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McDonald's Touchscreen Kiosks, Feared As Job Killers, Created More Jobs Instead (cnn.com) 204

An anonymous reader quotes a report from CNN: Some McDonald's franchisees -- which own and operate 95% of McDonald's in the United States -- are now rolling out kiosks that can take cash and accept change. But even in these locations, McDonald's is reassigning cashiers to other roles, including new "guest experience lead" jobs that help customers use the kiosks and assist with any issues. "In theory, kiosks should help save on labor, but in reality, restaurants have added complexity due to mobile ordering and delivery, and the labor saved from kiosks is often reallocated for these efforts," said RJ Hottovy, an analyst who covers the restaurant and retail industries at data analytics firm Placer.ai. Kiosks "have created a restaurant within a restaurant." And in some cases, kiosks have even been a flop. Bowling ally chain Bowlero added kiosks in lanes for customers to order food and drinks, but they went unused because staff and customers weren't fully trained on using them. "The unintended consequences have surprised a lot of people," Hottovy said.

Even some of the benefits of kiosks touted by chains -- they upsell customers by suggesting menu items and speed up orders -- don't always play out. A recent study from Temple University researchers found that, when a line forms behind customers using kiosks, they experience more stress when placing their orders and purchase less food. And some customers take longer to order tapping around on kiosks and paying than they do telling a cashier they'd like to order a burger and fries. Not to mention the kiosks can malfunction or break down. "If kiosks really improved speed of service, order accuracy, and upsell, they'd be rolled out more extensively across the industry than they are today," Hottovy said.

Kiosks have also been threatened as a fast-food industry response to higher minimum wage laws. [...] But the quick-service and fast-casual segments of the restaurant industry continue to grow. Staffing levels were nearly 150,000 jobs, or 3%, above pre-pandemic levels, according to the latest Labor Department data. Christopher Andrews, a sociologist at Drew University who studies the effects of technology on work, said the impacts of kiosks were similar to other self-service technology such as ATMs and self-checkout machines in supermarkets. Both technologies were predicted to cause job losses. "The introduction of ATMs did not result in massive technological unemployment for bank tellers," he said. "Instead, it freed them up from low-value tasks such as depositing and cashing checks to perform other tasks that created value."
Self-checkout have also not resulted in retail job losses, the report adds. "In some cases, self-checkout backfired for chains because self-checkout leads to higher merchandise losses from customer errors and more intentional shoplifting than when human cashiers are ringing up customers."
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McDonald's Touchscreen Kiosks, Feared As Job Killers, Created More Jobs Instead

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  • Dupe (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward

    I wonder if BeauHD has ever met EditorDavid? [slashdot.org]

  • This driverless bus, which can do a 14 mile route over the bridge into and out of Edinburgh, actually needs 2x as many people to operate it as a regular bus which only needs one driver. I love the irony of this its classic big brain stuff. Its a page out of Yes Minister. https://news.sky.com/story/amp... [sky.com]
    • by ledow ( 319597 ) on Thursday September 26, 2024 @03:02AM (#64818411) Homepage

      It doesn't *NEED* twice as many people. They have chosen to have a driverless bus with a driver AND a ticket operator. Now with a self-driving bus, I get the former, but they could also act as the later - like almost every other bus in the country. They just choose not to.

      It's like the Docklands Light Railway. It runs perfectly fine without any staff on trains. But unions protested so they basically create fake jobs to put staff on a driverless train. Often more than one.

      Driverless trains operate in many airports in the UK and EU. They aren't manned and don't need to be. But they never used unionised drivers so they don't have that issue.

      It's not a technology issue (though I'm absolutely a self-driving skeptic - but they could easily safely operate on limited routes if someone cared, it would just be far easier to do it with a tram than a bus that can steer anywhere). It's a union issue. It's a "must have a human" issue. It's a jobs issue.

      It's always been that way. We remove jobs because we realise the job people are doing is far better done by a machine and people actually suck at it. Then we get the people up in arms because that's ALL THEY KNOW HOW TO DO. Then to appease the unions, employers employ a token workforce to do a pointless, demeaning job at great expense but minimum wage and terrible inefficiency.

      Mining, car construction, factory workers, and now restaurant staff.

      A McDonald's kiosk is FAR MORE EFFICIENT than me telling a spotty teenager my order and them getting it wrong, especially when there are exceptions in the order.

      Since the kiosks were introduced in the UK, I haven't had a wrong order and - and I have been tracking this - the number of times I get a meal that's gone cold before its even got to me has gone to zero. The reason for that is simple... the computer remembers what I told it and "presses the right buttons" in the kitchen and there are checks along the way.

      McDonald's is now actually a good place to go eat. It's a bit pricey but I often have deals and vouchers in the app that make it less so. But I can go drive there, park up, my order is already in my phone, I tap it on a kiosk, take a number and a couple of minutes later someone delivers the tray to my table. And it's now ALWAYS correct, still hot and faster.

      There are still a dozen people behind the counter but they aren't wasting their time interacting with people or waiting for that interaction. They are cooking, stocking, cleaning or delivering food to customers, that's it. It's so much more efficient than it ever was before. They have a literal queue of orders, with no actual physical queue beyond a couple of people who think standing up and tapping their fingers will make their order come quicker, and people are able to put in more orders and grab a seat without waiting for a human to be free.

      I'm sure McDonald's could bow to a union and end up putting in people who stand there doing little all day or a token guy with a pad taking orders inside the restaurant the same as they do in the drive-through.

      But that's nothing to do with the actual technology or service - that would purely be unions making fusses about obsolete jobs.

      Meanwhile the number of gig-delivery jobs where the drivers are literally queuing up in the same McDonald's to collect an order for delivery has exploded. The day we get working drones / real self-driving / etc. all their jobs will go too. And I'm pretty sure that will mean I'll get my delivery order faster, hotter and to the right address more often and far fewer illegal scooters running around London doing so (see BBC news today).

      • by unrtst ( 777550 ) on Thursday September 26, 2024 @08:32AM (#64818827)

        I'm surprised you didn't pick on the last point in TFS:

        ... similar to other self-service technology such as ATMs and self-checkout machines in supermarkets. Both technologies were predicted to cause job losses. "The introduction of ATMs did not result in massive technological unemployment for bank tellers," he said. "Instead, it freed them up from low-value tasks such as depositing and cashing checks to perform other tasks that created value."

        I could understand their other points, but that one (unemployment of bank tellers due to ATMs), though it may not have happened right away, definitely happened. Entire branches gone; Multiple branches in areas gone; Where there are tellers, they are hardly any of them. They were freed up to perform other tasks, for sure... tasks at other employers.

        • Entire branches gone; Multiple branches in areas gone; Where there are tellers, they are hardly any of them.

          This is correlation, though. Which doesn't imply causation.

          Other possible causes: the rise of online banking & the decline of physical cash & checks.

          I mean, when is the last time you have needed to go to a bank or even use an ATM in the last few years?

          These days most people I know only ever go to a branch if they need to apply for a loan, open an account or renew their mortgage. And I think that applies to ATMs as well. I honestly can't actually remember the last time I used an ATM. Probably at a Co

  • That is the true revolution. A kiosk is only good when your phone runs out of charge. The solution of that is having chargers on every table. The best solution is when your don't have to get up from your table to get your food but rather they bring it to your table number. No lines at all except in actually preparing the food.

    • by SeaFox ( 739806 ) on Wednesday September 25, 2024 @11:38PM (#64818095)

      The best solution is when your don't have to get up from your table to get your food but rather they bring it to your table number. No lines at all except in actually preparing the food.

      That is exactly how McDonald's does it. There's table-markers hanging on the kiosk and you punch in number of the marker you are taking to display at your seat when you order. They bring your order to you.

      • by taustin ( 171655 )

        Unless they run out, or their kiosks get so little use they don't bother to put the tents out.

        Ordering on the phone, with permanent numbers assigned to each table, would mitigate that. For those that have smart phones and are willing to use them thus.

        • The UK McDonalds does that as well. At our local McDonalds, you can:
          Order at the counter (though you'll have to wait, not usually very long, for a member of staff)
          Order at the kiosk, get your food at the counter, and take it to your seat.
          Order at the kiosk, take a marker and sit at a table, and your food will be brought to you
          Order on the app, get your food at the counter, and take it to your table
          Order on the app using the numbers on the table, and your food will be brought to you

          That's not counting the dr

        • Unless they run out, or their kiosks get so little use they don't bother to put the tents out.

          Ordering on the phone, with permanent numbers assigned to each table, would mitigate that. For those that have smart phones and are willing to use them thus.

          The tents turned out to be superfluous. I use the kiosks, and while the "choose your table and take a tent" option is still there - but now unused - it turns out that it is just easier for the person bringing out the food to call out the order number. Which makes sense, rather than having to walk all over the restaurant looking for a table tent.

          My guess is that the next software update won't have the tents at all.

    • What I usually do with McDonalds (and most of these fast food joints) is use my phone to order and, depending on the situation, either ordering a in-house pickup (i.e., I'm dining there) or a curbside. I haven't used a drive through in quite a while. If I was dining in, I probably would still do the same thing, unless by using a kiosk I got the food delivered to my table.

      That said, I've been to Olive Garden a few times in the last few months. They have tablets at the table. There are a lot of problems with

      • Tablets at the tables at fluffed up casual dining places like red lobster and olive garden is so dumb.
        If they're gonna do that they might as well stop decorating the insides of the restaurants and have the staff dress in fast food uniforms as it instantly shatters any illusion of class when you pick up that grease booger encrusted tablet and it asks if you wanna pay $2 to play space invaders, do you wanna donate to charity, oops hold on the UI is a little glitchy and laggy, now we're ready to take your card

    • A kiosk is only good when your phone runs out of charge.

      If your phone is out of charge then you can;t use the kiosk either, because you need the phone to pay.

    • Hahahaha if anyone thinks I'm going to use my phone. Even QR code menus are starting to go out of style.
      It's really something that these clowns thought charging an extra $1 so they could pay people was gonna make people stop going and now the dollar menu is like the 5 dollar menu and the experience is like going through the DMV but now it's ok.

    • "The solution of that is having chargers on every table." The problem is that these chargers can also be rigged by criminals to steal data or install malware on the phones they are connected to. That's why you should never use those public phone charging trees with the USB cables hanging out of them. I rather they supplied regular power outlets. I don't mind the minor inconvenience of carrying my own phone charger with me.
  • Staffing levels were nearly 150,000 jobs, or 3%, above pre-pandemic levels, according to the latest Labor Department data.

    Three percent over a period of 4 years?

    Let's compare that with population growth since early 2020, and let's acknowledge all the "better than fast-food" restaurants that shuttered their doors due to COVID and never came back. But then again, post COVID lockdown, McDonalds (for example) is now believed to be too expensive for an ever-growing segment of the US population.

    3% growth over 4 years, that's all?

    • by Waffle Iron ( 339739 ) on Wednesday September 25, 2024 @11:17PM (#64818073)

      What are you bitching about? With McDonalds' massive price gouging over the last few years, their revenues and profits have skyrocketed by almost 40% compared to pre-pandemic levels while adding only 3% more staff. That's the definition economic success.

      • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

        by luther349 ( 645380 )
        you are confusing mcdonalds the corporation thats 95% a real estate company. that is where nearly all there profits come from vs a mcdonalds franchisee who make very little in terms of margins.
      • massive price gouging

        That's the definition economic success.

        It's also the definition of a company that will see massive drop offs in long term profitability due to short term greed, but Americans always redefine that as "someone else's problem."

    • I'm rich and mcdonalds is too expensive for me. They don't deliver on anything now.
      It's not fast, not consistent, not cheap.
      The quality was never great but I dunno it's gotten to the point where I'd rather air fry some frozen fried crap than get chicken mcnuggets.

  • Lots of cheap, low paying jobs with no earning prospects.

    They're better off mopping toilets.

    • The good news is, the jobs that were feared lost because of the kiosks, were also these same cheap low-paying jobs. It's not like the kiosks were displacing "good" jobs and replacing them with low-paying ones.

  • Whoever the rocket scientist was who sold them on this technology thinking that an employee trained in their proprietary touch screen interfaces would be slower in comparison to the patron needs to be sacked. Not being a patron of fast food much at all, these things make me not want to go inside.
    • It sounds like the pinnacle of enshittified customer experience: instead of ordering with a helpful member of staff, you get to use a frustrating piece of technology, while being condescended to by that same staff member. Who is probably not too happy having to play tech support to a bunch of confused boomers.
    • (In America) the kiosk is slower to use than ordering at the register. Piss poor programming on top of Windows.

      The kiosk program oozes the feel of lazy Object Oriented design and linear thinking, ie almost everything in memory gets trimmed upon screen refresh. Then it rebuilds/repopulates the data structures from scratch.

  • ... other self-service technology ...

    It's possible to get cash from a teller, or a supermarket, or paying via EFTPoS. When a self-check-out doesn't work, that means waiting until an employee sees and fixes the problem.

    The ability of machines to do all the work has been grossly over-estimated: They run-out of paper/coins, some part becomes dirty (scanner) or defective (produce scales), or is simply ignored by the customer (bagging-scales), or fail to boot. Customers, have their own glitches; holding the product wrong, operating the EFT inc

    • Every time I go to the supermarket, whether it be Kroger or Costco, or whatever, I usually buy some kind of alcohol. I go maybe twice a month to buy these things. At most of the places, there is like one cashier, and the rest are these self-serve checkouts. If I go through a self-checkout, as soon as I scan my beer I have to screw around and wait for someone to get off their ass and walk up, not even check my ID (I'm an greybeard now), and scan their ID. On those other two times a month I'm not buying alcoh

      • Sounds like a crappy implementation. The alcohol check at our self-checkout stations takes seconds: the responsible staff member is notified immediately, they glance over (and can easily see I'm well over 18), and unlock my station from their portable terminal. It's a non-issue. Even better: my supermarket offers scan-as-you go: no more need to unpack and re-pack everything at the checkout, just pay and carry the bags out.

        while it's illegal to drink the thing going down the highway, the way people dri
  • What they need to fix is the apparent grift someone in the C suite has on their ice cream machines. When a componet of your business is so unreliable that customers need an app to know where they can find a working soft serve machine, it's time to slam the door closed on that cozy little arrangement and man up.

  • A kiosk can dispense mall shopping advice and discount codes because you won't have a line of people waiting for it. Or a restaurant that has only a small handful of items, and/or no substitutions. When the menu gets complicated, then it's just a hassle for the customer. Having soda only dispensed by a machine for in-restaurant customers makes sense, that's a pretty simple selection process. Having them do all of their own ordering, even in a fast food joint, is irritating to many of them. If they can go so

  • The registers used to be (POS-shaped) dumb terminals, all hooked to one Xenix system in the office.

    • Hahahah the one thing I was interested in during my week at mcdonalds.
      By that time they'd moved on to SCO.
      Grifts of a feather.

      • Pretty sure in between MS Xenix and SCO Unix they ran SCO Xenix.

        I used to run it myself... on a 286-6 with 1MB RAM and a 40MB disk. It was my UUCP node. SCO had a weird but good UUCP. I knew the head of the Xenix development team (about a double handful of SCO peeps were in the scruz geek scene.)

  • by taustin ( 171655 ) on Thursday September 26, 2024 @12:17AM (#64818159) Homepage Journal

    Yeah, there will be more shrink from error and theft, but the big loss on self checkout is people who simply don't buy anything because the self checkout kiosks are a) unreliable, b) complicated, c) annoying, and d) less capable (most do not take cash). That's four strikes on bad customer service.

    The places that are weathering the current downturn the best are the ones that have doubled down on live customer service, not those who have tried (often unsuccessfully, as noted in TFA) to cut costs by shitting all over customer service.

    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      It's the germs that put me off. Those touch screens are filthy and rarely get cleaned. McDonald's is finger food, so the last thing I want is to be touching something hundreds of other people touched, some of them after using the bathroom and not washing properly.

      I wish fewer public things had touchscreens. I carry a touchscreen stylus in the car for parking ticket machines and the like, but it doesn't always work. Physical buttons can always be pushed with it. The calibration on them is often way off too,

  • by bradley13 ( 1118935 ) on Thursday September 26, 2024 @01:31AM (#64818265) Homepage

    customers weren't fully trained on using them

    Um... You don't get to train your customers.

    I've used the kiosks at one fast food place a couple of times. There are a couple of problems, maybe insoluble. The kiosks have to be usable by basically anyone, so they are "dumbed down": click on the pic. Only, the pics all pretty much look the same, and anyway (unlike Japan) the pics look nothing like the food you actually get. So you have to read anyway, but the pics dominate the screen. Anyway, any simplicity is destroyed by the fact that they are trying to upsell. So you have to read carefully to get what you want, reject all the upselling offers, and then double-check your order to be sure it is correct.

    For customers who know what they want, the kiosks are a lot slower than ordering from a person. Walk up to the counter, smile, say hello-elephant-menu-medium-with-diet-coke, pay, done in seconds. At the kiosk, this same process takes minutes. And they have to have staff anyway, to help the people who get lost in the kiost menus.

  • AI will make us all unemployed just like robotics did. Oh. Wait. Uhm...
  • by crunchygranola ( 1954152 ) on Thursday September 26, 2024 @01:53AM (#64818293)

    According to TFS the number of jobs is the being kept the same. Reassigning a worker to different tasks is not creating more jobs. A job is paid labor. The kiosks actually do reduce paid labor (jobs); it is the mobile service business line which is unrelated to the kiosks that require more labor. If the kiosks were not there to save labor hiring would have increased.

  • There are millions of people who know how to use the standard McDonalds point of sale system. Maybe they should have a button that switches the gui to that design which is faster and better for the millions of people who know how to use it.

  • At least part of the problem with those kiosks is lack of standardization and/or stability of design. Just when I start to get muscle memory for self-checkout at one store, I go to another and end up looking like an idiot because my usual store lets me put things on the scale and punch in, but another one freaks out, or it doesn't prompt when I expect it too. I had this happen at Whole Amazon a while ago. Pretty embarrassing to be staring at the thing like a deer in the headlights while my mind wandered,

  • What they need is an assembly line of very stupid kiosks. The stations are

    1. Burger
    2. French Fries
    3. Salad
    4. Drinks
    5. Incidentals
    6. You get your food
    7. An automatic wrapper encases you in a slice of cheese, some wax paper, and sticks you in a paper bag before booting you out the door.

  • but they went unused because staff and customers weren't fully trained on using them.

    The Touchscreen Generation of online checkout addicts have never been “trained” on how to use a large touchscreen? To order and pay for product with? That’s hilarious.

    McDonalds may be able to partner with Taylor and corruptly fuck us all out of ice cream for years, but this is a stretch.

  • This is already creating more jobs at slashdot to post the duplicates
  • So, McDonald's (and others) are dropping their prices recently on items because they're doing so much better these days? May I have a side order of skepticism?
  • Why can't the kiosks use voice recognition and if the customer is incoherent they can patch in someone from Zimbabwe to help?

  • I like the kiosks, I can "get what I want" now. But it doesn't change the inevitable side-eye from the asst mgr, who for some reason, even though you paid for your extra sauce packets (and the next 20 in line as well, what are they, 2 cents to make?) still want to make you think you should only have the two they give you for free.
  • by DrXym ( 126579 ) on Thursday September 26, 2024 @09:56AM (#64819065)

    It takes 3x as long to order the same thing through their idiot displays and MUCH longer for the order to materialise. And the process is festooned in selling up and antipatterns. I counted 4 attempts to selling up on me I ordered a burger a week ago in an airport branch of BK. Even human servers used to be trained to sell up once only. Oh and special offers are buried in shitty apps which are a clumsy and annoying nuisance on top of the kiosk.

    I realise McDonalds & Burger King really don't care if they waste the customer's time like this (fast food is SO yesterday) if they save on employee wages. But at the same time, if customers get pissed off by the wait times / lack of immediacy, or the selling up booby traps, or the impersonal nature, or the moribund menus then no wonder sales are sagging.

I've never been canoeing before, but I imagine there must be just a few simple heuristics you have to remember... Yes, don't fall out, and don't hit rocks.

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