Software Developer Tops List of U.S. News & World Report's Annual Best Jobs Rankings (usatoday.com) 128
According to U.S. News and World Report's annual best jobs rankings, software developer is the top pick for the new year. "The publication's Best Jobs of 2019 list takes seven factors into account, including median salary, employment rate and stress level," reports USA Today. "The median salary for a software developer is $101,790, and the unemployment rate is 1.9 percent, according to the most recent data from the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics." From the report: Though software developers have neither the highest median salary nor lowest unemployment rate on the U.S. News Best Jobs of 2019 list, the position's projected increase in demand -- roughly 30 percent between 2016 and 2026 -- and average stress levels helped it land the top spot, said Rebecca Koenig, careers reporter at U.S. News and World Report. "Unlike some other jobs that do pretty well on the list, which are very demanding, software developer tends not to be a really stressful profession," Koenig said. Here are the Top 10, in order:
1. Software Developer
2. Statistician
3. Physician assistant
4. Dentist
5. (tie) Orthodontist
6. (tie) Nurse anesthetist
7. Nurse practitioner
8. Pediatrician
9. (tie) Obstetrician and gynecologist
9. (tie) Oral and maxillofacial surgeon
9. (tie) Prosthodontist
9. (tie) Physician
1. Software Developer
2. Statistician
3. Physician assistant
4. Dentist
5. (tie) Orthodontist
6. (tie) Nurse anesthetist
7. Nurse practitioner
8. Pediatrician
9. (tie) Obstetrician and gynecologist
9. (tie) Oral and maxillofacial surgeon
9. (tie) Prosthodontist
9. (tie) Physician
my surprise (Score:5, Funny)
to find "Statistician" at #2, clear the Statistician at US news are gaming the "study" for this "report"
Re: (Score:1)
The new name for this is "AI Specialist" ...
Re: (Score:2)
to find "Statistician" at #2, clear the Statistician at US news are gaming the "study" for this "report"
I've looked at both of the following aphorisms and would still be surprised by this ranking believing in either...
Re: (Score:2)
Not to mention that about 90% of all statistics are made up, and 88.665% of them all are given with unmerited accuracy.
Re: (Score:2)
I believe you meant to say that you are 95% confident that the average statistician earns a #2 spot on the list.
Re: (Score:2)
Unfortunately, most companies have adopted "agile" as an excuse to not have any idea what they're doing, but since we're "agile", changing the specs every other day, even when almost at shipping, isn't a problem, right?
What, in Sweden? (Score:1)
"software developer tends not to be a really stressful profession" - Pfft, you're doing it wrong.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: What, in Sweden? (Score:1)
Yeah, probably not alpha testing in production like the real software mavericks!
Re: (Score:3)
Actually if it's not stressful, you're doing it right.
9 out of 10 times the reason for stress in development is crappy management. The 10th case is the guy who can't develop software if Stackoverflow is down.
Re: (Score:2)
Actually if it's not stressful, you're doing it right.
9 out of 10 times the reason for stress in development is crappy management. The 10th case is the guy who can't develop software if Stackoverflow is down.
Indeed- depends where you work. I hopped a couple of awful jobs before landing a few good ones. Once you get a good job with a good company it isn't stressful.
software developer tends not to be a stressful... (Score:2)
Filter error: Don't use so many caps. It's like YELLING.
Re:software developer tends not to be a stressful. (Score:5, Insightful)
Well, many of the others listed are medical-related. Those professions often have to deal with life-threatening emergencies, people in severe pain/duress, etc. For most software dev jobs, nobody gets injured, dies, nor puked on no matter how bad you or your colleagues screw up.
The big problem with software development is it has no direct future. If you don't move into management-esque positions, your career will plateau early. It can be decent money, don't get me wrong, but it's a poor ticket to a bigger and better future.
"Old" developers are typically not very welcomed. The reasons are a long and winding topic, and there are exceptions, but the bottom line is the software biz is not kind to "age".
Re: software developer tends not to be a stressful (Score:2, Informative)
Iâ(TM)ve heard this for as long as Iâ(TM)ve been on Slashdot I think â" which is since like â99 â" but have not witnessed it in practice. My experience is that itâ(TM)s really tough to break into the profession because nobody wants some kid who knows nothing when they could get a senior-level engineer that can design circles around the entry-level candidate.
Iâ(TM)ve been fighting for years to get junior devs on my team. There arenâ(TM)t enough seniors to meet the dema
Re: (Score:1)
Yet as you said, people still expect 3-7 in new stuff and 10-15 in old stuff. So you end up with people who have to lie to you to be given the chance to prove themselves.
It's not to prove themselves, it's a sleazy management tactic used to squeeze employees out of salaries on par with the actual job. If someone feels they're being "given a chance" they are less likely to haggle.
Re: (Score:2)
Also note that just because your shop values experienced developers, does not mean others do.
Maybe it's your shop that doesn't value experienced developers? However I think this is the core issue, not enough people know about software development to be able to do it well.
There are always shops that take an burn and churn approach to software development because they aren't very good. The good thing about churn and burn shops is that you can learn a lot in a short time, if you survive the pressure then you will probably have a lasting career.
After that you tend to figure out how to apply desig
Re: (Score:1)
And judge it. Often books are judged by covers by those not fully understanding what they are looking at, and younger people seem to have a knack for finding and "surfing" fashions and fads to seem cool and up-to-date to the uninitiated.
One guy recently convinced the boss to use microservices (ms) for something that clearly didn't need ms. The ms pusher got all kinds of bullshit off the web about ms being magic plug
Re: (Score:2)
Junior devs might be able to render an ASCII apostrophe so it presents correctly on Slashdot.
Re: (Score:2)
The big problem with software development is it has no direct future.
Why isn't it "continue to develop software"?
For most software dev jobs, nobody gets injured, dies, nor puked on no matter how bad you or your colleagues screw up.
Some, not all. Because some people do write software for the medical professionals during life-threatening emergencies, people in severe pain/duress, etc.
Re: (Score:1)
Why isn't it "continue to develop software"?
Because it's way more stressful than anyone wants to admit (devs out of pride and managers out of hiring prospects.) The reason ageism exists in software development so strongly is it takes years of actual experience to produce anything production-worthy (even are barely-passing levels,) and the stress of never having time to think about your own shit (software design is unlike any other profession, in that your time on the clock you are whoring out your mind, the time off the clock you're trying to switch
Re: (Score:2)
I feel like we live on different planets.
I've been a software developer for a decade now and I have never come within an iota of experiencing or feeling anything you talked about in your post. The developers I know 10 and 20 years older than me don't seem any different from me either.
I love my work, I moved close to my office (10 minute drive). I've been putting away max 401k, RothIRA, HSA every year for a decade now, so I've already saved about 250K which has grown in investments to close to 400K in my ver
Re: (Score:2)
All I can assume is that it must be location based or something. I live in Wisconsin
bingo.
I'm in the bay area. I'm over 50 and have been doing software since my teens, commercially. been in the area for over 25 years and am american-born. in the bay area, that's the kiss of death. wish I was kidding, but everyone my age says the same thing, its not unique to me.
this area ONLY wants kids. if you are over 35, good luck to you.
and yeah, that's one huge reason why software and hardware from the bay area is
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
>1-3 hours to switch gears
That sounds like the crux of most of your problems. As a developer you've probably spent a lot of time learning to use your mind efficiently, now may I suggest you spend some serious time investing in learning how to manage it more effectively? For starters, it sounds like you've got 1-3 hours per day of currently wasted time that you could productively spend practicing.
As someone who tends to get mentally fixated myself, I found meditation very useful for that - once you lear
Re: (Score:2)
>I know I can't turn my mind off.
> that part of my mind I have no control over
That can change. You have no control, because you've never *learned* control. Perhaps you have some condition that makes it more difficult, but more likely it's just that, like most people, you were never taught how to do it. Purely internal mental discipline is not something our society values or teaches.
Even the boundaries of "the conscious you" are, to a large extent, self-imposed. You can learn to extend your conscio
Re:software developer tends not to be a stressful. (Score:5, Interesting)
The big problem with software development is it has no direct future. If you don't move into management-esque positions, your career will plateau early. It can be decent money, don't get me wrong, but it's a poor ticket to a bigger and better future.
"Old" developers are typically not very welcomed. The reasons are a long and winding topic, and there are exceptions, but the bottom line is the software biz is not kind to "age".
At what point does this age problem kick in? I'm 50 and not seeing it. I have coworkers in their 60s and they're not seeing it. Heck, I know one guy in his early 70s who just likes to work and doesn't want to retire. He's independently wealthy at this point, having been through a couple of successful startups, so he tends to work for a year or two (at a premium salary, given his incredible depth and breadth of experience) and then take a year off.
From what I can see, software development is about as close to a pure merit-based industry as I've seen. If you can write good code, nobody much cares what you look like, how you dress (well, clothing is generally mandatory), the color of your hair, etc.
The one issue I have seen is that software devs who have accumulated only one or two years of experience in 20 years of work, meaning they've spent the whole time doing the same things over and over again, find it hard to get a job because they want to be paid like a 20-year veteran, but aren't any more effective than someone a couple years out of school.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
At what point does this age problem kick in? I'm 50 and not seeing it. I have coworkers in their 60s and they're not seeing it. Heck, I know one guy in his early 70s who just likes to work and doesn't want to retire. He's independently wealthy at this point, having been through a couple of successful startups, so he tends to work for a year or two (at a premium salary, given his incredible depth and breadth of experience) and then take a year off.
That's pretty far from the norm, few life-long developers are startup millionaires, especially now that the startup culture mostly died out and the industry matured more (that happened around the .com bubble popping for anyone who didn't already have a name for themselves or know someone who did.)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
The point is if you bothered to read the news and follow what's been going on in the IT sector, you'd understand that state of the industry.
Re: (Score:2)
When you have a sample size of 1, it's easy to believe in spells and fairies....however in the real world, in corporate America where turn over is a constant, old programmers get tossed on their ass on a regular basis. Don't believe me, read a few articles about IBM's layoffs. How about the Microsoft? Google? Perhaps UC Medical Center?
Interesting that you should mention Google, since that's where I work :-)
And if you read the post you responded to, you'll see my sample size is far more than one. Not only did I mention my co-workers (who have a lot of collective experience), but I've been in the industry for 30 years which obviously cannot all have been at Google. As it happens a big chunk of it was at IBM, where the only ageism I saw was pension cost-cutting.
The point is if you bothered to read the news and follow what's been going on in the IT sector, you'd understand that state of the industry.
IT or software development? The two are hugely different.
Ageism [Re:software developer tends not to be (Score:2)
Sorry, but my experience and that of colleagues differ.
I first noticed it myself when I used to do contracting. Multiple times in contract interviews they'd ask variations of, "We'd like to confirm you are comfortable working for a project lead who is younger." They wouldn't ask such unless something about age made them hesitant.
Perhaps they
Re: (Score:2)
I first noticed it myself when I used to do contracting. Multiple times in contract interviews they'd ask variations of, "We'd like to confirm you are comfortable working for a project lead who is younger." They wouldn't ask such unless something about age made them hesitant.
Don't be ridiculous. People in every industry would ask you that question. It's common for people to feel like the reporting hierarchy should somehow match the age hierarchy.
Re: (Score:1)
If so, that underscores my other comments about "typical" expectations being shattered in IT Land.
Re: (Score:2)
If so, that underscores my other comments about "typical" expectations being shattered in IT Land.
Not in the slightest. The same question would be asked for the same situation elsewhere -- and the same situation does happen elsewhere.
Re: (Score:1)
It's less likely to happen elsewhere, and thus less likely to cause the side-effects mentioned.
Re: (Score:2)
The big problem with software development is it has no direct future. If you don't move into management-esque positions, your career will plateau early
Your statement is true. Once upon a time, that bothered me. Nowadays, I don't know I want a management position. I have witnessed many places though where when a management position opens up, they don't promote a programmer, they promote a salesman, or someone from marketing, or some other branch. Once a programmer, it's hard to get out of being a programmer.
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:1)
What you wa
Re: (Score:2)
"If you are developing video games, expect to work very long hours all the time and be very stressed."
This is still not *that* stressing (try doing the same long hours servicing an ER, for instance) and the stress it poses is, for the most part, self-inflicted: you see the unemployment rates, man, grow some balls and just say no when it's no!
I have my doubts about this study... (Score:1)
Location distorts average pay (Score:4, Insightful)
The effective salary average may not be quite as high as one would think compared to other professions. Silicon Valley and some other parts of California tend to have a lot of software people. They also tend to have high prices and salaries - a devalued dollar.
Iowa and Nebraska tend to have a much higher numbers of corn farmers, and much lower prices. A Silicon Valley software developer making $100K isn't doing nearly as well as a Nebraska corn farmer averaging $100K. You can live pretty well on $100K in Nebraska.
So looking at national averages using nominal dollars overstates the effective pay for jobs that tend to cluster in California and and understates the buying power of jobs that tend to be found more in inexpensive areas.
As a specific example, the cost of living is about 2 1/2 times higher in San Jose than Dallas. That makes a difference. It means people working in aerospace and defense on average have more buying power than someone with the same salary working in solar-electric development.
Re: (Score:2, Informative)
but the corn farmer is subsidized by government (actual welfare queen.) Corn specifically, but also their phone, roads, "broadband" internet, farm insurance, loan assistance, and wildlife credits. ALSO, they get AT LEAST 2x more votes in the federal government depending on how you slice it... which ensures the continued theft of CA tax money in the flyover welfare states.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
I hope you grow up and accept reality. California subsidizes the states that hate it. California federal tax money disproportionately supports the genuine welfare programs that those other states disproportionately utilize. Sure it gets water to grow food but it exports that to those same states and much more than just the states it receives water from.
Re: (Score:2)
Secede. Just get some balls and do it. Colorado called the US goverment's bluff enough time and legalized pot. Then a bunch of other states followed.
Get a ballot initiative, Prop N, or what ever your state does, and stop funding the federal government. Someone's going to be first. If you guys have the spine to do it, just do it.
Re: (Score:1)
And don't forget how the ethanol in our fuel, due to lobbying from the farm industry, makes modern gas crap and is terrible for our vehicles. Thanks assholes. How about we try to preserve this non-renewable resource (topsoil, phosphates, etc.) and stop paying so much money to make so much extra unneeded corn? If you've ever done taxes for a business owner, or just paged through the instruction manual for taxes related to running a business, you quickly learn that the most powerful lobby in this country i
Re: (Score:2)
How about we try that? Shut down farms in the US and start importing food. Maybe that way Mexico would finally deliver something to the US that the US actually want to have.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Silicon Valley isn't in LA. The air is generally very clean.
Meanwhile, in Nebraska, the combine drivers have to stop every hour or so to cough the dust out of their lungs. The life expectancy of a farmer is lower than most other professions.
Re: (Score:2)
I've been through Silicon Valley - certainly far better than LA, but you have no idea what clean air is.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Silicon Valley and some other parts of California tend to have a lot of software people. They also tend to have high prices and salaries - a devalued dollar.
.. which is why I always wonder why more programmers don't get a job in Silicon Valley and then telecommute from Nebraska (or wherever) and pocket the difference.
It's not like software companies are against telecommuting -- hell, half of them allow their developers to telecommute from Bangalore.
Re: (Score:2)
Ask management. They feel as worthless as they are if they can't look over your shoulder and micromanage you.
Re: (Score:1)
Software developer is too broad (Score:3)
Among the software developers the better paid ones are the ones with some skill like PhD in computational geometry or machine learning or robotics or something and the software, usually C++, acts as a force multiplier.
I guess they didn't consider ageism... (Score:3)
You can be a productive doctor until you're six feet under. A software engineer over 40 is considered used up by a lot of companies, and it only gets worse as you get older. Obviously not in all cases, but I hear about it a lot in the industry. When I was working in hospitals, I never heard anything similar from the staff there.
Re: (Score:3)
Then relocate to Europe. A software engineer below age of 40 is not considered an experienced 'engineer', but a noob or apprentice.
Re: (Score:2)
How about remotely from USA? :P
Re: (Score:2)
Problematic because of where you are taxed where you are payed, social insurance etc. ...
But more problematic: most companies still frown upon remote work.
Then again: timezone difference
However: good luck! https://weworkremotely.com/ [weworkremotely.com] on stackoverflow are also often good remote jobs.
Re: (Score:2)
I would in a heartbeat. It seems that unless you work for a company large enough to get transferred to Europe, it's not really possible. I guess there are restrictions about companies hiring outside the EU unless they can prove need. Unlike the H1B sham we use in the US.
Re: (Score:2)
There is no restriction of remote work in europe.
And getting a work permit if you come from an "allied nation" is easy.
Re:I guess they didn't consider ageism... (Score:4, Insightful)
A software engineer over 40 is considered used up by a lot of companies, and it only gets worse as you get older.
This meme is created to pit older developers against younger developers and drive down salary costs. It's a pretty ugly thing to have to consider at the beginning of your career, at 25, that you only have 15 years left - so most people don't because who would start a career in software development knowing that?
I think companies are starting to realize that this attitude simply shrinks the availability of software developers. In the meantime more experienced developers find their way into better shops or work on their own business.
Re: (Score:1)
I guess it could be the fast pac
Ten (Score:2)
Where's the 10th? Is that some kind of decimal counter rollover joke for the software developers?
Last (Score:1)
Radiology Tech (Score:1)
depends on the job as well (Score:1)
Hours (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
No, but as I heard one nurse who worked on the Labor floor describe it: "I love my job because I work with patients who aren't sick." Presumably you understand the required hours before you take the job, but even OBs get time off.
"Software Developer" = ? (Score:2)
How? (Score:2)
Sick of embedded. How do I get a phone apps job, preferrably wfh some days a week?
How desperate are these companies? Willing to train phone?