The Ten Worst Products of the Year

WaZiX writes "Not sure what you want to buy for christmas? Well me neither, but PCMag has an interesting article on what they consider to be the 10 worst products of the year, so at least you know what not to buy. Helpful article that picked out products from different categories such as PDA's, Notebooks and MP3 players."

Missing option

[Anonymous Coward]

Slashdot subscription?

Re:Missing option

[nhaines]

Goatse Guy Lapel Pin?

Re:Missing option

[phorm]

Shares of SCO stock?

Re:Missing option

[jellomizer]

No way the Slashdot subscription is the best way to read the article before it gets slashdotted. Plus it reduces the number of Lame Attemps to get first posts. Increases the chance that the first posts are actually insightful and are on topic.

Re:Missing option

[System.out.println()]

I think Fark's attempts at preventing FP wars are the best: replace the phrase "first post" with "boobies" or "weeners". Then you get publicly scorned and hilarity ensues.

"I got the Weeners losers! HAHAHAHAHA"

Re:Missing option

[gl4ss]

if it's going to be slashdotted.. it'll get dotted anyways(or mirrored). it's not like there's much point in refreshing slashdot constantly anyways.

and if you're NOT a subscriber.. then hopefully some of the dupes get filtered away before you see them.

Re:Missing option

[nordicfrost]

No way the Slashdot subscription is the best way to read the article before it gets slashdotted

See the star next to my name? It won't be there for long since I discovered that I have already read 5/6ths of the stories before the ever get on Slashdot, much lesss gett Slashdotted.

My last subscription at Slashdot for sure.

Interesting Thought...

[ParadoxicalPostulate]

Would be funny if they put PC Magazine on that list.

Re:Interesting Thought...

[wishlish]

Given that one of their "Best Fall Software Downloads" was riddled with spyware (as I found out the hard way!), I'm all for this. Any major magazine recommending vendors of malware will never get my attention again.

Re:Interesting Thought...

[gcaseye6677]

I will never again download anything from download.com without thoroughly researching it, since most of what they have now is full of the nastiest kind of spyware/adware/crapware. It will be very hard to fight the spyware battle when some of the organizations in the computer industry that are thought of as reputable end up pushing out spyware to their users.

Re:Interesting Thought...

[StarTux]

And the fact that they recommended Dell, then across the to the right of the screen I see Dell is a partner.

Not quite go so far to totally discount them, but with knowledge of what they are about one can gleam some nuggets from them

Worth a subscription to PC Mag? No.

Re:Interesting Thought...

[OhPlz]

They should, that article was horrible. While there may have been some technical facts hidden in there I couldn't see them.. my eyes were rolling from the awful attempt at comedy.

Heck, I'm amazed PC Rag is still around.

Re:Interesting Thought...

[Anonymous Coward]

their comedy was just giga-crappy.

eMac

[hendridm]

The 40GB hard drive will fill up quickly, the lack of a DVD burner makes offloading files impossible, and the Radeon 9200 graphics card won't even run this fall's hot Mac games. And at around $800, this eMac ain't cheap.

His reviews mostly made sense except for the eMac rip. I'm not a huge Mac fan (nothing wrong with them, just not my cup of tea), but I thought he seemed to be targetting a different audience with his review of the eMac. 40GB would certainly not fill up quickly with the type of things my parents do on a computer, and I think anyone wishing to play "this fall's hottest games" wouldn't be considering an entry level computer. Finally, $800 seems to be about right for the price of an eMac. Sure, you can get a dell for $499 with a monitor (please don't correct the numbers), but Macintoshes cost more because they provide more value for their target audience. And when he said, "buy a Dell", does that mean if I pick an entry level Dell it will play "this fall's hottest games?" Although IANAG (gamer), something tells me you're not going to get stellar HL2 performance on an Intel 810.

Re:eMac

[TheRedHorse]

I'd also point out you can get an 80 GB drive with the emac if you wish, and a DVD burner is also available, their review of the eMac makes it seem that these options aren't available.

Re:eMac

[aldoman]

But it's an extra $100 for that!

Am I the only one that thinks paying $999 for a computer that Dell does with a flatpanel and twice the RAM for $699 is absolutely stupid?!

The eMac needs a real update. I'd be more than happy to pay $699 or even $799 for a G5-based 'pizza box' with which I can use my own monitor.

Re:eMac

[jedidiah]

Yes.

The Mac might be more expensive but it won't subject your giftee to any of the annoying malware associated with Windows. That's also something conspicuously left out of the original analysis. This is always swept under the rug.

Re:Any ware

[daviddennis]

There are enough programs for both Windows and Macintosh that any one individual could not possibly try all of them in her lifetime.

Unless you want software specifically targeted at some obscure niche, like an accounting system geared towards left-handed people who work in the trout farming industry, you'll find plenty of Mac software available.

Well, or unless you want ten million ways to wander around rooms and kill off robotic monsters, instead of only one million. Then I can't help you.

D

Re:Marketshare has everything to do with it.

[jedidiah]

It's not about the number of viruses. It's the NUMBER OF INFECTIONS. As recent common experience should have made you painfully aware of, vast parts of the planet can be infected by a the work of a single developer.

In a highly connected environment, it only takes ONE virus writer to cause havok on a planet of billions.

Viruses exist on any platform because they can. If they can be made, SOMEONE will make them.

These things don't require army divisions to pull off.

Re:eMac

[jawtheshark]

Yes.... Stupid from a monetary reason. You are absolutely right, but from a value reason: No. The eMac is a perfect investment for people who have light computing needs and need a reliable platform. Windows XP on a Dell (or any OEM) is just not reliable.

Why? Very simple: Spyware, viruses and other annoyances. I just spent the weekend of cleaning the 3 month (!!!) old Acer PC from one of my cousins. This cousin is not your local geek, he's a law student and uses his laptop for surfing, chat and writing papers. Hey, he's a student, he doesn't have tons of money, so he bought the cheapest laptop he could find: A Celeron with 256Meg RAM and 30Gig HD, Shared Graphics and whatnot. It ran Win-XP Home SP1, don't ask me why a OEM doesn't ship SP2 by default now... I suspect it cost him around 800Euro.
Now an entry level iBook is around 1200Euro, so it can't match in price. I'll grant you that. But what would have happened to my cousin if he didn't have a nice geek in the family willing to rip his hear out while cleaning up this barfed-up XP machine? He would have spent a lot of money by letting it be cleaned up by a company. If he would have opted for an iBook, it would have chugged along. His Acer was essentially a paperweight after 3 months of usage.

So, please, if you compare on price, also compare on value. I know I just compared a low-priced iBook with a low-priced laptop... The same hold for people not wanting portability: low-end Dell versus eMac.
I know that you and I wouldn't bother with such machines (though I own an iBook, because I am a "switcher"), but we are not low-usage-users.

Re:eMac

[jawtheshark]

Okay, let me restate that: a machine running XP is not reliable unless you know what you do. Hey, I know how to run any NT4 based Windows reliably (I have been running WinNT4, Win2k, WinXP Home and Pro) without any big problems whatsoever. The problem is: I know what I do.)

Windows can be reliable, it just isn't reliable without taking action yourself.

Even if the Dell was $1 and the iBook was $50000 according to you the iBook would still be a better choice because I want a reliable computer and a Dell just is not reliable.

No, because at a 1$ price, you could buy a new Dell every 3 months. Buying an iBook in that scenario would be idiot.
I'd like to know where I didn't stick to the facts. Please point out where. I challenge you to give a XP machine (bought straight from an OEM), give it to a non-geek student *and* keep it running reliably without making any changes to the basic configuration of the machine. If you can do that, I must tip my hat for you, and I'd be glad to take some sysadmin courses from you.

Re:eMac

[Lussarn]

Don't for one moment think a Mac is a unbreakable fort. Doesn't Apple have software updates, security issues. What happens if you don't patch a Mac? Possible intrusion is what happens, Same as on Wndows. Do you think I don't keep my boxes updated just because I run Linux?

Tell your friend not to install all that stuff that gives him malware.

Re:eMac

[jawtheshark]

I don't think it is an unbreakable fort, just as I know that OpenBSD, Linux, Solaris, whatever isn't unbreakable. OS X does have automatic updates, and they work very fine.

However, I can surf with Safari without getting drive-by-downloads, or whatnot. It is pretty much secure out of the box. Besides, there is not a single service active on a newly installed OS X. Windows XP SP2 has a firewall to protect its services now, but currently all OEMS ship with XP SP1.

Tell your friend not to install all th

NOT the same as on Windows

[SuperKendall]

What happens if you don't patch a Mac? Possible intrusion is what happens, Same as on Wndows.

Two things of note - if you don't patch a Mac, right now you have a working unpatched Mac. If you don't patch Windows (or even if you do), you PROBABLY have a comprimised computer for the majority of users. You are confusing two possibilities with the reality of the situation at hand.

Which leads me to my second point. All Macs come set up to update weekly, so issues are patched quickly - AND because of the security setup in OS X you'd have to have the administrator password from the user to be able to disable this process. On Windows it would be a lot easier for some spyware to stop Windows Update, or even redirect it to install more unpleasant things!

Macs may not be an unbreakable fort, but at least that have a fence and are in a good neighborhood!

Re:eMac

[fshalor]

Key** POSSIBLE... not probable.

And the autoupdates thing in a mac is a little more reliable than autoupdates in winXP. I've ran several mac's with and without virus scanners. None have had any problems.

I've gotta call back EVERY SINGLE FREAKIN winXP dell laptop at least every three months and wipe the bish out of it. Even patched, reconfigured, virusscanned, they all get something freaky. I've given up on fixing them and just wipe the drive each time.

I was just amuzed to even see PC mag flouted on /. ..

Re:eMac

[damiam]

Am I the only one that thinks paying $999 for a computer that Dell does with a flatpanel and twice the RAM for $699 is absolutely stupid?!

I agree with you completely. It'd be stupid to pay $999 for something that Dell does for $699. Now, show me where Dell sells a comparible machine (first hurdle: must run OSX) for $699.

Re:eMac

[damiam]

So where do you find a Dell that can run OSX (under PearPC) comparably to an eMac? Such a machine doesn't exist, let alone for $699.

Re:eMac

[garcia]

He also mentions that it doesn't have a DVD writer which will *not* allow for the "off-loading of files".

Well, I know plenty of people that don't have 40GB HDs and no DVD writer. Some people don't even have a DVD-ROM drive. Most people interested in the eMac line are probably low end users that aren't going to be "off-loading" great amounts of data to permanent backup anyway.

Re:eMac

[Eric S Raymond]

But we know the important question is really, will it run Emacs?

Text-based GUI though

[SuperKendall]

The draw of the other Emacs is that they are full versions - the one that comes with OS X is sadly only text-based (you have to run it in Terminal).

That's why I downloaded GnuEmacs and use that. And in answer to the other posters question, yes it uses standard OS X widgets so the text is AA.

Re:eMac

[jedidiah]

The notion that your archival device needs to be in your main chassis is just holdover from the PC mentality of the 80's and 90's that was driven by the general lameness of PC hardware. If something like firewire or SCSI is ubiquitous enough, you don't have to worry so much about what comes in the main case.

Re:eMac

[wizbit]

I think anyone wishing to play "this fall's hottest games" wouldn't be considering an entry level computer

Actually he said "this fall's hot Mac games," so that probably means Myth 2 and Marathon Infinity.

(i kid, i kid.)

Re:eMac

[operagost]

Don't forget Breakout and Super Breakout.

Re:eMac

[Laebshade]

World of Warcraft [worldofwarcraft.com] plays on Mac OSX. I'd say that's one of "this fall's hottest games" (since it came out in Nov.).

What are the game's system requirements?
[...]
Mac® System OS X 10.3.5 OS:

* 933 MHz or higher G4 or G5 processor
* 512 MB RAM or higher; DDR RAM recommended
* ATI or NVIDIA video hardware with 32 MB VRAM or more
* 4 GB or more of available hard drive space
* MacOS X 10.3.5 or newer
* 56k or higher modem with an Internet connection

Re:eMac

[Anonymous Coward]

It is a bit odd. I just looked at Dell prices (of course I might have missed systems, do correct me if I'm wrong). Dells are 40GB drives until you get to $899 systems. Nor do they contain DVD burners( or even CD burners) until you hit above the eMac price. Nor do they have even ATI or nvidia graphics, but onboard intel stuff. Doesn't look much different to me.

"Don't buy an eMac cos it sucks at X, Y and Z. Buy a dell instead, they also suck at X, Y and Z"

Re:eMac

[aldoman]

You are probably looking at the wrong line of Dells. Dells website is pretty poor unless you know what you are doing and you'll soon find you can build the exact same machine with the same specs for radically different prices just by going on different paths on the website.

Look at the 4200 I think. They are the cheapest, and sure, they have onboard video but the Radeon 9200 is shit anyway. And you can add whatever AGP graphics card, something I'd take over a built in 9200 card.

Re:eMac

[Golias]

I should also add that I know somebody who has an eMac (which he bought for video editing... He uses an external firewire drive for higher-capacity storage) and he's been playing the very hottest of "this fall's hottest games" (World of Warcraft) on it and has been very pleased with the performance.

Re:eMac

[bhima]

The eMac is the only device on that list I've had contact with. My Mum and little sister have an eMac & iMac respectivly. Neither of them play games but my Nieces & Nephews do and they seem pretty OK with both systems. Neither of them are even close to filling up the hard drive. Both went to a computer shop on their own to compare prices and had the sales guy tell them that the $499 loss leader PC was worse than useless and that they needed to spend $999.

Also I have a Dual G5 PowerMac with a total of 1.3 Terabytes of digital photos which I don't have a problem moving about with GigE or Firewire. Hasn't this guy ever heard of Firewire, USB and Ethernet?

I have to wonder how real is the rest of the list?

Re:eMac

[Beyond_GoodandEvil]

"...with a total of 1.3 Terabytes of digital photos."

Man that is a lot of pr0n, you sir are my hero.

Re:eMac

[phillymjs]

The low-end eMac is a perfectly fine entry-level machine. It can't burn DVDs, but it can burn CD-R/RW discs. I've got a client with a dozen eMacs, and they don't feel slow to me when I work on them. It takes a looooong time for the average home user to fill up a 40GB HDD (on a machine that can't get pwned and become some Russian kid's private warez storage space, anyway). The only legitimate gripe he could really have made, he didn't make-- and that's that it should come with more than 256MB of RAM standard.

~Philly

Already Know that.

[jellomizer]

It is fairly common knowlege that the eMac is apples lowest end System. No one ever made the impression that it wasn't. The eMac was primarly made for educational usage. Which normally means that its useage would be Running a Word Processor, Browsing the internet. Running low end Sciencetific tools, that could probably run quicly on a 486 as well and some Educational Games. It keeps the CRT Screen because it is easier to clean up from pencel marks and takes scratches better. The extra price over say the $499 Dell is usually due to 1st Apple is getting a larger % of the profit, (Most PC manufacturars make there Low End system and sell it at very low margins so they can advertise the lower end PC and then most people will go to Dell.com then look around and order a higher priced one), Secondarly the eMac is build to be a little more solid then a Dell W. Monitor Which is part of the Educational Need for a computer, thridly because of Supply v. Demmand the supply for part to make an eMac is much smaller then the supply of part to make a low end PC, so the price is higher.

I find it disapointing that PC magazine decided to choose the eMac as its bad system to buy not because they chose an Apple computer but because there are so many Windows PC that are of very poor quality and are advertised as much more then they are. But it is no secret that PC magizene is no Fan of Apple anyways. Back when the PowerMac g5 was released their "Glowing" afermation of the G5s power was saying it was just as good as the top of he line PC.

Re:Already Know that.

[Psychotext]

I'm not picking on you, I just think "Sciencetific" is a seriously funky word. I plan on using it wherever possible in future!

"Blah, blah, blah, cold fusion, perpetual motion, time travel."

"You must be pretty clever, that all sounds very Sciencetific!" ;)

Re:eMac

[BenjyD]

I thought that too. I've just spent the weekend fiddling with my gf's parent's new eMac and it's a really good computer. It's easily fast enough for most uses, easy to use, looks good, has a far superior mouse and keyboard to any low-end dell I've used and has an operating system that makes WindowsXP look like something from the dark ages.

I'm about as far from your average Mac zealot as you can get (typing this on a home-built dual-boot Fedora/win2K system), but I'd be perfectly happy with an eMac on my desk.

Re:eMac

[Alexander]

Oh crap, here comes the "I can buy/build an AMD powered uber-monster PC running XYZ for the price of a Mac" comments.

For the past 7 years, every time there's been an article that mentions the price of an Apple computer, these people come out of the woodwork and go batsh!t trying to show us how frugal/industrious they can be without ever understanding the market dynamic.

Please, we all understand that you can build a "Most Excellent" PC with glowing neon lights and water cooling that SPECmarks the h3ll out of a dual processor G5 for $.75 Canadian and it will run Slackware and GiMP and MAME and dual boot into Windows XP Super Home edition and play Halo 7 and Duke Nuke 'em at the same time in separate windows because you're driving 18 LCDs with the Radeon super-nuclear video card that you can get at the local computer superhaus for $1.95 and two packs of bubblegum.

Mac users just don't care, Ok? We really, really, don't care.

Re:eMac

[gad_zuki!]

Its officially mac bashing time for some, which is funny as this is a board known for its windows bashing, but bring up Macs and suddenly there's no shortage of "we love MS/Dell!" Suddenly, all the problems with windows and dell's build quality are tossed out the window.

As far as the cheap crap revolution goes, one in five components I buy have to be RMA'd. The time I spent troubleshooting this (along with shipping, not mention waiting) usually costs more than the device itself. Don't get me wrong, if you're a geek and know how to build PCs and can spot a failing IDE controller a mile away, then go save yourself some money. But most people aren't, especially mac users.

These are two very different markets, but people will compare them regardless. I think its because they see OSX as a threat to their own pet UNIX. The enemy of my enemy, etc.

Re:eMac

[Octagon Most]

"You have got to be kidding me. This board is known to have more fierce Mac fanboys then even Linux sometimes. I mean, look at the mods, is even one negative Mac post modded up? .... Go through the Mac posts again...watch legitimate opinions about Macs be modded down..while people say something as worthless as "I heard my friend got great performance on WoW with an eMac" get modded +5 insightful (real example from this thread even)."

You, Sir, are correct. I am a huge Mac fan and I am going to forfeit my

Re:eMac

[Anonymous Coward]

For someone who "really, really" doesn't care...you sure went off on an emotionally charged rant. ;)

Re:eMac

[sg3000]

> His reviews mostly made sense except for the eMac rip

Agreed. If you wanted to play this year's hottest games, first you wouldn't get a Mac anyway.

If you want to play one of last year's hottest games, like Knights of the Old Republic, you wouldn't pick a $799 eMac (where the "e" stands for "economy", I guess). However, a $1299 iMac or even a $999 iBook could fit the bill (with a bit more memory). Not cheap, but it's nowhere near buying a dual G5 Power Mac with a 30" screen.

The eMac is more for people like my mother-in-law who just wants to write emails and go to those horrible greeting cards web sites. Calling the eMac one of the 10 worst products of the year because it has a relatively small hard drive or no DVD burner is simply missing the intended market for the product.

Apples aren't cheap, but they do provide a lot of value (i.e., quality in relation to price). This doesn't mean that it provides the fastest processor for the cheapest price; it means that it delivers the the highest valued attributes for a particular market segment for the price the segment is willing to pay. For example in one of my Marketing classes we studied how the iMac provided the highest price to quality of any product, to the point where Apple could have increased the price by 20% and still maintained sales. By keeping the price point where it was, Apple was able to gain market share. In fact, the two companies that gave the highest value were Apple (with the iMac) and Dell. The lowest were Gateway, Sony, and NEC.

Maybe PC Magazine was just looking for an obligatory bash against Apple since the iPod is so popular.

Re:eMac

[Golias]

a $799 eMac (where the "e" stands for "economy", I guess).

Actually, the e stands for "education."

The eMac was only ever intended to be a school computer. That's why it's really heavy, really sturdy, has a cheap-ish but rugged screen, and has the power button hidden on the back of it.

It just happened to turn out that a lot of consumers thought it would be a nifty machine for other situations where the LCD-based iMac was not really called for, and Apple decided, after the fact, to make it available.

I use one in my music studio with a MOTU DSP as my main record-to-HD system. I like that it's whisper-quiet thanks to the big slow-moving cooling fan yet still fast enough to run my multi-track recording software. Also, it fits nicely on top of my audio equipment rack.

Would I use it for a game PC? Nah. I know from seeing other people game with them that it can run a lot of games okay, but already I have a cheap home-brew PC for games.

It's all about the right tool for the job, as far as I'm concerned, and the eMac happens to fill a useful niche or two out there.

Re:eMac

[Diordna]

Heh, I find this funny. I've had an eMac for a year. It plays Halo PC just fine and runs all of my dev, 2D, and 3D tools just fine. The eMac comment was complete bull. As for offloading data...I guess he's never heard of burning CD's. It isn't the most efficien thing, but if you do have a computer with a DVD burner in addition to it, some CAT5 cable takes care of that problem. And yes, he conveniently failed to mention the complete lack of spyware and viruses. Typical PC magazine guy.

Re:eMac

[jlouderb]

In retrospect, I probably should have said "buy an iMac"

Or a Penguin Revolution 2200.

jim louderback

Re:eMac

[Port1080]

Macs are good for "new to computers" people. If I was buying my grandmother a computer to browse the web and use e-mail, an eMac would be a good choice. Yeah it's more expensive, but very few viruses target MacOS, OSX is easy to use, and a lack of moving parts on the computer makes it hard to mess with (which is bad for a geek, but good for a newbie). A cheap Dell for half the cost would get the job done too, but then 3 months later you'd be cleaning off spyware, explaining how to use a virus scanner, etc, etc.

Re:eMac

[grassy_knoll]

A cheap Dell for half the cost would get the job done too, but then 3 months later you'd be cleaning off spyware, explaining how to use a virus scanner, etc, etc.

Good point, and it's why my mother uses a Mac. Yes, there is a greater initial cost, but the Mac OS and hardware require less maintenance over time.

My sister uses Apple as well, a powerbook IIRC. She's carted it across three continents, dropped it enough times the case is held together by duct tape and it still works fine.

Apple is expensive i

Re:eMac

[itistoday]

Macs are good for "new to computers" people.

Uh... this statement is just wrong. I use a Mac, but then again I also own a PC with Debian Linux and Windows XP Pro on it. I'm a software developer with experience in several languages, and lots of experience with various *nixes, yet my main machine is a Mac. Am I "new to computers"? Definitely not.

What's great about Mac OS X is that it's perfect for virtually everyone, it doesn't make using a computer "easy" because it lacks features, but rather because

Re:eMac

[rs79]

"Macs are good for "new to computers" people"

Yeah. I've only been programming computers since 1970 and have owned pretty much ever home computer since the apple iie, so I havn't been using computerd for very long.

I've used PCs ad a desktop machine since about 89 or so (and hated switching from my Amiga) and have got used to their nonsense.

I was forced to use a G4 iMac last summer for 2 weeks and found it to be a nice and reliable BSD box for all intents and purposes. Since BSD is mostly what I use I found it a really nice consumer BSD box ifinitly more reliable and easy to use that winbloze. I don't play games, I work for a living and I'r rather use a G3 iMac than any PC, although would obviously prefer a G5.

I will not be buying any more PC's, ever. They don't seem to actually work.

Re:eMac

[sootman]

"A cheap Dell for half the cost would get the job done too, but then 3 months later you'd be cleaning off spyware, explaining how to use a virus scanner, etc, etc."

And that's the same reason I recommend them to *experienced* computer users, too. Even though I am smart enough to *know* how to *fix* spyware, I'da rather not *worry* about it at all!

Re:eMac

[hey!]

Now, for everyone else, it is still the perfect platform. Put a "Power User" on a Mac and they can fly with it.

Ah, but you miss the point grasshopper.

True, the mac is good for a novice.

True the mac is good for the expert.

But what over the great ocean of mediocrity? Embracing mediocrity to generate extraordinary profits, that is the way of the enlightened business plan.

Re:eMac

[jedidiah]

The Mac is still what Windows would like to be when it finally grows up. Win9x and it's variants have always been poor attempts to mimic qualities of the Mac that were present in 1984.

As a "computer for your parents", a Macintosh still trumps a PC running WinDOS.

With Linux, you can at least do remote support over a 2400bps serial connection if necessary.

Re:eMac

[wizbit]

Who buys an entry level Mac?

Good question, but easy answer: the "switcher" crowd Apple hopes to attract from the Wintel markets with its free iLife apps, its gorgeous and nearly-passe-as-a-fashion-statement iPod, and so on. One of the Wintel crowd's biggest advantage has ALWAYS been price point, and with the original smash success of the iMac, Apple has made strides to combat that. The eMac, remember, was supposed to be a cheap way to take back schools, where Apple II's used to dominate in the 80s and now

Re:eMac

[BenjyD]

So where is this "provide more value" you are talking about?

It's called OS X.

Re:eMac

[SoTuA]

So for most folks there is no more value in OS X than in XP.

Maybe they don't think in OS terms, but they sure want "that computer that doesn't crash as much". I made my parents buy an eMac when I got married because the free tech support was leaving the nest. They appreciate it, even though the eMac was a bit slower than the machine that it replaced, because it doesn't crash every time you look at it sideways. It just works a lot better.

Re:eMac

[BenjyD]

From what I've seen of people using OS X, it seems to have some sort of subliminal effect on users. They just love it.

I think it's the effect of the sum of all the nice touches. Expose, the dock, the menu bar at the top of the screen, the nice graphics effects, the quality of the built-in apps. The fact that you can drag-and-drop everything: drag text off a web page and not only does a ghost of the text appear and move with the mouse cursor, you can drop it anywhere - stick it on the desktop and it appears as a snippet. Everything just works as you would expect it to, somehow.

Clearly that does have value to a lot of people.

Spyware and viruses are a serious problem, too. Let one slip through and that could be a day's productivity gone: that's the price difference between a Dell and a Mac made up in one day. I've seen it happen several times to my parents, intelligent people who've been using computers since the days of daisy-wheel printers.

Re:Here's my view on that:

[Yaztromo]

If you were to teach something, would you teach something that 95% of people could use, or teach something that only 5% of people could use?

Okay, so you're in Grade 4 (in North America -- about 10 years old). You won't be entering the workforce for at least another 8 to 14 years (depending on whether or not you attend University). Do you think it will matter one whit 8 to 14 years from now whether you did your web surfing and word processing on a Windows machine or a Mac?

Your logic lacks a basis in logic. Computer hardware and software generally changes at a fairly rapid pace (particularily in terms of how they interface with humans). The idea of getting an education in computer systems should be in how those systems generally function, and in making good educational use of them now, rather than trying to train students on specific software packages that will be out-of-date long before they enter the workforce.

If you want skills in software that companies and industry is demanding, go to a cheap local community college. That is what they are there for. You can go and get your MS Office certification and bask in the knowledge that you just spent a whack of money for a piece of paper that will be meaningless in two years time.

Personally, I find it much more useful to teach children in K-12 much more basic skills, such as language, mathematics, science, and the basic principals of information research. Virtually any computer can do this for them. The key is to make the computer accessable to the student, and this means having a system that is easy to use, somewhat intuitive in its functionality, and somethat that requires little maintenence, permitting a teacher who doesn't hold a computer administrator certificate like an MCSE to spend as little time as possible keeping the machines running for their students.

When I was 12 years old, I became an expert on the Commodore 64, the most popular computer at its time. Want to know how useful any of that knowledge is today, or how many C64 software titles I need to work with? Zero. The things I retained from then that are useful? Basic concepts like binary logic and math, and some programming fundementals.

Trying to teach the latest and greatest software misses the whole point of an education, and is simply a waste of time and effort. Teach students the fundementals, and they'll have the tools they need to figure out how to use new software packages as the need arises.

Brad BARCLAY

If you've waited until now to buy gifts

[Safety Cap]

...surely you can wait until Friday evening.

I'm in Denmark, you insensitive clod..

[erlando]

We open our gifts on the evening of Dec 24th..

;o)

The PSP.

[Anonymous Coward]

Long loading times, scratchable screen, bad battery life, a lousy UMD drive that ejects disc in midplay, the button that doesn't press...

I can go on all day...

Disagree with at least one

[Anonymous Coward]

The Dell 1600n isn't as bad as he is talking about... We bought one a couple weeks ago for like 2 bills and it works fine.

It copies when the attached PC is down, works fine as a network printer and isn't that slow. It takes a minute or so to warm up, but it is a laser, that is to be expected.

Re:Disagree with at least one

[pdiaz]

It takes a minute or so to warm up, but it is a laser, that is to be expected.

The HP 1300, which is an entry-level laser printer (PS), warms up in 8 seconds. 1 minute way more than is expected for modern laser printers!.

Worst. Product. Ever.

[Anonymous Coward]

SCO "Linux license".

the list

[Anonymous Coward]

Digital Cameras: Concord 5062AF
PDA: iPAQ
Phone: Samsung D415
Desktop PC: eMac
Notebook PC: VoodooPC Envy m:380
Multifunction Printer: MFP Laser Printer 1600n
MP3 Players: Mojo 1
HDTV: ADS Upconverter
Camcorder: Fisher's FVD-C1
Wireless: WF717-APR router

Re:the list

[sarahemm]

The iPAQ rz1715 to be specific, not the entire line.

Re:the list

[FunWithHeadlines]

"and hair dryer in bathtub didn't make it this year?"

That's because the editors who tested that last year were unavailable for comment this year.

The Ten...

[bushboy]

Worst Magazine Reviews of the Year, at number 1 we have ...

you get the picture

i think companies that make things like

[hsmith]

HDTV: High-definition content looks great on an HDTV, but on a regular TV, which is most of what you'll probably watch, it can look worse than an ancient Philco. And that's where the ADS Upconverter seems a logical choice. It claims to convert DVDs and over-the-air TV into video that'll stand up to real HD content. Don't buy it. Marred by a terrible user interface, a remote control seemingly designed by ascetic monks, and output quality that redefines GIGO (Good In, Garbage Out), it's a quick $500 flushed d

SCO License

[MooseByte]

Hmmm. I'd have figured the SCO license would have surely made that list. $699 and you don't even get a pet rock out of the deal.

Missing product

[antifoidulus]

"Cowboy Neal's 'Thongs for Geeks'", which includes graphic instructions.....
Shudders

How to make a PC Mag "worst of" list

[MadAnthony02]

1. Find worst product in catagory. Mention it.

2. Post a link to the "PC Mag guide" for that catagory with the tex "for better options in (name of catagory) see PC Mag's guide

3.Profit!

Tech Credentials

[dmayle]

GIGO (Good In, Garbage Out)

Way to show your tech credentials! [catb.org] Coming soon, to a PCMag article near you, the newest and hottest acronyms:

• LIFO - Little In, First Out
• DoS - Denial of webSite
• FIFO - Hey, isn't this that 7-up cartoon dude?
• FAQ - Frequently Answered Questions
• GPL - Groovy Public License
• IMHO - In My Honorable Opinion
• RTFM - Read The Fancy Manual

Re:Tech Credentials

[Otter]

Please note that the original read "...output quality that redefines GIGO (Good In, Garbage Out)...". Not the acme of technical humor (or the grammatical construction thereof), but it seems to have sailed over your head.

GigaWhat?

[Mz6]

"You'd think that with a name like "GigaFast," the WF717-APR router would deliver a great performance, but you'd be GigaWrong. Buy this one and you'll end up GigaSad in no time."

Could the article be anymore GigaLame?

Worst PCMag article of the year

[ALecs]

Nothing but a plug for their 'best of' articles.
Seriously, why waste the time to write an article about 10 things you don't recommend?

Re:Worst PCMag article of the year

[brkello]

White it wasn't a fantastic article, you write worst lists so that people don't make the mistake of buying a product. Like the worst list for toys that have objects that you stick in your mouth that have lead in them, you probably want to avoid those. Actually, they justify it in the beginning if you weren't so lazy and made that extra click (I know I know, it's slashdot). He said the worst list was made because usually when you go to the store, the "best" list stuff are sold out. These are things to av

From the article

[ajs318]

And at more than $700, it's not a cheap toss-off.

Indeed ..... but I know people who'd love an expensive toss-off!

So when do we get a list of...

[elid]

...10 worst Slashdot articles of the year?

Agree and Disagree

[catdevnull]

While anybody who trashes John C. Dvorak is OK in my book, I would disagree with this author's assessment of the eMac and I would agree as well. Underpowered? For A/V editing or number crunching, I would agree but for it's primary target market of education, I think that it's fine--or used to be. Word processing and web surfing don't require that much snap and pop. It's pretty much the same machine as an iBookG4. However, I would say that it's past time for Apple to update or jetison this model--the G4 processor is old news. I would expect to see Apple announce an update to this product to the G5 class at January's Macworld Expo or it will die a quiet little death.

They missed #1!

[krbvroc1]

My faith in PC Magazines normally excellent journalism has been shattered. The missed the worst gift of the year...

an SCO Intellectual Property license for the Linux lover in your life.

Its all junk

[DrinkDr.Pepper]

The worst digital slr of the year is the Pentax K1000. I mean it doesn't even have USB! See our review here. [slashdot.org]

The worst desktop computer of the year is the super nintendo. I can't seem to get it to run Open Office and I have to fold my CD's in half just to get them in the ROM drive. See our review here. [slashdot.org]

The worst spread sheet application of the year is Windows Calculator. I see that you can congifure it to use Radians, but you can't even plot y=mx+b. How am I supposed to get my paper published in Science using diagrams created with a tool like that? See our review here. [slashdot.org]

Cisco makes these terific and robust managed routers, but the Netgear FS108 is a piece of junk in comparison. It only has 8 100MB ports. It doesn't have any built-in firewall. And, to top it all off, I still have to use cat5 ethernet cables. Can you image what the designers could have been thinking when they came up with that? See our review here. [slashdot.org]


Maybe I'm being too critical of this article.

Pulitzer Prize!

[maddh]

From the Stretched Simile, Forced Metaphor, Overbaked Hyperbole and Lame Joke School of Journalism

"glacially slow processor and anemic memory"
"designed by orangutans without opposable thumbs"
"longer than it took the Minnow's crew to escape Gilligan's Island"
"it's slower than a 330-pound defensive tackle with two bad knees on a muddy field"
"like watching the neighbor's TV with a periscope"
"look worse than an ancient Philco"
"control more twitchy than Jennifer Tilly in Seed of Chucky"
"this twisted offspring of a Norelco shaver"
"you'd be GigaWrong. Buy this one and you'll end up GigaSad"
"doesn't matter a NanoBit."

eMac

[$criptah]

I am not a Mac fanatic, yet I do not like that eMac made the article. It is a solid machine for somebody who wants to have a stable client for checking e-mail, using a digital camera, surfing the web and being somewhat secure. Especially for $800.

Please do not give me "my Linux box can do the same for less" crap because there is no fucking way in hell I am going to recommend a Linux box to any of my relatives or non-techie people. Currently, I still see Linux as a great system for servers and desktops owned by techies who know the differences between kernel 2.4 and 2.6. Dell is okay, but as long as they run some sort of Windows, I am not touching them.

A couple of months ago I spent 2 days cleaning my friend's computer from every goddamn malware program out there. Then I cleaned my aunts computer, then I helped my mom because her box was extremely slow due to all the "addware" that she managed to install. Being a naive and a non-experienced user sucks, especially when companies do not want to be on your side. That is why I strongly push my mom toward an eMac because as far as I am concerned it represents a solid machine for beginners who do not want to spend all their free time maintaining it. Let's face the facts: not everybody enjoys configuring their computers whenever they have free time.

Here is why I like eMac:

It runs Mac OS X. This eliminates tons of malware available for Windows users. It is also easy to upgrade and maintain. I can enable SSHd and login to my mom's computer whenever she has a problem that needs to be fixed.

It is relatively cheap for what it is. Because I do not have to spend my time maintaining the computer, I can do something else. How much does your free time cost?

It has enough disk space. Believe it or not, 40GB is enough for any normal person. So far, all my software on my computer takes up 20GB. A person who does not download movies or music does not need a large hard drive to begin with.

eMac is pretty damn compact. I do not want my mom to deal with tons of wires, so a single box seems to be a perfect solution.

And that is just the beginning. Granted, I am a little biased towards Macs because since I got one, I noticed increase in my productivity. Now I can actually spend my time on writing code and doing fun things that do not involve system administration 24/7.

Typo About the eMac

[Necromancyr]

There was a typo in the article about the eMac. It read:

...and the Radeon 9200 graphics card won't even run this fall's hot Mac games.

It should have read:

...and the Radeon 9200 graphics card won't even run this fall's hot Mac game.

Apple eMac does not belong here

[mclaincausey]

It's ridiculous to put a computer marketed and priced for the entry level in this list and to call it "pathetic." The eMac isn't made for 3D gaming, it's made for running Office and web browsers, etc.

Worst Product of the Year

[Master of Transhuman]

George Bush.

Re:

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Re:The MP3 Headphones

[CountBrass]

Well that's just rubbish. I own and iPod but I don't feel the need to tell the world.

Re:worse pressy

[WIAKywbfatw]

My motto when it comes to buying hardware, especially when it comes to hardware that I'm recommending for other (usually less technically-adept) people is to buy a decent product from a good brand.

No-name modems, video cards, network adapters, etc might seem like a bargain but when you run into any kind of problem, or when you come to changing OS, then a no-name product is going to leave you up shit creak without a paddle virtually every single time.

Providing tech support to friends and relatives is one thing, providing tech support for a cheap, near-unsupported part is another thing altogether. If for no reason other than I don't want to piss off people I care about, I always make sure that I have them buying with reliability rather than false value in mind, and if that means I take the extra time necessary to research exactly what they need and handpick the product that they should buy then that's what I'll do.

Re:eMac bashing

[Dylan2000]

Eight hundred bucks for a thin client? Seriously?

Re:The eMac is not even a PC

[dead sun]

Odd, the eMac was a Personal Computer the last time I checked. It's no server, minicomputer, mainframe, thin client, or anything else to the best of my knowledge. Perhaps you mean it isn't a Windows PC or an x86 PC as is typically implied, given market share.

Nooo, it's a Mac, it's more than just a personal computer, right? Whatever.

Still, from the article, impossible to get information off of it because of a lack of a DVD burner? What's the author smoking? What did we all do with our 40+GB drives before DVD

Re:how come?

[Ubergrendle]

This is easy... because the auto magazines are too dependant upon advertising revenue from these companies -- invariably some of the worst cars come from manufacturers that advertise the most.

If you want to get honest car reviews, I'd recommend Edmondston's Lemon Aid Car Guide [lemonaidcars.com]...100% independent, uses public access to information through safety councils, etc. Its Canadian based, but should be very applicable to all North American-available automobiles.

You'll find this same experience with most stereo

Re:how come?

[rhild]

The Car Talk guys (from NPR) have the Worst Cars of the Millenium [cartalk.com] as voted on by their listeners.

It's funny and worth a read.

Re:Is it just me...

[Zak3056]

...or would you not purchase products from most of those companies anyway? A camcorder from Fisher...no thanks! Who the hell is Concord anyway? GiGaFast? Now there's a name brand! ;)

I agree completely! Give me a name brand Sorny, Magnetbox, or Panaphonics any day!