US Group Wants Canada Blacklisted Over Piracy 585
An anonymous reader writes "Following up on an earlier story, the IIAA wants to add Canada to a blacklist of the worst intellectual property offenders. A powerful coalition of U.S. software, movie and music producers is urging the Bush administration to put Canada on an infamous blacklist of intellectual property villains, alongside China, Russia and Belize. 'Canada's chronic failure to modernize its copyright regime has made it a global hub for bootleg movies, pirated software and tiny microchips that allow video-game users to bypass copyright protections', the International Intellectual Property Alliance complains in a submission to the U.S. government."
tiny microchips (Score:5, Funny)
Re:tiny microchips (Score:5, Funny)
Cue the music (Score:5, Funny)
Blame Canada
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm offended and frankly would be extremely angry if Canada bowed to this pressure.
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Informative)
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Still, she has been very pro Big Media in her speeches.
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Informative)
Heres a good bit: "The U.S. approach is quite clearly one of "do what I say, not what I do" (fair use is good for the U.S., but no one else), advising country after country that it does not meet international TPM standards (perhaps it is the U.S. that is not meeting emerging international standards), and criticizing national attempts to improve education or culture through exceptions or funding programs. Moreover, it is very clear that the U.S. lobby groups are never satisfied as even those countries that have ratified the WIPO treaties or entered into detailed free trade agreements with the U.S. that include IP provisions still find themselves criticized for not doing enough.
Canadians should not be deceived into thinking that our laws are failing to meet an international standard, no matter what U.S. lobby groups or the Globe and Mail say. Rather, Canadians should know that our approach - and the criticism that it inevitably brings from the U.S. - places us in very good company."
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Insightful)
Now we have meat packing plants of our own, and we can sell frozen steak internationally with all the associated markup.
Why the hell are we selling our oil?
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Everything from Timbits to MapleLeaf is American (US) owned, if only through parent companies.
No and no.
Just followed both the links to wikipedia you posted and then followed wikipedia's links at the bottom of each page. this is what I discovered:
Tim Hortons
This is traded on the NYSE and Toronto Stock Exchange (http://www.timhortons.com/en/pdfs/en_media_kit.pd f) so is probably owned mostly by US investment houses as the original poster said. Regardless of who owns the shares though, trading on a foriegn st
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Interesting that the War of 1812 was initiated by the US outraged at an affront to their liberties, yet this is about the US impressing it's dominance.. A bit of a reversal in 200 years I think.
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Funny)
We could throw the complete inventory of a franchise music store into Boston Harbor. and maybe a few politicians as well.
Re:Cue the music (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Funny)
SB
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Insightful)
From the environment's point-of-view, this might not be such a good idea.
Re:Cue the music (Score:4, Funny)
The transport costs would be negligible. Politicians, being full of hot air, can float independently over land or sea. They require a bit of a push to get them out over the water, but then one well-placed shot each to deflate them would drop them in.
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This could be a worse ecological disaster than the Exxon Valdiez
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Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Insightful)
In any event, saying "we hate America" means you're doing one awful lot of hating. I've known some Australians that were complete jackasses as well
Nobody can really hate America (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Cue the music (Score:4, Interesting)
The funny thing is, this is exactly the type of stereotyping that Americans are often criticized for. I was talking about a month ago with a very worldly fellow who is from France originally but has lived in something like 8 countries. I was quite surprised that he had the following unshakable beliefs:
When I tried to bait him with "French people wear berets, play tiny accordions, and never bathe" he didn't understand what I was doing. "See," he said, "Americans are completely ignorant about other cultures." Righto.
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Funny)
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If we don't, by and large, like what our PM is doing - and has been doing for over a decade - then why do we still vote for him? The people continue to vote him and his party in so I'd say most Aussies therefore agree with his policies. If not, the Aussie people have only the Aussie people to blame. Just like the American people must take the blame for the actions of their leader.
You half answered your own question. In the US, you can vote for the president -- largely for how they handle matters of foreign policy and trade -- as distinct from how you elect representatives to parliament. In Australia, there is no distinction, and the Prime Minister is appointed by the party that has majority representation. Unless you happen to live in the Prime Minister's electorate, you can not vote for or against him.
In Australia, I'd say the majority supported the majority parties' policies on d
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In the US, you can vote for the president -- largely for how they handle matters of foreign policy and trade -- as distinct from how you elect representatives to parliament. In Australia, there is no distinction, and the Prime Minister is appointed by the party that has majority representation. Unless you happen to live in the Prime Minister's electorate, you can not vote for or against him.
Canada has the same issue, but even if the would-be Prime Minister is not elected, there is the option that a junior member of that party will step down, and a by-election will be held in that riding to get the Prime Minister a seat in the House.
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This is the "first past the post, winner takes all" voting system we have, which together with our Monarchy.
Legally, the way it works is that, it is our Monarch (the queen) who appoints her government, and HER prime minister. As a Constitutional Monarch she is bound to represent the views of her citizens, who elect a Party to represent their views. The parties themselves elect a "leader" to lead the party and suggest roles for other members.
The final say though is
Re:Cue the music (Score:4, Funny)
The Germans would have a good case, but the last time we let them, they took it a bit to far. By having to prove that invasion is not an acceptable form of insult, we also gained sole rights to insult the Germans over the war.
In contrast the only people allowed to insult the English (along with the French. The Germans are still barred from the whole thing) are the ex-colonies. Unfortunately, this includes most of the rest of the world...
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One word: nukes. The US has them; you don't.
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Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Insightful)
1. Because they can.
2. Because they can buy the best lobbyists.
3. Because voters who don't pay attention let them.
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Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Cue the music (Score:4, Insightful)
- RG>
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Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Insightful)
Not to mention the US government (which is even less of a random group) has already pressured several other countries into changing their copyright laws and has been hard at work on Canada for some time already.
Re:Cue the music (Score:4, Interesting)
"Offtopic" my sphincter!
The interference of US politicos including DEA "advisors" on how to handle medical cannabis, US-led policy wonks who want us to charge a $75 levy on iPod and other media players to "recoup piracy losses", interference in our Kyoto protocol attempts, leveraging of "Income Trusts" as a tax loophole for fossil fuel companies to evade taxes, refusal by fossil fuel companies to pay the full royalties due on oil sands extraction, demands that we ignore US abuses of Canadian citizens under "anti-terrorism" "legislation" that never went through a proper judicial review in the US, refusal by the US to abide by NAFTA agreements on softwood even when their own courts say the US government is guilty, ...
Canada has a long, long list of grievances with the way the US interferes with our internal policies and government. The above is only a short list of some of the most important issues. Granted Shrub is only responsible personally for the so-called "War on Terror" and the related interference in our government's policies, but as the representative of the US government he is responsible for the entire pile during his tenure.
Re:Cue the music (Score:5, Interesting)
Europe is the crucible from which "modern" (it's really fuedal, thus old fashioned, but what the hell. Nobody remembers anything before last Thursday anyway) copyright law was cast, but it's the converts that are almost always the biggest PITA fanatics; especially if there's money and power in it for them.
KFG
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Thank goodness for Bit Torrent, and freedom in Canada.
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Surely they should be blacklisted for the above atrocities to mankind.
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Surely they should be blacklisted for the above atrocities to mankind.
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So they went with Al Gore's misspoken "Serial" and went to an extreme in poking fun at him. Big deal. They've made fun of Bush as well. Is making fun of Bush okay but not Saddam? What is your problem with it? If you can't stand the profanity and crassne
Tough choice (Score:5, Insightful)
- Copyright Law
- Business Model
Modernize one.Re:Tough choice (Score:5, Insightful)
Actually, that would be not too bad. (Score:5, Interesting)
They are part of *that* lot. (Score:5, Funny)
We concurred Yes. And reading this article just confirmed it, eh?
The release is backwards (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:The release is backwards (Score:4, Insightful)
Yeah, paying a tax on all recordable media is really fair.
LK
in other words (Score:4, Insightful)
Translation: "We have a stranglehold on the music and movie industries, we want control over video game consoles, as well."
Re:in other words (Score:5, Insightful)
Translation: "We have a stranglehold on the music and movie industries, we want control over video game consoles, as well."
No, a better translation would be:
The Conservative government needs a stick to shake at the Canadian public in order to cow them into accepting a digital media market that is more conducive to the desires of their corporate master. Conveniently, the media associations and their government cronies are happy to provide one.
I speak for all Canadians... (Score:5, Insightful)
What are your GPS coordinates? (Score:5, Funny)
You are a lucky winner in our "Win a Tommahawk Cruise Missile" competition.
Re:I speak for all Canadians... (Score:5, Informative)
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Bah, he caved in and gave it all away as a transparent gesture of being neighborly. In reality this was an example of "how high?". In the end, you (U.S.) are paying more for your products due to protectionism from your cartels.
Can't wait to see this government defeated this spring.
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Re:I speak for all Canadians... (Score:5, Insightful)
Sure, for a sufficiently revised definition of free.
OH NOS!!! (Score:5, Funny)
It could, and probably will, happen.
Re:OH NOS!!! (Score:4, Funny)
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And Canada preemptively retaliated with: (Score:3, Funny)
That will give you pause.
Re:OH NOS!!! (Score:4, Funny)
The Jolly Roger.
The Globe and Mail - a humour paper (Score:3, Insightful)
On the same page is another article, "For today's family, time's not on their side -- Hectic schedules, longer work weeks contribute to less togetherness than in 80s".
All right, say it again - both of these are on the front page of the Globe and Mail!
That's why I call it a "humour paper". (However, the National Post is actually funnier!)
Stephan
Where's David Wilkins Now??? (Score:5, Insightful)
If Canada doesn't dictate US policy, so too should the US not concern themselves with Canadian policies.
My Favorite quote (Score:5, Interesting)
Crisis levels? People are dying?
No, it's a fucking camcorder recording of a hollywood movie. All the bad things about watching the movie in the theator in the privacy of your own home.
If this is really a problem, it's because the movies suck and early word getting out about how bad the movie is is hurting sales. Simple solution to that; Stop making crap movies.
Re:My Favorite quote (Score:5, Interesting)
There's a missing note of hilarity here. Let me modify your statement slightly so you'll see it.
a fucking camcorder recording of a hollywood movie that was filmed in Canada because it is cheaper there
Are you laughing now? The US is exporting IP-related jobs to a country it claims doesn't respect IP.
Personally, I think that's a great joke.
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Camcorder copies of Hollywood movies is not something the government has any business discussing. There are tons of real problems that they should be spending their time trying to solve. It's like complaining the contractors painted your house the wrong color while hundreds of nuclear warheads are on their way to obliterate your country.
To the people in government that are discussing copyright crap: shut the hell up about non-issues like camcorder copies of movies and get your asses back to work trying t
They should start exporting their smokes north (Score:5, Insightful)
What is a "crisis level" for camcorders in movie theatres? Is that where the people behind you start attacking you for using a camera that makes too much noise (or gives off too much light, or what)?
Nonetheless, if this sanction was imposed, Canada could retaliate by putting the Yanks on the list of countries to whom they won't export oil or uranium. Then the Americans would have to nicer to Chavez ... (This won't happen. By "this" I mean Canada blocking energy exports. The Canadians put up with a lot.)
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Oil they can get elsewhere. You want to see them squirm, cut off their supply of nickel. Canada is the largest producer in the world of that metal.
Re:They should start exporting their smokes north (Score:4, Informative)
1: Canada
2: Mexico
3: Middle East
4: Argentina
I just read this the other day (cnn.com). Personally I was surprised that Mexico exported so much oil, but I'm not surprised about Canada. Funny thing is much of that oil gets sent to the States for refinement and then is sent back to Canada.
Willy
Piracy is a problem with video games? (Score:5, Informative)
You mean the one that rakes in more and more profits each year?
Yeah, piracy is just SUCH a problem, crippling that industry...
And Canada doesn't need any new policy since it's already a civil offence to violate the copyright of another.
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By far, porn is the most pirated form of IP, yet does not seem to be in any danger of disappearing.
Well, in order to have the law enforced, you have to be caught red handed...errr...there has to be
a smoking gun...ummm *coff*...dang, too hard (shit, did it again) to phrase it just right.
(/quietly exits thread)
Height of ignorance & arogance (Score:5, Insightful)
Canada's copyright system is MORE modern then the US. Common sense tells us that there is no difference "If I loan a CD to a friend to listen to", or "make a copy for him to listen to." I guess we should ban libraries too since the artist is not getting "his fair share."
Copyright & Intellectual Property Rights (which are neither property nor rights) are artificial rights from a world where only people care about greed, instead of sharing knowledge.
What price do you put on a patent that could cure cancer? Why is it OK to profit off the sick & dying? Have we really made that little progress in the past million years, that we still cry & whine like a 2 year saying "mine" -- simply because we were the first to come up with an idea, that we could care less about our fellow human beings??
Copyright: Because it's _such_ a crime against humanity, that people want to share what they find entertaining with others, for free!
--
Because its easier to get mod'd down for having the courage to look at the facts, then ignore Forgotten Christian History [peopleofhonoronly.com].
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Really this is all about forcing us to have a DMCA type law on the books.
Re:Height of ignorance & arogance (Score:5, Interesting)
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Data simply doesn't have this property. Any argument based on the premise that it does is fallacious.
Ahh... but you are allowed to hit a nail, or your TV, or whatever else you want that won't hurt anyone.
It's true that making a copy of a CD for a friend in the United States is currently illegal. I wo
Why is Canada singled out? (Score:4, Informative)
But that is besides the point. This is just yet another attempt by a US lobby to try to use the US government to boss Canada around.
Let's go over this slowly (Score:5, Interesting)
Over video games?
Cool.
Re:Let's go over this slowly (Score:4, Insightful)
Over video games?
Cool.
Just wait until they come to "liberate" you from your outdated copyright regime.
Biggest trading partner? Haliburton is ready to take over that.
NATO ally? Pay attention to how well they treat their EU allies lately.
Fighting terrorists? So did Saddam, didn't want any religious fundies opposing him.
Oil? And that's a.... con?
Friendly government? Wasn't that a WMD pointing at the US I saw, I'm sure I did.
And the five-year forecast: Civil war between eskimos, quebecois and english-speaking canadians.
Re:Let's go over this slowly (Score:5, Funny)
Do we refer to African-Americans as "negroes"? Or Microsoft as "scum-sucking patent-hoarding competition-crushing market-manipulating idea-stealing monopolistic capitalistic bastard offspring of leprous apes"?
Okay, bad example.
Re:Let's go over this slowly (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Let's go over this slowly (Score:5, Insightful)
Sure, we shouldn't stop sending you guys oil, but we should definitely be looking to sell more of it (along with other things) to places other than the US. They've proven over and over that they can't be trusted not to abuse their position as primary trade partner.
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I think Canada has a friendly enough reputation that the (Conservatives to follow Hillary) won't be able to lie that we have WMDs..
There are an awful lot of people of Chinese descent in Canada too... Too bad their a bunch of commies...
Oh wait Canada's gonna piss off the U.S. by being too left wing.... good good.
treaty obligations? (Score:5, Interesting)
Let's start adding them up... (Score:5, Funny)
SE Asia is pretty much one big pool of piracy all around.
China is a huge one, they don't seem to care about IP at all.
Ukraine seems to be the most fucked up of the former Soviets.
Russia isn't far behind, with allofmp3 and all.
All the remaining ex-Soviet states are notorious too.
East europe in general has a long track record of piracy.
West europe got the fastest lines and places like The Pirate Bay.
South America is quite rampant too, last I checked.
Australia banned the region coding crap, didn't they?
Anyone know if the Middle East and Africa qualifies? Haven't heard much but I bet they do. Now they want to add Canada to this "exclusive" list? I have a much simpler proposition: Take the list of countries. Remove US and maybe their pet dog, UK. The remainder is their list of copyright villains.
I can see this as only good. (Score:5, Funny)
I think (Score:5, Insightful)
To the best of my knowledge, copyright infringement going on in other countries in no way affects our safety (besides the weak "it funds terrorists" argument that seems to be the defacto excuse for everything around here anymore).
The only people that would benefit from the massive expense and sacrifice of civil liberty that would be necessary to enact such a stupid idea would be the media fat cats..... And they can go and (insert witty thing here) themselves for all I care.
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Any country that doesn't play by the economic policy of the US is a threat to the USA. The US is basically the arm of corporations now, your fellow countrymen's blind adherence to extreme propertarianism and extreme capitalism are partly to blame.
I've been real
Michael Geist (Score:5, Interesting)
This message proudly paid by a Montreal Pirate! (whatever that means
Oh Put A Sock In It (Score:5, Informative)
The last article was completely overblown, and this is even worse.
Need I even go into the many ways the US has violated [www.cbc.ca] our free trade agreement. How are different copyright laws even a violation?
Maybe because the copyright protections violate our basic copyright freedoms? There's no DMCA here.
In case you haven't noticed, we're lax in all areas of law. How has incarceration [wikipedia.org] helped to reduce US crime rates [fbi.gov]? Why should copyright violation be a criminal offense? The last article was even so bold to say:
So camcording is a criminal offense, you just have to, shock, prove your case rather than assume guilt. I guess this article is *technically* right when it says:
What else did they complain about proving?
Is that 15th century thinking I hear? Are they going to blacklist every liberal country?
Please, the UK and Australia wouldn't even have these type of laws if the US and *AA and friends hadn't strong armed them into it. Are these the only shinning examples they can find?
A Canuck who says, "BLACKLIST ME BABY!!!" (Score:5, Interesting)
Let's say that the U.S. delayed the release of all films in Canada by several months, as they have already threatened to do. Suddenly, film release dates in Canada would no longer coincide with the hype in American media. Canadian consumers would have to endure months of temptation to download industry-insider-provided rips of screeners (not crappy camcorder copies) before films finally come out in Canada. That would certainly hurt good films, but those one-weekend-wonder stinkers that are massively promoted (and never shown to critics in advance) would flop bigtime in a fore-warned Canada. Overall, that's a lot fewer movie tickets sold. Who's going to pick up the slack? Maybe, just maybe, local Canadian film-makers. Quebec actually has a pretty good cinema going but English Canada has bugger all thanks to the abundance of american media. Anything that reduces the market share of american cinema is likely to cause a boom in Canadian film. Yes, american TV shows filming on the cheap in Canada might finally have a little competition for local talent, but who cares?
Market controls on foreign content in a nation's cinema have been shown to improve that nation's cinema. Just look at French cinema since WWII. Their government required that a certain percentage of films shown in French cinemas had to be French. U.S. production companies were financing cheap films just to boost the overall French market so they could release more films in France! Canada considered implementing similar legislation, but failed to do so, much to the detriment of our own nation's cinema. Canada's cinema could certainly benefit from market controls today, but implementing them would be political suicide for any who dared. The U.S. would cry foul over protectionism and Canadians used to american films would be very peeved about not being able to get their fix. However, if the kind americans were to do this for us...
This really is a win-win situation for Canada. The worst the U.S. can do to Canada is the best possible thing for Canada's cinema and the worst possible thing for american film makers. So *PLEASE* blacklist us. Pretty please! I freakin' double dare ya! Heck, BAN the release of american movies in Canada indefinately!
I hope this hits the mainstream news in Canada (Score:5, Insightful)
I believe all this "Canadians are dirty rotten thieves" stuff the "IP proponents" are pulling is due to the fact that the current government is working on revising our copyright law. I suspect that they are trying to pressure the Canadian government into getting their way.
It might even be at the behest of the government who seems to be intent on listening to only one side (guess who?). The Conservatives campaigned partially on "repairing the damage that the liberals did to US - Canada relations" (not that most Americans pay much attention to Canada anyway...) The copyright reforms are likely to be very unpopular no matter what's in them. If they say, "Oh we need to crack down to keep our relations happy with the Americans", maybe they think that will smooth things over.
If that's the case, I think they are terribly misguided. Canadians have always had a low tolerance to being stepped on by the elephant that is the US. We have a chip on our shoulders. In fact, one of the defining principles of being a Canadian is that "We aren't American". For some people, that's their only definition of being Canadian.
Pressure from the US to do *anything* to our laws will likely doom that idea, whether it be good or bad. Hence it would be nice to see what happens if the above characterization would be on the front page of the local newspapers...
Time to fight back (Score:5, Funny)
Canadians are nice (Score:4, Informative)
Just because the US was pressured into these silly ideas of Intellectual Property Owners can rule your mind, doest make them right.
I think what the Riaa and Mpaa are worried about is that Canadians are still customers to be sold, not consumers to be culled.
There are very few places on earth that are as fair and law abiding as Canada, but when we ask them to enact silly DMCA like laws, they might just not agree they want them.
Remember, there is no such thing as Intellectual Property ownership, just a limited monopoly on the rights of distribution, excepting fair use.
The whole world could learn from Canada on this.
Cheers
Obligatory Canadian Bacon quotes (Score:3, Funny)
- "Let's send the Omega Force!"
- "There's a time to think, and there's a time to act. And this, gentlemen, is not a time to think."
- "Canadians are always dreaming up a lotta ways to ruin our lives. The metric system, for the love of God! Celsius! Neil Young!" ... and now Piracy!
and last, but not least:
- "Stop piracy, pronto! Or we'll level Toronto!"
""Chronic" failure", you say? (Score:5, Funny)
(catchpa: underway)
Re:As a Canadian to Bush (Score:5, Insightful)
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