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Technology

Drive a Greasecar - DIY Biodiesel 387

Posted by michael from the smells-like-french-fries dept.
TinyTim writes "Sure, you could buy expensive biodiesel for you car - or you can hack your diesel to run on filtered vegetable oil. Kits take a few hours to install and cost about $800, but you can get your fuel free from restaurant deep-fryers (the filters are ~$10/2000mi). Supposedly no loss of performance or mileage, and you can change between diesel and veggie oil with the flick of a switch. A previous article mentioned the theoretical possibility, but it looks like kits are now available from greasecar.com."
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Drive a Greasecar - DIY Biodiesel More

Drive a Greasecar - DIY Biodiesel

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  • So.... (Score:2, Funny)

    by Scrab ( 573004 )
    Would I have to cook my food in diesel?

  • Many Users (Score:2, Interesting)

    by cide1 ( 126814 )
    Once many people start using this, you wont be able to get the fuel for free. It is free now, because grease is considered waste. Once it has a value, restaurants will charge for it. Besides, this is a short term solution to a long term problem.
    • I might be missing something so fill me in if I am...
      You stated: ".... a short term solution to a long term problem."

      Now to me, vegetable oil is a re-newable resource... I guess there are worse things in this world then an influx of veggie growers?

      • Re:Many Users (Score:2, Interesting)

        by KingKire64 ( 321470 )
        I think the problem is is that there isnt enough land for the amount of ppl that would use this. COuld you imagine how much Vegetables would be needed if everyone in america drove these type cars. And thats just America. And plants are a renewable resource but they take time to grow
      • The amount of hydrocarbons we expend on creating a gallon of canola oil is supposedly more than the equivalent of a gallon of canola oil.... If this is true, then by switching to to using (virgin) canola oil instead of diesel fuel, we'd actually end up burning more hydrocarbons than if we just burned the diesel fuel directly.

        Using Canola is really only a positive thing if you presume that the used fryer fat would have been dumped in a landfill instead of being otherwise recycled. Once demand exceeds used-oil supply, canola based engines becomes a losing proposition.

      • I encountered a real life example of this with anti-freeze. During the course of 1 year, anti-freeze went from about $2 to about $12 for the same sized container. the difference was that a main ingredient (glycol I think but it's been a long time) had long been considered a waste product, mostly thrown away but some of it given to the anti-freeze manufacturers but then somebody came up with an alternative use and the anti-freeze companies had to start paying real money for it.

        Vegetable oil would likely be the same though I'm sure some restaurants would increase their push on fatty fried foods in order to maximize revenues. B)

    • it does have value.. the companies that collect the oil from a grease trap (for a fee) then filter it and sell it to cosmetics companies... :) French Fries one day, Eye Liner the next!
    • Actually, some people have started Biodiesel companies and are already buying used grease. I was shocked to find that most places are already selling thier grease.

  • Spot on the Driveway.. (Score:4, Funny)

    by lionchild ( 581331 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @03:33PM (#3918983) Journal
    And if you thought you were leaking oil before, now you have to identify if it's veggie oil, or if it's motor oil.

    I suppose you could try tasting it..you might get to know your fuel by taste! Bob's Burger Stand and his unmistakable motor fuel..er, deep fat frier grease!

    I can see it now: You drive into your local Drive-Thru and order a burger, fries, shake and 5 gallons of their day-old fryer grease!
    • Actaully, that isn't far off from reality. Pretty much all fast food chains have to pay someone to take the used veggie oil to some disposal facility. If you ask the managers if you can have a few tanks, they're usually more than happy to give it away.
  • <sarcasm>I finally eliminate all french fries from my diet, but if I get a cool mod for my car, I'll still smell like I work at McDonalds.</sarcasm>

  • Smells like...? (Score:5, Funny)

    by KILNA ( 536949 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @03:35PM (#3918997) Journal
    I remember reading that running on vegetable oil smells more or less like french fries. Anyone who has worked fast food can imagine the smell of burned grease-trap fuel. *wretch*

    • Re:Smells like...? (Score:4, Funny)

      by makisupa ( 118663 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @03:55PM (#3919124) Homepage
      Yes...

      I recall working at Wendy's and taking out the fryer grease...

      Pouring it into a dumpster that had 400 gallons of what smelled like rancid shit. It had a four-inch-thick congealed craptastic skin on it that belched farty gasses when breached.

      I don't care if it smells like french fries, as long as it doesn't belch rancid fart stink.

    • Re:Smells like...? (Score:5, Funny)

      by Anonvmous Coward ( 589068 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @04:10PM (#3919206)
      I don't think the average guy willing to make this mod will have to worry about it a whole lot. A girl would actually have to get into his car to be offended by it's smell.

  • How far can this go? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 19, 2002 @03:35PM (#3919000)
    Exactly how much used vegetable oil do we have lying around to convert into biodiesel? If there's so much waste veggie oil, there must be some other industry that takes it and uses it for another manufacturing process. It's a great idea, but I don't see this displacing the oil industry anytime soon.
    • One thing to remember is that the midwest produces far more food than is actually needed, and the rest goes to waste. It doesn't have to go through a deep-fat-fryer first, that's just a convenient source.

      I wouldn't want to speculate exactly how much. I would feel okay guessing it's not enough to completely replace fossil fuels in vehicles, but then again we probably need to drive less anyway. :)
      • What you _should_ be asking is how much fossil fuel is currently expended in the farming of those grains?

        C//
        • With the way the world works, I'd guess that the farm equipment is so fuel-inefficient it outweighs any fossil-fuel savings from using biodiesel.

          Though my point was that we're making all this food -anyway-, so it's kinda moot.

          • Re:How far can this go? (Score:3, Insightful)

            by PD ( 9577 )
            The farm equipment is usually diesel, and that can run on biodiesel too.

            Anyway, these carbons in the fuel are the good carbons. They are the ones that were floating around the atmosphere just last year. The bad carbons are the ones that were floating around 50 million years ago.

            We can burn all the fuel we want if we burn the kind that is made from carbons that were floating around last year.
    • Yes, that's right. Left over grease is purchased for the eventual use in soap. And restaurants gets paid for their leftovers, so I wonder how this guy is getting free oil? Is he stealing the oil?
      • And restaurants gets paid for their leftovers...
        Must depend where you are; I checked with some local restauranteurs and they have to pay to have their waste grease taken away. Converting it to bio-fuel would at least set a ceiling on what it costs to dispose of it. On top of this, I've read that biodiesel (the methyl esters, not the raw vegetable oil) is a superb lubricity additive and can replace the sulfur compounds which currently lube the injection pumps (and create nasty particulates). Looks like we should be paying companies to use waste grease for fuel. We could easily pay for it by getting rid of the wasteful ethanol subsidies and mandates (as if Archer Daniels Midland would let that happen).
    • Exactly how much used vegetable oil do we have lying around to convert into biodiesel? probably not much, used grease is almost universaly collected, filtered and refined for reuse in other products. Recyclers of grease in my area drive there trucks on routes and I see them 60Mi from home base so it must be profitable.

      When these guys get their grease for free its just because the resturants don't get paid for it, probably they have to pay to have it removed, and its pretty high in the novelty factor.

  • Gold! (Score:2, Funny)

    by Jucius Maximus ( 229128 )
    This would be gold for the travelling hot-dog and french fry salesmen who drive around diesel VW Jettas.

    (I'm thinking of the deep fryers used to cook the french fries.)

    And imagine the revenue Krispy Kreme donuts stores could get out of this! "Coffee, donut and fillup for only $2.99!"

  • Don't get too excited about this if you, like me, already have a gasoline-based car. This will only work if your car is already diesel-based.

    Bah, I knew I should have bought a German car!

  • As an experienced trucker, I know. (Score:5, Funny)

    by Procrasturbator ( 585082 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @03:40PM (#3919030)
    I can't run my truck off vegetable oil. I'd be too tempted to cook chicken in it as I drive. Then again, I'm already tempted to drink the diesel for the ethanol, so it's really a toss-up.

  • This isn't new.. (Score:4, Informative)

    by Planetes ( 6649 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @03:44PM (#3919055)
    I distinctly remember watching a show on Discovery Channel (I believe it was Invention) from several years ago about a guy in the US who drives to various fast food outlets to get used vegetable oil for his car. He said the only problem was that his car always smells like french fries. Here are a couple links to related stories that are more recent. July 2001 [valleyadvocate.com] and October 2001 [channelone.com]
    • (disclaimer: I have a hard time pumping gas sometimes) Talking to someone in my office, he says that the oil is actually pretty pollutive. Maybe this isn't a great idear.. I wonder how it stacks up to normal fuel in terms of pollution.

  • Obligatory Simpson's quote... (Score:5, Funny)

    by dark_panda ( 177006 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @03:44PM (#3919056)
    Bart: When you want grease, go to the source. Good old Krusty Burger.

    Homer: Oh, I'll say. Look at that red-headed kid. There must be twenty dollars worth of grease on his forehead alone.

    Bart: I was thinking more of the deep-fryer.

    Homer: All right, we'll try it your way.

    J

  • No free fry oil in Dubya's America! (Score:5, Informative)

    by lugonn ( 555020 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @03:45PM (#3919058)
    "you can get your fuel free from restaurant deep-fryers."

    Most restaurants with friers, dump the old oil into a large bin out back. Every few months a tanker truck comes and picks up the oil. Then they make crayons and other shit out of it. Point is, restaurants get money for their old oil. Why would they give it away?

    • Re:No free fry oil in Dubya's America! (Score:2, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Why would they give it away?

      Unless it's a VERY large quantity, (and even then) nearly all resturants actually pay a fair fee to have the grease "disposed" of.

      That's the reason they're more than happy to give it away free, if you talk to the right people.

    • make sure to ask (Score:3, Informative)

      by martissimo ( 515886 )
      because you really could end up charged with grease theft if you just pull up and fill your car up out of their oil dumpster.

      there was an article about such a thing at Salon, but it no longer available i guess, though you can read it with google cache...

      Grease Rustlers [216.239.39.100]


      Companies like Griffin have contracts with restaurants to come around regularly and pick up their grease. From Griffin's point of view, the grease is theirs the minute it enters the container.


      So i'd definitely think it would be wise to at least ask the restaraunt you wanna fill up at before doing so.
      • there was an article about such a thing at Salon, but it no longer available i guess, though you can read it with google cache...
        Errr... if you insist on deep-linking to Google's cache, could at least link to the first page [salon.com].
        • man i tried to get the non cached version of the article for about 5 minutes before i gave up on it, darn thing just refused to load for me for some reason, glad ya found it.

          as to why i choose that particular page, it was just the portion that applied most directly to my point really.
    • pure FUD. epa classifies used fryolater oil as a toxic waste and restaurants pay to remove it. i've met justin and when restaurants find out he'll take their grease for free, a lot started calling him asking.
    • Wow, and apparantly according to your subject line, this whole thing started when Bush entered office?!
    • >Point is, restaurants get money for their old oil.
      >Why would they give it away?

      No, not quite. They pay to have the grease hauled away, along with their other food waste, which is often separate from the usual garbage.

      Storing it indefinitely is a nuisance (and is regulated by law in many places), and so it is of value to the restaurant to have it hauled away, just as it is with, say, the butcher's carcassess, which don't just get thrown out with the municipal garbage.

      Now, the recycler gets a fee for collecting this stuff, and he also gets to collect for whatever he can convert it into.

      None of this means that the grease itself is a directly profitable commodity, just that it is enough of a nuisance that the collection of it is a viable service business, and that part of the disposal process includes a certain amount of recycling.

      When you are no longer the only person in your whole state with a frygrease conversion vehicle, you won't be able to simply ask the restaurant if you can have their fat for free. (And taking it without asking is tresspassing.)

    • Ding. Wrong.

      Resturants pay to get rid of their waste oil. There are a few companies that take it to extract the glycerine (for soap and the like), but that is it.

      At the Midwest Renewable Energy Fair [mrea.org] I saw the system mentioned, went to a session on it, and talked to a man with a grease powered VW truck. He gets all of his grease for free, and one other person that had a converted vehicle mentioned that he gets paid to take the grease.

      -Jim

  • I have seen buses run on bio fuel on the streets of Montreal, and they produce just fraction of smoke ordinary diesels do.

    The site and the explanation is here: BioBus [stcum.qc.ca]

  • Must start on diesel (Score:3, Interesting)

    by kiwimate ( 458274 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @03:48PM (#3919078) Journal
    The car starts on diesel and after several miles Mr. Noe-Hays flips a switch and changes to his other fuel source. At the end of the day he switches back to diesel to clean the engine of grease.

    Now, I wonder if it's just at the beginning of the day, or if he has to be on diesel every time he turns the key. If the latter, and you're mostly driving around town, then you'll never get the chance to use the oil part of it. (Not to detract from its usefulness on long journeys, of course.)

    I had a quick look at the greasecar site, but couldn't find the answer to this question. Anyone know the deal?
  • Could I have Olive Oil with a nice Balsamic Vinegarette?
  • There are still harmful emissions, and there's not enough fuel available to take a significant chunk out of the current fuel usage. Sorry, this isn't a solution. The only current solution is to reduce the amount of fuel you use, by taking a bus or other mass transit, for instance.

    • Re:What's the point? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by swordgeek ( 112599 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @04:16PM (#3919230) Journal
      You're right, and...

      You're wrong.

      This is slowly driving me crazy. This is an alternative idea, and one that is WORKING on a small scale. There are people right now who are recycling fryer grease into car fuel.

      - Is it emission free? Of course not!
      - Are the emissions better than gas/diesel emissions? Maybe. Maybe not.
      - Is this going to make it all OK for all of us to drive big cars as much as possible? Of course not!!!
      - Is it at least going to replace fossil fuels? Don't be absurd!

      This is not a solution. Electric cars or hybrids are not a solution. H2, solar, or compressed air powered cars are not the solution! No piece of technology stuck onto a car is going to solve the socioeconomic nightmare of our dependency on vehicles!

      BUT...

      That doesn't mean we shouldn't use this. In fact, we should be VIGOROUSLY studying these alternatives. The bottom line is that if we wait for a solution, it'll never happen and we'll eventually be buried up to our asses in rusted carparts and used car oil. WHILE we pursue a solution, we MUST be using this thing, the electric cars available, Hybrids, diesel, and whatever else is out there. Same for engines--let's look at the Wankel again, now that Mazda has (sadly) dropped it. If they get used, they get researched. If they don't get used, we'll end up stuck with inefficient, archaic, dinosaur-burning tanks until the end of time; and that will come a lot quicker as a result.

      So quit throwing away all of the little steps forward--they're the only way we advance.

      • The bottom line is that if we wait for a solution, it'll never happen and we'll eventually be buried up to our asses in rusted carparts and used car oil.

        I don't buy it. We're using energy faster than the sun can provide us with more of it. There isn't a solution, short of clean fusion/fission. Until then, the only "solution" is to stop using energy so quickly.

        • We're using energy faster than the sun can provide us with more of it.

          That's a news to me--I thought the vast majority of the sun's energy that hit the planet went unused.

          Do you have a source for that? If it's true, we should consider using some of the rest of the sun's output...

          --
          Benjamin Coates
    • Can it be made any more efficiently than corn-based ethanol? Hempseed or other oil-bearing plants?

    • Sorry, this isn't a solution. The only current solution is to reduce the amount of fuel you use, by taking a bus or other mass transit, for instance.

      Sorry, the vast majority of people (myself included) don't care enough to make lifestyle changes.

      Technical solutions are the only thing that even stand a chance. In the absence of a technical solution, the problem will continue to go unsolved.

      --
      Benjamin Coates

      • Technical solutions are the only thing that even stand a chance. In the absence of a technical solution, the problem will continue to go unsolved.

        That's fine. I'm just saying the problem is going to continue to go unsolved.

  • "you can get your fuel free from restaurant deep-fryers"

    I don't think that is going to work too well in Northern Wisconsin in the winter.

  • Berkeley is the leader in this ... (Score:3, Informative)

    by smoondog ( 85133 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @03:52PM (#3919108)
    Berkeley, CA runs recycling trucks on this stuff. [mindfully.org]

    There is a place in SF where you can buy it for your car. $3 or something a gallon (bit pricey, even for our ridiculous $1.75 87).

    -Sean

  • One thing I wonder -- what is the total emissions picture for operating this vehicle based on fryer food? One problem with the most common renewable energy source for gasoline engines -- ethanol -- is that you use almost as much energy in the conversion process that you gain from making the ethanol. How is vegetable oil made? Once use surpasses the amount reclaimed from food service, would it make economic sense to make vegetable oil just for vehicular use?

  • Seen 'em on the road. (Score:2, Informative)

    by Byteme ( 6617 )
    I live near Hampshire College and there are several of these cars driving around with the www.greasecar.com printed on the body. Volkswagens... Rabbits and a Bus I have seen. Our local rag did a srory [valleyadvocate.com] on these pioneers. I am thinking about buying my neighbor's diesel Rabbit for $250.00 just so I can try the kit out.
  • Would someone using such a kit on a car be elligible for the AFV tax break despite it being aftermarket? Hybrids, such as the new Civic, Prius, and Insight all are, so clearly some petroleum use is allowed.

  • Oil-pressing (Score:2, Informative)

    by nothing_23 ( 530363 )
    Making Vegetable oil isn't very difficult. [oilpress.com] You can buy high quality [magicmillusa.com] presses. Or even make your own. I mentioned this in a previous article, but From the Fryer to the Fuel Tank [amazon.com] has instructions on not only how to make your fuel, but how to build a cheap oil press with a diesel engine of course :). This book also has really helpful tables on which plants will produce the most oil.
  • I know a number of people who have been burning home-made biodiesel in unmodified engines, including cars and some tractors. There is really no need to modify the engine, unless it's very old (maybe more than 10 years). This is because biodiesel is more oxygenated than petro-diesel, and will attack the rubber hoses and such in the older fuel systems.

    As to the exhaust odor, I can personally attest that it is a lot more pleasant smelling that petro-diesel. Also, the noisy, sooty emissions that people associate with diesel is really just the result of badly designed engines. Get a recent TDI engine from volkswagon (an auto company whose engineers actually went to college!) and you'll have a much cleaner burning engine.

    Lastly, to respond to the inevitable comments about the economy of growing fuel crops (poor energy balance, not enough arable land, etc) - you are missing the point! Biodiesel is being made from a waste product. Clearly, it isn't the answer to all our energy needs, but it's a piece of the puzzle.

  • VW (Score:2, Informative)

    by carlivar ( 119811 )
    A great opportunity to preach my love of my 2002 Volkswagen Diesel. Specifically, a Jetta TDI wagon.

    I just went 601.4 miles on my last tank, which used 13.3 gallons. That's around 45 miles per gallon.

    The car is awesome. Same mileage as a silly little econobox such as a Metro, but with the power of an ordinary car. In fact it's probably got MORE torque than an ordinary car. I can pass gasoline cars easily in 5th gear on a hill, and I can let out the clutch from a stop without even touching the throttle!

    And yes, I guess I can run it on grease!

    I scoff at all you gasoline slaves.

    Carl

  • It's a little OT, but I saw this article [popsci.com] over at popular science the other day.

    For those who don't want to read the article, it describes VW's latest test/concept car. Two person, 600 lbs car. It has a tank for 1.7 gallons and gets better than 260 MPG(though only rated for 235. ONLY.). And no, it's not slow. They rated the top speed as over 70 MPH. Which is plenty fast, even for highway travel.

    Ontopic: it runs on diesel fuel. Who wants to mod this car and make it even more environmentally friendly? "It barely even burns Vegetable Oil!"

    I don't, however, know what's involved in applying the mod. Or if VW could even fit it in this car. But it would still be cool. I actually want one of these cars. Errr... this car. That would be sweet. *sigh* Time to go buy a lottery ticket.
    • 70 mph is slow.

      I used to own a vintage Aircooled VW (Karmann Ghia), and with the stock engine and transmission, it's top speed was 86 mph. However, power near the top end is pretty weak, especially up hills. Let me tell you, if you don't have a lot of power up above 50 mph or so, you WILL get jacked around on the freeway. Period.

      (which is why I yanked the stock engine out of there and replaced it with a Porsche engine - NO problem attaining 86 mph - NO problem attaining 110+ - NO more getting jacked around on the freeway, trying to merge on enterance ramps, etc.)

      I would never take a 70 MPH top-speed vehicle on ANY freeway. Speed Limit 55? What a joke. Wake up and smell the violators.

  • Not so simple (Score:5, Informative)

    by redelm ( 54142 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @04:17PM (#3919233) Homepage
    I've driven and worked on passenger car diesels exclusively for the past ten years. They're robust and reliable, but you can't just fuel them on anything. They run terribly on gasoline!

    The most critical part of the diesel is the fuel pump and injectors. They run at 3000-5000 psi with very low volume per stroke, so leakage cannot be tolerated. The fuel has to be filtered extremely well (sub micron). My worry with biodiesel is that it might plug filters due to microbial growth [always a problem in diesel], or the vegatable oil hydrolyze into organic acid plus glycerol. The organic acids will cause corrosion of the injector pump plungers and injector tips. Not good at all. The fuel will also have different rubber swell characteristics, so you may get fuel leaks. I'd try this first on a imetal-to-metal Mercedes with simple to replace rubber rather than a Peugeot or VW with a fuel-lubricated pump and that main O ring soaking in fuel.

    I expect vegatable oil could be made to work with additives: a biostat, acid neutralizer plus seal swell control. But it would have to remain a separate product becauase petroleum oil and vegatable oils aren't miscible. If you wanted a blend, you'd need an emulsifier, and the results might be too viscous.

    • Plus, your car will probably require triple-bypass surgery every 50,000 miles.

    • Actually, it's amazingly simple. (Score:5, Informative)

      by Ashurnasipal ( 589537 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @05:22PM (#3919554)
      Caveat: Although I have friends who run diesels on various fuels, I myself do not. So I'm a friend of experts, not an expert myself.

      Rudolf Diesel designed his engine to run on vegetable oil. That's how it was originally supposed to work, and it was originally demonstrated at the World's Fair running peanut oil.

      Modern diesel engines are slightly modified to optimally burn the refinery waste products we call "diesel fuel". But only slightly...

      If you want to efficiently burn vegetable oil in an unmodified modern diesel, you should use biodiesel (easily home-made, see Tickell's site [veggievan.org] for details).

      If you want to run straight veggie oil, you need to preheat the oil (no problem when the engine is running, plenty of heat easily available, but you will need a preheater or a small tank of "starter fuel" at startup time). You also need to make sure that your filters are very efficient, and that you have bacteria/fungi controls, and that you have a water trap. These are the same considerations with regular "diesel fuel", but since the latter is nasty hostile petrowaste and the former is edible bio-friendly fryer grease you will have to be much more careful and vigilant.

      Most people running straight vegetable oil are uber-geeks. They like to tinker and they aren't afraid of breaking things, because they know they will be able to get something to work if they need to. If you don't feel like that is a description of you, try biodiesel instead, and you won't have to make any modifications to your vehicle at all. You can even mix biodiesel and petrodiesel with no problem.

  • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 )
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • The main reason for supporting something like biodiesel is that it reduces reliance on imported oil. Virtually any country can grow vegetable oil-producing crops, and they probably have tons of waste oil around. Not being self-reliant on something as important to a modern economy as energy is a recipe for blackmail.

    What you get is a renewable resource that may not be better for the environment, but is better for geopolitical reasons. That's not so bad in my book.

    -jon

  • Sounds like something Ron Jeremy would drive.
  • Q: "Do you want fries with that?"
  • For the average school district, seems to me. God knows the cafeteria must throw off enough waste "fuel" to supply the school fleet, with plenty left over.
  • The smell your car would give off as exhaust would probably boost McDonalds sales through the roof!

  • Sorry, won't work... (Score:5, Informative)

    by Knacklappen ( 526643 ) <knacklappen@gmx.net> on Friday July 19, 2002 @05:07PM (#3919480) Journal
    Having worked with the development of high-pressure direct-injection diesel engines at both Volkswagen and Volvo, I am quite critical towards any replacement fuel that has not been widely and thoroughly tested.

    To begin with, some links for self study:
    - Dieselnet.com [dieselnet.com] has a great glossary [dieselnet.com] and provides some excellent links [dieselnet.com]
    - Delphi [delphi.com] has some nice PDF's on Unit Injectors [delphi.com] and Common Rail [delphi.com]
    - Here some information from Bosch [boschservice.com] - Siemens [siemensauto.com] has some nice pictures [siemensauto.com] of injection systems, mainly common rail

    Due to the very high pressures (up to 2100 bars) and therefore high temperatures with modern fuel injection systems, you really go to the limit of what diesel fuel can do: You use it simultaneously as fuel, coolant and oil and it takes a good blend to fulfill all these requirements! The chemical formula is important as well as the physical properties. The DOE [doe.gov] has a webpage about diesel fuels [doe.gov]. Have a look at their online diesel fuel property database [doe.gov] and see which properties are essential for characterizing fuel. Other important factors are
    - durability
    - particles/filtration
    - compressability/resistance against cavitation


    Not to forget resistance of all sealings etc against the fuel. Think RME and you know why almost everybody in the industry (e.g. SCANIA [scania.com]) only approves blends with max 5% alternative fuels...

    Don't get me wrong, but if those fuels are ruining the car, we really can't talk about environmental advantages then, now can we? On the other hand, serious life cycle analysis like this one [doe.gov] and field studies [deep.org] will hopefully help to develop cleaner cars. If those are then driven by gas engines, diesel engines or fuel cells... who knows?
  • There are over 230 comments on this thread right now. It is a "hardware" story.

    and yet...

    There is no "Imagine a Beowulf Cluster of these!" post.

  • In 10 seconds flat I was thinking about the car "Greased Lightning" from "Grease"

  • "Lunchlady Doris, have you got any grease?"
    "Yes, yes we do..."
    "Well then grease me up woman!"
    "Okie dokie."

    Favourite Simpsons quote, ever.
  • If you really want to promote alternatives then demand earlier introduction of low sulfur fuel [ecdiesel.com]. Some more info here [state.ak.us] and yes, the pretroleum industry is whining about cost increase [api.org], while even the car industry is demanding [dieselnet.com] this fuel...

  • "Ach! That's my Retirement Grease!" (Score:3, Funny)

    by Donut ( 128871 ) on Friday July 19, 2002 @06:03PM (#3919830)
    Be very careful fueling your cars from the local school's fryers. You might not know if that fluid is spoken for.

    -Donut
  • If someone calls your car a grease-bucket, all you'll be able to do is smile.....
  • From the webpage:

    The biggest reduction is in CO2 which is not eliminated from the exhaust emissions but the oil plant absorbs as much CO2 in its growing cylce as the oil puts out when it is burned. This creates a balance

    Ummmm, excuse me, but where did all the CO2 from burned gasoline originate? In the dinosaurs and the plants that died and became oil. hmmmm....sounds like a balance to me
    • Ummmm, excuse me, but where did all the CO2 from burned gasoline originate?...

      from plants -> animals that lived dozens of millions of years ago. Earth's ecosystem has long-since balanced itself to run witnout that carbon in the system. pumping it all back in in what, geologically and ecologically speaking is an instant of time can cause what D&Ders used to refer to as 'system shock'.

      When the polar ice caps finish melting (the north pole is probably going to be gone by mid century), then the planet's temperatures are really going to spike, and we'll be facing some serious drought and heat-wave problems.

  • But has anyone considered using this technology to take their home off the grid (if not actually attempt to run a small power plant)? There are some power plants that run off of refuse incinerators, but if a diesel turbine can be modified to run off of biodiesel, then you could kill two birds with one stone...

    Has anyone considered the possibility of building a fuel cell along those lines as well? One that you could, say, start with a small fireplace in order to heat the vegetable oil/grease to a vapor state sufficient to combust?

    While vehicles aren't the most efficient energy consumers, most homes are considerably worse...

    And then there's possibilities for developing nations, to both do away with a large amount of pollution, where even small villages could have electricity with waste products as the fuel (some do this already with methane producing cesspits)... Just retrofitting old diesel generator rigs with a system like this could move a lot of areas into at least the 20th century...

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