Russia Was Not Ready For the Data Center War It Started With Ukraine (arstechnica.com) 81
An anonymous reader quotes a report from Ars Technica: When Russia began attacking Ukrainian data centers and telecommunication infrastructure, it apparently failed to prepare for possible retaliation. Now Russia's digital services are facing widespread outages after Ukrainian drone strikes knocked out three of the largest data centers owned by Russian tech giant Yandex within several days. Pro-Kremlin bloggers are warning that Russia's centralized digital economy could collapse because the country is not prepared for the "data center war" it started, according to posts translated by the pseudonymous independent researcher ChrisO_wiki. The Russian commentators also suggested that Ukraine's decentralized digital services could prove more resilient than Russia's system if the countries continue trading such blows.
Russia initially launched a drone strike campaign targeting Ukrainian data centers and mobile phone networks in late September. The attacks temporarily disrupted Internet and cell phone service for up to 100,000 households in the Ukrainian capital of Kyiv and came as part of a broader long-range strike campaign that has involved Russian missiles and jet-powered drones hitting Ukraine's power grid infrastructure, transportation hubs, and even residential apartment building blocks. But Ukraine soon began striking back at data centers owned by the Russian company Yandex, also known as "Russia's Google," in what Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has described as a "symmetrical response."
[...] More importantly for Russian society, the damage to Yandex's data centers has reportedly caused interruptions or outages to popular Russian payment apps and digital banking services, email, e-commerce platforms, video streaming services, ride-hailing and food delivery apps, and navigation and map services. Yandex's search engine also accounts for about 70 percent of the market share in Russia. The disruptions are even more widespread, because the data center damage also impacts Yandex's cloud computing service, which counts some of Russia's largest companies as customers, according to The Moscow Times, an independent newspaper. These include large grocery and fast-food chains as well as a household appliance retailer.
Russia initially launched a drone strike campaign targeting Ukrainian data centers and mobile phone networks in late September. The attacks temporarily disrupted Internet and cell phone service for up to 100,000 households in the Ukrainian capital of Kyiv and came as part of a broader long-range strike campaign that has involved Russian missiles and jet-powered drones hitting Ukraine's power grid infrastructure, transportation hubs, and even residential apartment building blocks. But Ukraine soon began striking back at data centers owned by the Russian company Yandex, also known as "Russia's Google," in what Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has described as a "symmetrical response."
[...] More importantly for Russian society, the damage to Yandex's data centers has reportedly caused interruptions or outages to popular Russian payment apps and digital banking services, email, e-commerce platforms, video streaming services, ride-hailing and food delivery apps, and navigation and map services. Yandex's search engine also accounts for about 70 percent of the market share in Russia. The disruptions are even more widespread, because the data center damage also impacts Yandex's cloud computing service, which counts some of Russia's largest companies as customers, according to The Moscow Times, an independent newspaper. These include large grocery and fast-food chains as well as a household appliance retailer.
As they say... (Score:4, Insightful)
Or they could have just rented the damn port for a metric butt-ton of money.
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If they'd have opened nuclear power plants with the funds put towards the war, they'd have made more
...Chernobyls
Re:As they say... (Score:5, Interesting)
Chernobyl (actually in ukraine but whatever) was really the clusterfuck confluence of a very old design capable of a proper meltdown (modern designs literally can not) , incompetence, and a metric tonne of rotten luck. For modern designs the worst case scenario is Fukushima. An inconvenience not much worse than, say, blowing up an oil refinery, not an environmental omnicatastrophe.
Fukushima on the other hand, only led to MAYBE one death as a result of the accident, and a few handfuls of injuries. with 40 dead as a result of the evacuation, but keep in mind, it was a frigging earthquake, that did most of the damage, not the actual nuclear accident. If anything it showed in the very worst case scenario, destruction of the reactor, the design was safe. You'd have had more deaths if it was an oil refactory, because when THOSE things explode, there are significant deaths just because thats what happens when you blow up explosive fuels.
The real problem with modern nuclear is its just expensive and extremely complicated to get running compared with the cheaper energy from solar, wind, etc. But. the Environmental dangers? We solved that issue decades ago.
Re: As they say... (Score:1)
"The real problem with modern nuclear is its just expensive and extremely complicated to get running compared with the cheaper energy from solar, wind, etc. But. the Environmental dangers? We solved that issue decades ago."
Who is "we" here? Certainly not a failing country that will absolutely cut every corner.
Keep it up... (Score:5, Insightful)
With Russia's highly centralized systems maybe Ukraine has found a reasonable soft spot that they can hammer. They need to find these if they want to survive.
Welp (Score:2)
A thousand cuts (Score:2)
I also imagine there are a lot of well-rested folks, both Russian and not, who know of an opportunity to make it worse.
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I expect that Yandex is hiding behind statements in their contracts and Russian laws governing liability due to armed conflict to try to skate any responsibility to their customers.
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I'm talking about the many folks who have reason kicking them when they're down, right now.
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Good for the US as well... (Score:5, Insightful)
This is a good thing for the US since it seems that these data centers hosted bot farms spreading all kinds of lies in an attempt to influence the upcoming US elections.
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Oh and no matter which side of politics you support, anyone who wants elections in the US to be free, fair and democratic should be opposed to foreign governments and entities using social media bots to influence the outcome of those elections.
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....Unless we can be bought off with crypto fascist free speech corporate oligarchies. If Democracy and Communism both lose and make everyone pay, then the leadership is the problem. When our enemy is the best solution then winning is suicidal. Suicide is still homocide, it really doesn't matter who you murder as long as you win, even if it kills you. Like a marriage. Then you win after you suffer to death. But at least you win, and you were already born right. You just had to prove it to the losers, w
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Oh and no matter which side of politics you support, anyone who wants elections in the US to be free, fair and democratic should be opposed to foreign governments and entities using social media bots to influence the outcome of those elections.
Oh, hey! Didja hear about the Saudis and the Emirates and Qatar buying CBS and CNN? [arstechnica.com]
That's what Xi said... (Score:2)
Mostly I just wanted the excuse for the attempted Subjective joke, but...
Considering the secondary effects seemed to be the most interesting of the early comments, though it mostly made me wonder about Xi's take on the situation. On the one hand, Xi wants to keep the invasion option open just in case Taiwan tries to declare independence... On the second hand, kinetic military strikes on data centers is a bigger threat to countries with lots of data centers, which mostly means the US and China...
So back to t
Re: That's what Xi said... (Score:2)
The big spammers in Russia are government sponsored, and the government hates competition.
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And it's not just the US - There has been a measurable reduction in bot noise among many secessionist movements across the west, including Poland, Quebec, and Texas.
What pretext will puppet Trump invent now? (Score:2, Insightful)
Now Putin will call Trump and puppet Trump will demand stop attacks on data centers.
What will be the story?
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Given how quickly America came to disliking datacenters, seemingly as a real grassroots thing through hatred of techbros, hatred of higher energy prices to their own households, and hatred to water scarcity, seems like any complaint that Trump would make about it would simply lead to more backlash upon him.
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It's cute that you think he thinks that far ahead, or listens to anyone that does.
He doesn't give a shit - he knows he's a lame duck and there's nothing he can do about it. So he's going to try to get his beak wet at every chance he can, until kicked out to sea in early 2029 (hopefully before).
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You reap what you sow (Score:2)
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It's a war. Things get blown up.
As I understand it, the Russian military doesn't use civilian data centers. The Ukrainian military does. So Ukraine will just be hit harder in response.
Remember how Russia was defeated only a few weeks ago because Ukraine was blowing up the Russian version of Amazon? How'd that turn out?
Re:You reap what you sow (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't think anybody credible claimed, that attacks on Wildberries would destroy Russia, but these attacks did have a measurable effect on their economy. Hitting the economy with 1000 cuts was the main idea behind this and similar attacks, and it's ongoing.
Hitting the economy is a viable strategy, remember that imperial Germany had sizeable parts of France under occupation for 4 years, no part of Germany was occupied, but their economy eventually faltered in 1918.
it's all about sex (Score:1)
blowing up the Russian version of Amazon? How'd that turn out?
they already forgot about that. "datacenters" is the new "we are winning" rally of the month, so the billions keep flowing while people keep dying and ukraine is slowly reduced to rubble. this too will be silently forgotten in a few days, even before the retalliation, after which they'll cry bloody murder. on the bright side nafos ofc are enjoying their monthly little hardon.
then they blame trump for sucking up to putin by "forcing ukraine" to stop strikes on refinieries and allowing russia to sell an amoun
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Yes, we can see by your post, that Yandex appears to be at least somewhat operational.
Re: it's all about sex (Score:3)
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Maybe Russia is as good at picking its disinformation targets as the US is at picking its bomb targets... outdated.
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Yes, because Russia has been so dainty about not hitting civilian targets up until now.
Who the fuck are you trying to convince with this?
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Remember how Russia was defeated only a few weeks ago because Ukraine was blowing up the Russian version of Amazon? How'd that turn out?
I remember nothing of the sort. But I also don't pay attention to people saying things that are obvious horseshit.
Even if the actual Amazon was blown up, life wouldn't stop, and nobody but Amazon's insurers would be "defeated" - you are presenting a false premise or some other kind of bad-faith argument nonsense.
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Re:All war is total war (Score:5, Insightful)
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Russian intelligence had agents in Kiev who had assured them that they could stage a coup and take over the country. But the agents mostly turned out to be grifters and double-agents so that plan failed and a lot of high-level Russian intelligence folks got sacked.
They then progressed to forcing Ukraine to the negotiating table, which took a few weeks. Ukraine would have had no choice but to capitulate until Boris Johnson told them NATO would use them as mercenaries against Russia and provide them with weap
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Good job, Comrade. Your rubles will be deposited just as soon as Yandex gets back up again... as long as Ukraine doesn't keep blowing data centers into scrap.
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Well, I do believe that the odds are that Ukraine will be defeated, but then I also believed that the odds were that North Vietnam would be defeated. So I'm clearly no expert in this area.
Re: All war is total war (Score:2)
If Putin keeps sending drones into Poland then NATO is going to send troops all right... Into Russia.
It's true that NATO is there to contain Russia. If only Russia wasn't a continual aggressor, it wouldn't be necessary.
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Re: All war is total war (Score:2)
They tend to lose their footing while trying to bring in a nice breeze.
Re: All war is total war (Score:1)
They believed it because a lot of them remember when Russia and (Russophone) Ukraine were one and the same country; saw that Ukraine's government was just as crooked as theirs (but considerably more cash-strapped); and had a continuing suspicion that Ukrainian independence was as much a Western-imposed project as it was an actual grass-roots sentiment.
The cultural and linguistic blinders are real, man. I fucking spent the first seven years of my life in Kiev and the only Ukranian I ever remember hearing was
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Re: All war is total war (Score:1)
Ukraine was ruled from Russia for centuries before WW1. Russian civilization traces its history to Kiev a millennium ago. The roots are deep and intertwined. Enough so, for enough people, that the resentment can be ignored.
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That resentment has now been nurtured with immense amount of blood and will last as blistering hate for generations.
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When Russia started this they were not expecting a war. They were confident that the Ukrainians would welcome them.
That's certainly what Putin said, but it's not clear why you would believe it when they went into Ukraine with military vehicles, not with a brass band and a parade, unless... have you suffered some major head injury recently?
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"Diplomacy" (Score:1)
Watch out; a certain unnamed American leader will contact a Russian leader and say 'how about I throw some Amazon/Google/MS compute/storage your way and you send us diesel fuel?
It's the midterms (Score:3, Interesting)
Ukraine is taking them offline for the election, which is brilliant. Several close races will probably go blue now
Remember, Putin was in charge of information warfare at the KGB. And we all know he's sitting on unredacted Epstein files.
Hmm... this seems familiar (Score:3)
Russia Was Not Ready For the Data Center War It Started With Ukraine
So a country attacked another country w/o preparing for possible consequences? Where have I seen this before? /s
Re: Hmm... this seems familiar (Score:2)
The genocide of the midianites?
In Soviet Russia (Score:1)
Data wars YOU!
Everyone Loses (Score:2)
Same as it ever was. Soylent Green is people. Now in extra crispy
I was just saying the same thing today (Score:4, Interesting)
Pro-Kremlin bloggers are warning that Russia's centralized digital economy could collapse
While out working around the yard, this exact thought came to me. When you have a centralized economy, such as in Russia with Putin calling all the shots, any large scale interruption to any part of that centralization will have an outside effect. As this article relates, Yandex has its paws in everything. And what happens when Yandex goes down?
This entire invasion has been a fiasco on the Russian side from day one. I was truly astounded at how inept they were in the first month of their invasion, and that astounding has only increased over the past four years. A German officer wrote a book and toward the back of the book he outlined several things the Germans learned very quickly about Russian military doctrine. One of those items was that they would repeatedly throw men at the problem unitl either they succeeded or they exhausted their pool of men.
That was 80+ years ago and they still haven't changed. They learned nothing over the decades and this data center pummeling is another example of them not being able to think more than a day ahead.
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That was 80+ years ago and they still haven't changed. They learned nothing over the decades
Every time someone who knows something disagrees with Putin, they're defenestrated. This results in a lot of window-based loss of intelligence, and the rest learning not to offer any. This is not really a new mode of operation, it being cheaper to open a window than to pay for poison, but seems to have ticked up in recent decades.
Looking at the photos (Score:2)
Did they have any fire suppression in their datacenters? Or did the contractor take the money and just install some pipes?
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They would be lucky if they actually got the pipes. It's far more likely the contractor took the money, chipped off a little to the inspector, and did absolutely nothing at all.
FTFY (Score:2)
When Russia began attacking Ukrainian data centers and telecommunication infrastructure, it apparently failed to prepare for possible retaliation.
When Russia began attacking Ukraine... it apparently failed to prepare for possible retaliation.
FTFY. Based on how the Russians started whining when Ukraine had the nerve to shoot back.
Much deserved schadenfreude (Score:5, Insightful)
It is difficult to feel sorry about Russia's problems.
Delenda est Russia
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It is difficult to feel sorry about Russia's problems.
I am sorry the citizens have to live under Putin, does that count?
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I'm certainly sorry I have to live under Trump.
Re: Much deserved schadenfreude (Score:1)
Yes, that's exactly what I wanted to allude to. I have sympathy for them due to that. I feel bad I'm not doing more, but I also don't want to be trafficked or go before a firing squad
Nuland debates Mearsheimer (Score:2)
Trump - the gift that keeps on giving (to Putin) (Score:2)
Putin has to wake up smiling each day since November 2024. If Trump had lost the election, Russia probably would've lost this war by now... and Putin, his life.
Personally, I don't believe that Trump is an active Russian asset, controlled through blackmail or some other means. I think he's just an incredibly vain and stupid man who Putin can completely manipulate with ease. I mean, come on - how does a phone call that's supposed to be about pressing for information on that pneumonic plague death turn into "H
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Personally, I don't believe that Trump is an active Russian asset, controlled through blackmail or some other means.
So did you miss the part where after Deutsche bank dropped Trump, his kids told us they were doing all their banking with Russia? Trump was broke, all of his properties were fully leveraged, then Putin rode in on a white horse (and no shirt) and saved his bacon.
Two words too many (Score:2)
"Russia Was Not Ready For the Data Center War It Started With Ukraine"
Delete the non-bolded words in the sentence above for a more accurate description of Russia's current position. They're being absolutely embarrassed by Ukraine. The war Putin confidently said would last for a couple of weeks is closing in on 5 years with no clear end in sight. Suck on that Vlad!