EU Sets December 28, 2024, Deadline For All New Phones To Use USB-C for Wired Charging (theverge.com) 113
We finally have a final official deadline for when new phones sold in the European Union -- including future iPhones -- will have to use USB-C for wired charging: December 28th, 2024. From a report: That's because the EU's new USB-C legislation has just been published in the bloc's Official Journal, making it formally binding. Now we know the rules will officially enter into force in 20 days' time, and individual EU member states will then have a maximum of 24 months to apply them as national law. The date is more or less in line with previous forecasts from politicians, but until now, the exact date has remained vague given the number of stages each piece of EU legislation has to go through. When lawmakers reached an initial agreement on the legislation in June, they announced it would be applicable in "autumn 2024," but in October, a press release said the rules would apply "by the end of 2024."
Decent for being a statutory approach (Score:5, Informative)
Here's the text of the law [europa.eu] for those interested in perusing it. At first glance, it seems like it's just taking existing industry adoption and direction and encoding it so that certain companies that want to do things their way have to take a more expensive path. There's nothing stopping a company from developing a new connector. They just have to include a USB-C connector, too.
The law also notes that this is a consensus standard, and it seems to leave open the possibility of adopting new connectors if industry (rather than a single company) wants to adopt it. If there's a USB-D, there's little stopping them from amending the law to allow use of that. It does seem unlikely, though, since we can now, with the proper cables, handle 240W (enough to power a workstation notebook) and/or speeds of at least 120 Gbps with work proceeding on higher power and faster speeds. I'd love to see someone come up with a mag connector that can do that, but absent that, I'll happily take USB-C on every device.
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Haha :-)
Did I just hear you say "240W (enough to power a workstation notebook) and/or speeds of at least 120 Gbps" should be enough for anyone?
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No, you didn't. It covers what's out there now, and future requirements will be covered by work that is ongoing for USB-4-Gen3.12321-Mark2-version12.
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"USB-4-Gen3.12321-Mark2-version12"
Even when trying to mock the USB naming standards, it sounds like the confusing bullshit they came up with. And then they rename things that are already out. Fucking morans.
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Seems unlikely that the connector will change though. USB C has enough pins and versatility to handle pretty much anything, and the data rate will keep increasing. Any arbitrary protocol can be packetized and sent over it.
The only potential issue is if they want more than 240W, but by that point you will need a bigger connector than USB is ever likely to provide, and thus you can use whatever you like.
Are there any other reasons to switch connectors that you can think of? I suppose if we want even flatter p
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We thought they'd need a new connector for more than a few dozen watts and they figured out how to do 240W.
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240W is the limit of what is easily available. Basically the cable and connector are rated for 5A, so the only way to increase the power is to increase the voltage. 240W requires 48V, and 50V is where regulatory issues start to come in because the voltage reaches a dangerous level.
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The regulatory bit is interesting. I didn't know that. Another thing to go research for no particular reason. Thanks!
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No you cannot read what he wrote, stupor ken doll, because this is that:
It does seem unlikely, though, since we can now, with the proper cables, handle 240W (enough to power a workstation notebook) and/or speeds of at least 120 Gbps with work proceeding on higher power and faster speeds.
Emphasis mine, words his, failure to read yours
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Not sure if any existing USB-C magnetic connectors support the max speed and power, but I wouldn't be terribly surprised if some do. I mean, there's nothing magic about the connectors - it all comes down to wire thickness (for amperage) and length tolerances (for signal speeds). The connector itself typically offers orders of magnitude greater contact area than the cross section of the wires it's connected to - as long as it makes a solid connection without introducing length discrepancies or EMF chokes t
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My problem with these magnetic connectors is that they're round, so completely pointless for thinner devices.
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Mine aren't - they're about the same size and shape as a the plastic end for a typical USB-C cable. Only the thinnest devices are narrower.
There's lots of designs out there with different strengths and weaknesses - the round ones are nice because they're omni-directional, I think some even act as a swivel joint. But I wanted the slim profile.
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Can you pass 240W over a magnetic connector? It seems like the contact points wouldn't be guaranteed like they are on a M-F connector.
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No idea. But like I said, the contact points are likely MUCH larger than cross section of the wire itself, so they shouldn't be the choke point. I would think the big concern would be if intermittent connection (e.g. from jostling) would cause arcing/sparking that erodes the contacts over time.
I'm not sure what voltage 240W charging uses, but it's probably pretty high to keep the amperage low enough for those tiny wires to handle.
But there's very few things that actually pull anywhere near 240W - that'd h
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I just looked it up, and 240W USB-C is 48V and 5A.
I have a Dell Precision notebook, and it has a 240W power brick. A friend used to have an Alienware gaming notebook, and I think it was even bigger. (We used to joke that the battery was just there to keep it on while moving it to a different outlet because the battery life even without gaming sucked.)
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The law also notes that this is a consensus standard, and it seems to leave open the possibility of adopting new connectors if industry (rather than a single company) wants to adopt it
Not only that. The law mandates a review every 5 years of not only if the chosen connector is still suitable, but also if the list of included devices still makes sense or need to be amended.
I.e. we may see this expanded to wireless chargers, other devices, or new connectors adopted in the future.
Re: Decent for being a statutory approach (Score:2)
The law only specifies the physical connector. It doesnâ(TM)t seem to preclude companies from developing proprietary cables such as:
Qualcomm Quick Charge (QC)
MediaTek Pump Express
Samsung Adaptive Fast Charging
Oppo Super VOOC Flash Charge, are also known as Dash Charge or Warp Charge on OnePlus devices and Dart Charge on Realme devices
Huawei SuperCharge
Anker PowerIQ
Google fast charging
Motorola TurboPower
We already know what Apple's going to do.... (Score:2)
Hopefully by that time, a trim update for my car will be available that will support wireless carplay.
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I dunno. Considering how insufferably long the automobile companies dragged their heels on deploying CarPlay in the first place; and how they've made pretty much made no movement at all towards adopting multidisplay CarPlay 2 since WWDC, I would wager they will continue to insufferably and contemptibly drag their heels on any future updates and integrations as well.
For my part, I would place more hope on Apple upgrading MagSafe so that it can handle CarPlay (or other) data connections wirelessly down the s
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Re: We already know what Apple's going to do.... (Score:2)
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... which is ditch the charging port entirely and use wireless charging only.
You say that about a company that already said they will put USB-C connectors on the upcoming iPhone despite that phone not being covered by the law.
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I'll believe that when I see it.
They had plenty of time to switch to USB-C for the 14, but they didn't.
How about other devices? (Score:2)
If they're gonna do this for phones, I wish they'd also do it for Kindles and the like.
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It applies to radio devices that use a fixed or replaceable rechargeable battery. While there are referenced to other docs, this would seem to include Kindles as well.
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No. It applies to very specific devices, not all radio devices using batteries. In fact it applies to several non radio devices as well including cameras and portable navigation equipment.
e-readers are listed though. Read Annex 1a. It's not a complicated piece of legislation. https://data.consilium.europa.... [europa.eu]
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This law isn't about moving to "USB" - it's specifically about requiring devices to use the USB-C form factor for wired charging. I'd like to see Kindles included in this USB-C connector mandate.
Right now at my house we've got rechargeable devices that need Lightning cables, USB-C, Micro USB, even a couple that use Mini USB! Not to mention a few other proprietary chargers. It's ridiculous.
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If they're gonna do this for phones, I wish they'd also do it for Kindles and the like.
e-readers are specifically listed in Annex 1a
https://data.consilium.europa.... [europa.eu]
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That's awesome.
One more iPhone release with lightning (Score:2)
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Re: One more iPhone release with lightning (Score:2)
Re: One more iPhone release with lightning (Score:2)
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Assuming Apple releases an iPhone next year you can bet it will use the lightning connector.
They already confirmed it will come with USB-C.
Good news (Score:2)
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Re: Good news (Score:2)
Re: Good news (Score:2)
No, laptops up to 100W are covered. More powerful ones can continue to use whatever crap they want, but most already include the capability, albeit limited to 100 or 65 W for now.
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Simple solution for Apple (Score:2)
Ship every iPhone with a Lightning --> USB-C dongle plugged into the phone.
It's the user's business if they want to unplug it or not. It shipped as part of the phone that happened to be removable for servicing.
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I've long suggested that Apple should just stick to its guns and pull the iPhone out of the EU market, creating a new opportunity for illicit imports.
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I've long suggested that Apple should just stick to its guns and pull the iPhone out of the EU market, creating a new opportunity for illicit imports.
I think this is a great idea, and if I had as much money as Apple I would even go so far as to fund the smuggling and sales (via Apple branded black-market popup shops) in countries that tried to force Apple to change hardware. That way Apple would also not have to pay any EU VAT either... all sales pure profit. Well, except for whatever tax there is in the
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And do without a major part of their revenue? Fat chance.
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As usual, you are completely clueless.
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Ship every iPhone with a Lightning --> USB-C dongle plugged into the phone.
It's the user's business if they want to unplug it or not. It shipped as part of the phone that happened to be removable for servicing.
Nope. The connector needs to be on the device itself.
Next time you think you have a clever workaround it helps to have at least skim read the thing you claim to have a workaround for.
But if you did that you'd cease being our resident idiot and we'd all miss the SuperKendall we love calling out.
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If I know Apple, they will probably make a USB-C port on the phone, and then sell a USB-C to Lightning adapter to all their users can use the Lightning chargers because that's the one that has the Apple logo on it.
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Nope. The connector needs to be on the device itself.
It is on the device. It's part of the device. As stated, that port is removable so the user can replace the USB-C port if it becomes damaged, already an improvement over every phone ever made. You can remove a phone screen too, it's part of the device.
Very sad day (Score:2)
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Wow, you go girl.
While we're at it, let's cap EV charging at 5amps so it's, you know, standard.
Can't have anything confusing like a 3rd pedal, right?
Nothing was gained AND you get to push 20 year old straw men. woooo you.
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Much better than other overpriced alternatives at $30 a piece, with proprietary chips in them and planned obsolescence which makes 4th pin turn black every 12 months.
Re: clueless (Score:2)
Re:clueless (Score:5, Insightful)
You should know that zero bureaucrats were involved defining what technology was used, the EC farms that out to actual industry engineers to make recommendations, and that even if they did define it themselves they are 100% accountable to the voters both directly in case of MEPs and indirectly via national elections in case of the Council of the EU.
Yep it really is a great way to do things.
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Apple fanboi detected!
Re: clueless (Score:2)
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You are confused. This is not the US we are talking about. In actual reality, USB-C is an excellent choice from a tech point of view.
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Well, the problem is that it was an excellent choice a year or two ago. In 2-3 years it may no longer be an excellent choice, but it will take a further 2-3 years to change it.
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Nope. 2-3 for this years is completely disconnected from reality. Maybe some ultra-high end phones will be able to saturate in 10 years what USB-C can offer today, but that is still doubtful. And what would they be using it for anyways? As to power, USB-C PD does up to 100W. Think a phone will need more? Think again. Seriously. This is an excellent long-term choice.
Re: clueless (Score:2)
Thereâ(TM)s already a wide variety of USB-C connector specifications. It doesnâ(TM)t help with e-waste if on each device your cable/charger is no longer up to the yearly spec changes. Moreover, the USB spec with 3.1 makes it perfectly clear vendor specific cables are still possible which Google, Huawei and every other major Android clone requires a special, proprietary fast charge system.
Re: clueless (Score:2)
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You can't charge 100W Google phone on a 100W Anker iQ (or whatever they call it) charger. That's the problem, you're going to be limited to 10W (5V*2A) if you don't go with your vendor's custom charge protocol.
And within 10 years I hope we would have moved on from the scourge of tiny fragile cables.
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WTF are you talking about? "Yearly spec changes"? There is no such thing. Stop lying. As to "vendor specific cables", this is about _charging_ the phone, not about connecting a VR headset or the like. And if somebody thinks they can do slow-charge only and require a special cable for fast charge when USB PD could do the job, I expect the EU will come down on them like a hammer. My guess is nobody will be stupid enough to even try that.
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I don't see the EU coming down on Huawei, Anker, Samsung, Google and every other vendor that has custom charging protocols TODAY.
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Well, obviously. The law is not yet in effect. It will go into effect 2024. As you would know if you had done minimal research instead of clueless posturing. If you had done a bit more research, you would know that the EU gave phone vendors ample time to come up with their own standard and it clearly told them that things would get regulated if they failed. They failed. So things get regulated effective 2024.
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The regulation just says to use a particular connector, it does not set a protocol standard.
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And yeah it is a great idea. It's why Europe had digital mobile phones under a single standard LONG before the US did. It's why electric vehicles all use the same charger while US customers are still pawns in a format war. It's why all Europea
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Well, to be more precise, it's other industry experts taking a small bite out of Apple by having to change to an inferior standard, and using the force of "law" (or at least what purports to be law in the EU) to go along.
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Thunderbolt is far more physically robust than USB-C, and if something about it breaks, it's in the cable, not the device.
Re: clueless (Score:2)
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And even then, mostly only on their iPhones.
Even the updated new Apple TV remote now has a USB-C port for charging instead of lightning.
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for charging, and exclusive for that, Yes, they can (and must): the multiple charges hell fuck the users regularly
Re:Clueless-yes, and time for CJEU to say "Enough! (Score:4, Informative)
...
EU Politicians have no business dictating the shape or voltage of ALL PLUGS ANYWHERE that connect to a CONSUMER ELECTRONIC DEVICE. A subset of that is USB-C for iPhones.
...
Politicians have no business pretending to know jack about power receptacles, cords, plugs, etc. This is a perfect example of how idiots do stupid things when there's nobody to check them.
Well, it's a good thing that the standardisation process was driven by industry rather than politicians then. Both the current standard, and the process by which a future standard can be selected, were driven by the Commission Expert Group on Radio Equipment, which is required by EU law to have "all the relevant sectoral stakeholders represented".
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No USB-C would be a strange hill for Apple to be willing to die on. They've been slowly shifting over to USB-C over the last several years now. And December 2024? I'd be pretty surprised if Apple didn't already have internal plans for the iPhone to be on USB-C by then anyway. Hell, they used to be moving even faster towards USB-C, before the peanut gallery screamed bloody murder loud enough and for long enough that they actually backtracked and brought various legacy ports and slots back to the MacBook
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It'll probably take a few years, but government mandating technological development to stop and standardize on USB-C is stupid as hell.
Better off then what we have now. Plus what is the new connector going to be able to do that USB cant? Send power and data thru wires? Does that already. You can only throw so much power down wires.
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> what is the new connector going to be able to do
> that USB cant?
Who knows? Move more data? Move more power? Be more durable? Take up less space? Be waterproof or dustproof? Be easier to connect and disconnect? Use magnets instead of friction to stay connected like MacBook MagSafe? Do you really believe that USB-C is the be-all end-all solution and no one will ever develop anything that is technologically superior? Perhaps you should leave tech and go work for the EU's bureaucracy. You seem
Re: Clueless-yes, and time for CJEU to say "Enough (Score:2)
Don't confuse the form factor with the protocols.
Nothing prevents the protocol from being improved. USB 4 is already coming, 240W is already there, but there's no sign of needing a new connector anytime soon.
Because USB C is indeed the be all and end all for the foreseeable future. What was gimping usb A and B was the lack of pins and the fact that the pins are dedicated to their purpose only.
USB C has pins galore, and has alternate mode to dynamically allocate some points to anger protocols. So yes it will
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You're complaining about existing equipment. This will only be required on devices that come out after the enforcement date. Your existing transceiver, your laptop, and even your car won't have to get tossed in the trash.
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Uh... They do have control, in Europe. It's just that the market for phones is "global" enough that once you've produced an EU compliant phone, IE one with a USB-C charger connection, it doesn't make fiscal sense to make a different connector for elsewhere. It's like how products not produced for California still have the California cancer warning on them.
I mean, everything you mentioned you mention US approvals. FCC is US. DOT is US, etc...
Okay, your DOT vehicle doesn't charge via USB-C. That's fine,
Re: Clueless-yes, and time for CJEU to say "Enough (Score:2)
Oneplus has dash charge and now warp charge which are just oppo's vooc v2 and v4 rebranded.
It's a bad non standard protocol because contrary to most other fast charging protocols, it uses 5 pins. On the charger side, the usb A connector has a fifth pin behind the 4 standard ones. It requires a special usb cable with that 5th pin.
Most new chargers now support most charging protocols, from PD to quick charge, to whatever Samsung or apple use, but none I've seen support vooc because it needs non standard hardw
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So, in short, given the extra power available with USB-C, while you might still need Oneplus specific chargers for older equipment (and the EU isn't talking about forcing changes in existing equipment), at least NEW oneplus phones should be straight USB-C and no need for specific oneplus stuff for fast charging?
Seems to be a positive change for me.
I at least had some specific sympathy for Tesla's proprietary charge plug/port for their cars because at least at the time, other charging plugs had two problems(
Re: Clueless-yes, and time for CJEU to say "Enoug (Score:2)
I don't know, I've read the text quickly but i didn't see much regarding whether PD must be supported and whether other protocols are allowed.
I just hope manufacturers just hop on the PD train and that if they have their own secret sauce protocol, that they at least support standard PD too.
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I think that deliberately not supporting a protocol that is part of the USB-C standard in favor of your own secret sauce solution in order to force buyers to buy YOUR chargers in order to have full functionality(IE fast charging) would be something to get European regulators to perk up and start asking questions, and probably start charging fines after a bit.
It's also something that as more get on the "PD train", the PD train gets cheaper and cheaper, to the point that after a bit, keeping up your own secre
Re: Clueless-yes, and time for CJEU to say "Enoug (Score:2)
I can only hope so, but from my understanding, USB C is indeed only the connector, not any of the protocols you can carry over it.
And there are some devices covered by that legislation that don't need PD and can do just fine with dumb 5W or the 10 or 15 W of the old battery charging protocol.
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Well, if the device isn't high power enough to need PD, then it doesn't need PD, and just needs the correct connector, kind of like the headlamp powered by an 18650 I just bought. 15W is about the max you want to charge an 18650 cell at anyways, assuming you want good battery life. Keeping it to 5W would be even better.
But the important point here would be that the charge rate of the device is limited by the physical capacities of its battery, such that it doesn't need the more advanced power protocols.
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In your mighty opinion, who should decide? Because the corporation weren't. The market? The market is a fucking joke.
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My opinion is just that. It's not mighty. Thanks for the sarcasm. Moving on,
Government has no business legislating the legality of a "connector" on a cellphone any more than, for example, declaring that AA batteries suck so everything must use AAA batteries. D Cells are deprecated by market use, so without regard to your sarcasm, that "problem" was solved by "the market."
Connectors have been used to "require" the purchase of dedicated chargers, adapters, etc. The Market has lived with this for cellphon
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Bullshit. A) they can and B) it is a really good idea to do so. That nil-wits like you scream "fascism!" is an expected side-effect. There are always the utterly dumb that are also full of themselves.
Also, you are wayyyy behind power conversion efficiencies and you have a laptop that draws more than 100W? Are you some sort of cave-man? FYI, powering a 19V laptop with 20V/5A USB-C PD works completely fine and is within spec. Unless you have a historic or ego-prosthesis type monster that really needs more tha
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Oh my, my calm words are screaming? I think you're confusing your screechy voice with mine. Mine's more baritone and calm. I'm available for ASMR chats if you can afford them. I also haven't used the word "fascism" in any form, nor even brought Mike's law into it. Let's just pretend you woke up on the wrong side of the bed and ignore your invectives.
> Also, you are wayyyy behind power conversion efficiencies and you have a laptop that draws more than 100W? Are you some sort of cave-man? FYI, poweri
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Capitals = screaming. The rest of your crap is not even worth answering to. Just one comment: 90% voltage conversion power efficiency is _historic_. You are clueless as to what you are talking about. Does fit the arrogance nicely though.
Re: Clueless-yes, and time for CJEU to say "Enough (Score:2)
Should we tell him that PD charger can convert AC to 5V, but also 9V, 15V, 20V, and thus do only one conversion, the same way with the same loss that his current power supply does?
Or that his laptop converts that 19V to 3.3, 5 and 12V internally anyway?
Or that the law doesn't cover laptops drawing more than 100W?
Or that PD can do up to 240W?
But reading him, he probably believes the CPU runs directly on 19V...
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Indeed. But I guess this moron is so deeply stuck in his messed-up fantasy that he is not capable to see actual facts. He will just keep making up more fantasies and keep lying about the actual facts. Which he likely never bothered to find out in the first place. Like that laptops >100W are exempt, for obvious reasons (which I left out, but _obviously_ the EU is not making mobile devices drawing more than 100W or later 240W illegal...).
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you have a laptop that draws more than 100W?
Not all of us are satisfied with under-powered laptops. My Precision 7560 comes with a 250 watt power supply for the dock, and a 180 watt "portable" charger. The portable charger plugs in through the "standard" round port, the dock uses two USB C connections in order to charge at full rate. If you try an run it off either a single USB, or a 90w charger it goes into "limp mode" and slow charges the battery.
Re: Clueless-yes, and time for CJEU to say "Enough (Score:2)
Good thing then that the EU lawmakers listened to the tech guys and didn't include laptops drawing more than 100 W in the list of devices that must use USB C charging.
The law specifically addresses that point, saying that they aren't covered, but considering how the PD spec evolves and can already do 240W, they may considered for inclusion at a later date.
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Moron detected. The EU only pushed for standardization. To determine which exact plug/protocol the standard must ne set, the industry engineers were called in to give the opinion. It's not politicians, it's the industry that decided USB-C.