Brian Stretch writes with a story about the Mini Utility Vehicle prototype from XP Vehicles, an electric car that is partly inflatable. The recent struggles of the auto industry and a political climate that supports the development of alternative energy vehicles have given the car a better chance at actually hitting the market. Quoting:
"Building a car takes many years and tens to hundreds of millions of dollars traditionally. XP is able to cut a lot of the costs and timeframe because its car has 70 percent less parts than a regular car, and the company is using novel materials that require simpler factory devices, and production and manufacturing processes that lower the cost to deploy. ... The seat is inflatable, the dashboard is inflatable, and the internal structure and carrying racks are inflatable, or a mesh suspension. Instead of requiring six-axis robots, XP uses radio frequency welders that look like giant waffle irons. The factory equipment is much less expensive and the car simply has less parts that could fail. The motors are built into the rear wheels in most XP prototypes. The first cars to reach the market will have two rear hub motors and a motor controller, that's it."
They can expand production facilities cheaply by buying up old whoopy-cushion factories and doing minimal re-tooling! They could even re-hire the old employees, as the same skill-sets would apply!
However, I don't think I'll be the first in line to buy a new "Whoopy-Mobile". It would simply be too embarrassing to deflate at a public parking facility.
From reading the article, it looks as if the company has put in a lot of thought and effort into making a product that not only is technically advanced but also have developed a marketing strategy and are tailoring their product for a segment- The point about removable chargeable batteries was something that had kept crossing my mind everytime i had seen an article on electric cars and I am glad someone has gotten around to implementing it (I am unsure if anyone else has..if so please feel free to correct me!) . They appear to be getting their basics right and in addition are trying to put in some real innovation (inflatable parts).I hope they get their funding problems sorted. I for one would be rooting for them!
I think that no one is going to trust an inflatable car. I do like the idea of removable batteries though. I've had it myself in the past- removable batteries sold at gas stations solves the refueling and infrastructure problems with minimal investment/retooling costs. Just drop off your old battery and pick up a new one. Charging doesn't even need to be done at the station, if the power requirements are too high- ship them to a recharger and back. But something like this needs to happen- if you can
"Pick up a new one"? Seriously, have you ever tried to pick up a car battery? I'm talking about the regular kind, not the kind with enough juice to propel an automobile for hours. I think I might have found a flaw in this plan of yours.
Yes, they aren't *that* heavy. Only 50 pounds or so. But that doesn't matter- you'd be bringing your car with you when you pick it up. So you make it so they slide in and out onto a special cart, and the only lifting you need to do is onto the cart. If you're too infirm to do so, the clerk can do it. That's an easily solvable problem.
If you have a "refueling station" where you can swap the battery for a full one, fine. But TFA explicitly talks about taking the battery to your apartment for charging. And since we're talking about a battery pack to drive a vehicle (not just start the internal combustion engine), the battery will be a LOT bigger and heavier than a traditional car battery. Even with modern battery technology (some Li-ion variant) I guess the battery will be at least a 100 kg (about 220 pounds) part.
Car batteries are made of lead, that's why they are so heavy.They should use their advanced inflatable technology and just replace the lead batteries with lightweight, inflatable batteries.
"I think that no one is going to trust an inflatable car."
Why not? As they say in the article, a good chunk of your car is now your airbag. If they're confident enough to send a door panel for the police to shoot at, and can design a car that passes crash tests *without* writing it off, it sounds like they're on to something.
survive crash tests and still be recoverable? how much you wanna bet some convenient misfortune befalls developers before they can gut the current auto industry. because that is what they are on track to do.
for not too much more money you could even get the "inflation" done with a rigid foam instead of just air for people too freaked out by a car being nothing but air and composite.
I think that no one is going to trust an inflatable car.
If they show footage of it surviving major impacts that would crush other vehicles, and surviving a full clip of AK47 ammo without bursting, maybe they might. (the bullets just go straight through, though, so you might not survive...)
... means nothing when the few parts you do have are prone to disaster.
never fear though - this is yet another imaginary product (they have nothing more than a computer rendering ffs), you need not fear that your car will deflate on you any time soon.
RTFA for such gem's as this "What we have discovered is that the insurance industry is not going to let electric cars run extension chords all over the place because you trip and fall" - genius, just pure genius.
... means nothing when the few parts you do have are prone to disaster.
never fear though - this is yet another imaginary product (they have nothing more than a computer rendering ffs), you need not fear that your car will deflate on you any time soon.
Rigid Inflatable Boats (RIBs) have been around for quite some time.
Self-sealing gloop (like mountain bike tyres) FTW.
Self-sealing MTB tires mostly don't work. They work against cactus spines and similar, but mostly nothing else. My local bike shop guy even runs normal tubes, and just scabs them every time they fail. (He doesn't sell normal tubes though... just the expensive ones. sleazy)
Possibly get bought buy a larger rival. Or, the way things are going... build up resources until a 'larger' competitor with access to markets is bought.
No tears for GM or Chrysler, please; I'm a stockholder and I want to see honest, prudent, and environmentally responsible returns.
The comments here have shown me one thing: it's all in the mind of the buyer.
Cars like this don't turn over on a roundabout, neither will they be blown away by the wind. But they won't sell, cause customers (at least in the US) seem to have a different mindset. Most of the commenters seem to want a heavy, typical American concept which consumes a lot, of course.
Now maybe it's a hoax, maybe not. But they'd better look at Euro, Asian and African markets for a concept like this. Over here, we've had a number of electric vehicles on the road since 20 yrs. or so. Most of them based on existing small cars. Most of these projects were fairly succes full given their niche market, because people don't mind driving a really small car.
Tata (India) will be present in the US market real soon. First with a small car with a classic engine, later on with an air powered car. They have the size, money and production facilities to make this work. Others are coming too. But will they be able to change US' customers mindset?
You know, this fallacy really needs to die. I saw a front end collision between a Smart car and an F450, yeah that super-big thing, all decked out with rims and everything. The F450 wound up on top of the smart car. And what about the Smart Car driver? He opened his door, and walked out. The F450 driver, hospital with major injury despite wering a seatbelt.
That was the day I realized that the "big cars are safe cars" idea was a complete fraud.
That was the day I realized that the "big cars are safe cars" idea was a complete fraud.
Big cars are not automatically safe, nor are small cars automatically unsafe. The Smart is an excellent example of a well-engineered small car. There are numerous counterexamples, however; furthermore, they are far more numerous. I have a big unsafe car (1992 F250 4x4 Diesel... although if I took a front-end from one of those in a Smart I'd be worried about ending up with an International-Navistar Diesel V8 in my mouth) and a big safe car (1982 MBZ 300SD) and prefer to have some mass and some extended crump
No, seriously, there's no bloody way I'm getting into a car with a control system running Windows. I don't want the dashboard telling me "A fatal exception has occurred...".
I wish them the best, but their project is doomed. The EV market is clearly going towards batteries, the comments in the article about the scarcity of lithium (11th most numerous element in the ocean) are laughable. In current battery costs, only a small percentage goes towards the lithium raw material purchase. At least EVs more or less piggyback off the current electric grid, which obviously couldn't handle transportation demands, but its a start. The problems with fuel cells are numerous. Where do yo
Speaking of innovative body construction and drive train technology, here [amazon.com] is car which is constructed almost entirely of injection molded parts, and whose biomass powered drive train qualifies it as a zero emissions vehicle.
On top of that, it has that elusive quality that makes a car a hit: style. Within the target market segment, its appeal is undeniable. Best of all, it's not a concept car. You can buy it today.
The pictures in the linked article are of a 2003 model MCC Smart [wikipedia.org]. It's been stretched out a bit, they didn't even bother to make the wheels fit into the wheelarches after stretching!
...That's a unit of energy (in case you didn't have time to RTFA). If they can't make a simple table without screwing up their units, can they really make a car?
is this really a need crying out to be filled? I thought a smart car was already plastic hung on a metal frame. Maybe for things like the seats materials science could come up with a durable and rigid foamed substance that was still light but wasn't actually inflatable? Same for the dashboard. Why not a rigid material?
Doesn't this sound like a hoax? The CEO is named Redmond. The Car is called the XP. "XP started out with an investment from Microsoft, which offered a majority of its software products and a very large number of its licenses to build some process management." Aren't these some sort of reference to eXtreme Programming and and Windows XP?
Are they going to come out with a Sport Utility model called the eXtreme? Will the next models be called the Vista and the Seven?
I doubt their ability to build the car, considering that they obviously don't understand the difference between power and energy. From the table in TFA:
-"Available power" given in kWh
-and three rows below a "hybrid power" for the Volt that is completely meaningless, considering that the Volt drives on electric motors and only uses the petrol engine for recharging.
Unless David Mantey, Editor, PD&D has cooked up this drivel on his own. In that case I apologize to the XP Vehicles Inc. crew and David Mante
From their website [myxpcar.com]. If you don't feel like reading the answer, it's "we haven't got one to show you".
Q. Where can I see one of your cars?
A. It takes many years and tens of millions of dollars to create a domestic automobile for the retail market. Our competitors, are, in many cases, showing "mock-ups" of cars they hope to raise funding for. When we have spent the time and the money on a real car, we will show that car to our customers. We may allow some documentation of our mock-ups but we will not represent those efforts as engineered, market ready vehicles.
That sounds suspiciously like some of the Agile programming stuff...
Well, it does make prominent use of Microsoft Sharepoint, so color me skeptical on this point too.
[the] XP [car -edited] is basing its collaborative space around the Microsoft Office Sharepoint Server and also partnering with Autodesk
Too bad. Otherwise, I like the concept & business-model. I guess I'll have to wait for the open-source linux model to be developed. But as someone else commented, there's a so many Microsoft buzzwords thrown around, this could just be a hoax. The CEO's name is Redmond, and they use SharePoint prominently, and they make cars too? I'd like to see a prospectus.
It may be legit, vaporware [wikipedia.org] so far but legit; if they get it into production, perhaps the DNF [wikipedia.org] should examine the operation!
hostel to the US (Score:2, Funny)
From TFA:
all of the Lithium is located in countries that are hostel [sic] towards the U.S. - which is a bit of a problem ...
... which I guess means that they only reserve substandard accommodation for their US visitors, whereas everyone else gets 5-star. Rough deal.
Just Re-Tool... (Score:2)
Brilliant!
They can expand production facilities cheaply by buying up old whoopy-cushion factories and doing minimal re-tooling! They could even re-hire the old employees, as the same skill-sets would apply!
However, I don't think I'll be the first in line to buy a new "Whoopy-Mobile". It would simply be too embarrassing to deflate at a public parking facility.
Strat
I wish them the best in their endeavour (Score:3, Informative)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
I think that no one is going to trust an inflatable car. I do like the idea of removable batteries though. I've had it myself in the past- removable batteries sold at gas stations solves the refueling and infrastructure problems with minimal investment/retooling costs. Just drop off your old battery and pick up a new one. Charging doesn't even need to be done at the station, if the power requirements are too high- ship them to a recharger and back. But something like this needs to happen- if you can
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Yes, they aren't *that* heavy. Only 50 pounds or so. But that doesn't matter- you'd be bringing your car with you when you pick it up. So you make it so they slide in and out onto a special cart, and the only lifting you need to do is onto the cart. If you're too infirm to do so, the clerk can do it. That's an easily solvable problem.
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If you have a "refueling station" where you can swap the battery for a full one, fine.
But TFA explicitly talks about taking the battery to your apartment for charging. And since we're talking about a battery pack to drive a vehicle (not just start the internal combustion engine), the battery will be a LOT bigger and heavier than a traditional car battery.
Even with modern battery technology (some Li-ion variant) I guess the battery will be at least a 100 kg (about 220 pounds) part.
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Car batteries are made of lead, that's why they are so heavy. These are not lead batteries.
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"have you ever tried to pick up a car battery?"
How scrawny are your arms that this is a problem for you, anyway?
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"I think that no one is going to trust an inflatable car."
Why not? As they say in the article, a good chunk of your car is now your airbag. If they're confident enough to send a door panel for the police to shoot at, and can design a car that passes crash tests *without* writing it off, it sounds like they're on to something.
This is one to watch closely I think.
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I think that no one is going to trust an inflatable car.
If they show footage of it surviving major impacts that would crush other vehicles, and surviving a full clip of AK47 ammo without bursting, maybe they might. (the bullets just go straight through, though, so you might not survive...)
In other news (Score:5, Funny)
Bolivia is suspected to have substantial stocks of WMDs; especially under Salar de Uyuni
less parts to fail.. (Score:4, Interesting)
never fear though - this is yet another imaginary product (they have nothing more than a computer rendering ffs), you need not fear that your car will deflate on you any time soon.
RTFA for such gem's as this "What we have discovered is that the insurance industry is not going to let electric cars run extension chords all over the place because you trip and fall" - genius, just pure genius.
Re: (Score:2)
... means nothing when the few parts you do have are prone to disaster.
never fear though - this is yet another imaginary product (they have nothing more than a computer rendering ffs), you need not fear that your car will deflate on you any time soon.
Rigid Inflatable Boats (RIBs) have been around for quite some time.
Self-sealing gloop (like mountain bike tyres) FTW.
Re: (Score:2)
Self-sealing MTB tires mostly don't work. They work against cactus spines and similar, but mostly nothing else. My local bike shop guy even runs normal tubes, and just scabs them every time they fail. (He doesn't sell normal tubes though... just the expensive ones. sleazy)
If you fill it with Helium, will it float . . . ? (Score:2)
. . . maybe this is breakthrough that we have been waiting for on the "Flying Car" front?
Utah is the investment scam capital of US (Score:5, Informative)
State of Utah has more than its fair share of investment scams:
Here is one of several articles I have seen on the topic:
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4188/is_20070107/ai_n17107556/ [findarticles.com]
And after story about the inflatable car, I got the impression that these people were looking to scam investors, and/or the federal govt.
Looks like a classic startup operation (Score:3, Insightful)
Develop a plan.
Execute it well.
Possibly get bought buy a larger rival. Or, the way things are going... build up resources until a 'larger' competitor with access to markets is bought.
No tears for GM or Chrysler, please; I'm a stockholder and I want to see honest, prudent, and environmentally responsible returns.
Release the Cruft.
God-speed!
I feel for the poor 6-axis robots (Score:3, Funny)
They are now too expensive as well, and their work will be outsourced to cheaper waffle irons that are presumably located somewhere in Belgium...
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They are now too expensive as well, and their work will be outsourced to cheaper waffle irons that are presumably located somewhere in Belgium...
And when the waffle irons get too expensive we'll return to Oriental [child] labour ?
new meaning to news items (Score:3, Funny)
Now really think about it... (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Now really think about it... (Score:4, Informative)
You know, this fallacy really needs to die. I saw a front end collision between a Smart car and an F450, yeah that super-big thing, all decked out with rims and everything. The F450 wound up on top of the smart car. And what about the Smart Car driver? He opened his door, and walked out. The F450 driver, hospital with major injury despite wering a seatbelt.
That was the day I realized that the "big cars are safe cars" idea was a complete fraud.
Parent
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Re: (Score:3, Informative)
That was the day I realized that the "big cars are safe cars" idea was a complete fraud.
Big cars are not automatically safe, nor are small cars automatically unsafe. The Smart is an excellent example of a well-engineered small car. There are numerous counterexamples, however; furthermore, they are far more numerous. I have a big unsafe car (1992 F250 4x4 Diesel... although if I took a front-end from one of those in a Smart I'd be worried about ending up with an International-Navistar Diesel V8 in my mouth) and a big safe car (1982 MBZ 300SD) and prefer to have some mass and some extended crump
That's 'fewer' parts, not 'less'... (Score:2, Funny)
So go ahead and call me a grammar Nazi. At least I'm not the illiterate clot.
Mod parent up. (Score:2)
Saved me from posting the same thing.
...that's it (Score:2)
The first cars to reach the market will have two rear hub motors and a motor controller, that's it.
You mean there is no batteries ? ;-)
Definitely a babe magnet (Score:4, Funny)
My inflatable date will just love it.
Does it run Linux? (Score:2)
No, seriously, there's no bloody way I'm getting into a car with a control system running Windows. I don't want the dashboard telling me "A fatal exception has occurred...".
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dude2: Oh my god! Are you OK!?
dude1: No, I meant.... Oh nevermind.
sorry, not going to change the world (Score:2)
The problems with fuel cells are numerous. Where do yo
Speaking of innovative body construction and drive (Score:3, Funny)
Speaking of innovative body construction and drive train technology, here [amazon.com] is car which is constructed almost entirely of injection molded parts, and whose biomass powered drive train qualifies it as a zero emissions vehicle.
On top of that, it has that elusive quality that makes a car a hit: style. Within the target market segment, its appeal is undeniable. Best of all, it's not a concept car. You can buy it today.
Badly Faked (Score:5, Insightful)
The pictures in the linked article are of a 2003 model MCC Smart [wikipedia.org]. It's been stretched out a bit, they didn't even bother to make the wheels fit into the wheelarches after stretching!
Power is not measured in kWh... (Score:2, Interesting)
OK. The dashboard _concept_ is "interesting" but (Score:2)
is this really a need crying out to be filled? I thought a smart car was already plastic hung on a metal frame. Maybe for things like the seats materials science could come up with a durable and rigid foamed substance that was still light but wasn't actually inflatable? Same for the dashboard. Why not a rigid material?
Parent is making a reference - This is a Hoax? (Score:5, Insightful)
Doesn't this sound like a hoax? The CEO is named Redmond. The Car is called the XP. "XP started out with an investment from Microsoft, which offered a majority of its software products and a very large number of its licenses to build some process management." Aren't these some sort of reference to eXtreme Programming and and Windows XP?
Are they going to come out with a Sport Utility model called the eXtreme? Will the next models be called the Vista and the Seven?
Parent
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If they do I'm certain the XP model is going to be around for a veeery looong time.
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Even if they are serious (Score:3, Interesting)
I doubt their ability to build the car, considering that they obviously don't understand the difference between power and energy. From the table in TFA:
-"Available power" given in kWh
-and three rows below a "hybrid power" for the Volt that is completely meaningless, considering that the Volt drives on electric motors and only uses the petrol engine for recharging.
Unless David Mantey, Editor, PD&D has cooked up this drivel on his own. In that case I apologize to the XP Vehicles Inc. crew and David Mante
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
From their website [myxpcar.com]. If you don't feel like reading the answer, it's "we haven't got one to show you".
Q. Where can I see one of your cars?
A. It takes many years and tens of millions of dollars to create a domestic automobile for the retail market. Our competitors, are, in many cases, showing "mock-ups" of cars they hope to raise funding for. When we have spent the time and the money on a real car, we will show that car to our customers. We may allow some documentation of our mock-ups but we will not represent those efforts as engineered, market ready vehicles.
That sounds suspiciously like some of the Agile programming stuff...
Re:Just don't buy the upgrade (Score:5, Interesting)
Or be in when it goes "blue screen"...
Well, it does make prominent use of Microsoft Sharepoint, so color me skeptical on this point too.
[the] XP [car -edited] is basing its collaborative space around the Microsoft Office Sharepoint Server and also partnering with Autodesk
Too bad. Otherwise, I like the concept & business-model. I guess I'll have to wait for the open-source linux model to be developed. But as someone else commented, there's a so many Microsoft buzzwords thrown around, this could just be a hoax. The CEO's name is Redmond, and they use SharePoint prominently, and they make cars too? I'd like to see a prospectus.
Parent
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It may be legit, vaporware [wikipedia.org] so far but legit; if they get it into production, perhaps the DNF [wikipedia.org] should examine the operation!
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It'll be fine after SP3, just in time for it to be replaced by a bloated, road-hogging monstrosity.
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Imagining a boon in inflatable cars is bad enough, but a boon in inflatable electric cars?!
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wish I had mod point, definitely funny and very subtle.