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PCWorld: Six Months Since Release, Windows 11 Still 'Unnecessary' (youtube.com) 138

Posted by msmash from the closer-look dept.
UnknowingFool writes: In October 2021, PC World reviewed Windows 11 and labeled it as an "unnecessary replacement" to Windows 10 and did not recommend it for Windows 10 users. PC World noted that it was a "mixed bag of improved features and unnecessary changes." Six months later they reviewed it again. While MS has made improvements, PC World does not feel the improvements warrant a recommendation for Windows 10 users to upgrade.
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PCWorld: Six Months Since Release, Windows 11 Still 'Unnecessary' More

PCWorld: Six Months Since Release, Windows 11 Still 'Unnecessary'

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  • I get it. Everyone hates the new windows. Since 1992.

    • That is simply not true, I loved every other revision of windows. That's microsofts plan, the piss people off every other version and then correct their mistakes.

    • Windows 3, 3.1 and 3.11 were quite well-received as I recall. Most seemed to like Windows 95, at least at first. While 98 was hit-and-miss, 98 SE was considered as fairly solid. 2000 was highly regarded by those who used it, and despite a few big gripes XP was quite popular from the start. Windows 7 was an instant hit.

      Looking back, the versions of Windows that remained popular were the ones that were popular from the start.

  • It's very necessary (Score:4, Interesting)

    by rsilvergun ( 571051 ) on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @12:45PM (#62499496)
    like Windows ME & Vista before it it's absolutely necessary to keep consumers on the upgrade treadmill. It's like Starbucks rewards cards, it's not there to make your experience better, it's there for habitualization.

    • It's like Starbucks rewards cards

      Nah, I've been using Windows for an eternity and still haven't seen my free covfefe.

    • > it's absolutely necessary to keep consumers on the upgrade treadmill

      Not for long - "Operating System As A Service" coming soon as a mandatory update on a PC near you!

      https://www.microsoft.com/en-u... [microsoft.com]

      Getting users to buy the latest version can't make the money that forcing them to pay monthly to access their own data can!
      =Smidge=

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by juancn ( 596002 )
      I think it is, but not for the reason you think. It will take a long time to get a compelling new windows out, and usually it takes at least two major releases before they hit the nail in the head. XP was great, Vista sucked, 7 was great, 8 sucked, 10 was great, 11 sucked. See the pattern here?

  • Ads (Score:1, Redundant)

    by Rick Schumann ( 4662797 )
    All the better to surveil you and shove ads in your face, my dears.
    Fuck Windows, fuck Microsoft, viva la Linux.

  • Win 11 adds no value (Score:5, Interesting)

    by awwshit ( 6214476 ) on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @12:48PM (#62499514)

    I've been running Windows 11 on a couple of computers for close to 6 months now. Windows 11 adds no value over Windows 10, there is no killer feature or anything that would drive one to Windows 11 over Windows 10.

    • Android support, virtual desktops, native directstorage. those surely are of some value to someone, somewhere.
      • "Somewhere" is the operative word. It is not that Windows 11 has zero new features. The issue is it does not provide compelling features for a large number of users.
        • To be honest, I'm not even sure Win 11 is out of it's pre-release phase or beta or whatever they were calling it. The "launch" of Win 11 that wasn't exactly a launch per se, but will be available soon to you but is available to these guys over here now... it's all just too much stupid.
          • Considering how MS is trying to push it on Windows 10 users, MS thinks it has launched. One "security update" on my Windows 10 installed PC Health Checker without mentioning it was part of the install. It then proceeded to run after start up and told me my PC was not available for Windows 11. The "security" update also turned on all telemetry settings that I had turned off to phone to MS about my machine.

        • Rounded corners! Hasn't everyone been waiting for rounded corners? And nearly every review that comes out says Windows11 has a clean and fresh look--like your laundry when it comes out of the wash, I guess.

          When the best you can say about a new version of some software is that it has a clean and fresh look, that says s.t. about the software.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by gweihir ( 88907 )

        Virtual desktops are new in Win11??? WTF? I had well-working virtual desktops under Linux in 1995. Also had them under Win7 with WindowsPager or somewhat worse ones natively in Win10.

        Android? Just use an emulator. You do _not_ want all those crappy insecure Apps to run natively in crappy, insecure Windows.

      • Comment removed based on user account deletion

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Junta ( 36770 )

        You left out WSLG, though it sucks.

        The Android support is interesting, except it is amazon linked and a bit flaky if you go off script, and very hard to use.

        DirectStorage is an idea that's neat in theory, but in practice a bit superfluous.

      • Android support

        Available in Bluestacks and MEmu for years, both of which ship with the Google Play store by default, rather than having a bespoke Amazon Appstore install process.

        virtual desktops

        Sysinternals had a freeware option for this since the XP days; nVidia had their Desktop Manager (R.I.P.), Stardock has an add-on for it...virtual desktops have been available on Windows, for free, for decades.

        native directstorage

        That thing with a highly specific hardware requirement that a very small number of applications take advantage of, and which requires benchm

    • I'm not seeing much that Windows 11 has given. In fact, things like not being able to have an app name on the taskbar are thing that are annoying. W11, other than being the latest/greatest OS isn't really bringing much to the table that W10 has, other than better security that eventually will be patched in.

      If it works, don't fix it, and I have a feeling that MS is going to have to drag a lot of people kicking and screaming to W11... provided their hardware supports the OS.

      • Yes- the rigid restrictions placed on the task bar made it pretty much the most frustrating experience I've had with Window's interface.

        I might have 30 windows open at any given time. And I can only manage them via task view? That is insane, slow, and irritating.

        I am running Windows 11 on my main computer because I'll be forced into supporting it. But even so, I actually bought a piece of software to make the task bar usable again.

        They ought to fix that. It's a deal killer for folks who actually use their c

        • I wonder if this is one reason why macOS is seeing a resurgence, as well as Linux desktops. The Year of the Linux Desktop is going to be like the Year of the CD (if you are old enough, you might remember that. There was no specific year when it became common... it just was adopted over a period of time.

          Other than the better security features like Android/iOS like file encryption for users who are not logged in (sort of like old-school EFS, but different), as well as the AI based app gatekeeping that shoul

    • i Have been runnibg windows 11 for a month. It is slower on the same hardware. And lack of features in the task bar is frustrating. And whats worse is that if i need to fix a printer i have to go back to that same damn windows nt 4 dialog box from way back when to do so

      So after all the big downgrades to the UI it isnt even applied across the OS. It is something i miss about macs. If they upgraded the UI the entire UI was upgraded.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by gweihir ( 88907 )

      It costs you some performance though and it has limited hardware compatibility. Definitely a "stay away" version. I mean they did not even fix the NTFS performance problems. Interestingly, the modern Linux NTFS driver does not have those performance problems, so the problem is not NTFS, but bad OS design by Microsoft.

  • PCWorld: when were you last relevant?

    We have a few PCs that were purchased new and immediately upgraded to 11. Hasn't given me any trouble (though there's a lot of things to disable). Most everything in my house is Mac and Linux . . . so it's not used extensively.

    I would say that it's a chore to be on an OS that you can't find answers to "how do I" online (meaning older ones). Windows 10 is fine for now, yes, but Windows 11 won't require a change to a new OS as soon as Windows 10 will.

    This is *E
    • but, but... just install Linux!

  • Only reasons we upgrade windows (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @12:55PM (#62499546)

    when we are forced to by 3rd party app require for whatever reason
    when we are forced to by a 3rd party game that will only run on the newest windows
    when we get new hardware that only has driver support for newest version of windows

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by antdude ( 79039 )

      I hate doing major upgrades. I used to love getting them, but not anymore due to lack of resources like times, hardwares, money, etc. I don't play computer games like I used to.

      • I used to love getting them, but not anymore due to lack of resources like times, hardwares, money, etc.

        I stopped habitual upgrades once XP came out. I replaced a piece of hardware, and Windows de-activated itself. I couldn't re-activate over the Internet and had to place a phone call to some Indian dude who grilled me to make sure I wasn't building a new computer.

        These days I only change hardware if I absolutely have to, and there's no way I'd use Windows 10 or anything newer.

  • Duh (Score:5, Insightful)

    by smooth wombat ( 796938 ) on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @12:56PM (#62499548) Journal

    Why would anyone think there would be anything useful or new in 11? The entire point of 11 is shove ads in your face, not allow you to go about your work.

    10 is bad enough with its focus stealing and "search" plastered in every piece of software. 11 is just taking it to the next level

    • But, it's one louder!
    • I've not seen a single ad. Been on Windows 11 for a year now. Where do they hide them? If they are hidden, then that really isn't shoving them in your face is it?

      • Re:Duh (Score:5, Informative)

        by gTsiros ( 205624 ) on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @02:13PM (#62499916)

        i just opened the settings and took a screenshot

        https://i.imgur.com/UBiwLYe.pn... [imgur.com]

        THE SETTINGS

        notice anything?

        • It took me a minute, but eventually I did notice an icon for Office.
          Is that really what you call "shoving ads in your face?"
          I haven't seen this on my machine, but will look into it when I get home.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by caseih ( 160668 )

            Yes absolutely I do. There's zero reason for MS to make reference to Office 365 on this screen. The Start menu is bad enough for that sort of thing. And how Edge is constantly pushed in your face, especially when selecting your default browser. I believe Windows 11 removed the loophole that Chrome and Firefox were using to set themselves as the default browser without going through the hoops MS makes you go through to ensure you know Edge is what they prefer you use.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by Luthair ( 847766 )
            They do it a lot, and they've done it a lot in 10 too. Pestering you to use edge (and outright changing preferences), ads in File Explorer for OneDrive, ads in your start menu for apps, search contains ads from the web, tricking you (and now forcing you in 11) to sign in with a Microsoft account so they can track you across properties & devices, etc. etc.

            • Re: (Score:2)

              by Luthair ( 847766 )
              Oh, also every new built in application (weather/news/etc) is simply a vehicle to put ads in front of you.

        • THE SETTINGS

          notice anything?

          Yes I do. I noticed you had to open settings, something that users rarely do. Thanks for making my point that a tiny little borderline miss-able "Microsoft 365" icon does not even remotely fit with ... wait what did you call it? *checks* shove ads in your face.

          You think that is shoved ads in your face I wonder what you think of a TV commercial break, does it rape you?

          Incidentally are you forced to click it, you said *checks* not allow you to go about your work. Is your cursor frantically drawn to the tiny l

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by gTsiros ( 205624 )

            you're a fucking moron for the commercial break/rape comment alone

            and you're a fucking moron for not even paying attention to whom you are replying

            but most of all, you're a fucking moron for not only accepting these practices but also expect _others_ to accept these practices and ridiculing those who object to _any_ advertisements on a product they've paid for, again and again.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by thegarbz ( 1787294 )

      The entire point of 11 is shove ads in your face, not allow you to go about your work.

      There is literally no difference between Windows 11 and Windows 10 on this point. Are you just parroting stuff which you've heard trolled on Slashdot? Don't do that.

      10 is bad enough with its focus stealing and "search" plastered in every piece of software.

      Windows 10 has zero power over software's search function. And search doesn't "steal focus" on either Windows 10 or Windows 11. It's quite clear that you're a Linux user. That's good. We need more Linux users, but they need to STFU about stuff they have zero experience with and known nothing about.

      • Re: (Score:3)

        by sinij ( 911942 )
        Windows 10, depending on version, does show you ads on lock screen, on start menu, in search and even remotely installs applications that they want you to try. While it is possible to turn all of this off with group policy in Windows 10, pretending that this is not happening is just a transparent attempt to gaslight.

        • Who's pretending ads weren't on Windows 10? Of course they were. And that's how it's no different from Windows 11.

        • While it is possible to turn all of this off with group policy in Windows 10, pretending that this is not happening is just a transparent attempt to gaslight.

          Not reading my post does not make my post gaslighting. At no point did I say Windows 10 doesn't do this. The OP postulated that Windows 11's point is to shove ads in your face, my point is that since Windows 10 already did it to exactly the same extent so no, Windows 11 clearly has a different point since there's no change in this behaviour.

          Reading comprehension is hard, but hey you made an Anti-Windows 11 post so have a modpoint courtesy of one of Slashdot many braindead mods.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by sinij ( 911942 )
            So your entire tirade was over "Windows 11 shoves ads in your face" vs. "Windows 11 also shoves ads in your face" ? Rather pedantic.

    • Why would anyone think there would be anything useful or new in 11? The entire point of 11 is shove ads in your face, not allow you to go about your work.

      10 is bad enough with its focus stealing and "search" plastered in every piece of software. 11 is just taking it to the next level

      The most ironic part being that Windows Search pretty much hasn't worked at all since at least Windows 7.

  • Considering Windows 10 will be EOLed sooner or later, you've got no choice anyways unless you're OK with vulnerabilities and new applications refusing to start/work. LTSC will work longer but legally not that many people can use it.

    And it's not really better in the world of Linux unless you settle on something like RHEL or its clones and get stuck with very old versions of applications.

    Lastly, visually W11 might not be necessarily better but Microsoft has improved certain Windows features (like faster/s

    • If you hold out long enough, though, you'll get the option to "upgrade" to Windows 12 instead. If Microsoft holds true to its release history, that version should fix some of Windows 11's issues and be slightly less annoying to use.

      • If you hold out long enough, though, you'll get the option to "upgrade" to Windows 12 instead.

        Oh no, no. Version numbers are too dull and predictable. You know, it's just counting, like 7, 8, 10. It will be time to REINVENT that TIRED PARADIGM... again... and the bold new future shall be as the past!

        I predict that the next version will be called Windows XS. Icons will have the 3D look again, this time tilted downwards. The web browser will be replaced by Microsoft Whoopie. The clock will be displayed using Roman numerals.

  • Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @01:00PM (#62499568)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • Windows 11 is a dogs breakfast of half thought out UI implementations

      I would not feed a dog Windows 11.

    • Re:For the average user... (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Voyager529 ( 1363959 ) <voyager529@ya[ ].com ['hoo' in gap]> on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @02:39PM (#62500016)

      I mean come on, can we finally consolidate ALL settings in Settings instead of having to jump back and forth between it and the control panel.

      Honestly...I hope they don't. The problem is that there are a number of bespoke applications that have custom Control Panel applets, from audio interfaces to serial controllers, from Quicktime to Norton, and the old school ATI and nVidia add-ins during the XP era that are vastly superior to their current terribleness, there are plenty of pieces of hardware and software that use the Control Panel to give functionality.

      Some of these things are even more deeply integrated. Most memorably, Synaptic touchpads had an extension for the mouse control panel applet which allowed deep customization with things like chiral scrolling (which I miss dearly), edgemotion, and custom gestures. MS made a generic "touchpad" section in Settings that allows for about half a dozen common settings, but undoes most of what the Synaptics drivers enabled for years. Intel NICs add options to network adapters; things like jumbo frames and VLAN tagging and MAC spoofing are only possible in the Control Panel; "Settings" has no place for them.

      Even first party settings are "streamlined". Most of the network options beyond static IP are gone, most of the sound options are gone, the application uninstall section is garbage, Credential Manager is gone entirely, and trying to set PATH variables or virtual memory settings still spits you into sysdm.cpl anyway...and don't get me started on how printer installs, while streamlined, almost invariably use generic class drivers by default, rather than drivers that allow custom paper sizes and duplexing and a bunch of other useful things.

      After nearly a decade (if you count Windows 8 the start of a "settings" section, as I do), it's pretty clear that having Settings be a 1:1 replacement for even first party Control Panel options isn't in the cards...so between "both existing", "no more advanced options", or "do it in Powershell", I think 'keepin both' is the least bad option.

      I fully expect Windows 12 to be SaaS.

      I'm pretty sure MS would love nothing more than to charge a subscription for Windows...but I don't think they will. ChromeOS is free and can be installed on generic hardware now, even $50/year for Windows narrows the cost incentive to get a PC over a Mac, and the more they follow the trend of turning a browser into an OS, the more palatable Linux becomes. Moreover, if they try pushing the "App Store Only" functionality that they're 0 for 3 on attempts, it'll remove the very reason Windows is useful in the first place.

      I don't know if MS is capable of having a watershed moment where they finally become okay with being old, reliable, boring, predictable, and profitable through Office and Azure, rather than tripping over themselves to recreate Google or OSX messes. However, the longer it takes for them to learn their lesson, the more their customers will learn to adapt to letting MS be little more than an email host.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by gweihir ( 88907 )

      I fully expect Windows 12 to be SaaS.

      I believe early versions of that are already available. Will be interesting to see what they do about gaming then. I will not maintain a Windows-PC just to get a glorified console...

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Luthair ( 847766 )
      Personally I don't want anything in Settings, the new UIs are awful compared to the Control Panel ones they've been removing. Its almost like they're designed by someone who has no concept about how they'd be used.... go figure.

    • I fully expect Windows 12 to be SaaS.

      Rent seeking and an Apple/Google style walled garden are the goal + TPM 2.0 so you can't do anything they don't like anymore ...

  • Doesn't matter if Win 11 is unnecessary (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    Whether you like it or not, It is still inevitable. A lot of things will stop working with Windows 10, and you won't have a choice if you want to continue using Windows

    • And that's Microsoft in a nutshell. If they can't get users to migrate (not upgrade) from Windows 10 to 11 because it's better, they'll put out new versions of popular programs that simply refuse to run under 10, not because they need something that 10 doesn't have, but just to force you to pay for the newest version whether you want to or not.

  • So? (Score:3)

    by thegarbz ( 1787294 ) on Tuesday May 03, 2022 @01:12PM (#62499626)

    Most OS upgrades are completely unnecessary at first. They become necessary when the previous OS ceases support or some application makes use of an important feature not available the previous OS.

    Windows 11 works just fine for most users. A few people spend a whole 5min complaining about the task bar, but then those same users spent 5min complaining about some feature in every Windows release, and then when no one listened they pouted and got on with their work, work which largely has zero to do with the OS and everything to do with the applications running on it.

  • In a world where a huge percentage of "consumers" probably rarely use a traditional PC operating system, what remains for the "retail" market, is a niche sector of PC gaming and hobbyists. Sure, it's probably a reasonable amount of users, but will also be a fairly sophisticated group.
    Unless win11 offers a compelling reason to switch, then uptake will be slow.

    Thing is, I don't think it really matters to microsoft, because, over time, due to OEM tie-ins, it will become the dominant OS, right?

    For now, sure - t

  • And what, pray tell, are you going to do about it?

    Macs? Not the great power/money ratio they once were, but sure, that is one option. Probably not though.

    Linux? Oh please, you are delusional. If you didn't make the switch between the 7 -> 10 transition you won't switch now. And Microsoft knows it.

    Stick to Windows 10? Yes, works until MS pull the plug in ~40 months.

    Microsoft got you by the balls, and they know it. Have fun being their slave! :D

  • I had no idea it still existed.

  • I think that society in general is now coming to the gradual realization that using Windows harms communities, particular communities of color and OS minorities.

    Many windows users have, in an attempt to recreate the initial euphoria of getting a computer, gone on to try harder OSes such as Linux, or FreeBSD. One user claimed that after trying FreeBSD once, he used FreeBSD all the time now. He said FreeBSD was his gateway.

    Others have switched to Ubuntu - which does who-knows-what with your files. Ubu

  • They say Win 11 is a
    >"mixed bag of improved features and unnecessary changes."

    What are these improved features they speak of?

    I've certainly seen the unnecessary changes, not to mention a whole lot of unwanted "features" that only benefit Microsoft. But actual improvements?

  • I've been using Linux on my daily driver since March 2020.

    In the past week I've been doing video editing with KdenLive, using OBS to stream, and been gaming in 144 hz with absolutely no problem on my desktop with an Nvidia card.

    Linux gaming is ready and there's absolutely no reason to stay shackled to Microsoft.

  • My experience with Windows upgrades over the years is that eventually, people felt compelled to move to newer versions mostly because they found out they needed the new one for a peripheral to work, or for the hardware itself to work with it.

    For example, the folks who tried to stick it out on Windows XP eventually found they couldn't buy a document scanner or a printer anymore that had drivers for it.

    This happened again when people were content to stay on Windows 7, but new machines didn't include the neces

  • If you remove the unnecessary words then the title should read:

    Since Release, Windows Still 'Unnecessary'

  • .. PC World noted that it was a "mixed bag of improved features and unnecessary changes." ...

    ... and inexplicable removals [slashdot.org].

  • I recently bought a new laptop and it came with Windows 11. As a user I don't see a lot of difference between it and Windows 10, which I use at work. At work we went XP -> 7 -> 10, BTW, but do our serious development on Linux (x86, Raspberry Pi). I use a Mac at home.

    I've turned off most of the nagging and have a few abandonware applications that just don't run. I can live without most of them. The couple I really want I'll wrte something of my own and be done with it.

    ...laura

  • "Click for more options."

  • THIS will be the last straw!

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