The Indian Info-Rickshaws 205
DoomDoom writes "CNN is running a story
on how the Indian government is delivering health and educational services on a WiFi equipped rickshaw to the poorest of its citizens. It's a poetical union of a typical third world product with high-tech! Do you still think computing is unnecssary for the poorest of the poor?"
Hard Life (Score:5, Insightful)
"By using computers, I can improve my knowledge," Sharma, whose parents plan to pull her out of school at 15
Ouch. I complain that I only was able to go to a technical school [putting myself through college now]; at least I got to finish out high school.
It amazes me everytime I read about how hard so many people have it, then I look around and see these hideously overweight people driving SUVs, tossing out food, with a ridiculous sense of entitlement (e.g. "society owes me because I'm special") to that effect.
I wonder if more of us in America will ever wake up and realize how good we have it? Yes, of course, the wealth/technology/etc we have introduces its own set of problems, (e.g. SCO, Microsoft, obeisty, ...) but I'd rather
deal with that anyday than lack of education or starvation.
Re:Hard Life (Score:1, Insightful)
It's called Capitalism and a free market, and it's sharma's best chance of getting out of poverty. The person driving the SUV made money for some car company that has probably outsourced some of it's IT work to India.
I wonder if more of us in America will ever wake up and realize how good we have it?
If the American consumer stops consuming, there will be a more poorer people in the third world, not l
Re:Hard Life (Score:2, Insightful)
Define "glut" (Score:1, Informative)
Given the imperfections in any distribution system, the only way to make sure the poorest can get enough food to avoid starvation is to make it obscenely cheap.
Ever notice how the help for the poor is the US has changed "ending starvation" to "stopping malnutrition" to "feeding the hungry".
Yes, in the last few decades the US has eliminated starvation and undernutrition within its borders.
Pssst - don't tell the UN....
Re:Define "glut" (Score:2)
Re:Define "glut" (Score:2)
Ripley had one. "Nuke the site from orbit."
You can't be serious. (Score:2)
You seem to be under the delusion that governments and NGOs care what we think. If you aren't connected or sufficiently wealthy to buy your way into the "connected", they are simply not interested in anything you have to say, though the NGOs wiil be happy to accept your tax-deductible contributions.
For instance, here's a one sentence solution to the energy crisis and global warming:
Replace fossil fuel with
Re:Hard Life (Score:1)
It is hard to believe, but a call center near my house in delhi (India) has over 10000 workers in it corresponding to calls from the UK only. The also
Re:Hard Life (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Hard Life (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Hard Life (Score:3, Interesting)
Offshoring puts IT people in the US out of work, permanently (unless they have other skills or the resources to retrain for something that hasn't been offshored yet). Even if they do work again, it is at a lower salary. All that consuming power that IT people had here will be gone. And thus, third world people will be poorer. Not much of a benefit to them, is it?
Re:Trick answer...Insightful? (Score:2)
Re:Hard Life (Score:4, Interesting)
Ain't that how it is everywhere brother..... (Score:2)
I'm really moved by the idea of Rikshaws with mobile information on them. I'm sure that someone here could come up with a ba
Re:Is US so different? (Score:2)
The problem with distributing the wealth is that in these cases (as it seem
the real question is... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:the real question is... (Score:3, Informative)
Yeah, but it's Indian English. (Score:1, Interesting)
The Indian guys I work with are always talking about "veediables"[1] and whatnot. In print, though, there's no accent, so no problem.
This is precisely why India is such a bonanza for outsourcing: An incredible number of Indians are well-educated and speak English. Probably more English speakers in India than any of the countries where it's the official first language.
More power to 'em, I say.
[1] Variables.
Re:Yeah, but it's Indian English. (Score:2)
Re:Yeah, but it's Indian English. (Score:2)
Re: YES (Score:2)
Indian work ethics ... (Score:2)
I'm in office (software firm) from 10 AM to 10 PM , but somewhere in the middle afternoon there comes a time when work is too too hard , and I kick back with a little Quake3
Work ethic in India is a LOT different
Perfect for unemployed techworkers ... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Perfect for unemployed techworkers ... (Score:4, Informative)
unlike chinese rickshaws, indian rickshaws are not pulled, they are driven [wikipedia.org]
Re:Perfect for unemployed techworkers ... (Score:2, Informative)
Actually India has both kinds of rickshaws, the human powered ones and those of the automobile kind. In bigger cities - like Delhi - where distances are greater, automobile rickshaws (or simply auto-rickshaws) are more practical. In smaller cities and towns, human powered cycle rickshaws are more popular 'cause they are greatly cheaper for the same given distance.
Slashdot parody (Score:5, Funny)
Grumble, grumble...populism...communism...grumble grumble!
Well... (Score:2)
"By using computers, I can improve my knowledge," Sharma, whose parents plan to pull her out of school at 15, said in Hindi, before joining a class on Web cameras. "And that will help me get a job when I grow up. (Emphasis mine)
Now, she didn't specify whose job she wanted, but...
Re:Well... (Score:2)
Who? Me? (Score:2)
I'm going to assume this is a joke, just like the joke I made. It offends me that you would dig up a comment that disgusting, but I'm just going to count to ten and tell myself it's just a joke. It pisses me off that you would presume to know me to make such a vile remark, especially in response to a very mild jibe at a nameless person in a CNN story, but again, I'll just tell myself it's a joke.
But you think you know me, eh?
<rant>
I too have worked w
Re:Slashdot parody (Score:3, Insightful)
Many Americans have this insane fear certain types of jobs going to third-world countries will
Re:Slashdot parody (Score:1)
effectiveness? (Score:4, Insightful)
How is this really effective?
With a single rickshaw, even with decent class organization, how are these skills going to help people get better jobs or do their work better? Especially when they are barely completing junior high school years?
While it is a nice way to spread tech around, I dont see how it makes life better for people than the same amount of money in other educational things (books, teachers, that much money goes a long way).
Re:effectiveness? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:effectiveness? (Score:1)
To me this seems like a very trivial and probably ultimately useless pursuit. How about giving the people some running water? Or electricity? Maybe some effective anti-malaria drugs so that they don't die?
WiFi technology is great... only because we already have our running water and electricity. 3rd World countries lack even the basic infrastructure for a decent standard of living. Until we get that fixed, any cool gizmo is going to be completely lost upon the people.
Re:effectiveness? (Score:4, Insightful)
In the same way as every open door - put yourself in their position and think about it...
Re:effectiveness? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:effectiveness? (Score:1)
Just because you're getting seed prices and fertilizer news over a box, which makes rounds in 10 villages is not effective. You'd rather want the print media, which you can
Re:effectiveness? (Score:2)
Re:effectiveness? (Score:2)
Why shouldn't this guy?
Re:effectiveness? (Score:3, Insightful)
Perhaps I am reading more into these 3 paragraphs than I should be, but I think giving somebody like Sharma a hint that she can be somethi
broadband+cheap computing might be vital for us (Score:5, Insightful)
If you want to build community here in America, where mass media has supplanted our face to face community, cheap wireless broadband might be vital. Otherwise, you get a hollow corporate teevee community, which pushed hollow corporate consumer values into children's heads. When Americans get online, they can rebuild that community. Cheap computers and broadband are needed in order to distribute video entertainment, which need not be produced by large corporations.
Re:broadband+cheap computing might be vital for us (Score:3, Insightful)
it takes years, and some don't like to read (Score:2)
Video entertainment is a great way to instill memes in young minds. What has happened in the free software movement will be repeated in the Free Video Movement. Thouands of people all over the world will be able to collaborate on homebrew movies, sitc
Are they really trying? (Score:4, Insightful)
Probably every single one of you reading this post has spent more time in front of your computer today than these people will, at a rickshaw, in a month. And the Indian government wants to "... use technology to improve education, health care and access to agricultural information in India's villages ..."? If they were serious about that they'd create a tiny computer center in each village and instead of sending rickshaws around, send teachers instead.
Re:Are they really trying? (Score:1)
Re:Are they really trying? (Score:2, Informative)
If they were serious about that they'd create a tiny computer center in each village and instead of sending rickshaws around, send teachers instead.
There are a few barriers, from what I understand. One is communications lines, which don't exist in many of the rural areas. The other is that many rural Indians speak only a local dialect which isn't found on the Internet. It is possible that the tech support that goes along with the rickshaw also provides some translation facilities to help people make use
cost (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:cost (Score:5, Insightful)
It costs that much because you have to have enough money to pay for the lawyers you employ to go after people that speak out against your product.
Re:cost (Score:1)
Re:cost (Score:2)
Since this
Re:cost (Score:3, Insightful)
Probably, but because richer economies have to produce more robust products to even be considered for funding. If these rickshaws hit the US market, people like you would be complaining how terrible they are, how the range sucks, how painfully heavy they are, how big of flop they will be, etc.
Also, look at these things, those are full sized PCs in there, not laptops. In an economy where people
Re:cost (Score:2)
Bullshit. People in rich economies as people in poor economies have to produce products that make money. Look at Microsoft and Linux as an example.
Microsoft is getting a lot of funding to create new products while Linux houses aren't getting as much. Can you tell why since Linux is much more robust?
rickshaw protocol? (Score:2)
On a more serious note, where does the thing get power? And if there's already a power outlet wherever it travels, why not just put in a low cost PC permanently and save all the pedalling?
Re:rickshaw protocol? (Score:1)
Re:rickshaw protocol? (Score:2)
On a lighter note... (Score:5, Funny)
(By reading this post you agree to not take the previous sentence seriously. This agreement takes effect the instant your eyes meet the words in this post. No, you can not reject this agreement! Too late!)
Government initiatives (Score:4, Interesting)
In the article, it mentions many Indian villages are poorly wired, telephone lines can go dead for weeks at a time, making wireless technology the most reliable Web connection.
However, what it takes is a willing government to find an alternative, rather than giving promises to improve telephone lines.
For the love of the children, feed them first (Score:1)
Does India not know that patience will bring technology to them in least expense? Please wait, let the people and corporations at these united States of America pay for the R
Re:For the love of the children, feed them first (Score:2)
Hint- growing "organic" food without any benefit of modern science results in sickly, poor producing crops. So they'd be best not to ask Hollywood for gardening
Poetical? (Score:3)
I'll bet it's even poetic, which is how most normal people would have put it since "poetical" is an extremely uncommon word and the more proper usage is, indeed, "poetic".
... oh wait, terribly sorry. Forgot where I was for a second. Stupid me.
Re:Poetical? (Score:2)
Re:Poetical? (Score:2)
Oh, it's a real word, it's just a stupid one. It's become a sort of informal synonym of 'poetic' through common misuse (the same way 'virii' came into existance). It's still not the generally accepted word, 'poetic' is still the "normal" way of saying it.
But, of course, with Malda leading the downhill charge in communications skills here on Slashdot, I suppose this isn't the least bit surprising...
Re:Poetical? (Score:1, Offtopic)
A really bad latency (Score:2)
Re:A really bad latency (Score:2, Informative)
This is a very bad idea... (Score:1)
(Alternate challenge to Slashdotters: What is the correct verb for 'pulling a rickshaw'? I bet that Jepoardy punk would know...)
Re:This is a very bad idea... (Score:1, Funny)
Masturbation?
Poorest of the poor (Score:1, Insightful)
I asked. They'd like some housing, food, maybe some clothes and some medical help first. But thanks for asking!
Re:Poorest of the poor (Score:2)
Somehow, I don't think you asked at all, or read TFA.
So here we go again. "The people of [insert non-white foreign country here] need food and shelter before they start trying to earn money doing all the things that us smart white folks do.... blah blah blah [insert rest of half-baked /. mantra here]"
Here is the news. There is no famine underway in India right now. In India there is a middle class and there is also
Re:Poorest of the poor (Score:2)
Programming jobs exported to Ireland? No problem. Programming jobs exported to India? A problem.
Technological development in Eastern Europe? Let's talk about the technology. Technological development in India? Let's jump to the conclusion that those people don't need technology because they're barely capable of feeding themselves [not true], to say nothing of understanding what a computer is or gaining any benefit from it [not true
Re:Poorest of the poor (Score:2, Insightful)
Liar.
Most poor in the 3d world are, and have been, scraping by with barely enough housing, food, clothing and medical for generations. They're quite familiar with how to get by that way, thank you very much.
The ones that aren't stupid, which is remarkably many of them, know that the only way out of this multi-generational rut is by learning a skilled trade.
It sounds like the bulk of the
From the picture .. (Score:1)
Re:From the picture .. (Score:1, Offtopic)
What's the platform (Score:1)
Re:What's the platform (Score:1)
What about, say, *vaccines*? (Score:5, Insightful)
As to who thinks there are better places to put resources, none other than Bill and Melinda Gates [gatesfoundation.org] think so. Two of the high profile efforts are and AIDS vaccine [rubella.net] and TB efforts [healthylivingeating.com], although there's plenty more fronts they're throwing financing at.
I remember an interview with him (can't find it online) where he recalled being at a meeting with dozens of people pitching high tech solutions to Third World problems and him rejecting almost all of them in favor of vaccines. He said it was silly to start laying down fiber optic cable (this was a few years before WiFi) in an area where you couldn't draw clean water from a well.
Now, don't get me wrong. Any effort that conveys health information or basic education to people who need it is, by definition, a Good Thing (TM). Also, this is an indigenous effort of Indians (presumably the Indian government) helping their own, not someone outside trying to find the best place to spend their money. One would assume (and the photos of healthy people in TFA certainly imply) they've already got their vaccination, clean water, and hunger plans already in place, so they might as well experiment with alternate education efforts.
Still, I have to wonder about the long term viability of this project. With India's struggling masses, you have to wonder if the money might be better spent elsewhere.
Re:What about, say, *vaccines*? (Score:2, Insightful)
That's all well and good, but we're not talking about drawing fiber between villages.
We're talking about simply dragging some
Re:What about, say, *vaccines*? (Score:3, Insightful)
Good point, although I want to make sure you understand I do not object to the Infothela effort. It's well worth throwing some money around and try new things, especially in areas that have all the basics (water, vaccines, etc) already handled. As I said, I'm a little dubious about the long term prospects for this, but it's gre
Re:What about, say, *vaccines*? (Score:2)
There was a guy lying on the street this morning by the freeway entrance. He'd slept on the sidewalk all night under a mound of brown-stained rags. People like that are all over San Francisco. Meanwhile, there's a big row over who's going to pay for the reconstruction of the eastern span of the Bay Bridge, and someone was getting a wirless network installed in his apartment somewhere else in the city. What will we do? Abandon all of human
Re:What about, say, *vaccines*? (Score:2)
Re:What about, say, *vaccines*? (Score:2, Insightful)
I have to wonder about the long term viability of this project. With India's struggling masses, you have to wonder if the money might be better spent elsewhere.
With equal access to education, maybe they could learn to do a lot more stuff for themselves. Perhaps they could learn enough to be able to contribute something valuable to society, and then have the ability to buy vaccines on their own.
This same defense against providing equal access to educational resources always comes up in these discussion
Re:What about, say, *vaccines*? (Score:2)
You really should go and take a peek at the Gates foundation website. They really are going off and trying to put some of that money to good use and with very little fanfare, too. I agree that you can't simply prop up impovrished populations with aid and ignore higher issues, but the simple fact is that in an environment with massive infant mortality, starvation, or AIDs inspired civil wars, no one is g
Its different (Score:1)
Why it's on wheels (Score:2)
Only when it's benefiting Indians
william gibson? (Score:4, Funny)
WiFi Rickshaws? (Score:2)
The third world meets the Superhighway (Score:2, Interesting)
When people from my company travel to rural India and mention who they work for, people immediately assume they build toilets!
Still have doubts!! (Score:2, Interesting)
Token Effort (Score:3, Insightful)
Rumor has it that this project only ever sent and received a handful of emails before everyone lost interest.
It turned out that internet is pretty irrelevant to the locals. The only people who got anything out of it were the aid workers who got covered on CNN.
An email connection that is only available once a week at best when the rickshaw comes round is not much value to anyone, especially if you dont know anyone else who has an email address. Teaching spreadsheets and MS Word is not much value in a community which has no computers the rest of the week. If you are reliant on subsistence agriculture like I suspect most of these villages are, you are likely more worried about digging your fields by hand than calculating crop yields. Telemedicine is all very well but irrelevant if you cant afford the drugs or surgery required. There is very little internet content relevant to a rural farmer. Any grand talk of eGovernment are pointless if your local government is not on line.
The best you can hope for is a couple of kids get a glimpse of the outside world and get the ambition and drive to get out and make something of themselves.
The people who set up these projects on the other hand get to pat each other on the back, fly off to nice conferences in expensive hotels where they tell each other about how valuable their work is, and of course appear on CNN.
In my experience as soon as there is a community has a purpose for an internet connection, the free market kicks in and internet cafes spring up like mushrooms. As any traveler will tell you most moderately prosperous 3rd world towns are full of internet cafes full of local kids IMing each other.
A better use of government time would be laying copper (or even fiber) to these villages so they could start with a phone connection, and then use government policy to keep internet connection costs down.
A better use of our resources would be to stop subsidizing our farmers so that the 3rd world poor can compete fairly and work themselves out of poverty.
It makes a big difference (Score:3, Insightful)
Secondly, being an Indian, I can tell you this (and similar technology related efforts) make a big difference. In a lot of different ways. While these projects may or may not fulfill their key goal (whatever this may be), what it does provide is a sense of confidence to the people. A feeling of being cared for by the government. A sense of being looked after. And then, all such gadgets/advancements still generate a sense of wonder in the people. There is a sense of novelty associated to such devices/initiatives.
The point I'm trying to convey is, in the more developed world, such devices or initiatives happen far too often (and maybe even at a faster pace). For a big, poor country, that broke out of the shackles not too long ago (we have been independent only 60 years now), such initiatives bring about lot of self belief and confidence.
Middle-class English Hippies? (Score:2)
http://psand.net/itrike/ [psand.net]
Strictly speaking a hand-pulled version of this machine is a Rickshaw (or Jinrikisha - Japanese for Man propelled vehicle) and one pulled by a bike - i.e. a trike is a Velotaxi.
Re:necessity (Score:4, Interesting)
Where is Autopr0n? (Score:2)
~S
Re:I could care less about poor people in India (Score:5, Insightful)
Secondly:
You're absolutely correct. It is just you. If you're not interested in the article just because it's not about something more interesting (like Scott Peterson's latest hairstyle or the outcome of the six-hour finale of 'Who'll hook up with the mad axe murderer?') then I respectfully suggest that you move along. The majority of people onRe:I could care less about poor people in India (Score:1)
Most of India is in povety, you first say that they are great people (i.t.o. character and the like) but then justify your uncaring attitude because they are getting 'your' jobs and smell different to you. This is fickle. The reason why they have 'your' jobs is because 'your' corperations decide that it is better to make a buck than to employ peoplr at home. This is part of the g
Re:I could care less about poor people in India (Score:2)
Re:Poor people could care less (Score:4, Insightful)
When oh when will the /. crew get it into their heads that the rest of the world is not living in filth, squalor and poverty? They have a middle class in India too you know! Jeez! I mean, which is it? Are the Indians robbing us of our god-given, high-skill programming jobs or are they living in mud-huts and unable to read or write? Make up your minds!
Re:Poor people could care less (Score:2)
You could pick any country, pick a random amount of money, state the number of people earning less than it, and insist that all activities that are not directed at solving the more basic problems should be directed thereto. It's like the critics of the space program who think that money not spent sending Cassini to Saturn will benefit the poor of Chicago. It ain't gonna happen, t
Re:Waste (Score:2, Insightful)
Instead by providing a means to allow the people to educate themselves, they and their peers will be able to improve their own situation and
Re: Where is the WiFi? (Score:2)