Company That Made the First 3D Printed Metal Gun Is Selling Them For $11,900 182
Lucas123 writes "Solid Concepts, which last month revealed the first fully-functional, metal 3D gun, announced today that they're putting 100 limited-edition models of the 1911 .45 caliber pistol on sale for $11,900 each. Solid Concept demonstrated the gun by initially firing 50 rounds through it. Since then, the company said it has fired nearly 2,000 rounds through the pistol without a single malfunction. Unlike the very first 3D printed gun — the single-shot, plastic Liberator — Solid Concepts says is not trying to promote the right to bear arms under the Second Amendment. Its purpose in printing the firearm was to demonstrate its ability to turn out precision, durable parts that could withstand the massive pressure created by firing a bullet. People who purchase one of the limited-edition guns will also have the chance to tour Solid Concept's Texas facility to see their gun being printed, and to join their lead additive manufacturing engineers on the range for the first test firing of their limited 1911 gun."
Ironically, the first Highway Robbery committed (Score:5, Funny)
seriously (Score:2)
even in real robberies there is no need to shoot every time, I guess... danger number one is mishandling IMHO.
Anyway, right to print arms FTW (for the wealthy)
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I seem to remember reading claims that a large number of guns used in robberies are actually not even loaded; and thus are little more than props. Without bullets it is no more of a weapon than a rock (which is still a formidable weapon... quite an expensive, precision crafted rock)
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The gun is there to threaten the victim with death if they do not comply. Sometimes the crook happens to be carrying a gun.
Many times criminals who shoot someone during a robbery shoot because they are scared. The victim makes a quick unexpected move and the criminal panics and fires. That or the criminal did not expect someone to be at the place of robbery such as a home break-in where they thought the house was empty.
I was watching that show, First 48. They had an episode where a guy broke into the cab of
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Re:Ironically, the first Highway Robbery committed (Score:4)
yeah so you can get a machined version much cheaper.
incidentally, you can by cnc machines and cnc lathes for making it for cheaper than the metal printer used for this.
but they are making a good point about how it can be used for rapid prototyping of durable parts OR for making parts that can not be machine. I mean, how the fuck would you machine a honeycomb structure inside an object?? which is the real point why 3d printed car parts are going to be a big thing, because you can manufacture parts that have a different structure!
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It isn't about the price of the printed gun, it is about exclusivity. This gun is a limited edition, and will be from the set of the first 100 metal guns ever made by using a printer. That is bound to give the gun some value that exceeds the sum of its parts.
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And yet, what's to stop someone from making a copy of the file and hitting print on their own set of printers?
Yes, you get to be one of the first 100 to own a 3D printed gun. Too bad someone may extract the model file and be able to print up 100 more co
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I think the initial promise of 3d printing is having something that can produce prototypes or low numbers of items made cheaper.
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I think that was the initial promise, but that's old hat now. Today we want to print final parts, preferably which require no additional finishing, let alone machining.
It's not that it's not still cool to use 3d printing for prototyping, but now what we really want is to make stuff with it that you can't make any other way, or which would otherwise be cost-prohibitive.
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Yeah, that's kind of what I meant by " or low numbers of items made cheaper". The quantity of what you want to make often dicates the process. If its a super low quantity you often have to pay a prohibitavly high price per item.
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I'd like to see a subtractive-manufacturing machine that's FOSS in the same way that a RepRap is. Does such a thing exist?
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I believe so, try here [reprap.org] or here [reprap.org].
The first one I linked can be used for both additive and subtractive processes.
Re:Ironically, the first Highway Robbery committed (Score:4, Funny)
I think the "highway robbery" in this case comes from charging $11,900 for a pistol. Then again, nobody is putting a gun to anybody's head to buy one.
If they pistols don't sell, though, maybe they can figure out how to print 3D gold Krugerrands from lead. In fact, maybe that's why they've already got "lead additive manufacturing engineers".
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There's significant evidence that someone has been injecting tungsten filled "gold bars" into the world gold market. They're the correct weight, they displace the correct amount of water, the only way to tell is that the electrical resistance is something like .01% off. And cutting them in half, of course.
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http://www.perthmintbullion.com/us/blog/blog/12-03-26/Fake_Bars_-_The_Facts.aspx
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About a year or two, this was rampant, as there were pictures of people who drilled a hole, had a grey core staring back at them in their 100 ounce gold bars. To boot, the bars were made by a very reliable mint, had assay certificates, and had no obvious marks, so the counterfeiters were very good.
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Except Kurgerands are not pure gold coins, they are coins with an oz of gold in them, but that gold is alloyed to make it less soft and more worthy of use in circulation (as $1000+ coins jingle around in many pockets)
I would think this gives you some more leeway when it comes to its properties, at least enough to fool many buyers.
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Who said anything about faking gold? I had assumed that the 3D printer folks would put into practice what we alchemists have known for centuries.
(sorry, just another lame joke; those of you who didn't get it need not respond.)
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In what way? By printing a gun from 1911? I'm thinking the patent on that ran out more than a few years ago, which just happens to be why the 1911 is so popular. Anyone can make their own version, even if it is an exact copy of the original.
My guess is the cost of the 1911 itself. You can buy a top of the line 1911 for under $2k. So this 3D printed one for almost $12k should be the golden gun from a Bond movie.
Re:Ironically, the first Highway Robbery committed (Score:5, Interesting)
If someone tried to rob me with a plastic 3D printed gun, part of me would be tempted to resist just on the decent chance that they would blow their own hand off rather than shooting me.
Re:Ironically, the first Highway Robbery committed (Score:5, Funny)
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At the moment, statistically the odds are in their favor that it won't fail. Especially if it's only been fired 0 or 1 times. Not that you could ever get me to hold one, nor should you.
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Let me guess. You also believe that throwing live ammunition into a fire is extremely dangerous?
The chamber of the gun is extremely important to the firing of the bullet. While you will ignite the powder inside the casing by striking it correctly, the pressures from the explosion will take the easiest path to escape which just happens to be through the brass casings. There's a chance for minor injuries but what you usually end up with is a peeled back casing and the slug sitting where the bullet was left. T
Build-it-yourself (Score:2)
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Fortunately, you can still buy a factory-made .45 for a few hundred dollars. 3D printing has a long way to go.
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Fortunately, you can still buy a factory-made .45 for a few hundred dollars. 3D printing has a long way to go.
I think the point is not everywhere in the world....
Now can they print ammunition.
... which is still going to be orders of magnitude cheaper and easier to do the good ol' fashioned way.
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Ammo would be interesting, lead and brass casting are simple to do at small scale, the more difficult part would be smokeless powder which is a PITA to do and very dangerous. You could do black powder cartridges but that would rule out designs newer than about 1890.
Comment removed (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:The really exciting thing about this... (Score:4, Insightful)
Expect new and exciting patent/copyright laws when that starts to become a reality.
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Considering how much of our cars today already is made of plastic and what ridiculous prices come attached to them, I think that time of some new and exciting patent laws ain't as far away as you might think. Because those parts CAN already be printed by consumer 3d printers.
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Back in the Top Gear UK series 2 http://www.topgear.com/uk/tv-show/series-2 circa 2003, there is a short spot where they showed a conversion kit for a Toyota MR2 to be changed into a Ferrari 355. The car kit looks stunning and in no way could you tell the donor car was a MR2.
They go on to state that Ferrari put the shop out of business in less than a month. There are other replica car kits out there but they make such changes as to not infringe copyright, as in http://www.mr2kits.co.uk/kit-packages.html
If i
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Ferrari makes more money licensing it's logo then they do making cars.
By some definitions, they are just copyright trolls.
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That price is arbitrary. It's that high because these guns are actually working, limited edition art pieces. They made guns to show how much stress the final product can withstand. I'd bet actual manufacturing costs (except the printing equipment) were far less than a gun bought from a gunsmith would cost.
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It's an interesting proof of concept. But costs are going to have to come way down (perhaps with scale) for it to be very practical. 3D printing seems better suited to one-off parts rather than general manufacture. If you're going to build a million copies of something, it's probably always going to be cheaper just to build the traditional custom manufacturing equipment rather than using a general-purpose 3D printer.
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3D printing isn't fundamentally different than traditional manufacturing, it's just another form of it. A general purpose 3D printer is more versatile than custom equipment--but also much slower, more expensive, and less consistent.
And just because it's new and hip doesn't automatically make it the wave of the future. I bet there was a guy like you in the 50's who was making fun of everyone who didn't believe flying cars would ever become common, no doubt calling them luddites with no vision.
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I see some safety issues related to the strength of the metals. I would be interested if somebody put the printed metal material through some metalurigal tests to see how strong it is versus traditionally cast/machined parts.
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I would be interested if somebody put the printed metal material through some metalurigal tests to see how strong it is versus traditionally cast/machined parts.
They already did. They fired 2000+ rounds through the gun. Pretty good test. Now, the TFA doesn't mention if they used proof loads (larger amounts of powder used to test guns by giving one the assurance they can handle larger than expected pressures). But 2000 rounds is starting to get you into territory that suggests the gun is reasonably strong and safe.
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I would be interested if somebody put the printed metal material through some metalurigal tests to see how strong it is versus traditionally cast/machined parts.
If all else is equal, sintered metals are inferior to forged. They have a fine grain structure which is not only less resistant to deformation but is more likely to break instead of bending (and staying bent) when you pass the elastic limit.
If their particular grade of Inconel is sufficiently more amazing than the usual materials used for the important parts then it could be quite good.
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How are you going to print Naugahyde? Or rich Corinthian leather for that matter?
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In their ongoing effort to mock Ferrari the guys at 'Hot Rod' magazine (the same guys that demonstrated that a Pontiac GTO is faster then a Ferrari GTO) bought the Enzo that a talentless comic (who's name escapes me) totaled a few years ago, fixed it and reported on the costs.
The example that comes to mind is an red anodized aluminum washer, used to retain the headlights on an Enzo. 1 15mm washer from Ferarri: Price US$5000.
A 1911 for how much ??? (Score:2)
I look forward to buying the first 3D-printed AK47 for $15k. I mean, who the hell would want a normal $30 one: they're so last century...
Re:A 1911 for how much ??? (Score:4, Informative)
I own both a Springfield Arms 1911 and a Romanian AK (it's a 74, not a 47, meaning it takes 5.45x39 ammo instead of 7.62x39 like the 47 does). I paid $900 for my 1911 (brand new in the box) and I saw them at the last gun show I attended for up to $1500. I paid $1000 for the AK, 5 magazines and 1000 rounds of ammo. It is set up just like it would be in theater, and has hardly been used (muzzle wear and throat erosion are very low). The AK's I saw at the last gun show ranged from $650 up to $2000. Where are you getting them for $30?
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The AK's I saw at the last gun show ranged from $650 up to $2000. Where are you getting them for $30?
You live in rich country full of gun collectors who drive up the price for nice examples. In Africa, AK-47s can be had for around $300 [reference:http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2007/06/12/looking_for_a_deal_on_ak_47s_go_to_africa#sthash.IpUFO50V.dpbs].
It's also possible that at certain situations (e.g., after a proxy war) markets in very poor countries may be flooded with very cheap weapons, with ak-47s selling for as little as $6 [reference http://archive.is/5gesc%5D [archive.is]. However this is obviously not a
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The AK's I saw at the last gun show ranged from $650 up to $2000. Where are you getting them for $30?
Crazy Achmed's Firearm and Shovel Emporium
Custom bullets ? (Score:2)
Forget the gun, how about 3d printing bullets ?
Customized bullets with the name of the victim ? Or the reason the victim was shot at ?
That's not for me, I'll stick with jewelry and fitness accessories printing... :-)
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Sure, if you REALLY want to risk engraving shit on to live rounds.
Done it a million times.
Don't be such a chickenshit.
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How about a customized bullet with your own name on it. You know how they say "somewhere out there is a bullet with your name on it"?
Wouldn't you feel a lot safer if you owned that bullet?
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I think the 3d printing of ammunition is much more dangerous than some 11000$ kalashnikov knockoff replica.
Why? casting bullets from lead and stuffing them into (used) shell casings is insanely cheap and easy. it will be a LONG time before 3d printing can improve on a process we've been using for a century to create ammunition.
You can make bullets really cheap, at home, right now. It's marginally dangerous if you don't know what you're doing, but no more so then printing ammunition would be.
Here's some links to get you started! good luck!
http://www.midwayusa.com/find?dimensionids=5671 [midwayusa.com]
http://www.buffaloarms.com/ [buffaloarms.com]
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Home ammunition production is a solved problem. Take your pick http://www.midwayusa.com/find?dimensionids=11521 [midwayusa.com]
Call For New Legislation: (Score:3, Funny)
We must immediately restrict the availability of this 3D printing technology to prevent $11,900 cheap knockoff copies of firearms from flooding the streets!
I cannot wait to see... (Score:2)
For that price (Score:2)
Just buy yourself a 3D printer and print your own crappy guns.
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Just buy yourself a CNC mill and print your own real guns.
FTFY.
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Technically, milling is not the same as printing, but yes, good point.
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Technically, milling is not the same as printing, but yes, good point.
Is and isn't.
Isn't the same, because milling is subtractive, and 3D printing is additive.
Is the same, because either way you're taking a digital file and sending it to a machine that creates a physical object from said file.
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Isn't the same, because milling is subtractive, and 3D printing is additive.
So a CNC mill is a 3D eraser.
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Just how much do you think a direct metal laser sintering printer costs?
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Just how much do you think a direct metal laser sintering printer costs?
Well a rip rap cost according to google shopping search anywhere form $150 parts to over a $1000 fully assembled and about two weeks ago a 3d metal printer based on rep rap was developed it cost about 1000 pounds or 1600 dollars to make according to the slashdot summery. Now the cost of the printers would be a one time investment after that each gun only costs as much as the electricity and powdered metal, and abs plastic (for things like grips such). so really not all that much when it comes right down to
Interesting future (Score:2)
So 3D printing is reaching critical mass, that much is clear.
What will this do to our economy, where we no longer need to buy anything but printer supplies?
E.g. What happens to China's economy, and how will they respond?
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As far as I can tell, we're a long way from that, mostly because "printer supplies" would require such a wide array of materials.
3D printer can make shapes, but as far as I can see they're not very good with materials. They take what they get. A gun as the advantage of being a block of metal; all it needs to be is strong. But even something as simple as a kitchen spatula or frying pan would prove quite complicated. The spatula head needs to be flexible, while the handle needs to be stiff. A decent frying pa
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Okay, fine, in the hypothetical (but maybe not so far away future) - wouldn't this be a significant change to how the global economy functions?
Particularly should the materials recycling concepts gain traction, like this one -
http://www.appropedia.org/Recyclebot_v2.3 [appropedia.org]
In that world, you won't even use a whole lot of new plastic. Kid's toy breaks; grind said up and print replacement.
Seems significant.
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Absolutely, this has the potential to completely redesign the way we look at manufactured products. That goes well beyond China; it would radically disrupt the economy at home, too. A lot of products that are currently shipped could be printed.
I think the case of books is instructive, though. For a long time we've had the technology to print books at home. DRM was of course an issue, and publishers weren't jumping at the chance to make the book available to print, but even setting that aside I think people
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As far as I can tell, we're a long way from that, mostly because "printer supplies" would require such a wide array of materials.
Alternately, when 3d printing finally does take off, you'll see most stuff made out of just a handful of materials, those which are cheapest and most reliably fed through 3d printers. Well into that era you'll be getting a module with the electronics shipped to you, and you'll plug it into something that comes out of your printer, but lots of stuff will be directly printable.
Great job title (Score:2)
"Lead additive manufacturing engineers." What a great title for gun makers.
Yes, I know they don't mean Pb. But it would be so much funnier if they did.
Economies of scale? (Score:2)
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Maybe the price will drop as they print more. I'm fine with them leaving it at $11,900, fewer sales. Google result for "M1911A1 for sale" is a page advertising $419.00.
Tisas and some TLA beginning with A both sell $400 1911s, obviously not made in the USA. Too bad I can't remember the name of the second one, because their $400 pistol was the nicer one, with a better beavertail. hickok45 has a video for each.
Stacked Tolerances (Score:2)
I'd be very curious as to how much hand finishing is required on these firearms. While the 1911 is a simple design and commonly produced the difference between a weapon cranked out with CNC and finished by an assembly line gunsmith is notably different than the same parts finished by an accomplished smith who understands the finer points of the firearm.
I'd also point out that 2,000 rounds is no testament to durability, rather it's just barely out of what most 1911 enthusiasts consider the break-in period.
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I'd be very curious as to how much hand finishing is required on these firearms. While the 1911 is a simple design and commonly produced the difference between a weapon cranked out with CNC and finished by an assembly line gunsmith is notably different than the same parts finished by an accomplished smith who understands the finer points of the firearm.
Notable to who? Only to an educated owner who cares about the finer points of the firearm. Most people are not going to have a notably better experience with the Ed Brown than they are with Kimber, the poster child for CNC 1911s. At least, not once you've passed the break-in period. The hand-smithed 1911s still jam if a magazine is sloppy, or its spring is old, or maybe just if a round was tamped .5mm too little into the cartridge, or if you use a .45 ACP that your particular 1911 doesn't like to feed...
I b
durable parts that could withstand... (Score:2)
And while we're on the topic of MG's, "down with Lucus Electronics, prince of darkness."
Do I have this straight? (Score:2)
Dodge Ball Redux (Score:2)
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I'm still waiting on the first fully-functional 2D gun.
Re:Pretty sure it's not the first (Score:5, Funny)
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There's the WW2 Sten, for suitably "it'd hurt if you bashed someone with it" values of functional.
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(Also, company PR emphasizes that 'no machining' had to be done to the printed parts; which is impressive; but also allows room for assorted heat treatment, surface coating, and other things you do to metal without machine tools)
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That's why they used stainless and inconel. The stainless is used for the big parts and the inconel where the magic happens. Inconel is used for stuff like turbine wheels, even down to automotive turbochargers, where they have to be able to handle small impacts (at umpty-ump thousand RPM, a little bit of grit is serious) and a broad variety of temperatures, and up again to parts of jet engines. Neither one requires anything fancy done to it when you're done if it's a fancy enough alloy. Inconel is hard to w
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I just had to renew my drivers license the girl in her mid 20s in front of me in line was there to take the driving test it was her 4th attempt and the clerk reminded her that if she failed she would have to start over she said she knows she has started over more than once... that means she failed the driving test at least 11 times.
Six years ago when I renewed my license there was a guy taking the written test for a second time that day {It's an open book test and the book has one page for every question in
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I have a cousin that never learned to drive because he is not comfortable in cars after being in a terrible accident as a child, even as a passenger. He rides a bicycle everywhere and as a side benefit is in great shape you would never guess he was in his 50s.
My 22 year old son doesn't have license because he feels there is no point until he can afford the expense of insurance, gas, upkeep, etc. that comes with a owning vehicle so he also rides a bicycle everywhere.
Having no desire is not the same. I was dr
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What, exactly, is obsolete about the 1911? It's still one of the best, most reliable guns you can buy.
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What, exactly, is obsolete about the 1911? It's still one of the best, most reliable guns you can buy.
Some people measure obsolescence in actual years, as opposed to years of usefulness.
I'm guessing OP isn't a big fan of rulers, either.
Re:WTF (Score:5, Informative)
There is nothing obsolete about the design.
The M1911 was designed well before 1911 by John Browning and was a standard in U.S. military forces until the 1970s when, some would argue due to political pressure, the U.S. and NATO adopted the European standard 9mm round.
The standard 1911 fires a .45 ACP bullet and is remarkably elegant from a design perspective. Many would argue it's still the best defensive pistol out there. I'm carrying one on my hip at the moment.
The design has been reliable enough that I can take the parts from my current 1911 and put them in a 1911 from the era when they were initially introduced and have a very functional firearm. Today, one can pay anywhere from $400 to $5,000 for a 1911 depending on the manufacturer and I would gladly carry any of them to defend myself.
Just because it was designed over 100 years ago doesn't make it obsolete in any way, shape or form.
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NATO was on 9mm for a long time before the 70s, and the US didn't switch to it until the 80s (w/ the Beretta 92 aka M9)
Re:WTF (Score:4, Informative)
There is nothing obsolete about the design.
That's not really true. The path the cartridge follows and the design of the extractor make it prone to problems compared to other firearms. I've had a S&W 1911 firing standard hardball choke on a casing so hard it had to be cleared with a good-sized tool. So I bought the Kimber. I had one FTF before replacing mag springs and giving the weapon a detail strip, where I found a miserably fouled extractor. And that's just one of the problems with the design... that this is even a possibility.
The M1911 was designed well before 1911 by John Browning and was a standard in U.S. military forces until the 1970s when,
Utilization by a military doesn't prove anything except that they were using it.
The standard 1911 fires a .45 ACP bullet and is remarkably elegant from a design perspective. Many would argue it's still the best defensive pistol out there. I'm carrying one on my hip at the moment.
Confirmation bias. I have one too but I don't think it's the best thing around. Neither did John Moses Browning. He went on to design the Hi-Power based on the lessons learned from the 1911. Aside from its lesser cartridge, the Hi-Power is arguably a better firearm in every way.
The design has been reliable enough that I can take the parts from my current 1911 and put them in a 1911 from the era when they were initially introduced and have a very functional firearm.
The design is sloppy enough (due to age) that if you actually do take parts from your current 1911 and put them in an original 1911 without smithing, they might work perfectly, they might make your gun fail to fire or fail to eject, or they might make your gun fire full-auto and not stop.
Just because it was designed over 100 years ago doesn't make it obsolete in any way, shape or form.
It's obsolete in form. The shape is lovely, though, which is why there are still single-stack pistols around. For example, the S&W M&P .45 Pistol, with its simplified external extractor and so on and so forth.
Re:WTF (Score:4, Informative)
The 1911 isn't a perfect design by any means - I would flag three issues that can't be corrected via trivial gunsmithing:
1) The extractor has several functional issues, not the least of which that it's supposed to be both a structural element and a spring. It tends to get clogged with crud and be at the wrong tension.
2) The "ski jump" between the frame ramp and barrel throat and general feed geometry is less than ideal.
3) The clearance between slide stop and bullet is far too similar to the clearance between slide stop and mag follower, leading to situations where the slide doesn't lock back when it should or does lock back when it shouldn't.
That said, there are many upsides to the 1911 design as well that subsequent designs have failed to match. The trigger design is such that it's possible to get an excellent trigger in terms of crispness and ability to tune to a desired weight - better than is possible on any striker or double action platform. The barrel to slide lockup is better than any other design because of the tunability afforded by the bushing and barrel link. The 1911 is very thin given the caliber it's chambered in, which makes them excellent concealed carry guns. The 1911 ergonomics just "feel right" in most adult male's hands. The positive action safeties prevent "glock leg".
Personally, it's one of the two pistol types I choose to carry (the other being S&W J-frame revolvers).
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Are you really so scared of boogymen that you need to carry a gun in a holster on your hip? What the fuck do you think is going to happen?
or maybe he just enjoys his constitutional rights.
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Never, never diss people with lots of disposable income. Help them.
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It sounds like they're entirely relying on the collector value to sell these things. Good on them, I guess, because apparently people will pay ridiculous amounts for "collector" shit.
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I don't own a 3D printer but I would imagine that cooking parchment would work.
http://recipes.howstuffworks.com/tools-and-techniques/parchment-paper-questions.htm [howstuffworks.com]
Simply tape it down to the plate and print on it. In theory (yes, my theory) that should allow you to easily remove the ABS and it shouldn't stick to the paper. Of course, I disclaim any and all liability should this fuck up your machine or project.
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I'm guessing they use a saw. (Or some reasonable facsimile thereof)