To Replace HexChat, Linux Mint is Building a New Desktop Chat App Called 'Jargonaut' (omgubuntu.co.uk) 40
Ubuntu-based Linux Mint includes HexChat software by default "to offer a way for users of the distro to talk to, ask questions, and get support from other users," according to the Linux blog OMG Ubuntu.
But in February HexChat's developer announced its final release... That got devs thinking. As is, IRC isn't user-friendly. It's a kind of an arcane magic involving strange commands. Its onboarding is obtuse. And the protocol doesn't natively support things like media sharing (screenshots are useful when troubleshooting), clickable links, or other modern "niceties". And yet, IRC is a fast, established, open, and versatile protocol... It's free and immediate (no sign-up required to use it) which makes it ideal for 'when you need it' use.
So work has begun on a new dedicated "chat room" app to replace HexChat, called Jargonaut. Linux Mint's goal is not to build a fully-featured IRC client, or even an IRC client at all. Jargonaut is a chat app that just happens to use IRC as its underlying chat protocol. Users won't need to know what IRC is nor learn its syntax, as Jargonaut isn't going to respond to standard IRC commands... When the app is opened Linux Mint's official support channels are there, ready to engage with. A real-time support chat app built on IRC — with additional bells:
"[Jargonaut] will support pastebin/imgur via DND, uploading your system specifications, troubleshooting and many features which have nothing to do with IRC," says Linux Mint lead Clement Lefebvre in the distro's latest monthly update. "HexChat was a great IRC client which helped us make a relatively good support chat room. We're hoping Jargonaut will help us make this chat room even better and much easier to use."
"Like most of Linux Mint's home-grown XApps the new app is hosted on Github," the article points out, "which is where you should go t to check in on Jargonaut's current status, check out the code and compile it, or contribute to its development with your own fair hands."
The article also argues that IRC "isn't as trendy as Discord or Telegram, but it is a free, open standard that no single entity controls, is relatively low-bandwidth, interoperable, and efficient."
But in February HexChat's developer announced its final release... That got devs thinking. As is, IRC isn't user-friendly. It's a kind of an arcane magic involving strange commands. Its onboarding is obtuse. And the protocol doesn't natively support things like media sharing (screenshots are useful when troubleshooting), clickable links, or other modern "niceties". And yet, IRC is a fast, established, open, and versatile protocol... It's free and immediate (no sign-up required to use it) which makes it ideal for 'when you need it' use.
So work has begun on a new dedicated "chat room" app to replace HexChat, called Jargonaut. Linux Mint's goal is not to build a fully-featured IRC client, or even an IRC client at all. Jargonaut is a chat app that just happens to use IRC as its underlying chat protocol. Users won't need to know what IRC is nor learn its syntax, as Jargonaut isn't going to respond to standard IRC commands... When the app is opened Linux Mint's official support channels are there, ready to engage with. A real-time support chat app built on IRC — with additional bells:
"[Jargonaut] will support pastebin/imgur via DND, uploading your system specifications, troubleshooting and many features which have nothing to do with IRC," says Linux Mint lead Clement Lefebvre in the distro's latest monthly update. "HexChat was a great IRC client which helped us make a relatively good support chat room. We're hoping Jargonaut will help us make this chat room even better and much easier to use."
"Like most of Linux Mint's home-grown XApps the new app is hosted on Github," the article points out, "which is where you should go t to check in on Jargonaut's current status, check out the code and compile it, or contribute to its development with your own fair hands."
The article also argues that IRC "isn't as trendy as Discord or Telegram, but it is a free, open standard that no single entity controls, is relatively low-bandwidth, interoperable, and efficient."
Why replace HexChat? (Score:5, Insightful)
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They figure anyone who wants it can get it meanwhile they have a chance to make an foss standard that can compete with Slack... maybe.
I can't be the only one who thinks slack is a massive step backward despite it's slightly superior feature set. See IRC clients kinda already support everything that it does but they're not as user friendly and there is little assurance that other users support all these bolted on features.
This could provide companies with a clear cheaper alternative. IRC is cheap. Cheap a
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Not invented here syndrome. They didn’t invent it, therefore it is bad.
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If you want to make a new IRC client, fine, but why remove the old standby?
A person presented with an app to get help knows which app to use. A person presented with two apps does not. You just have to go into a typical subway and see a long queue of people caused almost entirely by analysis-paralysis - being presented with too many options causing you to slow down and become confused as to what you actually want. The same applies elsewhere.
More software options may be better for general utility of a PC, but they are not better for doing a specific task. Additionally for a chat ba
Re: Why replace HexChat? (Score:4, Informative)
Because "in February HexChat's developer announced its final release". And there probably won't be anyone else to take over, either, after the project didn't even make the move to gtk 3 because it was too much work.
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HexChat started as a Windows recompile of XChat, because XChat for Windows turned into a paid for app, while XChat was still GPL (the Windows licensing bit was closed-source code). So a few developers took over recompiling XChat for Windows by forking XChat. Eventually it became HexChat and became multiplatform again.
But due to lack of developers, HexChat is no longer being developed.
Funny enough, Wikipedia's "XChat" entry points to HexChat, I didn't expect that.
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Why not contribute instead of complaining about the people who give you free stuff? They're not beholden to you. If you think someone should continue HexChat, do so. I know, you can't, for reasons. What makes you think you can tell someone else to do the things you can't or won't do?
Boo hoo (Score:2, Interesting)
If the kids these days find HexChat too hard to use, they should try BitchX
Old (Score:2)
BitchX? You were lucky. I had to learn on ircii.
Re: Old (Score:3)
mirc here! and we did have irc bots to share mp3s and search people's collections, pre Napster! Great times... /slap JBMcB
Re: Old (Score:3)
ehh had my timeline confused and Google corrected me. Good god i was a decade after you!
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we had to make do with pigeons!
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Try telnet-ing to a specific port.
Each port later became a channel in IRC.
You had to apply for a login, then use telnet once approved. Most servers has 20-30 ports and each port had several hundred users, and no scroll back buffer.
No services, your login was your name. No colors. Talk moving too fast for ascii art (was all messed up by others).
There were the days.
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If the kids these days find HexChat too hard to use, they should try BitchX
Yep!
It's a kind of an arcane magic involving strange commands. Its onboarding is obtuse. And the protocol doesn't natively support things like media sharing
The race to the bottom has hit, well, a new bottom!
BitchX (Score:2)
I still use it. I don't like irssi and others. I wished BitchX would get security fixes. Even v1.3 developer build is very old. :(
Look at Twitch chat for an example of modern IRC (Score:2)
use. That's what's under the hood.
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I was thinking Discord. Basically IIRC for this century.
Both are terrible ways of handling support though, because they are not very searchable. Search engines don't index them. With a forum post you answer the question once and many people can find it, on IRC/Discord you end up with the same thing over and over and over and over again.
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Pfft. (Score:5, Interesting)
So, all they actually needed to do was code some extensions to HexChat, but hey, why not reinvent the wheel while you're at it. It's not like there's ever been remotely exploitable vulnerabilities in any IRC client ever so surely it must be easy to write one.
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Systemd.
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So, all they actually needed to do was code some extensions to HexChat
Best post of today.
Best post of tomorrow: "OMG why is HexChat getting so bloated. No one asked for this"
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Re: Pfft. (Score:2)
They didn't venture to replace HexChat because of that, but because development has stopped. Add functionality to a dead project? Not the brightest idea.
Peculiar choice... (Score:2)
So they want to do a bunch of stuff on top of IRC that, I suspect, will look really off to users of different IRC clients...
Meanwhile, you have Matrix, Mattemost, RocketChat, and probably several other chat platforms with these sorts of features baked in. You get the benefit of open ecosystem but with a more "fancy" baseline for the ecosystem to be on board with.
IRC was never intended to be "extended" so the likelihood of a rich chat client gracefully degrading is limtited.
Now maybe someone shows me the pla
Ximian (Score:2)
At some point Ximian had Ximian Chat for exactly that same purpose .
It was an idea that could have gone further but Ximian disappeared and on we went and the concept flew in the night.
Hit Help in any application and the chat would go in the proper help channel was what it was headed to.
Maybe there's a good chance with Mint chipping in.
When AOL did this... (Score:2)
EFNet banned all of AOL.
Because Nobody Should Have to Learn Anything (Score:1)
I can see a reason someone might develop a new IRC client if HexChat is going to cease further development, but because IRC isn't "user friendly" enough is absolutely not one of them. The barrier to entry for IRC is already extremely low, if you want Discord, just use Discord.
A major driving factor of enshittification of software is this foolish thought that because you cannot just look at a user interface and immediately intuit how to use it, that it is somehow bad design or bad software. Powerful tools re
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just look at a user interface and immediately intuit how to use it, that it is somehow bad design or bad software
It 100% is.
I maybe shouldn't be able to squeeze all 100% of a piece of software without reading the manual, but I should be able to do or at least easily find 95% of what an app is capable of.
That assume there is documentation and that it is well written, which is even more rare than good software.
Re: Because Nobody Should Have to Learn Anything (Score:1)
Your assertion that it is bad design immediately makes most command line tools, the most powerful and useful software in the technical arsenal, fall under bad design, and that's just not true.
Computers are tools, maybe the most powerful tools ever devised by man, and tools require skill to use.
The programming tools (all GUI) that I use for industrial controllers are not intuitive and you often require training to use effectively. The reason they are complex is the task they are designed to do is complex, an
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Your assertion that it is bad design immediately makes most command line tools, the most powerful and useful software in the technical arsenal, fall under bad design, and that's just not true.
It 100% is, since all of those tools require a second computer to know how to use them.
Useful in the right hands sure, but a pain in the ass to use.
Re: Because Nobody Should Have to Learn Anything (Score:2)
If application 1 and application 2 do identical things but application 1 requires extensive training and manual references, while any idiot can figure out application 2, which do you think will be more successful?
I could waste my time mastering application 1 so I can feel superior about myself, or have more time to do actual work using application 2.