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Google Security IT Technology

Google is Blocking RCS on Rooted Android Devices (theverge.com) 105

Google is cracking down on rooted Android devices, blocking multiple people from using the RCS message feature in Google Messages. From a report: Users with rooted phones -- a process that unlocks privileged access to the Android operating system, like jailbreaking iPhones -- have made several reports on the Google Messages support page, Reddit, and XDA's web forum over the last few months, finding they're suddenly unable to send or receive RCS messages. One example from Reddit user u/joefuf shows that RCS messages would simply vanish after hitting the send button. Several reports also mention that Google Messages gave no indication that RCS chat was no longer working, and was still showing as connected and working in Google Messages. In a statement sent to the Verge where we asked if Google is blocking rooted devices from using RCS, Google communications manager Ivy Hunt said the company is "ensuring that message-issuing/receiving devices are following the operating measures defined by the RCS standard" in a bid to prevent spam and abuse on Google Messages. In other words, yes, Google is blocking RCS on rooted devices.
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Google is Blocking RCS on Rooted Android Devices

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  • They way we tell you!
    • by ChunderDownunder ( 709234 ) on Friday March 01, 2024 @11:04AM (#64281992)

      Well to the extent that corporations engage in the security theatre of 2FA via messages sent to a phone number then RCS might be a better option than SMS.

      In reality, there are no open source client implementations of the RCS protocol, if you want to use that feature, you abide by their restrictions.

    • I do not understand your point. A rooted Android device is one the user has modified the OS from Google's supported versions. A feature like RCS breaking in an unsupported version of software should not be news to anyone. There are risks to using unsupported software.
      • Its a protocol. Not a piece of software. So it is a power grab to block it on devices they dont completely control.
        • by UnknowingFool ( 672806 ) on Friday March 01, 2024 @01:18PM (#64282530)

          Its a protocol. Not a piece of software. So it is a power grab to block it on devices they dont completely control.

          It is a protocol created and designed by Google. Remember Google RCS is not stock RCS (Universal Profile) as Universal Profile does not offer end-to-end encryption. In their public complaints about Apple not using their RCS, they fail to mention this little fact over and over again pretending their version of RCS is some sort of universal standard protocol. It is not. As it is their protocol, they can do whatever they want including not supporting it on modified, unsupported Android.

          • Comment removed based on user account deletion
            • Not supporting something generally means if you can get it to work more power too you but we're not going to spend a dime on it.

              No. Not supporting means if it breaks, it breaks. If you can fix, that's on you but there are no guarantees if can be fixed.

              This is an active act of willful sabotage. Going out of their way to discriminate and break something that really doesn't have any technical dependency on root status or no root status.

              Google RCS messages are encrypted end-to-end meaning there has to be security trust at multiple layers like the hardware and the OS. If the OS has been rooted, then there is no trust that the OS is secure anymore. Yes that is Google's decision but I cannot see how they can guarantee that messages are secure while working in an unsecured OS.

              • Comment removed based on user account deletion
                • Does guarantees are not appropriate to claims of security. Probability projections sure. But no one who understands security would ever guarantee any claim.

                  And Google knowing the OS is not secure is going to allow encrypted messages to be passed anyway? If you want to create your own E2EE messaging protocol and allow it to be used on rooted Android, go ahead. Google does not have to do that with their own protocol. I am sure all the other messaging apps like WhatsApp [whatsapp.com] or Telegram [telegram.org] is fully supported with rooted Android. Oh wait, they are not.

                  • Comment removed based on user account deletion
                    • This is not a closed project on a private campus. They already sent it out into the world and and so it is nearly a component for other people to modify as they see fit. Claims of ownership lose their power when you leave your stuff scattered all over other people's property.

                      Please cite where they gave up ownership of their version of RCS. That is like saying because my USB cables are all over my house, I own all the IP associated with USB.

                    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
                    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
                    • So I can make all the USB cables I want then? What you mean I don't own USB. YOU LIED TO ME!!
                    • Not what you said. I own USB. You said it.
                  • by Anonymous Coward
                    Nothing about the RCS standard - not the original open standard, nor Google's proprietary extension of it - requires the OS to be "secured" (read: not have root access) to allow E2E encrypted communications. That's just stupid. What you're effectively saying is it would be totally ok for Google to disable HTTPS in Chrome if used on a Linux machine that has a root user. Never thought I'd see the day morons on Slashdot would support the "Extinguish" step after Embracing and Extending, but here we are.
                    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
                    • Nothing about the RCS standard - not the original open standard, nor Google's proprietary extension of it - requires the OS to be "secured" (read: not have root access) to allow E2E encrypted communications.

                      Sigh. Universal Profile has not E2EE. Google RCS requires E2EE. Trying to communicate securely in an unsecured environment like a rooted Android is stupid.

                      That's just stupid. What you're effectively saying is it would be totally ok for Google to disable HTTPS in Chrome if used on a Linux machine that has a root user.

                      Google does not own HTTPS so that is irrelevant. HTTPS is also a standard that Google does not control. Google RCS is not standard RCS

                      Never thought I'd see the day morons on Slashdot would support the "Extinguish" step after Embracing and Extending, but here we are.

                      I never thought I see the day morons would require a software company that they must support software they did not control nor release. If you want Google RCS, use stock Android. It is that simple. If you root Android and R

                  • I'm not completely convinced that you know what it means to root an Android device. It definitely doesn't mean that the device is "insecure". It just means that the user has root access to the device, so they can make whatever changes they want to. It doesn't mean that J Random Hacker gets a free invite to snoop around.

  • who cares (Score:2, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward

    apple is the worst for not implementing RCS the way gooogle WANTS!!! *cry*

    • Yeah - i was just thinking that kills Google's high ground on the Apple imesage stuff (which is a shame because I'd love for Apple to impliment RCS).

      • by ceoyoyo ( 59147 )

        I don't understand why these Android users don't just download a non-Google RCS app. Unlike iMessage it's an open standard and all, right? Right?

        • by UnknowingFool ( 672806 ) on Friday March 01, 2024 @12:38PM (#64282348)
          It's probably because the app is very hard to find. I found it on alternate store where the English instructions where terrible. Incidentally the same company made a winning lottery ticket generator. They just needed all my banking info so they could directly deposit all my winnings.
          • by ceoyoyo ( 59147 )

            Ah, I think I've gotten a few phone calls from that company. They'd like me to go to the store and buy some Amazon gift cards so the police won't arrest me.

  • I'm on a rooted phone and rcs works for me?

  • Security (Score:5, Informative)

    by backslashdot ( 95548 ) on Friday March 01, 2024 @10:43AM (#64281946)

    Google is probably correct here, but ironically if you know what you're doing you can do a more valid test of security with a rooted a device than none.

    • Re:Security (Score:4, Insightful)

      by GameboyRMH ( 1153867 ) <gameboyrmh@@@gmail...com> on Friday March 01, 2024 @11:06AM (#64281998) Journal

      I don't see how there's any more justification to prevent rooted phones from using RCS than there would be to prevent them from using SMS. It looks to me like Google is just taking yet another opportunity to make Android a little more like a walled garden by making rooting more difficult and impractical, as usual.

      • I don't see how there's any more justification to prevent rooted phones from using RCS than there would be to prevent them from using SMS.

        Besides the fact that RCS messages are encrypted end-to-end and using a rooted phone breaks security? Other than inherent security risks, no other reason.

        It looks to me like Google is just taking yet another opportunity to make Android a little more like a walled garden by making rooting more difficult and impractical, as usual.

        No. Rooting is still as simple to implement as ever; however, no one at Google ever guaranteed that a rooted Android device works exactly the same as stock Android. In fact, Google has stated that there are risks to rooting your Android. It is almost the same warnings Google as using an alternate store. You can do it; Google warns you that there are risks.

        • Besides the fact that RCS messages are encrypted end-to-end and using a rooted phone breaks security? Other than inherent security risks, no other reason.

          LOLWUT? How would the phone being rooted break E2EE? Do you think general-purpose desktop computers suffer from the same issue? Because by this logic there would be no secure way to implement E2EE on an ordinary Windows or Linux PC.

          No. Rooting is still as simple to implement as ever

          I see you're not familiar with how much more difficult rooting Android phones has become over roughly the last half-dozen Android versions, and how newer versions have also allowed non-root apps to do less and less, also making rooting more necessary. Google warning people that t

          • Do you think general-purpose desktop computers suffer from the same issue?

            Nope, they don't. They hear a big multinational screaming "see-kur-a-tea" from the rooftops and their brains shut off like the good little convenient sheep that they are.

            Not that they'd have any knowledge to even try to make sense of it anyway. A good sheep doesn't learn about technology, they only use it. Then when it fails, they bitch, moan, and pay more rent money. Ya know, progress.

    • by hawk ( 1151 )

      >Google is probably correct here,

      Yet they complain about apple having the same concern.

      Obviously, they should let rooted phones use RCS, but color the messages from such phones a disturbing shade of mauve.

      hawk

  • TLA explainer (Score:4, Informative)

    by Errol backfiring ( 1280012 ) on Friday March 01, 2024 @10:50AM (#64281960) Journal
    Here's a link to wat RCS actually is [wikipedia.org].
  • by _merlin ( 160982 ) on Friday March 01, 2024 @11:07AM (#64282006) Homepage Journal

    My new Android phone has a nasty habit of pressuring me to agree to an obnoxious Google "privacy policy" and enable RCS. I wish it would just stop. If I root my phone, will it stop bothering me? Sounds like a reason to root my phone.

    • by jenningsthecat ( 1525947 ) on Friday March 01, 2024 @11:49AM (#64282144)

      My new Android phone has a nasty habit of pressuring me to agree to an obnoxious Google "privacy policy" and enable RCS. I wish it would just stop. If I root my phone, will it stop bothering me? Sounds like a reason to root my phone.

      If you're lucky enough to have a phone supported by LineageOS, there's no reason to root, and no reason to put up with Google's obnoxious BS. Just install Lineage WITHOUT all the Google nonsense. Become familiar with F-Droid and with sideloading APK's downloaded from trustworthy sources. Migrate from Gmail - you shouldn't be on that crap anyway - to Protonmail.

      It's a tradeoff - installing an alternate OS isn't for the faint of heart and can occasionally result in bricking a device. And there's a loss of convenience that results from not letting Google own all your shit. I'm ornery and obstinate enough to accept those downsides. In return I get to extend the middle fingers of both hands to the obnoxious Big G. If I'm ever in the position of being unable to do that, I'll go back to a flip phone, and texting be damned.

      If I held the button that eliminated Google from the face of the earth I wouldn't be writing this, I'd be busy pressing repeatedly to make sure the job got done. Fuck Google, not gently, with a running chainsaw, sideways. And fuck Sundar Pichai's transparently phony noblesse oblige.

      • I love LineageOS and F-Droid, I wish the open source movement were larger on Android. Most app developers seem to drool at the 0.00001% chance that their app goes viral so of course they want to enable ads, while in reality making basically nothing anyway.

        However, the loss of convenience that you mention can be somewhat gradual. You can still use for example gmail and normal apps from google play store with LineageOS, which may be more or less "necessary" when you need to run an application from some clue

      • If you're lucky enough to have a phone supported by LineageOS, there's no reason to root, and no reason to put up with Google's obnoxious BS. Just install Lineage WITHOUT all the Google nonsense. Become familiar with F-Droid and with sideloading APK's downloaded from trustworthy sources. Migrate from Gmail - you shouldn't be on that crap anyway - to Protonmail.

        How do people backup their phones without root?

        • Why would you need to?
        • If you're lucky enough to have a phone supported by LineageOS, there's no reason to root, and no reason to put up with Google's obnoxious BS. Just install Lineage WITHOUT all the Google nonsense. Become familiar with F-Droid and with sideloading APK's downloaded from trustworthy sources. Migrate from Gmail - you shouldn't be on that crap anyway - to Protonmail.

          How do people backup their phones without root?

          I'm not entirely clear on the extent of backup you're referring to; but for things like contacts, texts, and photos, I just plug the phone into my computer's USB port and copy files. In the case of texts I use an app called 'SMS Backup and Restore'. It's been a while, but IIRC it creates a file which it can then restore on any phone which has it installed.

          To be fair, my usage is less demanding than that of many folks. I never let myself get sucked in to relying heavily on my phone for anything beyond texts,

      • by G00F ( 241765 )

        I need like 4 apps on my phone. Can I install gmail, google voice, and google maps?

        Its more and more of a world where you either belong to one if not multiple Microsoft, Google, Apple.

        Even my work now is basically requiring people to install MS Auth on their personal phones or they are fired.

  • My wife has been so mad that Google started shoving RCS down her throat.
    My phone's not rooted, but it uses a custom ROM with no Google apps.
    RCS has no use cases that appeal to me.

  • At least if TFS is accurate: Google is also obfuscating what it's doing - pretending things are hunky-dory, not showing there's any problem with your messaging connectivity, but quietly sending the messages off into the ether.

    Seems pretty actively evil, at least to me.

    • by ichthus ( 72442 ) on Friday March 01, 2024 @12:15PM (#64282272) Homepage
      That's not at all what happens. The sending of messages fails, and you're notified as such. It gives you the option of retrying with RCS (which will repeatedly fail), or switching the conversation to SMS/MMS and re-sending.
      • That's not at all what happens. The sending of messages fails, and you're notified as such. It gives you the option of retrying with RCS (which will repeatedly fail), or switching the conversation to SMS/MMS and re-sending.

        Sure, 8 hours later. Go ahead and ask me how I know and why I disable RCS.

    • Google is also obfuscating what it's doing - pretending things are hunky-dory, not showing there's any problem with your messaging connectivity, but quietly sending the messages off into the ether.

      I don't understand. If someone has rooted their device what expectation of support do they expect from Google? If I've modified or replaced the engine in my Honda with a third party, I don't expect to demand Honda fix anything that went wrong afterwards. RCS messages are unreliable if someone has rooted their Android. And?

      • Comment removed based on user account deletion
        • It's because they are spending money in programmer time to actively sabotage the functionality that technically has no dependency on whether you have root or not.

          Citation needed. Google's exact answer is they are "ensuring that message-issuing/receiving devices are following the operating measures defined by the RCS standard”. The author then cried "Help, help, I'm being repressed!"

          Do not support something is to ignore it. They are actively attacking it. So that's why people are reacting. If you're actively sabotaging then if the company would say we're at war with root and will do anything to frustrate users attempts to bring their devices behavior into compliance with their own needs.

          Again citation needed. What actions are "actively sabotaging" and "actively attacking". Google like any software company made changes to their software which broke 3rd party unsupported versions. Since they were unsupported, Google is not going to fix it.

          • Comment removed based on user account deletion
            • Comment removed based on user account deletion
              • Google owns the RCS Protocol in Google's RCS App. It is not the phone owner's protocol.
                • Comment removed based on user account deletion
                  • Anything that comes on the phone belongs to the owner of the device. The action of distribution is louder than declaration of intent. Actions are always more credible than words.

                    That is idiotic at best. If I buy a phone does not mean I own the patents in the phone. I do not own the copyrights of the software. I cannot take my phone to a manufacturer and have a million copies made. Dude, face it, you have no real arguments and are just grasping at straws.

                    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
                    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
                    • Patents are only redeemable in court. Until then physical reality and physical measure reigns supreme. Patents only applied commercial operations not to real life outside the commercial compromise, in which a person is modifying something found in their environment for personal utility.

                      Dude, you are just spouting nonsense. You had no points.

                    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
                    • Ooh ooh I can do that too. Bears are really kangaroos because I made words on a page.

                      Yes a perfect example of the points you've been making. Illogical and have nothing to do with anything. Thank you for agreeing with me that you make no sense.

            • Actively looking for root and discriminating based on it t To activate alternate instruction branches.

              What? Rooting a device changes many things about it like permissions. Rooting a device also signals it is not the same version that Google supports. Why do you have such a persecution complex that Google not supporting a version they did not create is "discriminating".?

              It's going to be broken anyway. It was overzealous for Google to ever claim they could control it.

              It is Google's RCS protocol. They can do whatever they want. Why do you feel entitled to control their protocol?

              All this does is waste money, and makes it even harder for users and owners of their devices to administer and control their own physical properties behaviors.

              What does wasting money have anything to do with anything. You want Google RCS, use stock Android. It is that simple. If you root

  • ... give rooted phones green text bubbles and move on.

  • Imagine thinking that you've allowed to repair your phone but not keep your data without using a surveillance company's cloud backup service.

    With the demise of Titanium Backup, Swift Backup has done a good job of letting you get a secure and complete backup, but you must root to do it, due to Google's anticompetitive measures.

    RCS was already an uphill battle and good luck with that if you're losing the Alpha Geeks.

    I got my Signal username yesterday - good times.

  • People who root their devices may use RCS and ensure they use real E2Em instead of one app that probably is spoofable and tappable...

    So No RCS for you! (think Soup-Nazi guy voice)

  • DOA (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Generic User Account ( 6782004 ) on Friday March 01, 2024 @12:28PM (#64282318)

    That makes RCS dead on arrival. If there is no chance that everybody can use it, everybody is going to use something else.

    • You have it wrong. (Score:3, Informative)

      by Gravis Zero ( 934156 )

      From what I can tell, Google is actually just locking the "Google Messages" app to signed Android firmwares. This doesn't lock anyone out from communicating with RCS.

      "Google Messages" specifically connects to the "Jibe Cloud" and almost certainly, someone will make an open source RCS client. Now, if Google is a dick and decides only "Google Messages" can use the "Jibe Cloud" then it's still not locking everyone out because you can register your own RCS Instant Messenger System (IMS) to communicate with "Jib

      • From what I can tell, Google is actually just locking the "Google Messages" app to signed Android firmwares. This doesn't lock anyone out from communicating with RCS.

        This article is literally about users on legit Android phones who unlock root losing access to RCS. If I want to make a full backup of my phone, why should I silently be locked out from messaging?

        "Google Messages" specifically connects to the "Jibe Cloud" and almost certainly, someone will make an open source RCS client. Now, if Google is a dick and decides only "Google Messages" can use the "Jibe Cloud" then it's still not locking everyone out because you can register your own RCS Instant Messenger System (IMS) to communicate with "Jibe Cloud" via "Jibe Hub".

        Every cell carrier in the US has signed up to use Google's Jibe servers for RCS instead of running their own. RCS isn't part of open source Android so Google Messages relies upon proprietary Google Play APIs for RCS. The only clients implementing and allowed to use Google proprietary extensions are Google Messages

        • This article is literally about users on legit Android phones who unlock root losing access to RCS.

          Read closer because it specifies "Google Messages".

          The only clients implementing and allowed to use Google proprietary extensions are Google Messages and Samsung's licensed version.

          However, the core of RCS (text communication) is still supported which means those can be implemented using the specification. Sure, you won't get all the dumb extensions but not many people use then and the people that do aren't rooting their phones.

  • by cstacy ( 534252 ) on Friday March 01, 2024 @01:52PM (#64282658)

    You should not be using root for RCS.
    Did you do it that way with SCCS?
    Really you ought to switch to CVS.
    Or maybe git!

  • and move on...
  • Where we don't use SMS apart from when we want to be sure the message will be received. RCS doesn't ensure that.

    Right now, RCS is just Google's latest attempt to gain some market share in the instant messaging business.

    Even if it were to become fully supported by smartphones and mobile carriers, it would still require an Internet connection to receive the messages.
    And the optional SMS fallback only works when the sender doesn't have an Internet connection.

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