Tesla Accuses Rivian of Poaching Employees, Stealing Secrets (theverge.com) 45
According to a new lawsuit first reported by Bloomberg, Tesla alleges that four of its former workers took highly sensitive proprietary information as they left to work for the rival EV startup Rivian. The Verge reports: Tesla even claims Rivian is "knowingly encouraging" this behavior, and it is seeking unspecified punitive damages for what it alleges is "despicable, wanton, oppressive, willful, malicious, [and] duplicitous" conduct. Rivian calls the allegations "baseless." The lawsuit, filed late last week, names four former Tesla employees and Rivian as defendants, though Tesla says it has identified additional people who may have also stolen and brought confidential company information to the EV startup. Tesla says two of the named defendants admitted to taking confidential information. One is Tami Pascale, who was a senior manager in Tesla's staffing department. Tesla says that one day after Pascale signed Rivian's offer letter, she "took at least ten confidential and proprietary documents from Tesla's network," including candidate lists, information about where the automaker finds potential hires, and a "detailed internal write-up of an executive level candidate." Tesla says Pascale initially denied this when confronted by the company's investigative team in early July, but that she ultimately "confessed to taking the confidential and proprietary documents." Pascale allegedly did not agree to delete the files, though, and the company claims she still has her work laptop. Tesla says she shared the screen of her phone with one of the company's investigators, and that when she was asked to search for the company's name, "numerous files" were visible, but Pascale "abruptly ended the session."
Jessica Siron, who was a manager in Tesla's environmental, health, and safety department, allegedly sent documents to her personal Gmail account three days after signing an offer letter from Rivian. Tesla claims Siron initially denied doing this when confronted by its investigative team, but that she admitted to sending one document when pressed. Tesla's complaint is light on details about Rivian's knowledge or encouragement of any wrongdoing, save for the case of Kim Wong, who was a staff recruiter at Tesla up until just a few weeks ago. Tesla claims Wong was contacted by a Rivian hiring manager who told her "Rivian did not have the recruiting templates, structures, formulas, or documents that would be needed" to grow the startup's recruiting efforts, according to the complaint. The same day as that conversation, Tesla says Wong sent "at least sixteen highly confidential recruiting documents from Tesla's network to her Gmail account," including confidential Powerpoint presentations that contained details about the automaker's recruiting and hiring process, as well as salary information.
Rivian's associate general counsel, according to Tesla, took a "cavalier attitude" toward the accusations and "claimed that taking confidential information was common in the industry." Rivian tells The Verge it disagrees with this framing. "In good faith, we discussed with Tesla the seriousness with which we take any allegation. This document misrepresents a conversation between counsel," the spokesperson said. Tesla says in the lawsuit that it was able to figure all this out because its investigative team "recently acquired sophisticated electronic security monitoring tools." If this sounds familiar, it's because a similar fight broke out in 2017 between Alphabet's Waymo and Uber, where Waymo accused Anthony Levandowski of stealing troves of data about self-driving cars and conspiring with then-CEO Travis Kalanick to shepherd that data to Uber. It was eventually settled in early 2018.
Jessica Siron, who was a manager in Tesla's environmental, health, and safety department, allegedly sent documents to her personal Gmail account three days after signing an offer letter from Rivian. Tesla claims Siron initially denied doing this when confronted by its investigative team, but that she admitted to sending one document when pressed. Tesla's complaint is light on details about Rivian's knowledge or encouragement of any wrongdoing, save for the case of Kim Wong, who was a staff recruiter at Tesla up until just a few weeks ago. Tesla claims Wong was contacted by a Rivian hiring manager who told her "Rivian did not have the recruiting templates, structures, formulas, or documents that would be needed" to grow the startup's recruiting efforts, according to the complaint. The same day as that conversation, Tesla says Wong sent "at least sixteen highly confidential recruiting documents from Tesla's network to her Gmail account," including confidential Powerpoint presentations that contained details about the automaker's recruiting and hiring process, as well as salary information.
Rivian's associate general counsel, according to Tesla, took a "cavalier attitude" toward the accusations and "claimed that taking confidential information was common in the industry." Rivian tells The Verge it disagrees with this framing. "In good faith, we discussed with Tesla the seriousness with which we take any allegation. This document misrepresents a conversation between counsel," the spokesperson said. Tesla says in the lawsuit that it was able to figure all this out because its investigative team "recently acquired sophisticated electronic security monitoring tools." If this sounds familiar, it's because a similar fight broke out in 2017 between Alphabet's Waymo and Uber, where Waymo accused Anthony Levandowski of stealing troves of data about self-driving cars and conspiring with then-CEO Travis Kalanick to shepherd that data to Uber. It was eventually settled in early 2018.
"Poaching" employees? (Score:5, Interesting)
So free market is good except for the labor market? Oh wait, it was fine for Tesla to build a factory and hire cheaper Chinese workers, but no good when Tesla employees go for a better job elsewhere? So free market is good only when it is free for Tesla and not free for everyone else?
If you want to keep your employees, perhaps you should consider signing a contract with them, like, you know, giving them extra bonus, stock options, etc, for staying X years? Stock options vesting isn't a new thing. It is 2020 now, not Y2K.
Or just simply treat them well so other companies cannot attract them with just a pay raise?
Stealing secrets, ok, sue them, I suppose Tesla already have airtight contracts safeguarding trade secrets. But don't give me that shit about "poaching employees".
Re:"Poaching" employees? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:"Poaching" employees? (Score:5, Funny)
Sorry pally, I only come hard-boiled, see?
Re: "Poaching" employees? (Score:2)
Considering how theres no chance that tech firms like microsuck, apple, hp, and google ever manage to hire from the competition due to all the non compete clauses... how did tesla find themselves in this predicament to begin with?
Re: (Score:2)
Re: "Poaching" employees? (Score:2)
Hmm one or both parties? If the new company was somewhere where it was enforceable, could tesla file suit in the state/county where NewCompany is registered?
Re:"Poaching" employees? (Score:4, Insightful)
It's called industrial espionage when they steal documents, especially at the request of their new temporary employer. Sure employ them to get the proprietary secrets and then fire them quick smart, they have literally proven to their new employer they absolutely can not be trusted and they will steal from their employer to profit themselves, they have proven this. Once you have the data, why would you keep them, you know, you literally know, they will betray you company for a better offer and steal data when they leave. Any employee that steals proprietary data on the way out, should only be seen as a low level labourer from then on it, they have proven beyond doubt they can not be trusted, why would you put them in a trusted role.
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I mean, Tesla's never been big on the free market. They were built on government subsidies for customers and maintain their growth through ZEV credits.
Re: "Poaching" employees? (Score:1)
Not what the lawsuit is about (Score:4, Informative)
If you actually read the lawsuit, it obviously does not accuse Rivian of "poaching", that is perfectly fine. And Tesla does give employees bonuses, stock options etc and the problem is exactly that: The former employees stole lists with the exact salaries, bonuses, equity each Tesla employee is getting. I don't know if you have any idea how hiring works, but this gives Rivian a huge (and illegal) advantage when poaching employees - they need to spend EXACTLY as much as they need to entice each employee. I mean many employees will be happy at Tesla I assume, but if you know exactly what they are getting, you can make enticing offers to several (without overspending due to uncertainty over Tesla compensation) and some will come to you.
signing a contract better be an union one then! (Score:2)
signing a contract better be an union one then!
Texas, land of the free (Score:5, Interesting)
Bollocks. (Score:4, Interesting)
Sure you can steal documents, that's not ok.
Companies don't own employees, the arrogance that comes with claims of employee poaching is sickening.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
From the "making shit up" department ....
The only thing here that claimed "employee poaching" is the Slashdot headline.
Nowhere in the lawsuit, or even the source article, says that.
Not surprised; we've come to expect this kind of garbage reporting from Slashdot.
Tesla is upset (rightfully so) over the theft of their documents.... not a peep about the employees leaving in and of itself.
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Not settled (Score:5, Informative)
Waymo accused Anthony Levandowski of stealing troves of data about self-driving cars and conspiring with then-CEO Travis Kalanick to shepherd that data to Uber. It was eventually settled in early 2018.
It was settled between Uber and Google, but Anthony's trial is still going on. He's awaiting sentencing on over 30 federal charges.
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Toss A Coin To Your Witcher (Score:1)
When a humble bard
Graced a ride along
With Geralt of Rivian
Along came this song...
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That is Felon's way.
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Can't beat them? Tesla has sold over a million vehicles, Rivian still doesn't even have an assembly line and recently lost their partnership in Detroit.
Hahahha (Score:1)
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Case law has been pretty clear you own what is in your head, but your employee agreement may restrict what you can do with it post employment for some specified length of time.
On that subject: if all the valuable stuff is in your head, that means you don't need files and documents from your past employers systems, right? So don't take them.
So -- no tech theft? (Score:2)
From the article it seems what was misappropriated were HR and administrative stuff. Nothing about the technology. Did I miss something?
Given the intensely tech-driven business plan that Tesla approves it seems like a lawsuit for this is hardly worth the effort, unless the goal was just to give a PR black eye to Rivian. Or warn them off trying for the real goods.
Tesla should be thankful (Score:2)
Taking confidential information and a company laptop with you after you have quit is fucked up. Only I wouldn't call it poaching. I'd call this shit stain removal.
Garden Leave (Score:2)
Maybe as Elon mentioned on the earnings call anyone leaving Tesla should go on 6 months Garden Leave paid by Tesla
HR Secrets (Score:2)
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Well it's like leaving the Church of Scientology, except it's the Church of Elon they're being accused of betraying.
Always puzzled me (Score:2)
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See my other post in the comments on this article.
Control freaks twist language to make the alleged offense sound worse. Many employers do strive to keep their employees captive in various ways. Like by opposing a national health care system so that they can be the sole givers of healthcare benefits that are of course withdrawn the instant the employee leaves. They encourage and push employees to rig their finances so that their lives will be totally upended if the income from the employer is cut for a
Things have changed (Score:4, Interesting)
In 2014 Tesla posted "We believe that Tesla, other companies making electric cars, and the world would all benefit from a common, rapidly-evolving technology platform." (from "All Our Patent Are Belong To You" https://www.tesla.com/blog/all... [tesla.com])
In 2020 Tesla complains about the loss of proprietary information and employee poaching.
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In 1985 the Free Software Foundation is founded to "support the free software movement, which promotes the universal freedom to study, distribute, create, and modify computer software".
In 2008 the FSF claimes that various products sold by Cisco under the Linksys brand had violated the licensing terms of many programs on which FSF held copyright, including GCC, GNU Binutils, and the GNU C Library.
Even with patents and copyright, open sourcing often doesn't give everyone free reign to do whatever they like wi
Give them a reason to stay! (Score:1)
So Tesla doesn't treat its people well enough, or pay them well enough, to keep them from going to a competitor. That's on Tesla. You want to keep good people? Make sure they want to stay by treating them well and paying them what they deserve!
gravity sucks (Score:2)
Texas (Score:1)
This is what happens when you decide to move a bunch of people from California to Texas. A lot of these people want to stay, and Rivian is a great option for them. This isn't poaching, this is free-markets at work.
Poaching employees (Score:2)