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Intel CEO: Nokia Should Have Gone With Android 246

Posted by Soulskill
from the completely-impartial-observations dept.
nk497 writes "Intel CEO Paul Otellini has said Nokia made a mistake choosing Windows Phone 7, and should have gone with Android — but admitted the money on offer may have been too much to ignore. 'I wouldn't have made the decision he made, I would probably have gone to Android if I were him,' he said. 'MeeGo would have been the best strategy but he concluded he couldn't afford it.' Otellini said some closed mobile platforms will 'certainly survive,' but said open systems will 'win' in the end." Reader c0lo notes a followup to yesterday's news that open source software was banned from Windows Marketplace. It seems even Microsoft's own MS-RL open source license runs afoul of the Application Provider Agreement (PDF). The article suggests that these rules should give Nokia pause about their new partnership.
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Intel CEO: Nokia Should Have Gone With Android

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  • really intel? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward

    Intel should not speak. They are the one's putting drm into their chips....Talk about being open. Ass hats!

    http://gigaom.com/video/intel-chip-drm/

    • Re:really intel? (Score:5, Informative)

      by Sir_Sri (199544) on Friday February 18, 2011 @11:27AM (#35244434)

      They also shouldn't risk biting a major player in the market. WP7 has a lot of big corporate backers, now obviously including Nokia. Whether they will be successful or not depends on a lot of factors, but Intel should be aiming to sell chips to nokia, whether it's for MeeGo, Droid, WP7 or some other OS, not criticising their management choices publicly.

      Like it or not, Nokia still sells a LOT of phones, meaning there's a lot of money to be made as a part supplier, and a good chance than the sheer mass of Nokia + WP7 will be able to sustain that ecosystem. I know a lot of people coming over from Europe (I live in canada) regularly laugh at how terrible a lot of our supposedly wonderful iPhones etc. are, when Nokia phones have had better call quality, voice dialling, very good integration with MS office (without extra fees), maps etc. long before Apple or Google started bringing that to market. They still have a lot of brand loyalty, and a strong brand if they call pull it together.

      • Re:really intel? (Score:5, Informative)

        by monoqlith (610041) on Friday February 18, 2011 @12:07PM (#35244878)

        Remember this? [arstechnica.com] Intel lost in this deal already. They are probably quite angry with Nokia for betraying the partnership they had with MeeGo. Intel has a right to criticize their former partner Nokia, and I think it's good that the Intel chief has the balls to do so for what, in the end, will probably turn out to be a terrible decision, one that harmed both Nokia and Intel all just to help Microsoft.

        • by Sir_Sri (199544)

          Oh I don't doubt that they're angry, probably justifiably so. I agree, it's probably a bad decision, (and is almost certainly a bad decision to the /. crowd) but if WP7 gets 20% of the market, RIM 10, and google/apple split the remainder that's still a lot of phones selling that could have an intel inside sticker on them. I'm not sure that much market fragmentation is good, but then I've grown up with MS 90%, apple 9%, Other 1%, so my expectations are probably biasing things badly.

          I think for nokia they'r

      • by gbjbaanb (229885)

        They had a lot of brand loyalty, and a strong brand if they call pull it together.

        there, fixed that for you. No-one has brand loyalty to a hardware manufacturer, no-one buys a Nokia just because its a Nokia. they buy it becuase they know it'll work the same as other nokias and their last phone was of at lteast reasonable quality.

        Now its WP7 on Nokias, people will think twice, evaluate other handsets, and probably go with a HTC/Android or iPhone.

    • by bhcompy (1877290)
      Actually I was thinking that Intel shouldn't speak because they wouldn't be alive, or at least in their current market position, without Microsoft
      • That's not quite true. Intel chips would simply be running a different OS, most likely IBM's PC-DOS or PC OS/2. Or maybe even a different third party like GEOS.

        As for DRM, all of these companies are reacting defensively to protect their business. It makes perfect sense to put-up walls around themselves & their hardware, rather than embrace an open format that turns Hardware into commodities. That's the mistake IBM made with the PC, and Apple almost made with their Mac clones.

        • by Dcnjoe60 (682885)

          That's not quite true. Intel chips would simply be running a different OS, most likely IBM's PC-DOS or PC OS/2. Or maybe even a different third party like GEOS.

          As for DRM, all of these companies are reacting defensively to protect their business. It makes perfect sense to put-up walls around themselves & their hardware, rather than embrace an open format that turns Hardware into commodities. That's the mistake IBM made with the PC, and Apple almost made with their Mac clones.

          Of course it was that mistake that IBM made (and Apple with the Apple II) that is why we all use what used to be called pc compatible computers today. It wasn't Intel that benefited from that mistake, it was Microsoft itself.

      • by asdf7890 (1518587)
        This is possibly why he is speaking out. There have been antitrust investigations (IIRC as part of the big set of investigations against MS some years ago) regarding Intel providing information to Microsoft that they did not provide to anyone else. Here Intel is publicly distancing itself from MS, but on an issue that does not affect them (how many x86 chips are going to be running in W7 phones?) without actually taking a shot directly (all he is saying is that he though Android might be a better match for
    • Yeah, no doubt. For Intel to lecture about "open" technology is the pot calling the kettle black. They way they aggressively hold the x86 platform to their chest, a lawsuit always waiting to drop on AMD or NVidia if either company does something they don't like.

      Open up the x86 platform to a few other chip makers, then we can talk about "open systems".

    • by arivanov (12034)

      The more it moves towards the CPU the easier it will be to use it for other stuff.

      A DRM chip in the video subsystem is useful only for media. A DRM integrated into a processor and chipset can be used for your own data, not just for the data of the media corps.

    • Were his comments wrong, or are you just going the "ad hominem" route?

  • by sosuke (789685) on Friday February 18, 2011 @11:02AM (#35244146) Homepage
    On the open source topic see another discussion here http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2226260 [ycombinator.com] and this quote by SimonPStevens

    They aren't prohibiting "Free Software", they are prohibiting software that is under a license that requires the distributor to pass certain rights along to the recipient. Hence GPL like licenses that require distribution of source code, and that you grant redistribution rights to everyone you distribute it to are being explicitly prohibited. (And in fairness I can see why those licenses would cause problems for Microsoft as distributors) On the other hand BSD like licenses that allow you to repackage and distribute without source and without passing rights forward are acceptable.

    • by arivanov (12034) on Friday February 18, 2011 @12:17PM (#35244980) Homepage

      No

      They are prohibiting neither. They are prohibiting GPLv3, not v2. The significant difference is that GPLv3 has the interesting patent "mutual assured destruction" clause which is in direct contradiction to a number Microsoft agreements with customers and policies. In fact they cannot legally redist v3 without changing the policy they take on IPR.

  • is banned from the Windows market. I'm also curious as to why he thinks open systems will win in the end. Apple's walled garden is doing pretty well and my "open" vibrant is hardly open at all. T-mobile and Samsung do their best to conspire keep it closed.

    Unfortunately, writeups like these play to the slashdot crowd but the issue is bigger than "ZOMG OPEN PHONE GOOD!!!" Why is my android phone so locked down that I can't do basic things with it like I could with a PC?

    The real issues is that all these compa

    • ...because GPLv3 would require Microsoft to disclose the signing certificate keys for DRM'ed apps. Apparently Microsoft isn't the only group capable of spreading FUD.
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by 0123456 (636235)

      From TFA:

      "Excluded Licenses include, but are not limited to the GPLv3 Licenses"

    • I suspect that intel(speaking as a hardware manufacturer, and to a hardware manufacturer, not as an end-user) is speaking of "open" in the sense of "the software is freely(or RAND-ly, Intel isn't averse to paying for things if it suits them) for use and modification by multiple vendors" rather than "open" as in "not Tivoized"(which is really only the user's problem)...
      • (There is also another layer to consider: When Intel's CEO comes out with a public statement, odds are that it is neither a candid exposure of his innermost feelings nor altruistic friendly advice. In the PC and server market(particularly in the past few years, as AMD's lead from the A64 vs. Netburst days has faded), there are a number of companies generating enough profit to stay in the business; but the fight over the real margins is basically between Intel and Microsoft. AMD has some aggressively priced
    • What does a carrier locking down certain features on phones they support have to do with Android? Android is open, the carrier modified version running on your phone may not be. But you can put another OS on your Android phone if you don't like the one it came with. If I don't like iOS on my iPhone, what other options do I have? If I don't like Win7 on my Windows phone, what other options do I have?
  • by Gopal.V (532678) on Friday February 18, 2011 @11:07AM (#35244224) Homepage Journal

    The guy's more comfortable with Microsoft, he's got shares in it, he talks to the people, he knows Microsoft. Now, Google is a totally different beast there - they're doing exactly the same thing, i.e just make an OS, but they're not really Mr Elop's circle.

    And oh, yeah ... it is also a very distinct conflict of interest when SEC stops him [yle.fi] from selling all his MS Stock and buying NOK instead. It's like the rules tilted this particular crusade to a windmill.

    I love my Nokia phones and I've never bought any other. For the brief period I worked for Ericsson, I was shocked to realize the depth of their patent portfolio, especially when it comes to UX stuff. I can guess those guns will be aimed at Apple first, while it's leaderless without Steve, but eventually the aim's going to turn around and point at Android.

    • by Sockatume (732728)

      It's safe to assume that everyone that's developing on Android is already a major Nokia patent licencee. They've got reciprocal agreements with almost everyone that mean they make money and avoid patent suits. Using a patent as a club's nowhere near as profitable as using it as a revenue stream and a white flag, assuming you're an actual product-developing business and not just an IP warehouse.

  • by mehrotra.akash (1539473) on Friday February 18, 2011 @11:13AM (#35244276)
    Even the stocks do..( fell by 20%+ on the announcement )
    • by Sockatume (732728) on Friday February 18, 2011 @11:19AM (#35244338)

      Nokia's stock would've fallen even if they'd announced they were partnering with Jesus to bring an open-source version of iOS with Android's user interface to the market. They've spent absurd amounts of money acquiring and developing Symbian and collaborating on MeeGo as their primary platforms for the next decade, so switching to any alternative is a tacit admission that they'd thrown that money down the drain. A new partnership also involves a big transitional period in which it's very difficult to make much money. Investors do not like that kind of news.

      • Giving consumers the choice of Symbian/WP7/Android for each device until Meego is completely developed could have been a possibility
  • Consumer choice (Score:4, Interesting)

    by sunderland56 (621843) on Friday February 18, 2011 @11:17AM (#35244318)
    Nokia should not "choose" an operating system. Make a phone, and make it available with any and all operating systems (Windows, Android, maybe even Symbian). Sell them all on the open market, and give the *consumer* the choice.
    • Teams of assassins have just been sent from various parts of the world to kill you. This type of thinking must be dealt with. Choices? Freedom? Cease and desist immediately!

    • by Sockatume (732728)

      That's an interesting idea, but Nokia was barely coping with putting out bug-free releases and providing customer and developer support on one smartphone OS. I shudder to imagine the state of the handsets they'd be shipping if they had to work on three.

      (There's the customer confusion argument, too. Nokia already does about 20 new handsets a year to ensure it's properly fertilising all the niches, make it 60 and it'd be chaotic.)

    • by PReDiToR (687141)
      It would seem that if any company were going to do this it would be HTC.

      They make so many models and have so many OSs on them that they could just smash out phone after phone after phone with no OS and have either the carriers buy them and somehow justify the cost by putting their own Android OS on it or have resellers (even a department of their own) put basic Win/Droid/iOS (ha ha, yeah, whatever)/WebOS/Symbian/MeeGo etc. systems on with or without that carrier branding that is so popular around the wor
      • by gmack (197796)

        There is a very simple reason the telcos hate it when we install our own stuff: They want to be the sole gatekeeper so they can tax us anytime we do something and they actually feel entitled to that money.

        Telcos used to bully phone makers to no end to the point where they would provide the means to disable features that saved the customer money. I still recall hacking my phone to enable basic features like the ability to transfer files over USB instead of having to spent $0.75 a shot emailing *my own* pict

    • by Sleepy (4551)

      Can you point to a reference hardware design which runs all OS, or which allows the consumer to pick?
      No... that does not exist yet.

      So for now at least, phones are tied to the OS or vice-versa.

      Someday it will never matter what platform you use, and all your data is stored in open formats, and your data can be opened in competitive software, etc. but that is a LONG way off. The phone companies in the USA spent -millions- of dollars a few years ago, trying to convince everyone why you could not keep your phon

  • Because iOS is soooo much better! Oh wait...
  • by blind biker (1066130) on Friday February 18, 2011 @11:28AM (#35244440) Journal

    Qt could have been the key to retain developers. Also, partnering with MS is a sure-fire way to get fucked in the butt. Finally, firing your in-house developers and outsourcing it to India is a sure-fire way to fuck yourself in the butt.

  • "The Application must not include software, documentation, or other materials that, in whole or in part..."

    Which also means that applications linking (part) to LGPL licenses are incompatible. So that community port of QT (LGPL) to Windows Phone 7 doesn't matter as applications written in QT will be banned from the store. Don't you love Microsoft and their tricks ?

    And this is also one of the many reasons we as an userbase or group of developers should mistrust Nokia in everything...
  • by NtwoO (517588) on Friday February 18, 2011 @11:40AM (#35244548) Homepage
    The press round the whole move of Nokia to M$ is very focussed on Nokia's choice. It could also be that Microsoft chose Nokia as an attempt to obtain share with a reputable hardware vendor to gain some share in a segment that they clearly see themselves losing this time round. Who is the bigger party here? Who needs this most? Sure, Nokia is also falling around on its feet and had an eight count a few times in the last decade, but from the way I see it, this is a deal driven squarely by Microsoft.
    • It takes two to tango...

      microsoft is the bad date.
      nokia accepted, and is going to the movies at 7.

    • I definitely think Microsoft is the driving partner here. All Microsoft really did was shop their OS to a major hardware partner, that's been their plan all along, and doing this deal with Nokia is exactly how they'd want it to be. They provide software and large, respected hardware partner integrates and produces. Nokia on the other hand has completely changed their game plan in order to accommodate. If you had asked people two weeks ago what Nokia road map for the next 3 years looked like, then aske

    • by Sleepy (4551) on Friday February 18, 2011 @01:15PM (#35245928) Homepage

      Agreed.

      I'm not a Nokia phone user, but I used to be an avid Nokia n800 user and developer. It was an -amazing- tablet OS... but then Nokia threw out the API *twice* (or was it THREE times when they switched Maemo from GTK to Qt?). Nokia pissed off all their developers and users, because they wanted to make it a phone OS. They didn't see that Google had already won the open source phone OS war, and Nokia could never catch up and beat Android in the OS space.

      Ironically, Google's been struggling to get Android running on tablets well. Tablets could and should have been a Nokia market...
      The n800 was awesome for it's time, 800x480 and awesome video.. it simply needed scaling up in screen size.
      Gmapper would download Google Maps while you drive, but this was on maemo YEARS ago.
      I would have paid double cost the n800 to get one with a 7" diagonal screen, but Nokia management threw it all away....

      Even after Nokia halted development of Maemo, some Nokia engineers continued to help the open source community. On their own time of course, since management didn't seem to understand the opportunity that they blew, or the hostility caused by their constant mission changes...

  • Nokia is a brand that relies on hardware and software to differentiate its products from other manufacturers on the market. When they go to WP7 there will be precious little to differentiate their phones from anyone else. The hardware will be the facilitator for the software which will be virtually the same from one handset to the next. So why exactly would anyone prefer to buy a Nokia phone running WP7 over one with HTC, LG, Samsung or Dell? Chances are they won't care at all because all the phones will be
    • People make a big deal about this, but I have yet to see any evidence that OEM modifications cause people to choose one android handset over another. People chose which android phone to get based on what carrier they are with, how well the device performs, what features it has (physical keyboard, camera quality), the price, and how good the manufacturer is at providing updates. I haven't heard a single person say "I'm going to get the CLIQ over the myTouch, because I like Motoblur."

      Furthermore, the agreemen

  • .. after years of experience with them.

    I owned an HTC Mogul, HTC Touch Pro, and HTC Touch Pro 2 up until last December. All three phones ran Windows Mobile (which I kept updated). What I came to learn was that windows mobile is the best way to waste the great hardware that the phones were equipped with. All three of those phones were top notch upon release and could have been mind blowingly close to their advertised usability. Instead, and all because of the OS, they were so clunky and crippled it was

  • It's repeated in the PCPro article linked to in the OP, that Nokia is migrating to Windows Phone 7. There is a great deal of evidence that this is at least partly misleading. Nokia's new CEO (and former Windows exec) Stephen Elop has been careful to never, not even once, in print or via interview, say they are going to move to Windows Phone "Seven".

    There is good evidence to suggest that whatever Windows mobile OS Nokia adopts, it will be different in significant ways than the WP7 available now. Nokia has co

  • Other visionary insights from Intel's CEO: the sky is blue, water is wet, and money actually can buy happiness.
  • With a nod to JFK:

    2000 days ago, when the mighty roaring penguin had just taken to flight, the weirdest words were "./configure && make && make install". ;-)
    Today, in the world of software freedom, the weirdest (win?)word is "Ick bin kein Trojaner."

  • I really hate what they did buying McAfee. I have still not heard even one good reason for that purchase.

    However, throwing a boatload of money at Nokia to use Meego would have been brilliant IMO. That could have been the lever to get Intel all the way hip deep into the smartphone market (even if it was only mindshare).

    Otellini has one hell of a leisurely pace when it comes to getting into the growing smartphone and tablet markets. I think Meego should have been a "must have" priority to the point w
  • ...for a tech corporation on the way out. Make everything look fine and dandy in the short term by filling your coffers in any way possible (in this case, Microsoft's doing the pumping). Make a big announcement about some new product and/or "partnership". When the product bombs, as it will (Microsoft's underwhelming OS, bad rep in this market, limited app store, and ideological idiocy in regard to F/OSS), Nokia's new CEO and all his buddies will jump ship. Nokia's share of the market will rapidly declin

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