VW Group's Troubled Cariad Software Division To Lay Off 2,000 Workers 34
According to Germany's Manager Magazin, Volkswagen's board has approved laying off 2,000 employees in the Cariad software unit as part of the latest restructuring intended to right the digital ship. Autoblog reports: Former group CEO Herbert Diess established Car.Software Organization in 2020, eventually renaming it Cariad and giving the task of creating "a uniform software and technology platform for all Volkswagen Group brands." VW's info page on the division says the unit employs roughly 6,000 people around the world, up from roughly 4,500 at the end of 2021. Despite that same page claiming Cariad is building "the leading tech stack for the automotive industry," the failed stacks brought down the division's first CEO in less than a year, then brought down VW Group CEO Diess two years later as problems continued. It then probably played a role in bringing down Audi brand CEO Markus Duesmann and much, if not all, of Audi's Project Trinity when Oliver Blume took over as CEO of the VW Group. It finally took out Cariad's second CEO, Dirk Hilgenberg, over the summer. And aside from the career killing, Cariad's woes have proved problematic for every battery-electric car VW Group launch since the ID.3.
Blume put ex-Bentley production manager Peter Bosch in charge in May. Since then, Bosch has been at work on a reorganization plan to get the software division running as it should so that the software runs as it should, and so that vital products like the Audi Q6 E-Tron and Porsche Macan EV can get out the door as envisioned. Manager Magazin reported that Bosch's plan involves laying off those 2,000 employees over the next 15 months, a step that would rewind back to 2021 staffing levels, but that action needs to be discussed with VW's Works Council as it concerns labor issues. [...] As it awaits its v1.2 VW Group software, Porsche said it's going to move ahead with Google Built-In as an interim solution. More worryingly, Cariad's timetable was meant to have v2.0 out by 2025, when products like the electric Cayman and Boxster are expected, but v2.0 has been buried in favor of a redesign from scratch.
Blume put ex-Bentley production manager Peter Bosch in charge in May. Since then, Bosch has been at work on a reorganization plan to get the software division running as it should so that the software runs as it should, and so that vital products like the Audi Q6 E-Tron and Porsche Macan EV can get out the door as envisioned. Manager Magazin reported that Bosch's plan involves laying off those 2,000 employees over the next 15 months, a step that would rewind back to 2021 staffing levels, but that action needs to be discussed with VW's Works Council as it concerns labor issues. [...] As it awaits its v1.2 VW Group software, Porsche said it's going to move ahead with Google Built-In as an interim solution. More worryingly, Cariad's timetable was meant to have v2.0 out by 2025, when products like the electric Cayman and Boxster are expected, but v2.0 has been buried in favor of a redesign from scratch.
As usual a bunch of incompetent CEOs (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:As usual a bunch of incompetent CEOs (Score:4, Interesting)
2,000 people just lost their jobs.
Why in the world were they employing 2000 people? A software team of that size is not going to succeed. VW should have read Mythical Man Month.
Obamacare was implemented by two dozen states and was a great demonstration of the inverse relationship between team size and success. Those who spent the most had the biggest failures. Oregon spent the most, $300M, and failed. Kentucky spent 1% as much, was ready on day-one, and was widely considered to be the best.
Successful software projects use a small team with prior experience working together, have skin in the game, and are starved of resources so they have no choice but to implement a clean and simple design.
I'm so freaking tired of great man theory
Huh? Who do you think is the "great man" in this story?
Re: As usual a bunch of incompetent CEOs (Score:1, Insightful)
A very small team of competent efficient and efficient people will by definition be insufficiently diverse.
I've been on a few non diverse teams in my career. They were mind blowing experiences: what would normally take 8 hours with a typical, normal, diverse team, took one hour. I'm not exaggerating. So why are non diverse teams frowned upon? I posed this question once to my very liberal, but highly logical friend once, who conceded the fact that non diverse teams are far more efficient. The answer? "T
Full ACK... (Score:2)
... but they were employing 5000 people, or at least trying to do that.
Re: (Score:3)
Why in the world were they employing 2000 people? A software team of that size is not going to succeed.
Are you implying that the only thing required to make software is a software team? Are you that narrow minded / ignorant of how businesses work?
It's not one team (Score:3)
The problem isn't how many employees they have the problem is how poorly they were used.
As for great man theory it's the idea that people at the top are the ones who make everything happen and everyone els
Re: (Score:3)
Re: (Score:2)
One software to rule them all (Score:3)
renaming it Cariad and giving the task of creating "a uniform software and technology platform for all Volkswagen Group brands."
Similar things have been tried at my work, and it didn't go well.
Re: One software to rule them all (Score:3)
Essentially they are trying to transfer their main claim to fame from the construction side, the so called universal Querbausatz, into the software world.
What works so well in saving costs for building the damn cars just HAS to work equally well for the software running the damn things, right? Software does not and must not cost money!
Software is hard (Score:3)
It's especially hard for an older carmaker with limited experience in software
Some executives believe the fantasy that they can simply hire a bunch of people and build a world class dev team overnight
I wish them luck and success and hope they can figure out a successful strategy
Re:Software is hard (Score:5, Insightful)
Volkswagen's software is pretty terrible. My brand new Jetta has a number of random glitches that are very likely due to buggy software. Dash will randomly fail to come out of night mode after leaving the garage, so almost impossible to read in sunlight, only fix is to turn car off and back on again. Until I figured out the reset procedure the whole instrument cluster (including speedometer) would randomly shut off while driving.
The bitch is this didn't need to be computerized, I'd be happy with an analog instrument cluster and manual brightness knob. Not opposed to digital but if you're gonna do it you need to write better software.
Still no update for the system, despite my issue being on radar of NHTSA for over a year, reported by many other consumers, and now they're chopping the software workforce? This shouldn't be allowed in automotive. It's not a buggy video game that annoys you, many of these failures are safety related. They should be compelled to fix them.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Having to do that would piss me the fuck off. I'm not much of a car guy, I drive them into the ground (my last car didn't even have Bluetooth!) but if the features that I paid for on a five digit purchase don't work properly....
Re: Software is hard (Score:4, Interesting)
It goes deeper than that, it is a cultural issue of both VolkswagenGroup and Germany as a whole. The whole magical Mittelstand is overwhelmingly doing some sort of steel or machining or industrial endeavor and they are pretty damn great at it. VWG sources from them all and the (polemic) main and most important figure in manufacturing cars is the SpaltmaÃY, how well do your car body panels and parts fit together? The tighter, the better you have your manufacturing and assembling under control!
Now extrapolate that to a whole industry, and country and schooling and mind of the people, firmly oriented at the SpaltmaÃY, a hardware measurement!
They simply lack the culture and understanding of software. There is no SpaltmaÃY for that! There are not even body panels!
That is way too far outside of the comfort and expertise zone. That is why there are so many horrible and huge software project failures in Germany. They still have not GOT it that it is a different domain, a different reality and thought process. It is not they cannot do it⦠it is, they do not fundamentally understand it. There is no SpaltmaÃY for software.
Six THOUSAND employees? (Score:2)
renaming it Cariad and giving the task of creating "a uniform software and technology platform for all Volkswagen Group brands." VW's info page on the division says the unit employs roughly 6,000 people around the world
How does a business unit set up to develop in-car software employs 6,000 people? Or even 600?
I seem to remember Microsoft had some 2,000 devs and 500 managers working on Windows 7. That's a full OS running on billions of PC with an infinite number of configurations, drivers and software running on them. Let's say Microsoft had 2,500 more employees as overhead in that business unit and that still only 5,000 employees, i.e. less than the number of employees tasked to create embedded software in the controlled
Re: (Score:2)
Why hire 2500 skilled and competent programmers when for the same price you can hire 6000 at an overseas sweat shop?
Re: Six THOUSAND employees? (Score:3, Insightful)
Also, there is a big chance the 200-2000 good devs want ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with VWG, they are more like an overly hierarchical government apparatus or magistrate than a modern, slick and cool company you want to work for if you have options. Even external contractors loathe working for anything software in VWG, and they seem to have a ton of death-marches and other variations on hellish projects.
The big bucks are paid to the top level executives and program managers, you are just a lowly worker drone,
Re: Six THOUSAND employees? (Score:4, Insightful)
Also, there is a big chance the 200-2000 good devs want ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with VWG
Given VW's reputation earned with the Diesel emission fake software, chances are that numerous developers would not like to start writing software for a company where everyday you need to wonder if what you are asked to implement is legal. I mean, if I wanted to write malware for a living, I could also write root kits for Sony or Trojans for FinFisher.
Re: (Score:2)
Boeing is working on developing a real-time version of Linux that will pass DO-178B. That is the smart way to do things.
Re: (Score:2)
Because VW is trying to produce a whole new OS, instead of using one of the open source ones. Boeing is working on developing a real-time version of Linux that will pass DO-178B. That is the smart way to do things.
QNX has an RTOS already certified for that. I guess adding more options is better though.
Car software should be KISS (Score:2)
Keep it simple and straightforward.
You want few lines of code in car control software, not many. I'd say everything over maybe 20k LoC is too much, assuming standard libraries are used for things like OS, graphics, communication. I'm excluding any kind of entertainment system here.
A good engineer can produce 100 high quality LoC per day. So 200 days to write that for *1* engineer. And you'll get a self-consistent system.
I admit I'm a bit oversimplifying here, but 2000 devs is just outrageous.
Re: Car software should be KISS (Score:2)
I am not disagreeing with you, but modern cars have SO much more functionality for comfort and safety and entertainment built it, it boggles the mind. And it is hard to just strip any of it, your competitor has itâ¦
It sounds to me VWG chose a fundamentally flawed approach for SOFTWARE that has served them well in HARDWARE and construction. And nobody told them that idea insane.
Re: Car software should be KISS (Score:4, Insightful)
But they had to have all the secret hooks added to the code so VW could "monetize" the car in various ways.
Example: Do you like heated seats and heated side mirrors? That will be an annual charge of X or a monthly charge of Y.
The added LoC enable the useless functionality to implement that sort of "service", not the actual service of heating seats.
Granted, such a design is useful in various environments. People who live in very warm regions don't need heated seats. And VW probably saves a Euro by building the hardware into every vehicle then making that feature a subscription service to be paid by those customers that really WANT that feature.
But it adds LoC and increased complexity to the vehicle's software.
I bet most of the issue is.... (Score:2)
I bet most of the issue is caused by low-paid off-shored workers creating crap and most of those 2000 to be laid off are probably higher-paid domestic workers.
One company I was at hired out-sourced labor and the output they sent back was pure garbage. But, hey, the company saved thousands of dollars up-front (and lost their asses on the rear).
Re: (Score:2)
Start using facts, not your racism, etc.
VWG Software is pretty bad (Score:3)
Coming from other modern German car makers and how their software and interfaces work, it is really baffling when you sit in one of the many totally interchangeable VolkswagenGroup cars just how bad the menu and software are, and how annoying it feels to interface with the car and the car trying to tell you stuff. They even managed to get the beep wrong, and the UI navigation and interface are a disaster - even more since they swapped everything to the terrible touchscreen-only ideology. And their parking sensors seem to have been made for air craft carrier with how far a distance they indicate as red.
The cars themselves and the platforms donâ(TM)t even drive bad, they just FEEL horrible and annoying.
VWG as a whole just does not do software right.
VW EV car is great... except for the software (Score:2)
I like everything about the ID.4, except for the software.
Every day it asks for the user. Only one is registered. Sigh. Tap. ...
Want to start Carplay (every time, yes). Tap.
Start the Carplay service? Sigh, yes. Tap.
Long Pause.
Failed to start Carplay.
Try again? Yes. Tap.
Long Pause.
etc.
Every night, plug in car to charge.
"Immediate Charging!"
No, dammit!
Go back to driver side. Open door, don't sit (it thinks you want to drive away). Twist in awkwardly around steering wheel, tap screen, select "Charge at selecte
Re: (Score:2)
Same applies for remote. I'm just now trying to tell my car via Seat Connect app (Seat is a brand owned by Volkswagen, they all use the same backend) to start warming up later today.
It's requesting re-login, and after entering credentials, all I get is {"message:":"internal error"}.
Sometimes the remote commands "Start heating" are not going through. Sometimes it's reporting that car is unlocked (it is). And so on...
By the way, tip for that timed charging: I'm not sure if this works with ID.4, but for my Sea
Cariad is still hiring (Score:2)
Hmmmm. So where will the 2000 job cuts come from?