
Study: Young Children Diagnosed with ADHD Often Prescribed Medication Too Quickly (cbsnews.com) 198
"A new study released Friday found that young children diagnosed with attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder, or ADHD, are often prescribed medication too quickly," reports CBS News:
The study, led by Stanford Medicine and published in JAMA Network Open, examined the health records of nearly 10,000 preschool-aged children ages 3 to 5 between 2016 and 2023 who were diagnosed with ADHD... The Stanford study found that about 68% of those children who were diagnosed with ADHD were prescribed medications before age 7, most often stimulants such as Ritalin, which can help children focus their attention and regulate their emotions. The turn to medication often came quickly, according to the study. About 42% of the children who were diagnosed with ADHD were prescribed drugs within 30 days of diagnosis, the study found.
"We don't have concerns about the toxicity of the medications for 4- and 5-year-olds, but we do know that there is a high likelihood of treatment failure, because many families decide the side effects outweigh the benefits," Dr. Yair Bannett, assistant professor of pediatrics at Stanford Medicine and the lead author of the study, said in a statement. Those side effects can include irritability, aggressiveness and emotional problems, according to Bannett. "The high rate of medication prescriptions among preschool-age children with ADHD and the lack of delay between initial diagnosis and prescription require further investigation to assess the appropriateness of early medication treatment," the researchers concluded.
The study also found that the vast majority of the young children diagnosed with ADHD, about 76%, were boys.
CBS News interviewed Jamie Howard, senior clinical psychologist from the Child Mind Institute (who was not involved in the study). Howard said when treating ADHD in young children, clinical guidelines call for starting with "behavioral intervention...."
"I think that people have an association with ADHD and stimulant medication... But there is actually a lot more than that. And we want to give kids the opportunity to use these other strategies first, and then if they need medication, it can be incredibly helpful for a lot of kids."
"We don't have concerns about the toxicity of the medications for 4- and 5-year-olds, but we do know that there is a high likelihood of treatment failure, because many families decide the side effects outweigh the benefits," Dr. Yair Bannett, assistant professor of pediatrics at Stanford Medicine and the lead author of the study, said in a statement. Those side effects can include irritability, aggressiveness and emotional problems, according to Bannett. "The high rate of medication prescriptions among preschool-age children with ADHD and the lack of delay between initial diagnosis and prescription require further investigation to assess the appropriateness of early medication treatment," the researchers concluded.
The study also found that the vast majority of the young children diagnosed with ADHD, about 76%, were boys.
CBS News interviewed Jamie Howard, senior clinical psychologist from the Child Mind Institute (who was not involved in the study). Howard said when treating ADHD in young children, clinical guidelines call for starting with "behavioral intervention...."
"I think that people have an association with ADHD and stimulant medication... But there is actually a lot more than that. And we want to give kids the opportunity to use these other strategies first, and then if they need medication, it can be incredibly helpful for a lot of kids."
Overdiagnosed (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Overdiagnosed (Score:4, Insightful)
Yup. I wonder how many of these kids "diagnosed with ADHD" actually have just a case of childhood.
Re:Overdiagnosed (Score:4, Informative)
To paraphrase Buck Russell:
I don't think I want to know a six-year-old who isn't a dreamer, or a sillyheart. And I sure don't want to know one who takes their student career seriously or "regulates their emotions" like a fucking Vulcan. But I know a good kid when I see one. Because they're ALL good kids, until those who deliberately choose to ignore what being a child is drag them down and convince them and their parents that they have a behavioural disorder in order to pump them full of mood suppressing pharmaceuticals and earn a nice kickback.
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if they are running around disrupting class than that's not normal.
It's normal enough that almost every class has one or more disrupters.
Perhaps a standard classroom isn't the right environment for these kids.
Take them outside. Let them learn by doing, rather than expecting them to sit still through a lecture.
Then the "normal" kids can learn without the disruptions.
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So if they are running around disrupting class than that's not normal.
This depends on how young they are and how long they are asked to sit in class. Running around is a perfectly normal childhood behavior. It is not normal to be unable to sit and pay attention for any amount of time, it is not reasonable to expect kids to sit around for 6 hours a day.
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Re: Overdiagnosed (Score:2)
If a developmentally challenged child can't eat with a fork, then we shouldn't be duct taping forks to their hands at lunch time and forcing them to work through their disability. Forcing kids to sit at desks for lecture is the same thing for children who have not developed as fast as their peers in this area.
Here's a radical idea: take those kids out of their regular classes and put them together like they do with overachieving kids in some districts.
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Re: Overdiagnosed (Score:2)
I genuinely wonder why?
I turned 13 in 1980. We had more or less one kid in a class of 290 that had overt behavior that I would call ADHD today.
But the schools were and ARE filled with people who see education as their life's work and who genuinely care about their charges.
I guess sure you can wave your hand at Big pharma, teachers Union, government, GOP failing to pour even more $ into schools.
But what happened that we stopped paying attention and thinking about our (collective) kids and just said "meh, gi
Re: Overdiagnosed (Score:3)
you are making a broad generalization that is simply untrue. It feels true, but kids who are medicated - in my experience with 3 ADHD kids, and ADHD brother and father - directly contradicts your assertions. Meds are certainly more helpful in school, but they are helpful art home and over the summer as well.
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”are going to be able to look at the ever-growing costs of that prescription you handcuffed to them”
Considering in most other nations this isn't really a concern I would hope they ask "why did you elect people who let medication people need become so expensive". ADHD meds are not inherently expensive we just choose to make them that way politically.
Vote for cruelty and vengeance against others and when it turns to you complain about why things are so cruel. That's the real American way
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t seems the US average of children being given ADHD medication is more than double the worldwide average, and adults in the US more than three times the worldwide average.
Hard to say if it is a cause or a symptom, but one thing it is not is a surprise.
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Ok great but we agree the medication is cheaper right? Are you saying this is a supply issue and if so is it manufacturing or an artificial limit.
The rates between the US and the world was not part of my point.
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My father was diagnosed in his 40s. So your whole "father hooked" bullshit is just that. Bullshit. He was running his carpentry business into the ground, in-part because he could not consistently remember to send invoices to his customers for the work he had already done, using materials he had purchased out of his own pocket. ADHD meds made it easier for him to do the bookkeeping portion of his job, even if they were not necessary to do the carpentry par
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putting your whole family on amphetamines
My wife was diagnosed in her 40s. I did not put her on these meds. She, with the advice and recommendation of a qualified medical professional, put her on these meds. And they have been life changing. It is monumentally arrogant of you to decide, without any medical training or any familiarity with my wife/kids, to decide that they don't need or benefit from these medications. You may have no respect for the agency of those in your life with ADHD, but if my wife tells me these are helpful, and I can see how
School isn't fair to help kids (Score:3)
Schools now exist to sort students into groups based on how useful they will be to large corporations and the billionaires that own those corporations.
If your kid can't hack it there's billions of them to replace your kid in society and there's automation and AI to make them increasingly less relevant and necessary.
It's a side effect of having a competitive society instead of a cooperative one. Everybody says they want to do the best for
Re: Overdiagnosed (Score:3)
Reading the article, fixing the headline (Score:2)
Reading the article and fixing the /. headline /. headline - Study: Young Children Diagnosed with ADHD Often Prescribed Medication Too Quickly ./ headline - Young Children, Mostly Boys, Diagnosed with ADHD Often Prescribed Medication, Including Stimulants, Too Quickly
Alternate
The most missing part of the entire study is household type. This data needs to show if there is a large percentage of children, mostly boys, diagnosed with ADHD from single-parent households, comparing two parent, single parent mothe
single parent households 54% higher ADHD (Score:3)
Lower education level in mothers, lower economic level in the household and a 54% higher diagnosis of ADHD, mostly all in boys.
The media blackout and failure to discuss that the parent(s) in a household greatly affect the health, education and life outcomes for their children is what should be discussed
https://www.sciencedaily.com/r... [sciencedaily.com].
ADHD linked to low maternal education, lone parents and welfare benefits, Swedish study finds
Date: June 1, 2010
Key findings of the Swedish study include:
Acturarial and financial interests (Score:2)
We should include that the actuarial and financial interests play a role here.
Get a person on a maintenance medicine at an early age means that lots of interested parties get a decades long revenue stream:
- Psychologists / psychiatrists - 3 to 4 visits paid by the insurance company per year
- Pharmaceutical companies
- Retail drugstores, pharmacists, and staff
- State regulators, counting and monitoring the mass distribution of a controlled substance
- Medical researchers
- Insurance companies, claim processors
And ADHD topic and not other topics (Score:2)
Derailing to other topics does not make the ADHD and how the media ignores the disproportionate negative life outcomes of boys with ADHD and ADHD's link to single-parent households does does not address the topic.
It should be possible to have a reasoned discussion on ADHD and issues negatively affecting boys without knee-jerk, "insert other topic to derail" attempts.
- 75% of children diagnosed with ADHD are boys
- Boys raised in a single-parent household are more than 50% more likely to be diagnosed with ADH
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Young Children expected to act as adults in school is completely unrealistic expectation is the root cause of ADHD "epidemic". School day built around in-class instruction and passive sitting around does not work for many children. Fix that with more active play time and a lot of these issues will go away.
Some things that led up to the widespread claims of ADHD
Most teachers are now females.
Most girls are easier to manage than boys.
Boys are rowdy, active, and goofy.
Now would not it be so nice to have the boys act in a manner that the young ladies do?
So just claim the boys have ADHD, and chemically straitjacket them so they will sit in their seats like nice little boys do.
I have personal experience with the ADHD epidemic. In my son's middle school, the teachers diagnosed every male as suffering with
Re:Overdiagnosed (Score:4, Informative)
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Hispanic drug lords vote Republican?
Interesting data you have there.
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Or, just paying attention to the world: There's a mass shooting every week, and maybe once a year it's a transgender. 1 of 52 is roughly 2%.
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1 of 52 is roughly 2%.
What's the population of trans individuals in this country as a whole? A lot less than 2%. At any rate, trying to do statistical analysis with the tails of a distribution curve is a fools errand.
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Or, you can throw in a link that says the opposite of what you claim it does, but the link itself looks authoritative enough that most people will believe it without clicking. I've seen that multiple times on Slashdot in recent years.
As for the trans, the statistics I've seen are that they are about 1% of the population, but these statistics are suspect due to relying on self-reported survey responses and all the cultural and definitional issues - what even is "trans", for starters - lots of surveys either
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By the definition used by Gun Violence Archive,
"Four or more shot or killed" is just a gang-banger with a Glock giggle switch and bad aim.
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Statistical, societal and comprehension fail.
Pro tip: my children’s school doors are unlocked. Take your time.
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Take your time.
Re: Overdiagnosed (Score:2)
The Latin-derived prefix cis-, meaning 'on this side of', which is the opposite of trans-, meaning 'across from' or 'on the other side of'. This usage can be seen in the cisâ"trans distinction in chemistry, the cis and trans sides of the Golgi apparatus in cellular biology, the ancient Roman term Cisalpine Gaul (i.e. 'Gaul on this side of the Alps'), and Cisjordan (as distinguished from Transjordan).
But you sounded arrogant and sure of yourself when you spouted complete BS, and with the zeitgeist ranging from Trump to LLMs, you certainly nailed the modern era nicely.
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Wild posts, AC. There's this solid critique of American culture at the start, but by the end you're blaming feminists or saying we need to beat our kids more.
Kinda darkly hilarious, but concerning that people actually think like this.
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Wild posts, AC. There's this solid critique of American culture at the start, but by the end you're blaming feminists or saying we need to beat our kids more. Kinda darkly hilarious, but concerning that people actually think like this.
Single mothers create twice the likelihood of raising a son to be a criminal than single fathers do.
A woman can get pregnant, falsely and knowingly accuse a man of being the father, and control his very Freedom with the threat of incarceration if he fails to pay child support for a child that isn’t his. For eighteen years. Also known as 20% of a mans life. If it is discovered she lied later, no punishment is given. None.
It is estimated that over 30% of children being raised today, are being raised
Too much money (Score:3)
When watching YouTube short videos, I regularly see ads for adhd services (liven ADHD)
Re: Too much money (Score:2)
Boys (Score:5, Insightful)
>"The study also found that the vast majority of the young children diagnosed with ADHD, about 76%, were boys."
And that is because boys naturally have more problems with sitting still and complying with a boring lecture-style class. This is no secret, and anyone that has raised boys and girls knows this. They need more outlets for physical activity and working with "things" (instead of just listening and occasional communicating), and more discipline, and these are not being met. The system would rather drug them into compliant zombies than admit to and adapt to this reality. And then we wonder why many get even more screwed up later in life.
Re: Boys (Score:3)
My son with ADHD went on meds because he would run into traffic without thinking and almost got hit by a car in front of my house. The school did not ask us to medicate, because his behavior there was BETTER than at home. His anxiety kept his external ADHD symptoms in check there, but his greater feelings of comfort at home means he expressed those impulses more readily at home. And our home had no shortage of discipline.
my two daughters with ADHD ma
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>"Says someone who clearly does not have an ADHD child."
That is true. I do not dispute that ADHD is a thing or a problem. But I do believe that it is over-diagnosed and that many kids, especially boys, are caught up in something that can be explained not as a medical/mental problem, but a natural variation in character. And for those, addressed without medications, with some adjustments to their environment, and methods of being caught/handled.
>"my two daughters with ADHD manifest it differently th
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are caught up in something that can be explained not as a medical/mental problem, but a natural variation in character.
And what do you think is driving that variation in character if not underlying biology?
There are two main explanations. Nature vs Nurture, Biology vs environment. We all know that complex traits like personality are influenced by BOTH. Kids with ADHD have a biological difference, which manifests in a different personality predisposition. You are attempting to separate biology from character, and that is not actually possible. Kids with ADHD have real differences in the way their brain processes neurotransm
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That's a car and driver problem (the fact that we let people drive past homes, don't expect them to watch for people that might run into the street, and don't expect them to go slow enough that they can stop if someone runs into the street), not an ADHD/your son problem. Children should be able to run in front of their houses without having to think about it and without getting hit.
It's important to teach them while they are young there is no need to look both ways, because cars will always stop for them. If they grow up looking both ways it will be a harder habit to break later on.
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Kids with ADHD tend to act before they think. They are wired that way in their brain. I can tell my son a thousand times what the right behavior is. I can model it and make him practice it with me. But none of that matters if the part of his brain that seeks out novelty because of a genetic dopamine processing disorder sees the novelty it needs on the other side of the street reacts faster than the part that is supposed to make him look both ways.
I taught all
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Kids with ADHD tend to act before they think. They are wired that way in their brain. I can tell my son a thousand times what the right behavior is. I can model it and make him practice it with me. But none of that matters if the part of his brain that seeks out novelty because of a genetic dopamine processing disorder sees the novelty it needs on the other side of the street reacts faster than the part that is supposed to make him look both ways.
Then I guess you should supervise him so he does not do stupid things. On the plus side it sounds like you know this. On the down side one should not really have to tell any parent that, but here we are.
that difficulty stems from the very real differences in their brain chemistry. A difference that can be improved with pharmaceuticals.
I'm glad that is the case and I'm happy for you and your kids. I have no particular hate for big pharma or doctors in general, and while I do absolutely believe many drugs are overprescribed I certainly don't discount the beneficial and downright miraculous effects they can have when used appropriately.
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Then I guess you should supervise him so he does not do stupid things. On the plus side it sounds like you know this. On the down side one should not really have to tell any parent that, but here we are.
Thank you for explaining to a parent of 4 kids, what parenting requires. I so glad you explained it to me /s
I do supervise him, to the extent possible, but I also have 3 other kids, a job, a wife, and a society crumbling around me that makes 100% surveillance of an 11 year old a mathematical impossibility. Eventually I have to turn him lose on the world and see what he does, then course correct as needed. That is true of all kids, btw, but for ADHD kids there are certain course corrections that take longer
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Thank you for explaining to a parent of 4 kids, what parenting requires.
My anecdotal experience is that number of kids does not correlate with parenting skill. Unfortunately.
You sound like a good parent though, rest assured my negative comments about society in general are not aimed at you specifically.
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It's important to teach them while they are young there is no need to look both ways
Heh, reminds me of once when I was a kid. My Dad told me to look both ways while crossing a street. I was looking left and right constantly in response, and ended up running into a traffic cone.
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but drivers should be stopping for people.
I suspect most drivers try, if people give them adequate stopping distance. Now if you say they should always go slow enough so that is not an issue, I would suggest " by the time people are driving, they would be in the mindset that when they drive they can't go unless they can see that they aren't going to hit someone." seems a much more likely result.
Kids that are too young to learn to look both ways should be able to play in front of their homes.
Some kids live next to the freeway, or in busy cities. I'll tell you what works pretty well. Roads are for cars, and sidewalks are for pedestrians. Ca
It's not so much that boys (Score:2)
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>"It's that the age at which boys settle down and can sit and study is a few years older than one girls can so girls basically get a couple more years of Early education than boys."
Yes, I believe that is also a factor. But girls generally have better communication and attention-to-others skills, regardless of age; both are helpful in classroom settings. I don't think it is just the "headstart" they might have. Boys generally have better spacial and calculative skills. The former isn't generally helpf
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The study was on preschool children. They're not sitting through a "boring lecture-style class" unless it's their parents choosing to do that to them at home.
There's also a racial bias in the data. White kids are more likely to be diagnosed with ADHD then minority kids. White kids are also more likely to be given a prescription soon after diagnosis.
This has nothing to do with "the system" beyond the fact that a lot of primary care physicians are very busy and will hand over a prescription without argumen
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And that is because boys naturally have more problems with sitting still and complying with a boring lecture-style class. This is no secret, and anyone that has raised boys and girls knows this.
Yet even those boys must learn to live in a world where there are other people who have needs that their unacceptable behaviors are interrupting.
Treatment (Score:2)
Re: Treatment (Score:2)
meds were life changing for my wife, my kids, and my brother.
this anti-medication position is just buildout bigotry against neurodivergent folks wrapped up in a paper thin veneer of lovejoy-esque âoethink of the childrenâ which completely ignores the actual children.
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Mental health and mental health care has come with a stigma and resistance for generations. When my wife had postpartum depression years ago, I had no idea what was going on. I just thought she was angry with me all the time, and that our marriage was falling apart. Thankfully, a marriage counsellor had the insight to tell us that we didn't need a counsellor, we needed a doctor. That led to treatment that transformed our lives. Later, when my son started dealing with major depression, we knew how to get him
This is dumb (Score:5, Interesting)
The reason the doctors jump straight to meds is because behavioral modification has failed already. Our oldest was not diagnosed until they were 12. We spent years addressing their symptoms through behavior and only turned to meds when it became clear they surely needed them.
the next one started younger, but was in active therapy for their behavior for 2 years before we went to a neurologist for a diagnosis and drugs. The final straw was we moved, and he started running across the road to play with the new neighbors without looking due to his impulsivity and almost got hit by a car twice in a week. We started with a drug for impulse control first, and only added a stimulant a year later when his inability to focus was causing problems in school.
last one is clearly ADHD, but has not been formally diagnosed and is not on meds because, so far, their symptoms are not manifesting in harmful ways and are being successfully managed by addressing their behavior.
Parents turn to drugs, which cost money every month and time for trips to the doctor, when it is clear behavioral modification, which is free, has failed. This whole write up comes across as though it were written by RFk jr as a prelude to coming after psychological medications the way he has come for vaccines. With a lot of dumb rhetoric, fear mongering, and even worse âoesolutionsâ to the problems these medications address.
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My son is actually on 2 different medications. One for impulse control (non-stimulant) which took half a year to sort out the right dose and timing. It makes him sleepy about 2 hr after he takes it, and makes him irritable in the 2 hr before he needs to take it again. At first he was taking it in the morning. That meant he was causing fights in the morning before school and then falling
Re: This is dumb (Score:2)
Re: This is dumb (Score:3)
my brother is just as intelligent as I am, but you would never have believed it to look at his grades in school. He could not focus, could not remember to do or turn in assignments, and was always in trouble for impulsive behavior. He was headed to being a HS drop out.
Then he started medication. He ultimately graduated, and got an MS in engineering. Something he simply could not have done without meds.
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Besides, the best way to confirm an ADHD diagnosis is a test dose of the drugs. If you have ADHD, they help. If you don't, they'll make you worse.
this is not only not true, not how these medications work and not a way to obtain a proper diagnose, but an extremely irresponsible and reckless suggestion that no sane medical professional would make.
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But it is true that one confirmation of an ADHD diagnosis is how the patient responds to ADHD medication.
Medical professionals don't prescribe ADHD medication without diagnosing ADHD first. So if a patient is diagnosed with ADHD, how certain can the medical professional be that the patient has ADHD? What's the differential diagnosis? Generalized anxiety disorder, obsessive compulsive disorder, major depression, bipolar disorder I or II, autism spectrum disorder, etc., etc., etc., thyroid dysfunction, sleep
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But you are surely in a minority
I am going to need a citation on that.
Treatment costs time and money. Things that are always in short supply when you have children. Which means that they will come naturally later in attempting to deal with a child's behavioral or learning problems, after attempting those things that are free, and quick, such as telling your kid to behave better, and to stop doing the things their ADHD is pushing them to do. or trying to punish them for their poor behavior through groundings, spakings, and other punitive
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2. It's trivial nowadays - go to your insurance website and it lists all the pediatric neurologist that takes your insurance, go to their site or mychart and schedule an appointment, and then when you need a refill you just log back in and click "request refill".
There is, and has been, a shortage of qualified therapists and neurologists in this country for a while. That is more true for pediatric specialists. You might know this, if you were a parent of a neurodivergent child, as opposed to an armchair quarterback. That means that while there may be specialists listed in your insurance companies database, many of those specialists listed are no longer in business (first 3 we tried when l
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that doesn't mean all preschool age kids do
Strawman much? No one here claimed ALL preschool aged kids require medication.
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All kids struggle with this because their neurological development has not progressed to the point where they have full control over themselves. For kids with ADHD that is exacerbated by problems with their dopamine signaling pathways which mean they will never be able to attain the same level of control with the same level of effort as their more neurotypical peers.
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Re: This is dumb (Score:2)
Re: This is dumb (Score:2)
you know, like by outing them unnecessarily and implying there is something wrong with them for being trans. As opposed to the world being unfairly harsh with them being the cause of their elevated mortality.
the gender identity of my children is in no way relevant to the discussion, but you felt the need to comment on it as though it were. And not to be supportive, but to imply there is something wrong in my
That's how they make money (Score:2)
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The unfortunate thing is that ADHD, as a developmental disorder, is either something that kids grow out of or it persists through their adult life. And for most (about 2 out of 3 in some studies), it persists into adulthood.
What's the best treatment for ADHD? Medication.
How effective is medication treatment? Very effective for most individuals.
So yes, unfortunately, putting kids, who turn into adults, on medication for the rest of their lives is what we usually have to do for ADHD.
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OK, I can give you a clue: a month's supply of amphetamine salts (generic for Adderall) costs a whopping $15 ( https://www.goodrx.com/ampheta... [goodrx.com] ). Such money. Great wealth. Definitely a world conspiracy.
Boys are targeted (Score:2)
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Or a neurodevelopmental disorder. Inability to self-regulate the energy one has.
In today's society, kids can't just work it off on the farm like they used to. If you want your kid to succeed, he has to sit in class all day. Chemistry is often the most expediant solution.
A blood test would really help (Score:3)
Most diseases can be diagnosed through some kind of blood test. Send it off to the lab, and you get your answer, and the doctor knows how to treat the illness. ADHD and other psychiatric illnesses, have no such test. Doctors are forced to try to sort through symptoms, often with uncooperative patients, to determine what treatments (medicines or behavioral therapy) might help. There's a lot of trial and error, compounded by a selection of medicines that have a 30-40% success rate.
THE biggest advance we need in mental health, is the development of diagnostic blood tests.
ADHD may be over-diagnosed, I don't know. A test would help greatly.
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Sounds like the exact type of thing the NIH could help research. Too bad we've been gutting all that but these are exactly the type of things Federal funding helps get off the ground.
Can biomarkers be used to diagnose attention deficit hyperactivity disorder? [nih.gov]
it's news that doctors are rushed and sloppy? (Score:2)
Quickly? (Score:2)
The doctor writes very fast?
I think they meant early.
Wrong school? (Score:2)
Drug pushers push drugs on kids :o (Score:2)
“Probably a fifth of the entire American population is on SSRIs. Psychiatrist Josef Witt-Doerring explains why that’s terrifying and dangerous.”
It is not either/or... (Score:2)
Well, it shouldn't be, but in the US, there is a lack of availability for therapeutic resources and pressure for doctors to just bill for medication consults (quick and pays well). This is despite many doctors getting into psychiatry because they like doing multi-modal treatment with therapy and medications as need, but always providing both or working with a team to provide both. And it's not just ADHD. Depression, there is huge pressure to prescribe when CBT based intervention could give a better outcome
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Psychiatry is perfectly capable of distinguishing why someone is struggling with school.
Nonsense. Psychiatry is not a robust science - if we could even classify it as "scientific". Psychiatric treatments end up being "Let's throw a bunch of crud at the wall and see what sicks!"
Youre arguing from an authority that has none.
Re:Hmm (Score:4, Informative)
a heart condition is relatively straighforward and safe to diagnose with current tech and knowledge. a behavioral problem not so much.
regarding treatment, one prevalent view in western culture is that there is always a magic pill that will make the problem go away. well, sometimes, a pill is just not what is needed, but there is always a pressure on doctors to provide a quick solution, and there is often too little time to actually weigh the symptoms with enough attention. the problem might be more complex, it may turn out to be something that doesn't really need to be fixed but just managed, or it may be rooted in other causes, like environment or relationships, but the pill will do the trick of calming the kid down, hiding the symproms and keeping the parents happy while those causes remain unadressed, which in the long term may just aggravate the problem, or create new problems where there was none.
big pharma ofc is eager to "help".
Re:Hmm (Score:4, Interesting)
one prevalent view in western culture is that there is always a magic pill that will make the problem go away
Well what else would you like the doctor to do? You don't think doctors have been telling people and children "eat better, exercise more" but the doctor cant follow you home and make sure you do those things and the doctor cant make sure the parents change their behavior and manner of raising their kids and absent that what options do doctors have? Medicine or surgery, that's about it.
Re: Hmm (Score:2, Informative)
every parent of an ADHD kid I know (including myself) tried behavior modification for a long time before turning to medications. And even when we did, we were slow and deliberate about it with each of our kids.
fact is drugs cost money, and diagnosis costs time and money, and parents would always like to save both of those if possible. I have to take each of my ADHD kids to therapists weekly, and neurologis
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The idea that OTHERS needing something you donâ(TM)t need is some how an indication of their moral failing, as opposed to how the diversity of human experience manifests.
Wilhoit's law “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.”
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a dramatic over simplification.
it is a simplification. i'm opining on the internet, not writing a paper. dramatic is this:
this is rooted in the same fallacies as the anti vax and anti trans rhetoric coming out of this administration, and the anti gay rhetoric of the 90s. The idea that OTHERS needing something you donâ(TM)t need is some how an indication of their moral failing, as opposed to how the diversity of human experience manifests.
woah! i get this is an issue that affects you personally and not to be taken lightly, but i think you are missing the point for several reasons:
first of all, from your description it seems that you arrived at treatment with medication through a long and exhaustive process. that's how it should be, but that places your personal experience outside of the scope of both this paper and my opinion. this is about instances w
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And here you are, continuing to present yourself as an expert while giving bad advice to people about how to treat their children.
What kind of pathology drives a person to that? Are you getting off on the idea of children not getting the kind of medical care they should have available to them?
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first of all, from your description it seems that you arrived at treatment with medication through a long and exhaustive process. that's how it should be, but that places your personal experience outside of the scope of both this paper and my opinion. this is about instances where 4-5yo kids were prescribed medication after 30 days without behavioral therapy for at least 6 months, which seems to be the recommended guideline in the us.
This was the age at which my son's ADHD became apparent, and if we had been paying closer attention to how ADHD manifests in girls, we would have spotted the signs in my oldest at that age as well. If that is the age at which ADHD becomes dia
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My central criticism of this report is that it ignores the work parents do before they show up at the doctors office seeking medication. Nothing in your attempt to justify back-seat parenting/prescribing addresses this criticism. Nor does this paper address that either.
nor is your personal story proof that such work exists or is widespread. the study does suggest that if it exists at all it isn't done under medical observation and guidance.
Trying to get through early childhood needing meds you're not given can set you back years in your education and social skills.
that's why proper analysis of behavior, situation and environment is necessary, under professional guidance, as is evaluation of behavioral therapy, all of which takes time. except in extreme very obvious cases, i guess. if the symptoms are so extreme and unbearable then maybe worried parents should bring the kids in sooner?
I was saying "Exactly" to the later part of the post, which is pretty clear in context based on the rest of what I wrote in that post about my brother.
my bad, but
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ADHD is not just a behavioral problem, and pretending it is can condemn children to a lifetime of being treated like they're stupid misbehaving fuckups.
Bluntly, you should STFU. You do not know what you're talking about, and you're helping people confirm their incorrect beliefs.
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[_] Confirmed ADHD, with needs
[_] "Diagnosing" ADHD
I see you quietly snuck the conversation from one to the other, where no one is allowed to say anything contrary.
Bluntly, you should STFU. You're precluding the subject on injected pretenses, and you're helping people confirm their incorrect beliefs.
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regarding treatment, one prevalent view in western culture is that there is always a magic pill that will make the problem go away
And why shouldn't this be true? Humans are complicated biochemical machines, so why shouldn't tools ("pills") be used to fix them as needed?
a pill is just not what is needed
And what is your solution? Cognitive-Behavioral Therapy for ADHD basically works only for mild cases. And it does not _cure_ the underlying disorder. It just makes living with ADHD easier.
On the other hand, stimulants can make the symptoms go away, reducing anxiety and stress literally overnight. And their downsides are minor. In therapeutic doses ADHD stimulants are