NASA Will Finally Let Its Astronauts Bring iPhones To the Moon (x.com) 97
NASA Administrator Jared Isaacman has announced that astronauts on the upcoming Crew-12 and Artemis II missions will be allowed to carry iPhones and other modern smartphones into orbit and to the Moon -- a reversal of long-standing agency rules that had left crews relying on a 2016 Nikon DSLR and decade-old GoPros for the historic lunar flyby.
Isaacman framed the move as part of a broader push to challenge what he called bloated qualification requirements, where hardware approvals get mired in radiation characterization, battery thermal tests, outgassing reviews and vibration testing. "That operational urgency will serve NASA well as we pursue the highest-value science and research in orbit and on the lunar surface," he wrote.
Isaacman framed the move as part of a broader push to challenge what he called bloated qualification requirements, where hardware approvals get mired in radiation characterization, battery thermal tests, outgassing reviews and vibration testing. "That operational urgency will serve NASA well as we pursue the highest-value science and research in orbit and on the lunar surface," he wrote.
Spaceship mode? (Score:5, Funny)
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Yea, so you can be proud of having an Apple device that also has battery issues.
Re:Spaceship mode? (Score:4, Interesting)
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I wonder how the accelerators, gyros work up there? Not to mention GPS, and "Find my iPhone". You seriously might want a spaceship mode if the OS/apps can't handle the data from the sensors.
Apple ought to gift them all phones, and $10M to NASA as well, just to find out!
Roaming charges will be terrible (Score:1)
Will they have to put the phones in Spaceship mode?
I sure hope so, and leave it on while on the surface. The roaming changes are going to be really bad.
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yes, (Score:3)
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People have been carrying iphones for nearly 20 years at this point. I think the battery thermals are pretty well known and understood at this point. These aren't being used in the vacuum of space. This isn't a landing and there are no spacewalks planned. They are being used onboard.
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It's not the vacuum of space, but the Orion capsule is designed to operate at as little as 8 psi, about half normal sea level. At least it's not pure oxygen, but I do rather hope those specific phones have been tested at that pressure.
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Although NASA engineers are criticized for "What could go wrong?" there are many use cases when you're going 23Kmph in a finite structure built for weeks of living that can and do go wrong.
No, it's not pure oxygen, but fire control, unexpected EMI/RFI, outgassing plastics, all are major and life-threatening events to deal with.
Woe the day when an unapproved/untested device becomes a death weapon, or distorts a signal in such a way as to render bad navigation, etc.
Nothing is foolproof because fools are so in
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It being used as a weapon isn't one of the issues. Astronauts already have plenty of things that can be used as weapons. In fact there issued weapons in case of attack by sky bears like Ursa.
Re: yes, (Score:2)
8 psi is 16kft
8kft is 11 psi and what airline cabins are pressurized to
I would be more concerned about oxygen ingress than absolute pressure given that iphones seem to do reasonably well at altitude.
Re: yes, (Score:4, Insightful)
Lithium-ion batteries are doing so well at altitude that you can no longer put them in your check-in luggage, and that some airlines won't even let you put them in the overhead compartment anymore.
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Every commercial airline that flies has literally hundreds of smartphones on board, and has for over a decade. None have brought done a plane yet.
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Keep your iPhone, the power adapter, and any wireless charger in a well-ventilated area when in use or charging.
Spacecraft aren't exactly well-ventilated areas. And then you need to consider the high-oxygen atmosphere as well:
Explosive and other atmospheric conditions. Charging or using iPhone in any area with a potentially explosive atmosphere, such as areas where the air contains high levels of flammable chemicals, vapors, or particles (such as grain, dust, or metal powders), may be hazardous. Exposing iPhone to environments having high concentrations of industrial chemicals, including near evaporating liquified gasses such as helium, may damage or impair iPhone functionality. Obey all signs and instructions.
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Re: yes, (Score:1)
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And outgassing tests. Just wait until they're halfway to the moon and start choking on toxic fumes because someone took a kickback from Apple.
If I were an astronaut... (Score:2)
I wouldn't carry a device in my pocket that contains a lithium battery that hasn't been tested for safety in a vacuum.
Re:If I were an astronaut... (Score:4, Insightful)
If the phone is in a vacuum, the phone is the least of your worries.
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The last text message from the astronaut was "please...send...air!"
Re: If I were an astronaut... (Score:5, Funny)
Sent from my die phone
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new spacesuit who dis?
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The last text message from the astronaut was "please...send...air!"
AirDrop should solve that.
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Agreed. Plus, don't you assume the Nikon DSLR and GoPro cameras also had lithium batteries?
Plus the Artemis II Orion spacecraft utilizes four EaglePicher 120-volt lithium-ion batteries (two main, two backup) for critical power, managing communications, navigation, propulsion, and thermal control. Light weight lithium batteries are already used in many places on the spacecraft.
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I agree, but how do you know it hasn't actually been tested?
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At NASA, you know. Everybody knows. That's how they do things.
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They can't explode / burn in a vacuum...
Re: If I were an astronaut... (Score:3)
The lithium salts are the oxizider in a lithium-ion battery fire. The only way to put it out in space would be to cool it completely and rapidly.
Which isn't going to happen in a vacuum, so it will probably smolder for days or perhaps months.
Worse is in a low pressure environment like a crew capsule where it will turn into a high temperature fire and outgas a huge volume of smoke. And you will also not be able to get enough foam or water on it to stop it.
It's just an iphone (Score:2)
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If it releases poisonous gases into a tiny space capsule and then breaks by catching fire it could be a problem though. A very unlikely way for a mission to end, but NASA puts a lot of effort into preventing other equally unlikely dangers that could thwart a billion-dollar moon mission and put the crew's lives in danger.
I hope they mandate (Score:2)
safer batteries for such things. It's no laughing matter on a plane, let alone in the tight confines of a capsule, when a phone or laptop decides to go up in flames.
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It's actually quite hard to start a fire in zero-g because the CO2 stays around the flame and puts it out. Obviously that doesn't affect a phone battery because it brings its own oxygen, but the big risk is likely to be from the noxious gases it emits as it burns.
I wonder? (Score:2)
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I would agree is Microsoft developed IOS. I just hope they don't try to use Apple Maps to get to the moon. The thought of arriving at Apophis instead is quite alarming.
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Breakage acceptable, killage is not (Score:1)
I'm fine with NASA accepting an unknown risk that their non-radiation-hardened phones may fail to work or that stored non-critical pictures may be lost.
I'm NOT fine with them accepting an unknown risk of increased fire hazards.
Let's measure or get a very good estimate of the risk of a fire hazard then decide whether it's acceptable or not.
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Yep, there's a very good reason that engineers poke and prod at things for years before marking something as safe for a life critical area.
2016 Nikon DSLR vs. iPhone camera (Score:1)
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The DSLR doesn't do video conferencing or play music, so I think this decision may be more about that sort of feature.
But cameras? I wouldn't be surprised if the autofocus and dynamic range (via automatic HDR) of a high end phone were better than an old DSLR. For nighttime detail, my phone can rival a well respected zoom lens on a camera from this decade, and the results don't appear oversharpened or otherwise defective. I wouldn't believe it if I hadn't done the test myself. Of course, neither is great. Ca
Digital cameras didn't survive metal detectors (Score:1)
My early digital cameras didn't survive metal detectors. I got permanent stuck pixels on the sensors just by sending the cameras through the metal detectors.
Before you ask, we were not allowed to use lead-lined bags like we did with traditional film.
Can't wait to see those grainy, blurry, smeared images with stuck green pixels from the far side of the moon!
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I assume that you mean x-ray scanners, not metal detectors? Metal detectors shouldn't emit anything.
About Time (Score:2)
Operate how? (Score:1)
And they're going to operate their phones with spacesuit gloves on? They're going to do EVAs clutching their precious phone? NASA is allowing regular consumer-grade items into space when each launch is going to cost billions of dollars?
Seriously?
I'm sorry, this is one of the most daft ideas I've heard in a long time.
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They aren't doing EVAs at all on the Artimis II mission. They are keeping them in the spaceship where they will not wear gloves.
Employee Benefits (Score:3)
What's next? (Score:2)
Using game controllers to control the spacecraft?
OK, tasteless jokes aside, for what PURPOSE would that be?
I don't mind if they bring their phones to watch netflix. For that, safety relevant tests would be enough. But for mission equipment? NASA is not stupid. They know if tests are cheaper that finding out in orbit that your photo equipment was not vibration or radiation resistant enough.
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How Much Did Apple Pay For This (Score:3, Interesting)
This is clearly an advertisement for Apple. How much did Apple pay for this ad.
Other companies that wen to space and moon milked it for advertising for decades afterwards.
Re:How Much Did Apple Pay For This (Score:4, Informative)
This is clearly an advertisement for Apple. How much did Apple pay for this ad.
Other companies that wen to space and moon milked it for advertising for decades afterwards.
The actual NASA tweet only mentioned "smartphones" and didn't mention Apple, iPhones, or any particular manufacturers or models.
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Re:How Much Did Apple Pay For This (Score:5, Insightful)
Your bias is showing. You might want to re-read the headline.
NASA Will Finally Let Its Astronauts Bring iPhones To the Moon
iPhone? Check. Other phones? No check.
Only the user-generated headline & summary mentions iPhones, whereas the source material states
NASA astronauts will soon fly with the latest smartphones
.It looks like the submitter has a bias towards iPhones.
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Nope. You're showing that you don't actually read the post, which says: " iPhones and other modern smartphones". And incidentally, I have a Samsung Android phone. I avoid Apple products because they're too controlling. I run GNU/Linux.
You don't run GNU/Linux on your Samsung phone. You run bionic/Linux. Linux kernel but the bionic libc and the toybox Unix utils. And, of course, above the layer of basic libc and tools Android is very, very different from any desktop Linux distro.
I'm not saying this is a bad thing. There are really good reasons for Android's choices. And it definitely is a Linux system (no matter how much the Android Security team wishes it weren't -- so many vulns!). But it's not GNU/Linux, and it's not anything li
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Are you saying the post is different from the title? How much did Apple pay to make that happen?
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The title didn't. Maybe Apple only paid off msmash
Uhhh... Houston, we have a problem here (Score:3)
Everybody seems to have forgotten their lightning cables.
Finally? (Score:1)
"NASA Will *Finally* Let Its Astronauts Bring iPhones To the Moon"
As opposed to the last astronauts that went to the moon? Really? The reason the Apollo missions didn't bring iPhones was because NASA wouldn't let them?
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Neil Armstrong was a diehard Blackberry user.
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Oh wait ... it *is* rocket science! (Score:2)
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Probably more here than the people making the big decisions for NASA nowadays.
Added info (Score:2)
For what it is worth, the Artemis III astronauts will have modified Nikon Z9 cameras (a modern mirrorless camera) for taking shots on the surface. Ref 1 [space.com], 2 [talkoftitusville.com]. I don't think anyone would fancy exposing an iPhone to the vacuum of space, nor trying to operate it with
Anker battery packs (Score:2)
lunar dick pics (Score:1)
Finally, astronauts can take lunar dick pics. Might have to wait for the return trip to send them though.
Re: lunar dick pics (Score:3)
The question on everyone's mind: does microgravity cause shrinkage?
Cell towers there? (Score:2)
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What kind of coverage do you get? Will there be long distance charges with the current plan?
The roaming charges from the moon are astronomical....
Last Time (Score:2)
Roaming (Score:2)
A potential phone battery fire on a space capsule (Score:2)
Cell towers in space (Score:2)
When I read the summary, my first thought was 'are they bringing a bunch of cell-satellites with them?'
Latency will be brutal.
Lattes! (Score:2)
Now we need Lunar Lattes!
wait ... (Score:3)
noice!!!
now all there's left is ... actually getting them to the moon. piece of cake!
Great! (Score:2)
They'll be able to film a moonwalk in HD.
Forget the iPhone, bring a proper ilc... (Score:2)
Instead of taking a smartphone to the moon, they should've bringing a proper high end DSLR or mirrorless and some good glass. The cameras they used for Apollo were high end for the time, if we are going back it makes sense to use di.ilarlybhigh end cameras with full-frame sensors and good glass rather than a phone.
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Re: Forget the iPhone, bring a proper ilc... (Score:2)
Go pick up a copy of the coffee table book "Full Moon," which consists of rescans of the original Apollo positives, and you'll see images just as good or better in resolution and dynamic range than what today's "full frame" mirrorless cameras can produce.
Sure, the modern digital
roaming costs $100 per MB txts $5 per txt voice $2 (Score:2)
roaming costs $100 per MB txts $5 per txt voice $20 per min.
Risky (Score:2)
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Oh good (Score:2)
Because what we really needed was pictures from NASA missions touched up by AI / weird algorithms rather than the capturing of raw sensor data to be reviewed post mission. I wonder who will be first to discover life on another planet, NASA, Apple, or Samsung.
Can you hear now ??? Tough getting a signal (Score:2)
This makes no sense (Score:2)
The convenience of a smart phone is that it's many devices in one, and part of that is the connectivity to the rest of the world. You can take pictures with a reasonably high resolution camera, and immediately share them with your friends and family, or post to social media. In orbit (and beyond), you aren't going to have that instant global network access, nor do I assume astronauts are going to be itching to share pictures of their food on Spacebook. I would think a dedicated camera, that has its batte
Ok, but NO iPADs!!! (Score:2)
The Nazis behind the Moon, remember?