GTA VI Is a Worrying Sign For the Future of Physical Games (theverge.com) 94
Rockstar Games has revealed the price of Grand Theft Auto VI to be $79.99, and confirmed that the physical versions of the game won't include a disc. Instead, they'll contain a one-time download code when it launches November 19. "Not only is that a disappointing decision for people who like to own physical games, but given the scale of the next GTA, it also sets a bad precedent for the rest of the industry," reports The Verge. From the report: There are a lot of advantages to buying digital. You can start a download from your couch. You can store multiple games on one hard drive so you don't have to get up to play something else. Storefronts like Steam or the PlayStation Store don't run out of inventory of the newest game you're interested in, and you can often get games at a cheaper price thanks to frequent sales.
But it's becoming increasingly clear that digital ownership has significant disadvantages, too. If a game you don't own digitally is removed from a storefront, whether that's for things like licensing, artificially limited availability, or even the store eventually closing down, your only option is to hope you can find a physical version. If your account on a platform is banned, even if that ban isn't warranted, you might be locked out of your digital library with no way to play those games unless you buy them again or hope your account gets restored. You can't sell or trade digital games you've purchased, and while there are ways to share digital games, they require some work and are usually intended just for families.
It's also much harder to preserve digital games because they only "exist" on the hard drive of a console, PC, or device they were downloaded to. This is an issue across many industries, not just console games; there are multiple examples of things like mobile games and streaming shows becoming lost for good when they don't have a physical version. Without physical versions, you also can't find a used version of a game at a garage sale or a local game shop. It's unclear whether Rockstar will ever release a physical version of the game. As for why, The Verge suspects the decision was made in part to prevent leaks; "by only being available digitally, Rockstar can ensure that GTA VI unlocks at the same exact time for everyone."
"The digital-only choice might also indicate that the game has a massive file size that's too big for PlayStation and Xbox game discs."
But it's becoming increasingly clear that digital ownership has significant disadvantages, too. If a game you don't own digitally is removed from a storefront, whether that's for things like licensing, artificially limited availability, or even the store eventually closing down, your only option is to hope you can find a physical version. If your account on a platform is banned, even if that ban isn't warranted, you might be locked out of your digital library with no way to play those games unless you buy them again or hope your account gets restored. You can't sell or trade digital games you've purchased, and while there are ways to share digital games, they require some work and are usually intended just for families.
It's also much harder to preserve digital games because they only "exist" on the hard drive of a console, PC, or device they were downloaded to. This is an issue across many industries, not just console games; there are multiple examples of things like mobile games and streaming shows becoming lost for good when they don't have a physical version. Without physical versions, you also can't find a used version of a game at a garage sale or a local game shop. It's unclear whether Rockstar will ever release a physical version of the game. As for why, The Verge suspects the decision was made in part to prevent leaks; "by only being available digitally, Rockstar can ensure that GTA VI unlocks at the same exact time for everyone."
"The digital-only choice might also indicate that the game has a massive file size that's too big for PlayStation and Xbox game discs."
If you buy it, you're paying to get screwed (Score:5, Insightful)
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you insist on only using the "legal" definition of "stealing" in the context of piracy which requires depriving someone else of the item, and not the colloquial usage of stealing that means nothing more than illicitly obtaining a paid product or service without paying for it
That's not only a legal distinction, it's also a real one. If you're not depriving someone of something, you're simply not stealing. Anyone who thinks differently about that is just confused, and what's more, they were deliberately confused for the benefit of the copyright cartel. Thanks for letting us all know how confused you are.
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That's not only a legal distinction, it's also a real one. If you're not depriving someone of something, you're simply not stealing.
Theft of Services is a specifically-defined crime in some jurisdictions.
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Theft of Services is a specifically-defined crime in some jurisdictions.
Then you're depriving someone of operating costs and/or time, depending on the specific business model. Just making a copy of something without their involvement doesn't do that, period. It might still arguably be wrong, but it's definitely not theft.
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Re: If you buy it, you're paying to get screwed (Score:2)
I'm not your parent posterz but technically he didn't say "take an object", he said "deprive of use". That could've been applied to a service all along.
Less teenagers (Score:2)
A lot less buyers in their prime video game buying years 6 to 25 is what is happening.
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try that defense in court. It has worked for so many people before. Technically you are correct, but the courts have decided that depriving a corporation of potential profit is as good as asportation.
Re: If you buy it, you're paying to get screwed (Score:2)
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It's more like seeing your neighbor wearing jewelry, and then crafting your own piece that looks the same. Your neighbor still has their original jewelry.
People do this kind of thing all the time, they see their neighbors get something and then copy them - wether its a paint job or landscaping, or a new car etc.
Re: If you buy it, you're paying to get screwed (Score:2)
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Re: If you buy it, you're paying to get screwed (Score:1)
If buying isn't owning, piracy isn't stealing.
It's like sneaking into a baseball game without paying, no, that isn't "stealing".
And just like that, if you're a kid, don't get caught, but if you're an adult with a job, fuck you buddy, nobody owes you a fucking game you entitled loser.
Re: If you buy it, you're paying to get screwed (Score:2)
Re: If you buy it, you're paying to get screwed (Score:3)
Well, technically, copying it's not "piracy" to begin with.
Piracy is when you board a vessel in international waters without authorization.
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The pirate version will be better anyway. No DRM or ring 0 drivers buggering up your computer and breaking Linux compatibility. Save the installer and play it forever. The download server won't melt on day 1 so you will actually get to enjoy the game.
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"One time download"? (Score:3)
Re: "One time download"? (Score:2)
Re: "One time download"? (Score:2)
Uhm... how exactly is a "one time download code" different from a "one time download", in terms of practical consequences for the user?
Re: "One time download"? (Score:2)
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Re: "One time download"? (Score:2)
So how will they know it's "you" when you try to download it again 10 or 15 uears later?
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Well, I bought Triggerheart Exclica on Xbox Live Arcade back in 2006 on an Xbox 360.
I can go download that game, right now, on my Series X, because, gasp, it's the same account.
So if I were to buy GTA VI for Series X in a few months, and type the download code into the 'redeem code' box, it ties that code to my account. See?
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One-time download (Score:2)
I think the real problem here is that Rockstar doesn't seem to know what the term "physical version" means.
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I think the real problem here is that Rockstar doesn't seem to know what the term "physical version" means.
Define it then.
Then ask a dozen modern companies to do the same.
You'll quickly realize how many different definitions now exist, because of lawyers.
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Even the summary is confused. Apparently a copy on your hard drive is not physical, and therefore can't be preserved or whatever. The copy of GTA VI you might download from Rockstar is also not physical no matter what you put it on?
So a physical copy is what, printed on paper? Chiselled in stone? I'm not surprised Rockstar decided not to provide their six terabyte game in those formats.
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Even the summary is confused. Apparently a copy on your hard drive is not physical, and therefore can't be preserved or whatever. The copy of GTA VI you might download from Rockstar is also not physical no matter what you put it on? So a physical copy is what, printed on paper? Chiselled in stone?
So you found one braincell, but try as you might, couldn't find a second one to rub against it and figure out that maybe it's referring to the physical medium that people have been buying video games for over 4 decades -- on cartridges or optical discs?
And you really can't figure out the advantages of tangible copies:
- can be lent to friends
- isn't permanently tied to a specific account
- isn't dependent on a vendor's storefront needing to remain operational
- price competition between retailers vs f
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Ah, given the social skills and anger issues you must be a console gamer. See, when your computer isn't in a fancy box with "Sony" written on it you can put any downloaded file you like on any medium you wish. You can lend it to a friend, once you've downloaded it you don't need any "storefronts" at all, etc.
Your inability to copy files off your computer sounds like it's a problem all right, but I'm not sure that problem is Rockstar.
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Release something physical, at least (Score:1)
It could be something else physical, like
a hardback of book of concept art which didn't make it into the game, or
a poster of the overworld map (like how Elder Scrolls used to do), or
a DVD documentary of the making of the game, or
a physical copy of the music in the game similar to how Quake 2's disc plays on audio players. Maybe release all of the music from every GTA past and present onto one disc, bro
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It really is sad that we consumers need to insist they release something physical for one main reason. To mitigate their fucking greed.
A planet full of garbage, does not need ANY more physical copies of garbage. It needs more protections around the digital world that COULD replace it properly, if we keep Greed in check.
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I prefer having a physical copy as I know I'll have it for as long as the disc lives. Sure, that's probably really only 20, maybe 30 years tops, but I can always backup my installation as well.
My biggest problem is new games that are digital only is the sheer download sizes. BG3 was something like 120 gigs. It is a really beautiful games, so I understand but ouch. Of course, the whole game could of been compressed and released on a 128gb flash drive stick also. That cost more then a disc, so I could see why
Re: Release something physical, at least (Score:2)
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The problem is you've always owned a license to use a copy of the media. The same thing goes for music. You DO NOT OWN THE GAME OR MUSIC. You literally have a licese to use it. The whole reason you can make a backup of physical media legally is because you have the right to make a backup of licensed media you own. You can even sell the backup copy if the original media is destroyed. I was telling that to someone recently, where a jewel case for a CD and orignial liner had a CD-R copy of the disk they bough
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So... we should be fine with $80 or more for GTA6 (if anyone cares, I posted that price before this), and them flipping the switch on the server 6 months later.
Same thing applies... I _buy_ the game, my copy should work until the Master disc is unreadable. End of story.
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Who knows what kind of bullshit they will bake into the game, but if GTA V is any indication (who knows?) then you will still be able to play the single player game from e.g. a Steam backup* years from now.
* Never use Steam backups. They usually don't fucking work. Just back up the various directories.
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You're assuming everyone has internet that never fails... I'd rather have a BD set that doesn't fail.
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Y'know... games used to do that stuff... Riven was 5 CDs, and I could play it from when I bought it to the day they drop the bomb (the disc still works).
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So, yeah... (Score:2)
I'd like to direct you to this article: https://games.slashdot.org/sto... [slashdot.org]
There should be an option (maybe one-time, maybe not) to download a burnable copy of the game, and once they shut down the servers (whether it's the game or activation) they should be required to make available a patch to remove the online aspect.
If I bought GTA5, I should be able to play it locally for as long as the piece of paper the license key is on lasts, or until they release that patch (and, it should work offline).
Wait to catch up (Score:2)
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This is a good point. I bought Madden 25 and the disc is more or less just a DRM key. I had to connect to the Internet (I normally don't) to download Xbox updates and the Madden game itself. Once it's installed, you can disconnect from the Internet and it works so long as you have the disc inserted. I get that I'm an outlier in how I use my game system as I never connect to the Internet and have physical copies of all my games. You can get a lot of cheap Xbox one games and the graphics on game systems were
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The first game I encountered that effectively did this was Half-Life 2.
You could install Steam from the disc, but then Steam insisted on being updated.
You could install the game from the disc, but then it insisted on being updated. The update was, you guessed it, a full download.
So really the disc was just a waste of space and money, it might as well have just had a code.
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The point was even if the disc didn't contain the game itself, it allowed the console it was inserted into to connect to the server and download it without needing a key. If you got tired of the game, you could sell the disc, and someone else would just insert it and it would download again for them.
Putting a printed key in the package instead of a disc that will download the game completely kills your ability to sell the game as used, which is almost certainly the only reason they're doing it that way.
Re: Wait to catch up (Score:2)
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no disk means no resale (Score:2)
Game publishers have long hated after-market resale of games, because they can't get a cut of it. Now, they can sell boxes with a code inside that's only valid for one use, one user - and there's no possible way to resell it after you're done playing. It's affecting stores like Half Price Books, GameStop, and anyplace else that has made a market out of stuff people no longer want. Book publishers finally got over their greed after courts told them that they can't control the resale of a physical book tha
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AAA titles haven't had resale for a long time. Simply having the disc hasn't been enough to play a game for over a decade.
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Why should you be allowed to resell a game when you have already enjoyed the experience of playing the game? That is like selling your movie ticket after already watching the movie.
"But I was allowed to play it unlimited times"
The economic value of you playing through the game each time is less than the time prior to it. Selling it to a person who has never played it before is stealing.
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Why should you be allowed to resell a game when you have already enjoyed the experience of playing the game? That is like selling your movie ticket after already watching the movie.
No it's more like a ticket that allows you to return to the cinema as many times as you want to watch the same movie again. Once you get bored of watching the same movie multiple times, you sell the ticket to someone else.
Your analogy of seeing a movie with a one off ticket is closer to an arcade where you pay per play.
physical games (Score:2, Funny)
Physical games. Games that are played physically. In the real world. Not on a computer.
If you are expecting to play Grand Theft Auto VI as a physical game...
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If you are expecting to play Grand Theft Auto VI as a physical game...
You can play Grand Theft Auto Wherever at any time. Just go outside. Unfortunately, you can only play in so-called "roguelike" permadeath survival mode. (Funny, I don't look like an @...)
Suprised The Heck Outta Me (Score:2)
It's been a decade or more since I bought any sort of game. Games got too too expensive in price and my time.
Anyway, I'm surprised - shocked even - that they still sell discs at all. With all the talk about Steam and DLC I figured that disks had long died off.
In this day and age, no disk is not a problem in my mind. It's an expectation. But $80 for a game is horseshit. Way too expensive. That tied to the probability that it can only be played online and will become non-existent whenever they decide to disab
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GoG, ITCH.IO, Zoom and other allow you to download an offline installer. Steam is the LAST place I buy a game from.
Don't buy it... (Score:5, Insightful)
I know this may come as a shock, but the answer is simply to not buy it.
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On the other hand because videogames aren't essential items, one could simply spend their money in other videogames or even other things.
No time download (Score:2)
Are they going to release any version of this game?
So far every announcement we've heard is how it's not being released (at a certain time or form).
New? (Score:4, Insightful)
I mean GTA V was unplayable with just the disc. Many games in the last decade have not been playable without a MASSIVE download once you popped the disc in, and these days most "Gaming" PC's don't have a slot for a disc of any sort anyway.
Irrelevant (Score:2)
Physical hasn't been physical for a long time. There's virtually no major games released on disc that don't require you to download a massive update before you play on day 1 of release with all games having an online component locking you out if you don't apply that update.
For most games physical has been a complete waste of postage (or shelf space if you're old school and go buy things from shops).
Too many discs (Score:1)
Obsolescence (Score:2)
GOG (Score:3, Insightful)
I just wait for the GOG release of any game I may be interested in. If it doesn't ever show up at GOG, oh well, I simply don't need to play that game then.
Licensed Music (Score:2)
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Once upon a time there was no patching the music out; the game would just go out of print for years. That's why I had (and still have) a copy of Crisis Core for PSP on the shelf. Yeah, they finally fixed that, but there was a *long* period of time where they didn't.
Good (Score:2)
Physical media for games and software distribution is overrated and useless, as the physical media almost never contains 100% of the game or software anyway. And even if they can fit it on physical media, I don't want any optical discs. Optical discs are fucking trash (at software storage and distribution).
"A" physical disk? (Score:3)
Gee, do ya think? GTA 5 Enhanced takes up 96 GB on my PC. I don't imagine GTA 6 is going to be smaller, somehow.
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Yea, too bad we never invented the technology for distributing a single game spread across a set of multiple disks.
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What do you mean too bad. As someone who installed Windows 95 from a floppy disc I *NEVER* want to go through the process of installing something from multiple discs again. My internet connection is much faster than the fastest bluray player on the market (and when was the last time you saw a PC with a bluray player).
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There are many people in the world who simply can't get high speed connectivity or at least not for an affordable price. Many connections are also metered, so you have to add the cost of data on top of the cost of the game.
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Irrelevant. Media doesn't show up at a house magically the moment you want it. Even if your internet connection was 1/10th of what mine is (which would fail the definition of broadband) downloading and installing GTA is still faster than you deciding right now you want it, going getting dressed, getting in the car, driving off to some shop, buying the disc, driving home, and installing it from a painfully slow bluray player which your computer almost certainly doesn't have.
Only for you to finish and then ne
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Wait, you think a 96 GB download over a DSL line is faster than a 30 minute round-trip to BestBuy? Do the math again.
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... And you're completely ignoring the fact that most games distributed that way could also run the game while streaming most the data live from the disks themselves, so copying the whole thing to the harddrive first typically wasn't part of the time cost equation.
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> "The digital-only choice might also indicate that the game has a massive file size that's too big for PlayStation and Xbox game discs."
Gee, do ya think? GTA 5 Enhanced takes up 96 GB on my PC. I don't imagine GTA 6 is going to be smaller, somehow.
GTA V, out of the box on PC came on 6 (possibly 7, I can't remember and can't be arsed to check) DVDs and took ages to install. I only bought the physical disks because at the time I lived in Australia and it would have taken even longer to download.
Will it be discounted? (Score:2)
How many can actually play it? (Score:2)
That's why they are doing it (Score:2)
"But it's becoming increasingly clear that digital ownership has significant disadvantages, too. If a game you don't own digitally is removed from a storefront, whether that's for things like licensing, artificially limited availability, or even the store eventually closing down, your only option is to hope you can find a physical version. If your account on a platform is banned, even if that ban isn't warranted, you might be locked out of your digital library with no way to play those games unless you buy them again or hope your account gets restored. You can't sell or trade digital games you've purchased, and while there are ways to share digital games, they require some work and are usually intended just for families.
It's also much harder to preserve digital games because they only "exist" on the hard drive of a console, PC, or device they were downloaded to. This is an issue across many industries, not just console games; there are multiple examples of things like mobile games and streaming shows becoming lost for good when they don't have a physical version. Without physical versions, you also can't find a used version of a game at a garage sale or a local game shop."
These are literally some of the primary reasons game makers are moving TO Digital-only game distribution. They don't want this stuff.
online only? (Score:2)
Will gta vi even let you play it offline? What kind of drm will it have?