Adobe Exec Compared Creative Cloud Cancellation Fees To 'Heroin' (theverge.com) 34
Early termination fees are "a bit like heroin for Adobe," according to an Adobe executive quoted in the FTC's newly unredacted complaint against the company for allegedly hiding fees and making it too hard to cancel Creative Cloud. The Verge: "There is absolutely no way to kill off ETF or talk about it more obviously" in the order flow without "taking a big business hit," this executive said. That's the big reveal in the unredacted complaint, which also contains previously unseen allegations that Adobe was internally aware of studies showing its order and cancellation flows were too complicated and customers were unhappy with surprise early termination fees.
In a short interview, Adobe's general counsel and chief trust officer, Dana Rao, pushed back on both the specific quote and the FTC's complaint more generally, telling me that he was "disappointed in the way they're continuing to take comments out of context from non-executive employees from years ago to make their case."
In a short interview, Adobe's general counsel and chief trust officer, Dana Rao, pushed back on both the specific quote and the FTC's complaint more generally, telling me that he was "disappointed in the way they're continuing to take comments out of context from non-executive employees from years ago to make their case."
So what is the process now? (Score:5, Insightful)
Then tell us, what is the process now to stop paying for Adobe products? What are the three clicks necessary to make this happen? Are all fees clear and plainly visible?
If they won't give straight answers to these questions, keep going after them.
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It's actually quite simple.
Just don't get on the Adobe rental model....and if you're there, suck it up for the one time pain and get off the adobe teet.
There are now MORE than enough comparable (and at times MORE powerful) alternatives to Adobe products....they don't require a monthly rental fee, you can buy your licenses and only upgrade as needed.
Examples:
Affinity Photo - Photoshop
Affinity Designer - Illustrator
Affinity Publis
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The more I learn about the crapfest that is Adobe's subscription model, the more glad I am that I dumped their products the second that they switched to it.
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What is the process now to stop paying for Adobe products? What are the three clicks necessary to make this happen?
What is the process to buy back your soul from the devil once you sold it?
Answer: There is no way.
So I guess I was right . . . (Score:4, Interesting)
I've had more than a little friction from people over the years because I let 'em know Adobe doesn't work for me. It kept insisting I had to create a free account and sign in to get stuff (and if I misunderstood what I was seeing, that's Adobe's fault for making it complicated not plain). People couldn't understand why I refused to set up a free account - after all, it costs nothing.
It's not the money, it's the lock in - oh, and all the personal information they're trying to harvest along the way (haven't got a clue even if they are, but I think it's safe to assume so).
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"Adobe collects information that identifies you"
"We also disclose information with third parties we engage to process personal information on our behalf"
https://www.adobe.com/privacy/... [adobe.com]
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Yeah, and try using it in a shared environment - one user clicks that link and it fucks up the install for everyone.
Adobe wants everyone converted from free or permanent licenses to ongoing subscriptions, regardless of whether or not it has to behave unethically to force that outcome.
Then change your policy! (Score:5, Funny)
Just. Say. No (Score:4, Insightful)
..to software subscriptions
We need to fight back
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Those "super uber creative pros" who were always telling us Adobe's shitware was
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the end of their monopoly on creative software is neigh.
The designated Grim Reaper for the IT industry is a horse skeleton?
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We can presume you don't play any games on Steam or Xbox or elsewhere, right?
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Firstly steam is not a subscriptions service, I pay $0 to steam on any regular basis. I also do not play or have ever played a game that requires a subscription.
It does have lock in and if they decide to start charging a subscription I may not have the ability to keep the games I "own". That is why I prefer to use GOG, however games are so big now that I can only store a few so I am probably screwed either way.
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I have no problem with a subscription-based service: After all, their computers cost money. I have a problem with the government not enforcing the same truth-in-advertising and contract law on click-through agreements. If (US) corporations had to prove they acted in good faith, a lot of this deceiving, inveigling and obfuscating would disappear.
Some countries do have laws, requiring the steps of a cancellation process to be explained and clearly labelled. The US government, once again, fails to protec
It's a lease?! (Score:4, Interesting)
Monty Python (Score:5, Funny)
Health Inspector: I think it would be more appropriate if the box bore a large red label: warning lark's vomit.
Chocolate Company: But our sales would plummet!
So which is it Dana? (Score:5, Insightful)
First:
Early termination fees are "a bit like heroin for Adobe," according to an Adobe executive quoted ...
Then:
In a short interview, Adobe's general counsel and chief trust officer, Dana Rao, pushed back on both the specific quote and the FTC's complaint more generally, telling me that he was "disappointed in the way they're continuing to take comments out of context from non-executive employees from years ago to make their case."
Can't have it both ways. And if the person quoted was indeed not an executive, then why didn't you address that explicitly rather than just casually slipping that "non-executive" dig in there?
Also Dana, if you're claiming the comments are "out of context", then please feel free to explain the context to us. That way we could better understand how your company isn't scheming and lying in order to continue gouging your captive customer base.
What's that I'm hearing? Crickets? Yeah, that's what I thought.
been sayin' that for years (Score:3)
There are alternatives, but going there takes thinking, work, and a requirement to be open to a different way.. I never met an Adobe addict who would entertain any of those ideas.
Same for all you Microsoft junkies.
As someone who makes software, it goes both ways.. (Score:1)
Yep. Software is no longer a tool. It's a steep slippery slope to *dependency*... with all the negative psychological associations of that word. It's an addiction. Too bad for you. There are alternatives, but going there takes thinking, work, and a requirement to be open to a different way.. I never met an Adobe addict who would entertain any of those ideas. Same for all you Microsoft junkies.
You like bugfixes? You want your software to work when the OS vendor completely changes their permission model and it breaks your previously working software? You want your software to not cause a virus when the 3rd party networking lib it depends on has a vulnerability that needs patching?
I don't know about you, but feeding my family requires money. Not Adobe-level money, but I am not a charity and most of the best software made is not made by charities. Even the open source greats are strategic in
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...unless you want to go find vintage computer hardware and operating systems if you plan on using it in 20 years.
Software doesn't wear out, and if the computer is air-gapped from the network (or the network is air-gapped from the internet), then vulnerability bugs are a non-issue.
As far as vintage hardware goes, I can buy a brand new "legacy" computer rated for Win XP, Win 98, whatever, from Nixsys [nixsys.com]. Brand new components, even with a legacy OS installed. So if I was a creative type wanting to run older, serial# versions of Adobe stuff, the OS and the hardware are also a non-issue.
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Recurring fees? How about recurring value? Adobe is one of the worst offenders on all accounts. Vendor lock in. Ludicrously tight licensing. Straight lying about your options, I would say misleading but that's too ambiguous. They lie. They own their licensees and they abuse them as they see fit.
I mad
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You like bugfixes?
Yes. Unfortunately, Adobe has a LONG track record of either leaving bugs unfixed for years, or fixed but with different issues being added.
You want your software to work when the OS vendor completely changes their permission model and it breaks your previously working software?
Sure! However, that's an argument for waterfall development, where users can decide to stay on N-1 of Windows and N-1 of $SW with the awareness that they will have to upgrade their software if they upgrade their OS.
You want your software to not cause a virus when the 3rd party networking lib it depends on has a vulnerability that needs patching?
Of course not, but that's the sort of patch that should be an expectation for a good amount of time. The developer chose a network lib that had a vulnerabilit
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Because we all know those are the only two options, right? Monthly in perpetuity, or once every 20 years?
Just imagine if some rogue startup would come along with something in between.. Say.. Release a bit of software, agree to support that version for a specific period of time. Perhaps 3 years? 4? A lifecycle, if you will... Maybe they release new versions 6-12 months before they quit supporting the previous version?
Alas, mere mortals could only dream....
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I don't know about you, but feeding my family requires money.
Unless your "family" consists solely of members of the Business Software Alliance, and you're delusional enough to believe that your piddling offering is enough to bulge their already grotesquely bloated bellies, you're full of shit. The cost of an endless subscription with no upper limit on the annual charge is going to quickly out pace whatever amount is necessary to pay your living expenses. Let alone any actual family members.
don't complain about recurring fees. You want your program supported? That's how it has to be
No, it's not. There are other ways. You just refuse to engage with them beca
When Asked (Score:1)
A professional artist compared using Adobe products to having all your work and all its associated value locked up in proprietary file formats that you can't access unless you pay.
There was also a suggestion this was tantamount to copyright infringement, but we all know how hard complex ideas are for average people. Don't we?
How sad, the planet fitness model is backfiring... (Score:2)
I guess maybe now they'll have to work on making better products.
Yeah right, they're gonna resort to other underhanded tactics like making you write them a letter to cancel.
Your PSA for today (Score:2)
Never attempt to do business with a junkie. No good can come of it. They are prone to violence and rarely keep their word.
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+1 Insightful
Cancellation should be a simple choice. (Score:2)
...Not a puzzle room from Uncharted.
Re: Cancellation should be a simple choice. (Score:2)
Unless of course there is an assymetric relationship between parties of the contract. Then of course cancellation should be made as costly or difficult as possible. This is how the X-as-service industry is superior to a Regular Sale contract. It extracts more money from one side of the equation.
Goodby Adobe! (Score:1)
Mission accomplished?...