Forgot your password?
typodupeerror
Networking Google

Unanimous: Provo Utah Council Approves Google Fiber 130

Posted by Unknown Lamer
from the where-did-the-fiber-go dept.
symbolset writes "In a unanimous vote the Provo Municipal Council has agreed to a plan to sell the city's troubled iProvo fiber Internet network to Google. Although this makes Provo, Utah the third city to embrace Google's ambitious gigabit fiber to the home plan the existing network will allow the residents of Provo to see faster installation than the others. Google had previously announced plans to proceed immediately on approval." They city handed the network over for $1, but there are hidden costs, from the article: "Provo taxpayers will still have to pay off a $39 million bond that the city originally issued to build the network. With interest, taxpayers still have to pay $3.3 million in bond payments per year for the next 12 years. ... The city will have to pay about $722,000 for equipment in order to continue using the gigabit service for government operations ... The city also has to pay about $500,000 to a civil engineering firm to determine exactly where the fiber optic cables are buried ... Google will lease the network to Provo city for free for 15 years."
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.

Unanimous: Provo Utah Council Approves Google Fiber

Comments Filter:
  • by fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) on Wednesday April 24, 2013 @12:35PM (#43537821) Journal

    Because it takes a special company to provide 'family size' bandwidth in Utah!

    • by MickyTheIdiot (1032226) on Wednesday April 24, 2013 @12:39PM (#43537877) Homepage Journal

      I don't get it. Aren't they too godly to watch porn in Utah?

      • Re:Google Fiber (Score:5, Interesting)

        by elsmob (751783) on Wednesday April 24, 2013 @12:41PM (#43537901)

        I don't get it. Aren't they too godly to watch porn in Utah?

        Funny you should point that out, UT has one of the higher consumption (viewed) of porn.

        • by Anonymous Coward

          Not funny at all, it just makes sense. Much of the Middle East has the same behavioural property. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/6592123.stm

          People like to have sex, oppressive social obligations or otherwise.

        • Re: (Score:2, Flamebait)

          That's because the more openly repressed you are, the more twisted your closeted desires become.
          • by snadrus (930168)

            And occasionally dangerous/deadly the frustrations between them become.
            I'd rather live in a society where all weird is celebrated. Repression's a pressure cooker.

            • Re:Google Fiber (Score:4, Informative)

              by i kan reed (749298) on Wednesday April 24, 2013 @01:55PM (#43538699) Homepage Journal

              Pressure cookers have gotten a bad rap from terrorists, but I'll be damned if you can't get delicious food out of them.

              • by cayenne8 (626475)

                Pressure cookers have gotten a bad rap from terrorists, but I'll be damned if you can't get delicious food out of them.

                Not to worry, I'm sure our esteemed congressional leaders are fervently working to construct legislation to create laws for background checks and national registries for pressure cookers.

                And rest assured, we'll soon make sure there are "reasonable" limitations placed on capacity of pressure cookers too!!

                I mean, who realistically needs *MORE* than 4 quarts for a pressure cooker? These h

            • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

              by larry bagina (561269)

              Case in point: one of the Boston marathon bombers was upset because his wife wouldn't fist his asshole. The other was upset he couldn't get a girl to shit on his face.

              • That's OK because now he'll be getting enough BBC, Big Black Cock, to make up for the lack of fisting and some ATM, Ass To Mouth to make up for the face shitting too.

        • Probably should cite your source or we'll assume your "facts" are BS.
        • by McGruber (1417641)

          Funny you should point that out, UT has one of the higher consumption (viewed) of porn.

          Searching for "mormon porn" led me to this page that says forward thinking Mormons are getting around divine providence by using a technique called "bubbling", in which any clothed female can be made to look naked: http://slightlywarped.com/crapfactory/curiosities/2010/mormon_porn.htm [slightlywarped.com]

      • by slazzy (864185)
        I used to work at a hosting company and maintain servers for a large adult company, including building reports about their customers... If you think they watch a lot of porn in Utah, you should see how many customers come from the Vatican...
  • Living in the metro SLC area, it makes more sense to have Google Fiber at the University of Utah. And, there is no way in hell I would move to Provo. Hopefully the fiber will spread.
    • by phantomfive (622387) on Wednesday April 24, 2013 @12:45PM (#43537979) Journal
      Because Provo already built out large portions of a fiber optic network. That's where the $39million bond comes from. However, they were having trouble administering it, and were losing a lot more money every year. What they are basically saying is, "here, take over this project for us and you can have all the profits." The city wants fast internet, and Google wants to make money providing it. Wikipedia has more info.

      If you want SLC to have fiber, talk to the city council. Maybe they'll take up a bond and build it, too.
      • by ackthpt (218170)

        Because Provo already built out large portions of a fiber optic network. That's where the $39million bond comes from. However, they were having trouble administering it, and were losing a lot more money every year. What they are basically saying is, "here, take over this project for us and you can have all the profits." The city wants fast internet, and Google wants to make money providing it. Wikipedia has more info.

        If you want SLC to have fiber, talk to the city council. Maybe they'll take up a bond and build it, too.

        Though at the end of 15 years, or long before that, the network will appear to be too slow and overburdened, because of web bloat, streaming media, tracking, MMO games and spying on everyone with cameras and the natural progression of technology.

    • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

      by ColdWetDog (752185)

      Google: All your bits are belong to us!

      • by TheSync (5291)

        AYB is never going to get old!!!!

        I bet 10 years from now if you say "Harlem Shake" people are going to think you are talking about a street dance rather than an Internet meme.

        • I agree, and I always wondered why that is, why AYB is still so memorable. I'm assuming because AYB was created in the days when memes were rare entities and thus is perhaps a prototype.
          Now, well, yeah. I can't even keep track of knowyourmeme.com anymore.
  • incompetence (Score:5, Interesting)

    by dmbasso (1052166) on Wednesday April 24, 2013 @12:39PM (#43537883)

    The city also has to pay about $500,000 to a civil engineering firm to determine exactly where the fiber optic cables are buried...

    Wtf, don't they have the installation project plans in the first place? This is the kind of incompetence that really pisses me off.

    • Yeah, the construction company that laid the lines didn't keep plans. /facepalm
    • by Anonymous Coward

      Plans aren't always what I would call EXACT. They are what they say just plans.
      Plus it's a lot easier to tell your crew dig the blue line not the red line.
      It sounds like a lot but if they followed the plans they would still have several boo boo's that would probably have a damage valuation of 500k.

      • plus even if you have plans accurate to the inch you have to deal with the ground shifting about. you put the cable down this line 3 years ago?? the whole line has shifted THAT WAY by 3 feet.

        Remember kids the Call Before You Dig Hotline is 811 (or consult your local yellow pages for "utility locating services")

        • by jfengel (409917)

          Do they do anything more than just paint where the lines are supposed to be? Do they do anything to try to locate the actual lines? (Which, in the case of fiber or those crappy plastic plumbing lines the local water company installed, I presume would involve actually digging for it.)

          • by Java Pimp (98454) <java_pimp@NOspam.yahoo.com> on Wednesday April 24, 2013 @01:45PM (#43538583) Homepage
            They have some pretty neat equipment for finding the utility lines. Just the other week I saw the water company come through marking the water lines. One guy with a spray can followed the other who was holding this stick with a fork in it. The pointy end always pointing at the ground.
            • Decades ago I worked during the summer for the water department. One of our jobs was to find and mark water lines. We actually did use divining rods. No stick with a fork, though. Ours were two pieces of wire, each bent to form an 'L'. You loosely hold the shorter side, keeping the longer sides parallel to the ground and initially to each other. As you pass over the water main the wires cross. It worked quite reliably as long as the water main wasn't too deep. I always assumed it had something to do with ma

              • by Pope (17780)

                All dowsing/divining rods are bullshit. Ideomotor effect + confirmation bias.

              • by c++0xFF (1758032)

                Decades ago I worked during the summer for the water department. One of our jobs was to find and mark water lines. We actually did use divining rods. No stick with a fork, though. Ours were two pieces of wire, each bent to form an 'L'. You loosely hold the shorter side, keeping the longer sides parallel to the ground and initially to each other. As you pass over the water main the wires cross. It worked quite reliably as long as the water main wasn't too deep. I always assumed it had something to do with magnetism.

                I know someone [randi.org] who would pay quite handsomely for your services. As long as you can do this reliably, that is.

                • Perhaps it was all bunk, but I think one does need to keep in mind we were not looking for underground water. We were looking for iron pipes that just happened to be carrying water. If this is the only concentration of iron in the area it's pretty clearly going to have an impact on the magnetic field in the immediate vicinity. If metal deposits can have an impact on magnetic compasses, it doesn't seem too far fetched for them to have some effect on steel rods that may have a slight magnetic or static charge

        • by foobsr (693224)
          Here, in Germany, you have a system of signs that indicates were the piping is.

          CC.

    • Because hiring civil engineers is more expensive than outsourcing to a firm. And with outside firm, you'll effectively verify what your internal IT people know all along. Nobody believes internal IT people for some reason, but outside consultants telling the same exact story as internal sources makes it more believable.

      Yeah, we're dealing with that now. It isn't incompetence, it is people in decision making positions, knowing nothing about IT. Ignorance is not incompetence, though they often look and result

      • Re:incompetence (Score:4, Interesting)

        by captbob2002 (411323) on Wednesday April 24, 2013 @01:03PM (#43538191)

        My old boss always said "you cannot be a prophet in your own land."

        I am reminded about the time the two of us were pushing for this new thing called the "World Wide Web" or some such. Administration in the college said that it was nice, but gopher does all we'll ever need.

      • Nobody believes internal IT people for some reason, but outside consultants telling the same exact story as internal sources makes it more believable.

        It's called an audit. You bring in outsiders to verify what the insiders are telling you is the truth. If I'm a third party making an investment, I'm not going to rely on the good word of the people I'm buying from when millions of dollars are at stake.

        • It cannot be an audit if it hasn't happened yet. This is in planning (before implementation) stage. Last time we had an outsider come in, his recommendations were more expensive than internal IT's because a couple of their assumptions were flat out wrong. And the cost of the consultant (his fee) would have paid for about 1/2 of the difference between IT's recommendation, and the consultant's. How is that efficient?

          Oh, BTW, they are about to have another consultant come in and make the same recommendations

    • by kamapuaa (555446)

      This is pretty common, actually. Accurately mapping the position of every bit of line or piping isn't practical in the real world.

    • by sjbe (173966) on Wednesday April 24, 2013 @02:25PM (#43538953)

      Wtf, don't they have the installation project plans in the first place? This is the kind of incompetence that really pisses me off.

      Project plans frequently do not accurately document where the cable was actually placed. My father worked in engineering for AT&T for several decades planning jobs like this. He always had to go check what the plans said against what was drawn on the engineering documents. What the guys in the field do often does not match what the engineer designed. Furthermore since Google is essentially buying this cable they need to audit what they are actually buying. When you are investing millions of dollars you don't take anyone's word for it, you have someone go out and check to see that the actual infrastructure is something close to what the plans say it should be.

      This is exactly the opposite of incompetence. This is exactly how a rational buyer should behave when buying an expensive asset.

    • Re:incompetence (Score:5, Informative)

      by rahvin112 (446269) on Wednesday April 24, 2013 @04:45PM (#43540283)

      The only incompetence is your understanding. Out here in the real world things change in the field. That's because when the plans say install the line 1' off the sidewalk but as they start installing it they find the gas line is in that exact location they do some quick test holes and make a field change to move the wire to different spot.

      This is why in civil engineering you have plans, and you have a second set of plans called As-Builts, because how it was built often has serious variations form where it actually was shown to be built. I've seen utilities on the opposite side of the street, Buried 10' deep when they are supposed to be 18 inches, I've seen them follow a relatively straight line then jog 20' off for 10' then jog right back.

      See in the real world when you go to bury something you don't always know what you are going to run into. There is all kinds of stuff out there that's buried that no one knows is there and sometimes people don't even know what it is. I've stood in front of excavations staring at pipes that no one has any idea what it is, it's not on plans, city maps or even acknowledged by the dig locating service. I've also seen them run into buried rail lines, coffins and all sorts of things that would make your head spin. I've seen lines that were installed exactly as shown, but the road and homes that delineated it's location are gone because they were torn down and a shopping mall was built in their place. Real world buried utilities is very very hard and your an idiot for thinking it's easy.

      Oh and $500k is CHEAP for a subsurface utility investigation on a city the size of provo.

      • by dmbasso (1052166)

        The only incompetence is your understanding.

        Thank you for the ad hominen.

        [...] and you have a second set of plans called As-Builts

        Exactly, and it is incompetence to not keep them.

      • by Snufu (1049644)

        "Oh and $500k is CHEAP for a subsurface utility investigation on a city the size of provo."

        Yes, but is it dirt cheap?

  • Really, Provost Utah voted to accept Google fiber.

    Was there ever any doubt that they would?

    • by hedwards (940851)

      I doubt there was, especially given that Google doesn't just choose cities at random, the cities have to put in a proposal of some sort. I'm sure technically they could have said no, but if it was unanimous, you can be pretty sure that the odds were indistinguishable from 100% that it would be accepted.

      I do hope that they eventually get to Seattle as we have a crapload of fiber just sitting around and the incumbents don't seem to be particularly interesting in giving us fast speeds at any price.

      • by symbolset (646467) *
        Can you imagine trying to run a "reelect me because I voted to turn away Google Fiber" campaign? That would be epic.
  • by therealobsideus (1610557) on Wednesday April 24, 2013 @12:46PM (#43538011)
    Not a bad deal, at least as far as Google goes. Considering what Google charges for the 7/yr 5mb service (which is just a $300 buildout fee), the city basically just covered the cost for that. Free gigabit service to 25 public institutions (schools, universities etc).. not bad. And Google is going to finish building out to homes that were not part of the original build contract. All in all, not bad. Especially if you look at iProvo's history - the city has been stuck with the bond payments the entire time, this just actually gets them something for holding that debt.
  • The city council must have breathed a HUGE sigh of relief.
  • Don't expect us.

  • the hinterlands of kansas or bumbefuck missouri. for a while there it seemed like every new network technology from fios to dark fiber ended up in some rural midwestern or southern shithole hellbent on forwarding an e, i, or cyber industry and more than willing to hemmorage taxpayer money in the face of a familiar brand.
    • by RevDisk (740008)
      What's wrong with said "hinterlands"? It's cheap to do things, and usually get them done a lot quicker. Plenty of the more intelligent businesses are moving everything that can be moved to the middle of nowhere, as long as the infrastructure is good enough to handle it. Just keep a very fashionable 50 ish person office for PR and executives in NYC, DC, etc.

      Some of us geeks prefer being in the boonies.
  • $40 million to have Google Fiber free for 15 years. Yeah great deal *eye roll*
  • The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center [wired.com] (Watch What You Say) nearby in Bluffdale Utah. There is no coincidence.........
  • The existing Provo network is buried. You can bet that when Google finishes the job, they'll be doing it by hanging fiber, not burying it, as they are for their other installations. Provo will likely be the only hybrid Google Fiber installation for some little while. It will be interesting to see what the differences are in service availability between buried and hung in the same city.

"Don't discount flying pigs before you have good air defense." -- jvh@clinet.FI

Working...