Tesla's Having Issues Charging In the Cold 476
cartechboy writes "It's winter, and apparently meteorologists have just discovered the term Polar Vortex, as that seems to be the only thing they can talk about these days. But seriously, it's cold, and apparently the darling child of the automotive industry, the new Tesla Model S electric car, is having issues charging in the cold weather. It's being reported that the charging cables that come with the car are unable to provide a charge when the temperature dips below zero. As you can imagine, this is an issue in a country like Norway where the Model S is one of the most popular cars. In fact, it seems this issue has already left one Model S owner stranded with a dead battery nearly 100 miles from the nearest charging station. Other owners are reporting issues charging. Tesla's European sales chief Peter Bardenfleth-Hansen apologized for he inconvenience owners are facing, and said it's 'trying hard to resolve' the issue. Apparently the issues are simply down to the differences in the Norwegian network as Norway uses a slightly different charging adapter than other countries in Europe."
units please (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:units please (Score:5, Insightful)
"below zero' Kelvin? (is that you, Frank Herbert?) Centigrade? Farenheit?
Considering it's Europe and the fact that water freezes at 0 Celsius, my guess would be C.
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Welcome to England?
It's actually really annoying that no apps (Google Navigation, MyTracks etc.) let me have distances in miles and metres. It's either miles and feet, or kilometres and metres.
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Welcome to the era of Rome. 100 miles is 100.000 paces, which is very a very appropriate unit when you are asking OUT OF CHARGE!!!?!?!
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Below zero is a turn of phrase that means freezing, so 0C.
You also could have looked it up:
"Liion batteries offer reasonably good charging performance at cooler temperatures and allow fast-charging in a temperature bandwidth of 5 to 45 C (41 to 113 F). Charging should be performed within this temperature range. Below 5 C, the charge current should be reduced, and no charging is permitted at freezing temperatures" from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L... [wikipedia.org]
So again, 0C
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"Below zero is a turn of phrase that means freezing, so 0C."
Just no. "Below zero" is a turn of phrase that means "below zero". It is used as much in the United States to mean below 32F as it is elsewhere to mean 0C.
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In MM when someone says "below zero" it means below 0F. Not sure what it commonly means in the rest of the US though.
Re:units please (Score:4, Funny)
3M is headquartered in Minnesota, so it's clear the 3rd one just froze off from the cold.
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The point being that the phrase "below zero" means just that... the units you use are irrelevant.
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Because of the continental climate many of the north central US cities are colder than those in Alaska.
Were I live in MN for example the average low for January is 3F(-16C), in Embaras MN it is -8F(-22C), the average for Anchorage AK is 8F(-13C).
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They'd do even worse at 0K!
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They'd do even worse at 0K!
Actually 0K would make it easier to get superconductive chargers. But your hand would snap off and shatter on the ground when you plug it in. It's probably not a good trade off. ;-)
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"below zero' Kelvin? (is that you, Frank Herbert?) Centigrade? Farenheit?
FRANK: Is that you Leto, or has the Kumquat Haagen Dazs finally arrived?
Re:units please (Score:5, Funny)
Centigrade? Farenheit?
Sometimes it doesn't matter. From Futurama [wikipedia.org]:
Re:units please (Score:5, Informative)
In fact, it seems this issue has already left one Model S owner stranded with a dead battery nearly 100 miles from the nearest charging station.
Your quote from Futurama is amusing, but there's something even more amusing, or sad, depending on how you look at it. It's that one dude's car died, and somehow this is a reflection on the entire model line? I live in Minnesota, in the coldest major city by average temperature and up here, every cold snap results in thousands of dead batteries. The number one call out for tow truck companies out here isn't a flat tire but a dead battery. And simple physics provide plenty of explanation for why this is; Yet somehow, out of the thousands of cars that wouldn't start (to the point that it's a running joke: "Come for the low unemployment rate and good schools, stay because your car won't start")... one dude got selected and they say his electric car is somehow defective because of this?
Dude... if ONE car dies during a cold snap out of the entire model line, that's not a problem, that's an engineering success up here of epic proportions when it comes to cars. Maybe you've heard about our roads? We only have two seaons: Winter and road construction. Believe me... if a line of cars can survive up here and only one of them goes tits up in the cold, then someone's doing it right.
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"below zero'
Kelvin? (is that you, Frank Herbert?)
Centigrade?
Farenheit?
Does it matter, relative to the story?
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"Norway. Powered by nature." (Score:2)
'below zero' Kelvin?
Winter
In winter much of Norway is usually transformed into a snow-clad paradise.
The lower inland areas, both in the southern and northern parts of Norway, can have very low mean temperatures in winter. Temperatures can reach below -40 F/-40 C in the inner areas of Finnmark, Troms, Trondelag and Eastern Norway, even if this does not happen each winter.
By contrast, the coastal areas have comparatively mild winters. However, gales, rain and clouds can be frequent and heavy.
Seasons and climate in Norway [visitnorway.com]
It doesn't matter whether you measure temperature in degrees Fahrenheit or Centigrade. What matters is whether you can keep your Tesla on the road through a Nordic winter.
Re:units please (Score:5, Informative)
Re:units please (Score:5, Funny)
0F is "well below the freezing point".
...of what?
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"Pretty much everything" in the universe is hydrogen (well, not counting dark matter, which also doesn't seem to freeze much) --- which you won't find frozen at 0F in many places.
Re:units please (Score:4, Informative)
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Self-solving problem (Score:5, Funny)
People disincentivized into buying electric cars, increasing CO2 emissions, raising planetary temperatures until electric cars work.
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People disincentivized into buying electric cars, increasing CO2 emissions, raising planetary temperatures until electric cars work.
Is that how Dick Cheney logic works?
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But then temperatures rise, electric cars become prevalent and then temperatures drop and they cease working. Then we have to break out all the gas powered cars until the temperature rises enough that electric works again.
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Since we're pretending this isn't just a joke:
I think you're overestimating the rate at which life on the planet can consume atmospheric carbon dioxide. It's actually quite slow, compared to which burning fossil fuels can put it out.
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I have a bridge in Canada to sell you.
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Blithely accusing others of naivety, in defense of the scientifically unfounded: an activity I'm tired of dealing with.
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As Mune, from Chrono Trigger, once said, "I'm the wind! Whoosh!"
Blaming the cables? (Score:4, Insightful)
Now the batteries on the other hand.... Batteries don't hold charge very well in the cold. It's been one of the two big problems for electric cars since the 19th century.
Re:Blaming the cables? (Score:5, Interesting)
Thing is, a number of people have indicated that they have used third-party cables and those have solved the issue.
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Thing is, a number of people have indicated that they have used third-party cables and those have solved the issue.
Does using a third-party cable void the warranty, or violate the EULA?
Funky cold Medina, did I just say "violate the EULA" when talking about a fucking car? That is kind of depressing...
Re:Blaming the cables? (Score:5, Funny)
Thing is, a number of people have indicated that they have used third-party cables and those have solved the issue.
So it's obviously that the skin-effect electrons are out of phase with the ones in the middle, or that the wire is in the cable backward because, as everybody knows, the electrons flow through wire more easily in the same direction in which the wire was extruded. And that, of course, is why Monster brand charging cables would solve the problems ;-)
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As I understand the chemistry, they do in fact hold the charge just fine. They just become unable to release it as well. Easily demonstrable with a cell phone using similar Li-ION tech - take it outside and let to go to minus 20C and you'll see the charge indicator go low after usage that would normally only use about half of the charge in normal condition. Get it back inside and let it warm up and charge indicator goes back up to show the about half of the charge that remains.
I live in Finland and use one
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This has always been my concern with electric cars. Batteries do not work well in the cold. I live in the part of the USA where Norwegians settled because it reminded them of home. Except we were having a heat wave at the time, and now it's colder. A warm gasoline or diesel engine will generally keep running no matter how cold it gets, so by the time you are any distance from the safety of your home, you have the safety of a running car with a working heater until you run out of fuel (assuming you have not
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Actually this has been a concern with ALL cars. ICE cars don't work all that well in cold either. Ranging from cars refusing to start, lead batteries dying out and not supplying power to starter, fuel lines freezing, fuel filters failing, computer systems dying from condencation/corrosion damage and a vast multitude of over issues, northern climate proves a massive challenge to automotive industry even today. Not to even mention the whole "diesels don't work in the cold" issue we had until very recent times
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Solid state batteries based on Ni-MH and Li-ION fair quite decently in cold actually. It's the liquid state ones, such as lead batteries that have severe problems.
Also internal combustion cars have severe problems with hot engine and cold fuel lines leading to it among other things. Just because your engine is running warm doesn't mean that things like fuel lines are. Not to even mention that you need completely different fuel and fuel filters on diesels to even run in the cold.\
As for electric cars proving
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Now the batteries on the other hand.... Batteries don't hold charge very well in the cold. It's been one of the two big problems for electric cars since the 19th century.
Actually, batteries tend to hold charge very well when cold. Cool/cold and dry is typically the recommended (below freezing or not varies).
The problem is that they aren't very willing to let go of, or accept new, charge when cold - just as most any chemical process slow down when it's cold. This makes it hard to draw current to run the car or to charge the batteries back up.
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Looking a little deeper than the summary (or really the linked articles for that matter). It appears to not really have much of anything to do with the cold. According to Tesla it has to do with the charging system having difficulties interfacing with the Norwegian electric grid--which is evidently different from the rest of Europe and North America. These difficulties have apparently been on going for a while now. The problem just happened to make headlines since it's all nice and cold now and people a
Re:Blaming the cables? (Score:5, Interesting)
Electricity is a funny thing. Had a problem with a piece of electronics that we make. The CPU wouldn't boot up if it was colder than about 20F. It turns out that the CPU has an internal voltage regulator that relies on an external capacitor. My engineer used an electrolytic cap, and at around 20F, the series resistance of the cap exceeded the tolerances of the CPU's voltage regulator and it went into a perpetual brown-out reset. Now, if the chip was up and running, it was happy and kept running, even if it got cold. So it's fixed now, but for some older hardware in the field with the problem, we don't send firmware updates between December and March. That's just one of many bits of stupid we've encountered over the years. In short, every piece of electronics you develop needs to be tested in the most absurd conditions you can find. And even that won't be enough. Never underestimate the creative stupidity of your customers.
Edgar Hansen Was Right (Score:2)
Apparently the issues are simply down to the differences in the Norwegian network as Norway uses a slightly different charging adapter than other countries in Europe.
There is a right way, a wrong way, and a Norwegian way. --Edgar Hansen, Northwestern, Deadliest Catch
Re:Edgar Hansen Was Right (Score:5, Funny)
Well, as the joke goes here in Sweden:
Why are there no mental asylums in Norway?
It'd cost too much to put walls and a roof over the whole country....
In Norway this is a problem (Score:5, Interesting)
Yes, it's related to the cold, but it also appears to be related to the specific issues of Norway's grid.
Some speculation is that the problem involves too-extreme fluctuations in the electricity provided by that grid and a charger-side software-mediated shutoff of charging. If that's the case, then this might be another charger issue that can be solved with an over-the-air "patch" like some of the previous problems.
While this is definitely a concern for Tesla and their Norwegian customers, it doesn't seem to be relevant to cars in North America.
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We have standard european 230V grid.
I've never had issues with anything using an european plug.
My guess is the cold. It's been bad lately.
Another thing is the number of teslas here. I see them _everywhere_.
With my Toyota I had to pay $25000 as a one time tax, yearly taxes, road tolls, gas at $9/gallon.
The tesla and other electrics are completely tax free. Not even VAT. No yearly taxes. You pass for free in the toll roads, and electricity is about 16 cents/kWh.
I could also drive past the traffic in the bus l
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And have you seen reports of this problem around here ? Which makes it looks like it really is what they say it is..
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If you went to bed assuming you'd have a full charge in the morning, only to find that it only charged for 10 minutes before shutting off, you'd think that the charger was broken.
If it only charged for ten minutes before shutting off, the charger is broken.
Were having some trouble adapting them to the cold (Score:5, Funny)
Biased? (Score:2)
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Actually, the linked article is considerably better. The headline of TFA is more accurate: "Tesla Grapples With Charging-Cable Troubles In Norwegian Cold".
The article came to prominence via the New York Times, who published that rather scurrilous piece last year on Tesla, but this was a different writer and the Times' summary of it is reasonably neutral.
It's almost as though cars need winterizing (Score:5, Insightful)
Weird, eh?
I used to work in Northern Canada where all the US and some of the European manufacturers used to do cold weather testing. (The toolsets and options differ in North America which is why separate testing was done for Europe.) The Asian manufacturers were also doing cold testing there but their labs and warehouses ended up with all of the crappy real estate.
Did anyone seriously think the cold wouldn't be an issue? People need to get out of California and see what the rest of the world is like.
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As noted in the OP, the issue is not so much the battery tech but the Norway-specific cable that doesn't work. It charges in cold weather in other countries using different cables and it charges in Norway using a third party cable. But first party cable in Norway is apparently dysfunctional in the cold.
Reason given is that Norway has a different spec for the cable for specific local reasons.
Re:It's almost as though cars need winterizing (Score:4, Funny)
Did anyone seriously think the cold wouldn't be an issue? People need to get out of California and see what the rest of the world is like.
Merely pointing out that a world exists outside California is enough to blow a fair amount of minds, I'm afraid.
Even worse, you can extrapolate that to include, "outside 'Murica" for a large portion of the populace.
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Hmmmm...
I suppose as an Aussie I should look for any opportunity to put the boot into our mates across the Tasman...but I feel that I have to stand up for them here. While I can't offer any solid evidence either way, your statement immediately triggers my "that doesn't sound right" sense. I haven't spent a huge amount of time in NZ myself (about a month), but I feel that in their travel habits they are similar to Australians, who are huge travellers (both within Australia and overseas). 70-75% of adult Aust
Cable issue not Tesla issue (Score:2)
This is like saying a car is bad because the gas hose does not fit when it gets cold.
It is not an issue with the car.
And "dips below zero" would be a poor threshold.
We have windshield washer fluid that is rated to -50C (-58F) for a good reason.
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This is like saying a car is bad because the gas hose does not fit when it gets cold.
It is not an issue with the car.
That's like saying that when a 3D game won't run because they rely on driver bugs which don't exist in our driver, it's the game's problem. That might well be true, but everyone using our GPU will blame it on us.
Similarly, no-one will care whether it's 'the cable's fault' when they're stranded in the middle of nowhere at 40 below zero and unable to recharge their car.
Meteorologists (Score:5, Insightful)
No, meteorologists have understood the term Polar Vortex for decades. Weathermen, newscasters, and ratings-minded producers have only just discovered the term.
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No, meteorologists have understood the term Polar Vortex for decades. Weathermen, newscasters, and ratings-minded producers have only just discovered the term.
It gives the MSM a way to explain extreme cold that can be attributed to Global Warming.
Re:Meteorologists (Score:4, Interesting)
Indeed. Working with a meteorology research center that has been studying the polar vortex year after year for many decades, I find that remark in TFS quite out of place.
News meteorologist are quite fond of playing with hype... Just wait until one "figures out" that there is a link between the polar vortex and the ozone hole *gasp*
why is everyone always snide about Tesla? (Score:5, Informative)
apparently the darling child of the automotive industry
What's with the snide side commentary? Tesla isn't the "darling" of anyone. Snide, obnoxious comments like this are pretty much du jour in any coverage. Everyone's gunning for them, simply because they're odd kid on the block.
A Tesla catches fire after hitting a piece of massive road debris or getiting into a crash, and it's a fucking national emergency, their stock tanks, electric cars are suddenly "unsafe", etc.
Meanwhile: do you drive a Ford SUV made in the 90's? Twice, Ford weakened the roof and support pillars to save money, against the recommendation of their engineers.
Drive a 90's Ford? Their ignition switches were substandard and could short out, causing your car to catch fire at random. 8.6 million vehicles: http://articles.baltimoresun.c... [baltimoresun.com]
Drive a recent GM truck? They've also got a "randomly burst into fire" problem; 370,000 vehicles: http://money.cnn.com/2014/01/1... [cnn.com]
Just google "GM recall fire" or "Ford recall fire" and read page after page of recalls that affect hundreds of thousands if not millions of vehicles.
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Cables? (Score:2)
...the charging cables that come with the car are unable to provide a charge when the temperature dips below zero.
Um, Dear Editors (Slashdot and Green Car Reports), The "cables" can't provide a charge?
Really? (Score:5, Informative)
What's next, are we going to post about a gasoline car not starting (am actually trying to help someone jumpstart their ICE right now, maybe I can get featured too)?
Anyways, just last week, someone made the trip from NYC to LA [chargeny.com] in his Tesla Model S, seen temps in the -20F range, and the car was just fine. I'm driving my EV in these same temps, no issues either (ignoring the lower range).
This is not a battery issue as some people seem to indicate.
This is why nobody reads the articles (Score:5, Informative)
I'd advise Slashdot readers to take their typical tack, and not read the linked articles. They are crap. However (again, much like Slashdot), the comments can be enlightening.
What I'm seeing there is:
a) This is not about the cold, or winter at all. Its been a problem since they started delivering vehicles in August.
b) Due to all the bad press (from poor journalists such as these) over fires from improperly overcharged batteries, Tesla charging cables now try to detect when a battery is fully-charged and stop the charging process.
c) They do this by looking for changes in the current flow through them.
d) Norway's power grid is so dirty that it is fooling the cables. That's the issue, near as I can tell.
BS Summary anyway (Score:4, Interesting)
Some example of a guy stuck 100 miles away from a charging station as a result... AWAY.
If it was a charging issue, then shouldn't he still be at the charging station? If his voltage meter? was indicating the wrong amount, this has nothing to do with the charging station. If it was reading correctly as "low" and he opted to drive 100 miles into the middle of nowhere isn't that the fault of a stupid driver?
Anyway I think you summarized all the points, but I am still left wondering why (how) that left a man stranded 100 miles from a charging station...
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I'd advise Slashdot readers to take their typical tack, and not read the linked articles. They are crap. However (again, much like Slashdot), the comments can be enlightening.
What I'm seeing there is: .....
d) Norway's power grid is so dirty that it is fooling the cables. That's the issue, near as I can tell.
The power grid is not dirty, but uses a different system with no neutral wire and the voltage will therefore be floating with respect to earth. Tesla cables detect this as an earth-fault and disconnect.
Very little to do with Tesla. At all. Again. (Score:3)
FTFA: "The issues are simply down to differences in the Norwegian network that Tesla has not experienced elsewhere"
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FTFA: "The issues are simply down to differences in the Norwegian network that Tesla has not experienced elsewhere"
So, when my software doesn't work in Norway, I can just say 'the issues are simply down to differences in Norway that we've not experienced elsewhere', and everyone will be happy?
No, didn't think so.
can't trust these electric cars! (Score:4, Funny)
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Norwegian Issue (Score:5, Informative)
I am in the middle of the polar vortex (-13F today) and haven't been having any issues charging my Tesla. I also haven't heard of anyone else in MN having charging issues. This really appears to be a Norwegian issue moreso than a general Tesla + cold issue.
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As a side note, the battery on my wife's BMW is reporting issues and she's having to leave it running :)
Gas cars have batteries too!
Summary: Tesla doing fine in the cold, BMW having issues
Don't make fun of the POLAR VORTEX (Score:4, Interesting)
Here's a must see link for us weather nerds...
http://earth.nullschool.net/ [nullschool.net]
make sure to tune into the 10 hPa setting and watch the polar vortex do its thing.
Thank you supercomputer...
Oh for fux sake (Score:4)
Look, I think Elon Musk is a jerk, I'll probably never own a Tesla, but the Tesla-bashing hype is getting old. And stupid.
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News you don't like is still news.
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Really? This is the first submission I've seen that includes articles from greencarreports.com that aren't completely apologetic to Tesla.
Not to mention, just because you don't like the facts the news presents doesn't mean it's not news.
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But it's okay to report on a flaw in an Intel chip or a software patch which breaks a person's system, right?
This has nothing to do with being biased. It's reporting on a known issue which affects those who bought a Tesla, just like people who bought that certain Intel chip or installed the patch.
Re:Whenever I hear about electric car failures (Score:5, Interesting)
newsflash: batteries generate electricty from stored chemical energy
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How do think a battery works exactly?
Or is this years model S using some sort of super capacitor now?
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I am reminded why most lifeforms has been storing energy chemically, as opposed to electrically, for billions of years.
Oh, you mean like this? [vt.edu] Coming soon to an electric car near you! lol
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Re:Who Cares? (Score:5, Insightful)
Because many of us are interested. Tesla, love'em or hate'm are trying to sell a pure electric car without the compromises at a price at least a segment of the mass market can afford. There are ton's of technical hurdles to doing that and its interesting to watch theory and design encounter real world conditions.
Tesla is somewhat unique in this area too, Yes there is all electric Leaf and that strange i-Miev thing but neither of those comes anywhere near offering the range and performance characteristics of what most of us Americans expect from our ICE powered vehicles, in other words they make compromises, where as most Slashdoter's would be quite pleased with the Tesla compared to their current ride, provided it continues to live up to expectations.
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provided it continues to live up to expectations.
What do you mean "continues"?
Re:Who Cares? (Score:5, Insightful)
The name Tesla also holds a special place in geek culture. Choosing that as name for an electric car manufacture puts a greater expectation on the product.
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most Slashdoter's would be quite pleased with the Tesla compared to their current ride, provided it continues to live up to expectations.
Its interesting that living up to the expectations is something the Tesla pretty much takes in stride, and all we hear about are the corner cases of Tesla glitches.
Fires after devastating crashes, charger issues, etc.
Similar (and worse) problems in ICE vehicles are scarcely mentioned, Gas line freezes, gas tank ruptures, just refusing to start in cold weather.
There seems to be a media preference for reporting problems, no doubt fueled by all the advertising done by the big auto makers. Of course nobody will
Re:Who Cares? (Score:5, Insightful)
Tesla (and battery powered cars in general) being fundamentally broken in cold weather...
A problem unique to the Tesla charging cables supplied in Norway is not "fundamentally broken" let alone having any significance to battery powered cars in general.
Tesla just needs to fix the problem and distribute new cables to Norwegian customers. Big fucking deal.
Methinks you have an axe to grind, and truth isn't important to you.
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Why is every Tesla fart reported on ./?
Because its firggin obvious no internal combustion engines have starting problems below freezing.
So its necessary to point out every liability about this new fangled electric car so that buyers put that silly idea out of their head. Besides, big auto will take advertisements in your newspaper, blog site, etc when you have Tesla failure stories. Now double check those jumper cables, then go crank it over while I spray some ether down the intake.
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Because its firggin obvious no internal combustion engines have starting problems below freezing.
It's not a 'starting problem', it's a 'refuelling problem'. I've refuelled my car at 40 below zero before, with no problems.
And it starts at 30 below zero if I forget to plug the heater in, though it's not very happy about that.
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Because its firggin obvious no internal combustion engines have starting problems below freezing.
It's not a 'starting problem', it's a 'refuelling problem'. I've refuelled my car at 40 below zero before, with no problems.
And it starts at 30 below zero if I forget to plug the heater in, though it's not very happy about that.
Yeah, and I've had gas line freeze at 10 below, 20 minutes after filling the tank, cars that simply refuse to start, fought for head block heater parking spaces at work, etc. Anyone who has lived in cold country who doesn't have a cold weather car horror story doesn't own a car.
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Anyone who has lived in cold country who doesn't have a cold weather car horror story doesn't own a car.
Wow. Apparently I don't own a car. I must have imagined driving it this morning.
Re:Proof that electric cars can never work (Score:4, Insightful)
And the reason this story is in the news is because internal combustion engines never have problems in cold weather.
I don't think most people are unaware or haven't experienced cold weather related problems with traditional ICE powered cars. We also know most of the time (modern cars anyway) they work just fine even in very cold conditions. On the other hand many of us have little or no experience with pure electric cars. So the failure modes and frequencies are in fact interesting whatever they may be, because my guess is at some point many of us will own an all electric car.
Re:Proof that electric cars can never work (Score:5, Interesting)
I live in Chicago, Illinois, where the outdoor temperature last night was -15 F. Windchill, -40F.
I had to promise my car that I'd wax it every weekend this summer if she would just start this morning.
My wife's car, 10 years newer than mine, did not start at all. Heavy snow followed by deep freeze is hell on internal combustion engines that are not kept in a heated garage overnight. I was sarcastically trying to make the point that suddenly these journalists have discovered that cars don't do well in record cold temperatures, but only the electric ones. I don't feel like reading this press release, but I'll bet the story didn't mention that probably 1/3 of the cars in Chicago couldn't start this morning.
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I'm really tired of these articles popping up before the issue is fully diagnosed.
Would you feel the same way if the story was about a problem with Apple or Microsoft gear?
Re: If you live in Norway, stick with proven tech (Score:3, Informative)
Do you live in Norway?
Do you have any basis for making recommendations for what Norwegians should do?
The Tesla actually provides a very good value proposition in Norway because of the way petrol-based cars are taxed (and electrical cars are not). Hence the Tesla being so popular in Norway.
Also, diesel-based cars can struggle in cold weather. For instance p, whenever I go on a mountain trip in winter in Norway I need to make sure that I fill petrol in the cold part of the country as the diesel being sold the
Re:If you live in Norway, stick with proven tech (Score:5, Informative)
Perhaps you shouldn't give such strong advice on topics you are not that familiar with?
Re:If you live in Norway, stick with proven tech (Score:4, Informative)
Let's face it. Norway is often very cold in the winter.
Not particularly cold, given how far north we are due to the Gulf stream and particularly if you live near the coastline - and Norway is a lot of coastline. In the capital, the lowest temp last year was -17.2C, just above 0F, the average in the winter months is just below freezing. True, if I pick one of the coldest cities on the coldest nights it might be -30C, but that's rare.
If you fuck up and buy a 'green' car that won't start in the cold, then you die in the cold.
Oh please, it might be a big inconvienience calling a tow truck but nobody's going to die. If you're at home and it won't charge, stay home. If you're at a charging station there will be houses nearby. And if it breaks down in the middle of nowhere on a night with -30C then you're equally screwed as in an ICE car.
And there is this briefly mentioned problem of the fucking Norwegian electrical connectors not mating with standard electric car connectors...
Here we're talking about quite regular home connectors, we use the "Schuko" plug used in most of Europe or alternatively the IEC 60309 industrial plugs for faster charging, both very standard in Europe but different than the US. I guess that's what they're talking about since there's few other Teslas on the road in the colder parts of Europe.
The charging problems mentioned here have by the way been solved [newsinenglish.no] in a software patch already, Norwegian papers covered that on last saturday. With charging stations popping up in more and more places, rather abundant and cheap electric power and very nice tax breaks on electric cars I can assure you Tesla will continue to sell well in Norway.
Re:I call bullshit (Score:5, Informative)
Norway, on the other hand, has 230 V between the phases and is completely isolated from the ground. With a perfectly balanced load you can expect ~127 V ground-phase, but the voltage can stray far away from that. This is an IT system (Insulated Terra). The Tesla charging cable is quite picky with the grounding, so it isn't working as it should.
This has nothing to do with the connectors, which are the same in Norway as in Germany or France.