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A Technical Look Inside TempleOS 284

Posted by timothy from the not-big-and-fancy dept.
jones_supa writes: TempleOS has become somewhat of a legend in the operating system community. Its sole author, Terry A. Davis, is a special kind of person, who has a tendency to appear in various places with a burst of strange comments. Nevertheless, he has spent the past 12 years creating a new operating system from scratch, and has shipped a functional product. An article takes a constructive technical look at the internals of TempleOS: installation, shell, file explorer, hypertext system, custom HolyC programming language, and interaction with hardware. The OS ships with a suite of several tools and demos as well. To see the sheer amount of content that's been written here over the years, to see such effort expended on a labor of love, is wonderfully heart-warming. In many ways TempleOS seems similar to systems such as the Xerox Alto, Oberon, and Plan 9; an all-inclusive system that blurs the lines between programs and documents.
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A Technical Look Inside TempleOS More

A Technical Look Inside TempleOS

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  • Interesting person (Score:5, Interesting)

    by spiritplumber ( 1944222 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @10:27AM (#49875915) Homepage
    This guy hangs out on hackernews, he's... well frankly he's a bit of a religious nut, but he doesn't preach at you or anything (unless you ask). Definitely a work of passion.

    • Re:Interesting person (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Eravnrekaree ( 467752 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @11:18AM (#49876381)

      People may have different religious views than you, but, so what, its a free country. The manner in which in this society we have this oversensitization to being offended and against someones views and opinions offending someone is being used to shut down free speech and the free expression and exchange of ideas and information. Its actually the worst with the leftists who are most intolerant of anyone who does not agree with their views on matters and use "being offended" by Christians to basically attack and shut down anyone who is a professed Christain from being able to talk about their own beliefs and profess it. There's in an old phrase, I disagree with what you say but I respect your right to say it. So many people today, especially those on the left, are becoming increasingly opposed to people being able to express themselves and use their own perverse, twisted and insane defintions of "tolerance" to shut down any dissenting or opposing viewpoints, especially if you are a Christian and someone doesnt like your viewpoints, you are accused and labelled as being "intolerant" and "hateful" just by expressing your own viewpoints and religious ideas, not by trying to shut down others ability to express their own. What is going on here is that "intolerance" is now expressing a view that other people think are offensive, rather than trying to shutdown others peoples ability to express their own views. They have in effect turned everything upside down. Now if it is "tolerant" to suppress and censor anyone who says something you offend with, and "intolerant" for anyone to express views you disagree with. By basically saying that if you disagree with leftist atheists, muslims or whatever, you are somehow "intolerant", leftists are shutting down free speech and claiming to be "tolerant" when in fact they are "intolerant".

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by avgjoe62 ( 558860 )
        Intolerant is baking a cake for a person that's on their fourth marriage while refusing to bake one for a lesbian couple that is finally able to marry after twenty years together.

        • If this is not an example of first world problems, I'm not sure what is.

        • Re:Interesting person (Score:5, Insightful)

          by antiperimetaparalogo ( 4091871 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @11:56AM (#49876793)

          Intolerant is baking a cake for a person that's on their fourth marriage while refusing to bake one for a lesbian couple that is finally able to marry after twenty years together.

          "Intolerant" is defining "intolerant" as: "Intolerant is baking a cake for a person that's on their fourth marriage while refusing to bake one for a lesbian couple that is finally able to marry after twenty years together"...

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by MSG ( 12810 )

            "Intolerant" is defining "intolerant" as: "Intolerant is baking a cake for a person that's on their fourth marriage while refusing to bake one for a lesbian couple that is finally able to marry after twenty years together"...

            Passing moral judgement on the act may be intolerant, but providing an example of behavior which is objectively intolerant is not, itself, an intolerant behavior.

            • "Intolerant" is defining "intolerant" as: "Intolerant is baking a cake for a person that's on their fourth marriage while refusing to bake one for a lesbian couple that is finally able to marry after twenty years together"...

              Passing moral judgement on the act may be intolerant, but providing an example of behavior which is objectively intolerant is not, itself, an intolerant behavior.

              "objectively" ...?! [slashdot.org]

        • Re:Interesting person (Score:5, Insightful)

          by Eravnrekaree ( 467752 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @12:22PM (#49876997)

          Apples and oranges. there is a tendancy to compare a speech issue to what the law actually is regarding a non-speech issue. The gay wedding cake issue is not about speech, the baker didnt deny the gay couple any free speech rights. The baker was also not playing cop, businesses generally have a right to refuse services (not that I am wholly in agreement with this), and there are exceptions to that, the case concerns how far those exceptions go. About the issue regarding legality of acts in relation to speech, For instance, you have every right to suggest that say, driving 200 mph on residential streets should be legal, that its not legal does not mean your free speech rights have been violated to hold your own opinion on this matter. Free speech does not give you the right to do things that you can use your free speech rights to advocate should be legal. Its important with the wedding cake issue, was that they were not refusing service to all gays for any service, only the cake which was being used for the weddings. Obviously, to refuse service to gays for say, table seating in a restaurant, is a situation with different circumstances. Not all christians support the idea of refusing service to gays on the issue of providing a cake, basically becuase many christians have a view that its not our position to judge them, even though it is against the tenants of the religion. Not all christian denominations oppose gay unions, either, if you are gay there are several Christian denominations to choose from that would accept you and hold your ceremony. The people that were pressing these buttons on the gay wedding cake issue had plenty of bakers who would bake a gay wedding cake for them, they actually went from baker to baker to find one who one who would refuse to do it so they could then castigate them. Personally, I do not agree with refusing to make a wedding cake for gays, if I am running a business and someone comes to me wanting a lawful product or service I would not deny it to them on account of their sexual preferences. It is my view that gay marriage should not be legal, you cannot just change the definitions of words. I am supportive of civil unions for gays that give them the same benefits, they can call it a wedding if they want but thats not what it should officially be titled on paper. Yes, its about definitions of words, words do mean things, you cannot call a cat a dog and just change those definitions willy nilly, the very definition of marriage is a union between man and women for the purpose of producing children, it is important that Marriage mean something and have a clear definition for the function it is mean to encourage, to be something that is to promote family values as this is a critical bedrock for a civilization.

          • I would also like to add that my previous comments regarding the loss of free speech in our society was about civility and issues regarding etiquette rather than exclusively the law. Obviously, etiquette and law are different things, I do lament the loss of the ability to openly profess ones views generally in a society, regardless as to the legal status and condition around such speech issues. On the gay wedding cake issue, I can see there is a problem there and the denial of service is not something I agr

          • the baker didnt deny the gay couple any free speech rights.

            That's backwards. The argument is on the baker's free speech in creating the artwork (a form of speech/expression) or not creating it. There's a difference between baking something (utilitarian) and designing something.

        • Re:Interesting person (Score:5, Insightful)

          by bobbied ( 2522392 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @12:39PM (#49877163)

          Intolerant is baking a cake for a person that's on their fourth marriage while refusing to bake one for a lesbian couple that is finally able to marry after twenty years together.

          Actually, intolerance is refusing to let people hold their own views and forcing them to act in violation of these views. Intolerance is forcing others to accept YOUR views over theirs.

          Not baking a cake doesn't prevent anybody from getting married... Not delivering pizza to the reception prevent people from getting married either. Yet both are seen as intolerance that must be stamped out for the good of all.

          So who's really being intolerant? The people who can still get married like they say they wanted, but have to find another place to get their cake and pizza or the baker and pizzeria owner that is being forced into doing something they think is wrong? Tolerance says, OK, I don't agree with you, but I can take my business elsewhere so I will.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by DarkOx ( 621550 )

          Maybe it is maybe it isn't. The question is why do you and honestly why did the couple care. This isn't like civil rights battles of the past with Jim Crowe and such.

          If blacks were being turned away from a specific lunch counter there would have been no big movement the issue was they were truned away at EVERY counter. We don't have that problem today, certainly not with the GLBTt community.

          The fact the so much outrage over the incident exists proves that. They could said well "a fuck you too than" and

          • The question is why do you and honestly why did the couple care.

            Why does the nature of the relationship of their customers matter to the bakers?

            Do you vet your clients for morality?

            if the American Nazi party tried to hire me to do some work for them I'd turn them down.

            And in your mind, those two 60 year-old women who just got legally married are equivalent to Nazis?

            I THINK WE HAVE A WINNER, HERE! Can someone reach into the Godwin Prize Bag and see what our contestant has won?

      • Re:Interesting person (Score:5, Insightful)

        by swb ( 14022 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @11:41AM (#49876623)

        Believe in god(s), demon(s), flying saucers, Cthulhu, animal spirits, whatever the fuck you want. I really don't care. ...until you want to shape the lives of others with rules or demands originated from your beliefs, at that point, kindly shut the fuck up and go back to whatever hole you crawled out of.

        And I'm universally bigoted in this regard. Christian wants prayer or creationism in school? Fuck you. Muslim wants special meals served or no drawings of Mohammed? Fuck you. Buddhist doesn't want me to squash bugs in my house? Fuck you. Orthodox Jew won't sit next to a woman on a public airplane? Fuck you.

        If your beliefs require anyone else to change their behavior in public, your beliefs are broken.

        I will (sort of) agree that some groups (and not just the left) likes to use certain buzzwords to shutdown debate. Not 100% in agreement with some aspect of Israeli government policy? No, you're not an anti-semite.

        • What's your position on lesbian cake?

          • Re: (Score:3)

            by swb ( 14022 )

            I think the entire homoesexual marriage "debate" is a fraud.

            For all intents and purposes, "marriage" is merely a state-sponsored package of legal rights and obligations. Why shouldn't homoesexuals get married? But then again, I feel the same way about plural marriages. If 3+ people want to be married, who says they shouldn't?

            That being said, I've always been surprised that homoesexuals WANT to get married. I had always figured that the last thing they would want to do is buy into the patriarchal and rel

        • I really don't care. ...until you want to shape the lives of others with rules or demands originated from your beliefs, at that point, kindly shut the fuck up and go back to whatever hole you crawled out of.

          If your beliefs require anyone else to change their behavior in public, your beliefs are broken.

          I think your beliefs might be broken. When's the last time you had them looked at?

      • Re: (Score:3)

        by aitikin ( 909209 )
        I'm reading the comment your replied again and again. I literally see nothing wrong with it and nothing to prompt such a...harsh response. He's a religious nut. By all means, everything I've ever seen pertaining to him indicates this. I don't understand where your rant is coming from. Even my most adamantly religious friends consider this guy a nut...

      • People may have different religious views than you, but, so what, its a free country. The manner in which in this society we have this oversensitization to being offended and against someones views and opinions offending someone is being used to shut down free speech and the free expression and exchange of ideas and information. Its actually the worst with the leftists who are most intolerant of anyone who does not agree with their views on matters and use "being offended" by Christians to basically attack

  • holy holy holy (Score:5, Funny)

    by Rich_Lather ( 925834 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @10:36AM (#49875991)
    Will this operating system be completely free of daemons?

  • Before you comment saying he's a racist asshole (Score:5, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @10:45AM (#49876039)

    Keep in mind this guy has schizophrenia, the word salads and bursts of inappropriate language are literally part of his illness, so try to focus on his technical achievements rather than take offence to his language.

    • You think you can halt the courts of public opinion?

    • Maybe he just likes calling people niggers?

    • > so try to focus on his technical achievements

      Like thinking memory protection is pointless?

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Jeremi ( 14640 )

        Like thinking memory protection is pointless?

        It is pointless, in a single-user environment, where all the software was written by the same guy, with no networking, who never makes coding errors.

        Admittedly that's a pretty specific use case, but it works for him. It reminds me of coding on the Amiga, back in the day. Bad pointer dereference? Oops, total OS crash and reboot, and if you're really lucky now your filesystem is corrupted and you've lost the source code you were working on. That'll teach ya... ;)

  • Origins (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @10:50AM (#49876083)

    - Prof told me to write an OS and I wrote Linux.

    - God told me to write an OS and I wrote TempleOS.

    - Devil told me to write an OS and I wrote Windows.

  • Hmm... (Score:5, Interesting)

    by EmeraldBot ( 3513925 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @10:57AM (#49876143)

    TempleOS has always struck me very similar to the ancient LISP machines, the ones that everyone loves so much. It's such a shame that the OS will forever be held back by its author, as well as some of its more practical limitations (*cough* no sound support *cough*), because it has some very good ideas. It particular, the indexing and documentation system are just overall fantastic; Java is widely lauded for its excellent documentation features, but it doesn't have anything compared to this. The shell is another really awesome idea; a multimedia shell is something that I've actually never considered, to be totally honest, it never crossed my mind. Imagine a shell you could just live in; one in which you could browse your system, listen to music, do your email, etc. all without ever having to leave your coding environment. I know emacs exists, but it's not quite on this level - I wish other operating systems like FreeBSD or Linux had an equivalent.

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by adolf ( 21054 )

      The shell is another really awesome idea; a multimedia shell is something that I've actually never considered, to be totally honest, it never crossed my mind. Imagine a shell you could just live in; one in which you could browse your system, listen to music, do your email, etc. all without ever having to leave your coding environment. I know emacs exists, but it's not quite on this level - I wish other operating systems like FreeBSD or Linux had an equivalent.

      Sounds a lot like how I used bash twenty years

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by Rinikusu ( 28164 )

      Take a look at Terminology, then. https://www.youtube.com/watch?... [youtube.com]

  • Didn't we do this already? (Score:3, Informative)

    by gstoddart ( 321705 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @10:58AM (#49876163) Homepage

    Or is this a different bit of publicity than this [slashdot.org]?

    Is this to be a semi-annual thing?

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by krkhan ( 1071096 )

      While this is creepy, and might be interesting in a clinical sense ... why have we started covering the crazy end of the tech spectrum? I'm afraid this just reads like "batshit crazy guy writes gibberish OS, come look at our ads".

      I would've agreed if TFA wasn't posted yesterday and did not add substance to the story. As it turns out, it's a fascinating read and really does a wonderful job of finally doing a technical piece on TempleOS instead of focusing on the creator's mental illness.

  • "blurs the lines between programs and documents" (Score:5, Funny)

    by tlambert ( 566799 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @11:00AM (#49876183)

    "blurs the lines between programs and documents"

    Yeah. So do Word macro viruses and Outlook email exploits.

  • Unified Hypertext is impressive (among others) (Score:4, Interesting)

    by CrashNBrn ( 1143981 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @11:10AM (#49876295)
    I saw TempleOS on BetaNews -- at least 5 years ago now. Never had the time nor inclination to see what it was all about, as it looked just a little bit too Old-School (the EGA/VGA 16 color). This "technical look" is actually pretty interesting, especially the way the system is built on and uses hyperlinks, the file format is described as

    HTML, JSON, XML, shell scripts, source files, text files – TempleOS replaces all of these via one unified hypertext representation.

    Maybe the WhatWG or W3C could learn a thing or three.

  • Ouch (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward

    Relevant quote from article, stating that everything in TempleOS runs in ring 0, has no concept of users or permissions:

    He [Terry] argues that Linux is designed for a use case that most people don’t have. Linux, he says, aims to be a 1970s mainframe, with 100 users connected at once. If a crash in one users’ programs could take down all the others, then obviously that would be bad. But for a personal computer, with just one user, this makes no sense. Instead the OS should empower the single user

  • Nice article (Score:3, Insightful)

    by juanfgs ( 922455 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @11:26AM (#49876471)

    It's really interesting how people jump in the bandwagon of bashing this because of it's author. But this article really points out things that I wanted to see but I missed from running templeOS, which are the interesting part that it's author created.

    It's wonderful to see how when freeing a developer of current constraints of accepted programming practices it can come up with crazy but interesting and admittedly cool ideas.

    The DolDoc was particularly interesting for me, mostly in a world where we have HTML everywhere plugged to a VM, DolDoc seems like a different approach (which I'm sure has plenty of flaws) to be considered at least as food for thought for future solutions.

    And last but not least, I really respect someone who can do this kind of stuff. Even if I may not agree with his ideas, I'm glad that he spends time in actually creating stuff which is more that I can say about a lot of people.

  • In: redneck, US-type religious nutcase. Out: redneck religious nutcase OS.

    • >I have imposed a 100,000 line of code limit for all time.

      That actually doesn't sound like a bad idea.

    • Very impressive, writing large amounts of structured code considering the gibberish in the comments.
      How is this possible?
      • I once had a colleague who suffered of a mild to moderate form of autism. He was an excellent coder, but could hardly do anything else than that. So.... a combination of autism and schizophrenia ?
      • When commenting there is most likely more stress which causes word salad to occur more often. Coding is actually being in a serene environment. At least in my experience.

  • Twice conversion to the other side (Score:3)

    by krkhan ( 1071096 ) on Tuesday June 09, 2015 @12:40PM (#49877179) Homepage
    Interestingly, the man claimed to be an atheist [vice.com] at some point.

    He’d grown up Catholic, but later embraced atheism. "I thought the brain was a computer," Davis says, "And so I had no need for a soul." He saw himself as a scientific materialist; he believes that metaphor—the brain as a computer—has done more to increase the number of atheists than anything by Darwin. He still considers himself scientifically minded. "Today I find the people most similar to me are atheist-scientist people," he says. "The difference is God has talked to me, so I'm basically like an atheist who God has talked to."

  • This is the new name of Losetheos.
    (As in, "Lose the Operating System").

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