Mozilla M9 Released 202
_m writes "The boyos at mozilla.org have dropped mozilla M9 and, from looking at the m10 nightly releases, it looks really promising. Go out and support your local developer. Still some small problems, but it looks like quite a lot of the important things have been sorted. Go alt tags! "
Re:Static link please (Score:1)
The good and the bad (Score:2)
BAD: Dammit, it's still basically brings my machine to a halt when I run this thing on Linux. Just running the mouse over the slashdot navigation to the left can bring my system up to 80% load. I know this is still alpha, but on the same machine in Windows 98 (with M8) this was not a problem. No one else seems to be complaining about this. Is it just me? I have a PII450 with 128 Meg of RAM...
GOOD: Lots of Javascript fixes, including a bug I submitted that was marked as a "won't fix - as designed".
REALLY COOL: It uses my Gnome widget themes! For some unknown reason, I feel all warm and fuzzy inside because of this
I have to say to all the Mozilla coders out there that as a user of your product(s) and a web developer please keep up the great work! If any of you ever come to Boise, ID I will personally buy you a round at a local pub!
David
error: method `~` of object `~` failed
Actual Microsoft Error Message
it was a contest numnut :) (Score:1)
Re:KFM! (Score:1)
Incidentally, this is off-topic, but why on earth does Qt in its Win95-lookalike mode replicate Windows' horrendous behaviour with dragging scrollbars (move the pointer more than 50-odd pixels away from the scrollbar while dragging it and it pops back to its previous position)? (Fortunately it doesn't do this in Motif mode.)
"I want to use software that doesn't suck." - ESR
"All software that isn't free sucks." - RMS
Re:KFM! (Score:2)
Don't bitch about it. (Score:1)
The last thing you should bitch about is upgrading to libc 2-1, come on people.. get with the times.. internet explorer requires 40-50 meg updates almost each time you upgrade.
The new netscape is a web and application framework. MUCH more powerfull and standard then internet explorer is and will be anytime in the near future.
SO far all you people complaing about segfaults, standardize your system, get with the times. do a lil homework, solve your problems.
Meanwhile, my code updates, my bugzilla notes and my fine running browser and working, and i'm developing websites around the technology based in mozilla..
It won't let me post without a subject. (Score:2)
You can fix the pointer (Score:2)
Re:Tis most excellent. (Score:1)
Re:grrrr... (Score:2)
The configure crap makes a LOT of assumptions right now, and doesn't actually know what library versions it actually needs, so its often times a real bitch to figure out what everyone at Mozilla seems to have upgraded on their systems that you haven't.
Updating imlib, gtk+ and gdk don't seem to have fixed the problem when I upgraded those yesterday (and promptly broke Gnome...), although the problem seems to come from imlib.
There are often wierd problems running with older system libraries, and things like that.
If you're going to delve into the dark and mysterious world of Mozilla building, here's a couple tips:
1) Run the most recent versions of everything. If that means upgrading to RedHat 6.0, you're probably going to have to do it. They're having similar issues supporting VC++ 5 and 6 under Windows, and the growing trend is build with the newest, and fix it later...
2) The client.mk script, and makefiles aren't very reliable. If you keep blowing core, and aren't seeing lots of other reports about it (and tinderbox is green), blow away the tree, and repull a new copy. Dependancies don't work all the time, nor does make clean, and that seems to be the only reliable way to fix it. Sucks over a modem, huh? I'm suspecting that may be the problem here...
3) Sort of restating #1, but if you're running a stock RedHat 5.2, upgrade your glibc unless you've got a pile of ram. There's some issue with loading libraries multiple times that chows down LOTS of RAM on a stock 5.2 system.
4) When gdb asks you if you want to load all the symbols, *SAY NO* if you don't have a quarter gig of RAM or something. Trust me on this one.
Re:KFM! (Score:1)
but I have never been able to get it to accept a
cookie-that blows email on the Web.Mozilla has great potential but alas lags sooo far behind the Winbloat/Netscape pair.Looks like I'll bite the bullet and shell out $35.00 for Opera...if that ever comes to pass.
Re:I think you're confusing shared with static (Score:1)
No, that's Microsoft. From the above posts, it seems "shared" libraries on MS platforms have a fixed base address, set at build time. So you can "share" all you want... until some two DLLs you need decide they want the same piece of virtual address space. Then all hell breaks loose.
At least this is my impression from reading the above. I don't touch MS stuff, so I wouldn't know, really.
Unconstructive criticism :P (Score:1)
Mozilla is certainly look good - however, it still doesn't want to use our http proxy server like wot I am compelled to use. The autoproxy option doesn't work (I dunno if we even have javascript yet), but worse, the manual proxy configuration simply isn't hooked up.
Which means I can see my own web page (gee!), but I can't give it a workout with real surfing.
Is this on the cards for m10?
Re:Instead of getting milestones... (Score:1)
current development releases. They are for
testing and reporting of bugs. If you don't
want to test and report (at least one) bug,
don't bother downloading the release. Just
wait until someone comes along on slashdot and
says, "OK folks, Mozilla 1.0 is available!"
On the other hand, if you want that day to
arrive sooner rather than later, you'll go
download the latest release and do your duty.
-WW
--
Why are there so many Unix-using Star Trek fans?
When was the last time Picard said, "Computer, bring
Re:I think you're confusing shared with static (Score:1)
So, then the windows DLLs *are* position independent, no? Which brings us back to the first question -- why are the linux binaries larger, and do symbol tables have *anything* to do with it?
Re:You can fix the pointer (Score:1)
Options/Configure File Manager...
Then pick the Color(!) tab where you'll find a "Change cursor over link" option.
RTFWebSite (Score:2)
Re:RTFWebSite (Score:1)
One improvement... (Score:1)
One improvement.. The size of the binaries for Linux have been reduced to a level much closer to the other platforms.
Why are the Linux binaries still larger than the others? Does anyone know?
Troll???? (Score:1)
And just as a sidenote, I knew this issue could be understood as a provocation, so I tried to write it so as NOT to sound as one. It seems that I failed.
DAMMIT! (Score:1)
Oh well, I have a few days of vacation so I guess I can spare the dl time.
---
Put Hemos through English 101!
"An armed society is a polite society" -- Robert Heinlein
Re:Try this (Score:1)
Instead of getting milestones... (Score:5)
Take a look at bugzilla (bugzilla.mozilla.org) and get an account there. Browse the bugs to see what the report looks like and see if you can submit an original bug, make a test case for an existing one or whatnot. We're all going to be using this browser in the end, so you may as well have some say in how it turns out.
Enjoy M9!
RedHat 6.0 (no 5.2) (Score:1)
They explain that Mozilla is unstable with glibc 2.0x due to a bug in these releases of glibc. (glibc 2.1 fixed a couple of bugs in some of my heavily threaded programs)
Re: (Score:1)
Re:68 Freakin 6 (Score:1)
Re:Instead of getting milestones... (Score:1)
I think Mozilla is great, but I don't use it. I've gotten every milestone since M5, and they've al been unusable. I am not a coder, and although I realize that my bug-reporting services are needed, I am not masochistic enough to use Mozilla. It has terrible page-load times, layout bugs that make it unusable, and the mail client doesn't work at all, and I'm not so altruistic that I'm willing to put up with all that, even though Netscape sucks so much. M9 is 15% done downloading, but I don't hold out much hope for its quality.
Re:Instead of getting milestones... (Score:1)
Its the crucible of stupidity. Maybe you should think about a few things first.
1) These are development releases. You don't seem to be able to handle them. Its okay to realize your own deficiencies.
2) Give constructive critisism, rather than general "its unusable...I don't hold out much hope for its quality". Layout problems and strange refreshes are a hassle. But its a development release. But without much specific to share, it sounds more like FUD.
There is probably a 3 and a 4, when i think of them I'll write later.
^~~^~^^~~^~^~^~^^~^^~^~^~~^^^~^^~~^~~~^~~
Re:Godzilla (Score:1)
Re:Static link please (Score:1)
Re:KFM! (Score:1)
There are a couple of things that bug me though. I *have* to drag-n-drop to save a link. I prefer the right-click-save-as myself. Having to continually move around windows to facilitate dnd has always drove me.
There are also those very rare times I need JavaScript. Even in Netscape I turn it off unless I need it. Great for avoiding those annoying popups certain sites force on you, specifically the free homepage sites.
Right-click-back is missing also. I hate having to go to that widget everytime I go back a page. Actually, I like having everything in Netscape's right-click menu, especially "open link in new window."
Pointer doesn't change over links. A small annoyance. I think I can live without that.
No SSL. I do a fair bit of online shopping. It was the reason I went out and got a VISA.
If it weren't for those things, I'd be using KFM right now.
I did try KDE 2 a little while back. Konqueror is *really* promising, although fairly unstable... Hmm, I think I'll try it again tonight.
Re:Gnome libs required: won't work on Red Hat 5.1 (Score:1)
Will Mozilla ever gain outside contributors? (Score:2)
Yes, I know that the source is available, but this is a huge object oriented project. Source code alone just doesn't cut it. Where are the models? Here, where I work there are information models, state transition diagrams, interface event documents, how can anybody be expected to dive into 19+ MB compressed of source code?
Am I mistaken, or is there virtually no information available that would allow someone outside of the project to figure it out without brute force reading all of the code?
Re:Godzilla (Score:1)
Re:KFM! (Score:1)
Be thankful for what you get :) (Score:1)
Try M9 (Score:1)
Beware IE.
...
Re:Instead of getting milestones... (Score:1)
if oss is to compete with commercial software, it cant have this paternalistic streak. you've got to figure out how to make it work for the lazy ones without alienating them, because *lowers voice* there's a lot of lazy ones.
Re:Is bug finding & reporting worth my while? (Score:1)
It seems that many testers would need some form of good feedback which would make them believe they weren't wasting their time. Like lists of feature that need testing and which have been tested and which have how many bug reports already filed on them, etc.
There's not a complete and all-inclusive list to use as a guide to testing, but you might want to check out the Bugathon [mozilla.org] page, which offers some good guidance on areas where Mozilla testing is needed.
Re:Now's the time to bitch (Score:1)
--
Re:Idiot slashdot moderators (Score:2)
So, where's the flamebait?
Moderators, a post doesn't become flamebait or a troll just because you don't agree with it. If it's on-topic and contains valid opinions and/or information, try to hold back on the downmoderating.
Re:Now's the time to bitch (Score:1)
Why bother with such uninformed BS? Have you ever even been *near* a copy of VC++? Our project is now at 4.6 Megabytes of source code... It only takes 5-10 minutes to rebuild from clean. We're very happy with the code it produces. Ever heard of "Minimal Rebuild"? "Incremental Linking"? Or are you too busy hacking your makefile by hand?
As for "$2k+", you are way off. VC++6.0 Standard Edition (I can't imagine you would need more than this to build Mozilla) is about $110. Even if you buy the "Professional" version (better optimizer?), you're looking at not much more than $500. No, it's not free, but that's an argument for another day
If Microsoft need to be bashed, then so be it. Unfortunately, mindless, uninformed rants such as yours will inevitably drown out the voices of reason.
Andrew
Re:68 Freakin 6 (Score:2)
I think it needs a buffer anyway. Maybe just for this session say. It can throw away anything that's in their when you quit. Say a hash table that you prune at 128 entries. This should take up about 10-20 KB max of memory. The code really would be trivial. I can imagine you could do it in 50-150 lines of code (assuming you already have a hash class). And it would really be a boon for a lot of different people, and I don't think it would hurt anyone. And if it does, just make it a configurable cache like the memory cache for netscrape.
Why the binaries are larger on Linux (Score:1)
That sucks of course, but at least it means the program usually runs, and that doesn't suck. Getting it to work with real shared libraries is a kind of a final development phase thing and I really hope that it works out, because who need yet another bloated monster stomping its great big lizard feet all over their memory?
--
Re:NO Gnome libs required: Clue here (Score:1)
ARGH! They didn't fix my bug! (Score:1)
Mozilla *still* doesn't understand multipart/x-mixed-replace as a MIME type. This has been around in Netscape since... Well, before 3.
And yes... I could try to find the problem and fix it, but enough other people have complained about this problem that I thought I'd be too late!
Mozilla? Quick/small/IEkiller? (Score:2)
I notice that with Mozilla, at least, it's halfway between. It has some of the features, and lots of bugs, with no real reason for me to download. I can use Lynx, I can use Netscape (the piece of sh*t that it is) and I can use the KFM or the Konqueror (which is MUCH more unstable, but it is SO SWEET it's not even funny); and when Opera comes out, I swear I'm gonna bite the bullet, pay the fee (and no source!!) and use a browser which works with all the neat features I need/want from the Net. Mozilla was promising, but I don't even really like the UI. Ah well, maybe I'm anti-GTK; I don't know. I guess that's probably it. Although, if it supports full GTK themes, I might take a look.... some of the themes are DAMN cool and it would be almost acceptable. I don't like the GTK as far as stability goes (which is our key hand against the Windows crowd; take it away and what have we got? Lots of useless source code for instable programs....) but it can sure look like one sexy bitch. Interesting times, eh?
Re:Mozilla? Quick/small/IEkiller? (Score:2)
IE5 is much much more stable than any version of netscape ever was ( specially Unix versions)
Try to be objective for once !!!
Re:One improvement... (Score:1)
Re:Gnome libs required: won't work on Red Hat 5.1 (Score:2)
Re:Mozilla? Quick/small/IEkiller? (Score:1)
Re:As long as we stick to standards (Score:1)
While I don't doubt or disrespect your html editing capabilities, I think that I could produce a graphically rich page (with image maps) faster with DreamWeaver + TextPad than you could with Vi(m)|(x)Emacs.
Of course, dw + textpad will never come out for Linux
PS. Some people want graphically rich pages, especially in our Intranet, therefore I will produce those pages for them. Text only and Image rich pages each have their place.
Mozilla is basically a complete rewrite now (Score:1)
If you don't like something, you really can fix it without having to wade through reams and reams of mediocre eighties code.
Er, there's not really any of that "mediocre eighties code" left...
Berlin-- http://www.berlin-consortium.org [berlin-consoritum.org]
Not a crash... (Score:1)
[apprunner] crashes silently at the end of its startup spiel.
No, just the first time you run it, you actually run the installation wizard, which exits when it is done. When you start apprunner the next time (and all subsequent times), it will start up the browser.
Berlin-- http://www.berlin-consortium.org [berlin-consoritum.org]
Dumb question (Score:1)
My morning so far:
And so it goes... . SNF .
Steve 'Nephtes' Freeland | Okay, so maybe I'm a tiny itty
Re:One improvement... (Score:1)
Yes, a crash... (Score:2)
M8 did the same thing to me... I think I skipped M7 for other reasons. M6 was the last one I had where apprunner worked.
That's the only serious bug I've run into with this version... I'm doing my browsing in the Mozilla viewer now, and it's working fine. And the form widgets work! (Can you tell I'm excited about that?
Re:Dynamically linked binaries considered harmful. (Score:1)
I work at a company that adamantly refuses to include any kind of versioning in the DLL's it releases for in-house development, and I have been linking everything statically for quite a while. I figure I've saved the company thousands of dollars just for not having to spend a lot of time diagnosing mismatched DLL's.
Pork Jet, a.k.a. M1[01] (Score:2)
Flamebait over here (Score:1)
Re:Godzilla (Score:1)
< martin>
Stop drawing dinosaur pictures and get back to working on your thesis.
</martin>
C;)
-Felix
Re:As long as we stick to standards (Score:1)
After checking that my hand 'coded' style sheet works under both IE and NS, I add it to my InterDev project. I then add a subclass - InterDev promptly screws up the style sheet (drops a trailing squiggly bracket) so that it doesn't work properly on Netscape. Of course, IE will still correctly parse the style sheet - apparently it is more 'forgiving'.
To add insult to injury, it actually displays correctly formed source within the IDE - but doesn't save it as such.
Let's not forget, having a standards compliant browser isn't going to be enough. Developers may want to support standards, but they might not have a choice as to whose. Market acceptance is what will win the day.
Idiot slashdot moderators (Score:1)
Not complaining, but... (Score:1)
Re:Unconstructive criticism :P (Score:1)
http://www.mozilla.org/projects/seamonkey/relea
I would have found out for myself. Ah well, roll on M11.
Re:I think you're confusing shared with static (Score:2)
No no no, Linux shared libraries use position independant code (PIC). This means it works wherever. Windows DLLs use position-dependant code. This means that if you get two DLLs that have the same base address (or overlap), one has to be automagically re-linked to use a different base address. The Linux way is less kludgy but the Windows way results in smaller libraries.
However, the major issue for Mozilla seems to be that the C++ code is producing excessively large symbol tables with gcc. I haven't been following this closely, so I may have the details wrong, but it seems a way has been found to get around this. I think this is only a disk space and download-time issue, and doesn't impact run-time memory consumption.
gcc doesn't produce very compact code at the best of times. Unfortunately, the gcc developers don't seem to consider this a priority.
Re:NSPL (Score:1)
menu screw ups (Score:1)
Re:68 Freakin 6 (Score:1)
Please don't bloat browsers by stupidly including an unnecessary DNS cache.
At work I have a fast name server - no need.
At home I have a slow connection to the ISP's nameserver - so I run my own caching nameserver there. This speeds up not only the browser, but everything else that need DNS as well. (Yes - plenty of other stuff use DNS) No need for an
in-browser DNS cache.
If they have to do it in order to support lame os'es for which no standalone nameserver software exist - at least make the DNS cache a separate product so it may be avoided completely.
Re:NSPL (Score:1)
Source that you have can never be taken back, even under the NPL, and you (and should!) contribute your own code under the MPL instead, of which the NPL is a superset. (The MPL is basically ``you must make your changes available'', at its core. It and the NPL both use ``file boundary'' to delineate license domains, so you could combine an MPL-licensed file with a BSD-licensed one without difficulty.) There are a good annotation and FAQ hanging off of http://www.mozilla.org/NPL/. Most of the source in the tree is NPL, but most new files are MPL these days. Hope that helped.
Dynamically linked binaries considered harmful... (Score:2)
Completely missed the question (Score:1)
Ben
Re:Idiot slashdot moderators (Score:1)
Personally on linux I use kfm, which is more like IE than anything else.
For something as important as the WWW, you would think that a descent/stable browser would be a high priority for linux. Give me CSS, DHTML and JS, and I am a happy camper.
Re:More IDIOTIC moderation! (Score:1)
I think that moderating down crude proselitism may be aceptable in some cases. But moderating down an on-topic post for stating a fact the moderator dislikes is a very serious issue.
Re:68 Freakin 6 (Score:1)
Event if you don't go all the way and make bind run as a real name server, you can still do caching only DNS. Plus, it's really cool to have resolv.conf have this line:
nameserver: 127.0.0.1
I think every linux dist I've seen has bind, and there's a really easy howto on setting it up for caching.
Re:Now's the time to bitch (Score:1)
I happen to use visual c++ and it certainly doesn't take 20 minutes to compile. The project I'm working on right now is a few thousand lines and takes about 10 seconds to compile. The compiled executable is about 260K and this is a debugable version that is using rtti, exceptions, and a few other c++ features. gcc 2.7.2.1 produces a debug executable twice that size for a few 100 lines of c+++ that only uses the iostream library.(I realize gcc 2.7.2.1 is pretty bad about c++)
Some of the IDE features such as giving the function prototype when you start typing in the function name and listing class or struct members are useful and handy. It's sort of like a tab completion for programming. But on the downside, it doesn't handle parathetical matching and indentation as well as emacs or xemacs does.
Re:Alpha Compiles??? (Score:1)
Re:Too little too late? (Score:1)
a) Because of the adherence to standards, many (most?) web designers will immediately start using it as their reference browser for laying out pages. Therefore, pages will look 'best when viewed with Mozilla', so naturally people will want to run it.
b) One of the things holding back the growth of Linux has been the lack of a good web browser. Communicator 4.6 is a valiant effort, but does not compare to IE5 under NT. Communicator crashes *way* too much, and is behind the times when it comes to modern standards support. It is barely useable for me, and that's only because I know how to 'ps aux | grep netscape', 'kill ' and 'rm -f ~/.netscape/.lock' Imagine the average office schmuck doing that.
Mozilla promises to be better in every way than IE5, which should propel the growth of both Linux and Mozilla.
c) Because it is open source, the rendering engine is bound to end up embedded in just about everything... network appliances, Linux GUIs, etc. In addition to being open source, it's also much more lightweight than IE, making it attractive for these environments.
Just my
Re:Will Mozilla ever gain outside contributors? (Score:2)
Yes - I was at one stage contributing actively to the Rhapsody/MacOS X Server port. I got out of that when Apple canned the x86 port of MacOS X Server - something that is still 100% boneheaded. My Rhapsody DR2 install no longer works, so basically Apple lost a developer FOREVER. Oh yeah, I was going through a bit of a down patch in my life, and I wasn't coding much. But I did have commit privs on the CVS tree for Mozilla/Rhapsody, so it is possible.
If you have an itch, scratch it - download the source, get cvs in order and sync with the latest source.
Even if you can't code, get the latest stuff, build it (it's not hard) and run it through its paces. If you're going to debug the lizard, you'll need mucho memory (on my 96 MB dual PPro, it just swapped...). But documenters, bug testers and more than just the occasional fix really help. High quality bug reports are worth their weight in gold.
Maybe think about profiling. If memory or CPU usage is bugging you, compile with the profiler options turned on and figure out where the problem is, and fix it (or suggest a fix) based upon your research.
Those who can... (Score:4)
Those not smart enough for that, test and submit bug reports.
Those not smart enough for that, wait patiently while others work out the bugs.
Those not smart enough for that, sit back on Slashdot and bitch about how the quality of pre-release software isn't good enough for them, make meaningless comments about momentum and market share, etc.
Those not smart enough for that are dead, since they couldn't figure out how to breathe.
Re:Will Mozilla ever gain outside contributors? (Score:1)
Re:Try this (Score:1)
Re:Instead of getting milestones... (Score:1)
Re:but that is the browser... (Score:1)
Communicator 5 wont be much different from Mozilla 5, except that it will include copyrighted code that can't be included in the source such as RSA.
You should be able to download both.
-andrew
Re:Those who can... (Score:1)
the ugly (Score:2)
Because the transition of M9 to M10 is a big one (finishing implementing all the features), there has been a whole slew of problems and "breakage" in the source tree.
Real nasty stuff, but hey, it's the home stretch.
Re:Mozilla? Quick/small/IEkiller? (Score:1)
Both that version and the 4.08 standalone I use on my Windows 98 box at home give me no trouble at all.
Re:I think you're confusing shared with static (Score:1)
Now's the time to bitch (Score:1)
Re:Mozilla? Quick/small/IEkiller? (Score:1)
You should have learned this by now:
You can't ignore OS updates and complain when your out of date components arn't supported in new software.
If you are running somthing that can use glibc 2.1, you should upgrade.
Re:One improvement... (Score:1)
Windows shared libraries are not position independent. This makes them (dramatically) smaller, but also forces an instance of the library for each application that uses it.
In other words, it's not a bug, it's a FEATURE! The libraries are bigger, but only so long as one and only one application is using it.
Of course, I may have totally mangled that. Anyone who's not a bear of very little brain care to comment?
Amphigory
--
Cease striving and know the I [jehovah] am God.
-- Psalm 45:6
grrrr... (Score:2)
what's up with only posting a linux bianary for RH6? that's really lame, now i have to wait and download 18 megs of source. Also, I would like some bzip2 zipps, my 28.8 modem works hard enough as it is, why don't we get the processor off rc5 and into some work for a change(I'm talking about my processor, as it's easier for the modem to download smaller bzips and have them take longer to uncompress)?
Re:Gnome libs required: won't work on Red Hat 5.1 (Score:1)
Upgrade -- Redhat 5.1 is what: 18 months old now?
TEST (Score:2)
--
NO Gnome libs required: Clue here (Score:2)
The reason old builds worked and this one doesn't was because AS IT SAYS IN PLAIN ENGLISH this build is intended for glibc2.1 You presumably don't have glibc 2.1, or if you do, your GTK+ and C++ libraries aren't built against it. To try M9, get glibc2.1 and those libraries built for the new libc.
If you don't have GTK+ 1.2 at all, I have no idea how you expected most new GUI stuff to run, seems like half of Freshmeat is GTK+ apps these days.
Re:Will Mozilla ever gain outside contributors? (Score:2)
Even in my own programming I find that when working on a new project, it's extremely difficult to model the code except with the code itself. Until the classes are written, the ideas exist only in my head and can't be easily translated to visual information. By the time the ideas are concrete enough to visualize, the classes are already written and there's not much reason to concretely document anything but the interfaces and the less obvious sections of code. I have a friend who says some people are "visual" learners and some are not; well, I suppose many coders think in a non-visual way. To them, the addition of a GUI to an IDE is only helpful if it means fewer keystrokes.
Once Mozilla 1.0 is out, though, I think we'll start seeing a lot more OO models. Then it will be easier for all of us to tack on our own little mods.
How to help (Score:2)
1. You should read the Getting Started document:
http://www.mozilla.org/get-involved.html
This will give you some ideas in how you can help.
2. The Gecko Bug a Thon is useful to help with:
http://www.mozilla.org/newlayout/bugathon.html
3. The status page keeps you up to date with current progress:
http://www.mozilla.org/status/
4. And of course stuff also appears on the homepage!
http://www.mozilla.org/
68 Freakin 6 (Score:5)
It's not like I'm running on an Amiga or a Casio E-100 or a Palm Pilot or a Sinclair QL or a Dreamcast or a yawn... I mean, this is a red-hot-one-year-ago (remember how things were a year ago... a month ago... last week... kids today) laptop. i586. MMX. Quake II. WindowMaker. vi. Capisce? 1024x768 pixels of uncut attitude. Every Milestone I have to break it to my baby: the Man from Mozilla says 'No'.
Laptop: Are you on crack? You're saying I have to put up with Netscape 4.07? That heinous piece of crap.
Me: Hey, watch your language, laptop. Don't make me hafta open a can of Lynx on your ass.
Laptop: Alright, alright. Couldn't you just download the source? Pretty please? Me: 20Mb on a 33.3k connection? Buddy, your F00F bug is showing.Laptop: But Navigator hates Java. The slightest applet brings it to its knees.
Me: I know.
Laptop: Why the hell don't browsers cache DNS lookups? There's some kind of DNS locking going on that causes it to whiteout. On DNS for chrissakes! You look at top and it's got like 96% of the memory.
Me: I know.
Laptop: Try reading Slashdot on that baby. Good luck. Back doesn't mean back on planet Netscape.
Me: I know.
Laptop: Don't get me started on Javascript. Or CSS. Bloat. Speed. Key Bindings.
Me: I'm sure it will come. One day...
Laptop: Yeah. That'd be a freakin Milestone.
Re:I think you're confusing shared with static (Score:2)
$ ls -l apprunner
-rwxrwxr-x 1 mattdm mattdm 58133 Aug 24 20:31 apprunner
$ strip apprunner
$ ls -l apprunner
-rwxrwxr-x 1 mattdm mattdm 25384 Aug 27 08:30 apprunner
$ ls -l viewer
-rwxrwxr-x 1 mattdm mattdm 190161 Aug 24 20:31 viewer
$ strip viewer
$ ls -l viewer
-rwxrwxr-x 1 mattdm mattdm 122068 Aug 27 08:30 viewer
--
Javascript (Score:2)