Verizon Confirms That It Will No Longer Activate 3G Phones (droid-life.com) 109
According to Droid Life, Verizon is no longer activating 3G-only phones. Instead, they will only accept 4G LTE-equipped phones going forward. Here's what Verizon had to say about the matter: "For several years we've been been publicly saying that our 3G CDMA network will remain available through the end of 2019. Virtually all traffic on our network is on our 4G LTE network. To facilitate a smooth transition to 4G LTE capable products and services, we are no longer allowing devices that are not 4G LTE capable to be activated on our network." From the report: Now, as is noted in the statement above, Verizon has committed to shutting down its 3G CDMA network by the end of 2019. They also stopped selling 3G devices some time ago, I believe, and even started selling LTE-only flip phones to replace them. [...] On a related note, an earlier leak suggested that Verizon may stop some older LTE devices from being activated too. The documentation there said that CDMA devices as well as devices that do not support HD Voice or VoLTE will not be accepted.
Data logging (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
If you managed to deal with moving from telegraph to telephone, I'm sure you'll handle this transition as well.
Re:Data logging (Score:5, Informative)
Telegraphs and telephones largely do different things. Roughly, telephony is voice. Telegraphy is text. The two existed in parallel for about a century. What killed telegraphy wasn't telephony. It was satellite communications,the Internet, and the widespread availability of PCs and modems that allowed cheap, reliable, digital communications via the telephone voice network.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Well, Telix killed the telegraph log before any of that.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:1)
For your use case, rather than full LTE, using LTE-M (AT&T, Verizon) or NB-IOT (T-mobile) might be useful. Other technologies are Lora and Sigfox. All of these are low throughput, and low energy. Lora and SigFox use unlicensed spectrum, with all the associated benefits and drawbacks. (Also, although the spectrum is unlicensed, the devices themselves do comply with restrictions e.g. duty cycle).
Re: (Score:1)
Re:Data logging (Score:5, Interesting)
I use 2G and 3G systems for my data logging projects. They are much cheaper. Eventually I am afraid I will need to use a full 4G LTE system (at least in the US).
As you specified "at least in the US" you're probably living in a country that chose GSM from the very begining. Verizon does not have a "3G" GSM network such as HSPA, they went with CDMA which was a slower, more dead end technology. They're one of the last networks to get rid of it.
If you want to use 3G GSM devices in the US, you need to go with AT&T as they're the only company that implemented an internationally compatible version of 3G GSM.
Re: (Score:2, Informative)
CDMA is not dead. Current LTE is a more advanced version of CDMA and called something else because Qualcomm submitted it to a standards body.
Verizon's CDMA was designed for voice and data was added on as a second thought. While modern versions of CDMA are designed for data and voice.
what you call GSM is the old voice only TDMA tech which was competing with CDMA for voice
Re: (Score:1)
No. WCDMA (UMTS) was a more advanced version of CDMA that used a wider band and allowed to both carry on a data call and a voice call at the same time along with higher bandwidth. CDMA was a 2G standard while EV-DO was the 3G equivalent built on top of CDMA. WCDMA was the 3G built on top of GSM leveraging technology from CDMA.
LTE uses OFDMA which is more closely related to the TDMA that GSM used than CDMA in that CDMA everyone is on all frequencies all the time and use orthogonal codes to get an individu
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re: (Score:2)
GSM is 2G, LTE Advanced is 4G (Score:2)
From the Cellular network standards navbox [wikipedia.org] at Wikipedia
E: Europe / the world;
A: Americas, including the U.S.
2G:
E: GSM
A: cdmaOne (IS-95), D-AMPS (IS-54 and IS-136)
2G transitional (2.5G, 2.75G):
E: GPRS, EDGE/EGPRS, Evolved EDGE (little-used / not implemented)
A: CDMA2000 1X, CDMA2000 1X Advanced
3G:
E: UMTS;
A: CDMA2000 1xEV-DO Release 0 (TIA/IS-856) (May have also been adopted in Europe, but I'll assume not i
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
CDMA is not dead. Current LTE is a more advanced version of CDMA and called something else because Qualcomm submitted it to a standards body.
Nope, LTE is the "4th" (3.5th actually) generation of the GSM standard.
WiMax was meant to be the replacement for CDMA although it wasn't developed from CDMA. WiMax has also died a well needed death.
Verizon's CDMA was designed for voice and data was added on as a second thought. While modern versions of CDMA are designed for data and voice.
what you call GSM is the old voice only TDMA tech which was competing with CDMA for voice
Nope, what I call GSM are the group of technologies including GSM, UTMS, HSPA and LTE which colloquially fall under the moniker GSM.
Re: (Score:2)
Wi-Max was pretty fast though. I used both Sprint Wi-Max (on the HTC Evo) and Vivid Wireless (Wi-Max in Australia) .. I mean they weren't great compared to wired of course, but they were both pretty decent.
Re: (Score:3)
Now both are moving to LTE, which is based on OFDM modulation.
Although it's common to colloquially include UMTS and LTE in GSM, technically, GSM is going away (if not gone already) - neither UMTS nor LTE are part of GSM, and LTE is c
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
I wonder if Verizon will resell any 3g capacity to MVNOs you might be able to use.
Re: (Score:2)
I use 2G and 3G systems for my data logging projects. They are much cheaper. Eventually I am afraid I will need to use a full 4G LTE system (at least in the US).
You do not need to use a "full 4G LTE" system for data logging. Neither in the US, nor anywhere else. You WILL need to abandon 2G and 3G pretty much worldwide between 2020 and 2025, but do not need full 4G LTe for M2M communications (which includes data logging)
You can use LTE-M, a simpler variant of LTE, aproved in 2013 specificaly for M2M (like data logging) communications.
It goes easy on cost because of simpler modems and economies of scale because it is a pretty much single standard, and is very light o
Re: Data logging (Score:1)
We all fucking know that, but in conversation it is easiest to call it 4G because that is what the carriers call it.
4G L(i)TE (Score:2)
In other words, "4G LTE" is really 4G Lite. I don't know when the "i" got dropped.
Re: (Score:2)
How much spectrum will this free up? (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
911 calls can use any available network (hence the "emergency service only" which us t-mobile users see when we go anywhere off the highway), so they should work in areas covered by other service providers.
Re: (Score:2)
The phone could only make calls on technologies / bands it supports. While the phone will (hopefully) roam onto non-preferred network to make a 911 call, "emergency calls only" shows up when I'm outside of all coverage from all networks. A CDMA/1x/EVDO phone won't be able to roam and make a 911 call if there's only coverage from HSPA/LTE networks.
Re: (Score:2)
911 will probably work, until the end of 2019. Much like how 911 doesn't work right now on an AMPS (analog) phone, unless it also supports a newer network (CDMA/1x/EVDO / GSM bands on world phones)
Really? (Score:4, Interesting)
Funny! I have several persons in my circle of friends and acquaintances who still use 2G phones and don't want anything else. And why should they? Why should someone need to use the internet at all with their mobile phone? But then again telcos won't try to switch them off anytime soon in the country where I live, I guess.
Re:Really? (Score:5, Interesting)
This will hit old people with flip phones the hardest. My dad uses one of these, he has one particular model he likes, and it naturally is not a 4g phone. He doesn't need a smart phone, given his tendency to leave it unplugged for days and the fact that he is so computer illiterate that he has trouble with digital gas pumps (he's bought a few car washes that he didn't want trying to get it to print a receipt). And I have an elderly friend who has an earlier version of the same phone, probably over 10 years old and still going. But I guess they aren't profitable enough to care about, compared to those on the smartphone upgrade treadmill.
Re: (Score:2)
he is so computer illiterate that he has trouble with digital gas pumps (he's bought a few car washes that he didn't want trying to get it to print a receipt).
I've nearly done this because either the screen is hard to read with the sun shining on it or the buttons are so worn it's difficult to see which the "Yes" and "No" buttons are.
Re: (Score:2)
But I guess they aren't profitable enough to care about, compared to those on the smartphone upgrade treadmill.
The real business driver for shutting down older generation networks isn't the profitability or lack thereof of the phones and their subscribers, but instead the profitable use of that spectrum. If you have a band that is allocated to 2G and it has only a few subscribers on it, that spectrum license would be much more profitably (and efficiently) used on a newer technology with more users on it. The carrier also gains a benefit of sunsetting older networks by being able to remove gear from the tower and bei
Re: (Score:2)
The carrier also gains a benefit of sunsetting older networks by being able to remove gear from the tower and being able to repurpose that "real estate" for additional radios/equipment supporting high-demand newer technologies.
Plus they won't have to maintain gear that may be harder to find replacement parts for.
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
It is funny that people consider flip phones to be ancient. Many people don't even have a mobile phone. I am 65 and I didn't have one until I was in my 30s.
My Uncle Fred doesn't have email and is proud of it.
Re: (Score:2)
I'm 31 and I have a flip phone. I did have smartphones but found them too distracting.
I know some folks who have no mobile phone at all. Or email, or computers. They have everyone beat.
Re: (Score:2)
So I'm an idiot for keeping a phone for 8-10 years, that was given to me my previous employer. How many phone have you purchased during that time and how much did each cost? $300 each, $400 each $500 each? bet you've spent about $800-$1000 for all your new phones....
Yea, I'll update, when I feel like it before the end of 2019.
You could get rid of your phone, and not spend anything on them.
Re: (Score:1)
I have a friend who used to read Slashdot daily about 10 years ago.
Today he has a flip phone from about the same time period, and almost angrily refuses to change from it and insists he will never ever have a smart phone no matter what. States there is no reason to ever get that and why would he want that when he only wants a phone to be a phone.
He became a grandpa fast.
Re: (Score:2)
I have a friend who used to read Slashdot daily about 10 years ago.
Today he has a flip phone from about the same time period, and almost angrily refuses to change from it and insists he will never ever have a smart phone no matter what. States there is no reason to ever get that and why would he want that when he only wants a phone to be a phone.
He became a grandpa fast.
I call it the Amish complex. Somewhere along the line, the old order Amish decided that 1840 was the cutoff date. After that most everything is bad. Your friend decided that flip phones were the proper end of technology.
The thing about smartphones is that some folks think you get one, and you become a Facebook addict, or walk out in front of cars, or suddenly become a hipster. I certainly don't use mine for that. I use the phone to check my email accounts when I'm away from the house, reference technica
Re: (Score:2)
Funny! I have several persons in my circle of friends and acquaintances who still use 2G phones and don't want anything else. And why should they? Why should someone need to use the internet at all with their mobile phone? But then again telcos won't try to switch them off anytime soon in the country where I live, I guess.
Actually, maybe in the country were you live those 2G and 3G phones will be swtiched off sooner than you think.
I live in Venezuela, and it will happen, In india is happening already. Only africa remains a question mark about 2G 3G shutdown.
See, spectrum is expensive, equipment shelters are overcrowded, spectrum is super-expensive, communities are reluctants to allow new anteannas (for "reassons"), and 5G needs lots and lots of small coverage antenas.
So, a way to 5G is to eliminate the 2G and 3G equipment (f
Re: (Score:1)
wrt 2G and 3G, Africa and South Asia are just as unlikely to phase these technologies out; though 5G is likely to be introduced in some markets, after 5G implementations in Northern Europe will be rated stable. 5G was launched on 27 June 2018 in Finland and Estonia.
The situation with mobile tech adoption in In
Comment removed (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: (Score:3)
Welcome to New Hampshire...
You'll only get decent coverage near Manchester, Concord, Hampton (seacoast area, but not Rye or North Hampton) and Portsmouth / Dover areas...
Re: (Score:2)
The problem with 4G in portsmouth is that Nyarlathotep is interfering with 4G signals so that people can not post acurate photos of him before they succumb to maddness, and their phones are destroyed.
Re: (Score:2)
Cell phones work in New Hampshire? Who knew?
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:3)
"Well, in Vermont they don't work at all "
Not so. There are several places in Vermont where if you stand in the right spot and hold your phone just so, you can sometimes get one or even two bars on your cell phone.
Seriously, cell phone coverage in Vermont used to be pretty bad to nonexistent. But for the past decade or so, it's been much improved. Heck, in some places you can even get a signal indoors these days.
Re: (Score:1)
"All our traffic is 4G, because those poor 3G plebs can't get any bandwidth from the one tower per 400 sq miles we've deigned to provide them with"
Re: (Score:2)
1G devices still work
Where? A quick search of the internet tells me that the last 1G system was shutdown sometime around 2010.
Oh, I get it, you said the devices still work. That's like saying your old tube TV set still works. With my old TV set I can at least use that for some retro gaming with my 8-bit Nintendo and its light gun. What are you going to do with that 1G phone? My nephew has a 1G phone, he's in diapers and likes to pretend he's making phone calls like his mom and dad.
I'm sure someone will read this and just c
LTE coverage isn't there yet. (Score:1)
I don't think that by the end of 2019 the places that I go where my phone switches to CDMA are going to have LTE support. Sure it works in the cities. But driving from city to city all I can get is EVDO, sometimes 1xRTT. I doubt that Verizon will have all of those cell sites converted to LTE by the end of 2019.
Does this mean a reduction in coverage? The only reason to go with Verizon is that it works everywhere. When I'm driving in the boonies and still need to take a work call -- that's why I pay through t
Freq refarming for 5G and high cost of infrastruct (Score:3)
Most operators around the world, specially in developed countries, are planning to shutdown 2G and 3G services. The sunsetting is expected in most of the world between 2020 and 2025
Some operators on the loosing side of 3G (CDMA2000-EVDO and TD-SCDMA) are shooting down 3G first, and then 2G. Other operators are shooting down 2G first, keeping 3G to support Voice, in order not to pay for VoLTE Licenses. Yet others plan to keep 2G in a restricted mode for M2M Communications (think smart meters, IoT, etc.).
This is actually a Good thing. We had 3 standards for 2G (GSM, IS-54/136 a.k.a. TDMA and IS-135 a.k.a. CDMA2000), then we had 3 3G standards (CDMA2000-EVDO, WCDMA and TD-SCDMA). Then we had two (or three, depending on how you count) standards for 4G (802.16m a.k.a. WiMax, FDD-LTE and TDD-LTE ).
You can imagine how crowded a radio shelter is nowadays. How much electricity it consumes, how much heat it generates, and how costly the O&M contracts and logistics of all that gear is...
And how crowded the spectrum is as well since the spectrum tends to be very expensive.
With (hopefully) only one 5G standard, and sunseting of all 2G and 3G networks, more harmonization worldwide is possible, which leads to simpler radio modems (the end Game is TDD-LTE + 5G), and cheaper equipment. Also, spectrum that is currently used for 2G and 3G can be refarmend for 4G and 5G, leading to better service.
this should be seen as a welcome development.
Re: (Score:2)
I am in the UK, and I still get 2G connections on my 4G phone in some areas. The first network here to dump 2G is going to lose a lot of subscribers because their phones will find large areas of "no signal". Also, a lot of phones switch to 2G only when the battery is low cos it uses less power. (They go back to 4G when a call is initiated).
Re: (Score:2)
Bury the dead with phones, like that, when 2G/3G dies, the dead will be able to enjoy it in the afterlife.
A welcome development? (Score:3)
"this should be seen as a welcome development."
Why should it? I still use a 2G feature phone since it does everything I need, i can operate it without looking at the screen and while wearing gloves and the battery lasts over a week on standby. What is so welcome about me having to spend money on a phone with 4G when I don't need the functionality?
Re: (Score:2)
Why should it? I still use a 2G feature phone since it does everything I need, i can operate it without looking at the screen and while wearing gloves and the battery lasts over a week on standby. What is so welcome about me having to spend money on a phone with 4G when I don't need the functionality?
By that same token, analog phones worked fine! Why did they sunseted the standard? Oh, the Nikel-Cadmium batteries contaminated the soil more than the lithium ion of today, and while there were less phones back then, those contaminated more and used more raw materials.
The same could be said about IS-54/136, or CDMA2000, or TD-SCDMA... Those worked fine... Why discontinue them?
Anyway, you do not need to buy a smartphone to enjoy the benefits of 4G, here you can have this phone for around $80. It has 4G. You
Re: (Score:2)
"Oh, the Nikel-Cadmium batteries contaminated the soil more than the lithium ion of today, and while there were less phones back then, those contaminated more and used more raw materials."
My 2G phone is smaller and used less raw materials in its manufacture than any smartphone.
"Those worked fine... Why discontinue them?"
I don't know, you tell me. There reaches a point where things are good enough , the only reason to keep replacing them is to make money for the companies involved, not to provide a better se
Electronics Recycling, or Save for MVNOs? (Score:2)
I suppose I can now box my 3G phone hoard of "backup" phones for electronics recycling. I wonder how this will affect MVNOs, and the many 3G phones activated on those that sell service on Verizon's network? I have one on PagePlus for the few times I don't think I'll have usable T-Mobile access.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Just put them on eBay so people who live in places where the networks are still going can buy them... or people who want them for other projects.
You can have my Motorola Star Tac (Score:2)
when you pry it from my cold dead hand!
Re: (Score:2)
Flip phones... where I could feel like Captain Kirk...
That's not what they said. (Score:2)
"For several years we've been been publicly saying that our 3G CDMA network will remain available through the end of 2019..."
No, that's not what they said. Verizon verbally confirmed the 3G network will be available through the end of 2019. They never stated it was not going to be available after that, they simply did not commit to keeping it up. They are leaving themselves the option of shutting it down then. Nothing has been said about it being taken offline.
Boo! (Score:2)
Time for a newer smartphone by the end of 2019 since this iPhone 4S goes up to 3G (can do 1X too). :(