Facebook is Building a Real Community in California To Test Whether People Love Tech Companies Enough To Live in Them (nytimes.com) 181
In Menlo Park, Calif., Facebook is building a real community and testing the proposition: Do people love tech companies so much they will live inside them? From a report: Willow Village will be wedged between the Menlo Park neighborhood of Belle Haven and the city of East Palo Alto, both heavily Hispanic communities that are among Silicon Valley's poorest. Facebook is planning 1,500 apartments, and has agreed with Menlo Park to offer 225 of them at below-market rates. The most likely tenants of the full-price units are Facebook employees, who already receive a five-figure bonus if they live near the office.
The community will have eight acres of parks, plazas and bike-pedestrian paths open to the public. Facebook wants to revitalize the railway running alongside the property and will finish next year a pedestrian bridge over the expressway. The bridge will provide access to the trail that rings San Francisco Bay, a boon for birders and bikers. Mr. Tenanes, Facebook's vice president for real estate, contemplates the audacity of building a city.
The community will have eight acres of parks, plazas and bike-pedestrian paths open to the public. Facebook wants to revitalize the railway running alongside the property and will finish next year a pedestrian bridge over the expressway. The bridge will provide access to the trail that rings San Francisco Bay, a boon for birders and bikers. Mr. Tenanes, Facebook's vice president for real estate, contemplates the audacity of building a city.
Stop playing SimCity, Mark... (Score:5, Insightful)
...we don't trust you to run a virtual community, so why the hell would any of us want to live in a REAL community under your control?
Re:Stop playing SimCity, Mark... (Score:4, Insightful)
What will they do about the homeless? (Score:2)
That seems to always be a problem in Sims...
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...we don't trust you to run a virtual community, so why the hell would any of us want to live in a REAL community under your control?
I'm sorry, what's that you're ranting about? I couldn't quite hear you over the shrieking noise of soul-crushing debt brought on by an insane real estate market.
(There's nothing REAL about the justification for California housing costs, so you better fucking believe those who are forced to live there are going to jump all over this bargain.)
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we
Who the fuck is "we"?
Because for most people, it never becomes an issue of questioning trust, the trust is implicit and any question raised is an annoyance.
These sort of people far outnumber the pseudo-activist types like yourself, who somehow think that because they boycott a particular product, they are dealing a blow to "the bad guys" and somehow proliferating their view throughout society.
In reality almost everyone else doesn't give a fuck and never will without profound social upheaval. Your "activism"
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...we don't trust you to run a virtual community, so why the hell would any of us want to live in a REAL community under your control?
Obviously, it will be better for you if they have more control over you. Have you not been listening to the government?
Cult? (Score:2, Interesting)
How is working for these big CA tech companies any different from being in a cult at this point? You believe their ideology or at least pretend to; speak up and you will be fired. They already paid extra to keep you on a string so they could summon you whenever it was convenient for them. Now live on their property? Will they hand out free drinks next? (Read: DON'T DRINK IT.)
company store days are comeing back and irs (Score:5, Insightful)
company store days are comeing back and the irs can hold a big tax bill over your head as well for the real cost of your free housing. so jay you better be ready for the 80-90 hour work week.
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As an avid cyclist (Score:2)
I'd rather cycle in Chicago in the middle of winter than on a pristine cycle path in sunny California in a Facebook village for overpaid yuppies. The latter sounds like my personal idea of hell on Earth.
Re:As an avid cyclist (Score:5, Interesting)
As someone who has cycled in Chicago in the middle of winter AND on a pristine cycle path in sunny California, I can say with confidence that you are bullshitting. After about ten minutes of getting hit in the face with sleet and your bike sliding on icy streets and the hairs freezing in your nose and cars splashing a colloidal mixture of slush, road salt and filth onto you, it gets kind of old.
Also, you're likely to find just as many overpaid yuppies in Chicago as you would in Menlo Park. If you've ever cycled down Halsted Street or Ashland near Division or Diversey & Sheffield, or Lincoln Ave toward downtown or Dearborn past Chicago Ave., the place is crawling with overpaid yuppies. The difference is that in California, you are more likely to see those yuppies wearing cropped t-shirts and short-shorts with their butt cheeks hanging out (even the women!) and that can make all the difference when it comes to quality of life.
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As someone else who has done both, I'm with OP. I cycled up and down Halsted all winter long for years, dodging door, potholes, and other shit and had a blast. After living in the bay area for the last 10 years, I'll say fuck this place. It's sunny and still fucking cold and ain't nobody walking around with cropped t-shirts and short shorts like your fantasy. It's a bunch of androgynous ugly nerds with baggy hoodies who don't know shit.
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Bullocks.
The South Bay, down Facebook and Google way, is generally excruciatingly hot... usually at least 10, and often 15-20, degrees hotter than the city. I do usually have an emergency hoodie in the car when I drive down there, because I've lived in California long enough to know better than to not have an extra layer handy just in case. But I don't think I've had to break it out south of Redwood City or so in the last decade.
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Pullman was very successful. Also, you shouldn't use the past tense, because it's still one of the nicest neighborhoods in the city and it's even been designated as a National Monument. If you want to compare Facebookville with some negative planned industrial communities, you probably should look for examples other than Pullman.
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According to Weather Underground, it's 34 degrees F in Chicago right now. Second day of Spring.
Let's not BS here. Chicago gets plenty winter these days. If you live there, you know they get more than enough.
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Literally the only people in Chicago who wish they had more winter are the Streets & Sanitation guys who drive snow plows and make overtime salting the streets.
So if you're lamenting the "warmest winter ever", you're not a Chicagoan.
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2014 was the 4th snowiest winter in Chicago since 1884. I know because I was there shoveling that shit and it lasted one hell of a lot longer than a day. We were unable to get our car out of the garage because the alley couldn't be plowed for over a week and the drifts lasted until March. There was snow piled against our b
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The Truman Show! (Score:4, Insightful)
Seriously - anyone who takes below-market housing from Facebook of all companies should expect a double-dose of data collection.
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Make sure you "LIKE" my new Converse shoes i just bought at the Facebook Marketplace!
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Talk about bad timing... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Talk about bad timing... (Score:5, Funny)
Negative, Meatbag. ZUCKERBOT 9000 is consumed with planning its run for the president of... KILL ALL HUMANS. All who oppose ZUCKERBOT 9000 are russian bots. BEEP BOOP BOOP.
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...Which debacle? ...,
Yup, the debacle where Facebook apparently knew about the data privacy issues for years but did nothing about them, in possible violation of the 2011 consent agreement. That debacle.
Re: Talk about bad timing... (Score:2)
*a company which was hoping to sell data to Trump used Facebook's API, but Trump never bought the data
India (Score:1)
There are tech companies that do this in India, one big gated community including housing and the office space. The folks that lived there seemed to enjoy it.
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We're on our way to making the area outside a gated community look just like it does in India, so I assume this will make the people here love that gated living just as much.
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Great! Now we call all live in corporate burbclaves just like Cyberpunk 2020 and Shadowrun, because totally were roadmaps rather than cautionary tales...
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Do the watchtowers and barbed wire face inward, or outward?
Street Names (Score:5, Funny)
Most homes will be built near the corner of Cambridge and Analytica. The Home Owners Association will demand that none of the houses shall have locks and no windows will have blinds/drapes .
Wasn't this a movie with Emma Watson in it? (Score:1)
"...contemplates the audacity of building a city."
Examples of audacity: sending people to Mars, sending a car into orbit, exploiting peoples' desire for social connection, putting pineapple on pizza
Not an example of audacity: building yet another company town. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Company_town
Real Plan (Score:5, Insightful)
Invest a little money into poor communities buying up properties tax free .. of course no one living there now can actually afford them
Make new apartments and condo's reinvigorating a blight, tax free
Keep it on the books for 10 years, pricing all the poor people out, until its full of hipsters and yuppies, then sell for a massive profit and still not pay taxes on it
http://dof.ca.gov/Forecasting/... [ca.gov]
The federal tax bill passed at the end of December 2017 allows the Governor to designate eligible census tracts as Opportunity Zones. Investments made by individuals through special funds in these zones would be allowed to defer or eliminate federal taxes on capital gains.
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strings attached (Score:1)
2) Local laws are contradictory
3) You are treated as an infinite resource
4) You lose all the freedom required to do your job
5) Immigrants take your home after 8 months
6) Everyone looks for the most superficial ways to show the world how smart they are all the time
Poll (Score:2, Funny)
Yes
No
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I really believe that FB is a global mental illness and shit like that just kinda cemented it for me.
How does somebody get so outta touch that they don't even think of the implications of asking such a stupid question.
I have seen that Black Mirror episode (Score:3)
Community outreach (Score:2)
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IMO, why not? (Score:2)
I live in a city that was created back in the early 1900's by the railroad. They put their infrastructure here and then built a "planned community" around it. Today, CSX still uses the tracks here as a rail yard and we have a station stop that's used for the commuter rail system. But generally, the buildings the railroad originally built have all been re-purposed for other things and we have a self-sustaining town here.
I think it's wishful thinking if they believe success in such an endeavor proves people
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sign me up (Score:5, Insightful)
Wait, and it comes with a 15% discount on their products? Sounds great!
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will they will have to prove that you did not go to the doctor and hell if they want to be that much of an ass then what having there own doctor come over for free to check the worker out.
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but they still can fire you for something done at home in your off time and it they do under CA law they may have to give a lot of back OT pay.
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Hello Margery, George Costanza. How are you sweet heart? Listen, can you give Mr. Thomassoulo a message for me? Yes. If he needs me, tell him (screams) I’M IN MY OFFICE! Thanks.
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Assuming you don't live in such a community, with other means of surveillance and work for Facebook...
Leave phone at home, running, with Facebook installed. Go out for a day at the beach. Sick people sleep, and sleeping people put their ringer on vibrate.
Better yet, leave the phone at home on WiFi so the FB app has GPS and Internet access. Swap your SIM to a cheap flip-phone, and use that while out.
landlord tenant law say they can't kick you out th (Score:2)
landlord tenant law say they can't kick you out that easy.
I have a name for it! (Score:2)
I have a name for it: Experimental Prototype Community of Tomorrow
Or is that already taken?
I know Americans are cattle already... (Score:1)
...but this is taking "branding" to a truly disgusting level.
mnem
"I refuse to belong to any club that would have me as a member." ~ Groucho
Company town (Score:2)
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More valuable than their employees' cash, they want more of their employees' time.
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Yep, the US needs working hour/vacation time laws, even if that makes us only slightly more productive than other developed countries. Happiness > productivity.
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You code sixteen slocs, what do you get? (Score:2)
Some people say a coder is made outta mud
A poor coder's made outta hacking and fud
Hacking and fud and scripts and caffeine
A mind that's weak and a keyboard that's strong
You code sixteen slocs, what do you get?
Another day older and deeper in debt
Google, don't you call me 'cause I can't go
I owe my soul to the company store
I wake up in a basement where the sun doesn't shine
I picked up my keyboard and walked in half past nine
I hacked sixteen slocs of fine gui code
And the manager said "well, bless my soul"
You co
Poor or not... (Score:2)
"The Bay Area's poorest..."
Read: most affordable. Last I checked, the poor need to live somewhere as well.
How many existing residents will be displaced if eminent domain (aka land theft) is used to build the thing. I bet the 15% of below-market-rate homes will still hold fewer people than the homes bulldozed to build this utopia.
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that book should be required god damn reading in highschool.. now more than ever.
Imagine if Google did this (Score:2)
Like most Google projects, they'd have 250 houses in varying degrees of incomplete, fiber would be run to the opposite side of town, they would have neglected to lay the utility infrastructure, and kick everyone out in 6 months when they change remind everyone this was BETA.
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If google did this
How cute. Google already does. Only without the housing - they have homeless [businessinsider.com] employees that live on campus [quora.com].
Facebook at least wants to give the illusion that their employees are free to go as far as 100 ft to home. Actually, Google does have its own housing project [mercurynews.com] but they seem to not be that interested.
From virtual Skinner Box to a real one you pay for (Score:3)
Think of all the cool experiments Facebook can do with real life people in real world boxes?
Naming contest (Score:2)
Please submit your suggestions using hash tag #DeleteFacebook winner will be announced during next Facebook shareholder meeting.
- Fuckerville
- Slavetown
- Pwn3dville
- New Pyongyang
- Dusttopia
- Stalkerville
- Airstrip Two
- Creepertown
Re:Naming contest (Score:5, Funny)
Zuckerburg too obvious?
old idea - labor camp (Score:2)
Labor camps, like in the movie Angel City, existed to enslave and exploit workers. They can't afford to leave, had no one to contact for justice or protection.
this isn't really new. (Score:3)
I have seen large companies that "own" small towns in the 70s-80's do this.
This is how they try to get you in as a selling point, free in-house child care, discounted food, discounted gas, grocery stores and housing, company vehicle. Where they trick you is you won't see any real raises or employee growth and once you have a few kids the convenience is to good of a deal to walk away from, so your stuck there for another 15 or so years....
Some places were very much like the movie the firm, as in, you really didn't want to leave under threat of the company "knowing" certain things about your lifestyle.
I guess it's fine if you totally ok with that kind of lifestyle ...then again this was back when companies actually kept people until they retired, they may have wanted a slave but at least they kept you employed for ever...
They should just do dormitories (Score:2)
RIF (Score:1)
What happens when the employee gets laid off or RIF'd?
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reduction_in_Force)
Obviously this is for management, not employees.
Another GULAG? (Score:1)
On the plus side (Score:2)
All the free KoolAid you can drink.
Facebook town (Score:2)
Control (Score:3)
Moving is already hell. Losing your job is already hell. Imagine being told to pack your things _and_ that you have 30 days to find a new place to live at the same time!
Birders and bikers (Score:2)
I know what a biker is, but a birder? Is it what you call someone who loves doing birdwatching?
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Maybe because they feel the need to invent new words to own them and make sure older people don't understand them.
Maybe we should call them rebranders instead of millenials.
Oh boy, company towns are back (Score:2)
FB has a VP of Real Estate ??? (Score:2, Insightful)
Let's all contemplate the ramifications of this statement for a moment.
Let's not pretend Facebook is being benevolent (Score:2)
"Facebook is planning 1,500 apartments, and has agreed with Menlo Park to offer 225 of them at below-market rates."
Oh Facebook has agreed to? That's nice of them.
Menlo Park requires new residential developments of that side to reserve at least 15% of new units for below-market rates. Guess what 15% of 1,500 is?
Link missing (Score:2)
Source: https://www.menlopark.org/Docu... [menlopark.org]
Real tech themed area would be all open plan (Score:2)
When I read the headline, the image in my mind was a community built like an open plan office. All of the beds are in one or two huge rooms. If people snore, you can use headphones to block it out. Surrounding the giant shared bedrooms are a whole bunch of small rooms for changing or other activities of an intimate nature. There aren't nearly enough, so book early. Outside of that is a narrow strip of grass that they call a park.
Folk music covered this one.... get the banjo. (Score:2)
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>I don't know who the singer is, but I have in my mind
> the chorus, "I sold mah soul to the Company Store".
Actually, it's "I owe my soul to the company store". A popular version of "Sixteen Tons" was done by Tennessee Ernie Ford in 1955, hitting #1 on the Billboard charts https://www.youtube.com/watch?... [youtube.com] The original was written and sung by Merle Travis in 1946.
dreams (Score:2)
This must be their dream. Imagine... no more traffic, planet saved, and all that ? What you say nerds ? -1 ?
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I mean, it seems hard enough to entice these high salary people to move to a community sandwiched in between what sounds like ghetto neighborhoods...why would you actively try to bring in likely criminal and low life tenets to live with your employees?
I know some think that it will lift up the poorer types, but from what I've seen over my years of watching it happen in my cities, it rarely is able to undo generations of living poorly, n
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"below market rate" in the Bay Area means something quite different than what you might stereotype. These aren't section 8 housing for ex-convicts. "Below market rate" simply means "not $1M or above". So that the non-tech staff or workers (full time jobs) earning "just" 100k or so can afford to live there.
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First of all, "below-market rates" in the SF Bay area does not equate to "low rent", it simply refers to rental rates that are below the uber-exorbitant standard rents in the area. Most middle-income people still won't be able to afford them no less people of limited income.
Secondly, poor, Hispanic communities do not equate to "ghetto neighborhoods" and "criminal and low life" individual. This kind of racism and elitism does nothing to promote a diverse, productive society.
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I feel more sorry for the residents of the surrounding neighborhoods...
(1) Will their reasonably-prices stores and gathering places be replaced with those that cater to chichi tech-hipsters?
(2) Will any of their communities be bulldozed under eminent domain/"blight" laws to make way for a measly 225 housing units?
Not being as rich as your neighbors doesn't make you "ghetto", and poorer people need to live somewhere too.
below market rates (Score:2)
why would you actively try to bring in likely criminal and low life tenets to live with your employees?
"Below market rates" for rent in that part of CA does not imply affordability to "low life tenets[sic]", or anyone in the bottom three quintiles of household income in the U.S.
Re:'Social Credit' (Score:5, Interesting)
I live in a nice neighborhood. They also included about 12 'low income' style houses in the mix. I believe it is a requirement where I live.
These are houses, which are purchased. Not rental units. I have no idea how they maintain the 'low income' ideal when houses are sold.
But here is what I have found:
The turnover rate of the low-income housing is probably triple of the 'regular' (somewhat high-end) houses.
MOST of the people are good/fine. No problems.
I would say that 75% of the 'problems' in the neighborhood stem from the low-income section. (My house is close by, I see what is happening) 75% of the problems yes, but this is in a neighborhood that has very, very few problems. So we're talking about maybe 3 police actions per year that I see.
75% of the traffic is also generated by that small collection of homes. Like these people drive a lot.
The biggest difference though is the age of the residents. In the 'regular' homes, the homeowner age is well above 50. I am on the young side, and I turn 50 in two weeks. I think two other guys are below 50, the rest are much older.
The low-income housing is made up of lots of younger people. 20 somethings, 30 somethings.
I don't think income has much to do with the 'problems', I think it has more to do with age. And honestly, the number of 'problems' is very low. It seems like a bunch of normal people, who couldn't afford $700,000 homes, but were able to live in a nice neighborhood for maybe a third of that price.
OH! The only issue I have is with parking overflow. Every once in a while a new group of people will move in with a plethora of cars which they start parking in front of other houses. The low income area is more like a condo complex (but they are detached) and they have their own parking areas, but they do get full. So people park on the normal street. All of the houses have at least 3 car garages, and giant driveways. We aren't even supposed to park on the street overnight...but the low-income residents didn't have to sign a CC&R stating they wouldn't park on the street...we did.
That's it. These are all really small issues. But I do believe that the people living in the low-income area benefit greatly from being in a nice neighborhood. I think it's fine.
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Just wait until one is made into a sober living house.
There was a cluster about a mile away from my house. Being converted into old folks assisted living now, after 3+ years of hell.
We'd have the recycle bins disappear regularly. As tweeks would steal them for 'bag money'. Couldn't leave the cheapest thing where it could be stolen.
The theory of 'low income housing' is that the scumbags stop reinforcing each others bad habits. But they always build them in mini clusters.
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I think you're wrong about age not making a difference. Young adults tend to be more aggressive, and less willing to obey rules they don't agree with. This is just a statistical extrapolation from personal observations, and certainly doesn't translate into "belligerent punks that trash the neighborhood", but I remember my friends from just post-college years, and tales my younger brothers told, and...well, lots of anecdotal stuff. And it makes sense from an evolutionary perspective, too. Enough so that
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If I had to guess, it was required by the local government as part of allowing Facebook to do this new development in the first place. It's quite common in the San Francisco Bay Area. Here's an example in San Francisco [sfmohcd.org].
Stupid is a scalar (Score:2)
Well, at least you're original. Most idiots make the mistake the other way round.
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The 225 low rent places will be for the "contractors" at FB (janitors, kitchen staff, thought police, etc).
Wouldn't it make more sense to just pay them more, rather than subsidizing their rent?
Rent subsidies for poor people to live in the heart of Silicon Valley makes about as much sense as subsidizing the BMW dealerships so they can sell Z4s to poor people at lower prices.
The key to making housing affordable is to increase the total supply. These 1.5K new houses will help, but the SF Bay Area really needs 1.5M.
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The 225 low rent places will be for the "contractors" at FB (janitors, kitchen staff, thought police, etc).
Wouldn't it make more sense to just pay them more, rather than subsidizing their rent?
Where else do you expect the baristas, shop keeps, wait staff and other servants to live? At least the higher paid ones, every one else making minimum wage will have to commute.
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Where else do you expect the baristas, shop keeps, wait staff and other servants to live?
Gilroy.
At least the higher paid ones, every one else making minimum wage will have to commute.
Without the rent subsides, people will not be able to live in the area and accept the low pay. Employers will have to pay more so that workers can afford to either pay market rent or commute from someplace cheaper, such as Gilroy. What the workers get in rent subsidies, they lose on payday. The difference is that rent subsidies don't give them the freedom to spend on what they really want. Perhaps instead of cheaper (but still high) rent in Palo Alto, they would prefer to commute and spend their
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Those systems will likely be used to snoop into Google employees' lives, first and foremost. Who is kidding whom?
Living under the microscope of your employer would be terrible.
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I think the kind of drugs dealt in this neighborhood is intended to be adderall and maybe some overpriced "designer pot", and "low income" merely means "junior" employees who can't afford million dollar homes or $6k monthly rents.