Costumed Crowd 'Speedruns' Scientology Building For Social Media Trend (yahoo.com) 89
Last Saturday someone dressed as Jesus "was among the dozens of people in costumes and masks seen on a video forcing open the door of a Scientology building on Hollywood Boulevard," reports the Los Angeles Times, "after a tug-of-war with a security guard."
The footage posted on TikTok and Instagram shows the group sprinting up and down stairs and clashing with black-shirted security guards, giggling and gasping to catch their breath while church members scream at them to leave. On their way out — as security guards approach armed with fire extinguishers — one of the sprinters stops and dances to celebrate their successful escape, a move reminiscent of a taunt from the video game Fortnite. For weeks, groups of people have barged into two of the church's Hollywood properties, racing through hallways and tussling with security guards, trying to see how far they can get before they are forced to leave by church staff...
Church officials say the incidents are not a game and have accused the speed runners of "hate crimes." After dozens on Saturday stormed the Ivar Avenue building that houses an exhibit dedicated to the church's founder, science fiction author L. Ron Hubbard, the external door handles were removed from all three of Scientology's properties on Hollywood Boulevard by Sunday morning. Guards could be seen blocking the doorway to one building on Monday afternoon...
No arrests have been made.
A report from the Associated Press cites a joke left on one of the videos: that if runners reach the top of the building, they'll find Tom Cruise. One commenter on a recent TikTok video of a speedrun asked why people are doing this, and another user simply replied, "because it's fun."
The 18-year-old who started the trend told the Hollywood Reporter his original video has been viewed over 100 million times. "From there on out, I pretty much knew that Scientology was like a free gateway to a lot of views."
Vulture notes that "there's even a Roblox re-creation of the trend, made using the 'maps; drawn from actual videos"
Church officials say the incidents are not a game and have accused the speed runners of "hate crimes." After dozens on Saturday stormed the Ivar Avenue building that houses an exhibit dedicated to the church's founder, science fiction author L. Ron Hubbard, the external door handles were removed from all three of Scientology's properties on Hollywood Boulevard by Sunday morning. Guards could be seen blocking the doorway to one building on Monday afternoon...
No arrests have been made.
A report from the Associated Press cites a joke left on one of the videos: that if runners reach the top of the building, they'll find Tom Cruise. One commenter on a recent TikTok video of a speedrun asked why people are doing this, and another user simply replied, "because it's fun."
The 18-year-old who started the trend told the Hollywood Reporter his original video has been viewed over 100 million times. "From there on out, I pretty much knew that Scientology was like a free gateway to a lot of views."
Vulture notes that "there's even a Roblox re-creation of the trend, made using the 'maps; drawn from actual videos"
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Well, let's think about that (Score:5, Insightful)
A sad commentary on some people's morality that they think this is okay. What ever happened to the "golden rule?"
Well, on the other hand, if it was an actual "religion" rather than a sci-fi writer's spoof of one I might have more sympathy. The thing is so bizarre that it is a living example of Poe's law - you literally can't tell the difference between Scientology and a spoof of Scientology.
So, sure, get all hot and bothered about the morality of this, but a group of people making fun of something that's indistinguishable itself from making fun, is pretty morally neutral actually.
Re:Well, let's think about that (Score:4, Funny)
You must be full of Thetons. You need an audit now. That'll be $5000 please.
Going into their house is morally wrong (Score:5, Insightful)
Dial it back a little (Score:3, Informative)
Going into their house is morally wrong ... it's a dehumanization based on ideology
Let's dial it back a little. Reel your neck in just a touch.
It's no one's house per se. It's a church. Most churches are open to the public. This isn't a home invasion. No one has been hurt.
It could be said to be valid, if somewhat loud, protest. Considering how Scientology has with great intent in many cases forced itself onto others, how its tax-free stratus makes it a drain on public coffers, and how it has openly used the threat of financial ruin to coerce ongoing membership.
Now, that is likely a
Dial it back a little, as in be respectful ... (Score:1)
Going into their house is morally wrong ... it's a dehumanization based on ideology
Let's dial it back a little. Reel your neck in just a touch. It's no one's house per se. It's a church. Most churches are open to the public. This isn't a home invasion.
"The lady doth protest too much, methinks." No one said "home invasion". Is English not your native language, have you never heard the phrase "house of worship"?
Being open to the public is not a license to act like an entitled a-hole and mock someone else's ideology. It really is cult vs cult behavior.
"Dial it back a little", as in be a polite guest in someone else's house, refuge, etc? Yes.
Considering how Scientology has with great intent in many cases forced itself onto others ...
If you want to mock them in when they are in public proselytizing, by all means, let them have it. That is the c
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Let's dial it back a little and RTFA.
You can certainly have the position that Scientology just sucks and gets what they deserve, but that's not what you actually said. What you said is just sort of silly and shows you didn't read anything but the headline.
It doesn't appear to be a church, just a building owned by a church. Scientology definitely does operate lots of buildings that are basically open to the public every day, but they certainly aren't obligated to make every building like that 24/7.
These peop
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If this is their punishment, they are getting off easy.
Self entitled vigilantism is not moral either.
... it really is cult vs cult behavior to go there. Entitled ass-hattery.
If you want to confront them when they come out into public to proselytize by all means expose and mock them. But their house, their refuge, should be off limits
Re: Going into their house is morally wrong (Score:2)
That is a valid argument, up until the point where the church of Scientology starts to pervert justice and law enforcement. We have passed that point.
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A sad commentary on some people's morality that they think this is okay. What ever happened to the "golden rule?"
Well, on the other hand, if it was an actual "religion" rather than a sci-fi writer's spoof of one I might have more sympathy. The thing is so bizarre that it is a living example of Poe's law - you literally can't tell the difference between Scientology and a spoof of Scientology.
So, sure, get all hot and bothered about the morality of this, but a group of people making fun of something that's indistinguishable itself from making fun, is pretty morally neutral actually.
Seems like a dangerous attitude. This barging in on the Scientologists is very much like the teenagers knocking on doors and then running away. Would it be acceptable to distinguish between the doors of neighbors that we like and don't like? It's an outrage when the teenagers bother the nice old widow but something we condone when it's the unfriendly curmudgeon. That doesn't sound right.
Re: Well, let's think about that (Score:2)
> Well, on the other hand, if it was an actual "religion" rather than a sci-fi writer's spoof
I'm not sure how one defines an "actual religion" in a way that's distinguishable from a spoof. This seems like a distinction without a difference.
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That's definitely true. There are at least three ongoing religions besides Scientology that were officially started as ... well, not jokes exactly. One of them was started to satisfy a college requirement that students have religious activity.
But the thing is, what a religion is started for has little to do with what it develops into. Decades later many of the followers of the particular religion that I am most familiar with take it quite seriously. (I've no clue as to how serious the Jedi are.)
Its just cult vs cult (Score:1)
A sad commentary on some people's morality that they think this is okay. What ever happened to the "golden rule?"
We've descended into ideological cults, and if there is one thing a cult hates and cannot tolerate it is the other cults. The other ideologies. The golden rule requires the non-cult like behaviors of tolerance and minding one's own business unless someone is in danger.
Re: It's definitely a hate crime (Score:2)
Just because a priest rapes a child doesn't give everyone the right to put Catholic congregants in danger and harass them.
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A sad commentary on some people's morality that they think this is okay. What ever happened to the "golden rule?"
If only Scientology itself practised that philosophy. Instead it has been litigious with its critics, and cruel, manipulative, and avaricious towards its members.
Re: It's definitely a hate crime (Score:2)
Go take a real good look at the FACE act - you know, the one that puts praying grandmothers standing outside abortion clinics in jail. It also applies to people interfering with a person in a religious service - it's what Don Lemon and a few others were charged with violating when they staged a protest inside a church.
The Feds can and should crack down on these 'pranksters' - it wouldn't be too hard to simply lick the doors behind them and keep them in the building till police arrive.
Dangerously stupid stunt (Score:2, Insightful)
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Scientology is an official religion
"Why do people have to fight over their various religious beliefs, can't they just coexist?"
*Scientology exists*
"Oh."
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Official religion but it shouldn't be. Just like the highly profitable Mega-Churches. They may be playing in the grey area of the law but sometimes the good of humanity is more important than laws written by the people abusing them. Loopholes are closed all the time.
Re:Dangerously stupid stunt (Score:5, Interesting)
It's not so much that this is dangerous anyone taking part in this knows damn well what they're getting into.
This is what the cool kids call getting into good trouble. It's protest meant to draw attention.
That said Scientology is really on the ropes right now with collapsing membership and because of the internet it's difficult for their silly brand of nonsense to get much play. So there were probably better targets and better things for the protesters to do but it might have been personal if one of their friends or family members got stuck in the cult or themselves personally.
I know there are a lot of EX Jehovah witnesses trying to get people out.
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That said Scientology is really on the ropes right now with collapsing membership and because of the internet it's difficult for their silly brand of nonsense to get much play.
It's a bit like The Onion having to buy Infowars to remain relevant. Scientology's brand of batshit crazy religion is largely overshadowed by MAGA which has a far larger membership and in many ways is even more stupid.
Re: Dangerously stupid stunt (Score:2)
This is what the cool kids call getting into good trouble. It's protest meant to draw attention.
Interfering with a persons religious services is a serious crime, see the FACE act.
What, exactly, are the 'cool kids' trying to draw attention to?
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It is not an "official religion." It is *recognized* as a religion by the IRS, and receives the same egregiously advantageous financial benefits as other religions, but that doesn't really give it any more weight than Mormonism, Presbyterianism, Catholicism, etc. None of which (thus far) are "official" in this increasingly "best of all possible worlds" >-|
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A lot of people seem to have trouble distinguishing between "official religion"
and "officially a religion", alas. But with that snickered over, it at least has that latter distinction, disgustingly.
Re: Dangerously stupid stunt (Score:2)
It's a religion to evade taxes.
I bet (Score:2, Insightful)
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Or a church.
Re:I bet (Score:5, Interesting)
Almost all mosques are open to the public and welcoming. If they tried it they'd be told to stop running, would they like to sit down and have some tea?
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They wouldn't even have to run in the first place since they could take their time and freely look around.
Re: I bet (Score:1)
As a reminder, they put on costumes (to hide their identity), assaulted the security guards, trespassed, likely did some damage, and likely interfered/interrupted some sort of religious service going on somewhere inside the building.
I don't think the Muslims in a mosque would be as compliant as you want them to be - I can't see them being very accepting of costumed individuals running into the building as some kind of "tik-tok" challenge...
Um... For mosques they do it all the time (Score:1)
One of my all-time famous stories is a bunch of magats showing up with rifles at a mosque and then realizing they just showed up at a Nation of Islam mosque and turning tail and running when they noticed the guys out front with guns.
Religion is harmless when you don't give it any political power and you don't let it rip people off. At that point to devolves into a social club with a bit of spiritualism.
The proble
Re: Um... For mosques they do it all the time (Score:2)
It's not at all COMMON for right wingers to go harass Muslims at places of worship.
FTFY
If you want to claim it is somehow "not uncommon" (AKA "common") for right-wingers to harass Muslims at places of worship you really need to cite AT LEAST one specific instance, not a vague reference to an urban legend story with ZERO specifics...
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Whether something is a religion or not is mainly up the the view of the individual. I have known religious Scientologists, i.e. Scientologists who viewed it as a religion. Yeah, it's silly, and based on lies, but name a religion that I can be convinced isn't. My favorite religion admits that it was created to fulfill a college religion requirement....but that doesn't stop it from being an actual religion...with a few members who seriously view it that way.
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Why would they? A mosque is a place of worship, not a place of fraud fleecing members for money to have their Thetans measured. If you want something comparable to storming a building full of fraudsters who do nothing but lie, steal from people, and literally send thugs after people to threaten them you should say: "I bet... They wouldn't try this in the White House."
Hey, that's not nice (Score:5, Funny)
Let's be mindful of their religion and ask ourselves, "What would Tom Cruise do?"
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Unless, of course, it involves international espionage. Then the gloves are off for sure.
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I'm a member of the Midday Church of Oprah, and I am still upset how Mr Cruise disrespected the holy sofa [people.com].
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Maybe jump on a couch?
Bonus points next round for playing The Floor is Lava!
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Well, being a reacher of the top of the building is an almost impossible mission, a pretty risky business specially for outsiders. I'd join a few good man, train all the right moves, and avoid any collateral damage, so we can get there and become legend. I bet the guards will be losin'it.
I wonder what secrets are up there. Maybe vanilla skies? The mummy of Ron Hubbard?
But I suspect that after that, days of thunder will be upon us. Scientologists have an endless love for their secrets. They'll hire the best
questionable (Score:1)
Ok look, to all of you claiming this is a religion, prove it. This is some science fiction fantasy bullshit dressed up like religion and operating more like a cult. I'm pretty sure L Ron is a vampire and Satoshi too, which is as real as Scientology is a religion.
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Right, just ask the Pastafarians.
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Don't say "religion" when you only mean Christianity. Some religions actually do offer proofs.
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Re:questionable (Score:4, Interesting)
Google is your friend. In the US the IRS recognizes it as a religion, as does the DOD. Other countries are more skeptical.
You've just said "religion" three ways: a descriptive phrase, a noun and another noun.
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In the US the IRS recognizes it as a religion, as does the DOD.
DoD? As in the Department of Defense?
The US Government recognizes Scientology as a tax-exempt religious organization. The Department of Defense is part of the US Government, so it does as well.
But so what? How does this affect DoD operations? There are no Scientology chaplains in the DoD. Maybe Scientologists who are serving can obtain religious exceptions to policies of one kind or another, or time off for observances, just like any other service-member? Is that what you meant?
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Yeah, the US government isn't that consistent.
Guess you answered your own question.
OP asked for proof Scientology is a religion (Slashd
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Google is your friend. In the US the IRS recognizes it as a religion,
Yeah, but isn't the bar for that ridiculously low in the US? Like the Jedi "religion" being tax-exempt on religious grounds? And there's no discussion that that one is based purely on fiction.
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You don't ask for that burden of proof from other religions. At least we can touch an eMeter, so where's the talking snake?
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Ok look, to all of you claiming this is a religion, prove it.
religion is a quite fuzzy term, there is no consensus on what a religion is and we don't even know the exact etymology of the word.
This is some science fiction fantasy bullshit dressed up like religion
you mean like angels, miracles, resurrections, prophecies, afterlife (with virgins!), halls of the slain, flying spaghetti, spiritual machines?
and operating more like a cult.
i don't know of any religion that doesn't have a "cult" to be followed, that is, a set of rites or norms expected to be observed, and a set of followers. those ofc vary greatly. and most religions also expect offerings and use part of the
Re: questionable (Score:2)
you haven't pointed to a single characteristic which could uniquely define a "religion" as "real" in a way in which scientology would not qualify.
Can you think of a single religion that has a paywall?
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most religious congregations use ruses to fund themselves. i don't think the particular way to do this is a defining characteristic of "not-a-religion". it is indeed gross, but it's also quite in sync with modern capitalist mentality, and it's not very different from paying indulgences to ensure fast-track access to end-game content (aka heaven), a practice employed for centuries by one of the most extended and recognized religions in the world.
i mean, i get your point, i'm not defending scientology by any
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i don't know of any religion that doesn't have a "cult" to be followed, that is, a set of rites or norms expected to be observed, and a set of followers.
A "cult" has come to mean a group (religious or otherwise) that exploits or abuses its members in one or more ways. Not all religions are cults, and not all cults are religions.
There have been many efforts to characterize what constitutes a cult. One of the better ones I have heard of is the BITE model. [freedomofmind.com]
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good observation. i had to tuck "cult" in there somehow :-)
then again note that even bite doesn't limit "cult" (mind control) to religions. many cults will use some god concept or faith as a channel or pretext, but mind control is actually a separate thing from religion and happens in many contexts. you'll notice that many of their listed characteristics apply perfectly well to other entities, like governments, ideologies, lobby groups ... i like their definition: "manipulative groups".
Not all religions are cults, and not all cults are religions
i would say not all c
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[...] note that even bite doesn't limit "cult" (mind control) to religions. many cults will use some god concept or faith as a channel or pretext, but mind control is actually a separate thing from religion and happens in many contexts. you'll notice that many of their listed characteristics apply perfectly well to other entities, like governments, ideologies, lobby groups ... i like their definition: "manipulative groups".
Yes, as I said, not all cults are religions. (And not all religions are cults -- see below.) For example, psychological cults, such as est which began in the 1970s, are generally areligious -- no god required.
i would say not all cults are religions but definitely every religion embodies some form of mind control, by definition. for good or worse, that's another matter. i guess the threshold is in "to exploit or abuse", but there are again many nuances to that!
There's nothing wrong with a group, religious or otherwise, having rules its members are expected to follow. As you say, the key issue is whether those rules are exploitative or abusive, and there's a judgement call involved with that.
Many religions just offer fellowship in a particular spiritual tradi
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(And not all religions are cults -- see below.)
Many religions just offer fellowship in a particular spiritual tradition, and don't seek to "control" the minds of their members.
i just don't see that cults have to be necessarily exploitative, so i would go with "not all religions are cults that abuse or exploit", and i'm maybe spliting hairs but i'm not sure that this is the exclusive meaning (although it is often implied), there are many groups we call "cults" in casual speech that aren't, some groups are called cults because their beliefs are extreme, but that doesn't necessarily imply abuse or exploitation. which is why i said "all religions embody some form of mind control".
aga
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Watch The Master (Score:2)
https://slate.com/culture/2012... [slate.com]
Lightweight hijinx (Score:2)
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Never thought I'd have to say this. (Score:2)
Last Saturday someone dressed as Jesus "was among the dozens of people in costumes and masks seen on a video forcing open the door of a Scientology building on Hollywood Boulevard," reports the Los Angeles Times, "after a tug-of-war with a security guard."
It wasn't Trump. :-)
(Not even "Doctor" Trump [theguardian.com] this time. /s)
So its about monetization .... (Score:1)
The 18-year-old who started the trend told the Hollywood Reporter his original video has been viewed over 100 million times. "From there on out, I pretty much knew that Scientology was like a free gateway to a lot of views."
So it's about monetization of one's content. I'm sure L Ron Hubbard would approve. ;-)
You see folks, the preceding is a joke. It mocks a group without invading their "home", without being an entitled a-hole who imagines they possess the moral superiority to trespass onto someone else's "refuge".
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If the church were smart (Score:1)
they'd use the attention for recruiting, setting up big signs and a Q&A desk.
If runners reach the top of the building :o (Score:2)
L. Ron Hubbard shurly
Technology Cocktail [tonyortega.org]:
L. Ron Hubbard: “A service facsimile is a brother to R/Ses and evil intentions. This is easily seen when one understands the anatomy of the service fac and the right/wrong, dominate and survive computations that enter into it. And when one understands that an R/S always means a hidden, evil intention and that the total reason for an R/S is to make wrong. In order to get someon
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I had to google for it, so for those who are wondering: "R/S" stands for Rock Slam -- a particular sudden needle-movement that occurs on an e-meter when someone is being audited. Scientology auditors usually associate it with negative thoughts about the organization.
What was right about it is now wrong about it and what was once wrong is now right. A=A=A enters into the situation where rightness becomes wrongness.
Chilling. The equation or confusion of opposites is one of the standard methods of mind control.
This brings up some interesting issues (Score:3)
"if runners reach the top of the building, they'll find Tom Cruise." - What if they go to the basement? Will they find David Miscavige's wife?
"Scientology is an official religion"
+ Scientology was not a recognized religion in the U.S. until 1993.
+ Before that their members still wrote their donations off their taxes as "religious deductions".
+ IRS charged them penalties.
+ Several Scientologists filed lawsuits against the IRS.
+ Members of the House/Senate were worried donations to their campaign from Scientology members would be made public if those IRS cases came to court.
+ Solution: They were given religious status and the lawsuits were dropped.
So, why was it so important elected officials wouldn't want to be tied to Scientology? Because of Operation: Snow White.
WIK: "Operation Snow White was a criminal conspiracy by the Church of Scientology during the 1970s to purge unfavorable records about Scientology and its founder, L. Ron Hubbard. This project included a series of infiltrations into and thefts from 136 government agencies, foreign embassies and consulates, as well as private organizations critical of Scientology, carried out by Church members in more than 30 countries. It was one of the largest infiltrations of the United States government in history, with up to 5,000 covert agents."
"Mary Sue Hubbard, Cindy Raymond, Gerald Bennett Wolfe, Henning Heldt, Duke Snider, Gregory Willardson, Richard Weigand, Mitchell Herman, Sharon Thomas, Jane Kember, and Mo Budlong, all high-ranking Scientologists, were convicted; prison sentences were as long as six years, though no defendant served that amount. L. Ron Hubbard was named by federal prosecutors as an "unindicted co-conspirator" and went into hiding for the rest of his life."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
And yet, Charles Grassley (R-IA) still spearheaded the move to give them official religious status.
DO NOT GET CAUGHT (Score:2)
If they get you, they will dump all the thetans in you.
You will be the entire church's thetan bucket.
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Damn, I didn't even consider the possibility that they have Ghostbusters-style Thetan Traps!
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Of course they do!
And the big power switch to turn it off as well, which i do not recommend pulling if you're doing a really good run
I don't understand what makes this ok (Score:2)
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Re: I don't understand what makes this ok (Score:2)
From the FACE act:
(2) by force or threat of force or by physical obstruction, intentionally injures, intimidates or interferes with or attempts to injure, intimidate or interfere with any person lawfully exercising or seeking to exercise the First Amendment right of religious freedom at a place of religious worship; or
(3) intentionally damages or destroys the property of a facility, or attempts to do so, because such facility provides reproductive health services, or intentionally damages or destroys the property of a place of religious worship,
This is the law Don Lemon and the protesters violated when they stormed the church in Minneapolis because they thought a part-time preacher there was an ICE agent.
See: https://www.law.cornell.edu/us... [cornell.edu]
I was really hoping for something else there (Score:2)
But... (Score:2)
dirtbags (Score:2)
I have ZERO positive to say about scientology; it's a scam setup by the world's worst SciFi author.
That said, however, the people who did this are scum.
You have NO RIGHT to enter somebody else's facility (no matter how much you disagree with them or hate them) and mock them, wreak havok, sew discord, make a scene, etc. That's NOT a party, or a gag, or a joke, or a protest. These jerks would call the cops if a pack of scientologists did this to THEM in their homes or some place THEY care about, or some place
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Well said; I commented much the same thing, and I utterly detest Scientology and everyone involved in it.
With that said, even these brain-warped Scientologists have a right to do what they do without interference or having their building invaded.
Pointless (Score:2)
As much as I detest Scientology, I have a hard time condoning this.
Everyone thinks stuff like this is hilarious until it affects them or their job, and suddenly it's not so funny.
I'm not defending Scientology or any of their kooky shit, but even they have a right to do what they do without interference or having their building invaded.