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Twitter Censorship

To Fight Censorship Order, X.com Announces It's Ending Business Operations in Brazil (engadget.com) 163

X.com "says it's ending business operations in Brazil effective immediately," reports Engadget, "but the service will remain available to users in the country." The company says Alexandre de Moraes, the president of the Superior Electoral Court and a justice of the Supreme Federal Court, threatened one of X's legal representatives with arrest if it did not "comply with his censorship orders." According to Reuters, de Moreas demanded that X remove certain content from its platform.

Rather than comply, X has opted to end its local operations "to protect the safety of our staff."

According to X, de Moraes made the threat in a "secret order," which it shared publicly. X owner Elon Musk claimed that the demand "would require us to break (in secret) Brazilian, Argentinian, American and international law."

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To Fight Censorship Order, X.com Announces It's Ending Business Operations in Brazil

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  • by quonset ( 4839537 ) on Saturday August 17, 2024 @01:44PM (#64714046)

    Here is how ol Musty caved to Turkey [imgur.com] when told he had to censor posts by opposition candidates.

    Funny how he had no problem breaking American or "international law" back then to enable censorship.

    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Saturday August 17, 2024 @01:58PM (#64714072) Homepage Journal

      The fact that Musk does censor twitter (try entering the words "cis" or "cisgender") is going to scupper his lawsuit against advertisers. Clearly he does recognize the need for some moderation, even if it's the wrong moderation.

      • Also, some of the types of censorship they perform still technically allows a user to speak, but their posts are essentially hidden. I've managed to earn myself one of those types of shadowbans, ostensibly because my usage patterns on X lead to my account being falsely flagged by their bot detection algorithm. I say "ostensibly" because I'm unapologetically a gay man who doesn't have much love for what passes for right-wing politics these days.

        That being said, it's Musk's dime and he can run the site the

        • I suggest Mastodon. Try tech.lgbt [instances.social]
        • by VaccinesCauseAdults ( 7114361 ) on Saturday August 17, 2024 @05:34PM (#64714460)
          I got banned from Twitter for saying (exact quote): âoeFuck off and die you dumb Nazi cunt.â This message was to a Holocaust-denying fascist Nazi who poster AI-generated false images of Auschwitz concentration survivors enjoying a nice swimming pool for pleasure (an event that never happened) instead of being exterminated in âoeshowersâ. On Elon Musk disinformation platforms, freedom of speech and censorship is a very organic and nuanced concept.
        • it's Musk's dime and he can run the site the way he wants to.

          This also means everyone else is allowed to criticize him all the want about it. Which seems to offend some people that liberty runs two ways. It's "cancelling" if they disapprove, but a mere "boycott" if they do approve. Musk can be pro-liberty one day and anti-liberty the next, depending upon how he thinks the money will flow, but everyone else can call him out on it if they want.

      • (try entering the words "cis" or "cisgender")

        "Those damn alphabet people with their pride parades and special labels. Why can't we have the same thing for us straight folks?"

        "Okay. You're a cisgendered heterosexual. Feel free to have your own parade whenever you want."

        "What did you just call me?!"

        "sigh"

        • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Saturday August 17, 2024 @04:08PM (#64714314) Homepage Journal

          It's all because his estranged daughter is trans and he's very upset about it. Things she is a victim of the "woke mind virus".

          Most parents would be happy if their children are happy, but not Musk.

          • by thegarbz ( 1787294 ) on Saturday August 17, 2024 @06:04PM (#64714494)

            Most parents would be happy if their children are happy, but not Musk.

            Most parents wouldn't name their kids Azure, Exa Dark Sideræl, or X AE A-XII. Though maybe he's so upset at the very normally named "Vivian" being transgender than he figured if he fucked up their lives enough with a completely batshit name they would be too mentally pre-occupied to consider a sex-change.

            • by Mal-2 ( 675116 )

              At least there's plenty of precedent for males being named Vivian, if he doesn't want to change that.

          • It's all because his estranged daughter is trans

            I have a hunch this offends him due to his deep belief Earth is suffering from an underpopulation crisis. He's helping with this "cause" by trying to have tens of children, and he certainly expects those children will follow his footsteps and do similarly.

            Now, going through surgery generally causes a trans person to become infertile, which means Vivian would have violated Musk's desire for her to father him 15 grandchildren, 225 great-grandchildren, 3375 great-great-grandchildren etc. Hence his hate: "the w

            • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

              Perhaps, but I think it's just that he considers himself to have superior genetics and thinks he has a duty to spread them far and wide. Many of the mothers of his children are senior staff at his companies too. Grimes in currently in a custody battle with him over their children, who she alleges that he neglects.

              Given Musk's vast wealth, if he was really that concerned about his genetic legacy, he could have had his daughter's sperm frozen for use later. A lot of trans people have sperm/eggs frozen before

      • by Shemmie ( 909181 )

        The fact that Musk does censor twitter (try entering the words "cis" or "cisgender")

        https://x.com/search?q=cisgend... [x.com]

        Someone said it 5 minutes ago?

        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

          If you tweet "cis" or "cisgender" your post will have limited visibility. You can appeal it and they almost always grant the appeal.

          There are also some accounts that are exempt. They are all conservative/far right accounts, and they can use things like the n word without their posts being restricted. They are generally speaking able to break most Twitter rules with impunity.

          That's what passes for free speech on Musk's Twitter.

          • by Local ID10T ( 790134 ) <ID10T.L.USER@gmail.com> on Saturday August 17, 2024 @07:35PM (#64714624) Homepage

            If you tweet "cis" or "cisgender" your post will have limited visibility.

            To be fair... those are considered pejorative terms by many of the people they apply to.

            • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

              by Powercntrl ( 458442 )

              To be fair... those are considered pejorative terms by many of the people they apply to.

              That'd be like a Christian being offended by someone saying "Merry Christmas", because hearing it also happens to remind them of all the religions that don't celebrate.

            • Re: (Score:2, Flamebait)

              by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

              Yes, and Musk is one of those who believes that "cisgender" is a slur. Of course it's not, in the same way that describing someone as straight or heterosexual isn't.

              We had all this with gay people. Some people just wanted it to be "normal" and "pervert", for their own bigoted reasons.

      • > The fact that Musk does censor twitter (try entering the words "cis" or "cisgender") is going to scupper his lawsuit against advertisers. Clearly he does recognize the need for some moderation, even if it's the wrong moderation.

        What does that have to do with a lawsuit over collusion in the advertising market by an organization that controls most of the online ad spend?

        I mean, you can read it right here [courthousenews.com]. I've gone through it and I really can't see how deciding that certain words may be forbidden when u

        • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

          I recommend Lawful Masses video on YouTube about it. He's an actual lawyer and explains the weaknesses of the lawsuit.

          Another example is Musk said that he wouldn't tolerate calling conservatives "weird", when that was trending on Twitter. So he clearly recognizes the need to limit the content on the platform, because he finds some of it offensive to the point of being unacceptable even to Mr. Free Speech Absolutionist.

          Which rather undermines his argument that advertisers shouldn't care about the Nazis and o

          • I'm sure there are many arguments they can go over in court, but that is a very weak argument, because individual advertisers could simply have their own standards to protect their own brands. Why does a need for moderation mean that competitors controlling the majority of online ad spend need to work together on this? Can't they set their own standards and agree or disagree on whether to advertise in a place?

            The legal issue isn't that they want to protect their brands, the legal issue is because you have

            • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

              A court isn't going to care that they outsourced their standards vetting to an industry body. Not only is that pretty much standard practice in the business, not least because they want to say to offer their clients the standard safe option that guarantees they won't be getting bad publicity by appearing next to Nazis.

              It's not a conspiracy, it's how industries work. Musk thinks that major brands would choose to show up next to the N word and worse if only it wasn't for the "conspiracy", but the reality is t

      • The fact that Musk does censor twitter (try entering the words "cis" or "cisgender") is going to scupper his lawsuit against advertisers. Clearly he does recognize the need for some moderation, even if it's the wrong moderation.

        And lets not forget his buddy DeSantis [nbcnews.com] literally burning... sorry, "hauling" books away to the landfill [apnews.com]:

        “We abolished the gender studies program. Now we’re throwing out the trash,” Christopher Rufo, a DeSantis appointee to the Sarasota college’s governing board, posted Friday on X, formerly Twitter.

        That's not to say that Brazil is in the right here... but the post makes no mention of what this content is, so it could be anything from legit opposition speech to neo-Nazi's making death

      • by rossdee ( 243626 )

        I can remember when CIS stood for Commonwealth of Independent States
        but I don't think that Tsar Vladimir bothers with the name these days

        • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

          Cis- is from Latin, as is trans-. Both were widely used as prefixes in chemistry, before being applied to people.

          In any case, words change meaning. When most people say gay, they aren't describing a state of happiness anymore.

          • And in geography for millennia before that. Viz., Transylvania (beyond the woods), Cisalpine Gaul (Gaul on this side of the Alps).

      • I literally just posted "some nutter claims you can't post the term cisgender on x."

        It posted just fine and has been up for a while with no repercussions.

        Try again? Maybe you misspelled it.

    • by Local ID10T ( 790134 ) <ID10T.L.USER@gmail.com> on Saturday August 17, 2024 @01:58PM (#64714074) Homepage

      If the order aligns with Musk's politics, Twitter will follow it. If not, Twitter will refuse.

      Twitter is a private business. Musk can run it his way.

      He will bear the consequences for his choices, good or bad. He is wealthy and influential enough that he may be able to avoid the negative consequences coming his way... maybe. He has offended nations both friendly and unfriendly to the USA recently ("civil war is inevitable..."), that may cost him his political cover and leave him protected only by his immense wealth.

      But it is still his choice.

      • So as long as musk doesn't cross that line like Bernie Madoff or Elizabeth Holmes did he'll be just fine.

        On the other hand among the working class the slightest faux pas is enough to get you cut the pieces by your fellow members of the working class. We have absolutely no solidarity. There are people working to change that but it's slow going. There's an entire generation that grew up thinking dog eat dog competition fighting tooth and nail for every scrap is the best way to live
        • There's an entire generation that grew up thinking dog eat dog competition fighting tooth and nail for every scrap is the best way to live

          Unless that whole Star Trek post-scarcity thing happens, that's just how things are. There's not enough resources to go around for everyone to have their own McMansion in suburbia, so we play our little competitive games against each other to see who gets to be among the lucky winners.

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by GameboyRMH ( 1153867 )

      That's just a small part of it, here's how the same Musk who said he doesn't want to put his thumb on the scale is turning TwitX into a global fascism accelerator:

      https://www.wired.com/story/mu... [wired.com]

      https://www.wired.com/story/te... [wired.com]

      • That's just a small part of it, here's how the same Musk who said he doesn't want to put his thumb on the scale is turning TwitX into a global fascism accelerator:

        https://www.wired.com/story/mu... [wired.com]

        https://www.wired.com/story/te... [wired.com]

        Um ... supporting a politician or point of view that you don't like != "fascism".

        (While ironically, censorship and trying to jail your political opponents, kind of ... is.)

    • > Funny how he had no problem breaking American or "international law" back then to enable censorship.

      That was a choice between allowing the people there access to some of X or none of it, and he thought that having access to X would be beneficial because the censorship would be very leaky, as it always is.

      This action is to prevent the arrest of one of his people in Brazil on the orders of the head of the SDF (essentially the Brazilian Supreme Court).

    • Any bad new for the cesspool formerly known as Twitter is good news to me.

      Anyway, not a joke in the discussion, though it was goodish and productive FP.

  • by linebackn ( 131821 ) on Saturday August 17, 2024 @01:51PM (#64714062)

    "X.com Announces It's Ending Business Operations"

    Now, that is how it really should read.

  • by rknop ( 240417 ) on Saturday August 17, 2024 @01:57PM (#64714070) Homepage

    Nobody is really against censorship. They just get all upset when the *wrong things* get censored.

    • True enough. But there is a huge difference between "Stop publishing things I don't like" and "Stop publishing things that are likely to cause serious harm".

      That moves the question from "what constitutes censorship?" to "what is harmful enough we can all agree to ban it?", and probably opens a whole can of worms regarding what we consider as harm and what levels of harm are acceptable in the name of freedom.

      • There are ways to stop harm that don't involve censorship. If someone's mind immediately jumps to, "we must censor that!" without looking at other alternatives, then that is a problem. As an example, Slashdot found the alternative of moderating down to -1, but leaving the post on the page for anyone who wants to see it.
        • And what about convincing people horse paste cures COVID, and they should preferentially use that over doctor-recommended actions like keeping your distance from people who may be sick, or wearing masks so you don't cough virus-laden particles all over others, or (once they were available), getting vaccinated?

          A lot of people died because we didn't censor those things.

  • by SeaFox ( 739806 ) on Saturday August 17, 2024 @02:49PM (#64714168)

    They still have to follow Brazil's laws to operate at all in the country. Removing offices and employees from the land doesn't make then immune to court decisions like this.

    • And the country is able to order domestic entities to block Twitter, but it has no authority to tell it what it can publish to the Internet from servers in other jurisdictions.

      If people still access Twitter from somewhere Twitter has no legal presence... Not Elon's problem.

    • >"They still have to follow Brazil's laws to operate at all in the country. Removing offices and employees from the land doesn't make then immune to court decisions like this."

      Yes it does. If they have no business operations/holdings there (which includes taking money from any of their citizens or businesses), that is the end. If Brazil wants to try and block Twitter Twitter at the IP level, that is their prerogative. If they want to go over their own citizens for accessing the platform, that is their

  • Cry me a river (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Maclir ( 33773 )

    So Elon doesn't want to comply with a court ruling that (probably) goes against his personal viewpoints? Tough shit. The 'First Amendment' doesn't apply outside of the USA (and in the USA, only to the Government). Do the world a favor and kill Twitter / X completely.

    • Re:Cry me a river (Score:4, Informative)

      by Mitreya ( 579078 ) <mitreya.gmail@com> on Saturday August 17, 2024 @04:04PM (#64714304)

      Elon doesn't want to comply with a court ruling

      One of the particularly concerning things is the secret nature of the court order. The order requires that the censored people not be informed about why or by whom they were blocked.
      Whether or not you like Elon Musk (I am guessing not) I think you'd agree that secret censorship is pretty scary.

  • You can still access it via the twitter URL, don't let that egomaniac win.

  • And more to do with cost control and containment. I doubt they're making anything in the region and I don't think they have enough capital to spend money chasing market share right now
    • by godrik ( 1287354 )

      My guess is that twitter had very little operation in Brazil. Either in dev/op or in sales. And so cutting the operation for a handful of people and foregoing a tiny bit of ad income is not that much hurt.

      So I am guessing that Elon would rather gain PR and have an inconvenience.

      • Currently Brazil is 6th in number of users (https://www.statista.com/statistics/242606/number-of-active-twitter-users-in-selected-countries/).

        • by godrik ( 1287354 )

          I didn't know, that's interesting. Though, the real question is how big is it in term of revenue?

  • How is a one character domain name even allowed?

    Beside when I visit it just says something went wrong. That warning is right on so many levels. Is it supposed to be the new twitter or something? I don't social.
    • How is a one character domain name even allowed?

      It was intended as the original branding for what is now PayPal. "Let me X you some money." Rolls right off the tongue, like a Luden's during a sneezing fit.

      Musk just has some bizarre fascination with the twenty-fourth letter of the Latin alphabet. His obsession even went as far as naming one of his kids X.

      • I'm waiting for the rebrand of Texla.

        It's rich guy syndrome. When the retirement plan of so many employees to is to say "you're a genius boss!" whenever the rich guy has a dumb idea, the lack of negative feedback leads to strange behavior. A little bit of self doubt is good, it makes one try just a bit harder, and think just a bit more before speaking or acting. A lack of self doubt leads to hastily thought out decisions, failure to get advice, and having one's foot stuck in one's mouth for too long.

      • But that didn't answer my question; a b c and d .com don't have an assignment, I stopped there since I saw a pattern and by now I would figure that if it was supposed to be allowed they would be long since taken.

        Ok Z has an entry, but allowing this seems lame, or corrupt.
  • by poity ( 465672 ) on Sunday August 18, 2024 @01:22AM (#64715024)

    To those lurking, if the comments here read like you're on Reddit, it's because those nerds who used to host things like The Anarchist Cookbook on their ftp servers no longer post here. Now, you have a different cohort who use words that previously described physical injury ("harm") to catastrophize fleeting moments of mental discomfort.

Never test for an error condition you don't know how to handle. -- Steinbach

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