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Businesses China The Internet

Alibaba Face Off With Chinese Regulator Over Fake Products 79

Posted by samzenpus from the clean-up-your-act dept.
hackingbear writes China's State Administration of Industry and Commerce on Wednesday issued a scathing report against one of the country's biggest stars, accusing e-commerce giant Alibaba of failing to do enough to prevent fake goods from being sold on its websites. SAIC said Alibaba allowed "illegal advertising" that misled consumers with false claims about low prices and other details. It claims some Alibaba employees took bribes and the company failed to deal effectively with fraud. Alibaba fired back with charges of bias and misconduct by accusing the SAIC official in charge of Internet monitoring, Liu Hongliang, of unspecified "procedural misconduct" and warned it will file a formal complaint. Such public defiance is almost unheard of in China. Apparently, Alibaba has long attained the too big to fail status.
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Alibaba Face Off With Chinese Regulator Over Fake Products More

Alibaba Face Off With Chinese Regulator Over Fake Products

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  • Need a fake gold coin? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Rooked_One ( 591287 ) on Thursday January 29, 2015 @10:09PM (#48937003) Journal
    Alibaba has them. And even some great copies of NGC and PCGS slabbed coins.

  • This will help ali baba. E-bay had the same problem. I've encountered dozens of fake scams on ali baba. Mostly for watches.

    • And China will execute people for corruption and bribery.

      • Re:Great! (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Nikker ( 749551 ) on Thursday January 29, 2015 @11:39PM (#48937305)
        This is merely a waltz for the public. China knows what they are getting into with Alibaba, the ability to take what they have lying around and sidestep having to find someone else sell it for them. Right now China basically manufactures for the world but they sell at small margins so that resellers / contractors sell the goods at a markup to the rest of the world. Alibaba gives a chance to sell directly to the consumer. The Chinese government wants Alibaba to seem strong willed so "The West" builds confidence in buying their stuff. In reality most of what Alibaba sells is leftovers and over runs.

        I personally don't think China would leave something this public to chance, most of Alibaba's backers are the who's who of Chinese nationals and Chinese mainland (which the govt controls) makes everything Alibaba sells. It's hard to picture Alibaba being as rogue as they put on.
        • I'm living in China at the moment, and I can confidently say that probably 95% of the goods available on Taobao and Alibaba have some type of problem with them. If you're looking for something cheap, only need to use it for a little while, don't require any type of technical support whatsoever, and have no long term expectations, Alibaba is a wonderful place. If you're looking for something else, I would stick to American, European, Japanese, and Korean goods.

        • I don't think so. This is not cheap Chinese products we are talking about. China itself is actively clamping down on fake products with blatent trademark infringement leaving the country. These products also make up a very small portion of what is sold on Alibaba so it's actually unlikely to hurt anyone by stopping the trade. They aren't clamping down on cheap shit that breaks after 2 days, they are clamping down on cheap shit which breaks after two days and has Bose written on it.

    • How do you become surprised that you're getting fake watches, sunglasses, et cetera from Alibaba, anyway? It's believable that a few items will legally trickle through channels as advance demo units and the like, and wind up on eBay, but it's not at all believable that some random Chinese outfit can legally supply you anywhere from one to several thousand pieces of genuine Casio watches or LV handbags or even Cisco routers, for that matter.

      • Pretty much my thought. I'm worried I might have to look somewhere else to buy cheap plastic crap in the shape of expensive-looking things, but more adequately priced. America has always turned to China (and other Asian countries) to sell us cheap plastic crap, why are people trying to ruin the arrangement?
      • They make some outstanding fake jerseys over there and sell them at a fraction of the price they go for here. Nobody in their right mind buying those would think they were legit though. Not at those prices.

    • You don't help Alibaba by pointing out what they already know. I'm certainly not going to defend the Electronic Bay of Thieves' business pratices, but Alibaba has built their business on telling you that you are dealing with crooks. They go to great lengths to warn you that the people they hook you up with are not trustworthy and that they will hold your money in escrow for you, while warning you never to deal with the seller directly. Then, when you get cheated, they always side with the seller.

      Don't try

    • Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Zappy ( 7013 )

      I don't have a problem with fakes marketed as fake (or the pr term replica).

      I do have a problem with crap made to look like a nice products marketed as nice products at almost nice product price point.

      At least 95% of the time things I got at Ali was what was more or less described.
      There where some notable exceptions however and Ali, for now at least, doesn't care. Escrow is a joke, the people handling the disputes are incompetent or interested probably both. The people handling the complaint on the dispute

  • Like the bankers, too big to punish. Everybody should know who wears the pants in government-corporate relationships.

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by TWX ( 665546 )
      I donno, the Chinese seem to be willing to actually punish corporate executive and government official types from time to time. We'll just have to see if this is one of those times.

      I can't deny it's annoying, searching for something using Google and getting fifteen Alibaba entries on the list first, when it looks like thirteen of them are using identical stock photos. That kind of crap is why I won't use Alibaba at all; I'd rather pay the markup from a local distributor than worry about being fleeced t

      • So far, my experience with Alibaba (Aliexpress, anyway) is that at least on small items they are happy to refund you and ding the shipper. They don't care about those guys, if they go out of business and get broken up for parts or whatever there will be another guy right behind them with some more crappy crap.

        • So far, my experience with Alibaba (Aliexpress, anyway) is that at least on small items they are happy to refund you and ding the shipper.

          If you're seeing that enough to make a comment about it, maybe you should look to a different source.

          • If you're seeing that enough to make a comment about it, maybe you should look to a different source.

            I have to return stuff I bought on eBay all the time, and occasionally stuff I buy from Amazon. It's not a big deal that some of the stuff from Aliexpress is garbage, until I get stuck with a bill and pile of shit. That hasn't happened to me yet, though.

      • Comment removed based on user account deletion

      • I donno, the Chinese seem to be willing to actually punish corporate executive and government official types from time to time.

        I suspect there's very little overlap between those punished and those who are guilty.

        When I say guilty I'm referring to the coruption etc. that they're charged with. Clearly they're guilty of being a threat to someone in power, or not paying the right bribes.

  • why does anybody feel safe purchasing from them (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 29, 2015 @10:25PM (#48937059)

    I'm at a complete loss to understand why anybody would purchase anything from a site name Alibaba.

    Lets just call ourselves outright thieves, its right there in the title and yet people are surprised when they are sold a bill of goods.

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by Anonymous Coward

      I bought a HDMI to DVI adapter for $3.60 with free shipping from China. It took 5 days to get here and I'm using it now to see what I'm typing. Why WOULDN'T I buy it from Alibaba? The price is realistic. The service is good. ...I know it sounds like an advert, but they're the facts! I dont know how they can provide a functioning adapter at that price, and I don't care. It's good to see a bit of Chinese competition against local ripoff merchants trying to maintain an unrealistic price point.

  • Amazon Looks the Other Way, Acts Innocent (Score:4, Informative)

    by Press2ToContinue ( 2424598 ) * on Thursday January 29, 2015 @10:34PM (#48937081)

    Alibabi is not unique in this regard, Amazon is due for a dressing-down for quite similar negligence. I have bought many supposedly name-brand items, only to realize upon receiving that they are cheap, fraudulent knock-offs. Yet Amazon seems unable or unwilling to address the issue. Reading recent comments, you can sometimes tell, but Amazon does not associate the product supplier with the comments, so there is no way to track which suppliers are providing authentic goods, and which are taking you for a ride.

    • eBay (Score:1)

      by phorm ( 591458 )

      Ebay has been the bulk of my experience with this, and they deal with it *VERY* poorly.

      MicroSDXC card which is labelled as 32GB but actually rewrites sectors at about 4GB (you won't know until after you used it awhile), ah well they sold that to you too long ago so we won't deal with it, even though it's fraud

      DVD series that's boxed nicely but obviously not legit (poor subtitles taken from fansubs, even some eps with scan-lines)... well we'll do something about that *IF* you can prove they're fake by having

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by Anonymous Coward

      There's a reason my household only buys on Amazon what is supplied by Amazon. Third party seller? Forget it.

    • when they started using third-parties to fulfill a bunch of order that they put their name on. Just another of their shitty anti-consumer business decisions along with the slow-frog-boil that is Prime and the shit filled walled garden that is bootloader locked Kindle.

  • What? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by ArchieBunker ( 132337 ) on Thursday January 29, 2015 @10:36PM (#48937093)

    I go to Alibaba because they sell cheap knockoffs.

    • Knockoffs is the least serious claim. China is trying to improve its image at this time, and continuing to make cheap, shitty knockoffs is harming its image. They're fighting the race to the bottom that they created by ignoring or even blessing the copying all this time.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by jtara ( 133429 )

      Hmmmm.... somehow I thought that knockoffs are legal in China? Maybe only if they knockoff another Chinese manufacturer? Maybe only if they sell it to a Chinese person?

      Because otherwise, how can you explain why so many different factories make exactly the same product?

      Now, legitimately, maybe IP-holders in China license multiple factories to make the same product, and then each factory sells the items directly from the factory, and pays a royalty to the IP-holder, but...

      No.

      Still, my advice on buying from Al

      • Re: (Score:3)

        by tlhIngan ( 30335 )

        Hmmmm.... somehow I thought that knockoffs are legal in China? Maybe only if they knockoff another Chinese manufacturer? Maybe only if they sell it to a Chinese person?

        Ironically, it's more a case of "ripping off your own products".

        Knockoffs are legal... if they're of a non-Chinese good.

        But try to knock off a Chinese product or even pirate a Chinese product (say a DVD or something) and China Does Something About It(tm). There have been more than a few piracy groups busted for pirating Chinese movies and TV

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by Greyfox ( 87712 )
      Yeah, if you're in the market for cheap plastic crap and aren't terribly picky about quality, that's definitely the place to go. Hopefully that's not where my doctor goes to get his pee-hole probulators. There are some goods where cheap wal-mart quality simply won't do. Hello Kitty Branded dildos, yes, pee-hole probes, no. Because you know if that goddamn thing breaks off inside you, doc's gonna have to go for the forceps, which were probably also made for cheap in China. And you know, next thing you know,
    • I like cheap knockoffs just like the next guy, if they effectively do the same thing as the "real thing". If they don't [gnome.org] then it's more of a problem. (the stated case has nothing to do with alibaba I believe)

    • I go to Alibaba because they sell cheap knockoffs.

      Knockoffs and fakes are two different things. Don't worry you'll always be able to get cheap crap from alibaba. They are trying to stop you getting cheap crap with Rolex written on it.

  • The corporatocracy will not have it's growth stunted regardless of political affiliation.

  • Kind of fits. Alibaba needs 40 thieves.

  • Alibaba was the big shit last fall and I was looking to buy a plasma TV in the 60" range so I checked their site. If I were to believe Alibaba's seller, I could get 5 of them for the same price as 1 TV from Costco. Yeah, that sounds legit.

    • If I were to believe Alibaba's seller, I could get 5 of them for the same price as 1 TV from Costco. Yeah, that sounds legit.

      That's a fairly clear scam, unless you were shopping Sony and they were offering J. Random Brand. But there are real things on there, too. And if you were to buy 5 TVs you probably could get them somewhere close to half off, but you'd have to pick them up from the port for that price.

  • If corporate America can offshore the production of its goods to China, displacing US workers, but continuing to keep prices high, then I see this as a fair and just response to that. Cut out the middlemen, it is good for the US consumer, and that's all that matters, right? Just like global trade.

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by Anonymous Coward

      There lies not the issue:
      If there's a product listing for company X's product, then it had better be company X's product.
      If it's listed as company Ex's product and is similarly spec'ed and with identical look or listed as compatible with company X's , then no problem. Just it must not be listed as company X's product.

  • This will not end well (Score:3)

    by jimmydevice ( 699057 ) on Thursday January 29, 2015 @11:46PM (#48937329)

    It's the same gang fuck attitude we saw in the 80' with the atari 2600. Junk carts, moving mfg to asia, fire everyone .This time, it's not a bunch of shit for brains designers / coders and polyester suit wearing sales droids, it's the chinese elite with unlimited capital and a unbridled desire to be a +one percent.
    We are truly fucked. Get ready for food riots.

  • Chinese official face their biggest challenge yet: too big to pay bribes.

  • 1. short Alibaba stock
    2. post negative official message publicly
    3. ???
    4. PROFIT !!!

  • not ready for prime time (Score:5, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday January 30, 2015 @08:26AM (#48938993)

    I bought a 32GB USB 3.0 stick from Aliexpress. It said "Toshiba" on it, even though linux would show the vendor as generic. The drive showed 32GB free space. However, it only had 6GB of actual space on it (there are utilities out there that will actually test this). I gave the item 1 star, the lowest possible rating. For the next few days, the vendor was calling my house (yes, I was stupid to put my real phone number on my order - silly me, thinking that I was dealing with professionals, not thugs) at 3am, threatening to continue calling at that time until I changed my review to 5 stars. Only 5 stars would be "a fair review", as they were so keen to say.

    So I just unplugged my phone at night for the next month and deleted my Aliexpress account. I had provided Aliexpress' abuse department with emailed threats that I received and voice calls, but they never even replied. Screw them. I'll stick with Ebay, which has a functioning feedback system, or something else that is legit.

  • A lot of sellers give false information about their products, and they get really angry when you complain about it.

    Just look for "philips 50000mAh" power banks, for instance.
    They often defy physics by having more storage capability per weight than is theoretically possible for LiPo batteries.

    LED lights and similar often exaggerate their light output by at least a factor 2, sometimes 10.

    That said, I'm happy with quite a lot of aliexpress products, so I think that aliexpress would be great if they started to

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Mirar ( 264502 )

      Actually I noticed some of the same behaviour from dx.com - I sent a bad review for some stuff, and those never got accepted, then vanished from my review list.

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