Internet Access In Gaza Partially Restored After Blackout (techcrunch.com) 262
An anonymous reader quotes a report from TechCrunch: After a weekend of almost complete internet blackout, connectivity in Gaza has been partially restored. On Friday, internet monitoring firms and experts reported that access to the internet had significantly degraded in the Palestinian enclave. The local internet service NetStream "collapsed," according to NetBlocks, a firm that tracks internet access across the world. At the same time, IODA, another internet monitoring system, showed outages and degradation across several Palestinian internet providers. The lack of internet communications caused emergency lines to stop ringing, made it hard for paramedics to locate the wounded, and for family members to reach relatives and friends, according to The New York Times.
On Sunday, IODA reported "marginal restoration" of internet connectivity in Gaza. Abdulmajeed Melhem, chief executive of the Palestinian main telecommunications company Paltel Group, told The Times that the internet had come back even though the company had not made any repairs. Then on Monday, Gaza had roughly the same access to internet connectivity as before Friday, according to several experts and firms that are monitoring the internet in the region, including Doug Madory, an expert who for years has focused on monitoring networks across the world. "There was the 34 hour complete blackout from Friday to Sunday -- a first for Gaza. Then there was last night's partial outage in northern Gaza," Madory, who is the director of internet analysis at Kentik, told TechCrunch on Monday. "The situation is still very precious: no power, little water. Service could potentially drop out again at any time." [...]
It's unclear what caused the internet outages in Gaza on Friday and what caused the improvements on Sunday and Monday. The Washington Post reported on Sunday that the U.S. government put pressure on the Israeli government to switch the internet back on in Gaza, citing an unnamed U.S. official. "We made it clear they had to be turned back on," the official said. "The communications are back on. They need to stay on," The Post quoted the official as saying. Also on Sunday, The Times reported that the U.S. government believed that the Israeli government was responsible for the near-blackout of the internet in Gaza.
On Sunday, IODA reported "marginal restoration" of internet connectivity in Gaza. Abdulmajeed Melhem, chief executive of the Palestinian main telecommunications company Paltel Group, told The Times that the internet had come back even though the company had not made any repairs. Then on Monday, Gaza had roughly the same access to internet connectivity as before Friday, according to several experts and firms that are monitoring the internet in the region, including Doug Madory, an expert who for years has focused on monitoring networks across the world. "There was the 34 hour complete blackout from Friday to Sunday -- a first for Gaza. Then there was last night's partial outage in northern Gaza," Madory, who is the director of internet analysis at Kentik, told TechCrunch on Monday. "The situation is still very precious: no power, little water. Service could potentially drop out again at any time." [...]
It's unclear what caused the internet outages in Gaza on Friday and what caused the improvements on Sunday and Monday. The Washington Post reported on Sunday that the U.S. government put pressure on the Israeli government to switch the internet back on in Gaza, citing an unnamed U.S. official. "We made it clear they had to be turned back on," the official said. "The communications are back on. They need to stay on," The Post quoted the official as saying. Also on Sunday, The Times reported that the U.S. government believed that the Israeli government was responsible for the near-blackout of the internet in Gaza.
Im actually genuinely surprised (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Im actually genuinely surprised (Score:4, Insightful)
While it's undeniable that it's a legitimate military target, the military also has the duty to minimize civilian casualties.
Hamas drinks water too. That doesn't mean you can blast all of the water towers in a densely populated city.
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
It also means you can't abuse the rules by doing things like building terror tunnels and depots under hospitals, homes, etc and then confusing the situation with crisis actors...
Something Hamas is INFAMOUS for.
It's quite literally to the point that if people actually die, it's the fault of Hamas.
They just wanna kill jews in the largest possible quantity.
And they don't guive a shit about the Palestinian people. Ir they wouldn't be setting up facilities in such a manner as to use citizens as bullet and bomb
Re:Im actually genuinely surprised (Score:4, Informative)
It also means you can't abuse the rules by doing things like building terror tunnels and depots under hospitals, homes, etc and then confusing the situation with crisis actors...
No, it does not. The rules are not nullified by the other side breaking them.
Something Hamas is INFAMOUS for.
Every terrorist group is famous for flaunting the rules. It's kind of one of their defining features.
It's quite literally to the point that if people actually die, it's the fault of Hamas.
No, it's not. That's some stupid shit that sick fucking war criminals say to justify leveling residential blocks in a vendetta.
They just wanna kill jews in the largest possible quantity.
Hamas? Absolutely. Palestinians? No.
And they don't guive a shit about the Palestinian people. Ir they wouldn't be setting up facilities in such a manner as to use citizens as bullet and bomb catchers.
No argument there. Hamas is human trash.
Israel is doing their damnedest to meet them in the 9th circle of hell.
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So you're okay with a terror group using their own civilians as human shields?
No. Fuck that.
"Every terrorist group is famous for flaunting the rules. It's kind of one of their defining features."
That doesn't make it acceptable.
"No it's not (Hamas' fault."
Yeah. It is. They see no problem using their owe people as bullet catchers and bomb proofing.
You cannot fight such people by being "nice".
Sorry.
Once the terrorism's out for play, it's Old Yeller time.
Re: (Score:2)
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So you're okay with a terror group using their own civilians as human shields?
Oh shut the fuck up.
Nobody said that. Do you think you're fucking clever with that strawman? How fucking old are you, 15?
No. Fuck that.
Indeed. Hamas are war criminals. String the fuckers up.
Yeah. It is. They see no problem using their owe people as bullet catchers and bomb proofing.
It doesn't matter what they do.
War Crimes are committed by each side independent of whether or not the other side commits them.
There's no "but they did...." defense. None. This is a fact. You can moralize it, and you're free to hold that opinion, but in international law, that opinion is worth shit.
Re: (Score:2)
That's not how it works. You still think you're a lawyer of international law as you stand up for the Nazis. Fuck you. Fuck the Hitler Youth. Fuck Hamas. Learn your history, you ignorant pile of shit.
About 1/4th of Allied bombs landed in France. Were you not aware?
Re: (Score:2)
You ACs shitposting all over this are interesting. Centrally coordinated?
Ask Milosevic how violating the Rome Statute goes
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PotAto....PotAHto...
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You must remove the buried potatoes, but you must not disturb a particle of soil in the process. No farming for you!
Also, the soil in no way helped grow the potatoes, and the fact that soil will grow more potatoes is not the fault of the soil.
Nazis love enablers like you (Score:2)
People like you who wept for the Hitler Youth in WWII...
Re: (Score:3)
Sure they are. If one side refuses to wear uniforms. You're allowed to blow up as many terrorists as you like.
If you're a Hamas terrorist and hiding behind some civilians, sucks to be those civilians, but not a war crime if a few of them take one for their team.
That's not nullification of the rules. The things you say (killing civilians is okay when killing combatants hiding among them as long as it isn't disproportionate to the military goal) are literally part of the laws of war. They even make it clear that hiding among civilians is a war crime.
There's no real evidence that Israel has broken the laws of war apart from one questionable video of a smoke (white phosphorous) shell exploding in the port area which maybe counts as indiscriminate. The problem is that
Re: (Score:2)
killing civilians is okay when killing combatants hiding among them as long as it isn't disproportionate to the military goal
Correct. Proportionality comes into play here.
And I'd love to see the math workup where thousands of civilians killed to take out a few hundred terrorists that may have been in bombed locations adds up to proportionality.
It's frankly fucking absurd. It's some fucking Russia-level absurd horse shit.
Israel has practiced proportionality in the past, but it's clear as fucking day they're not now.
This is revenge. I suspect the lack of discrimination (also a war crime) isn't a lack of military discipline in
Re: (Score:3)
Israel has practiced proportionality in the past
Yes and what has the achieved for them?
The reality here is the west needs to let of the post colonialist guilt and consider the realistic outcomes for these frozen conflicts. You can thumb thru you history books all you like and come up with some justification or another why a given group is entitled to some specific area of ground. That is a particularly true in this example. So let us skip that digression.
If we accept Israel has a right to exist, than it has an implied right to defend itself, and do so
Re:Im actually genuinely surprised (Score:4, Insightful)
Yes and what has the achieved for them?
Stopped reading here.
Doesn't fucking matter. A war crime is a war crime, and "we tried not bombing city blocks, and it didn't work" will not save you from a life imprisonment if you are apprehended by Interpol in an ICJ jurisdiction, or if the next government of Israel sends Netanyahu to one.
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Hamas was elected even if it was 20 years ago. Elections have consequences, and you can say the most of the current population wasn't even voting age blah blah, but they have not deposed that government either.
So how did Netanyahu return to power? Hopes and prayers? Or was it votes? He hasn't been deposed yet either. One standard, please.
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It's clear as fuck that you're not a lawyer of military law.
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The number of "civilian" casualties that you see quoted is directly from Hamas and is actually the number of Palestinian casualties, including both Hamas fighters and those killed by Hamas (for example for disloyalty or through their hundreds of failed rocket launches) so the nominator is actually much smaller than normally quoted.
There is no factual count of civilian casualties. I'm extrapolating it as such: Hamas numbers of casualties, taking into account that it's war time and literally everybody is full of shit during war, and giving a general estimate of what percentage of them were likely to be Hamas fighters.
The military wing of Hamas constitutes 2% of the population of Gaza.
It can very easily be that every single building the IDF targeted had Hamas fighters in it.
Statistically highly unlikely.
Regardless, wiping out a building (that has civilian ownership/population) to kill a single militant is a very clear war c
Re: (Score:2)
There is no factual count of civilian casualties. I'm extrapolating it as such:
I think this is a crucial comment here. My instinct tells me that Netanyahu is a war criminal just because that's his kind of thing. I don't agree with either of your math calculations because your extrapolation is speculation. You might be right, AC might be more or less right.
We need an actual independent war crimes investigation against actual allegations and probably carried out by the ICC.
Regardless, wiping out a building (that has civilian ownership/population) to kill a single militant is a very clear war crime.
If that was a building where a sniper was firing from and placing troops at risk that would be a normal, and milita
Re: (Score:2)
If that was a building where a sniper was firing from and placing troops at risk that would be a normal, and militarily justifiable, procedure for the US. Its just not that simple. If it was a single "militant", not currently fighting then I agree. What about 2? What about 10? What about 200?
Oh- you're I didn't mean to imply an actual militant engaging in military activities against you.
In that case, literally nearly anything goes.
These obviously are not that, since there are no Israeli boots on the ground here (yet)
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These obviously are not that, since there are no Israeli boots on the ground here (yet)
Actually, there are now boots on the ground, but there weren't when the neighborhoods were originally flattened so I accept your point. As I've said elsewhere, I'm absolutely convinced Netanyahu will attempt to commit war crimes given his record. That needs to be properly and legally confirmed however. A big part of their justification has been Hamas firing mobile rocket launchers and/or weapons.
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We are talking war crimes, so we are talking the Rome Statute.
If you'd like to educate your ignorant ass. [wikipedia.org]
Thanks for playing indeed, lol.
Shame you didn't slap a username on that stupid fucking post
Re: (Score:2)
You would do yourself a favor if you responded to the arguments made rather than using Ad Hominem attacks.
Re: (Score:2)
You're trying to convince an antisemite to not be a pile of shit. You're not going to win this one.
Re: Im actually genuinely surprised (Score:2)
Is that really all that's going on here? Or is that just the story your self-selected news sources repeated over and over?
There is more than just a bunch of loonatics going on a killing spree. There was about 75 years of subjugation and systematic oppression.
Re: (Score:2)
Muslims controlled Palestine from the 14th century until the era of Mandatory Palestine.
Your invented history is amusing, though. [wikipedia.org]
The population did not swing to the Jewish side until the dumbshit 1948 war, which involved war crimes (civilian massacres [wikipedia.org]) by both the Palestinian Jews and the Palestinian Muslims.
Re: (Score:2)
The fact you say "Muslims" rather than "Turks" gives away the dishonesty of that history. You are trying to imply "Palestinians" but in fact these people were not that. Funnily enough, you could actually have gone back in time to Arab conquests in the area in the 7th century and that would have been better for your case. The fact, however, is that both Arabs (who later became a part of the "Palestinian" population) and Jews were living in the area all the time.
Wrong. You tried to imply that Arabs arrived and "tried to kick out them Jews". Jews have been a minority in Palestine since the 15th century, when the semitic Palestinian population became predominantly Muslim (the methodology of that being irrelevant at this juncture).
This does not somehow displace them as indigenous to that land, though.
Jews were living in Palestine (known also by the name "Judea") from thousands of years BC continually until now. They were not a majority but they were around 30% of the population, of what is currently Palestine for much of recent time before the creation of Israel. Arab Muslims were also not a majority.
Muslims living in Palestine from the advent of Islam continually until now.
Palestinian Muslims were the majority.
Nobody brought up Arab muslims except for you. If you
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Just being of use to the enemy military is not enough to make something a legitimate target. For example, hospitals treat wounded soldiers with a view to sending them back to fight, but they are also mostly not legitimate military targets.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes (Score:4, Insightful)
Maybe there's a lesson in here.
Could just be that voting for warmongers is gonna bite you in the balls at some point. Especially when you're dependent on your nominal enemy for food, water, electricity, telecommunications, and just about everything else. Maybe peace is the better option?
Israel's far right government (Score:3)
Nobody is reaping what they sowed here. Both far right-wing governments on both sides use each other and the violence caused by each other to stay in power and to recruit new far right wing a
Re: Israel's far right government (Score:2)
Yes. Hamas ousting fatah so they could shoot rockets into Israel was a Jewish conspiracy.
Bravo.
Only person bringing up the Jewish people is you (Score:3)
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Maybe peace is the better option?
It is.
But how will hamas have any power or legitimacy if there's peace?
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The last elections were in 2006, and there were not considered free. The majority of Palestinians were not old enough to vote in 2006, and half of them hadn't even been born. Half of the population of Gaza is under 18.
You can flip this logic around too. Some Israelis voted for successive governments that oversaw an invasion and annexation of Palestine, not to mention the violence and killing. If you think that their ancestors voting 44% for Hamas one time is justification for what is happening in Gaza now,
Re:Play stupid games, win stupid prizes (Score:5, Informative)
You are probably going to play pedantic games with this and claim ".....but Netanyahu and Likud didnt.", but Isreal has offered a two state solution many times.
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/1... [nytimes.com]
Re: Play stupid games, win stupid prizes (Score:2, Insightful)
'nother fun fact: Netanyahu and Likud have been in power almost uninterrupted for the last two decades because Labour staked its reputation on various iterations of land-for-peace in the late 90s, and it was answered with a wave of suicide bombings cheerled by the head of the PA himself.
To put it in domestic terms, it would have been like after 9/11 it having come out that instead of hanging out with the likes of Bill Ayers in the 80s and 90s, Kerry, Obama and Hillary had been jihading it up in Afghanistan.
Re: (Score:2)
Labor's plans might not have worked out as they would have wished but 2 decades of zero peace process from the conservatives along with increased settlement building has clearly gotten them into an even worse spot than anything Labor every did.
As you said, the conservatives have been in power for the last 20 years and it's their complete and utter failure to find any kind of solution to this problem Israel has made for itself that has them in this spot today.
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This is untrue. What the article claims was on offer never actually was. No maps were every drawn up.
Even what the article claims was on offer is worded misleadingly. There would still have been refugee camps, and a form of apartheid. Arabs would have been forced to choose between remaining in Israel or going to what was left of their former homes, in the hopes of rebuilding and that the peace held.
It was never realistic and it was never put on the table in the form that the article claims. Mostly just a PR
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Yeah, decades ago. It's been over 20 years since the Israelis made any kind of serious peace effort.
Internet = Spying tool (Score:3)
If the IDF turns off the internet, the 5 eyes can't spy.
--
Life is really simple, but we insist on making it complicated. - Confucius
One question (Score:5, Insightful)
One question: What did Hamas think Israel would do when they invaded Israel, killed people, and took hostages? Send a 'thank you' card?
No, they're going to reduce Gaza to a parking lot of rubble.
They'll bomb it so hard and so thoroughly that they'll have to update the topographic maps of the area. It's only ~14 meters above sea level, so they may just bomb it until it's underwater.
I have sympathy for the Palestinians, not for Hamas. Hamas started this and now everyone gets to play whether they want to or not.
Re:One question (Score:4, Insightful)
One question: What did Hamas think Israel would do when they invaded Israel, killed people, and took hostages? Send a 'thank you' card?
No, they're going to reduce Gaza to a parking lot of rubble.
They'll bomb it so hard and so thoroughly that they'll have to update the topographic maps of the area. It's only ~14 meters above sea level, so they may just bomb it until it's underwater.
I have sympathy for the Palestinians, not for Hamas. Hamas started this and now everyone gets to play whether they want to or not.
What did Israel think Hamas would do when they occupied the West Bank, kicked Palestinians off of their land to build Jewish Settlements, and kept Gaza under a severe blockade for over a decade?
Israeli or Palestinian, disliking the actions of the leaders doesn't make civilians fair game.
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My understanding was that Israel withdrew from Gaza, including tearing down settlements, and that wasn't enough for Hamas, who assert(ed) all of Israel was theirs. It when Hamas acted on this (launching rockets, terrorist attacks and whatnot) that Israel setup the blockade. Your turn...
There were never many Settlements in Gaza, and you completely ignored the issue of Israel occupying the West Back, kicking out Palestinians, and building settlements in your place.
That's not to justify what Hamas did, nothing can justify that, but it's telling how rare it is to see someone even try to defend Israel's settlement policy.
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However, it seems like you're pretending that the West Bank doesn't exist?
And while the West Bank isn't ruled by Hamas like Gaza is, Israeli atrocities continue on a daily basis there.
Your turn.
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That's honestly an open question I personally have not seen any solid evidence for, maybe there's new reporting out there recently
Most speculate the attack was bait meant to provoke a response, either to win pr support because they were banking on a heavy handed response or draw the IDF into an urban quagmire. It pretty much worked on the US as we got pulled into 20 years of failed nation building from a single incident.
It could also just be plain ol' terrorism, just chaos and revanchism. This is where i
Re: (Score:2)
Gaza will still be ruled by terrorists, and the world will recognize the Israeli government as being full of war criminals as well.
This isn't the first war on terror.
It is the first where the nation fighting said terrorists wiped out more civilians than bad guys, because they were so angry they literally didn't give a fuck.
I have compassion for that anger, but it doesn't justify the war crimes. Netanyahu will never
Re: (Score:2, Troll)
One question: What did Hamas think Israel would do when they invaded Israel, killed people, and took hostages? Send a 'thank you' card?
It's a valid question, but what I want to know is What did Israel expect to happen [vox.com]?
I have sympathy for the Palestinians, not for Hamas.
Hamas are tools... of Netanyahu [www.cbc.ca]. I wonder how many of them know?
Re: (Score:2)
That is an undeniable war crime.
I do acknowledge the difficulty of trying to combat fucking terrorists in an urban environment, but you know what? When the US marched into Iraq and Afghanistan, we didn't reduce Kabul or Baghdad to rubble.
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The insurgency in Iraq lasted for years.
And no, electrical and water were never knocked out, as in destroyed. The US used low-destruction munitions and targeted distribution centers to lights-out at critical times, with explicit consideration for what it would do to the civilian population. That's still terrible, but there you have an example of someone actually trying to follow international law.
Lying to make a point is stupid. Don't be stupid.
Re: One question (Score:2)
Right. And given that response was entirely predictable why would Hamas attack Israeli civilians?
Serious question, why would they do something that meant almost certain death? The answer isn't that they just want to kill Jews.
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I have sympathy for the Palestinians
I have limited sympathy for Palestinians. So far they have accepted Hamas rule which is widely publicised as having a jihad against the state of Israel and Hamas has support for their terrorist activities in both Palestine and a significant portion of the Arab world (who didn't even condemn Hamas's message for Muslims all over the world to indiscriminately kill jews in retaliation for ... Israel's retaliation for the Hamas airstrike 3 weeks ago).
People are responsible for their governments, not the other wa
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Point of order, Hamas did not invade Israel. The areas in question are part of Palestine, they are merely occupied by Israel.
You could flip this around and ask what Israeli settlers expected to happen when they moved into occupied territory that was actively disputed.
None of which helps, it just perpetuates the endless cycle of violence as each side blames their actions on the other's most recent atrocity.
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What I want to know is what Israeli conservatives have been thinking for the last 20 years? The whole zero peace plan while bulldozing Palestinian homes and settling their own people on the territory was never a long term strategy to anything other than another war with Hamas.
While the actions of Hamas were truly reprehensible they were also incredibly predictable. Keep a people down for long enough while stealing their homes and eventually some of them are going to do something horrible back.
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Are you suggesting that because Hamas committed war crimes, then it is okay for Israel to do the same?
Absolutely not.
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The thing is, Hamas and their butt-boy brigades have DEFINITELY committed war crimes (and continues to).
Where is actual evidence Israel's done any such thing?
All you have is "Al Jazeera alleges...
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Do you want a factual answer?
Or do you just want some6thing you'll continue to ignore for some broken-headed ideological brain-fart?
How is it a war crime when your enemy operates by terror attack and stacks bodies of their own people up to absorb damage?
People who're utilizing crisis actors.
Supposedly "dead" people who get carried around, then move because playing dead is UNCOMFORTABLE?
THOSE are actual crimes.
And that's ignoring the fact that these people literally ambushed civilians across the country, mur
Re: (Score:2)
Do you want a factual answer?
You're too fucking stupid to formulate any such thing.
Or do you just want some6thing you'll continue to ignore for some broken-headed ideological brain-fart?
Waiting for that "factual answer"
How is it a war crime when your enemy operates by terror attack and stacks bodies of their own people up to absorb damage?
That's your factual answer, you stupid fucker?
You've just made it clear you don't actually know what a war crime is.
Aerial operations over an urban center where proportionality is not respected is a war crime, full stop.
Particularly,
Intentionally launching an attack in the knowledge that such attack will cause incidental loss of life or injury to civilians or damage to civilian objects or widespread, long-term and severe damage to the natural environment which would be clearly excessive in relation to the concrete and direct overall military advantage anticipated;
Supposedly "dead" people who get carried around, then move because playing dead is UNCOMFORTABLE?
Oh, you're a sick motherfucker. You have no evidence of any such thing, and direct photographic evidence of the deaths are available from independent reports from multiple countries.
THOSE are actual crimes.
Suppos
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Also, war is not a "One For You, One FOr Me" proposition where everything is maintained on a balance sheet.
That's a GAME.
This is WAR.
Re: (Score:2)
How so?
I am so glad you bit :)
Aerial operations must conform to 3 rules to not be a war crime.
Military necessity, distinction, and proportionality.
1 is arguably true.
2 and 3 are clearly being violated.
See US invasion of Iraq for a template on how to not commit war crimes in your aerial operations.
Um, there's definitely terrorists there? Have you been living in a cave?
The fact that there are terrorists in the Gaza Strip is not in dispute.
If you're arguing that every square inch of Gaza City is thus subject to bombing, you have demonstrated why violating rule 2 above makes you a w
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See US invasion of Iraq for a template on how to not commit war crimes in your aerial operations.
During the Invasion of Iraq, Iraqi forces were keeping separate from the civilian population and so when they were targeted that didn't cause much "collateral" damage. The closest equivalent here would be the Second Battle of Fallujah [wikipedia.org] in which there was massive destruction of buildings.
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Iraqi and US forces surrounded the city and gave the residents weeks to leave.
US forces conducted searches of places likely to hold civilians, rather than dropping bombs on them.
US forces urged people who could not leave to stay in their homes, where they would be safe. And they largely were.
Strikes in Fallujah were directed by close combat needs.
Gaza is at 10x that in days.
Gaza civilians were given days to leave.
Gaza residential homes were bombed b
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Both of those acts are war crimes (The hiding among civilians) and the non-proportional aerial bombardment of groups of civilians "that may have terrorists among them".
Sure, the fact the civilians in Gaza are suffering is due to war crimes, but the war crimes are by the Palestinians, not the Israelis.
That is false. The war crimes are committed by both sides.
One of those sides is a terrorist organization, and they're already sanctioned in every way possible by most of the world's economy. The other side is a fucking UN-recognized state, that has a fucking obligation not to commit said war crimes, and would be held accountable if no
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I'm not denying that there isn't a legitimate way for this operation to be carried out.
This operation appears to be in clear violation of Rome Statute rules on proprtionality.
That's a war crime. You don't ever get to commit a war crime, even when someone raises the big scary T word. Period.
If Israel wipes out Hamas while leaving Gaza (mostly) intact, then ya, Palestinians will be better off.
However, at this rate, Gaza won't have anyth
Re:One question (Score:4, Informative)
If you want to be at war with Islam, for which view I actually do have some sympathy, then declare war and follow the international laws regarding war. Don't engage in this cowardly chickenshit terrorism. Israel kills Palestinians in small numbers frequently, Hamas boils over, kills a wad of Israelis, then Israel kills a whole bunch of Palestinians, lather rinse repeat. What's the end game? Nuclear war in the middle east? How is that supposed to wind up with a happy ending for anyone?
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Telling someone to follow "international law" with terrorists and a UN organization dominated by Islamic radicals who root for Hamas.
That's FUNNY!
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Telling someone to follow "international law" with terrorists
Yeah, I know, good luck [reuters.com].
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Looks like Auntie Beeb has forgotten how to spell HAMAS.
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"What the fuck is your thing dude?"
My "thing"?
I figured that'd obvious.
When it comes to terrorism, "playing nice" just gets more people killed.
FUCK THOSE PEOPLE.
Israel's done what they could to clear the deck of civilians.
If they don't choose to get the fuck out of the way? Tough shit.
If they didn't move because they believed Hamas? TOUGH SHIT. At that point, it's called "Partisanship".
"Documented" merely means someone wrote down bullshit".
But if you want to believe Hamas and the Hamas supporters in the
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Israel's done what they could to clear the deck of civilians.
No, they haven't, and either way- that's not how international law works.
If they don't choose to get the fuck out of the way? Tough shit.
Wrong answer, dumbshit.
That's called a war crime.
If they didn't move because they believed Hamas? TOUGH SHIT. At that point, it's called "Partisanship".
Wrong answer, dumbshit.
That's called a war crime.
Noncombatants are noncombatants regardless of what they believe. Only material aid and picking up a weapon changes that.
"Documented" merely means someone wrote down bullshit".
When many people from many countries "write down the same bullshit", at what point do you continue to deny it, lol?
You're clearly fucking invested in the idea that Israel is not committing atrocities, and it's not cle
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Volunteering to be a human shield is material aide.
The human shields are not volunteers. There are recordings, from the IDF, of phone calls with Gaza residents who tried to move to the south side of the strip and were shot at by Hamas so had to return to their homes. There were also aerial photographs of road blocks on the evacuation routes and it seemed Hamas carried out attacks with explosives against the civilians.
That's not "fair" on the IDF, but they can't just assume that anyone who stays behind in a civilian apartment block is a volunteer for Hamas.
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Then they are human shields for hamas and hamas is solely responsible for their fate.
Netanyahu is responsible for Hamas [www.cbc.ca], not only through providing direct material aid, but also through policy. How's that affect your math?
Re: (Score:2)
Israel wants to solve the problem with bombs. Then they complain about Hamas rockets. It's the same picture, except of course Israel can reliably hit what they want to hit any time they try and Hamas generally can't.
But when they send troops into Gaza they harass, intimidate, abuse, and sometimes murder peaceful civilians, and use them as human shields.
In short what we've got is one side which cannot afford (literally) anything but terrorism, and one side which can but chooses to engage in terrorism anyway.
Re: (Score:2)
How is that even relevant?
How are you able to tie your shoes? Or do you depend on velcro?
It's obviously relevant if Netanyahu is funding the same organization he's claiming is making it impossible to do anything other than massacre the Palestinians.
Re: (Score:2)
"No they haven't."
Ah. Willfully ignorant.
Yes. Israel, before cutting off communications networks had notified the Gaza area, and they air dropped notifications.
Translation: I could be saying "Water's wet." and you're going "NUH UH!"
"When people from many countries..."
It means it's heavily repeated bullshit.
"Noncombattants.."
Who are being used by their own government as human shields...
YOUR solution is to simply sit there, frozen, while Hamas murders people.
Re: (Score:2)
That doesn't mean it's not material aid.
You don't know what you're talking about.
Re: (Score:3)
Netanyahu is the one who said it was his strategy [www.cbc.ca], in March of 2019.
So tell me, am I gullible for believing he was telling the truth? Or am I supposed to believe everything Netanyahu says is a lie, in which case I can't believe any claims coming out of Israel now with him in charge?
Fuel shortage (Score:2)
. How could they recover then, and how push US force Israel to help the move?
Am I the only one (Score:2, Troll)
that sees a parallel between the Nazi destruction of the Warsaw Ghetto and the pending Israeli destruction on the Gaza Ghetto?
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
Gaza is not a Ghetto - the place is full of new cars and people stuck there who visited from the UK, Australia, US etc. to visit relatives.
Any comparison to the Warsaw Ghetto is wrong and offensive.
Re: (Score:2)
Maybe Hamas can spend ... (Score:2)
Phew! (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
If I understand the situation correctly, they could keep it off as long as they want since all gaza infrastructure runs through Israel. Water, electricity, most shipping, and internet. They can turn that stuff on and off as easy as flipping a few switches. Maybe some of southern gaza can get cell service through egypt?
And thus why Israel is an occupying force.
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
And thus why Israel is an occupying force.
As one example, Gaza's water supply is dependent on Israel. This is because when the European Union made an in-kind donation of $100 million in water pipe, Hamas used the pipe sections to make rockets. Let's assume that Gaza's Internet is being used in the same way.
Re: (Score:2)
New meaning to the phrase, launching an internet service.
Re: (Score:2)
Excuse me? Who tried to agree with the original partition of the area?
Who agreed to the final partition of the area?
Who has, multiple times, given up land to attempt to buy peace?
Israel. Always Israel.
Who decided "fuck it, we'll take it all!"
You guessed it. The palestinians and a myriad progression of terrorist masters.
Stop bitching because YOUR team opens up conflicts with terrorism, gets their asses kicked, then uses news media to pretend THEY are the aggressed upon.
Re: Might be just part of an attack (Score:2)
I think you should check the historic maps.
Re: Might be just part of an attack (Score:2)
"Every source is false. Believe what I say instead."
- Every Israel supporter, when presented with a fact they don't like.
Re: (Score:3)
Israel supplies about 2/3rds of Gaza's water, the rest coming from desalination plants that need fuel to run. Gaza needs fuel for electricity too. Israel also blockades Gaza and controls everything going in and out, so cutting off fuel (and food) is easy.
That's why Gaza is often described as an open-air prison. Israel effectively controls everything that goes in and out, including people. Israel controls basic infrastructure.
Re: (Score:2)
What about the parts of the Gaza wall that borders Egypt and I think other Arab states...?
Why not go through those...shouldn't they be more friendly?
Re: (Score:2)
Egypt and other states won't open the borders because they know that if they do, Israel will force all 2.5 million Palestinians over them. It would be a massive refugee crisis, and ethnic cleansing.
Of course it would be lovely if Egypt and others just accepted all Palestinian refugees and then Israel negotiated in good faith for a return and viable two state solution, but obviously that's not on the cards.
Re: (Score:3)
Absolutely! And if they manage to commit genocide in the process, and utterly wipe out all those inconvenient Palestinians...well, that's just a price that has to be paid (wink, wink).
If hell existed, you just know who would be smiling and giving the old elbow nudge to all his buddies.
Re: Exterminate Hamas (Score:3)
You don't see any irony in a Jewish nation comminuting a Holocaust against a population that, right or wrong, are legally part of their country?
Not that Israel is Jewish any more than the US is run by the pope.
What happens after? The US pours endless money and weapons into Israel so it can defend against every country around it, every one of which are now convinced Israel an existential threat to their existence? The US can't afford what it's currently doing.
Re: (Score:3)
Unfortunately, US politicians understand very well that standing up to Israel even a little will unleash the wrath of powerful, well-funded pro-Israeli lobbying organizations.
Re: (Score:2)
No doubt you're correct. Did you know there's video of Netanyahu telling an audience how his government supports Hamas in order to keep a two-state solution off the table? If it looks like the US is turning on him, or if his own people decide to hold him accountable, Netanyahu will find some way to prop them up. If they slaughter more Israeli civilians, well, that's a small price to pay for staying in power.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: Starlink (Score:2)
According to reports, Israel has actively targeted its own hostages, reasoning that if they are alive, they have to negotiate with Hammas. If they're dead, then they can blame Hammas.
This isn't wild speculation, this is hard, documented Israeli policy.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wik... [wikipedia.org]