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The Military Security The Internet United States

America's 'CyberWar' With Foreign Governments Could Get More Aggressive (wral.com) 116

America's Department of Defense "has quietly empowered the United States Cyber Command to take a far more aggressive approach to defending the nation against cyberattacks, a shift in strategy that could increase the risk of conflict with the foreign states that sponsor malicious hacking groups," reports the New York Times. Long-time Slashdot reader TheSauce shares their report: In the spring, as the Pentagon elevated the command's status, it opened the door to nearly daily raids on foreign networks, seeking to disable cyberweapons before they can be unleashed, according to strategy documents and military and intelligence officials... The new strategy envisions constant, disruptive "short of war" activities in foreign computer networks... "Continuous engagement imposes tactical friction and strategic costs on our adversaries, compelling them to shift resources to defense and reduce attacks"...

The risks of escalation -- of U.S. action in foreign networks leading to retaliatory strikes against U.S. banks, dams, financial markets or communications networks -- are considerable, according to current and former officials... The chief risk is that the internet becomes a battleground of all-against-all, as nations not only place "implants" in the networks of their adversaries -- something the United States, China, Russia, Iran and North Korea have done with varying levels of sophistication -- but also begin to engage in daily attack and counterattack.

An article shared by schwit1 notes that officials in the Obama administration "were also worried that a vigorous cyber response...could escalate into a full scale cyber war."

Yet the Times reports that this new policy reflects "a widespread view that the United States has mounted an inadequate defense against the rising number of attacks aimed at America."
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America's 'CyberWar' With Foreign Governments Could Get More Aggressive

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  • Yet the Times reports that this new policy reflects "a widespread view that the United States has mounted an inadequate defense against the rising number of attacks aimed at America."

    You don't say.

    It's been obvious for a while that the NSA is too busy hacking other people's computers to properly defend important computers in the USA. I think this comes from the fact that the NSA is run by military leaders, who were all taught that the best defence is a good offence. Yet, no one in government appears to ques

    • wrong. It is NOT apparent. NSA is doing their jobs. They absolutely DO lock down systems. The problem is that W split the work between NSA and DHS, which was stupid. DHS has done a HORRIBLE job. And the fact that you do not understand what is happening speaks of how poorly our tech world is doing.
    • Re:Is water wet? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by currently_awake ( 1248758 ) on Saturday June 23, 2018 @07:07PM (#56835626)
      There should be 1 government organization responsible for computer security, and they should not also be in charge of spying as that deters foreign governments and corporations from fully cooperating with them. Giving them legal authority to force companies to patch security holes would also help.
      • There should be 1 government organization responsible for computer security, and they should not also be in charge of spying as that deters foreign governments and corporations from fully cooperating with them. Giving them legal authority to force companies to patch security holes would also help.

        Not only authority to legally order large software companies to patch security holes, but prosecute them for some form of criminal negligence when they do things like marketing routers with hard-coded default admin/vendor-access passwords (and especially for not mentioning that little detail very plainly to potential buyers). That sort of nonsense is not just ignoring security or even doing it badly, it's giving the entire concept of security the "Bronx cheer" and causes great financial and societal harm th

        • by Agripa ( 139780 )

          Not only authority to legally order large software companies to patch security holes, but prosecute them for some form of criminal negligence when they do things like marketing routers with hard-coded default admin/vendor-access passwords (and especially for not mentioning that little detail very plainly to potential buyers).

          Who do they prosecute when another government agency either pays or orders exploits to be designed in?

          • Not only authority to legally order large software companies to patch security holes, but prosecute them for some form of criminal negligence when they do things like marketing routers with hard-coded default admin/vendor-access passwords (and especially for not mentioning that little detail very plainly to potential buyers).

            Who do they prosecute when another government agency either pays or orders exploits to be designed in?

            Well, since we're "wish-listing" here as it's unlikely in the extreme that any of this unconstitutional behavior will see any serious repercussions anytime soon, I'd like to see every s

      • by Agripa ( 139780 )

        There should be 1 government organization responsible for computer security, and they should not also be in charge of spying as that deters foreign governments and corporations from fully cooperating with them. Giving them legal authority to force companies to patch security holes would also help.

        The NSA has poisoned that well for the entire US government with the aid of the FBI and Congress. They even managed to smear NIST. Nobody should be cooperating with them.

  • They're not really a "foreign" government now, more like a good buddy

  • Do it (Score:4, Interesting)

    by WindBourne ( 631190 ) on Saturday June 23, 2018 @04:13PM (#56835040) Journal
    Seriously, the west has been under attack from Russia, CHina, North Korea, Iran, Syria, and a few others, for the last 20 years. We have been in a defensive posture, and losing badly.
    It is high time to do the right things and first off strengthen our telecommunications network. We should be running vlan on equipment that is made ONLY in the west. Utilities should be on 1 vlan, and with absolutely NO CROSS-OVER. Likewise, MIlitary/Intelligence should be on one, Roads on another, banks on another (used only for transfers between banks), etc, etc. Regardless, the internet/gen comm absolutely should be on a different vlan from the rest of this.
    And above all, we need to stop offshoring of access to those vlans, as well as making sure that telcos techs have security checks. The idea that ATT is outsourcing access to their internal network to India and CHina is nothing less than amazing.
    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by PopeRatzo ( 965947 )

      Seriously, the west has been under attack from Russia, CHina, North Korea, Iran, Syria, and a few others, for the last 20 years.

      Yes, but Russia only attacks us because they love freedom and want the USA to be strong and a shining example of democracy in the West, and not for any nefarious reasons. If you suggest otherwise, you should watch your ass.

    • VLAN. I do not think that word means what you think it means.

    • Re:Do it (Score:4, Funny)

      by tindur ( 658483 ) on Saturday June 23, 2018 @04:41PM (#56835158)

      Seriously, the west has been under attack from Russia, CHina, North Korea, Iran, Syria, and a few others, for the last 20 years. We have been in a defensive posture, and losing badly.

      So let's start by attacking Canada and western Europe.

    • Re:Do it (Score:5, Informative)

      by Nkwe ( 604125 ) on Saturday June 23, 2018 @09:47PM (#56836064)

      It is high time to do the right things and first off strengthen our telecommunications network. We should be running vlan on equipment that is made ONLY in the west. Utilities should be on 1 vlan, and with absolutely NO CROSS-OVER. Likewise, MIlitary/Intelligence should be on one, Roads on another, banks on another (used only for transfers between banks), etc, etc.

      You do understand that VLAN only offers security if you have complete control over the physical network? I suspect you may not because you mention using VLAN to isolate services that would typically be at significantly different physical locations and be administered by different people.

      Using US made equipment would be a start, but the issue with VLAN is that if anyone has access to the configuration of anything touching a physical connection that is "protected" by VLAN, they can just change the configuration and you don't have isolation any more. All VLAN does is add a couple of bytes to the header of the packets and you *hope* that everyone listening honors those packets. It can really only be used within a physically trusted segment of your network *and* you have to trust everyone who can configure the related network gear. This means that if an attacker gets configuration access to any of your devices touching the VLAN trunk, they can alter the configuration and escalate their access. If you are using VLANs to isolate workstation access at the workstation NIC, well just don't.

      In your example of using VLAN to isolate military, utilities, and banking, I would have to assume that you mean isolating them when they run across a common set of network links. This is an unlikely scenario because VLAN is a physical layer 2 (data link / Ethernet segment) thing and you typically would use a network layer 3 (routing / IP subnet) thing to deal with connecting disparate networks over distance. If you are actually talking about tying these entities together at the physical layer of the network, you would have to trust that the parties at both ends and everyone in the middle absolutely kept physical administrative control and that there were no bad actors in the mix. This is unlikely.

      Other technologies, such as VPN would be more appropriate. This as well as regulations that require either air-gapping of sensitive systems or proven control of the encryption keys used to create VPN sessions running through shared networks.

    • Seriously, the west has been under attack from Russia, CHina, North Korea, Iran, Syria, and a few others, for the last 20 years.

      ...or are you so far out there you can see Pluto from your house? Paid no attention whatsoever to Wikileaks or Edward Snowden? Attacking other countries networks and trying to spy on everyone is what you do. Just ask one of your top allies, Angela Merkel. [theguardian.com]

      attacks ON Russia, China, North Korea, and Iran were going on LONG before Stuxnet.

      FTFY. For christsake you spend more than

      • BS. We DO spy, which is what Snowden spoke about.
        BUT, CHina, Russia, North Korea, Iran, etc have been working to destroy the west since the 90s. We were not even dealing with the issues.
        And had you paid attention to Snowden, you would have known that BND had given NSA access to their networks. IOW, they KNEW we were there (though I suspect that they did not know that we were listening in on Merkel).
        So, no, the smart thing is for us to start dealing with Russia/China/etc on their own terms.
        • by Uberbah ( 647458 )

          BUT, CHina, Russia, North Korea, Iran, etc have been working to destroy the west since the 90s.

          More projection. The U.S. literally bragged [dailywire.com] about interfering in the 1996 Russian election, has been staging practice invasions off North Korea's coast every year since the 90's, committed an act of war on Iran with Stuxnet and spent years illegally threatening them with a military invasion over a nuclear weapons program the U.S. knew Iran didn't actually have.

          So, no, the smart thing is for us to start dealing w

  • Researching and designing a specific payload to decimate a targeted resource? Or doesn't an aggressive offense count? Smells like FUD to me.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]

    ""a widespread view that the United States has mounted an inadequate defense against the rising number of attacks aimed at America.""

  • Perpetrated by cave-men that think the only valid response to anything is to apply violence. The actual facts are that attribution is basically impossible and that you have an extremely high chance to hit the wrong target and that will obviously make matters worse, not better. There is even an attack-technique were you let some aggressive but brain-dead actor do your dirty work by faking an attack from the intended victim. So far this did usually not work because nobody was actually stupid enough to try an

    • Oh yes, of course, they cannot attribute anything to anyone, because they are extremely stupid, and you know so much better. Luckily, hope is not yet lost, the current US comander-in-chief is constantly looking for people as brilliant as you...
      • by gweihir ( 88907 )

        Fascinating. You obviously have not even taken a very brief look at the relevant literature and research. Probably you should apply there, as you seem to have the right combination of "can do" attitude and absolutely no clue whatever.

  • What allies? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Midnight Thunder ( 17205 ) on Saturday June 23, 2018 @04:39PM (#56835152) Homepage Journal

    Once upon a time the US was an ally many nations wanted to have (discounting the relationships fostered by the CIA). Today, the image of the US is one of isolationism and paranoia, very much in the frame of the leader.

    Granted, it is hard to tell what is due to the commander in chief and what is simply politics as usual? It is also hard tell who is creating more spin?

    Whatever happens the next leader needs to heal the wounds and divisions created by Trump (he already started during Obamaâ(TM)s terms), but that wonâ(TM)t be easy while Trump is still respected by his base. It also wonâ(TM)t be easy while the Democrats donâ(TM)t listen to the nation.

    • by swell ( 195815 )
      Not sure how you got modded up for an incoherent rant that you didn't bother to proofread. Try to do better in the future. Show a little respect for other Slashdot users.
    • The Leader of the Free World shares some qualities with the person who cuts your birthday cake. If they say "I want to eat the whole cake" then you don't want that person doing the job.
    • Once upon a time the US was an ally many nations wanted to have (discounting the relationships fostered by the CIA). Today, the image of the US is one of isolationism and paranoia, very much in the frame of the leader.

      A bit grotesque to hold Trump accountable for the demise of US as world police agent and favourite cheerleader.

  • by Gravis Zero ( 934156 ) on Saturday June 23, 2018 @05:59PM (#56835416)

    If there is going to be any real defense of our critical systems then what we actually need is to have our own government bringing down vulnerable systems. Allowing these systems to continue to function when they could fail at any moment is like building on a fractured foundation: it's a disaster waiting to happen.

    This effort will cause annoying outages but it will also force companies to invest in real security while allowing those who already have will thrive. Most companies have been complacent for far too long and it's made us very vulnerable.

  • ... than what?

    We hear about Russia, China, Ukraine ...

    What has the US ever done?

    • by AHuxley ( 892839 )
      Its the 1983 way of thinking. Every bad person has to have an ip. At the end of that is an ISP and a modem.
      Thats the way networks are created. In the 1980's and now in 2018.
      Beyond that modem is a home computer with a ssd in 2018. All the US cyber experts have to do is follow the network back to a bad home computer in a bad nation.
      Push some new and unexpected gov malware down to that home computer and its a happy cyber ending.
    • What has the US ever done? ...

      That's missing the point abut as badly as it's possible to miss.

      Sure so America has done some pretty bad stuff, but surely that doesn't mean you want people to do it back to you in turn. Even if you argue turnabout is fair play, it's also entirely fair and wise to protect against it.

  • ... can't get rid of Kaspersky. [slashdot.org]

    US Government Can't Get Controversial Kaspersky Lab Software Off Its Networks

  • by ka9dgx ( 72702 ) on Saturday June 23, 2018 @09:11PM (#56835996) Homepage Journal

    Ambient Authority is a design decision which only appears once you have multiple users sharing a computer. As a result, everyone just kept using it without much thought... until we find ourselves in a world of persistent networks, mobile code, no system administrators, and multiple layers of firmware and OS from various hardware and software vendors.

    In such a system, any code runs with the full authority of the user who started the task, and the users have no effective means of limiting the side effects of running a given program. This in turn means we have to try to guess the intent of code (which is equivalent to solving the halting problem, and is thus impossible). The band-aid is to then try to enumerate all the bad code in the world (virus scanners), and to enumerate all the code bugs in all our programs (security updates), and to eliminate the trust of users (DRM, forced updates, "safety" filters in our browsers). None of these band-aids will work against a determined individual, let alone a nation-state.

    Running tasks with the least possible privilege, the "Principle of Least Authority" (POLA) allows a user in such a system to decide ahead of time exactly what files the program is allowed to read, write, etc. Because we're all used to dialog boxes, and drag to drop GUI elements, this doesn't even require any special training of users to accomplish.

    Of course, rebuilding our infrastructure to fix a design flaw of the size and scope of using 2 digit years (the Y2K problem we once faced), isn't going to be easy... especially when there's no deadline to make the need for action obvious. It's just going to remain an insidious vulnerability instead for decades to come.

    If you think EAL certifications address this, they don't. 8(

  • Oceania was at war with Eastasia: Oceania had always been at war with Eastasia.

  • The idea is that it is foolish to have a single producer of CPU, OS, components.
    Think about it: Where is all the Win 10 telemetry going ?
    How many "conveniente bugs" do a modern CPU have ?
    How many ways are there (that we do not know) to "shutdown" a network infrastructure ?

    By having country level perople and experts you also enhance the employment...
    What can you wish more ?

  • "the Pentagon elevated the command's status, it opened the door to nearly daily raids on foreign networks, seeking to disable cyberweapons before they can be unleashed"

    All the Pentagon has to do is stop running their infrastructure on Microsoft Windows.
  • The Pentagon is trying to CyberAttack our way to a more secure future. But Security comes from Defense, not attack.

    Thousands of years of human experience have shown that destruction is easier than creation. One man can quickly destroy something that takes a community months to create. It may be that "To every thing there is a season; and a time for every purpose under heaven." But, if you don't spend more time on creation than destruction, you end up a lonely, starving scavenger. Any stable, prosperous soci

  • That's the only way to really avoid escalation, never fight back, never defend, just give up.

    If we're going to hit back out of the fear that the people attacking us will be mad about it (as if we aren't), why bother defending ourselves at all?

"I got everybody to pay up front...then I blew up their planet." "Now why didn't I think of that?" -- Post Bros. Comics

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