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Transportation Technology

Musk Reveals Plan To Scale Tesla To 'Extreme Size' (techcrunch.com) 79

Posted by msmash from the closer-look dept.
Elon Musk signaled plans to scale Tesla to the "extreme" while teasing the release of Tesla's "Master Plan Part 3" on Twitter one day before opening the automaker's first European factory. From a report: On Monday, Musk revealed on Twitter the themes that will dominate the next installment in Tesla's long-term playbook: artificial intelligence and scaling the automaker's operations. "Main Tesla subjects will be scaling to extreme size, which is needed to shift humanity away from fossil fuels, and AI," Musk tweeted. "But I will also include sections about SpaceX, Tesla and The Boring Company." The plan may detail what "extreme size" looks like for Tesla and outline the automaker's strategy for scaling its manufacturing and supply chain amid a global pandemic and supply chain crunch.
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Musk Reveals Plan To Scale Tesla To 'Extreme Size' More

Musk Reveals Plan To Scale Tesla To 'Extreme Size'

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  • Oof, "planning" to reveal plans... (Score:3)

    by davide marney ( 231845 ) on Monday March 21, 2022 @01:11PM (#62377447) Journal

    An article of several paragraphs describing a tweet that lists a topic containing several sections.

    But, no actual "plans". Just planning to have a plan.

    Man, you can't even buy PR like that.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by DarkOx ( 621550 )

      Its like you have no experience with the Financial and Tech press.

      This is if anything more content than they usually have when they start writing.

      • Actually, if you bother to read Elons plan 1 & 2, and consider the effect those plans have had on the economy, transportation, and vehicle safety systems, youd realize when he makes a plan, its significance on our society cant be overstated.
    • Elon can announce things like no other! His announcements are unparalleled genius! If only other people could announce things like Elon could, maybe their companies could trade at a 190 P/E ratio too!
    • Yourself and 99.9999% of us, including me, will never achieve even 0.0001% of what Musk has achieved so far in his life. What have you done that could benefit humankind since you were born ?

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by haruchai ( 17472 )

        Yourself and 99.9999% of us, including me, will never achieve even 0.0001% of what Musk has achieved so far in his life.
        What have you done that could benefit humankind since you were born ?

        Been responsible for far fewer personal GHG emissions than that bloviating hypocrite

      • Just curious what is your scale for benefiting mankind? reducing carbon emissions? lower cost to orbit? personal wealth?
        • Don't forget affordable high speed internet from the middle of nowhere (I'm posting this from a Starlink connection in outstate Minnesota)

      • You mistake my point. I am not criticizing Musk for being the success that he is, I'm criticizing the rest of the world from getting the vapors from what is nothing more than just a freakin' tweet. The PR dial is stuck on 11. Turn that sucker down, folks.

    • Or do I mean parking theme?

  • I am sick of hearing about AI and how it's going to take all our jobs & rule the world. If we could shift away from it that would be great. I am glad Musk is on our side

  • OK, so Teslas of extreme size. HoHum. What I want is the extreme size version of this [boringcompany.com].

  • Sell drive trains seperately (Score:3)

    by schweini ( 607711 ) on Monday March 21, 2022 @01:22PM (#62377475)
    I wish Tesla would sell their drive trains in modular form seperately. Used ones seem to be very popular amongst car-hacking people.
    If they would do that, and one could mix-n-match different modules, we'd get a plethora of small car manufacurers that simply build the car around a Tesla base. I think that would be awesome.

    And besides, I bet that's something a couple of companies will be offering soon anyhow.

    • Ford started selling them. https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/... [cnet.com]

      Although I'd never touch anything made by Ford.

      • Unfortunately, they're not only charging way too much for a motor alone, they won't sell you a controller matched to it either. You just get it with a pigtail. If that was a price for a motor with a controller, they wouldn't be able to keep up with demand.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by DarkOx ( 621550 )

      I agree it would be cool. I don't think we will see that for some time though.

      Most of the big autos do sell the drive train products as "crate engines" etc and I expect Tesla will at some point too. However their more margin in wrapping an entire car around it. Until Tesla has the manufacturing capacity to build more power train equipment than market to sell their cars into they won't do it.

      I don't expect Tesla's barrier to producing more cars currently is bodies/coach work; they could have outsourced that

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by fermion ( 181285 )
      It may be that Tesla will be a parts supplier. Many good cars manufactures existed post war in the US. The smaller ones tended to fall as the larger were able to sell at prices that may have been lower than cost. Right now nearly every non-US car manufacturer is on track to be totally or mostly EV by the end of the decade. Kia has a car that us the same price as Tesla, and may be preferable for people who want a car supported by a known person, not just a random minimum wage call center worker.

      Tesla has

  • How about delivering products first (Score:4, Insightful)

    by wraith_five ( 9507791 ) on Monday March 21, 2022 @01:29PM (#62377497)
    Wish Elon would focus on delivering products he's already sold, Full Self Driving, or delivering ones that were supposed to be available years ago, Semi, Roadster, and Cybertruck, or delivering on battery tech they promised, Structural Battery Cells. Then we can hear all about his "Next Big Thing".

    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward

      That's not how grifting works. Never stop moving - remember the Mango news cycle shuffle?

    • In all honesty the first 3 rely on the 4th to be feasible. Seems like they don't have the battery and/or manufacturing capacity to keep up with current Model 3/Y and S/X orders so new product development gets put to the wayside (which also gives those products more time to mature in all honesty).

      All 3 of those new models are likely to demand more battery capacity than the existing models, especially the Semi so until Tesla is able to ramp up battery production with their dry-cell production process, new c

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by mspohr ( 589790 )

      Best to have a plan for "what's next" ready while you finish up current plans. Besides, the things you mention are not part of the secret plans. They are just implementation details.
      - Full self driving is being delivered in stages and keeps improving. Already better than human driver.
      - Semi, Roadster, Cybertruck are delayed to avoid competing with resources to make more of current models. They will be put into mass production if they ever catch up with demand.
      - Structural battery packs are being implemented

      • Besides, the things you mention are not part of the secret plans. They are just implementation details.

        This is pure comedy gold. Respect.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by mspohr ( 589790 )

          I think this illustrates the problem with your thinking. Part of Musk's genius is that he makes long term plans and then executes them. I have been following him for many years and I appreciate his long term vision and his ability to execute. (He's also made me several million dollars richer.)
          Those who are stuck in short sighted "waddabout" gotchas are doomed to the eternal wage slave treadmill.
          Good luck.

      • Besides, the things you mention are not part of the secret plans. They are just implementation details.

        Um, full self driving and the trucks are specifically mentioned in the second master plan. [tesla.com]

        Create stunning solar roofs with seamlessly integrated battery storage
        Expand the electric vehicle product line to address all major segments
        Develop a self-driving capability that is 10X safer than manual via massive fleet learning
        Enable your car to make money for you when you aren't using it

        Emphasis is mine.

        He also has stated [twitter.com] that volume production shouldn't be considered an "implementation detail".

        Prototypes

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

        Full self driving is nowhere near as good as a human driver. Even Tesla tell you not to use it on most roads.

        Musk tends to vastly underestimate the difficulty of bring products to market. Sometimes he gets lucky and things work out, more often they get delayed for years. FSD is the best example, but the same thing happened with the Semi.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by mspohr ( 589790 )

          Much safer than the average human:

          https://www.tesla.com/VehicleS... [tesla.com]

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

            That's horseshit and Tesla knows it. They start by not comparing like-for-like, because Autopilot is only for highway driving which has a relatively low accident rate.

            Tesla also likes to claim that autopilot was not engaged whenever there is an autopilot related crash. We can't take their word for any of this. The fact is that their system is under investigation by the NHTSA for multiple issues, and they have had to roll back several times on things like the maximum time allowed before a hands-off-wheel war

      • As a user of the FSD beta, itâ(TM)s not even close to being better than a human driver outside of one specific instance. That instance being staying safely in your lane driving down the interstate. Itâ(TM)s fantastic at that and definitely does make it safer for me during that sort of trip. Outside of that though itâ(TM)s absolutely terrifying. I use it in hope of helping them gather data to make it better. But itâ(TM)s years away from being ready.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by mspohr ( 589790 )

          Your anecdotal experience is irrelevant. If you want some actual data, read the Tesla Safety Reports. They show that Tesla cars (at all levels of FSD implementation) are much safer (increasing safety with increasing levels of automation) than the "average human driver".

    • But it sounds like the next big thing is producing more of those already-promised things.

      Actual full-self-driving does belong in a separate category, since nobody knows how hard it will ultimately be to do, or when it will be done. Musk has definitely over-promised on that front, continually, and personally I would not pre-pay for a vehicle feature in hopes of it getting better with a software upgrade at some point in the future.

  • Musk Reveals Plan To Scale Himself To 'Extreme Size' [hitc.com]

  • While Musk's fortune increases, he increases the price of a Tesla? How does that help shift humanity away from fossil fuels? Why doesn't he absorb it? Greed?

    https://www.autoblog.com/2022/... [autoblog.com]

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by mspohr ( 589790 )

      Tesla is already back ordered to the end of the year. They could lower prices but that would just make the queue longer to get a Tesla. Better that they charge more money and use it to build more factories. If they ever catch up production with demand, they can lower prices.

    • Your statement is true for every auto manufacturer now. Prices have climbed like crazy in the past two years. Have you paid attention to your grocery bill lately?

    • How does that help shift humanity away from fossil fuels?

      If Tesla's goal was to help shift humanity away from fossil fuels, they wouldn't sell their carbon credits. Tesla's goal, as with every for-profit corporation, is to make money.

  • Let's complete "Master Plan. Part Deux". [tesla.com] We're still waiting on a few things:
    - Pickup Truck
    - Heavy Duty Trucks
    - Urban Transport
    - Full Autonomy
    - Autonomous Ridesharing

    Maybe Musk considers them complete, but I don't see them out in the world.

    • Dooooduh ... haven't you heard? Delivering is just an implementation detail! Get with the program!

      Besides, you didn't even mention the most exciting milestone of all: the prototype Tesla Robot! I can't describe the joy of knowing I live in a world where that's no more than 9 months away! It will change EVERYTHING!

      • Dooooduh ... haven't you heard? Delivering is just an implementation detail! Get with the program!

        Musk's own statements have repeatedly stated [twitter.com] he doesn't believe that. In fact, the opposite.

        Prototypes are easy, production is hard.

        That's why I think he's jumping the gun.

  • This guy sends 30.000 satellites up in a 'normal' way so that polar scientists in Antarctica can watch porn so, I'm curious what 'extreme' means.

  • Elon Musk hasn't invented anything (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    He has put together a team that gets things done, and invents .. but what invention's design did he conceive? Heck Zuckerface is more of an inventor at least Facebook (social network using real identity -- as opposed to the crapshoot that was MySpace) is an original idea.

    SpaceX - reusable rockets .. not his idea at all
    Methane powered engines - Russians had working models, that he admits he was "inspired" by
    Tesla - electric cars .. not his idea
    Autonomous vehicles - not his idea.. DARPA Grand Challenge of 200

    • He also managed to out-weird Frank Zappa in naming his kids. That's pretty impressive.

    • Elon Musk has invented or is responsible for inventions. You can have amazing ides but the details are critical. What good is something on paper like Jules Verne's Nautilus compared to a Los Angeles attack sub?

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by q_e_t ( 5104099 )

      DARPA Grand Challenge of 2005 kicked things off.

      They were being worked on well before that. I saw a demonstration (via video) of one going round a track a decade prior.

  • See, there's plenty of room to grow. Tesla will be selling cars on Mars in 10 years.

  • ... I don't see how that means "shifting humanity away from fossil fuels". Seems like it would outstrip the growth in renewable generation quite handily. Power's got to come from somewhere.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by ghoul ( 157158 )
      Beamed Solar power from satellites

    • "... I don't see how that means "shifting humanity away from fossil fuels". Seems like it would outstrip the growth in renewable generation quite handily. "

      I guess he'll make bikes, trikes, quads and since it's Musk we're talking of, 'pents'. :-)

      "Power's got to come from somewhere."

      He sells solar tiles as well, just as power-walls to store the energy.

      It's a one shop solution.

  • ...that for example I can order a Tesla X that is 10 times bigger the current model size ?

  • Tesla's market cap is 0.95 Trillion. Everyone else is about 1 Trillion, I don't think the other automakers are going away

  • I didn't even know Master Plans 1 and 2 existed (from 2008 and 2016).. Reading them now, they're actually pretty stunning. I'm sure a lot of folks poo-poo'ed them at the time, Plan 1 was especially bold. https://www.tesla.com/blog/sec... [tesla.com] https://www.tesla.com/blog/mas... [tesla.com]

  • Granted, it is what Tesla needs to do, shift from making cars (which they don't really do that well) to creating new standardization and components (which they could do really well at) that most if not, all car manufactures would use (think motors, cells, regen braking, etc, etc.).

    Musk isn't good at logistics and the kind of scaling that tightly controls expenses to control margins. That's what the traditional car companies do very, very well and they aren't going to sit on their hands and wait for Tesla to

  • Tax payers are already paying EXTREME amounts for all the subsidies on fancy cars people don't need to drive.

    If we're going after privilege, why are we ignoring the people getting showered with government money ?

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