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Google and Microsoft Both Want To Stop Dual-Boot Windows/Android Device 153

Posted by Soulskill
from the partners-in-nope dept.
An anonymous reader writes "The laptop has undergone many changes over the past decade. At various times, netbooks, ultrabooks, and Chromebooks have been en vogue. Over the past several months, we've seen signs of the next step in the laptop's evolution: Android/Windows dual-boot laptops. Several companies have built these machines already, including Asus and its upcoming Transformer Book Duet TD300. However, neither Google nor Microsoft seem to want such an unholy marriage of operating systems, and they've both pressured Asus to kill off the dual-boot product lines. Asus has now complied. 'Google has little incentive to approve dual-OS models, since that could help Microsoft move into mobile devices where Android is dominant. ... Microsoft has its own reasons for not wanting to share space on computers with Google, particularly on business-oriented desktop and laptop PCs that could give the Internet giant an entry point into a Microsoft stronghold. Computer makers that make dual-OS machines risk jeopardizing a flow of marketing funds from Microsoft that are an important economic force in the low-margin PC business.'"
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Google and Microsoft Both Want To Stop Dual-Boot Windows/Android Devices

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  • by Anonymous Coward on Friday March 14, 2014 @03:35PM (#46486111)

    So neither perspective or any reason has the customers interests in mind.

    • by Njovich (553857) on Friday March 14, 2014 @03:44PM (#46486187)

      Quite the contrary, if the customer didn't want this, they wouldn't care about it.

      • by lgw (121541)

        Let's remember who Google's customers are (hint: it's not the users). I think Google is specifically thinking of their customers in this move. It's the opposition from MS that baffles me.

        • by rtb61 (674572)

          Both are working to target the same concept, tying the operating system to the device. They both hate the idea of the consumer believing the operating system that came with the device is disposable and can be readily replaced with the OS of your choice, say a flavour of Linux. Two OS's on a device, hmm why not three or more specifically why not replace those two with a third alternate OS. So basically both companies are using the size and predatory power to try to keep other Operating systems out of the ma

    • If these guys had customers in mind, they wouldn't make a half baked half assed hybrid between windows and android.

      Not that I'm slamming either, but, this makes about as much sense as a toaster refrigerator combo.

      • by roc97007 (608802) on Friday March 14, 2014 @04:02PM (#46486389) Journal

        I dunno, I see it as a toaster meatloaf peeler combo. In an environment where your job required a meatloaf peeler (although you don't see the use) and what you personally really need is to toast some bread.

        Ok, that sounded better in my head.

        • Actually, that made perfect sense. AND I thought it was funny. I have mod points, but wanted to let you know beyond +1 Funny or +1 Insightful

          Thanks

      • by FatdogHaiku (978357) on Friday March 14, 2014 @04:45PM (#46486873)

        If these guys had customers in mind, they wouldn't make a half baked half assed hybrid between windows and android.

        Androws!

        no no no, wait...

        Windroid!

      • by slapout (93640)

        It's more like having a refrigerator with a freezer.

    • by Skuld-Chan (302449) on Friday March 14, 2014 @04:41PM (#46486835)

      I really don't care about dual booting - in my experience the machine spends most of its time in one environment, and the one time you do switch its got a months worth of patches to install.

      • by tlhIngan (30335)

        I really don't care about dual booting - in my experience the machine spends most of its time in one environment, and the one time you do switch its got a months worth of patches to install.

        Not a problem here. If you spend all your time in Windows that is, because you can bet the Android side won't get a lick of patches!

    • by Anonymous Coward

      To be honest, dual-boot has traditionally been a very bad user experience as each OS has different ideas about where user files should go, how permissions on the filesystem should work, etc. Each OS is so isolated from each other that getting your files across OSes is a total pain. Not to mention the fact that reboots are incredibly destructive to user state anyway - I have three or four OS installs on my desktop and I only bother using the Ubuntu install because it's the most balanced for my needs. I don't

    • by nurb432 (527695)

      As long as you dont have alternatives, the customer's interests come last. There is a line you dont want to cross when you start to lose customers, but that point hasn't been reached.

    • by xystren (522982)
      Yeah, just sell me the hardware and let my choose my OS or OSes. I Would be perfectly happy with that. If I want multiboot, I'm make my system multiboot. What is this crap about Microsoft/Google not wanting to share space with Google? WTF - it isn't even their hardware, it's the purchaser's hardware!
  • I think I have my next project, then? Does anyone want to buy one of these?
  • by Anonymous Coward

    Fuck Google AND Microsoft.

  • by Anonymous Coward

    why not just spend the hour that it takes to set up your own linux/windows dual boot?

    • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Then why not spend the 100ms that it takes to press Shift key at the beginning of a sentence?
    • If you're going to spend the time, why not configure your own virtual environment, where you can run both simultaneously?

      Finally, a valid use for the Windows key: to switch your machine in and out of Windows!

  • by Anonymous Coward

    Don't make any mistake about it anymore. Google has been falling into the old footsteps of 1990s Microsoft for some time. They're moving to close source anything of value, they're moving to prevent anyone who isn't on board with Google from making decent Android devices, and they're moving to prevent multi-boot.

    Welcome to 1999. Google is evil.

    • And in the meantime, Apple had Boot Camp since early versions of OS X and are also providing the Windows drivers for their own computers.

      Welcome to 2014. Apple are the good guys.

      • Eh..... (Score:4, Informative)

        by mfwitten (1906728) on Friday March 14, 2014 @03:59PM (#46486357)

        * Apple has Boot Camp because they have to allow Dual Booting in order to lure in the majority of computer users—Windows users. They sure as hell aren't helping Linux users out.

        * Apple introduced Boot Camp when they were still user-friendly—before they started constructing their walled guarden (located at 1984 Infinite Loop).

        * Of course Apple provides the Windows drivers for Apple's own machines; every vendor that supports Windows has always had to do so.

        • Can't you use Boot Camp for Linux or any other operating system?

          • by mfwitten (1906728)

            Just because you can does not mean it's supported.

            Guess what? It's not supported.

        • Re:Eh..... (Score:4, Interesting)

          by sunderland56 (621843) on Friday March 14, 2014 @04:18PM (#46486537)

          * Apple has Boot Camp because they have to allow Dual Booting in order to lure in the majority of computer users

          Most users who want to use Windows software on a Mac will use some virtual solution like Parallels; then they can run Windows and MacOSX software at the same time, without waiting 5 minutes for a reboot.

          Really, I think someone deep inside Apple did it as a prank. It is great fun to hang out at Starbucks, and watch the reaction of all the other MacBook users when they suddenly realize that you are running Windows.... on a MacBook.... heads have been known to explode.

          * Of course Apple provides the Windows drivers for Apple's own machines; every vendor that supports Windows has always had to do so.

          There are enough drivers built in to a standard Windows distribution to allow most common hardware to just run, no special vendor drivers needed.

      • by Kremmy (793693)
        What was the cover charge on that one again?

        It's really time to move to an honestly open computing model, so we can rely on long term supported systems that aren't being screwed with on a whim by people wearing business hats.
      • by tlhIngan (30335) <.slashdot. .at. .worf.net.> on Friday March 14, 2014 @04:02PM (#46486379)

        And in the meantime, Apple had Boot Camp since early versions of OS X and are also providing the Windows drivers for their own computers.

        Welcome to 2014. Apple are the good guys.

        And having installed Macs using Boot Camp, it's one of the slickest ways to install Windows. The tool basically creates a boot (DVD/USB/etc) with the drivers slipstreamed in and everything, so you install Windows and everything just works.

        Previous versions of Boot Camp did require you to install the drivers after Windows, but modern versions slipstream them in, so after installing, everything is loaded. No need to hunt through Windows Update and websites downloading and installing drivers.

        And no crapware, either. Only Apple can make installing Windows easy.

        • by Algae_94 (2017070)

          Maybe I'm missing out on something here, but I find installing Windows to be extremely easy all around. It's been years since I've had to hunt down drivers after an install.

          • by cbhacking (979169)

            Some people think still using 12-year-old OSes is a good idea.

            "And having used Apple's AutoEngineStarterCrank, it's one of the slickest ways to start your car. Sure, early Apple cars required you to turn the crank by hand, but these days you just get out, plug the AutoEngineStartCrank into the front of the car, and it does the work for you!"

            As "no crapware", somebody hasn't looked very closely at the Apple drivers... Feature-crippled and riddled with security vulnerabilities compared to the standard ones th

          • My personal experience is that installing Windows often runs into snags.

      • Except Apples drivers for Windows are really bad, not fully featured and they regularly deprecate versions of Windows on their kit for no reasons - for instance Windows 8 on 2006 Quad Core Mac Pros with 16GB ram, or indeed any 64bit install of Windows on that hardware will cause Bootcamp to say "nope", despite it working perfectly well.

      • by cbhacking (979169)

        Seriously crappy drivers, mind you (I've found trivial EoP-to-kernel-from standard-user bugs in them), but at least they exist...

  • by mfwitten (1906728) on Friday March 14, 2014 @03:45PM (#46486195)

    "When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him." —Jonathan Swift

  • Personally I don't care what OS I use as long as I can accomplish the task at hand. I find all OS's missing some functionality. Some do it deliberately and others are missing the developers and/or resources. Android is my preferred mobile platform and OSX is my referred desktop platform. As it stands now both will lose from this choice since I may go for the Air instead of a combo.

  • we've seen signs of the next step in the laptop's evolution

    Who would want a dual boot a laptop with an OS that has been dead for almost 20 years?

    • NeXTstep is alive and well; it's just called OS X now. Mac users can use Boot Camp to switch between OS X and Windows. I don't know how well it'd work with Android/x86 though.
  • by sootman (158191) on Friday March 14, 2014 @03:47PM (#46486227) Homepage Journal

    Open! Right? [twitter.com]

    • I think they shouldn't forbid vendors from going this route. But it seems like a major waste of money. Its always going to be more expensive than either a Chromebook or a Windows netbook.

      The major problem it has is it needs to pay the Microsoft tax to exist. That is no way to displace Microsoft from the market.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      More like "but who will get paid for the patent licensing if it's both a Windows and Android device?"

    • FWIW, it doesn't matter if Google buys a baby mulching building (all running OpenBSD, natch'...), starts selling your information to advertisers (I mean really, not selling services to advertisers that work more effectively because Google has information about you, I mean actually selling your name, address, and fetishes to anyone who wants to advertise with them), arranges a Presidential assassination, blows up the Empire State Building, and worst of all, builds a private monorail to ferry employees betwe

  • Well, you know.

  • Alrighty kids, now go back to your sandboxes and let the big boys do the real work on the Linux systems.
    • All sounds good, until you need to lug around either a heavy bulky laptop or spend a lot of money for a light one, with the enough battery so you can go around with a full work station for real work. When you are web browsing and running simple apps most of the time. You are better of getting a cheap tablet or chromebook with a Data Plan and have your Linux running on a server where you can access for nearly anywhere.

      So if you are going to access your server from a low end thin client. What should your co

      • until you need to lug around either a heavy bulky laptop or spend a lot of money for a light one

        I learned on Scroogled.com a couple weeks ago that 10" Windows laptops are back in production.

        You are better of getting a cheap tablet or chromebook with a Data Plan and have your Linux running on a server where you can access for nearly anywhere.

        If you're going to just use a Chromebook as an X11 or VNC terminal for a GNU/Linux VPS, how much does a data plan for that cost over the 48-month expected service life of a laptop? And how well does 3D graphics (e.g. Blender) tunnel over such a connection?

  • If you think it's a bad experience when you have a single OS (plus first-party apps) vendor, and a separate manufacturer (e.g.: my Lenovo and it's bevy of task-tray items), try it now with two fully supported OSs out of the box.

    While I agree that it sucks that Google and Microsoft both are trying to defeat this initiative, I can also say with a 95% certainty that even if the both condoned it, it would still be a really bad experience.

    Google's hypocrisy with android being "Open" is what's really exposed here

  • If your product relies on a 3rd-party to actually attract customers (and/or make a profit), your business model is flawed and you're doomed.
    .
    • If your product relies on a 3rd-party to actually attract customers (and/or make a profit), your business model is flawed and you're doomed.

      Are petrol stations doomed because they rely on automakers to bring in customers? Are game console makers* doomed because they rely on third-party developers to attract customers, and vice versa?

      * Other than Nintendo, whose consoles rely heavily on the first-party lineup.

      • by rainer_d (115765)

        If your product relies on a 3rd-party to actually attract customers (and/or make a profit), your business model is flawed and you're doomed.

        Are petrol stations doomed because they rely on automakers to bring in customers?

        Petrol works for all cars.
        Software and OSs doesn't work on all hardware. Esp. mobile.
        In addition, petrol stations usually don't get kickbacks from car-manufacturers.
        AFAIK, though, a couple of years ago, independent petrol-stations in the UK went bust when supermarket-chains started selling gas below cost for a couple of months...

        But hey, if you think that ASUS, Acer et.al. have a viable, future-proof business model: go ahead, their stock is publicly traded ;-)

  • That is Latin for Devide and conquor.

  • Nobody wants this.
  • I am suddenly struck by the urge to dual boot on my 8.1 laptop. Is Android-x86 prefect and wonderful?
  • Information just wants to be free.

    Or at least 1/20th the cost we get overcharged for substandard service in the US while real First World nations get real Internet, real dual boot, and real security.

    You can always dual boot the other way and not "tell" the Win side about the removable 2 TB SDD you have.

  • Seems like neither Google nor Microsoft wants to compete with the other, so they partitioned the PC market with Google getting the mobile part and Microsoft the desktop. Business as usual.

  • Begins with fucking over your customers for selfish reasons.

  • We could have given their bastard children..
    Metroid
    Winroids
    Andows

  • for people, consumer organisations and politicians to promote dual (or more) boot devices...

  • Ten pounds of shit in a five pound bag. Ten pounds of OS in a five pound box.

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