by Anonymous Coward
on Friday September 12 2008, @12:30AM (#24974375)
This allows for retransmissions from inside the network rather than having to retransmit data from the source, as is the case with TCP.
No, this is not a best-effort protocol. Retransmission is required as in TCP, except in this case intermediary nodes along the route can take responsibility for retransmission of packets, whereas in TCP the source of the packet must carry out this role.
Peter: Hello.
Malcom: (After 1 hour) Hello.
Peter: (After 1 hour) Take the Nitro away from Sun.
Malcom: (After 1 hour) What?
Peter: (After 1 hour) Take the Nitro out of Sunshine U idiot.
Malcom: NO CARRIER.
Dear Blessed, I am writing you from Europa deeep ocean cause I halve heard you have Jen Rus heart and a sound mined.
I am in ployed at the Banke of Europah as Estate Officer. Recently, highlee respected microbe, Sister d-R81, passed away with kno known daughter celles. Through good fortune and rewards for acts of kindeness, she gathered many microgrammes of sulfur during her blessed lyffe time. No Body has bean forward to claim her Estate for Six (6 )months she hs passed. Her Estate will be absorbed soon , with no Benefisheeary. She would have want it to be past to Sum Body to do good acts with and it will be wasteful to abzorb.
Since your govment do not know yet of our existent, there is no risk too you. You will keep Sixty ( 6 0)per centage of sulfur that works out to 35.4 microgramms. I will collect theremainder when I have rode to yur plant on your spacecraft Galileo. My jupiter friend on Jupiter sent me that they have found this craft deliverd right to them.
Do not bee concrnd word. I will be Benevolent dict-ator. Sulfuric economy be flourashing.
Send yor contact lens numbers and sulfur banque code with which to strat transacshin now.
Dear Emmannue^328*() 4532.4,
I am cery interested in your offer. But a few clarifications are needed.
First is it 6 Jovian months or 6 earth months.
Secondly, I have a group of investors willing to collectively invest. As proof of your intention could you send us 0.1 micrograms of the sulfur and a photo of yourself holding a piece of paper with the phrase "1 @m @n 1d10t".
Thankyou.
Blessed.
It's one of those things I genuinely think would be more interesting to watch than do, given the effort you'd need to expend to avoid flying all over the place, and all kinds of fluids spreading all over the room...
Are any of your penises too small for the girl or zerf of your dreams? Do you want that sense of fulfillment that only having all 9 penises firing on full gives you? Then 9-Alive is for you! You will no longer care if your gal or zerf has less than 4 breasts. You will feel the joy of the rings of Triga Seven or the scenic craters of Belka Miso as if you were there. You will be purple with pleasure like a youngling. 9-Alive will make you thrive like a supernova! Order now at IP 102.78.15.85.23.205.59.104.
Radio amateurs ran a wide area IP network over 1200 baud AX.25 half-duplex links in 1985, and wide area networks without IP before then. You could literally hear your packet being relayed from point to point. The IP software of the time (KA9Q NOS, and later on Linux) could handle the delays just fine. It wasn't the 30-minute delays of planetary communications, but certainly much slower than conventional IP networks, seconds per packet and tens of seconds for packets to be forwarded and acknowledged. Linux has had the features necessary to do this way back in the Waltje (Fred Van Kempen) networking software, before Alan Cox started working on it. Waltje was a Dutch CB packet enthusiast. Sometimes people turn that stuff on and don't realize they aren't the first ones.
Vint Cerf may have worked on the development, but the idea was covered by Vernor Vinge in 1992 ("A Fire Upon The Deep"). Yes, it was fiction, but Vinge drew on his knowledge as a computer scientist. He also betrayed himself as having more than a passing familiarity with the pitfalls and pratfalls of usenet message threads. "Hexapodia As The Key Insight" (Thanks, Jack.)
Excuse me if I am repeating obvious conclusions. My only gateway onto the 'Net is very expensive, and I don't get all messages.
I agree on the Usenet references... It was eerily accurate, and very enjoyable. Also, I liked his concept of aliens, which were actually alien, rather than most sci-fi.
V 1.0 IPV4, world coverage, good speeds, Information Superhighway V 2.0 IPV6, much faster, light speed is the limit V 3.0 SSWW aka Solar System Wide Web, why run in a superhighway if you can crawl in the space?
Considering we don't have any systems to send anyone to another planet and the planetary exploration systems we have are only limited robotic probes, what exactly is the point?
In terms of planetary travel it's actually one of the less difficult issues on the list to get communications systems working and figure out how to use systems with heavy delays. Nobody is going to be living on Mars until we have a way to get there and we're at least ten years away from a rocket that can even launch a sufficient payload.
I'd just put this on the back burner until some of the other issues are taken care of. Even the most advanced plans for sending humans to Mars still are conceptual and no prototypes exist even.
The Internet in near space (LEO or even the moon) does not have latency beyond what current protocols can deal with.
So those limited robotic probes can communicate of course. Not having to invent a whole new protocol and being able to re-use existing sattelites for retransmission is a big win for future missions.
Actually, Delay-tolerant Networking has applications that go beyond just space. One prime example is acoustic networks for oceanic monitoring - http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/iel5/4302188/4302189/04302341.pdf [ieee.org] has a nice paper about the application. Also, battlefield communications where there may be intermittent connectivity benefits from DTN.
Anyway, the reason for getting direct IP connectivity to space probes is to reduce the overhead: If you can just say wget http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/mars/opportunity/todayspic.jpg [nasa.gov] to access Oppy's camera instead of having to go through various hoops it makes everyones work easier. Combine this with dynamic and automatic routing (for example, for solar oppositions)..So yes, mostly the benefits are for scientists and engineers in space projects.
You're talking like working on a way of networking things excludes *also* working on a way to get people to Mars.
It seems unlikely to me that the people working on this are the same set of people designing propulsion systems, and ways of sustaining life on other planets.
Nothing new here. FidoNet [wikipedia.org] has been providing latency tolerant networking since the 1980s. Just ask our friends in Cuba, they're still using something similar, but thumb drives and USB key fobs means the packet size can be well over a Gigabyte. Put that in your pipe I mean 'series of tubes', and smoke it!
Just to clear up what seems to be a common confusion, DTN is *not* IP for space. It is a new networking stack that can work *over* IP, but fundamentally uses a store and forward architecture, and can uses other physical or transport layers. It will work with minibuses driving around rural africa, and it will allow "bundles" to be eventually delivered to probes that are in the shadow of a planet. See dtnrg.org
Make it worth our while. We want to read trollposts of epic proportions. We want to see that you've done your homework. We want to feel the cognitive dissonance of simultaneous +1 informative and -1 troll(though -1 flamebait is also acceptable).
We've read niggers, goatse, coprophilia, homosexual anal sex, and bestiality. The clock is ticking -- the more others post, the less likely that you will innovate before they do.
Can you hear me now? (Score:5, Funny)
Does VoIP work when there's no sound in space?
Cue packet-sending spacedwelling overlord jokes in 0101, 0011, 0001, ...
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
Your countdown must not like even numbers...
drop ed pac ets (Score:5, Funny)
The e ar stil few b gs in the sy tem.
Parent
Re:drop ed pac ets (Score:5, Informative)
This allows for retransmissions from inside the network rather than having to retransmit data from the source, as is the case with TCP.
No, this is not a best-effort protocol. Retransmission is required as in TCP, except in this case intermediary nodes along the route can take responsibility for retransmission of packets, whereas in TCP the source of the packet must carry out this role.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Naahhh, I think it's ok. It's just been slashdotted.
Re:Can you hear me now? (Score:5, Funny)
Yep. It works like this.
Peter: Hello.
Malcom: (After 1 hour) Hello.
Peter: (After 1 hour) Take the Nitro away from Sun.
Malcom: (After 1 hour) What?
Peter: (After 1 hour) Take the Nitro out of Sunshine U idiot.
Malcom: NO CARRIER.
Parent
It's the Internet, Jim (Score:5, Funny)
But not as we know it.
ET (Score:5, Funny)
Intergalactic Phising Expedition (Score:5, Funny)
Dear Blessed, I am writing you from Europa deeep ocean cause I halve heard you have Jen Rus heart and a sound mined.
I am in ployed at the Banke of Europah as Estate Officer. Recently, highlee respected microbe, Sister d-R81, passed away with kno known daughter celles. Through good fortune and rewards for acts of kindeness, she gathered many microgrammes of sulfur during her blessed lyffe time. No Body has bean forward to claim her Estate for Six (6 )months she hs passed. Her Estate will be absorbed soon , with no Benefisheeary. She would have want it to be past to Sum Body to do good acts with and it will be wasteful to abzorb.
Since your govment do not know yet of our existent, there is no risk too you. You will keep Sixty ( 6 0)per centage of sulfur that works out to 35.4 microgramms. I will collect theremainder when I have rode to yur plant on your spacecraft Galileo. My jupiter friend on Jupiter sent me that they have found this craft deliverd right to them.
Do not bee concrnd word. I will be Benevolent dict-ator. Sulfuric economy be flourashing.
Send yor contact lens numbers and sulfur banque code with which to strat transacshin now.
Sincerelty,
Royal Honnroble Emmannue^328*() 4532.4
Banke of Europa
Parent
Re:Intergalactic Phising Expedition (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
Oh, gawd. Now I'm scared. (Score:2)
"Contact lens code". Very nice.
ET's finger (Score:2, Funny)
can now get harassed to make savings on his long distance calls to his home planet
And also receive e-mails about pills that make his finger longer.
Lame..... (Score:2, Funny)
And you thought latency was bad on Earth... (Score:5, Funny)
Re: (Score:2)
Wait till you try to play World of Warcraft from MARS!
An hour and a half (round trip) grind before you get anywhere whatsoever? Won't that be an improvement?
Re:And you thought latency was bad on Earth... (Score:5, Funny)
It's just 20 minutes.. if you play a Hunter, none of your guildmates will notice the difference.
Parent
space pr0n (Score:5, Funny)
can't wait for the space pr0n sites to pop up
Re:space pr0n (Score:4, Interesting)
Oh, god... Could you imagine bodily fluids being shot around in space? It'd be like tubgirl but WORSE...
Although, zero-g fucking would be pretty awesome to watch :D
Parent
Re:space pr0n (Score:5, Funny)
"Although, zero-g fucking would be pretty awesome to watch :D"
Spoken like a true-blue /.'er!
Anyone else would have left off the 'to watch' part.
Congrat's! Enlarge and frame your /. Geek Certificate and show it off proudly!
P.S. Sadly, I too thought the same thing.
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
It would be a good way to earn "hard" currency :)
Re:space pr0n (Score:5, Funny)
You mean like THIS?
http://www.filecabi.net/video/et-sex.html [filecabi.net]
Rule #34, baby! Rule #34!
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
Yuk !!!!!
simple... (Score:2)
oh great (Score:2, Informative)
Are any of your penises too small for the girl or zerf of your dreams? Do you want that sense of fulfillment that only having all 9 penises firing on full gives you? Then 9-Alive is for you! You will no longer care if your gal or zerf has less than 4 breasts. You will feel the joy of the rings of Triga Seven or the scenic craters of Belka Miso as if you were there. You will be purple with pleasure like a youngling. 9-Alive will make you thrive like a supernova! Order now at IP 102.78.15.85.23.205.59.104.
Department of Redundancy Department (Score:2, Funny)
Interplanetary Internet Tested In Space.
Uhh, where else would they test it?
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
On a different planet?
'In Space?' Where are you, and how is your pr0n? (Score:3, Funny)
"You mean from a different planet, which I would count as "in space"."
It is a matter of perspective, Earthling. :)
Hams had it in 1985 (Score:5, Interesting)
Bruce
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
You could literally hear your packet being relayed from point to point.
I am not surprised! Morse keys make a racket!
Prior Interplanetary Art (Score:4, Interesting)
Vint Cerf may have worked on the development, but the idea was covered by Vernor Vinge in 1992 ("A Fire Upon The Deep"). Yes, it was fiction, but Vinge drew on his knowledge as a computer scientist. He also betrayed himself as having more than a passing familiarity with the pitfalls and pratfalls of usenet message threads. "Hexapodia As The Key Insight" (Thanks, Jack.)
Re: (Score:2)
I agree on the Usenet references... It was eerily accurate, and very enjoyable. Also, I liked his concept of aliens, which were actually alien, rather than most sci-fi.
Imagine the horror (Score:2)
vulcanary 108 years old/biological male but engineered female/YU5567. XH558, Vulcan
Re: (Score:2)
You'd be his age by the time you get a reply.
Evolution of internet (Score:2)
V 2.0 IPV6, much faster, light speed is the limit
V 3.0 SSWW aka Solar System Wide Web, why run in a superhighway if you can crawl in the space?
What's the point? (Score:3, Insightful)
In terms of planetary travel it's actually one of the less difficult issues on the list to get communications systems working and figure out how to use systems with heavy delays. Nobody is going to be living on Mars until we have a way to get there and we're at least ten years away from a rocket that can even launch a sufficient payload.
I'd just put this on the back burner until some of the other issues are taken care of. Even the most advanced plans for sending humans to Mars still are conceptual and no prototypes exist even.
The Internet in near space (LEO or even the moon) does not have latency beyond what current protocols can deal with.
Re:What's the point? (Score:5, Insightful)
So those limited robotic probes can communicate of course. Not having to invent a whole new protocol and being able to re-use existing sattelites for retransmission is a big win for future missions.
Parent
Re:What's the point? (Score:5, Interesting)
Actually, Delay-tolerant Networking has applications that go beyond just space. One prime example is acoustic networks for oceanic monitoring - http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/iel5/4302188/4302189/04302341.pdf [ieee.org] has a nice paper about the application. Also, battlefield communications where there may be intermittent connectivity benefits from DTN.
Anyway, the reason for getting direct IP connectivity to space probes is to reduce the overhead: If you can just say wget http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/mars/opportunity/todayspic.jpg [nasa.gov] to access Oppy's camera instead of having to go through various hoops it makes everyones work easier. Combine this with dynamic and automatic routing (for example, for solar oppositions)..So yes, mostly the benefits are for scientists and engineers in space projects.
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
Oh, sure, the practical uses. I hear 'Delay-Tolerant Networking', and I think 'carrier pidgeon' [faqs.org].
Re: (Score:2)
You're talking like working on a way of networking things excludes *also* working on a way to get people to Mars.
It seems unlikely to me that the people working on this are the same set of people designing propulsion systems, and ways of sustaining life on other planets.
Re: (Score:2)
Prior Art (Score:2)
Arthur C. Clarke envisaged this problem years ago for 2001.
Prior art, FidoNet (Score:2)
Nothing new here. FidoNet [wikipedia.org] has been providing latency tolerant networking since the 1980s. Just ask our friends in Cuba, they're still using something similar, but thumb drives and USB key fobs means the packet size can be well over a Gigabyte. Put that in your pipe I mean 'series of tubes', and smoke it!
DTN is not IP for space (Score:2, Interesting)
Just to clear up what seems to be a common confusion, DTN is *not* IP for space. It is a new networking stack that can work *over* IP, but fundamentally uses a store and forward architecture, and can uses other physical or transport layers. It will work with minibuses driving around rural africa, and it will allow "bundles" to be eventually delivered to probes that are in the shadow of a planet. See dtnrg.org
How about a webcam on the moon! (Score:2)
Then we place one one Mars...
Fun, and we get to test this "interplanetary internet" thing...
Doesn't seem all that hard to do...
Re:Nonsense! (Score:5, Funny)
More importantly, can we adapt the technology for these tubes to build a space elevator?
Parent
Re: (Score:2)
Willy Wonka has prior art.
No space elevator needed. Willy Wonka just needs to fart...
Re: (Score:2)
My user database is ready (Score:3, Funny)
To all the people who said I was crazy to have a planet table in my user database for Suso webhosting, *pfftt*
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Make it worth our while. We want to read trollposts of epic proportions. We want to see that you've done your homework. We want to feel the cognitive dissonance of simultaneous +1 informative and -1 troll(though -1 flamebait is also acceptable).
We've read niggers, goatse, coprophilia, homosexual anal sex, and bestiality. The clock is ticking -- the more others post, the less likely that you will innovate before they do.
It's a tough world, man. Getting the firs