How to change your Radeon 9500 into a 9700 256
Ian Bell writes "We have just posted a very difficult guide to turning your ATI Radeon 9500 into a 9700. But you have to have the correct 9500. A 9500 with 4 rendering pipelines, modified to enable all 8 pipelines, will effectively double the memory bus, if you have the extra 64 Meg of memory to attach it to. We will explain below which card to acquire for this awesome graphics card transformation. Check out how to do this yourself and get the power of a 9700 at half the price." Update: 01/19 18:33 GMT by T : And for those running Windows, Sanity writes "Aside from the hardware mod, there is a program called Riva Tuner that has, among other things, a software mod for unlocking those gates, plus overclocking to a full 9700 pro! Gives me more $$$ to spend on cool stuff."
One for the price of two (Score:5, Funny)
Re:One for the price of two (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:One for the price of two (Score:5, Insightful)
uh (Score:3, Informative)
Or, you might get zilch - since that's why those are 9500's and not 9700's. That memory is suspect.
selling these (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:selling these (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:selling these (Score:3, Insightful)
However.. that doesn't mean that ATI won't find some bullshit reason to sue you and throw confusion on the whole issue to make you look like a bad guy. (presuming you are in America, where this kind of things is all so common)
Remember when US Robotics had a fit becase they were selling their Dual Standard modems at twice the price of their Sporster (single standard), yet using the same board/chipset? Someone published an init string that would enable dual mode on the sporster.... and ATI had a fit, trying to say it was copyrigh violation, illegal, etcetera.
Re:selling these (Score:3, Funny)
Re:selling these (Score:2)
yeah.
I shaddup now.
Re:selling these (Score:2, Interesting)
http://usrfaq.koepke.net/usrfaq.txt [koepke.net]
(Search for "Troedsson" in that document)
Proper credit to "Zaphod Beeblebrox" of old Atari ST-fame - he's the "guy" I'm referring to.
Re:selling these (Score:2, Informative)
Excuse me? (Score:2)
Did any of the people who modded this up bother to verify these claims?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&i
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&i
Or do a search for iOpener...
Or do a search for TiVo and find items like this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&i
Re:selling these (Score:2)
yes and no (Score:3, Interesting)
The problem, as everyone is pointing out, is that this is a very tricky hack, and that there's a very good chance that the 9500 you buy will not be physically capable of the hack. For the entrepreneur, that means that every 9500 worked on that doesn't result in a speed increase will have to be resold for well *below* cost, since it may be damaged and is no longer under warranty. Secondly, you have to figure out how many failed attempts you will have before you have a successful one (let's say the ratio is 5 to 1); and probably one of those 5 is totally unusable and unresellable. Now we can figure out your profit per "good" card. Add up the cost of your losses on the 5 bad cards, and add that amount to the cost of the one "good" card you are selling (which, BTW, you have to sell for a good discount below the 9700's price). Assuming you made a profit at that point, you then have to divide your profit by the total amount of hours you have invested in both modifying AND selling all of the cards.
By comparison, what's your opportunity cost? That is, what is the highest compensation alternatives you are giving up to spend time on this project (selling linux systems on eBay, delivering pizzas, etc.), and which is the better time investment?
Selling hacks and sophisticated hardware upgrades on eBay really only makes sense when the profit potential is significant enough for you to absorb all of the losses of failed attempts (not in this case, because the 9700 effectively sets a price cap on the project).
A guide for... (Score:2, Funny)
Read other fora before attempting ... (Score:5, Informative)
This mod and its possible failure modes have been discussed [rage3d.com] on the rage3d forums.
It seems the best theory as to why some checkerboard and some do not, is that the 9500 uses binned chips, where not all eight texture pipelines necessarily operate correctly at normal speeds, voltages, or possibly at all.
The mod apparently works by unlocking or changing a hard-wired ID field, which then allows the 9700 bios to be used on the 9500 board.
What a rippoff (Score:5, Informative)
Yet today's article says:
Oh yeah! "We". I'm sure you thought of it first. Not even a single mention of the Russian hackers who first came up with this easy hack. Not really brain surgery. Few people I know hacked up the board in less than few hours.
Re:What a rippoff (Score:3, Funny)
Very clever trick, but we all know where this is going:
In Soviet Russia, ATI Radeon 9700 can be turned into a 9500 with just a simple hack.
Word to the Wary (Score:5, Interesting)
This hack has been crawling around the boards for a while and it seems fairly legit. The basic layout and architecture of the 9500 and 9700 are the same and this hack attempts to:
1) Re-enable the extra pixel pipelines that are present on the 9500 just not enable. A simple resister swap near the gpu is required.
2) Flash the bios of the 9500 with a 9700 bios image.
3) Overclock the 9500's core clock to compete with 9700.
4) (Optional) Add more memory.
The biggest problem I see is that the stock memory on the 9500 is of a cheaper variety and isn't rated for the frequency that a 9700 operates at.
So, even if you indeed have the skills/luck involved to pull off this cute hack, then you'll not necessarily be able to compete with a 9700.
My advice, go with the 9500 Pro. Out of the box it's only a step slower than the 9700 Pro and costs half the coin of a 9700/9700 Pro.
But if you've got a 9500 in your machine and some time/money to spare. Why not see if you can achieve great things with a minimum cost?
Re:Word to the Wary (Score:3, Interesting)
See http://www.guru3d.com/rivatuner/ for more information on the software method.
Some links (Score:5, Informative)
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/story.html?id=1042
http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?s=&t
An aside (Score:2)
The same ppl who brought you the SoftQuadro(4) hack. One that allows you to use Quadro drivers on geforce cards. Unwinder 'at' Guru3d.com
This is getting to be a little too much... (Score:5, Insightful)
I love the hacker ethic, kludge something until it works. Sometimes you have to, sometimes you want to, and sometimes just for the hell of it.
I understand trying to save a few bucks, but COME ON PEOPLE.
What I am seeing more and more is these whack hardware hacks which 20% of the time do increase the hardware potential and the 80% fry whatever you are fooling with. So you clean the part of real good, RMA it, and get a new one. Screwing the rest of the world in the process cause you wanted to hack it.
I remember in the day of the Celeron 300A, I was working in a shop that sold them hand over fist. And we got them back hand over fist due to over clockers"Dunna what happened man, just didn't work one day, I didn't over clock it though, musta been defective"
You futz up the graphic card, clean the solder off, and bring it back to Best Buy. They don't look it, they just give you another, and prices go up.
But everyone doesn't take that into account when they bring it back.
I don;t have unlimited funds, but I know you get what you pay for.
People that buy that Athlon 1800, cheap ass board, cheap ass fan, cheap ass power supply, overclock it, then spend 200 bucks on cooling, which could have applied to just buying a better cheap, board, and power supply.
And what scares me is this is the next generation of admins. I see the result now in the field. Some young computer whiz has outfitted an entire office with no name stuff, only a years guarantee, then he quits, six months later stuff starts to go out. And I have to tell them they have to buy new stuff cause they nearly new stuff was crap.
So I ask the community this. If you mod it and fry it. Throw it in the garbage, dont make me pay by bringing it back or RMA ing New Egg. But howsa about this. If it ain't broke. Don't fuck with it.
Puto
Re:This is getting to be a little too much... (Score:3, Interesting)
I don't agree that "if it ain't broke, don't fuck with it," as tweaking and playing are both very natural and very educational: but don't return it. You broke it: you fix it. If you can't fix it: you buy one that can do what you wanted it to do in the first place. But don't fall into the pit of buyers remorse by getting a wall-mart, emachines, or other low-quality computer to save a few dollars, then chop it up to try and compensate for not buying something that could satisfy you. Buy and support the things that you want. And always, always do your research. If you could spend 3 hours finding out what the best available PSU for your system is, you could save 6 hours later on trying to cut it open and cool it.
(Which reminds me, my PSU is too loud. Where did my Dremel go?)
-C
Re:This is getting to be a little too much... (Score:2)
While I agree with everything else you've said, I have to dissent on this.
Honestly, when you buy a Compaq, Dell, HP, or whatever brand name PC, you're buying into the fact that they can repair/replace it, which means that you are at their mercy for quality of service -- there's nothing you can do yourself to get things up and running.
If the company has computer staff, they should be fixing it. Anyone who has dealt with machines from major manufacturers knows they are nothing but the worst PITA ever made, in every way possible (all the way to the point of proprietary memory somtimes!) when it comes to repairing it yourself.
By buying non-brand name system he has left the new workers with something they can fix without having to depend on one company. If the CD-ROM breaks, they don't need to call up Compaq and wait 3 days for a replacement with the screw holes in exactly the right place to ship -- they can walk down to the local computer store and buy a new one on the spot, not to mention one made by the same company as Compaq would have sent you, but also for about $300 cheaper.
And, while you might think he bought "crap", I can tell you with great certainty that that "crap" are exactly the same parts in the name brand computer, except that the "crap" he bought conforms to standards, whereas the OEM part is irreplaceable except by the OEM.
Example: Does the name PC Chips make your skin crawl? Probably. Did you know that many of the boards in brand name computers were made by them?
I'm supposing not...
Re:This is getting to be a little too much... (Score:2)
It is also a political problem. If the tech manager is allowed to build a bunch of custom computer systems the computer illiterate in the company are at their mercy. Upper management is not going to buy a system that gives a middle manager complete control over like that. They'd rather spend more time/money buying from Compaq or IBM so any problem can be outsourced and the IT department gets to do as little as possible.
Re:This is getting to be a little too much... (Score:4, Insightful)
Also, it can be a good way to make use of parts which are out-of-spec for the higher performance version.
sPh
Re:This is getting to be a little too much... (Score:2)
Many more are now, than they used to be, but not all. On the other hand, paperback paper quality has gone up as well (think trade paperbacks, not mass market.)
I dunno, I buy hardcovers cause the type is easier on my eyes, and I like collecting books with dust jackets. However, I rarely buy HCs new - I'll buy remaindered and used books instead, often times cheaper than a new paperback edition. I used to buy book club editions, but with the cost of shipping as it is, it's cheaper buying the discounted original publisher hardcover off of Amazon or Barnes and Noble.
Re:This is getting to be a little too much... (Score:2)
Well, if you don't want to pay market prices for the stuff you want, you'll just have to do without it untill the price drops. And by that time, you'll want the latest and greatest which will be as expensive as the latest and greatest is now.
I can hack my 1974 Chevy Impala's 350 engine into a nitris driven speed machine/death-trap, relatively cheaply. And I can also blow it, and myself to hell trying. Or I can buy a new high performace sports car. Becasue I appreciate what I have and I don't want to destroy it, and because I can't afford to upgrade, I do without.
And I strive to figure out how to better myself so that one day maybe I can earn enough money to upgrade.
Or I could just dump the Chevy and buy a Harley.
Re:This is getting to be a little too much... (Score:3, Informative)
It would be hard for me, if I cared, to know that those pixel pipelines were sitting there, unused. You know, "because they were there." It looks fun to do, regardless of whether you need it or not.
Well, in answer to your first question, most likely they're charging more for the top of the line product to help make up for R&D costs. "But that same R&D made both boards, so why shouldn't the 9500 pay the same amount for it?" Cause then they get undercut on the low end. Welcome to how the computer business works. The early adopters who absolutely gotta have the latest greatest toy end up subsidizing R&D.
As for the second part of your post, it's worth noting that it's not unusual in cases like this where you have two different levels of chips, that the chips used in the lower level are actually defectives from the premiere chip - in other words, they tested it, found out some of the pipelines didn't work and sold it as a 4 pipeline 9500. Intel used to do the same thing with non-math coprocessor chips and AMD has done the same thing with the Athlon MP's.
Re:This is getting to be a little too much... (Score:2)
Because the 9700s can be guaranteed to operate at that clock rate. The 9500s can only be guaranteed to operate at a reduced clock rate and/or with fewer pipelines. You ignored the statistics that say that 80% of the time this mod will result in a fried card because the extra pipelines you enabled were defective.
Essentially, the 9700s are expensive because they are the "real deal". The 9500s are best described as "factory reject" 9700s that ATi figured out how to salvage from total loss - Fortunately, the design of the 9700 allows the bad circuity to be disabled, allowing the card to function properly and with guaranteed (but lower) performance, rather than going into the trash.
In the 20% of cases where the card doesn't die, I wouldn't trust it anyway, because most likely it failed QA testing for 9700 functionality in some way.
Nothing new. :) (Score:2)
I think the same thing occurred in some Celeron vs. PIII and Duron vs. Athlon incarnations - In some cases, the dies and design were different, but I think in others, Intel/AMD salvaged CPUs with defective caches by disabling the defective portion and releasing a "budget" CPU with half the cache.
Re:This is getting to be a little too much... (Score:2)
How many is a few? Do you know how many people will return boards because of this? I doubt its more than 2-3. Maybe a few hundreds, possibly thousands. ATI's current profits are around 4 million (taken from their Q1 2003 report (PDF) [ati.com]. Call it a 1,000 boards at $100 per chip. Sounds good to me. That's 2.5% of their total profits. Is that really so insignificant?
Ever heard of R & D? (Score:2, Insightful)
However, what about the employees? What about the engineers, designers, leaders, managers? What about the people coordinating the soldering? What about the training dollars?
What about the machines and assembly lines that make these graphic cards? Are they free, too? The heat, the electricity? The chairs and computers?
Marketing, advertising, insurance for employees, and lawyers aren't free, either.
But even with the above restraints, another company could make a Radeon 9700 clone much cheaper, and I don't mean a Chinese sweat shop. I mean, say, a company in Canada making an identical clone manufacturing the 9700 for a cheaper cost with the same quality, selling it for half the price, and still make tons of money off it?
How could that (theoretically) be possible?
BECAUSE YOU'RE FORGETTING THAT ATI had to spend $$$$ in Research and Development, prototyping, training, and paying top dollar for engineers and designers. Many mistakes and failed efforts, many successful runs exploited for improvement.
A clone company would not have to pay these costs if they ripped off the design. GET IT? That's why new video cards cost so much, because the manufacturer (in this case ATI) had to RESEARCH THE THING it's making. That, and the fact that since the LATEST and the GREATEST video card was made for early adopters/hardcore gamers, they pay the biggest fee. Versions of the Card are priced cheaper for less demanding markets. Even though most of the technology is the same for the 9500, it is the early adopters that are the reason that ATI made 9700 the HIGHEST instead of just stopping at 9500, and that extra "R&D" cost makes sense.
And why is everybody upset about a company making a profit? Are you people crazy?
The company has to pay for their investment, then a lot of the money left over is put back into future R & D.
ATI designed, developed, and manufactures the best (consumer?) graphics card in the world. That takes lots of Research and Development $$.
Also, I am pretty sure what you described about misrepresenting equipment you broke is illegal.
File sharing has almost no R & D costs, (at least not in the millions and billions of USD).
Modding a 9500... (Score:2)
I would be willing to bet that most pro modders would charge you at least $40. How many pro modders will give you a %100 chance of it working?
If you know how to modify a graphics card it's cheaper. But the unmodded card costs more then the different between the 2 cards. So WHY? If you mess it up. Or more likley, the cheap card is just not modifiable, then you've wasted everyone's time and money.
Most people doing this are hobbiests, who are trying to squeeze every penny. Why? Cause playing with their computers is more important then using them.
Software mod (Score:5, Interesting)
Difference between modifying and stealing? (Score:2, Insightful)
When you purchase a video card, however, and "unlock" a feature that is only meant to be purchased, isn't that stealing?
Well in the famous case.. (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Difference between modifying and stealing? (Score:2)
How the hell could that possibly be illegal? I didn't coerce anybody...I didn't defraud anybody...I didn't deprive anybody of anything at all. So what could possibly be wrong with that?
Depends what kind of laws we are talking about (Score:2)
Lets say that it was always legal to modify anything you bought, hardware, software or data. It would be still illegal to distribute copies of other people's code without permission, but not to post any new code that modifies its behavior. So what's the big deal?
Obviously ATI makes money selling cheaper cards. So they would still sell them and turn profit even if a cheap, legal mod kit was available. If 9500 is in fact artifically crippled, they would probably just remove the performance restriction and everyone would have more fun gaming than now. ATI would still have an option of selling a high end card that really has better hardware or low end that is really cheaper to make. If 9500 is a defective 9700, ATI might provide a control panel that lets users turn on extra features at their own risk. Remember that NVIDIA does have an overclocking control panel? Windows XP Home addition will either have the same featues as XP Pro or will have the extra code really compiled out rather than just artifically disabled. In the later case, home users will have a leaner, faster OS.
Shareware programmers will release two versions of their code. The free version will not have any timeout, nagging dialogs or ads, because those might be removed by a legal patch. Instead if will just not have code for certain features. This is mostly a win to the users, because low-budget or low-need people will have free software without getting annoyed and spamed.
Sample music will be distributed as 24KHz MP3s or clips. Or perhaps, a couple of songs in an album will be free in full quality. When you pay for music, you will get a full-quality MP3. You just will not be allowed to distribute it. Perhaps it will be watermarked to try to catch you. It will not be illegal to try to remove watermarks, but you will be scared to post a file because you can never know if you removed all of them unless you really mess up file's quality.
All I see is benefit to the users and only a slight challenge to manufacturers. There will be some companies for which current system is so ingrained in their business that they would go under. Some other companies will make less money. But its not the purpose of the law to guarantee that everyone makes as much money as they want. Just that someone is motivated enough to create and manufacture new products.
DMCA (Score:2)
Could the manufacturer claim that their product was reverse engineered? After all, you had to 'hack'/study/modify the product in order to get the new functionality.
Scary stuff. Very scary.
Re:Difference between modifying and stealing? (Score:2)
What about cars? You buy a brand new Vette only to find out that the factory limited your speed by programming one of the computer chips to lock out at 167 MPH. So you buy a different chip to "unlock" your cars full potential. Is that stealing?
I say it's not. You bought the card, it's yours, do whatever the hell you want with it. But I agree with another poster about not trying to return it if you fry it. You fuck it up, it's your problem. Deal with it. Don't take it back to the store and cause prices to go up. I don't overclock any of my stuff because I can't afford to replace it if I mess it up. I bought items that were fast enough for my use and when they aren't fast enough I'll replace them. After I have replaced them, I may then try to speed them up a bit just for fun because at that point, if I make a mistake it doesn't matter because I already have a replacement.
Re:Difference between modifying and stealing? (Score:3, Interesting)
sPh
Re:Difference between modifying and stealing? (Score:2, Insightful)
And perhaps enjoy the same fate!
Sounds to me like ... (Score:5, Funny)
The one thing that bothers me is the "Turn your 9500 into a 9700" that's not really true, see a 9700 was meant to run like a 9700 and a 9500 is meant to run like a 9500, this will be more or less a memory/speed upgrade for a 9500.
I seriously doubt that ATI would try to keep the market inflated by purposefully dumbing down a high end card, this sort of thing doesn't happen in real life. It's not like Intel has ever used a pIII chip with the cache disabled/ripped out for celerons before. I mean jeeze people why would a hardware company want to make something intentionally slower, it's not as if 3 steps from the top cards cost nearly 200% less. Next someone is going to tell me it costs roughly $18 to manufacture a Radeon 9700. I tell you, it's all lies, all lies.
Re:Sounds to me like ... (Score:5, Interesting)
See also the 'flippy discs' of the C-64 era. It was cheaper/easier for companies to use the double sided media they used on other systems, then produce new single sided floppies just for the c-64 market. You punched a second hole in the floppy, and turn it over.
Again, I don't argue that's what ATI is doing here. I personally agree with the person above who suggested they're probably using 'bin chips' that for some reason didn't make the cut for the 9700 boards.
So you pays your monies and you takes your chances. Mmmm I love the smell of newbies with solder suckers in the morning
Re:Sounds to me like ... (Score:2)
Re:Sounds to me like ... (Score:2)
Re:Sounds to me like ... (Score:2)
$50 mil for R&D $50 mil for Engineering and Design $50 mil for Advertising
make 100 million of them ... end product costs $1.50 to make.
Pending all 100 million are bought. I don't understand exactly how this system works, but yeah it is very possible that a radeon 9700 costs ati $17 overall to make. Will they ever admit it? Hell no they won't.
Insightful? (Score:2)
Maybe you commented before the "Funny" moderation to the parent post, but c'mon!
Re:Insightful? (Score:2)
See my reply to the other "clever commentator". (How come you guys don't get modded "Overrated", or at least "Redundant"?)
As a side note, did it ever occur to anyone that maybe some younger readers, or not-so-technical types, or (God forbid) hardcore Mac users might not have realized that Intel has been dumbing down Celerons for a while? One of the problems with sarcasm, especially poorly done sarcasm, is that it doesn't actually provide information. Instead, it assumes that everyone already knows the relevant facts. Perhaps my post, which actually contained facts wasn't so useless after all?
Re:Sounds to me like ... (Score:2)
Actually, for sarcasm, it was pretty badly done. Good sarcasm is easy to tell from idiocy/ignorance. The exaggerations are _too_ ridiculous, the points made are _too_ silly. The post I replied to was nothing like that. It was poorly written, plain and simple. The author really, truly sounded ignorant.
Also, I notice someone else at +5 with reply which was similar to mine in that it also took that post seriously. Whatever.
I dunno about ethics, but... (Score:5, Funny)
Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if ATI leaked this mod in the first place. Just think of all the money they save on voided warrantys alone. Not to mention tech support...
"Hello, ATI technical support. Can I help you?"
"Yeah, I have a problem with my video card. It keeps locking up"
"I see... what kind of card is it?"
"Well, it's a 9500, but I modded it so that..."
*click*
Re:I dunno about ethics, but... (Score:2)
Actual cost is... (Score:2)
- Initial investment is one half of the cost of a Radeon 9700
- You screw it up in any one of a hundred different ways and the magic smoke escapes
- You get pissed off and purchase a the new GeForce card when it comes out instead
Final cost is nearly twice a Radeon 9700. Hmmm...Convert ANY card (Score:5, Funny)
Sounds familiar... (Score:3, Interesting)
DDR only needs a TNT2 (Score:2, Funny)
make it perform the same as a Radeon DDR
For me, DDR [stepmania.com] performs perfectly well even with an old beat-up TNT2.
Re:DDR only needs a TNT2 (Score:2)
Nothing Wrong With this from a buisness point. (Score:3, Insightful)
Also, the same applies to this ati hack. While many people can afford the 9500, far less are willing to spring for the 9700. As such, ATI is STILL selling cards. Bottom line, if it is moving product out the door, it's a good business deal. Add this to the fact that ATI may entice former nvidia-only people to try their products, and this software hack (the hardware hack is no longer necessary with Wizzards and Rivatuner software hacks out) becomes a means for ATI to get a load of free press/publicity/interest, and sell some cards.
Cant Be legal (Score:2, Offtopic)
Plus it smells of 'reverse engineering'..
Today, both of these gets you in trouble.
Your card is NOT just hardware (Score:2)
While we can debate their ablity to re-possess your card, they can revoke your right to *use* it.
Underage Contracts (Score:2)
Or your parents are libel for your actions, depending on the jurisdiction in your area.
( not saying I agree with this nonsense, or the enforceability of the silly EULA's.. I'm only talking about the letter of the law here..
What puzzles me about the 9700... (Score:2)
sPh
Don't do this, overclock a Radeon 9700 NON pro (Score:3, Interesting)
ATI could have taken better preventive measures (Score:2)
Some tips. (Score:3, Informative)
1) Use low heat and good solder a 63/27 tin content.
2) Use a small tip, and I mean small, not the stock screwdriver tip!
3) Use flux, most people don't and wonder why the solder doesn't melt.
4) If you dont want the little SMD to "stick" to anything else, cover the other solder point with a little oil (just clean it when you are done)
5) Don't get frustrated, just take a break if you feel yourself getting worked up.
6) Do use an ESD strap and make sure you and the strap are grounded.
7) If you have not done much soldering don't do it, unless you have money to burn along with your finger tips.
Re:Some tips. (Score:2, Informative)
Don't use your cheap two prong plug iron. Your iron MUST have a ground lead, or you WILL zap your chips.
More tips. (Score:2)
2) A large tip can be filed down to a small one. Sometimes they're copper, sometimes they're iron. Either is soft enough to be easily worked, but copper can get rather flimsy if filed down too small; be careful with it.
3) Avoid acid flux like you find at the hardware store. Acid flux is for plumbing projects, where it's actually desirous to have a bit of metal eaten away to get a clean surface to accept solder. With SMD work, a little bit of metal disappearing can mean that -all- of it disappearing. Water-soluable flux is available, and works fine. Look for it if you have any intent on cleaning the board once you're done with it. Otherwise, rosin flux is fine, but can be difficult to clean in a world without CFCs.
4) There is no 4)
5) Work slow. Double-check what you've done, and then check it again.
6) Ground yourself. Ground your work area, if conductive. Avoid working on surfaces capable of holding a static charge, which could discharge through the part you're working on into your grounded body. Wooden benches are good for this. Failing that, a disposable pie pan, aluminum foil, or other metallic kitchen object would probably be fine.
7) If you have not done much soldering, you wouldn't have read this far. Thus, I suggest that you not undertake any project involving surface-mount components, and get back to wasting time on Slashdot in between gaming sessions of humanly indiscernable framerate on your Radeon 9500. You'll thank me later.
Re:Some tips. (Score:2)
Kill joys (Score:3, Interesting)
Afterwards... (Score:3, Funny)
</sarcasm>
Old-skool radeon (Score:2, Funny)
The DMCA has nothing to do with this. (Score:5, Interesting)
You Bastards! (Score:4, Funny)
Re:The DMCA has nothing to do with this. (Score:2, Interesting)
Access to a work (Score:2)
You are circumventing this technical access method to gain access to their work.
Pretty straightforward to me.
But it is still a dumb law.
Re:The DMCA has nothing to do with this. (Score:3, Insightful)
Since this mod apparently requires you to flash the 9500 with the 9700 firmware, you would at very least be violating copyright on the 9700 firmware. Unless, of course, you somehow paid for a copy of the 9700 firmware. The only way I know to do that would be to buy a 9700, and not actually use it.
Re:The DMCA has nothing to do with this. (Score:2)
Right track, wrong side of the road. Unless that firmware has a license allowing such things (and it probably doesn't), copying that firmware was against copyright laws long before the DMCA.
Unless there was some circumvention of an anti-copying mechanism or a VCR without automatic gain control involved, I don't think the DMCA has dick to do with this, as parent stated.
Title 17 covers more than copyright (Score:3, Informative)
It [bans] circumvention of protected copyrighted works.
No, 17 USC 1201(a) [cornell.edu] bans circumvention of access control on works under any Title 17 monopoly. Copyright is only a small part of Title 17 [cornell.edu], which also includes protection of original circuits (chapter 9) and original vessel hull designs (chapter 13).
What copy protection scheme does this mod allow us to circumvent?
This mod circumvents the part of the board that controls access to the extra Radeon 9700 functional units on the chip. Because the chip's layout is a mask work under 17 USC chapter 9, it's a "work protected under this title" for the purposes of section 1201.
Suing does not imply law (Score:2)
I doubt it (Score:2)
sPh
Re:Do we not care about ethics? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Do we not care about ethics? (Score:2)
I don't think it is.
Still, there's a difference.
The TV-company is selling you the channels as a service, and by cracking your TV-decoder you're taking that service without paying.
ATI is selling you the 9700 with extra memory. By doing the "improve the card"-thingie yourself you're doing the service to yourself. No "taking" involved.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:You are going to get flamed... (Score:2)
Repeat after me: ``It is not my responsibility to make sure a company turns a profit." I know this who Mandrake donation thing might have confused people, but the fact is that businesses do not set prices at a dangerous level... and if they do, they go out of business, and their successors do not make the same mistake.
Since ATI has been around long enough to know how the world works, I am sure they know what they are doing. If this hack results in lost sales, they can simply drop the price of the 9700 to reasonable levels, and it will no longer be worth the risk of modding your current card.
Welcome to capitalism... Stay around a while, and you might learn something.
Re: (Score:2)
Re:You are going to get flamed... (Score:2)
Capitalism has worked incredibly well for hundreds of years, all across the world. Some geeks modifying a videocard is not going to bring the system to a crashing halt.
Likewise, if you think ATI needs your charity, you are gravely mistaken.
Re: (Score:2)
Re:You are going to get flamed... (Score:3, Insightful)
You say that the modification of a video card will drive ATI out of business. Since ATI is a capitalistic company, that statement applies quite well.
You call what I say "Straw man arguments", then say:
Comparing a product (ATI video card) with a service (DirecTV)...
Gee, I guess if I modify my VCR to record at a slower speed I will single-handedly bring the blank-tape industry to a crashing halt... Maybe I should leave all my electrical appliances on all the time or else the power companies will be comming to a crasing halt... Maybe I should buy the least fuel-effecient vehicle, or else the gas industry will come to a crashing halt... These are all perfectly valid analogies of you arguement, and do a good job of illustrating the fallacies in your arguement.
I think you should take a look at your own messages before you start name-calling. (An all too common tactic on Slashdot)
Re: (Score:2)
Re:You are going to get flamed... (Score:2)
There are no similiarites between a subscription service, and a video card... You did the same thing you are accusing me of.
____
You never used those words... But your point was no different. Hell, that was essentially an abbreviaton, rather than saying: "If I modify my VCR [blah blah blah] it will be depriving the VCR tape industry of money that it is entitled to have, hence, driving their profit margins lower, and subsequently making their position unsustainable", I just shortened it to what you read. Sure, "single-handedly" was an exaggeration, but that's not a show-stopper.
You call it straw man all you want, but it's a perfectly valid analogy that goes along with what you have been saying.
____
Ah, and you meant what, when you said the following?
You are clearly implying the end of their "[survival]"...
Then, in case that wasn't already clear enough:
And just a little more...
Ah, I see. So you never said anything about driving "ATI out of business". So you must have thought that ATI was going to loose their "razor-thin profit margins", was going to go "belly-up", and not be able to "remain profitable", but you "did not say" they would go "out of business." ???
____
Would you like to know what I think? I think, somewhere along the way you read some counter arguements, and since you could not defend your position, you tried to slide into a entirely different position. It's almost the inverse of straw man. You changed your own position, the argued in favor of it (the new position).
You look like an idiot because of what you said, not what I've said.
If what I've written already hasn't changed your mind (or perhaps you refuse to accept it) then there's not much more I can do here. It's utterly useless to debate with someone when they have no sense of rationality.
So, I'll let you have the last word. You can start name-calling, or plead your innocence, and that I'm putting words into your mouth, if you want to... but I wont read it, and I don't believe your little game of shifting from one position to another, and being as vague as possible, is going to convince anyone else, either... Have a nice life.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Do we not care about ethics? (Score:4, Insightful)
No, it's not stealing. For it to be stealing, you would have to take something without the owner's consent. As it is, you're simply depriving them of money you _otherwise_ might have given them, had you not known how to turn a 9500 into a 9700. That's not theft at all.
Maybe ATi could argue that they're entitled to the money - that these people are enjoying the benefits of owning a 9700 card without having paid for one. But they haven't _stolen_ it, they've simply obtained the benefits by unconventional means. AFAIK there's no law against upgrading and overclocking; maybe there was something in the EULA for the drivers, but apart from that there's no problem.
Re:Do we not care about ethics? (Score:2)
Re:Do we not care about ethics? (Score:2)
Remember where you're posting. This is
Re:Do we not care about ethics? (Score:2)
Your concern is justified; I kindly explain... (Score:2, Insightful)
You have provided no evidence of anyone stealing; you have no reason to show guilt: some people are buying Radeon 9500 models and behold they are owned by them and discovered they are realy a 9700 model in disguise! Speaking in another capacity, this is truly grounds for lawsuit unto ATI for deceptive marketing.
Of'course, I think ATI is making good products, yet the age-old concern of theft still arises and you have honestly and bravly asked that age-old question: Is it stealing when we bought a product and discovered it to be another more costly product and by our respect of returning products for refund that occur in the opposite occurence, do we return our products to ATI? Here's your answer: a financial transaction took place, you are under contracted law that may or may not allow you to return a product that had been sold upon the truths as being lawfully or unlawfully guise.
So, my joke for you is...Take it back to ATI, tell them they sold you a ATI Radeon 9700 and they'll give you company credit of the value of that Radeon 9700 to apply for the selection of another product and possibly you will get a refund.
OK I'M JOKING! Think of it as another way: ATI has given you a benefit (or blessing, if you will) and they have given you an incompletly implemented Radeon 9700, marketed as a 9500 and sold half price, and it is up to your own time or skill or merit to finish their incomplete manufacture to a complete Radeon 9700.
Hey, if someone gave you a Manshion that was half-finished/half-destroyed, would you thank them or tell them it would be a steal for you to purchase it from them at such a low cost? It's the market, buddy. ATI is aware of this and perhaps due to the 9500 and 9700 being under ATI's poor marketers, they'll change or have already changed the future Radeon 9500 to be a more deceptive and unmodifiable Radeon 9700 product that proves to require more time or skill or merit for the owner to complete its manufacture.
I remember the ol' Total Recal movie that makes me laugh... Douglas Quait wakes up in a Taxi, the driver is a robot. The transcript is like this:
Quait: How did I get here?
Taxi: I'm sorry, will you please re-phrase your question.
Quait: How did I get in this Taxi?
Taxi: The door opened, you got in...Hell of a day, isn't it?
Re:This is not a good idea. (Score:5, Funny)
...which leads to an inversely proportional reaction in the chamber injectors causing a core breach?
;)