RIP Google Hangouts, Google's Last, Best Chance To Compete With iMessage (arstechnica.com) 92
Google Hangouts is scheduled for death today. The phone app has been individually booting people off the service since July, but the last vestiges of Hangouts, the web app, will be shut down today. From a report: For a brief period, Hangouts was Google's best, most ambitious, most popular messaging effort, but 5 billion downloads later, Google is moving on. Hangout's next of kin, Google Chat, should have all of your messages and contacts automatically imported by now, but the new service is a mere shadow of the original plan for Hangouts. The closing of Hangouts is the latest chapter in the mess that is Google's messaging history. Google Talk launched 17 years ago, and Google still doesn't have a competitive message platform. Part of the reason we're on Google's umpteenth messaging app is that there is no solid, stable home for messaging inside Google.
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More Nokia, which, apart from other problems, also had the problem of thinking that the carriers were their customers and pandering to their whims above the needs of the end users.
I want a message bridging app (Score:4, Insightful)
Universal Texting by sms has become messaging by data on WhatsApp, iMessage, Snapchat, messenger
And that means an I message user can't freely talk in a group on WhatsApp and Vicaversa
The good news is that data is better place for messaging than sms. In Europe some carriers don't even offer sms or make it sms upgrade cost.
But it's painful to figure out how to contact someone when you know their phone number. Are they WhatsApp or iMessage or pure sms.
Sms is really carrier specific but it bridges across carriers
We need data based messaging that is agnostic to the branded version of iMessage or WhatsApp app
Nooo! (Score:2)
Don't do it. Can we get a court order or one of those injunction thingies?
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It's up to the Supreme Court now...
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Which judge is responsible for the southwestern US?
GoogleTalk was really good (Score:1)
Re: GoogleTalk was really good (Score:2)
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Yep. The API was pretty mature too, so I could incorporate it into a custom work app and have lots of interoperability. Then with little fanfare or warning it broke. Another Google idea that was sunsetted.
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Federation is a great thing for sure. Matrix.org has been getting very popular as a next-generation, integrated messaging solution based on open standards, open software, and federated protocols. By default they don't use XMPP. There were some reasons given but I can't remember what all they were.
Google service launch code (Score:2)
For ($gService in @Gservices) {
&terminateService ($_);
}
return($yetAnotherFailure);
Yes, I do use the default variable name in my PERL code. I find it easier to read later.
Re:Google service launch code (Score:4, Funny)
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Oh please, one minor bug. That's what the QA team is for.
What was it for? (Score:2)
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This absence created the globally-fractured competition for messaging apps, and similarly-fractured premium messaging options (like RCS atop SMS/MMS).
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Why can't I send RCS messages to phones on other carriers
* Is your phone using the Joyn, the Universal Profile, or something else? RCS has lots of flavors.
Are RCS chats encrypted?
* If every client is using Google's RCS hosting and each client has Google's RCS extension loaded AND there are only 2 clients then encryption is supported.
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And since there's more than 1 RCS spec/implementation, and iMessage is considered its own premium messaging option, and these all don't play nice... thus, it's fractured.
Without going any deeper, you've trolled yourself by proudly declaring that you don't even fully appreciate the RCS landscape, much less the global messaging landscape across markets. So sad. Troll fail.
Re: What was it for? (Score:2)
The default Android install did not come packaged with a halfway-basic SMS and telephony app
Since that statement is totally incorrect, I'm curious what else you think.
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The default Android install did not come packaged with a halfway-basic SMS and telephony app
Since that statement is totally incorrect, I'm curious what else you think.
I replied above to another comment questioning that context. Here's the link to my reply there https://slashdot.org/comments.... [slashdot.org]
The takeaway should be that the mobility landscape was dramatically different back then. And for giggles, here's the complete version history of released (beta and final) since Android 1.0... and the phone app was called "Dialer" and integration of contacts to Call/Message/etc didn't come until Android 2.0. Read here https://www.temok.com/blog/and... [temok.com]
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and the phone app was called "Dialer" and integration of contacts to Call/Message/etc didn't come until Android 2.0.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
"Instant messaging, text messaging, and MMS."
Remember what about said about you simply being wrong? You were wrong.
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So much so, that the INTEGRATION of those capabilities (saying nothing of the QUALITY) was a notable improvement for Android 2.0
Try again? Or does every Google-branded option equal "best of breed" for you? Cuz you're sounding like a Google Apologist with every reply!
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I can not imagine that there ever was an Android phone with out an "Phone App" - for calls, and/or without an SMS app. It is a phone. Obviously it has both.
And what has that to do with "messaging" is beyond me. Remember ICQ? (I think it still exists) it predates Android by a decade or more. And then there is Skype, also predates any Android and iPhone ...
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The app ecosystem was more open insofar as every file-download site (like download.com) often allow your installation of various binaries of questionable integrity; truly the wild-west days of mobile software. (At the time
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Compete with iMessage? (Score:2)
Did Google Hangouts even send SMS? I thought it was just what they were calling Google Talk, er, Google Chat, whatever the name is this week. As far as users are concerned, there isn't any difference.
Whatever, it's not like they could compete anyway. iMessage is the only option on iOS and it's not available on any other platform. The headline is stupid.
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Yes it did. It was sort of a collection of Google messaging services including Google Chat and Google Voice SMS. Very convenient
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Could it send an SMS on iOS? If not, it wasn't competing.
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No idea, but the android and web app had the ability. Apple might have some anti-competitive restriction preventing it on iOS
Re:Compete with iMessage? (Score:4, Informative)
Exactly that. Apple doesn't allow other apps to handle SMS messages. That's why nothing can actually compete with iMessage: It's the only option on the only platform it runs on.
So, no, Google Hangouts was never competing with iMessage. The headline is incredibly stupid.
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It may have been possible actually for Google Voice users either those that have Google Fi or forwarding to a phone with a different number. In that case it's not exactly SMS, but you could send and receive SMS messages through the app via Google servers
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Like I said, it was never competing with iMessage.
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Guess for some users, but on the other hand, iMessage was never competing with Hangouts outside of the iOS environment
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iMessage wasn't competing with Hangouts inside the iOS environment either. Remember that Apple doesn't allow any other app to send and receive SMS messages.
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Just for people that use a Google Voice number
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Yeah, no. You've stretched this well beyond credulity.
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And why would anyone have a second SMS messenger on his device?
I most certainly have no second SMS messenger on my Android, and I'm pretty sure Hangouts could not sent SMS, if so, it required authorization, which I obviously never would give to a 3rd party app.
You do know that _EVERY_ SMS app can actually READ your SMSs? So goes 2FA out of the window ...
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Shouldn't rely on SMS for 2FA anyways, it's insecure
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As long as there are no real alternatives ...
And it is not 'really' unsecure, lol. You need to do quite some 'hacking' to abuse it.
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Can someone tell me what iMessage is so I know how to avoid it?
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It is the standard app on iPhones to sent SMS.
Any more stupid questions?
If you have no iPhone: why bother?
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It's Apple's second-rate BBM clone that also happens to be the only messaging app allowed on the iPhone that can handle SMS message.
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Hangouts runs on iPhones, too ... ...
Erm: ran
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Again, it was not competing with iMessage because Apple does not allow other apps to handle SMS. Pay attention.
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Sorry, ...
I don't get your point?
What has Hangouts to do with SMS? Obviously nothing
So what has it to do with iMessage? Obviously nothing again.
Perhaps you should pay more attention or explain more clearly what you want to say :D
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Sigh... I keep forgetting that you're really, really, stupid.
The question is "did Hangouts compete iMessage". I contend that it did not as nothing could compete with iMessage. I made that very clear in my earlier posts.
So what does SMS have to do with it? Everything, you moron. Apple only allows iMessage to handle SMS on iOS. This means that it is the only viable option on that platform. On iOS, iMessage isn't competing with any other app. Because iMessage only works on iOS, it isn't competing with a
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Seems you are the Moron.
I explained it already: there is no need to "compete" with iMessage on SMS - as it is only SMS.
No one is using or wants to use another App for SMS. Why would anyone?
And this begs the question: can Hangout send SMS on Android? Or why do you bring up this competition issue?
iMessage is for any non apple user an SMS client. And that is it. No one needs to bother about it. And for an Apple user it is: an SMS client. And no one wants or bothers about "other SMS clients" - WTF, an SMS clien
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Are you a masochist or something?
Listen up, dumbass, you're clearly too stupid for this discussion. Let me explain in way that even a drooling moron like yourself can understand ... with help from an adult.
My claim was that the headline was stupid because Hangouts did not compete with iMessage.
Now go be stupid somewhere else, you illiterate prick.
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My claim was that the headline was stupid because Hangouts did not compete with iMessage.
Lool, the drooling moron in this case is obviously you.
So, I explain it to you in simple terms an adult should be able to understand: I misunderstood your sentence above as: "My claim was that the headline was stupid because Hangouts did n^Ho^Ht^H compete with iMessage."
And that was plain obvious from my first answer. So you could have pointed out that misunderstanding, but you did not. No idea why ... autistic behaviou
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Did you know that you've never once been right when you've tried to contradict me? It's pathetic. You need to learn to bow your head to your betters.
Apple forbids competition to iMessage
That is a simple fact.
Fact #1: iMessage only runs on Apple shit. (iMessage isn't competing with Hangouts on any other platforms.)
Fact #2: Apple doesn't let other apps handle SMS messages. (Apple forbids competition)
What does that tell you?
Fact #3: Nothing is competing with iMessage because nothing can compete with iMessage.
Because nothing can compete with
Google is its own worst enemy (Score:3)
Google's messaging history is such a mess. Jumping back to another related recent story - even if Apple were to say "okay, okay, we'll support RCS", can anyone guarantee Google will still do so three years from now?
And if Google does stick with RCS, my guess is they'll treat it like they did WebKit - start off with the same base as everyone else, but eventually break off and start working on their own special Googly flavor.
The worst part... (Score:2)
Alternative... (Score:1)
I know 2 people who are fully in love with Google
No way to at least lure them over onto something like Signal?
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I know 2 people who are fully in love with Google
No way to at least lure them over onto something like Signal?
I wish. But one I am going to marry, and the other is my oldest friend. So I guess I am stuck with Google Chat. (At least until they come out with the next new version.)
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I wish. But one I am going to marry,
Well hopefully Google enjoys listening in on your honeymoon as much as you enjoy having it! :-)
Seriously though, congrats and best wishes to a great marriage.
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Hangouts was great and ironically private. (Score:3)
Ironically, it was the only one that handled privacy well. Now, every service requires an app to be installed on a mobile device. My kids borrow my phone all the time. I hate telegram and WhatsApp because unless I want to do some advanced and creative hacks, they can get to the application. At least with Google's chat program, I don't need to install an app and can keep it off all devices. I can just access it in an incognito window and destroy all evidence of it existing on my computers and devices by closing a window. I also loved how it supported multiple accounts so well and I could have a dedicated account for private conversations with no notifications or extra protection. I always had one for professional/family use and one for personal use.
I like to have some private conversations. I hate being nervous every time someone touches my phone, such as taking a pic or me showing them a photo or something on my phone.
Everyone on slashdot whines excessively about privacy from the gov or big corps. I honestly don't care about them. Neither care about my boring life. My wife? She probably wouldn't be happy if she saw me complaining or talking about private details like I sometimes do in conversations. (no mistresses or anything...just more mundane things)
My kids? I certainly don't want them seeing many conversations, especially the ones with my wife, for the same reason. Once everyone I know stopped using Google Messenger in favor of WhatsApp, Telegram, or SMS, my privacy went WAAAY down.
It's ironic that Telegram and WhatsApp brag about their encryption so much, but since they force you to install an app on the phone, it's so much less private for anyone with a family or who ever interacts with other human beings in-person. Google Hangouts was great and is sorely missed.
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Seems like your problem could be easily fixed by not allowing others to use your phone. I consider cell phones to have the same privacy level as a purse. You don't go through someone else's phone just like you don't go through someone else's purse.
You've never shown a photo on your phone? (Score:2)
Seems like your problem could be easily fixed by not allowing others to use your phone. I consider cell phones to have the same privacy level as a purse. You don't go through someone else's phone just like you don't go through someone else's purse.
While I avoid people using my phone at all times, no one has ever asked to see a picture? Your wife has never asked to see what someone texted or e-mailed you? It doesn't even have to be hostile. This morning, my wife just wanted to know what a kids' friend has texted about her availability this weekend. Also, people don't have to "go through" a phone. Half the time it ends up on a different screen just by someone's hand accidentally touching the wrong parts.
And regardless...even if folks are polite an
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Android has features to deal with these. You can open an app, such as Photos, in a way that whoever you lent your phone to cannot switch to other apps. You can also enable multiple profiles, and have a personal profile for your own stuff, and another for guest users, or even more than two if you want several people to have their own individual personal profiles.
As for WhatsApp and Telegram, they both allow you to have conversations that auto-delete precisely so that you can have private stuff disappear, and
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The installed-apps strategy (popularized by BlackBerry) allowed for the client app to manage the encryption schemes and store keys onto the physical device, plus wrapping biometrics or other security strategy atop the app for content-access. Any servi
Divorce lawyers are greater threat than the CIA (Score:2)
You have a false sense of privacy because you can access your Hangouts through a browser window in Incognito mode? The contents of that browser window being served from a server where the service has displayed fully-unencrypted messages? THAT PRIVACY?! WUT?! The installed-apps strategy (popularized by BlackBerry) allowed for the client app to manage the encryption schemes and store keys onto the physical device, plus wrapping biometrics or other security strategy atop the app for content-access. Any service provider in the middle would only be able to transfer the encrypted package without actually reading its contents. THAT'S PRIVACY. You simply described the ability of hiding your tracks ON YOUR DEVICE. But any other device could access your data using similar (and/or easier) methods.
Sorry, I am not a terrorist. I am not a criminal. I am not the target of industrial espionage. I'm a normal person. No one cares about my data. The police don't care. The gov doesn't care. I doubt hackers even care.
The only thing that has ever caused me distress is coworkers and family members reading sensitive messages on my device. To me, privacy is not having anything sensitive on any device. The FBI can read all my messages.
For most of us, divorce lawyers are a greater threat than the CI
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But if you're referring to Ashley Madison-esque services, improper OnlyFans donations, uncontrolled sports booking or other gambling addiction, or anything else you would feel
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You are just silly.
It's ironic that Telegram and WhatsApp brag about their encryption so much, but since they force you to install an app on the phone
Simply delete them from the phone after you have installed them on your PC. (* facepalm *)
You must not have kids. (Score:2)
You are just silly.
It's ironic that Telegram and WhatsApp brag about their encryption so much, but since they force you to install an app on the phone Simply delete them from the phone after you have installed them on your PC. (* facepalm *)
Kids use the damn computer!!! If you have kids, they will use your device. Even if they have their own, they'll forget to put their phone/iPad/laptop on the charger and ask to use yours. You're going to log out EVERY SINGLE TIME you walk away from your computer to take a piss? You've never lived with kids if you think your suggestion is viable.
You also need to reverify your account periodically, especially after patches, so will have to reinstall the app every few weeks to authenticate.
Also, FYI,
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You're going to log out EVERY SINGLE TIME you walk away from your computer to take a piss? ...
If I had kids? Of course
You've never lived with kids if you think your suggestion is viable.
It is: as you can give everyone its own account.
Also, FYI, for Apple users, it keeps a permanent record of every application installed for everyone in a family plan. ...
Yes, and? No one sees who has installed what
Install telegram? Your wife has a permanent record of it...viewable from her device, without access to yours.
Si
Look at the Apple family plan purchase history! (Score:2)
You're going to log out EVERY SINGLE TIME you walk away from your computer to take a piss? If I had kids? Of course ...
You've never lived with kids if you think your suggestion is viable. It is: as you can give everyone its own account.
Also, FYI, for Apple users, it keeps a permanent record of every application installed for everyone in a family plan. Yes, and? No one sees who has installed what ...
Install telegram? Your wife has a permanent record of it...viewable from her device, without access to yours. Simply wrong. You delete your Telegram WITH data, and it's gone. How the funk would your wife have access to it?
You're incorrect. I can see EVERY application my wife has "purchased" including free apps in her history as well as the date she first acquired it. I don't have access to her device. It's granted to me as part of the family plan. I don't know my wife's passcode. Apparently, these can be hidden and then she requires access to my device to see them. But then again...now there's a permanent record my wife can access of every app I've ever installed, with my passcode....which is bearable, but not in my com
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I guess you are "bad with tech".
Because what you write makes no sense.
How should your wife have access to any passcode/device/app if you never gave it to her?
How can your wife see the "family plan" when you are the Apple-Account-holder.
If you can see, that your son installed grinder, you still have no access to his account. If you download grinder on your own device: you have to make your own account, or know his login name, and password.
Did you share your apple account details with your wife? Then better s
Onto the pile (Score:3)
One more for the heap [killedbygoogle.com].
What's the best cross platform & private msg a (Score:2)
Is there a cross platform app that doesn't require a phone number, private end to end encryption, lets you share pics/video, allows video/audio chat, text messaging? Push notification? Bonus if it is easy enough for grandma to download and use.
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I want to completely avoid giving out personal information (apart from an email address), and yeah I'd like to avoid Meta/Facebook too.
Re: What's the best cross platform & private m (Score:1)
What (Score:2)
are those even?
Both "Hangouts" and "iMessage" are completely alien. Are they some proprietary chat applications that no-one uses?
Re: What (Score:2)
Obviously I don't use iMessages since I don't have any iDevices, and Hangouts isn't relevant anymore, but you make it sound like you don't know what they are.
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Fear not (Score:2)
RCS will definitely be the standard to bring down iMessage.
Even though I'm in Europe and everybody and his dog uses WhatsApp, I just use SMS and iMessage.
At least, I don't get useless and time-wasting WhatsApps from equally useless wife of my brother, as my mother does.
WhatsApp should start charging money for people who send messages.
Re: Fear not (Score:2)
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Why would it "bring down" iMessage?
As soon as it is really a standard, iMessage will support it.
Seriously, from what damn anti Apple, Apple hater planet are you?
iMessage is a damn SMS app, that is all. As soon as SMS is complemented/replaced by RCS, obviously it will be supported by iMessage.
How retarded are those Apple haters?
Killed by Google (Score:3)
https://killedbygoogle.com/ [killedbygoogle.com]
Reader was a great RSS tool. Still angry.
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Commafeed [commafeed.com] is here for you.
Created as a copy of Reader shortly after it was killed, it's very good and free/Free. Keeps all the same keyboard shortcuts too. The developer is still actively involved. It can be self-hosted or use his service. No cost (though I give him $50/year).
Problem is: Google is Untrustworthy and Evil (Score:2, Insightful)
Bring back Google Talk (Score:2)
Google could bring back Google Talk, a simple, basic client that my entire network of family, friends and colleagues used because it was so nice and clean and easy.
I know these days they'd have to bring it back as a giant clunky Electron app instead of the svelte little thing it used to be, so it would probably suck.
Just amazing they managed to shit the bed so hard on this.
The best? LOL! (Score:2)
I hated it.
Unintuitive UI - close to unusable, beyond sending simple messages.
The best? What about GoogleTalk, it had everything one wanted and connected to every XMPP Server and was compatible with my iChat client on my Mac ...
Start with 'working' (Score:2)
iMessage and Signal serve very different purposes but actually work (meaning they do what they're supposed to more than they do not).
Google running the message server isn't confidence instilling for me . . .
What we need is notSignal - free, somewhat authenticated messaging with no obviously broken protocols we just don't kid ourselves with the expectation that conversations are private. If more people used that than anything else, the problem would be solved.
I use iMessage and Signal. My only complaint is