Ford To Stop Selling Every Car In North America But the Mustang, Focus Active (techcrunch.com) 391
An anonymous reader quotes a report from TechCrunch: Ford today announced it will phase out most cars it sells in North America. According to its latest financial release, the auto giant "will transition to two vehicles" -- the Mustang and an unannounced vehicle, the Focus Active, being the only traditional cars it sells in the region. Ford sees 90 percent of its North America portfolio in trucks, utilities and commercial vehicles. Citing a reduction in consumer demand and product profitability, Ford is in turn not investing in the next generation of sedans. The Taurus is no more. The press release also talks about a new type of vehicle, though it sounds like a crossover. This so-called white space vehicle will "combine the best attributes of cars and utilities, such as higher ride height, space and versatility." Currently, Ford sells six sedans and coupes in North America: the Fiesta, Focus, Fusion, C-Max, Mustang and Taurus. This lineup hits multiple segments, from the compact Fiesta to the mid-size Focus, C-Max and Fusion to the full-size Taurus. The Mustang stands alone as the lone coupe.
A high ride is a good thing? (Score:2, Insightful)
I love my antiquated '94 Corolla wagon, not that it's a great car or anything (although it is), but largely because it's got a low and wide profile. Makes it fun to negotiate a curve. Who wants to drive around in a high box?
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I love my antiquated '94 Corolla wagon, not that it's a great car or anything (although it is), but largely because it's got a low and wide profile. Makes it fun to negotiate a curve. Who wants to drive around in a high box?
The floorpan on most of these crossovers is only an inch or two higher than the cars they're based on. The suspension is dramatically more advanced than your '94 Corolla Wagon, or even a car from '94 that actually handles like something other than a moldy dog turd. Basically any modern crossover will run rings around your wagon in the twisties.
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Yeh my Mazda CX5 handles very well indeed, and the turbo diesel is both more powerfull and economical than a corolla.
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Your on crack now. An inch or two or three adds up fast. Also 'cars they're based on'? You mean the tall slow cars they're based on, in the few cases that's true. Most are based on light truck chassis.
Do you realize the work that's done to get a chassis down 1 inch on a fast car?
The modern car will not only have a higher CG, it will weigh much more. Congress passed rollover protection, perhaps they had never met the car industry and expected them to use better material, in any case modern cars are heav
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Suck it up, you should be able to drive over a coin and call heads or tails, just by feel.
She was wearing those three-quarter jeans with the twine belt, all Ellie-Mae-like, and they fit so tight over the pocket you could read the date on the dime on her right front thigh.
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Your on crack now.
*You're
An inch or two or three adds up fast.
That's what she told you, huh?
Also 'cars they're based on'? You mean the tall slow cars they're based on, in the few cases that's true. Most are based on light truck chassis.
Uh no. This is in fact the defining factor between crossovers and SUVs. Crossovers are based on cars. SUVs are based on light trucks.
The modern car will not only have a higher CG, it will weigh much more. Congress passed rollover protection, perhaps they had never met the car industry and expected them to use better material, in any case modern cars are heavy pigs by 90s standards.
And yet, they still outhandle them in most cases, especially on broken pavement and the like, because instead of crap like macpherson or even double wishbone (which is at least decent, if bulky) they are using multilink front and rear. Only the most pathetic of econoboxes are still using macpherson. Macpherson has bump steer. I used to driv
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Porsche uses MacPherson fronts.
Re: A high ride is a good thing? (Score:3)
Nothing new on the suspension front since the introduction of the Citroen DS.
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Suspension has improved because the industry moved towards using better suspension, not because of new inventions. They also pay more attention to setup. It's impossible to lose control over a modern car. Well maybe not impossible since somehow people manage to do that.
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Heck, didn't the mustang above move from live axle to IRS? That's not because IRS is new.
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Who the hell cares which car goes around corners faster when exceeding the speed limit. The compact/mid SUV much easier access and egress, better vision, far more effective loading area, in fact the most logical body shape for a car. The low end cars are very competitive and the compact/mid SUV leaves more price to play with and upmarket in fitments and more scope for batteries, flat bed front to back. Who knows, eventually a two door rag top mustang mid SUV.
Re:A high ride is a good thing? (Score:5, Interesting)
The compact/mid SUV much easier access and egress, better vision, far more effective loading area, in fact the most logical body shape for a car.
You spend a few minutes or even seconds getting in and out, or loading and unloading. You spend hours driving. Sedans have better aerodynamics than crossovers. The most logical body shape for a car is a sedan or wagon, given that we live in the real world with wind resistance.
Re:A high ride is a good thing? (Score:4, Informative)
Mothers, pregnant, with children and elderly relatives. They don't have to crouch down to get into a car, limbo dance into the back seats through the narrow shaped gaps. Large flappy doors for two door cars (Peugeot) are another dislike. They are impossible to get out of in a supermarket car park. So sliding doors are preferred. Basically like having a personal Hackney cab. All the cars that people drive now seem to be either four wheel drive or something between an estate car and a van.
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Mothers, pregnant, with children and elderly relatives. They don't have to crouch down to get into a car, limbo dance into the back seats through the narrow shaped gaps.
This, so many times. So much easier to get a baby into a carrier seat when you're not half bent over.
I prefer my little sports sedan for actual driving though.
Re:A high ride is a good thing? (Score:5, Funny)
Mothers, pregnant, with children and elderly relatives.
That's NOT where elderly relatives come from.
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And yet despite having more or less the same relative amounts of mothers, pregnant women, children and elderly, no-one else in the world buys SUVs and crossovers in the same relative amounts as Americans.
The facts strongly suggest it is not utility that is the selling point...
I do. (Score:3)
I do. Streets in my city (Asunción) are awful. Lots of potholes and plenty of ill-designed and ill-placed speed bumps. When you have low quality streets, a high ride is a godsend.
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I love my antiquated '94 Corolla wagon, not that it's a great car or anything (although it is), but largely because it's got a low and wide profile. Makes it fun to negotiate a curve. Who wants to drive around in a high box?
Indeed
Though '94 isn't antiquated, my (favorite) car is a 1974 Mini Clubman GT. Weighs all of 750 kg (1650 lbs) with me in it, the modified 1275cc motor pushes out over 100bhp, and you only need 5 spanners, 3 screwdrivers, a hammer and a soldering iron + crimping tool to work on it.
It's a road going go-kart
My other car is an MX-5 (miata) but it is nowhere near as fun
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There's a reason Corollas became the best selling car of all time over the VW bug a little over twenty years ago. I have a 1992 sixth generation Corolla with nearly 500k miles.
Indeed.
The Nipponese made vehicles of such quality that the earth's preeminent automobile manufacturer was torn asunder, and Detroit has never been the same.
Ironic, perhaps, that two of the nations vanquished in the 2nd World War (Germany and Japan) grew to dominate worldwide automotive manufacturing.
Perhaps divesting one's national goals from military encroachment to industrial excellence promotes national productivity. Who knew?
Re:A high ride is a good thing? (Score:4, Insightful)
More like, "perhaps having your legacy industry blown to kingdom-come and having to rebuild it from scratch gives you a leg up...."
Especially since in this case, the people who rebuilt their industry from scratch did it with money from the guys who didn't have to rebuild theirs....
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Also, if you call all your cars Corolla you will sell many Corollas!
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Ask anyone who has had to deal with the nightmare that is the Ford Powershift (aka Powershit) double clutch automatic transmission fitted to various smaller Ford vehicles in some market how much they like Ford...
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A good bike is like 5 grand.
That car is like, 500 dollars, max.
The above is comically erroneous, and is emblematic of the syndrome in which a certain class of people believes they can buy their way into a sport by spending more money.
You can buy a bicycle that is more than good enough for a short commute for $300, used, and there are plenty from which to choose,
on Craigslist.
No one other than a pro racer "needs" a bicycle which costs $5,000. And if you go to an amateur race with a $5,000 bicycle, there is a
very good chance you will be beaten in that race by a rider who
Re:A high ride is a good thing? (Score:4, Insightful)
"good bike" is subjective, and there are GREAT bikes available for far less than $5,000 new. You don't need a fucking carbon fiber frame with Shimano Dura-ace components front-to-back on your commuter bike - you aren't entering the Tour de France here. Also, there's this web site called "Craigslist" that you may have heard of, which connects you with people that are selling used stuff in your area. If a 25 year old Corolla is acceptable, why wouldn't a lightly-used 3-year old bike be?
And then there's this:
Operating cost of a bicycle is essentially free, plus some tires, brake elements, and chain oil. And you can subtract the gym membership you don't need for getting your cardio in.
Operating cost of your Corolla that you keep going on about is much higher. The next set of tires + brake job alone would more than pay for a decent commuter bike, never mind the fuel, battery, oil changes, brake fluid / power steering / coolant flush / transmission oil if you're actually maintaining the thing.
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Horse shit. Basically every bike except the boutique dealers is made by Giant these days, so just buy a Giant and don't pay for the brand and higher-end components that you won't even notice the difference on. By and large, they are all the same frame with a different paint job and different components bolted on.
You can get a brand new Giant "city" bike with disc brakes for $600 MSRP. Find a dealer who's clearancing a prior year model (which, again, nobody except an avid cyclist is likely to notice the d
Comment removed (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Oil and gas profits not as high as projected... (Score:5, Insightful)
Funny that they're discontinuing all the fuel efficient models just as the many-years-long slump in oil prices is ending. I guess they can only think about what they should have done in the past, not plan for the future.
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The car buyers are not buying the smaller cars, they are buying the larger ones - just like in the last dot com boom. There's a cartoon somewhere (LA times) where the car dealer shows the customer the largest 4x4 they have on sale. It towers over the car dealership with a huge shadow.
Re:Oil and gas profits not as high as projected... (Score:5, Interesting)
Ford sells a ridiculous number of trucks, that is why they are phasing out less popular models. They somehow suckered people into thinking $60k for a truck is a normal price. One model is over $100k when maxed out with options!
Following the Japanese (Score:5, Interesting)
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Honda's manufacturing is quite incredible. Their factories keep 30 minutes worth of parts on hand, with constant deliveries through the day. They have really got it down to a fine art.
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Let me guess .... only 1 color? (Score:4, Funny)
Crown Vic (Score:4, Funny)
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I can, it's an energy thing. I can spot 6 inches of a cop car sticking past the end of a cinder block wall.
Perhaps you should drive faster?
The wheels (Score:2)
A lot of unmarked cop cars still have steel wheels with those shiny silver caps in the center. Some places are getting trickier and ordering alloy wheels and very well hidden LED lights. Fuck everyone that buys a white/grey/black Explorer with blackout tint, how I am supposed to tell you from a cop?
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Aside - if you bring back those terrible wood panelled atrocities from the 80s, you could start making cool John Hughes-alike films again. 80s - terrible cars, great films.
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You can thank the Government for that. That 4.6L V8 sucked gas. Now everyone is buying Explorers(or similar) with the same 4.6l V8 but even more weight, but since it is a "Truck" it doesn't fall under mileage guidelines. Unintended consequences are never addressed. We Must Have Our 45 MPG cars! Who cares if nobody wants them.
Adam (Score:2)
Maybe they should try calling it the "Osbourne 2". I guess it's not the same, presumably their trucks can keep them afloat as their car sales die until the new model is really out.
Goodbye Ford. (Score:4, Insightful)
You're betting the company on SUVs, and in a few years when gas prices shoot up again, you're gonna lose the company. Does anyone really believe gas prices can stay this low for forever? I think they'll shoot up again within 5 years, just when Ford has ditched all its cars that people will actually want to buy when gas is $5 a gallon.
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You're betting the company on SUVs, and in a few years when gas prices shoot up again, you're gonna lose the company
They will all be electrics or hybrids by then. The trucks they will sell in 5-10 years will get much better mileage than the cars they sell today.
Does anyone really believe gas prices can stay this low for forever?
Nope, and neither does Ford.
Ditching their traditional cars is a bold move, that's true enough. But I can't think of a single rational argument against it.
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when Ford has ditched all its cars that people will actually want to buy when gas is $5 a gallon.
Americans are often confused why Europeans drive small fuel efficient cars. Well I just filled up for $7.80US / gallon. So you can imagine I'm quite happy that my 10 year older beater car gets 45mpg.
How will they achieve CAFE? (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:How will they achieve CAFE? (Score:5, Insightful)
They classify all the other vehicles (pickups, SUVs) as trucks.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_average_fuel_economy [wikipedia.org]
By the time they roll this out, Trump will have abolished both CAFE and global warming and we'll all be dancing happily in the street.
MIsleading headline and summary (Score:5, Informative)
Ford currently sells five models of sedans: Taurus, Focus RS, Fiesta, Mustang, and Focus Active. They're phasing out the first three models over the next few years, to be replaced with all new electric and hybrid models. Still spending a bit to keep the other two in production for the foreseeable future though.
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Ford currently sells five models of sedans: Taurus, Focus RS, Fiesta, Mustang, and Focus Active. They're phasing out the first three models over the next few years, to be replaced with all new electric and hybrid models. Still spending a bit to keep the other two in production for the foreseeable future though.
Erm... I think you need to look up the meaning of sedan, it's 4 doors and a boot.
The Focus RS and Fiesta are hatchbacks, the Mustang is a coupe and the Focus Active is a jacked up hatchback (called a SUV).
The Focus can be had as a Sedan, but not in the RS spec.
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It read more like an Onion article.
misleading title (Score:2)
To stop selling all but two cars.
To continue selling even more crossovers, SUVs, utes, pickups, trucks....
Co-incidentally, "non-cars" have much less stringent fuel economy regulations. Small passenger cars need to meet a corporate average of 45mpg, light trucks of the same physical size can get away with 37mpg.
Large passengers cars need to average 34mpg, while large trucks only need to get to 25mpg.
They are going to buy Tesla. (Score:3)
Model T (Score:4, Insightful)
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Incidentally, the 25 mpg refers to a Sierra Club lie, the Model T was actually capable of 21 to 23 mpg.
Re:Model T (Score:5, Insightful)
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A couple off decades ago we briefly had the Yugo show up in the US. Went about as well as expected. Although that was TWICE the HP!!!!!
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If people were willing to buy a 20hp car
Interesting side note, the cheapest car available in the USA seems to be a Nissan Note at 88hp, it also is one of the weakest on the USA market based on my 10minutes of intense googling.
My own car, one of the most popular in Europe weighs in at 86hp and it's the 3rd weakest in its range and genre. The SEAT Mii which is probably the cheapest car in Europe comes in at 59hp.
Different priorities.
But my point is that Americans are often genuinely confused at how I could possibly drive such a "weak" car. They are
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Where will Amazon deliver my pacakages?! (Score:4, Funny)
Break the size embargo (Score:2)
Focusing resources (Score:2)
It's not just re-using underlying tech, you also see companies more often not only farm ou
To boldly go (Score:2)
I want one of those "white space vehicles". Though, to be honest, I'm not too bothered about the color...
Hey, is this is 24 days late? (Score:2)
Re: Higher height is just terrible (Score:2)
The expanded CAFE standards drove much of the personal auto space into truck-based vehicles (SUV's etc.)
Good luck getting those repealed - benefiting the oil companies turns out to be their actual purpose.
Re: Higher height is just terrible (Score:2, Interesting)
Which in reality causes worse consumption.
It would be more effective to scrap the CAFE rules and put euro tax levels on the fuel.
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That would not be because they are low, but because they are long.
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Those fins even more so. Either at the back or the front. Cyclists and pedestrians would get impaled on them like something out of Mad Max. Even the handlebars on BMX bicycles had the same hazard. Those solid steel bumpers may last for decades but they were like having blocks of concrete at the front of your car. So they moved to carbon fibre that would crumple and deform to absorb the impact for both driver and victim.
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High hoods are signficantly more dangerous for pedestrians.
What? Who told you that? They are off their nut. High hoods are much safer for pedestrians, both because they have less distance to fall onto them, and because there's more room under the hood for crumple space to absorb energy if you hit one.
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> English sewing machine motors.
Completely off topic, but my boss's new Harley Sportster sounds like a huge angry sewing machine when he revs it. I made him so paranoid after saying that that he went back to the dealer to drive a used one to compare the sound.
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Raises hand: I don't care about safety, not if it means I have to drive some econobox.
Raise hand: I don't care about Ford, not if it means I have to drive a Ford.
Sorry American car makers, I have two Hondas (2001 Civic EX and 2002 CR-V EX - both 5spd manual) and they still run like champs. Seems foreign, especially Japanese, cars have always fit me better and more comfortably than American cars.
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Japanese, cars have always fit me better and more comfortably than American cars.
This is largely a myth. Two cars coming off the same production line, one goes left, gets Toyota badging, the other goes right and gets GM. Which one has the higher customer rating? Yup, Toyota. Better life cycle too. Same parts, same labor, same everything, what is the difference?
Turns out, how people VIEW their cars matters. They take care of cars that they think will last, and don't take care of cars that are "cheap". Self fulfilling.
FORD (Score:5, Funny)
FORD:
Found On Road, Discontinued
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1. Why?
2. Even if you do need a Supercharger, Tesla has the best network of chargers along highway routes.
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I think you're missing the point.
Tesla psychologically owns the luxury market. It's the cool kid's ride, easily analogized to the iPhone 8 or 10. Is it a pavement pounder? Yes. Is it the fastest? No. It's the coolest, or so says the buyers, who pay a huge margin to a company that barely floats its boat.
I like Corvettes, but Bowling Green lost its way, IMHO. Still very cool. But not for the cool kids. Corvettes are like Blackberrys, or maybe an LG.
Afterthought: Isn't it appropriate to use smartphone metaphor
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Tesla makes plenty of money on the S and X. It's just that they are investing that money on bringing up the Model 3 and other projects.
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Tesla makes plenty of money on the S and X. It's just that they are investing that money on bringing up the Model 3 and other projects.
That's not the case at all. Money for the Model 3 is coming from investors and loans.
According to their Q4 report [shareholder.com], their gross profit is $438 million a quarter. Of that, $146 million goes towards paying interest on their loans. Another $1 billion goes to other expenses, including R&D, marketing and administrative. Notice how they're already $600 million the red before we even get to the $786 million in capital expenditures (aka. factory construction).
So they paying for all this with loans, which i
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Well, they didn't see it that way.
https://www.cnbc.com/2014/03/2... [cnbc.com]
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If US consumer tastes change (as they always do) Ford is toast.
Tesla can't make enough sedans and not affordably enough
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Re:Or... Ford cedes sedan market to Tesla (Score:4, Informative)
I think exception would be taken if I ran an extension cord from my second-story window into the parking lot and across to where I could actually park. I also suspect that my car would not remain plugged-in for as long as I might need.
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Well damn, I guess we should scrap the whole idea of EVs then because you can't charge one.
You know there's literally hundreds of millions of people that have driveways and garages that can, right? If it's not a good solution for you, don't buy one. Gasoline will still be a thing for some time.
Ford sells millions, Tesla sells thousands (Score:2, Troll)
Kinda like McDonald's cedes the burger business to Bob'z Burgerz and Auto Parts, in Kinnipequid, Maine?
Ford sold about 7 million units last year.
Renault sold about 10 million, Honda 5 million, GM 10 million, Volkswagen 11 million, Toyota 11 million.
Tesla sold about 100,000. If they manage to increase sales by 100 times, they'll be a real car company.
On the other hand, if increase 20%/year for 50 yea (Score:3)
Let's look at those numbers a bit differently. Tesla investors hope that Tesla grows, of course. If Tesla does extremely well and increases sales by 20% every single year, in 50 they'll be - still not one of the top 5 automakers.
50 years. Ugh (Score:2)
My post was missing a word. If Tesla grows by 20% per year, every single year, then in 50 years they'll be - still far smaller than Toyota, Volkswagen, Daimler Chrysler, etc. That's how the math comes out. It's like comparing my YouTube channel to NBC or Discovery Networks.
In 100 years, they could be one of the top automakers, if they have strong growth every single year and never make a mistake.
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Hey man. This is Slashdot. Do you seriously expect anyone around here to know how to compute exponential growth?
That said, 25 years is rather a long time to sustain a double digit growth rate.
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Several years? OPEC just decided they're going up now/2019.
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We import petroleum for a good reason. If we used all of our own, we would run out faster and lose our control on global oil prices. Having a stockpile is a price control measure.
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