Volkswagen Announces a Cheap Electric Car to Compete With China (telegraph.co.uk) 102
An anonymous reader shared this report from the Telegraph:
Volkswagen has teased plans for a "China-killer" electric vehicle that will cost just €20,000 ($20,664 USD or £16,700) as the German carmaker gears up to take on a flood of Beijing-backed low-cost rivals. The company on Thursday shared its first images of a new vehicle expected to be called the ID.1, which will go into production from 2027.
The low-cost EV is intended to go head to head with all-electric brands from Chinese carmakers such as BYD, which overtook Tesla in British sales for the first time last month. Previous images of the vehicle suggest it will be an electric hatchback. Thomas Schäfer, the VW chief executive, said the new model would be "an affordable, high-quality, profitable electric Volkswagen from Europe, for Europe". Quentin Willson, the motoring journalist and founder of FairCharge, said the car could be a "possible China EV killer". Dan Caesar, of Electric Vehicles UK, added: "Cheaper EVs are exactly what legacy auto-makers need to be competitive during this critical time. We would expect the ID.1 to be warmly welcomed by motorists." Ginny Buckley, of consumer advice website Electrifying, said Volkswagen had been "clear about its intent to compete with China's low-cost EVs"...
The German carmaker is planning to cut 35,000 jobs by 2030 as it grapples with stalled demand for EVs in Europe and growing competition from Chinese rivals.
Volkswagen executives describe the upcoming EV will be a "true Volkswagen for everyone," according to the article
It also notes that the number of EVs sold across Europe "fell by 3% to 3 million during 2024, according to data from analysts Rho Motion."
The low-cost EV is intended to go head to head with all-electric brands from Chinese carmakers such as BYD, which overtook Tesla in British sales for the first time last month. Previous images of the vehicle suggest it will be an electric hatchback. Thomas Schäfer, the VW chief executive, said the new model would be "an affordable, high-quality, profitable electric Volkswagen from Europe, for Europe". Quentin Willson, the motoring journalist and founder of FairCharge, said the car could be a "possible China EV killer". Dan Caesar, of Electric Vehicles UK, added: "Cheaper EVs are exactly what legacy auto-makers need to be competitive during this critical time. We would expect the ID.1 to be warmly welcomed by motorists." Ginny Buckley, of consumer advice website Electrifying, said Volkswagen had been "clear about its intent to compete with China's low-cost EVs"...
The German carmaker is planning to cut 35,000 jobs by 2030 as it grapples with stalled demand for EVs in Europe and growing competition from Chinese rivals.
Volkswagen executives describe the upcoming EV will be a "true Volkswagen for everyone," according to the article
It also notes that the number of EVs sold across Europe "fell by 3% to 3 million during 2024, according to data from analysts Rho Motion."
China is cheaper (Score:4, Informative)
The only thing holding China back is tariffs.
Re:China is cheaper (Score:5, Insightful)
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Well, that and basically paying their workers peanuts [wagecentre.com].
Re:China is cheaper (Score:5, Insightful)
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This is a bit of a dated perspective. Chinese labor isn't especially low in 2025, that's mostly propaganda.
China has 'light touch' regulations and a simpler tax structure. The chinese government would be considered to subsidize these companies by western economics, but mostly they've removed most tax hurdles and through CCP 'integration' into companies reduces the component prices between the companies. 'everything is a comodity' in China and compenents are priced like they were a comodity.
It's a huge mi
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You really seem to have drunk the CCP koolaid. No one claimed that was the sole reason for China's success, I pointed out that slave labour (Uyghurs and others) would also generally reduce the cost of goods in China which will also reduce costs for businesses not directly connected. https://www.walkfree.org/globa... [walkfree.org]
Not enough replacement labour seems questionable given the unemployment stories particularly in youth.
Re: China is cheaper (Score:4, Insightful)
Are they paid peanuts by Chinese standards? Itâ(TM)s cheaper country after all.
Incidentally, US made cars include a large premium for the private healthcare costs that the manufacturers have to pay for for their employees. Itâ(TM)s a competitive disadvantage compared with other first world countries. Thatâ(TM)s a choice by Americans to not have universal healthcare. I once read that for GM, for example, that itâ(TM)s $1,500 per car.
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Universal healthcare probably wouldn't work in the US because the real problem is that the US government just let companies buy each other until there's a monopoly/duopoly/regional monopolies.
The medical care is already 30% of the US government budget as it is, and it is what it is.
Re: China is cheaper (Score:2)
Re: China is cheaper (Score:2)
Taxes would be higher (and spread further and perhaps more fairly), but the admin overhead would be lower. So, cheaper overall and not included in the cost of products.
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Wow, that's one hell of a hand wave assumption
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More people would receive treatment and survive conditions that would otherwise be terminal without treatment. This would lead to more people lingering on with chronic conditions and needing future care related or unrelated to what would have killed them.
Some of these treatments and followup supportive care can be very very expensive.
Savings from admin overhead would be more than erased by more people getting better access to services.
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Most ineffective in the world? Only if you completely ignore the existence of about 150-160 countries. This is why we in the US so often cannot take Europeans seriously. You are always comparing yourselves to some hyperbolic image of the average American that includes the worst attributes from a very large and diverse country.
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There's also another mandatory employer contribution that doesn't have a direct analogue in the west - basically a contribution toward an employee's home loan.
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All the others. Countries subsidise EVs on the consumption side, not the production side. Tesla didn't get a money for every car made, they got a tax credit for every car sold. To be fair China *also* did this.
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All the others. Countries subsidise EVs on the consumption side, not the production side. Tesla didn't get a money for every car made, they got a tax credit for every car sold. To be fair China *also* did this.
China subsized production by giving direct money for R&D, for EV components and materials, and for investment shares of companies. Additionally corporate tax rates were decreased for EV companies, and they were given low-interest loans, land, and electricity. These subsidies totaled tens of billions of dollars. More importantly, they were given more than 10 years ago to a nascent industry that otherwise would not have made the same breathtaking progress.
Those billions were in addition to the tens of
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And everyone moans about this, but this is just a sensible and strategic active industrial policy, ie investing in the future. They got it right, and Western governments were oblivious and screwed the pooch (or actively antithetical due to OEMs acting as vested interests instead of skating to where the puck was going, plus cultural war imbecilities).
God knows, it's not like Western governments have refused to pursue active industrial policies of their own in the past. That's how we have the fossil fuel and
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There are a lot of companies in Europe that make the equivalent of buggy whips. Parts of the drivetrain that don't exist in an EV. Japan is the same, which is one of the reasons why they have tried to stick with hybrids and make hydrogen happen.
The Chinese decided to go all in on EVs early, and didn't worry too much about fossil fuel drivetrain manufacturers. They were just expected to pivot.
Re: China is cheaper (Score:2)
China didnâ(TM)t expect their manufacturers to pivot because their car industry was then much smaller and less invested in ICE. A modern ICE engine is a remarkable feat of engineering, and a lot has gone into refining it into what it now is. Those were huge investments and a huge moat if you were a traditional car manufacturer or component supplier. China didnâ(TM)t have that much to protect so could leapfrog the ICE era.
Western government should have seen the writing on the wall and also helped t
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China is cheaper because of CCP directly and indirectly subsidizes EV production.
Like with carbon credits that subsidizes Tesla?
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Is that what BYD did?
Re:China is cheaper (Score:4, Informative)
China is cheaper because of CCP directly and indirectly subsidizes EV production.
Not really, western auto makers are still pissing about with ICE power trains, over designing vehicles, trying to reuse old factories, they spreading the production all over the place seemingly mostly motivated by where they get the biggest tax breaks for each factory and while doing all of this they still use a lot of contractors spread out all over the place. This results in grossly over priced cars but that's OK, the cost can be offloaded on the consumer. According to the EU companies like BYD get no more subsidies than European or US car manufacturers do. What makes Chinese cars cheaper is that they make as many components as possible themselves, they make them in the same location and vertically integrate the entire supply chain right from the Lithium mines through the shipping operations and up to delivery to the dealer's lot. Another big factor is efficiently designed modern extensively automated factories, assembly lines and efficiently designed vehicles. The Chinese secret sauce to automobile manufacture is basically just re-discovering what Henry Ford did where as much as possible of the entire car manufacturing was put in one place and then they made a 21's century version of it. It also doesn't hurt that Chinese EV's when compared to the European and US competition look like Samsung's lates smartphone next to a Nokia 3310.
Re:China is cheaper (Score:4, Informative)
Actually according to the EU BYD has been subsidised on international sales to the tune of 17% which is why BYD has as 17% tariff applied on its imports.
Certainly it's not the 100% numbers that the Trump nutjobs are quoting, but the EU recognised that China did prop up production of its cars even for international markets and applied tariffs accordingly. It varied based on the company and isn't a fixed blanked tariff.
Re:China is cheaper (Score:5, Insightful)
Actually according to the EU BYD has been subsidised on international sales to the tune of 17% which is why BYD has as 17% tariff applied on its imports.
Certainly it's not the 100% numbers that the Trump nutjobs are quoting, but the EU recognised that China did prop up production of its cars even for international markets and applied tariffs accordingly. It varied based on the company and isn't a fixed blanked tariff.
There is a 17.0% subsidy tariff for BYD, 18.8% for Geely and 35.3% for SAIC, and on top of that you pay an import duty of 10%. So I mixed up the standard import with the subsidy tariff. Not that what BYD gets in terms of subsidies is any different from the litany of subsidies that European and US car maker have gotten for decades so westerners whining about China subsidising auto makers as if Western governments don't do that is hypocritical in the extreme.
Re:China is cheaper (Score:4, Informative)
Actually it is different. The numbers here do not account for the subsidies given to domestic car production in China for the Chinese market which very much is the same as what was given by any other country to any other car company. There's a difference between local subsidies to sell cars locally, tax benefits and rebates to the purchaser, and subsidising cars destined for export to 3rd countries.
In China the latter is happening and the tariffs cover those cases accordingly depending on the company. VW wasn't being subsidised by the EU to produce cars destined for China. But Geely very much was being subsidised by China to produce cars destined for the EU. That's the whole point of contention between production based subsidies and sales based subsidies.
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Actually it is different. The numbers here do not account for the subsidies given to domestic car production in China for the Chinese market which very much is the same as what was given by any other country to any other car company. There's a difference between local subsidies to sell cars locally, tax benefits and rebates to the purchaser, and subsidising cars destined for export to 3rd countries.
In China the latter is happening and the tariffs cover those cases accordingly depending on the company. VW wasn't being subsidised by the EU to produce cars destined for China. But Geely very much was being subsidised by China to produce cars destined for the EU. That's the whole point of contention between production based subsidies and sales based subsidies.
Domestic production subsides in China don't really matter in the context of what Chinese cars cost in Europe, and I don't really see a difference between local subsidies, tax benefits, rebates, and subsidies, they are all basically subsidies to the Chinese manufacturer and Western car makers enjoy those too. That leaves export subsidies in China as the only outstanding subsidies issue and since those are the reason for the EU tariffs that evens out. Furthermore VW is 200 billion EUR debt so if they are eith
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Domestic production subsides in China don't really matter in the context of what Chinese cars cost in Europe
That was my point. China doesn't just apply subsidies for domestic production. They directly fund producing cheaper cars for foreign markets in order to dominate a market.
That is something you can do providing you are a) a private company, and b) do not have a monopoly position since that would fall afoul of antitrust laws, but if you get a government involved (as the EU investigation showed) then tariffs are the correct answer.
Not all subsidies are the same. The question is not about the manufacturer, but
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Wrong. BYD according to the EU was given $3.4B in subsidies. Meanwhile Germany e.g. subsidized e.g. VW, and not e.g. it's EVs but also its ICE cars giving 10s of billions.
https://www.dw.com/en/germany-... [dw.com]
When did I deny the fact that the EU also subsidised ICE tech? in fact when the German government bails out VW's 200 billion euro debt burden they will absolutely be bailing out the entirety of VW's long and pitiful history of ICE tech failures.
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Not really, western auto makers are still pissing about with ICE power trains
Indeed my next BMW will still have an ICE powertrain, otherwise I'd have to keep my current one forever. Fortunately I expect they will be building them for a while yet.
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China is cheaper because of CCP directly and indirectly subsidizes EV production.
That's only part of the story. Yes there is direct and indirect subsidy for EV production. This was very closely investigated by the EU and commensurate tariffs applied. These were in the range of around 11-30%. Even with those tariffs now in place Chinese cars are still cheaper.
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Cheaper and better. Great drivetrains and batteries. Exceeding German luxury quality and quietness, for a fraction of the price. Stuff like double glazed windows and massage seats as standard. Even the infotainment has got decent, or at least as decent as automotive ones get, and of course we have Android Auto now so it's not all that critical.
It's a very bad situation for us. We are going to have to pay ridiculous prices for our cars, just to prop up our failing automakers, because they sure as hell can't
Well yes, but so does Germany (Score:2)
China subsidizes domestic EV sales a bit more than Germany subsidizes domestic car sales. Yes subsidizes in China are a bit higher, but only about twice as much as Germany... for a much bigger country.
Re: China is cheaper (Score:2)
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China is cheaper because of CCP directly and indirectly subsidizes EV production.
Germany also subsidises it's car industry... so does the US or have your forgotten the billions paid to keep GM and Ford afloat... the big difference is that Germany and China are subsidising for a profit, not just to keep the whole thing from toppling over.
IMHO, this is not a bad thing, government supporting an industry that is bringing in billions and keeping thousands employed. It's what a government should be doing.
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The only thing holding China back is tariffs.
Well, let's imagine the tariffs on Chinese EVs went *poof* and now you can get BYD cars in America. First, you've still got people who would never be caught dead in an EV, regardless of how inexpensive it is. Then you've got people who wouldn't buy them because they're afraid it will fall apart like that RGQZTS doorknob they bought from Amazon. Finally, you've got the typical American car buyer who isn't interested in anything that can't haul 8 kids to soccer practice and all the luggage for their trip t
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
First, you've still got people who would never be caught dead in an EV, regardless of how inexpensive it is.
We call such people: "virtue-signalling idiots". That's a small enough population, regardless of how much sewage Fox News pumps into peoples' brains.
Then you've got people who wouldn't buy them because they're afraid it will fall apart like that RGQZTS doorknob they bought from Amazon.
Warranty exists. And it's not like Ford or GM had any issues with selling turds before. Just add a bit more Superbowl ads.
Finally, you've got the typical American car buyer who isn't interested in anything that can't haul 8 kids to soccer practice and all the luggage for their trip to Disney World.
Hmm... I can get TWO electric cars for the price of one gas car. Maybe I should do that! Oh, and Ozempic is going to solve the problem that Americans are pretty well approximated by spheres.
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Actually did that in 2023. We realized we could buy a Chevy Bolt (EV) and a Subaru Outback Wilderness (ICE, for off-road) for nearly exactly the price of a single Jeep Wrangler Hybrid. Now we have a super-low-cost-to-run commuter vehicle and an occasional-use outback vehicle. And two vehicles for the odd situation we need two simultaneously.
Re:China is cheaper (Score:4, Interesting)
The 45 kWh BYD Dolphin starts at 30k Euro here. Without tariffs it would be competitive ... but only competitive. Even without tariffs basic models of Inster and Citroen eC3 would be cheaper.
It's pretty crazy they sell them under 10k in China, but that doesn't really help here.
Why the huge discrepancy? (Score:2)
Re:Why the huge discrepancy? (Score:5, Informative)
Where does the extra 20K Euro go?
People always drag out the basics trim prices for the entry level Chinese market Dolphin. For one thing the price in China for the basic trim Dolphin is around 14000 euro, not 10000 EUR, that price is for entry level the Dolphin Mini which is a different car. The price difference goes towards all kinds of things starting with bigger batteries, 10% import duty, sales tax, the car is made to European safety standards, there are transport costs, the cost of maintaining a supply chain overseas is higher, the overseas version has all kinds of bells and whistles the cheapest Chinese version does not have. For example you get driving assist, all kinds of proximity sensors, a 360 degree parking camera system at all trim levels that you don't get in European/Japenese/Korean/US made cars except at the luxury trim level and the Android infotainment system is AFAIK not offered in the cheapest Chinese versions. On top of that the cheaper oft talked about Chinese version of the BYD Dolphin only has a 32 kWh battery. The European BYD Dolphin version, at least in my part of Europe is exclusively offered with a 60 kwh battery in the entry level version since dealers to not bother with trying to sell not the 32 kWh battery version and sometimes not even the 45kwh either, they concentrate entirely on the 60 kWh version. All of that combines into a car that is significantly more expensive that 14000 EUR, even in China, to a large extent because of the 60 kWh battery. Thus the price difference is not anywhere near as stark as he makes it out to be.
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In the UK we have SAIC cards under the MG brand. Under £20k for an MG5, with a ~250 mile range, estate shape (I think they call them station wagons in the US), and lots of nice features like autopilot as standard.
That's about 24,000 Euro, for comparison.
They are well established in the UK, with a network of dealers/service centres.
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You're right, absolutely massive discounts on MG5 at the moment here too.
Hadn't seen it, they are selling a station wagon well below the price BYD is selling a mini-compact.
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Don't know about the eC3, but the eC4 I have is a piece of shit and as soon as the leasing contract runs out, I will return it and never ever get a car made by Citroen and probably by Stellantis generally (the Peugeot e208 I had previously was better, but still shit).
Re: China is cheaper (Score:2)
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An apparently very common defect - the charger died. Took Peugeot two months to replace it despite how how often that happens. Also a way too small windshield that resulted in bad visibility upwards and to the sides. Some functionality like the blind spot warner only started working after several resets. The satnav was crap and often showed position that was off by dozens of meters. Very slow firmware updates and only a 3G modem making the app useless in a country that had switched off 3G years ago.
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If that's the case, where is the flood of good and inexpensive Chinese EVs in Europe? I haven't seen it yet. There are some Chinese cars in the usual price range for EVs, that is >30.000 Euros. That's not cheap.
In contrast there are some very few cheapish EVs by European car makers (in particular Dacia (owned by Renault), Citroën) which are (partially) built in China. And I would not call the Dacia Spring "good", just acceptable under some conditions.
Re: haha (Score:2)
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True.
We hope to see more of 15k EVs.
Re: haha (Score:2)
I'd buy that tomorrow if it was available in the US. It would be perfect for my commute. Only allowed to have SUVs and larger at $30k and up over here.
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If you can travel to Mexico you can buy it under the name Renault Kwid, base price 375,000 MXN (~18,200 USD). https://www.renault.com.mx/aut... [renault.com.mx] The catch is it's made in China so you'd have to add the tariffs.
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Wrong link. Correct link for the EV version: https://www.renault.com.mx/aut... [renault.com.mx]
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It likely can’t be registered because the government hasn’t done any safety testing. Which is why I see micro Japanese trucks for sale now.
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US Government doesn't really do safety testing. It's more that the company hasn't done the paperwork, including 3rd party safety testing, for legal importation into the USA. And the vehicles aren't old enough to be imported under that loophole.
Now, individuals and individual companies can import a handful for special purpose/testing reasons, but that's a lot of fees for the importing party.
For the European market (Score:4, Interesting)
This EV likely won't see the light of day in America. Our least expensive EV will likely be the soon-to-be-relaunched Chevy Bolt EUV, which is expected to be somewhere around $30k MSRP, since the Equinox EV starts at $35k.
Re:For the European market (Score:4, Insightful)
If VW tried to release that vehicle in the US, it would probably get a 50% protectionist tariff slapped on it.
"Protecting" the US automakers from cheap foreign EV competition seemed to be one of the few things that the Trump and Biden administrations agreed on.
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If VW tried to release that vehicle in the US, it would probably get a 50% protectionist tariff slapped on it.
Why would VW release an EV in the USA? You have no place to charge it now that Trump is trying to block the installation of new chargers.
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Why would VW release an EV in the USA? You have no place to charge it now that Trump is trying to block the installation of new chargers.
Don't forget the average american is morbidly obese and can't fit into a small car. They can only fit into a hummer or lifted pick up truck. Having a vehicle seven times the weight of a sedan EV sort of defeats the purpose of an EV. There are no self-service EV stations either. You expect american Shamu to get out of a lifted truck every 5 blocks to recharge their 7 ton EV?
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They won't even try. The smallest EV they sell in NA is the ID.4, which is like $60K CDN (I assume around 40 US?).
I have some hope for the re-launched electric Golf whenever they get around to those.
VW like others could assemble it here (Score:2)
The US has other foreign-owned brands like BMW it manufactures in the US. German tire and transmission (ZF) makers have been here for years.
Selling in the US does not just mean imports.
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This EV likely won't see the light of day in America.
Not according to this article I found:
https://electrek.co/2025/02/05... [electrek.co]
Our least expensive EV will likely be the soon-to-be-relaunched Chevy Bolt EUV, which is expected to be somewhere around $30k MSRP, since the Equinox EV starts at $35k.
The first edition of Chevy bolt was a bit handicapped for not supporting DC fast charging as standard equipment. Originally DCFC was an additional cost option but I expect that to be standard equipment as GM adopts NACS across all their EV models.
I know a family that owns a Chevy Bolt and apparently they've been pleased with it since GM fixed the battery fire issue. They've been charging with the included L1 charger cord so far and I
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This EV likely won't see the light of day in America. Our least expensive EV will likely be the soon-to-be-relaunched Chevy Bolt EUV, which is expected to be somewhere around $30k MSRP, since the Equinox EV starts at $35k.
The irony is, the average American car is already large and heavy, so an ideal starting point for electrification. Europeans tend to prefer smaller cars, which tends to limit the amount of batteries you can stuff under the floor and still have a car that is drivable and easy to park.
You got my attention... (Score:3, Informative)
The links provided gave me gibberish on one computer and a paywall on another. However, I did find a link to a news article that I can actually read and appears relevant: https://electrek.co/2025/02/05... [electrek.co]
From that fine article:
For those in the US, donâ(TM)t get too excited. The new entry-level EV likely wonâ(TM)t make the trip overseas. Shafer described the model as â an affordable, high-quality, and profitable electric Volkswagen from Europe for Europe.â
Well, that's disappointing for me as I live in the USA. I'd be willing to buy a BEV with a range of at least 150 miles if available for the right price, especially if it offers vehicle-to-load capability as I could use it as a battery pack on wheels for camping, power outages at home, work out in remote areas, and perhaps more. I'd keep my 4x4 SUV for when the snow is deep and such but I'd happily drive a BEV for the right price, assuming I can comfortably fit my 6'5" 200+ pound body in the driver's seat. I've driven imported vehicles before as loaners and rentals and apparently Americans are on average quite taller and heavier than people overseas. Maybe they need more McDonald's and Starbucks so their growth isn't stunted. Canadians are apparently an exception, likely because they are not technically "overseas" from the USA. They look to be similarly tall and wide as Americans. Maybe from consuming all those Canadian geese and plenty of maple syrup.
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I've driven imported vehicles before as loaners and rentals and apparently Americans are on average quite taller and heavier than people overseas.
Heavier, maybe - but quite a few European countries are taller than us on average.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org] (note that the table is sortable by column)
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Heavier, maybe - but quite a few European countries are taller than us on average.
How many of them export cars to the USA? BMW comes to mind but after that I'm drawing a blank.
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Fiat?
Now you're just making up words. ;^)
Seriously though I see that Fiat is out of Italy and Italians are on the average about the same height as Americans, possibly shorter, so perhaps not any better than any other import for fitting Americans inside.
I remember going shopping for a new-to-me vehicle and telling the used car salesman that I had two requirements for what I was looking for, 4WD and no sunroof. 4WD because my neighborhood is the last to get plowed after a big snowfall. No sunroof because experie
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Canada misses out on a lot of affordable European vehicles because our auto laws are aligned more or less with American ones. I'm pretty sure that's 100% deliberate - any car less than 15 years old must be in compliance with the Motor Vehicle Safety Act. For some suspicious reason, that's only American-made cars.
"true Volkswagen for everyone" (Score:5, Funny)
a "true Volkswagen for everyone,"
Does that mean it's a "Volks-Volkswagen"?
Re:"true Volkswagen for everyone" (Score:5, Funny)
I dunno, check with their department of redundancy department.
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a "true Volkswagen for everyone,"
Does that mean it's a "Volks-Volkswagen"?
VW = VolksWanker.
if they are smart (Score:1)
if they are smart, it will be a rebadged Geely exported from Germany to avoid tariffs.
Choices (Score:1)
Volkswagen has teased plans for a "China-killer" electric vehicle that will cost just â20,000 ($20,664 USD or £16,700) as the German carmaker gears up to take on a flood of Beijing-backed low-cost rivals. The company on Thursday shared its first images of a new vehicle expected to be called the ID.1, which will go into production from 2027.
The low-cost EV is intended to go head to head with all-electric brands from Chinese carmakers such as BYD, which overtook Tesla in British sales for the first time last mont
After recent developments a Tesla swasticar is now out of the question for large portion of western market.
China sentiments seems to be diminishing throughout Europe.
Among these three Volkswagen seems to be in the better position from a brand perspective to gain market share throughout Europe.
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"China sentiments seems to be diminishing throughout Europe."
And not just in Europe, in the Western Hemisphere, China has been putting money into all kinds of projects, even the Bahamas. And with la Presidenta pulling the rug out from USAID, many other countries will now turn to China. America First!! Don't forget, the U.S. is a )_*)&*^% Christian Nation.
China is only cheaper (Score:2)
And of co
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This is a stupid and inaccurate understanding of Chinese EVs. For a start, the range of EVs made in China is exceptionally broad, from dirt cheap microcars up to super premium SUVs and sports cars. Second, at every price point, the quality is better than the equivalent offerings from most Western OEMs: in terms of cabin, tech fitted, fit and finish, etc. Third, the subsidies that mattered in China were the strategic investment subsidies that were used to spark the market between one and two decades ago.
At l
Re: China is only cheaper (Score:3)
VW abandoned its EV powertrain (Score:4, Funny)
e-UP (Score:2)
I doubt they will hit the 20k price with the id.1. Dacia Spring (which is a much worse vehicle than the e-UP but is actually selling now) is 20k.
VW's biggest competitor in Europe are not the chinese, but it's own subsidiaries like Skoda and Seat, which for the last 1
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There's definitely a weird kind of narrative that's developed in European discussions of EVs, along the lines of "why did the OEMs make all those big heavy costly premium SUV EVs first, they should have done small light cheap cars?", which kinda ignores the first decade of EVs: the Leaf, the Twizy, the Zoe, the e-Up, then the e208 etc.
I've seen it especially in relation to Renault 5 reviews, which have all been saying that the car is an incredible achievement. As one of the many tens of thousands of owners
JUST BUILD IT (Score:2)
The reason that these car companies fail is because they could easily build a $20,000 electric car, but they donâ(TM)t.
They pitch it, they promise it, they advertise it, but they never deliver it.
A company like Volkswagen, which essentially carries the resources of the entire German state behind it could easily do this. All they have to do is build it.
EVs sold across Europe fell by 3% [] during 2024 (Score:2)
'number of EVs sold across Europe "fell by 3% to 3 million during 2024'
This was because Germany (roughly the EV largest market) ended subsidies in Dec 2023 causing a significant drop there.. Sales grew in many countries including France, UK, Netherlands.
VW quality (Score:2)
I don't know what VW sells in the rest of the world, but going by Consumer Reports, they have among the worst reliability in the US. The Chinese cars also have poor reliability in China apparently, so maybe VW can make inroads, but I doubt it without German government subsidy.
How is $20k cheap? (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
£16,700 is more than I've ever paid for a car, and I've bought a couple new. I wouldn't say this price is for everyone.
Probably not serviceable (Score:2)
Let me guess (Score:2)
The cars will require an internet connection. Without it, many traditionally standard features won't work. With it, advertising will be served whether the occupants want it or not. Features such as heated seats will require a subscription - don't pay, and they'll freeze your ass. Also, you can kiss your privacy goodbye, suckah!
Of course, the way things are going, the same things will be true of much more expensive cars. So maybe these Volkswagens will be a good deal after all - unless planned obsolescence h