów (Lviv) that for centuries was considered a Polish city. This narrative works well on those who know Polish-Ukrainian history only from Wikipedia - it is also aimed at Ukrainians themselves. In reality, there are no such claims (to oc

          • Thank you for this information and insight. It makes sense.

            • Thank you for this information and insight. It makes sense.

              You are welcome. Of course with full NATO support and American nuclear umbrella Poland would consider taking on the offense - in direction of Kaliningrad and maybe Belarussia. Russia claims to Kaliningrad are very weak, certainly weaker than those to Crime. It was a simple land grab from 1945. Many consider taking it a prudent move, like popping a big pimple. Again not for any silly nationalistic reasons but purely political ones, to relieve pressure from Baltic states and break their siege. It is only logi

        • There's also the fact that this sabotage took place in Belarus, which was meant to be entirely friendly territory. Sabotage of rail lines inside the Ukraine is one thing. Did the Russians expect to need to send repair teams to Belarus to undo damage there?

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by jabuzz ( 182671 )

            The reports early in the invasion is that the Ukrainians had sabotaged the lines coming from Russia and Belarus themselves anyway. If it where me I would have blown bridges because good luck repairing those quickly. However in the south this didn't work and Russia was able to capture a rail yard which explains their better performance in the south, as they where able to bring supplies up from Crimea. However I would be astounded if the Ukrainians had not by now blown rail bridges to halt the advance from th

        • Poland _should_ be nervous. They're direct neighbors of Ukraine and of Belarus, Russia's previously successful political conquest.

          I also believe you also meant "en masse", rather than "in Mass". I don't believe the Russians are directly focusing on churches.

          • Maybe those Russians (Putin) should have attended mass more often.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by jabuzz ( 182671 )

            More specifically a few years back the Russian foreign minister suggested to his German counterpart that Poland was not a real country and that they should divide it up. Yeah sounded ridiculous at the time, not so much any more part from the fact Germany would not be having anything to do with such a notion in the 21st Century.

            Next on the list was almost certainly Moldova if it had gone to plan. Right now if I was in Trans-Dniester I would expect Moldovia to reassert it's authority of the area. If I where a

      • Some time after their shitty diesel powered aircraft carrier leaves dry dock. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Luckyo ( 1726890 )

        Depends on what kind of sabotage. Most kinds are repaired in hours, but there are some ways to delay that to days.

        That's with WW2 technology. We've progressed since then in repair tech, while rails are still pretty much the same when they're not high speed.

        • there are some ways to delay that to days.

          For a longer delay, target bridges and tunnels.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by Luckyo ( 1726890 )

            Very difficult to do. Requires explosives, and large amount of them and someone who knows how to use them correctly.

            This is the sort of stuff armies spend months to years training people to do because of just how hard it is to blow out a bridge or collapse a tunnel. When it comes to railway sabotage, the most common thing is to just remove or damage rails or switches. That requires just a few hours with tools and very little training.

            • Re: (Score:3)

              by jwhyche ( 6192 )

              Very difficult to do. Requires explosives, and large amount of them and someone who knows how to use them corre

              You assume that there isn't someone in Ukraine that doesn't know how to do this? You also don't need explosives to disable a bridge. A large boat in a river hitting a structure support will do nicely. You don't need to destroy the bridge to make it un-usable. Just structurally damage enough so it can't carry the load that needs to be carried.

              • Re: (Score:2)

                by Luckyo ( 1726890 )

                We're talking Belarus rail workers. Not professional Ukrainian soldiers. Not captains of large riverine vessels. This whole ridiculous "ghost of Kiev" fantasy stuff is getting tiring.

                • Re: (Score:3)

                  by jwhyche ( 6192 )

                  I'm not talking about Belarus rail workers. I'm talking about ways to render a bridge unusable to a occupying force. Really this whole slashdot idiot with out reading comprehension is getting tiring.

                  • Re: (Score:2)

                    by robi5 ( 1261542 )

                    I think the context is, how much time does it require to undo the effects of whatever the sabotage did? The GP just mentioned, in line with this context, that it's not the hypothetical scenarios that are interesting (hitting a bridge with a giant boat) but whatever the Belarus folks could've conceivably done to sabotage military transport into Ukraine

                  • Re: (Score:2)

                    by Luckyo ( 1726890 )

                    I'm talking about reality, where Belarus rail workers are claimed to have sabotaged the rail lines, just like the topic suggests.

                    You know, the topic being "Anti-Russian Railway Workers in Belarus Reportedly Sabotaged All Rail Traffic to Ukraine".

                    You appear to now admit to be talking about some random off topic fantasy, so I guess we're not talking about the same thing.

                    • Re: (Score:3)

                      by jwhyche ( 6192 )

                      I'm sorry that you didn't understand the fact that we are talking about two separate things. Please enlighten me what part of the original post you found confusing. I will do my best to explain it to you using small words. I'll even type it slowly to assist you with your reading comprehension issue.

            • Depends a lot on quality.

              Here in the U.S., tunnels [wikipedia.org] and bridges [wikipedia.org] have been known to fail spectacularly, all by themselves, and I don't imagine that Ukrainian infrastructure is much better.

              Also, if you know that Russian invasion is a realistic threat, you probably have planned and prepared for that invasion, and one of the first things you'd want to do is to limit the enemy's mobility. He has to cover long distances, and supply his lines over those distances. As a defender, you really don't. That is one

              • Re: (Score:2)

                by Luckyo ( 1726890 )

                Story is about Belarussian rail workers sabotaging rail lines in Belarus. Not civilian militia, and not in Ukraine.

                • My bad. Sorry about that.

                  Point about militia: defenders (or in this case halfway decent human beings in Belarus) have an inherent advantage over attackers, all else being even close to equal.

                  • Re: (Score:2)

                    by Luckyo ( 1726890 )

                    Defenders in Belarus would be Belarus military. Attackers would be the saboteurs on the sovereign land of the nation defended by said military that sabotage it for sovereign interests of a foreign power.

                    Just like in Ukraine, Russian saboteurs going ahead of the invasion to mark targets and sabotage logistics aren't defenders but attackers. Exact same logic applies there, and there are plenty of videos of how such saboteurs and suspected saboteurs are treated by the territorial defense units and citizen mili

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by DrXym ( 126579 )
          Railway travel hasn't changed significantly since WW2. It's still metal rails, points, timetables, scheduling. There are computers, safety systems and whatnot but it's the same principle. If you wanted to physically sabotage the rail network the it's the same to do now as it ever was - destroy points, rails, bridges, tunnels. Cause derailments & crashes. Belarus would need to send troops or police to protect their railways and sabotage would degrade their ability to function effectively.

          If anything co

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by Luckyo ( 1726890 )

            While fixing the automation would indeed take longer, there are manual overrides on site. Just have MPs manually deal with switches on site. No need for automation.

            • Re: (Score:2)

              by DrXym ( 126579 )
              The automation is there for a reason - scheduling, speed, safety. Even if they had people up and down the line it's going to be slower, less reliable and less safe. It would permanently degrade the operation of the line which was the purpose of doing it. It would also require Russia to have rear echelon troops protecting the line which would further degrade their logistics.

              • Re: (Score:2)

                by Luckyo ( 1726890 )

                The automation is there to reduce the amount of people being used in the process. That is literally where the name comes from. Automating a process that was done by humans.

                In case of physical switching like railways, we used to have people literally working at switching location turning a switch. This is still a backup option in most cases. This is why I'm stating that if automation is damaged, that's one of the easiest things to fix. While you undo the damage to the automation processes, just send military

        • Remember that this is sabotage of Belarusian rail, in Belarus, by Belarusians. That will complicate things a bit.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by Luckyo ( 1726890 )

            Considering amount of experience of Lukashenka's government with suppressing internal dissent, unlikely to complicate it. It's going to make it easier to handle. Remember how quickly and how thoroughly that government crushed the last large protest?

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by edis ( 266347 )

      It is disputable, if railway worker part would be allowed to take over. Russian are not hosts in Belarus yet.

    • I was saying to someone just today that if I was Ukraine, I'd be sending in spooks into Russia to sabotage their rail network. IED some train lines and run havok. Russia is indeed very rail dependent and people on russian twitter where posting photos of just endless train carriages of tanks and apcs being carted to the border. If you sabotage those train lines, you've caused serious damage to their logistics giving you the ability to encircle and pound the russian military into the dirt.

      I'm not that surpris

  • I guess that puts the kabosh on that.
  • This tweet reminds me when during the early phase of the war Ukraine loudly mentioned the help they were getting from inside the FSB. Maybe they were, maybe they weren't. I bet Russia lost its shit trying to find out. It definitely must have created a rift between the FSB and military.

    So when tweets like this come out without verification, I think it's more likely that it is more of the same. That said, I have absolutely no doubt that Belarus has no appetite for this war. They tried to depose Lukashenko

  • Railways being less useful to the Russians seems to benefit Lushenko. Not only may it reduce the number of Russian troops in his country, but it also gives him a reason to avoid committing more to Putin's war. Seems like a win-win for Lushenko.

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