Former Google CEO Says US Tech Workers Must Match China's 996 Schedule To Remain Competitive (fortune.com) 179
U.S. tech workers must sacrifice work-life balance to compete with China's workforce, former Google CEO Eric Schmidt has warned. Speaking on the All-In podcast, Schmidt said China's tech sector operates on "996" schedules -- 9 a.m. to 9 p.m., six days a week -- despite the practice being outlawed in 2021. He criticized remote work as particularly harmful for young employees who miss learning opportunities from in-person office interactions.
âoeIf you're going to be in tech and you're going to win, you're going to have to make some tradeoffs," Schmidt said. "Remember, we're up against the Chinese; the Chinese work-life balance consists of 996, which is 9 a.m. to 9 p.m., six days a week," he said. Silicon Valley AI startups are already adopting similar expectations, demanding 72-hour workweeks according to Wired. Google's Sergey Brin recently told Gemini team employees to work in-office weekdays, calling 60 hours weekly "the sweet spot of productivity."
âoeIf you're going to be in tech and you're going to win, you're going to have to make some tradeoffs," Schmidt said. "Remember, we're up against the Chinese; the Chinese work-life balance consists of 996, which is 9 a.m. to 9 p.m., six days a week," he said. Silicon Valley AI startups are already adopting similar expectations, demanding 72-hour workweeks according to Wired. Google's Sergey Brin recently told Gemini team employees to work in-office weekdays, calling 60 hours weekly "the sweet spot of productivity."
Fucking idiots (Score:5, Insightful)
Every study out there says that weâ(TM)d be as productive, or more so if we worked *less* in a week, not more. But noooo, mr âoeyou canâ(TM)t win at life if youâ(TM)re not a burnt out wreck by 33â canâ(TM)t deal the idea that he doesnâ(TM)t control you for the maximum possible number of hours.
Re:Fucking idiots (Score:5, Insightful)
This is just CEO-Brain bullshit. These people keep thinking we live to work, instead of work to live. What they forget is that yes many CEOs and "Founders" do work insane hours. But thats because they expect that at the end of the rainbow they will look in their bank account and behold a stupid number of zeros in their bank balance.
But the rest of us have our labour effectively stolen from us. We make the boss a million dollars off our labour and in return we get maybe $100K. For most americans, a lot less. Its almost as if 3/4 of the week we are working for free. And they want us to do more? Fuck no. I want to spend time with my girl and the kids. I want to spend time playing in punk bands, or shooting scrubs in videogames.. I want a fucking holiday.
If they want me to spend MORE time in the office, and especially if they want 72 hours a week, then I want to see at least six zeros hitting my bank account every goddamn year. And then in a year or so I'll say "Bite me", and take those years, find a nice house in the south west forests and live out my years fishing or growing murder-chillis or doing sick leadbreaks.
These billionares, they aren't like us, and they arent on our side.
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These billionares, they aren't like us, and they arent on our side.
They are sociopaths and predators, which you have to be if you want to be a billionaire
Canhave higher birthrate or 24x7 work but not both (Score:5, Informative)
Odd, how Eric Schmidt sees a declining birthrate as a crisis, and somehow does not connect that working 12 hours a day for 6 days a week leaves no time to date, find a long term relationship, get married, have children, etc.
https://hrmasia.com/worry-abou... [hrmasia.com]
Worry about lack of workers, not technology, says former Google CEO
Future worker shortage from falling birth rates should be bigger worry than AI replacing jobs, says Eric Schmidt, former Chief Executive of Google.
Champa Ha - May 26, 2023
Here's a guess: The WEF billionaires see crisis in shrinking markets, shrinking consumer bases, shrinking number of workers, a lot less consumers, and a lot less consumption.
Odd how Eric Schmidt's words follow the Infossys billionaire's call for, mainly men, of India to work 70 hours a week to compete.
https://www.cnn.com/india-info... [cnn.com]
Young Indians should work 70 hours a week, says billionaire tech founder
By Diksha Madhok, CNN - Published 4:48 AM EDT, Fri October 27, 2023
And a 75 year political base is about to get challenged and its well defined parties, well defined worn out positions on the left/right, and a media preferred set of 'acceptable for publication political discussion points' going to have to face modern issues instead of defer, defer, defer.
The declining workforce, declining birth rate, rise in childless women (45% of 40 year olds by 2030 in the USA) means that fundamental moneymaker/election winning issues for the left and the right will get downplayed and mostly forgotten as lack of births becomes (and lack of workers, lack of taxpayers) becomes the central issue for political, economic, social discourse.
Stagnating with a 'political / corporate / social culture of nostalgia' by a large set of now very elderly leaders on the left and right who've been aging in place for 25 years without doing anything different is how we got here.
Re: Canhave higher birthrate or 24x7 work but not (Score:2)
i don't think they care or think about that very much. they want to get moar naow. and when-if the machine dries up, they'll say everyone suck and move to another country.
in other words, they're parasites - they use, abuse and kill the host only to move to another host.
But the correlation between countries limits it (Score:2)
The industrialized countries now are all fighting to be the cleanest dirty shirt in a clothes hamper.
They are all trending in the same direction where moving investments amongst them can short run work, long run it will be a slow stagnation.
There will be a declining set of countries with a workable legal system left to invest in.
Re:Canhave higher birthrate or 24x7 work but not b (Score:5, Insightful)
You assume too much. When he whines about declining birthrates, what he means is he sees a lack of labor drones which wil increase labor cost.
He has no need for well-adjusted, happy adults. He doesn't care if suicide rates skyrocket. He doesn't care if the kids get to see their parents at all. He would gladly take them fresh out of a growing tube, if he could.
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> The declining workforce, declining birth rate, rise in childless women (45% of 40 year olds by 2030 in the USA) means that
> fundamental moneymaker/election winning issues for the left and the right will get downplayed and mostly forgotten as
> lack of births becomes (and lack of workers, lack of taxpayers) becomes the central issue for political, economic, social
> discourse.
Re: Canhave higher birthrate or 24x7 work but not (Score:2)
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Odd, how Eric Schmidt sees a declining birthrate as a crisis, and somehow does not connect that working 12 hours a day for 6 days a week leaves no time to date, find a long term relationship, get married, have children, etc.
Yep. Schmidt is a high-IQ idiot that overlooks blatantly obvious things.
Re: Canhave higher birthrate or 24x7 work but not (Score:2)
You only need a minute or two to make a baby..
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Speak for yourself.
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At some point having children at 40 will become more financially untenable than in your 20s.
The hell with that, what about the biological problems with having children at 40? Assuming that the woman even still has eggs left, of course.
Re: Fucking idiots (Score:2)
Re: Fucking idiots (Score:2)
Yes to the above AND if you are doing 996 you will have someone working for you to let you do that. A cook, a gardner, a nanny, a PA, a personal stylist. You are not needing to do anything else for yourself. Unless you are a the big C level, you can not afford that. I donâ(TM)t and wonât.
Re:Fucking idiots (Score:4, Insightful)
This is just CEO-Brain bullshit. These people keep thinking we live to work, instead of work to live. What they forget is that yes many CEOs and "Founders" do work insane hours. But thats because they expect that at the end of the rainbow they will look in their bank account and behold a stupid number of zeros in their bank balance.
They are driven, mindlessly, to pile up riches far beyond any conceivable need. They seem unaware that in doing so they are just as much slaves to instinct as any "lower animal".
Perhaps they should consider the myth of King Midas. Also:
"And he said unto them, Take heed, and beware of covetousness: for a man’s life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth. And he spake a parable unto them, saying, The ground of a certain rich man brought forth plentifully: and he thought within himself, saying, What shall I do, because I have no room where to bestow my fruits? And he said, This will I do: I will pull down my barns, and build greater; and there will I bestow all my fruits and my goods. And I will say to my soul, Soul, thou hast much goods laid up for many years; take thine ease, eat, drink, and be merry. But God said unto him, Thou fool, this night thy soul shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided? So is he that layeth up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God".
- Luke 12:15-21
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During his tenure he often courted controversy by saying outrageous things that were at odds with Google's mission. I guess, in hindsight, he was doing that to identify underlings who would object so he could sideline them in his quest to destroy the soul of that company.
He'
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This is just CEO-Brain bullshit. These people keep thinking we live to work, instead of work to live. What they forget is that yes many CEOs and "Founders" do work insane hours. But thats because they expect that at the end of the rainbow they will look in their bank account and behold a stupid number of zeros in their bank balance.
And that does not even work for them. A lot of catastrophic mistakes can be attributed to CEO idiots working too much.
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You could have left the last three words off your sentence and it would be even more valid.
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"work insane hours"
Yes, but at what intensity of work?
Are they intensively conceptualising, cross-referencing, designing, analysing, critiquing themselves before others, holding 2-down and 1-down meetings?
Or are they flicking through reports, glancing at dashboards, lazily delegating, unfairly haranguing and generally ordering people around at insane hours?
I guess for most CEOs it falls between these two extremes..
The more intensively you work, the less you tend to be lord it over your fellow man.
Re:Fucking idiots (Score:5, Informative)
Google's Sergey Brin recently told Gemini team employees to work in-office weekdays, calling 60 hours weekly "the sweet spot of productivity."
Pay me what they pay him and I will work 60 hour weeks, no problem.
Re:Fucking idiots (Score:5, Interesting)
CEOs generally don't work those kinds of hours. They might be on the company clock, but a lot of it is what your regular cubicle occupant would consider slacking.
God knows I've spent enough time exempting them from web filters so they can watch streaming sports events or get to their favorite gambling sites.
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Google's Sergey Brin recently told Gemini team employees to work in-office weekdays, calling 60 hours weekly "the sweet spot of productivity."
These ultrarich executives are sometimes considered uber-intelligent visionaries. However, quotes like these that are obviously nonscientific reveal they often don't know what they're talking about. We pay attention to them not based on mental but financial assets.
Pay me what they pay him and I will work 60 hour weeks, no problem.
This is the part that is obviously selfish and not logical. Schmidt is calling for free labor for a company that has tons of money to spend. Google could hire more people to do the work. Why don't they? Two reasons. First, they're cheap. Spend hun
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Correct, someone like Sergey Brin has tens of billions of dollars in Alphabet stock at current valuation. The more he can get current employees to work without hiring new people, the more his own valuation goes up. Its not about his Salary so to speak, its about his owned Stock and competing with other rich assholes for who is the richest asshole.
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Re: Fucking idiots (Score:5, Informative)
schmidt has no knowledge of history or math
https://www.scry.llc/2024/12/2... [scry.llc]
"The real cause of economic depressions is the mismatch between production time and consumption time which occurs gradually as productivity rises. Governments then create make-work jobs in a haphazard attempt to maintain consumption (equilibrium). Eventually, the impedance mismatch leads to collapse and a new system. We are probably on the verge of that change."
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Wow. Just making up "economic history" because it sounds right to him, and no one ever tells him he is full of shit.
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If you have seen any videos of China posted by people who have actually gone there, you tend to see millions of cheerful people strolling around, shopping, getting exercise and fresh air, and travelling.
Mostly couples. According to Mr Schmidt, all those videos must have been taken on Sunday - the only time when workers have any free time.
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Indeed. Peak for mental work is at around 30h/week. Work more, produce less per week. Incidentally, this has been known for a long, long time. The first systematic investigations that found this were by Henry Ford and others not in any way "socialist" people. And this result has been confirmed by time and again.
Eric Schmidt is incompetent and lacks education and qualification.
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I'd like there to be a study done, at what level of wealth do you just become stupid. We have quite a few case studies to utilize right now.
In other words (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: In other words (Score:2)
No tech has ever reduced work. In fact they demand more hours out of fewer people. Think of all the people who are going to have to check the AI slop
Re: In other words (Score:4, Insightful)
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We're in a moving average created by the young people who enter the market every year, and old people living it. Young people have energy and start from scratch, they're able and willing to work a lot. What the successful young can buy biases the new normal, and moves the goalposts for everybody.
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You can thank unions for that 40-hour week, as well as weekends, paid holidays, vacation, lunches and breaks. A 60 hour week (10 hours x 6 days) used to be the norm (of course farm boys moving to the city thought that was luxury). Then there are things like overtime pay, workers compensation, workplace safety rules, OSHA, MSDS sheets, ergonomics, and the political power to make these into laws. Since our rulers done away with the unions in most industries they've been nibbling around the edges of our pro
What if (Score:5, Insightful)
Our workforce is supposed to "compete with China" for what, exactly?
The most miserable work life? The fewest workplace protections? The most money made by billionaires? The highest rate of workplace burnout and suicide? A future where they know they'll never be able to afford a home?
Re:What if (Score:4, Insightful)
Third. Most money by billionares. 1, 2 & 4 & 5 are merely the expenses to be paid on it. Of course those downsides are paid by us, not the billionares.
Personally I couldn;'t give a fuck if China out competes us. If I have a home , well fed kids, and enough time to give those kids a happy childhood, I'm gonna be pretty happy. Maybe they can go and visit china on a holiday. Or not. Ehhh....
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And if you happen to be at the bottom I'm sure you did something to get there because as long as I'm not personally at the bottom the system works.
That last line basically describes modern right-wing capitalism in a nutshell.
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As supported by Prosperity Gospel televangelists.
Re:What if (Score:5, Interesting)
And a lot of the Chinese youth are pushing back with "do nothing". Instead of living it up, they work as a delivery person and live on that. No fancy house, no fancy car, no flashy phone, etc. But enough money for food, shelter and living expenses. And time to basically sit around and do whatever you want - lie down at the park and watch the day pass by, etc.
Even the Chinese see 996 as a waste of their time - they're not going to burn themselves out.
Of course, it only works because China has huge income inequality so necessities like food and shelter are relatively cheap on a minimal income.
All CEO must compete with Dalai Lama for empathy (Score:3)
or they are not fit for their jobs.
Lead by example (Score:2)
You go first Eric Schmidt.
really need to go union! (Score:5, Insightful)
really need to go union!
Re: (Score:2)
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There's a microscopic chance they'll be another election in about a year and then another one in two years. It's a long shot but you never know.
The real question is is can we stop having moral panics and freaking out about queer people long enough to think clearly. The problem is is people under severe duress don't think very clearly
Re:really need to go union! (Score:5, Insightful)
It is just as well possible that elections will continue, but they will be rigged - this is the way the despots usually show the unwashed masses that they are supported by an overwhelming majority.
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Of course he does. That is projection - in his head, everyone else would do the same as he does. He cannot evwn imagine that not everyone's as evil as he is.
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Will be? They have been since the introduction of computerized voting. Everywhere else on Earth a 5% deviation from exit polls is considered indicative of cheating and 10% is considered definitive. Here deviations of 20% don't even make the local news, not even precincts (and occasionally an entire county) with more votes than there are registered voters raise eyebrows any longer.
As Stalin's secretary said, "I consider it completely unimportant who in the party will vote, or how; but what is extraordinar
Re: really need to go union! (Score:2)
That is pretty easy to predict.
He could have help though, all he needs is for pootin to invade Estonia or maybe drop a bomb on Poland, then it's an easy slide to just say they did it first.
Share your wealth and I might (Score:4, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3)
Here's the thing. Spending 72 hours on the clock would physically kill a lot of people. It would be *massively* illegal to do in the U.S., not to mention highly counterproductive because:
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Just over a century ago 60 hour weeks were the norm for mines and factories and 72 was not uncommon. You can thank the unions for your viewpoint.
Obligatory (Score:5, Insightful)
Freedom is slavery.
Work six days a week for twelve hours a day, so you can be free...
This is the best life
Really
Ignore those dreams of a farm in the country
We own you now
Citizen, serve!
Re: (Score:2)
"Ignore those dreams of a farm in the country"
As a farm kid, the 996 would be an upgrade. 6 AM to 8 PM seven days a week would be closer. The cows need milking on Sunday too.
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That's not what the slogan means. Don't worry: I didn't understand Big Brother's slogans for a long time, either.
The slogan really means: [Your] freedom [of choice] is [causing] slavery [of Big Brother]. The other slogans have similar missing qualifiers.
When I young, someone explained, thusly: You work and get lots of money but little time to enjoy it, or get lots of free time but little money to enjoy it. It's why being the owner is so appealing: Other people's sweat making one rich.
Why would p
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Whatever happened to "Don't be evil"?
Hmm? (Score:5, Insightful)
Who, exactly, will win if the workers take on the 996 schedule?
Hint: it isn't the workers.
This isn't about productivity (Score:3)
It's the classic idle hands are The devil's plaything. It goes back to at least the 1800s. But we never fucking learn.
Chinese are wimps (Score:2)
I would occasionally submit timecards recording over 100 hours per week, and I had a guy working for me who recorded 16 hours per day for an entire week. HR would come back screaming that there was an error, please fix. Nope - It was accurate. My boss would chide us and say we shouldn't be doing that. Of course we ignored him. Those were good times.
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I was a theater techie in my late-teens/early-20s, 100-hour weeks back to back to back were the norm and I went three months without a day off. Then I met a few techies in the 40s and thought, "Holy crap, I don't want to be these guys."
Rich man says what? (Score:2)
Fuck this guy. It's always 1%'ers who say this shit ... as if they are the guy with the whip on a Nordic war ship. Who is the drummer?
What a dbag.
Advice from Sociopaths (Score:5, Insightful)
Two people working half as many hours can produce at least as much as someone working twice as many hours.The Chinese already have more than twice as many people so Chinese workers can work half as many hours as American workers. American tech workers need to work 24/6 - 24 hours a day six days a week to compete.
Of course all of that is all just confused nonsense. Because the competition between China and the United States isn't individual workers competing against one another. Its large companies. So you need to translate what he is saying. "For me to compete with the Chinese companies I need people to work harder because I don't know how to organize them to be more productive and I don't want to have to pay more people to work. So longer hours for workers are the only solution for me to keep my company competitive."
Um... no thanks (Score:2)
Unless you're guaranteed a significant cut of the profits (or, more likely, the buyout) - why on earth would you want to do that?
Long hours are great if... (Score:2)
...they are voluntary
When I'm totally immersed in a project, I love working long hours. The project takes over my mind and is the most enjoyable thing I can think of doing.
At the other extreme. being forced to work long hours to meet some arbitrary schedule goal sucks mightily
with the NEW h1b fee it's harder to do this! (Score:2)
with the NEW h1b fee it's harder to do this!
No benefits (Score:2)
What happened to 'work smarter not harder'.
What happened to 'Capitalism distributes profits (to workers)'.
These benefits seem to be missing from your plan.
There's also the reality, described by dgatwood ( 11270 ) [slashdot.org] that the plan is not sustainable in a technology-dependent industry.
That is not winning. (Score:2)
If you have to work 12 hours a day 6 days a week that is not winning.
Yea, nope... (Score:2)
The work structure isn't sustainable. Sure, China may have outlawed the practice just to look good to the rest of world, but it could also be because it will destroy your workforce. It will make them ill and will kill them prematurely.
Or, they get organized and some heads start rolling down the streets. Always a possibility.
Think about the children! (Score:2)
This is the future these globalist freaks plan... (Score:2)
for you. If they can drop all borders, get everybody onto a universal electronic currency, institute a global tax on the middle class, and do away with pesky stuff like the US Constitution with its Bill of Rights (rights granted to individuals by a creator which government may not mess with, rather than rights lent to people by a government), then everything will be a constant drumbeat of race-to-the-bottom rhetoric by rich elites who have no intention of joining average folks in their new status at the bot
Nice! (smart quotes) (Score:2)
âoeIf you're going to be in tech
Even Slashdot editors get bitten by the smart quotes bug.
Maybe it's time to implement an auto replace to standard quotes?
In the mean time, the settings are still in System Settings > Keyboard > Text Input > Edit (global) or Edit > Substitutions or Preferences > Autocorrection menu (app specific).
What a dweeb (Score:2)
Over centuries, as productivity has increased, people have gained a higher standard of living, which includes working fewer hours. Medieval peasants worked until they dropped. Industrial revolution - people worked 70-80 hours per week. Today, in Western countries, it's down to 40-45 hours.
If this guy wants to go back to sweatshops, let him lead the way. Hand him a coal shovel and show him the mine.
Re: (Score:2)
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That could be a goal for the Chinese, we don't have any say in it.
Pull the other one. (Score:2)
If we work from 9 to 9 for 6 days, we will have to do chores on the seventh day. It will be the end of the economy as we know it. What will we produce? For whom? When will we Google things and watch Google TV?
What would be the meaning of life? I work therefor I am...
Pull the other one. You may want to catch up on history. Start with the industrial revolution. No, don't. I guess you work 996, so can easily put in the effort to start with the dinosaurs. Chop chop!
This is actually correct... (Score:2)
60+ hours a week working is totally fine.
After deducting 8 daily hours for sleep, a week has 112 hours.
Working a bit more than half of that makes sense. However not all of that work is paid - unless you can pay people to do it for you.
Traveling to work is work. Taking care of kids and family? Work. Cooking and cleaning? Work. Shopping? Work.
I usually have about 3 hours a weekday free and 8 hours per weekend day. That's 31 hours, so I work way more than 60.
Way to be deadass, completely fucking wrong (Score:2)
Fuck off Eric Schmidt (Score:2)
I don't care about your corporation "winning" to make more money for billionaires. Go fuck yourself.
I support this (Score:2)
What's stopping him from talking less and working more?
Any of his children or siblings short on funds to the extent they'll sign up to 996 slave labour??
Fuck him. Let it rot.
Is he doing that? (Score:2)
Is he doing 996, especially currently or ever before? And how was his compensation per hour compared to what a 996 engineer would get?
So the US is a 3rd world "shithole" now? (Score:2)
Because in civilized nations, it is known that peak overall performance is at around 30h/week for mental work and around 40h/week for manual work. Work more, get less productivity per week (!).
Or maybe this person is just a blithering idiot that only "understands" numbers and cannot understand real-world implications of those numbers.
We all know this is horse shit (Score:2)
9 a.m. to 9 p.m., six days a week (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Not illegal for exempt employees, which nearly all Google employess are. At least not Federally, it might be illegal in California.
Eric Schmidt should spend 996 in prison (Score:2)
This is a job (Score:2)
Eff you, Eric Schmidt (Score:2)
Just a quote (Score:2)
And I remember a study that showed after working six 60-hour weeks the total output per sixty hour week became less than after a forty hour week. Not productivity per hour, but per week.
slave driver (Score:2)
Eric would really like to have slaves that can never leave. Because there is nothing other than WINNING EVERYTHING AT ALL TIMES!
Techno-feudalism (Score:2)
Remember feudalism? A very few lords, a few vassals and a huge number of serfs?
Seems like Schmidt wants to bring it back. Only problem is that feudalism is a hugely unproductive [medievalists.net] economic system, so Schmidt is full of shit.
Lol, no (Score:2)
Sorry, but I'm not going to take any such position. They can go fuck themselves.
Unless they are paying me CEO salaries, I shouldn't be expected to work CEO hours.
Sure, in some cases, like I have stock in the startup I'm in, I may work like that, but that's due to the expected payout.
In a normal job, making say $150K? Nope.
you first (Score:2)
Japan (Score:2)
Really? (Score:3)
This is the guy that once promised to not be evil?
Re:Remember the ice cream truck ad? (Score:5, Insightful)
In other news, former slave owner exec and pillar of destroyed privacy cracks whip, compares other slaves as more productive. Has multiple citizenships to avoid US taxes. News at 11.
Re: (Score:2)
Says the guy who spends all day trolling SlashDot when he's not flipping burgers.