Senators Rip Into Automakers For Selling Customer Data and Blocking Right To Repair (theverge.com) 42
A bipartisan group of senators is calling out the auto industry for its "hypocritical, profit-driven" opposition to national right-to-repair legislation, while also selling customer data to insurance companies and other third-party interests. From a report: In a letter sent to the CEOs of the top automakers, the trio of legislators -- Sens. Elizabeth Warren (D-MA), Jeff Merkley (D-OR), and Josh Hawley (R-MO) -- urge them to better protect customer privacy, while also dropping their opposition to state and national right-to-repair efforts.
"Right-to-repair laws support consumer choice and prevent automakers from using restrictive repair laws to their financial advantage," the senators write. "It is clear that the motivation behind automotive companies' avoidance of complying with right-to-repair laws is not due to a concern for consumer security or privacy, but instead a hypocritical, profit-driven reaction."
"Right-to-repair laws support consumer choice and prevent automakers from using restrictive repair laws to their financial advantage," the senators write. "It is clear that the motivation behind automotive companies' avoidance of complying with right-to-repair laws is not due to a concern for consumer security or privacy, but instead a hypocritical, profit-driven reaction."
If they were serious ... (Score:4, Insightful)
Look, if these folks are serious, they would be demanding that the car companies NOT collect the data to begin with. This is just performance theater.
Re: (Score:3)
This is why the TikTok thing is so funny for me. In all the government's arguments replace tiktok with Meta, Alphabet, Amazon, etc and the same arguments still apply. The only difference is it's billionares collecting the data, not the Chinese.
Re: (Score:2)
Thank you for this term!
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:3)
And here I thought we'd settled on Congresscritters.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
And here I thought we'd settled on Congresscritters.
We had but really like Congressclowns.
Re: (Score:3)
The snag is that critter is too benign for some of the professional clowns that show up, especially in recent years. In the past critters would make a half hearted attempt to pretend to be competent when cameras were trained on them. Today it's practically a point of pride for some recent arrivals to display their ignorance to the public. So yes, Clown is appropriate when some congressional hearings are indistinguishable from clown shows.
Now of course, we can split hares here. Many of these people, like
Re:If they were serious ... (Score:4, Insightful)
Look, if these folks are serious, they would be demanding that the car companies NOT collect the data to begin with. This is just performance theater.
Oh, they are serious alright. They want their bribes and campaign contributions.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
The AC is right. Why would we mod up the most generic and thoughtless political commentary ever made? It's completely meaningless.
"Bah! They're all corrupt!" isn't informative, interesting, or insightful. It's right up there with "Nobody wants to work anymore!" and social-bonding complaints about non-specific or non-existent problems caused or exacerbated by an unspecified 'they'.
It's the old guy at the bar saying "they ought to throw 'em all out" followed by an equally uninformed geriatric chorus of "th
Re: (Score:2)
By any chance, are you out of mod points for modding up vapid, banal comments like the one you replied to?
"hurr corrupt politicians!!" is not interesting, insightful, informative, original, or funny. If anything, it's redundant or overrated.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Look, if these folks are serious, they would be demanding that the car companies NOT collect the data to begin with. This is just performance theater.
You mean like supporting initiatives like a GDPR that makes companies directly responsible for keeping the data they collect secure as well as liable for breaches and misuse?
Start down this road and the next thing you know America will be demanding fair working hours and European style happiness.
Re: (Score:2)
Start down this road and the next thing you know America will be demanding fair working hours and European style happiness.
Don't threaten me with a good time. Next you'll start scaremongering about socialized medicine too!
Re: (Score:2)
Well, data collection is useful. It's been done for centuries. Everyone wants to know how their products are being used (you're using vaseline for that??), where they are popular or not, and things like that. The problem comes with collecting data that is identifiable to the end user, and then using that data for ulterior motives, like targeted ads, selling the data to third parties, and all sorts of ridiculous micro-monetization.
Hmm... (Score:2)
A bipartisan group of senators is calling out the auto industry for its "hypocritical, profit-driven" opposition to national right-to-repair legislation
Geez, if only there was a body of people whose responsibility it was to write legislation to make national right-to-repair a possibility. But, alas, this group of people in the article (did they call them Senators? I dunno) have absolutely no power at all.
I am curious though, as to how the auto industry is opposing national right-to-repair legislation. How are they able to do this? It's very important for this group of people, these "Senators", to know so they can tackle the problem right at the source!
Re: (Score:3)
"Lobbying and Opposition [google.com]:
The auto industry has actively lobbied against right-to-repair legislation, arguing that it would create significant risks and negatively impact the automotive industry and consumers.
They have also supported the development of alternative solutions, such as voluntary repair programs and industry-led initiatives, to address repair concerns without compromising safety or security.
Automakers have spent millions of dollars on lobbying efforts to defeat right
Re: (Score:2)
"Lobbying and Opposition [google.com]:
The auto industry has actively lobbied against right-to-repair legislation, arguing that it would create significant risks and negatively impact the automotive industry and consumers.
They have also supported the development of alternative solutions, such as voluntary repair programs and industry-led initiatives, to address repair concerns without compromising safety or security. Automakers have spent millions of dollars on lobbying efforts to defeat right-to-repair initiatives, highlighting the importance of this issue to the industry. The Alliance for Automotive Innovation, a trade association representing major automakers, has been a key player in opposing right-to-repair legislation."
https://www.vice.com/en/articl... [vice.com]
Ironically funny from your link:
"A lot of the money is going to airing terrifying advertisements that imply criminals could access your data should Question 1 pass."
The criminals already have access, they just happen to be the manufacturers.
I see that the big concern is that the manufacturers might try to move away from the wired port to a wireless model that only they can access, and claim the bad guys could then get information. Hmm. Perhaps do not get rid of the wired port? Or if they want wirele
Re: (Score:2)
They are so transparently full of shit. The argument has zero merit.
I don't have a problem with them saying that, though. I have a problem with every person (especially in government) who hears it, but then doesn't laugh in their face and say "That's the stupidest thing I heard all day!"
Re: (Score:2)
I have a problem with every person (especially in government) who hears it, but then doesn't laugh in their face and say "That's the stupidest thing I heard all day!"
While I agree it's absolutely a ridiculous argument, I have no doubt that people who work in government hear stupid shit all day long, and it's pretty stiff competition for #1 on that list.
Re: (Score:2)
It's worse. Their fear mongering is based on cellular telemetry and even WiFi that they implemented to get around existing openness laws WRT things you can read from the diagnostic port. Rather than open up, they moved those things off of the physical connection and into "the cloud".
So any fear to be had is a direct result of their fuckery. Ditch the wireless and make it all available from the physical port. Then document it all.
Dont feed them. (Score:5, Interesting)
Dont feed them. Don't buy that shiny new car. Keep your old one on the road as long as you can.
It's my way of punishign the car industry for taking away the stickshift, the manual handbrake, for including the stupid backup camera and attendant tumorous display intruding upon the cabin.
It's my revenge for them taking away all the tactile controls and putting them on touch screens.
Fuck 'em. They're all nuts, and the ones that aren't.. no one can afford (Porsche and Ferrari still seem somewhat committed to making driver's cars, but.. who can afford that, amirite?)
Re: (Score:2)
Are any of them good enough quality to do that?
Tried that with my last car, I was in the shop every month and paying at least a car payment. After a decade and 150K miles it needed constant maintenance and repairs. I used to do a lot of this myself but I have less time and desire at this point in my life. This particular car was hard to work on, lots of taking two things off to get to the one thing you need to fix, adding up to lots of time. The car just wasn't built to be serviced for the long haul.
Part of
Re: (Score:2)
My last car I held for 10 years before buying new. My current car is 14 years old and nothing wrong with it. Regular maintenance, not (overly) abusing it, and maintaining it inside and out helps to keep it going.
Re: (Score:3)
My current car is 33 years old and looks almost new. Basic maintenance is really all it takes. Excluding consumables, the only repairs in the last 10 years have been the front struts and a battery terminal.
A friend of mine drives a car that's even older, if only by a few years. (He recently bought a Tesla "for winter", but still regularly drives his old car.) He'll tell you the same thing: basic maintenance and sensible driving keeps you off the 'necessary' upgrade treadmill.
Aside from vanity (the reason
Re: (Score:3)
Aside from vanity (the reason my wife drives a late model vehicle and my idiot brother drives a truck) what possible motivation could there be to upgrade every few years?
While I agree with your outlook, and do keep cars a long time, there are many non-vanity reasons to get a new car. First, and most notable, crash ratings - your 33 year old car offers nowhere near as much protection in a crash as anything made today (FYI - also airbags do expire). Second, not all new tech is bad, for example LED headlights are night and day (pun intended) difference from Halogen reflectors that your car has. Third, sensors and control systems improved a lot - modern stability and traction s
Re: Dont feed them. (Score:2)
Crash safety is highly variable. The W126 Mercedes has done well in impromptu testing against newer vehicles. Newer being better might be the way to bet in the absence of additional information, but it's not guaranteed.
Re: (Score:2)
Hit or miss, and it's not intuitive.
I have a 2013 mini, a car well-known to blow up at the merest provocation. 11 years, 140k miles, and only 2 fairly big repairs
Meanwhile, my mazdas at the same age would've been on the 3rd clutch, 2nd set of air control valves, etc etc.
When you get a good one keep it as long as you can. 'cause they don't make 'em like they used to.
And that first carmarker to have the cojones to make an old-fashioned car these days will likely sell at on of them.
Re: (Score:2)
It is still possible to find a vehicle that can last a very long time. 2014 Lexus RX350, 2013 to 2015 Toyota Camry can realistically hit 500K miles, but nothing made today
Agreed - except for backup camera (Score:3)
Quite useful when you're parking in front of some sticky out bushes or some other irregular street furniture where you can't always see what you're backing into.
Re: (Score:2)
The backup camera is actually useful. I won't buy another car without one.
We also need cars that drop you off at the front door of your destination and then go park themselves. I'll buy a car with that before one with just FSD.
Re: (Score:2)
It doesn't help that we have all this nanny-state BS regulation that makes it so hard to produce a proper pure drivers car anymore without all the crap.
Bipartisan? (Score:2, Insightful)
It's interesting that there's a Republican in the group, given co-president Musk's likely views on any limits on the auto industry's right to run roughshod over US citizens. Even if this is merely performance theatre, as others here have suggested, it could still stir up unwelcome sentiments among the peon... er, people.
Re: (Score:2)
It does not surprise me that Hawley in particular among the Republicans is for calling out the Industry. He always tests what he believes with what is popular. Push will come to shove if they actually write legislation, get it past the Committees including any he is on, and gets it to the floor. Then we'll see whether he puts his signature on the dotted line, and we'll know whether this was just a "for sale" sign.
Then why don't they try to legalize repair? (Score:2)
We have been asking these people for over a couple decades now, to repeal DMCA's 1201.
They still haven't done it (or even sponsored legislation which got voted down), and that's how we know that they don't give a fuck about right-to-repair.
You can lie to us in press releases, but you can't effectively lie about your actual record. If they actually wanted right to repair, then these federal legislators would have tried to repeal the federal law which makes repair illegal. What lying sacks of shit!
Bipartisan meaning (Score:2)
Bipartisan: Two sets of crooks have their hands in the cookie jar.
Foolish to become data brokers (Score:2)