Gecko-based K-Meleon 0.9 browser Released 345
Fylfot writes "After a long time in development, version 0.9 of the Gecko-based K-Meleon web browser for Windows has been released.
K-Meleon is the geekier, more configurable, lighter-weight (XULless), speedier twin of Firefox. When 1.0 comes out, Microsoft may have another reason to worry about Internet Explorer marketshare.
Also reported on Chip Online and MozillaZine."
Geekier? (Score:4, Interesting)
You forgot (Score:2, Funny)
Re:You forgot (Score:2)
Re:Geekier? (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Geekier? (Score:2)
Re:Geekier? (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Geekier? (Score:2)
Wait a second... (Score:5, Funny)
Oh shit, my Internet penis is shortening by the second....must......download....
I predict... (Score:4, Insightful)
It's totally pointless for Firefox to re-implement its own widgets when I have a GUI that already provides those to apps for a reason! I switched to Opera long ago because it takes up half the memory and works at twice the speed. Cross-platform compatibility, you say? Opera happily exists on multiple platforms while still using native widgets. For crying out loud, Firefox even has its own generic string class! Unless the Mozilla/Firefox developers are intent on constructing their own OS, they should stick to just being a native browser on whichever platform of choice. Otherewise, Mozilla/Firefox will continue to be slower than they should be and will continue to take up ungodly huge amounts of RAM when they shouldn't. And most people will continue to defend it just because they don't like Microsoft and have adopted Firefox as their little badge of rebellion. Sheesh.
Re:I predict... (Score:2, Insightful)
Firefox was relativly easy to develop, because of all of what you think is was
Re:I predict... (Score:2, Informative)
Galeon was my favorite browser in the world for the longest time, smart, simple and FAST. Now that I am back on windows, Opera has taken over that position (yes, I did use opera in linux, this waqs ages ago, and at the time I still preferred Galeon) and I doubt anything could take the crown away from it. Still I'm going t
W95 geekishness (Score:2)
Re:W95 geekishness (Score:2)
--Asa
Re:W95 geekishness (Score:2)
Updating software one Windows 1.1?
Re:W95 geekishness (Score:2)
marketshare worry? (Score:2, Funny)
Too bad (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Too bad (Score:2)
Geekier? (Score:5, Funny)
I don't think so (Score:5, Insightful)
K-Meleon is the geekier, more configurable... Microsoft may have another reason to worry about Internet Explorer marketshare.
If K-Meleon is more geeky than Firefox, than I don't think IE will be worrying any time soon.
Re:I don't think so (Score:2)
Firefox isn't a geeky app. Automati
It's MS only :( (Score:3, Insightful)
How can that possibly be geekier than multiplatform Firefox?
Re:It's MS only :( (Score:2)
Re:It's MS only :( (Score:2, Redundant)
Well, I just tried K-Meleon and it took about 2 seconds to start-up on a 3.06 Ghz P4 w/HT and 1GB ram. It takes about 2 seconds as well for Firefox to start up on this box. I didn't notice K-Meleon to be any faster. The only thing I noticed was a little less memory use.
Oh, and you can get speed optimized [www.moox.ws] Firefox builds. These builds have better 3D-Now, MMX, SSE, SSE2 and SSE3 optimizations, so you need to download the one that is
Geekier? (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't buy the threat to IE market share. I'm sure it's a great browser, and I'm geeky enough to take an interest in it, but if I were representative of 99% of the population, Linux would be massive on the desktop.
Re:Geekier? (Score:2)
Have you taken a look at top lately? hi M while it is running and you'll see Linux is massive on the desktop.
Re:Geekier? (Score:2)
You've put your finger on the number one blind spot in the desktop wars. Most geeks just can't seem to grasp that they are not typical computer users. This has always been a source of conflict between the two main computer user communities: people who live and breathe computing, and the great mass of people who see computers as nothing but tools. It's always been a bad thing, but it's paticularly bad when geeks
Re:Geekier? (Score:2)
In the case of firefox, it's already infiltrated the ignorant masses who believe they are part of the tech crowd (Microsoft "Tech"s, MCSE's, some college students, etc). Once something has that level of penetration it's general acceptance is a given.
I'll give you a clue, with some exceptions, the ignorant masses stay ignorant and choose not
Re:Geekier? (Score:2)
Where did you check? Firefox usage is still something like 3%. Reports vary, but I've never seen anybody claim much more than that.
I'd be encouraged if there were even a tiny trend, like a percentage point every couple of months. But I don't see it.
I'm not sure how to respond to the rest of your post, which kind of contradicts itself. All I can say is that your patronizing attitude ("ignorant masses"?) is not helpful.
Re:Geekier? (Score:2)
"which kind of contradicts itself."
In what manner? Exactly what in my post actually contradicts myself.
"your patronizing attitude ("ignorant masses"
If its *that* good... (Score:5, Insightful)
So, chances are more that a FF user may convert to K-melon than an IE user!
or not?
Re:If its *that* good... (Score:4, Informative)
I downloaded the newest version and installed it. It installs cleanly, a feature I appreciate greatly (no registry entries or system files to be orphaned). It loads very fast. I manually brought in my bookmarks from Firefox and started browsing.
So far, it loads fast and then goes about as fast as Firefox. K-Meleon uses a scheme that creates "layers" instead of tabs which I personally find much less intuitive. One features I use most in Firefox is the "Open in Tabs" selection from the bookmarks menu.
Instead of an "Open in Tabs" option within bookmarks, K-Meleon has you create "groups" of "layers" which you then label. To create a group, you have to open individual layers for each page and then point each layer at a page I wanted in the group. You can then save them with a name like "news." You can then just type "news" in the address bar and hit Shift+Enter to bring up the group in different layers. It is slick and fast once the group is created. Of course, don't accidentally type in "News" b/c the group names are case-sensitive.
All in all it's interesting and fun to play with new software. Yet with my N=1 sample of me, I'd say that I found tabs and their implementation in Firefox much more intuitive than layers and groups. There was no simple method to import Firefox bookmarks from within K-Meleon, but it did import IE Favorites quite easily and has methods that supposedly work with Netscape and Opera bookmarks. Also, while the browser itself feels light and nimble, its menu structure is cluttered and not particularly intuitive.
All of this is written with about an hour and a half of use on a 0.9 release, so my impressions must be taken with a grain of salt and improvements are sure to come. However, this brief experience certainly makes me think that an IE user would adjust more readily to Firefox than K-Meleon. Consequently, I think K-Meleon is more likely to convert Firefox users than IE users.
But that's just my opinion.
Faster but... (Score:5, Insightful)
Well it seems much faster than firefox, but there's a point at which an application becomes 'too customizable'. You have to edit a text file just to change the toolbar buttons? And there doesnt seem to be any extensions right now, you might want to wait. Personally I would like to see a native-rendered firefox.
Re:Faster but... (Score:2)
Alright I take that back. There are extensions [kmeleon.org] but not Adblock or Web Developer yet.
Mind warp (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Mind warp (Score:5, Funny)
Why foo? (Score:2)
Re:Mind warp (Score:2)
Re:Mind warp (Score:2)
--
Evan
Re:Mind warp (Score:2)
Re:Mind warp (Score:2)
One LESS reason to worry for IE? (Score:2, Insightful)
Imagine these developers working instead on bringing to life open-source products that are really lacking. Like a good Exchange substitute.
Re:One LESS reason to worry for IE? (Score:3, Insightful)
waste of time (Score:3, Interesting)
Remember hitting a brick wall with a sledgehammer will knock it down, so smaller hammers can fix the holes. Hitting it with lots of little hammers chips it, but it still stands.
Why not support HURD? (Score:2, Insightful)
Besides, try using Firefox on a Pentium 1, then try K-Meleon. Basically, Firefox is a dog on older computers, and K-Meleon isn't.
Simple. XUL == Slow. (Score:5, Informative)
Browsers with native toolkits, like K-Meleon or Galeon or Epiphany, fill this void. They use the excellent Mozilla rendering engine with fast, native widgets.
Re:Simple. XUL == Slow. (Score:3, Interesting)
This is the reason I'm stuck using Opera at work - it's the only browser that performs well. Time to DL the newest K-Meleon and give it a whirl.
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Simple. XUL == Slow. (Score:2)
Re:Simple. XUL == Slow. (Score:2)
Re:Simple. XUL == Slow. (Score:2)
Let me introduce you to a concept: Not everyone has much money. There are working people in the United States who can't scrape together $400 for the Dell uber-cheap of the month, but who can get an old Pentium from the thrift store for $5. There are millions of people in Africa who make many times less in a day than the lowest paid burger flipper in the United States makes in an hour. Get some perspective.
Re:Simple. XUL == Slow. (Score:3, Interesting)
Using a platform such XUL would allow me to put out quality code faster, which may or may not put more money in my pocket faster....and thats my perspective. thanks to the mozilla foundation."
If a program can do everything that another program can do runs in less memory and on a slower computer great!
Why not have a good Web browser that will run on lower power PC's
Re:Simple. XUL == Slow. (Score:2, Interesting)
CPU 400Mhz
HD 7200rpm
RAM 386mb
OS Win2K.
Firefox is simply to slow on my system and eats most of my ram.
K-meleon is FAST and memory efficient.
Why not tell Linux to give up the desktop as well (Score:2)
Let the market figure it out. The competition of different ideas is what has gotten us to this point. If people got the idea that they shouldn't even try there would never have been a Firefox or Mozilla.
I think you over estimate the size of your hammer.
Because K-Meleon was there first! (Score:2, Insightful)
Version 0.5 is dated 2001-09-30 16:36. IIRC I used K-Meleon 0.3 or 0.4 way back because it integrated with Windows a lot better than Mozilla did.
Dissecting the features (Score:5, Interesting)
Support for Bookmarks, Favorites and Hotlists
Hmm, nothing too special? It'll be interesting to see what form they take - whether the Safari-esque model of bookmark management (a page) or the standard pop-up organizer.
Layers(Tabbed Browsing)
Wooo... Kind of a necessity in today's brower 'market'.
Integrated search tools to search Google or configurable to use your favorite web resources
Neat. Still nothing revolutionary.. think Firefox.
Enhanced privacy and security features to protect against spyware and viruses - block pop-ups and web sites that try to change your home page or download spyware!
Anything like this is great.. Maybe this will start to hint Microsoft along those lines, and we can get real security that can keep my family's computer running (despite the naive endusers).
Unique right-click toolbar buttons allow quick access to additional features and settings
Now, right mouse button features are good but I feel they are a bit of a crutch for poor design and don't make it as accessible to the user. I suppose I fall into teh 'Apple' camp of one button computing.. the right button/scroll is handy, but not the end all/be all... certainly not something to trump as a unique feature.
Complete customization of all menus and toolbars
Now this is a great thing.. I love the way I can configure MS Office to my exact specifications, and this could be the real reason to switch over to K-Meleon 0.9 IMHO.
Configurable to use your mail and news programs
Hmm, wonder if this will take the form of just popping up my mail client when I click on something, or a news client when I click on something, or if it is something revolutionary?
Bit of a screed, I know, but just my two cents.
Re:Dissecting the features (Score:2)
Neat. Still nothing revolutionary.. think Firefox.
If it's configureable by non-admin users, then this is a big plus. I hate that about firefox and opera.
Re:Dissecting the features (Score:3, Informative)
1 autoscroll is WAAAAAYY better, it doesn't gimp if you move the mouse up while over a javascript image. Also it's fast without 'jittering' that FF does.
2 faster. Windows are faster to create than FF, opening/closing.. can't speak for rendering speed, it's probably the same.
And the problems:
1 options are scattered through several disparate menus. There's the Edit->prefs, and the Tools menu with 13 sub-menus.
2 can't use extensions? That's a biggi
I agree, but it's not IE 6 that should worry (Score:2)
When 1.0 comes out, Microsoft may have another reason to worry about Internet Explorer marketshare.
True enough, but MS should worry more about the Embedded IE that comes with Platform Builder. A small FireFox, clean and stripped down could do for palm devices what FireFox is doing for desktop PCs.
Promotion, promotion, promotion... (Score:2)
The reason Firefox has a reasonable shot is because it has an actual, honest-to-God fanbase and strong marketing for an open source product.
This just has a crappy logo and some random submitter talking it up. (Hint: You need more than that to have a successful product.)
Multi user ? (Score:2, Interesting)
What Niche? (Score:3, Informative)
I'm sorry, but that's a battle it's probably going to lose. As for taking market share from IE, I don't see it being anything significant. Any IE users that switch are likely to change to Firefox, since there's so many existing users and comes across as a commercial product (read: clean website, clean interface, etc). Any IE users that were unlikely to switch to Firefox are unlikely to switch to K-Meleon. The only people I see using this are the Slashdot crowd.
I personally won't switch because Firefox has been stable enough for me, and waiting 2 seconds for it to load isn't too painful. K-Meleon can probably load it in what, 1.5 seconds? Yay.
Re:What Niche? (Score:2)
Re:What Niche? (Score:2)
Re:What Niche? (Score:2)
Re:What Niche? (Score:2)
Re:What Niche? (Score:2)
Re:What Niche? (Score:2)
Re:What Niche? (Score:2)
Meanwhile, people ask me about Firefox all time. People who don't know anything about programming or system administration. They do know that their computers have gotten much slower over time thanks to the myriad types of malware that spreads to their computers thanks to IE. And they've heard about Firefox.
I think you're living in some sort of a weird alternate reality where IE is still better. Maybe you could come out of 2002 for a bit a
Geekiest (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Geekiest (Score:3, Insightful)
** Note: I use Konqueror [konqueror.org] and it is orders of magnitude faster than Mozilla/Firefox/IE in loading Web pages. I definitely believe that Konqie is the perfect br
Re:Geekiest (Score:2)
Re:Geekiest (Score:2)
But nowadays, when the slowest systems I u
Re:Geekiest (Score:2)
Konqie is faster not only in loading webpages but also in application startup time.
Re:Geekiest (Score:2)
Re:Don't need it to load faster (Score:3, Insightful)
By itself, running solo on a modern machine, yeah, no prob, runs great.
But when you're running IIS, MSSQL, and Postgres servers, K-Lite, eMule and DC++ clients, crunching video using VirtualDub in the background and playing NWN and you've tasked out to check the web on where to find that last item you need for your quest, y
Or just try Moox (Score:4, Interesting)
This guy makes processor optimized builds of Firefox. He even provides some numbers of tests he did on an Athlon system. Anyway, if you use a moox build with some other minor tweaks (like pipelining), you will definitely notice a difference.
Download link (Score:2, Informative)
Download at: http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/kmeleon/kmeleo
Redundant comment but I repeat! (Score:2)
One of the last unpluggable holes that I have to deal with is that the Explorer shell and other apps use MSIE as the rendering engine for displaying HTML. If only there was a way to use the same hooks but to point it to Firefox's or even Mozilla's rendering code, I'd feel a lot better about using Windows in general.
I had made this comment before and someone replied that it was possible. I'd really like to see
But can it use FF extensions? (Score:3, Insightful)
They should fix the following... (Score:2)
This may or may not be fixed via the obscure config files in preferences.
Furthermore there is no method of asking if setting specific cookies is ok.
Apart from that, it looks really good. They should polish the dialogboxes though. They look rather amateurish.
Smelly Socks (Score:2)
Yum !
Not all good (Score:2)
CD Embedded Browser (Score:2)
Re:CD Embedded Browser (Score:2)
Re:CD Embedded Browser (Score:2)
An EMBEDDED browser would be one that can RUN off a CD without having write configuration files. Ideally I would manually write a configuration or K-meleon would just with a set of predetermined defaults and just work.
You can embed the MSHTML COM object in a VB or C++ program and it will run on almost any Windows as lo
FTP mirror (Score:2)
Not twin (Score:2)
Firefox is cross-platform - this baby is not. Perhaps K-Meleon is a cousin.
Layers... (Score:2)
Windows only, nothing to do with KDE (Score:2, Informative)
Tisk tisk (Score:2, Insightful)
Nice KDE troll and all but this product is for Windows. Can't even read the headline blurb before posting? You almost had it too but then you had to flame away.
Re:Speedier twin of Firefox (Score:3, Informative)
KDE? What?
Surprisingly, given the name, it has nothing whatsoever to do with KDE. It's a Windows program for a start.
Re:Hopefully no memory leaks like FireFox (Score:4, Interesting)
http://www.moox.ws/tech/mozilla/
Re:Hopefully no memory leaks like FireFox (Score:2)
Re:Hopefully no memory leaks like FireFox (Score:2)
How about blanket statements about blanket statements regarding an OS?
Re:Hopefully no memory leaks like FireFox (Score:2)
Re:Why should MS care? (Score:2)
Re:IE Market share (Score:2)
Re:speed? (Score:2)
Re:Dillo (Score:3, Funny)
-josh