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Security Technology

Shoplifters Could Soon Be Chased Down By Drones (technologyreview.com) 144

An anonymous reader quotes a report from MIT Technology Review: Flock Safety, whose drones were once reserved for police departments, is now offering them for private-sector security, the company announced today, with potential customers including including businesses intent on curbing shoplifting.Companies in the US can now place Flock's drone docking stations on their premises. If the company has a waiver from the Federal Aviation Administration to fly beyond visual line of sight (these are becoming easier to get), its security team can fly the drones within a certain radius, often a few miles.

"Instead of a 911 call [that triggers the drone], it's an alarm call," says Keith Kauffman, a former police chief who now directs Flock's drone program. "It's still the same type of response." Kauffman walked through how the drone program might work in the case of retail theft: If the security team at a store like Home Depot, for example, saw shoplifters leave the store, then the drone, equipped with cameras, could be activated from its docking station on the roof. "The drone follows the people. The people get in a car. You click a button," he says, "and you track the vehicle with the drone, and the drone just follows the car." The video feed of that drone might go to the company's security team, but it could also be automatically transmitted directly to police departments.

The defense tech startup Epirus has developed a cutting-edge, cost-efficient drone zapper that's sparking the interest of the US military. Now the company has to deliver. The company says it's in talks with large retailers but doesn't yet have any signed contracts. The only private-sector company Kauffman named as a customer is Morning Star, a California tomato processor that uses drones to secure its distribution facilities. Flock will also pitch the drones to hospital campuses, warehouse sites, and oil and gas facilities. It's worth noting that the FAA is currently drafting new rules for how it grants approval to pilots flying drones out of sight, and it's not clear if Flock's use case would be allowed under the currently proposed guidance.

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Shoplifters Could Soon Be Chased Down By Drones

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  • RF Jammers (Score:4, Interesting)

    by sizzlinkitty ( 1199479 ) on Thursday September 25, 2025 @11:46PM (#65684076)

    The solution to everything is becoming RF Jammers.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Powercntrl ( 458442 )

      Actually, I think the solution is just don't steal stuff.

      • Re:RF Jammers (Score:5, Interesting)

        by awwshit ( 6214476 ) on Friday September 26, 2025 @12:20AM (#65684118)

        Ever walked out of the store after paying and the scanners by the door alarm? Maybe because the cashier forgot to burn the tag or remove the tag? Should that trigger drones following you and live video to the police?

        Its possible that this is overkill. Crime isn't that bad and we still have ways to fight it without this nonsense.

        • Re:RF Jammers (Score:5, Insightful)

          by viperidaenz ( 2515578 ) on Friday September 26, 2025 @02:05AM (#65684188)

          Presumably in this case, you would stop and talk to the security staff, not run when the alarm sounds.

          • by mysidia ( 191772 )

            You might. But it is not a violation of the law to ignore or not hear an alarm and just walk away.
            On the other hand the creepy drones following you can potentially have you file criminal and civil charges against the business and the pilots for stalking.

          • Stores can't detain people. If I'm not shoplifting then I'm under no obligation to correct their mistakes. Now Sams Club and Costco are another story. Part of their membership agreement is allowing your receipt to be checked.

            • Their remedy would be limited to revoking your membership, not physically stopping you or having the police arrest you.
            • Stores usually have a "conditions of entry" sign somewhere. They're private property and are allowed to set conditions. While they can't force you to do anything, breaching those conditions is grounds for them to trespass you.

        • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

          by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

          I've noticed that people mostly ignore alarms these days. There is so much shit beeping urgently at you, and most of it is just crying wolf.

          False alarms when leaving shops are particularly common, especially now with self service checkouts. It happened to me last weekend with a steak that was tagged, and I just ignored it and carried on walking. Nobody chased me, and I wouldn't have let them see in my bag anyway.

          • by skam240 ( 789197 )

            Ignoring shop lifting alarms is a good way to end up stuck talking to cops later. I don't know if you were driving but one picture of your licence plate is all they need. Either that or if they get a picture of your face on the cameras they might harass you the next time you're in. Better to wait a minute and deal with the store staff in the moment as they're aware of the fact that anyone who stops and waits patiently after an alarm probably wasn't shop lifting to begin with.

            • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

              The police won't get involved for the theft of some groceries. They know who I am because I used my loyalty card when I paid. If they think I'm that stupid they are welcome to confront me and be made fools of next time, but I'm sure they probably just checked the transaction records and saw that I paid for a security marked steak and lost interest.

              • by skam240 ( 789197 )

                All fair points. I still think you could end up with potential problems ignoring stuff like that.

          • by tlhIngan ( 30335 )

            False alarms when leaving shops are particularly common, especially now with self service checkouts. It happened to me last weekend with a steak that was tagged, and I just ignored it and carried on walking. Nobody chased me, and I wouldn't have let them see in my bag anyway.

            Probably because they already know you paid for the item. The surveillance these days is next-generation - and your self-checkout receipt is basically instantly available to everyone. If the alarm goes off, they probably already know it

            • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

              Possibly. The machine didn't warn me about the tag, even though it probably knows that there is one.

            • I've been waved through by staff even though the alarm went off and I stopped. They just waved me through.

              In the past 20 years I've only been waved through I've never even had a receipt checked in that situation.

              The purpose of the alarm at this point seems to actually be to get somebody in the security room to check the video. They should probably just turn the beepers off.

        • Ever walked out of the store after paying and the scanners by the door alarm? Maybe because the cashier forgot to burn the tag or remove the tag? Should that trigger drones following you and live video to the police?

          Its possible that this is overkill. Crime isn't that bad and we still have ways to fight it without this nonsense.

          No. And nobody is suggesting that. You did, so you could call it overkill, I think that's called a straw man. Why wouldn't they send a drone in exactly the same circumstances they'd have theft prevention people running for the doors to head someone off or record their vehicle/accomplices?

          If they weren't already tracking you through the store, they're just going to review the tapes later, why tf would they follow your car. It sounds like nonsense because it is, nobody would do it.

          • RTFA: "If the security team at a store like Home Depot, for example, saw shoplifters leave the store, then the drone, equipped with cameras, could be activated from its docking station on the roof."

            How does the security team notice that you are a shoplifter? Because the cashier forgot to burn the tag on the thing you bought and the scanner triggered when you left. Once you are out the door, Home Depot can't stop you, but they could follow you. Do you think security is going to assume a false alarm? No way.

      • by Moryath ( 553296 )
        Nah. These unintelligent garbage drones all need to be short circuited and destroyed fast. EMP FTW.
        • Yeah, take down all the drones in the vicinity, and all the pacemakers too. And everyone's phone.
          You'll have a very large bill to pay to replace everyone's stuff you broke.

          • by mysidia ( 191772 )

            You'll have a very large bill to pay to replace everyone's stuff you broke.

            No you won't. A mobile EMP is not going to destroy anyone's phone. You may cause them to drop calls or temporarily lose connection to the tower. If your Emp is really strong you may cause logic errors resulting in systems rebooting or crashing. The EMP does not have to be even that strong to stop a drone however -- just strong enough to cause a loss of communications and loss of cameras' video reception for a few minutes wh

      • Or steal an RF jammer. And batteries.
    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by rsilvergun ( 571051 )
      Or a shotgun. Really looking forward to one of these damn things being shot out of the sky. Might need a 30-06 instead of a shotgun but you get the idea.

      Americans aren't exactly shy about using firearms and as our civilization collapses they're going to get less and less shy about it.
      • Looking forward to people being peppered with shot raining down on them?
        It probably won't kill anyone, but it's not going to be comfortable.

        • Re:RF Jammers (Score:4, Interesting)

          by Chris Mattern ( 191822 ) on Friday September 26, 2025 @05:52AM (#65684364)

          You might want to rethink your assertion that it won't kill anybody. One study found that 32% of those hit by firearm rounds falling back to earth are killed: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.go... [nih.gov]

          • Literally no one has ever been killed by falling birdshot, which is what he is clearly talking about. Hell, even I know that, and I'm one of those gun-grabbing leftists.
            • by Jeremi ( 14640 ) on Friday September 26, 2025 @09:37AM (#65684672) Homepage

              Americans are widely known for limiting their ammunition to birdshot in the name of public safety. It's all part of our restrained and responsible gun culture.

              • by shanen ( 462549 )

                Only joke on the rich target? Slashdot ain't what it used to be.

                However you did remind me of another drone application I'd like to see: Crow-chasing drones. Maybe with the birdshot capability for self-defense if the crows try to gang up on a drone? (There must be a joke somewhere in there?)

            • by ceoyoyo ( 59147 )

              Might need a 30-06 instead of a shotgun

              Realistically, nobody is going to carry around either a shotgun loaded with birdshot or a .30 calibre rifle. If people are shooting at drones in the streets it's going to be with handguns.

            • by ls671 ( 1122017 )

              Heck I used to go duck hunting and sometimes received bird shots from other hunters near by. Those were direct shots, not going up and then down. It felt like rain drops.

      • The moment you use a gun during a crime, it's +5 years in the pokey if you get caught. Most of US states have a law that says: carrying a gun while committing a crime is +X years, brandishing it +Y years, discharging +Z years. That's a lot compared to a shoplifting charge.

      • Shooting down a several thousand dollar drone is going to carry more harsh of a penalty than shoplifting.

    • by skam240 ( 789197 )

      Most of the types who shop lift don't have their lives together enough to take such measures. There are the small numbers that are smart about what they do and yes some of those may resort to such things but they're only a fraction of the total shop lifting problem. I think this could still help a lot.

    • by Kisai ( 213879 )

      Partially true.

      I doubt many thieves are sophisticated enough to think to jam radio signals, let alone leave their damn cell phones and off while they are out committing crimes.

      And if they see a drone chasing them, just get out and hit it with a piece of rebar. We also know that drones can be defeated by birds and nets, so just keep a cargo net or something in the vehicle and throw that at the drone. A smarter thief would know that stealing the drone would be more lucrative, so trigger it, throw a net on it,

    • Add an AI pilot to the drone, and your RF jammer becomes far less effective.

    • So...making sure to commit a crime?

      RF Jammers and the shotguns mentioned would be a fine introduction to the wonderful world of federal-level felonies, where the fines from the FCC might start as high as $100,000 and destroying an aircraft would violate FAA regs with up to 20 years in prison.

      Not a civil offense or a parking ticket, but a way to ruin one's life for good.

  • I have no issues with this because companies will be using their own money to create a chain if evidence that will bring professional thieves to justice while avoiding injury and death to store employees. If police are called once a target location is found, the location of suspected individuals and the evidence will be easy to monitor to give real time updates increasing officer/public safety. It may cause thieves to become more sophisticated to take advantage of a singular drone or if thieves find a way
    • I do (Score:2, Insightful)

      by rsilvergun ( 571051 )
      I do not want militarized drones flying all over my damn City every time somebody steals a power sander. Those things are big and heavy and if they fall and they will they're going to do a hell of a lot of damage to whatever they land on.

      I don't think the corporate profits are worth the risk. I'm not stupid enough to pretend they're going to pass the savings on to me.
    • by mysidia ( 191772 )

      Question is.. how far are we away from having drones that also "shoot" or deploy a marker of some kind. Such as a UV paint to highlight a target, or a tracker that embeds into their skin, so even when they flee into said "no fly zone" their location can still be approximated within the zone until they eventually move on and walk back outside the zone, and other covert drone docks placed at strategic locations can then automatically deploy to resume tracking.

      • Question is.. how far are we away from having drones that also "shoot" or deploy a marker of some kind.

        I'd say we are a very long way off from that. This could already be done by human security to tag shoplifters and it is not because if they ever got it wrong at 'shot' someone who was not shoplifting they now have a very expensive law suit to deal with.

      • Great idea! Once you're out of the store, shopkeeper's privilege doesn't apply, and now the store is on the hook for assault and battery.
        • by mysidia ( 191772 )

          Ok, then the drone can hit them with the micro tracking darts and UV paint just as they cross the line exiting the building. They'll be hit while still inside the store's premises, so the privilege applies

  • Just donâ(TM)t let rogue eBay managers get their hands on the drones
  • by Powercntrl ( 458442 ) on Friday September 26, 2025 @12:06AM (#65684106) Homepage

    So, buy an expensive drone and you might be able to catch shoplifters who live relatively close to your store.

    Seems like just having good old fashioned outdoor closed circuit cameras in the parking lot would accomplish the part you actually need (identifying the suspect's vehicle), and then you just let the police handle the rest.

    • A couple miles of real-time location information, relayed directly to police does sound helpful.

      Sending the police a license plate after reviewing CCTV footage, only to get a response like "yes, that car was stolen half an hour before your robbery, then dumped a few miles away" isn't very helpful.

      The most stolen cars are not expensive, or fast.
      They're the most common.
      In New Zealand, it's the Toyota Aqua and Corolla. Mazda Demio was number one for a while.
      Two decades ago, it was high value cars that were sto

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward

      You assume that the local PD is funded enough to actually handle shoplifting cases. Having lived in a city which defunded its popo, shoplifting was a common thing... and yes, if someone fought if caught, it was a strong-arm robbery, most of them had knives, and nobody is going to risk a hobo stabbing them over a couple makeup items. The local retailers either had to put everything under lock and key, limit their hours... or just close shop. Prosecution? Good luck. At most, it would be a citation.

      If a c

    • by mysidia ( 191772 )

      So, buy an expensive drone and you might be able to catch shoplifters who live relatively close to your store.

      Or who have a car parked in the parking lot. The drone really just has to follow them long enough to get enough information to Identify or find them later. Most people will be driving their own cars -- your average shop lifter is an opportunity in petty crimes, Not a car thief, so it is probably going to be either their car, Or a friend who can report who they lent the car to.

      • Or they live in the neighborhood, or took transit to the store. Maybe they rode a bicycle.

        In any case, if I’ve done nothing wrong and your drone follows me off your property I’m filing stalking and maybe doxxing complaints against your security guard, your store, your store’s manager, and Flock.

  • by awwshit ( 6214476 ) on Friday September 26, 2025 @12:24AM (#65684122)

    Those drones will never see the falcon coming.

  • by joshuark ( 6549270 ) on Friday September 26, 2025 @12:32AM (#65684132)

    Go for Dungeons and Dragons look...of a Beholder, put a giant eyeball beach ball costume (preferably bloodshot...) and then the drones can chase the shoplifters scaring the caca out of them, and give a nostalgic feel from Dungeons and Dragons...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]

    or perhaps a Spectator? Since it is guarding store items. ???

    https://www.dndbeyond.com/mons... [dndbeyond.com]

    Or retro "Attack of the Killer Tomatoes" where people are running around in the parking lot (pushing shopping carts) and screaming while giant tomatoes roll after them...now its a giant floating eyeball.

    https://youtu.be/txfdGlxEsG8?t... [youtu.be]

    JoshK.

    • I love it. I don't think it would scare the shoplifters, just entertain them. But it would be great PR in a world with a lot of drone anxiety.

  • by khchung ( 462899 ) on Friday September 26, 2025 @01:56AM (#65684178) Journal

    Next in the news: Criminals shoplift to lure out drones to follow them a drone trap, to capture the drone to sell for parts.

    These drones most likely cost more than what was shoplifted. A bundle of loose strings thrown at the drone could tangle its rotors and easily bring it down. Just lure the drone into an alley with someone hiding above with a bundle of loose fishing lines, then drone-0, thieves-1.

  • by TuballoyThunder ( 534063 ) on Friday September 26, 2025 @06:40AM (#65684432)
    to a dystopian future. People who work there should be ashamed.
    • Help me understand.

      Stores shouldn't use technology to try to catch shoplifters? Is that the dystopian part?

      This seems like a good thing for the stores, and for society as a whole, as it will discourage crime.

      • The same company is installing mass-surveillance cameras, free (so far, pending lawsuits) of the restrictions placed on law enforcement, when the whole purpose of the cameras is that they give the data to police, who are paying them to do it.

        That's the dystopian part people would be talking about in reference to Flock.

        Do you live under a fucking rock or something?

        • The context is important here.

          Shoplifters are walking into the private property of the store owner, fully knowing that the place is under surveillance, and stealing the private property of that store owner. What on earth is wrong with the store owner providing video footage of people stealing stuff from him? That infringes on exactly nobody's privacy rights, nor should it be seen as such.

          So no, I've got zero issue with store owners getting drones and sharing the video with police. If I were a store owner, I

  • I realize that when you have a product you need to hype the use case; but (even if you do accept the premises, many of them fairly sweeping and drastic, that nodding in agreement with techhead mall cops want you to) this all seems a bit much.

    There are certainly exceptions; but it a lot of retail environments your way to the exit and your vehicle takes you past multiple fixed cameras, including ones in the parking area that will let you correlate a person with a car and license plate; unless they really,
    • I know it's selfish but I'd rather that thieves actually get caught than have to go ask someone for help to unlock the cage holding the socks I want to buy.
  • This is a perfect setup for abuse. Creepy managers will follow women and children home with these drones. This needs to come with the legal hurdle of, at minimum, irrefutable proof that the person shoplifted with a steep fine and possibly prosecution for abuse. The solution: Just don't shop at stores that use drones to stalk their customers.
  • I know a person who works at a retail store. Usually the person stealing is s can ome homeless person. They do catch them stealing and confront them at the door but all you can do is question them. You can't search them or otherwise touch them physically. So what is this drone going to do? They will get to their box and wait for the drone to go away because no one can do anything anyway.
    • I thought this would be needless to say, but your comment reminds me how stupid the average person is.

      There will be no point in buying this technology unless you're calling the police on the shoplifters, and you have local policing available.

  • by argStyopa ( 232550 ) on Friday September 26, 2025 @09:36AM (#65684666) Journal

    Honestly, they're barely punished if at all. This is the catch & release culture today; on the microscopic chance they're arrested, they're released, almost always without a bond because "that's unfair".

    Companies across the US are abandoning stores in metro areas where the shoplifting* rates have made it impossible to run a retail business. Where they continue to try to limp along, they operate completely under lock & key - nearly all the goods are locked away for a staff member to 'release' at customer request.
    In the few instances where store staff ACTUALLY STOP what is obviously, clearly an illegal act...the STORE OWNERS are the ones more aggressively prosecuted. City councils shriek endlessly about mandating stores stay open, threatening legal action if they don't. Or, hilariously, they think city-run stores are going to replace retail businesses; how'd that work out for KCity? (https://www.reddit.com/r/kansascity/comments/1mojr46/a_troubled_kansas_city_grocery_store_has_closed/) $18 mill later, they closed because they were always empty, the food they had was rotten, staff was awful, and people shopping there didn't feel safe.

    *you can hardly even call it that any longer when the "thefts" amount to people just walking in and taking things openly, with no interference from staff or even POLICE OFFICERS that are standing right there

    We've all become blase about retail theft and endemic crime. It's not even news. In my memory, in urban Mpls you could leave your car RUNNING when you ran into a grocery store. It's no longer like that for... reasons.

    Want to know why people think society is crumbling, I can't think of a better example. Drones chasing down shoplifters for no consequence is an amazingly dumb focus on the part that's not really broken.

    • It depends where you live.

      In Texas, for example, police in most jurisdictions go after shoplifters, and prosecutors follow through if they can get enough evidence.

      Some places in the US have passed laws or ordinances choosing not to investigate or prosecute shoplifters. Not all places are like that.

  • I envision a large city's skies filled with drones chasing down shoplifters, along with all the dangers that accompany that, such as drones crashing into things, people, and possibly each other when the inevitable glitches and failures occur. But wait, there's more!

    As these things become more pervasive and attitudes become more lax, employees will find ways to deploy drones "just because" for chasing skirt or pulling pranks. But I'm sure that law enforcement will turn a blind eye, because by then these "pri

    • Thanks for your insightful points on potential drone misuse. The issue goes even deeper, as I suggest here: https://pdfernhout.net/recogni... [pdfernhout.net]
      "Military robots like drones are ironic because they are created essentially to force humans to work like robots in an industrialized social order. Why not just create industrial robots to do the work instead? ... There is a fundamental mismatch between 21st century reality and 20th century security thinking. Those "security" agencies are using those tools of abundance

      • P.S. One other vision of a better future involving robots is James P. Hogan's 1982 sc-fi novel "Voyage From Yesteryear" which I am rereading for the fifth or so time (this time via an audiobook version).
        https://archive.org/details/vo... [archive.org]
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
        "The Mayflower II has brought with it thousands of settlers, all the trappings of the authoritarian regime along with bureaucracy, religion, fascism and a military presence to keep the population in line. However, the planners behind the gener

        • Thanks for the thoughtful replies. I've just skimmed them - as well as your website - and will read thoroughly when I have the time. So far it seems we're pretty much on the same page when it comes to what societies do and don't need.

          I'll also look up the SF titles you mentioned. And thanks for reminding me about Marshall Brain - it's been (too many) years since I last read his work and he had fallen off my radar.

          From a less science-y point of view, if you haven't read or listened to Astra Taylor I recommen

          • Thanks for the reply and the Astra Taylor recommendation (who is new to me):
            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
            "Born in Winnipeg, Manitoba, Taylor grew up in Athens, Georgia, and was unschooled until age 13 when she enrolled in ninth grade.[4] At 16 she abandoned high school to attend classes at the University of Georgia; at the university she studied Deleuze and Guattari under Ronald L. Bogue. She has described herself as a "teenage Deleuzian."
            Taylor enrolled at Brown University,

      • Pretty sure military robots are currently used to take out military humans. Don't know what SciFi you are reading where they are used to control the laborers, but it sounds interesting, and I'd like to give it a read.
        • Sorry, it is a kind-of subtle point on using military robotics to enforce a status quo in which most people are forced to work under threat of vast discomfort of some sort of others (even if that means using military robots in some other country, like the USA using drones in the Middle East). It's also an oblique reference to what so many Slashdot articles have been about -- using technology to monitor and direct workers.

          For context, consider civilian causalities even in narrowly target military campaigns u

    • "Chasing skirt"? Yeah, nothing makes a woman more wet than having a drone follow her!
      • "Chasing skirt"? Yeah, nothing makes a woman more wet than having a drone follow her!

        It has nothing to do with making the woman wet, and everything to do with making the pervy creep hard...

  • There is very little FAA allowed drone airspace in the San Francisco Bay area. Also, the sic optics of drones chasing down civilians for anything would would regrettable for any police department.
    • Depends on the drone. Lightweight plastic drones with ducted rotors probably wouldn't do too much damage. But longer battery life means added weight, so I don't know how useful a harm-free drone would be.
    • So you're saying they'll be told sternly not to fly over 400', and the police will love them?

    • What do teenage shoplifters get in the UK? A letter to their parents? (Spoiler: There's a big article about this in the BBC this week)

      The police will love flying them around, but most of the stores that buy it will be disappointed and sales will drop over time.

  • Any of you shoplifters want to buy my EMP device for blinding drones? The drone arms race has begun. I'm also working on a handgun mount for a drone...
    • So instead of a night in jail after the 10th time getting caught, the shoplifter turned terrorist gets 25 years, and you get 10 years? Sounds like a really good plan you've got!

  • The drones need to carry Hellfire missiles.

  • Hope for the sake of the shoplifters they aren't those same drones Ukraine utilizes to negates those Russian tanks!
  • "The people get in a car. You click a button," he says,

    ... and a hell-Fire Missile administers swift and certain justice.

The confusion of a staff member is measured by the length of his memos. -- New York Times, Jan. 20, 1981

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