Air Travel Set for Biggest Overhaul in 50 Years With UN-Backed Digital Credentials (theguardian.com) 95
The International Civil Aviation Organization plans to eliminate boarding passes and check-ins within three years through a new "digital travel credential" system. Passengers will store passport data on their phones and use facial recognition to move through airports, while airlines will automatically detect arrivals via biometric scanning.
The system will dynamically update "journey passes" for flight changes and delays, potentially streamlining connections. "The last upgrade of great scale was the adoption of e-ticketing in the early 2000s," said Valerie Viale from travel technology company Amadeus, who noted passenger data will be deleted within 15 seconds at each checkpoint to address privacy concerns.
The system will dynamically update "journey passes" for flight changes and delays, potentially streamlining connections. "The last upgrade of great scale was the adoption of e-ticketing in the early 2000s," said Valerie Viale from travel technology company Amadeus, who noted passenger data will be deleted within 15 seconds at each checkpoint to address privacy concerns.
Phones mandatory? (Score:2, Interesting)
Do not want!
I always print boarding passes. I don't store sensitive data on my phone. It has no idea I have a bank account, for example.
And what about children? A kid who's too young for a phone can scan a boarding pass now.
will all airports have free WIFI? will this app be (Score:3)
will all airports have free WIFI? will this app be 100% off line?
Free Phones? (Score:2)
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Local grocery store actually has a rack of free smartphones for people who don't own one. Or maybe for people who just don't want to install the store's intrusive app. The free smartphones can then be inserted into a little holder on some of the shopping carts.
However it's a "premium" upscale store and the prices are higher, so I don't shop there often. Not interested in how the "smart" shopping is supposed to work, though vaguely curious about the anti-theft precautions. Presumably each phone must trigger
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Re: Phones mandatory? (Score:1)
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Re: Phones mandatory? (Score:2)
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Most airlines have an unaccompanied minor program where staffers will escort the kid and make sure they get to where they need to go and handed off to a designated guardian at the destination.
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In three years... (Score:2)
Hardly anyone will be traveling by air anyway.
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Re: In three years... (Score:2)
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Hardly anyone will be traveling by air anyway.
Unless the tariffs are still in place, then it'll be *way* cheaper to fly half way around the world to India or China, buy an iPhone there and smuggle it back into the U.S. up your butt -- like Mega Seeds [fandom.com]. iPhone mules will be ranked by how many they can smuggle at once (and chargers will, of course, be extra).
Yea, right. (Score:5, Insightful)
Data at each checkpoint deleted within 15 seconds....bullshit. Everything will be logged and used to build a profile of your movements. If it doesn't do it at the get-go, some incident will happen that will be used to justify the change.
Re:Yea, right. (Score:5, Funny)
I believe it. What good does it do to have the records spread across checkpoints all over the world? They'll keep all the records at the central scrutinizer.
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What makes you think this is an expansion? They already have all this data.
Many countries' passports have had biometric data on an RFID chip for over a decade now. My passport has it, I just touch it against the scanner at the immigration gates and a camera compares the data on it to my face. Your ticket and passport are used to go through the airport, all logged I'm sure.
For foreigners, many countries require fingerprints at the border now. Japan, South Korea, and China all do.
I'm sure all the cameras in t
Wonderful (Score:5, Insightful)
Passengers will store passport data on their phones and use facial recognition to move through airports, while airlines will automatically detect arrivals via biometric scanning.
So you'll have to have a smart phone to fly, that U.S. Border Control can search (or seize) for whatever reason, and surrender biometric/facial data and have even less privacy -- which, yes, I understand is reduced in this setting anyway.
Uh huh, sure.
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To get biometric/facial data, they only need to make a photo of you. Or two.
Of all my travel issues (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Of all my travel issues (Score:4, Insightful)
Of all my travel issues, boarding passes have never been one.
This, of course, isn't about you, or us ...
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Indeed. I'm not sure what exactly is the problem with the current boarding passes. Most people these days seem to be using their phones for it already, showing the blob of pixels to a card reader. For long-haul trips, I prefer a hard, printed copy myself in case I happen to drop/break my phone or it runs out of battery just at the wrong moment. But what's the supposed advantage here? Skipping ID check at the gate by agents? When boarding planes, especially for long haul, the ID checks have *never* been the
Re: Of all my travel issues (Score:2)
would-be dicators everywhere... (Score:5, Interesting)
including the sort who regularly attend the UN, all dream of the day when everybody on the planet will have to always carry a digital tracking device (cell phone with GPS and apps) which will be tied to a digital wallet, digital ID, and digital citizenship and travel documents. This will make ANYBODY trackable, oppressable, silenceable, cancelable, suppressable, etc.
Haven't been a "good boy" (in the view of your local dictator), well then no food, clothing, shelter, travel, lawyer, medical care, etc for you (your money instantly made worthless with a keystroke) and your identity erased (your passport and ID voided with a keystroke) and your ability to go anywhere eliminated.
This is a step into the darkest future humanity could ever imagine. People need to cling to, and demand their governments support, PAPER documents and anonymous untraceable PAPER and COIN money. It's fine to enable people to CHOOSE to have images of their documents in their phones and have authorities offer people the OPTION to show their paper that way when traveling etc, and fine to enable people to CHOOSE to have and use credit/debit cards and the OPTION to pay using them, but for basic human freedom to continue to exist, the all-digital push must be squelched.
Re:would-be dicators everywhere... (Score:5, Interesting)
<Mr Fun at Parties shows self out>
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There are plenty of "sky scrapers" in Bangkok where you can not use the elevators without facial recognition.
You get a one time key card, a specific elevator "number" is called for you, it RFC or NFC reads your keycard and opens when it sees your face. Or starts moving when you are inside and look at the screen in front of you. Except for an emergency button, there are no controls. It stops at the floor, the security guard programmed.
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Yeah, but they aren't obligatory. You can live your life without going there.
This is different, they're telling you you either accept whatever shit they throw at you or you can't travel.
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Haven't been a "good boy" (in the view of your local dictator), well then no food, clothing, shelter, travel, lawyer, medical care, etc for you (your money instantly made worthless with a keystroke) and your identity erased (your passport and ID voided with a keystroke) and your ability to go anywhere eliminated.
To be fair they can (and do) do such things even if you don't own a cell phone.
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They can steal it. A few years ago a Japanese actor flew into the US with $400k in cash, legally earned, and this was stolen by the US government at the border. For all practical purposes, it was invalidated for him.
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Manifesto destiny (Score:2)
I thought it said UK at first (Score:2)
That at least would have been interesting but the UN is a toothless hag well past her time with no legal say on anything important.
The real solution (Score:5, Insightful)
Is to allow passengers to buy tickets without providing their name. I should be allowed to buy a plane ticket anonymously just like when I buy grocery or food at the restaurant. Only airport security / customs should have my passeport and my real name. Airlines shouldn't have access to that information, and this way I should be allowed to sell my plane ticket to anybody else if I want to. Just like I am allowed to resell my phone or my bus ticket.
Re:The real solution (Score:4, Informative)
Airlines ask for your personal and passport information for multiple reasons:
- They want to make sure that you have the right to travel to your destination. If you cannot enter the country of your destination, it is on them to return you to your origin and that costs money so that they want to avoid this situation by checking your elligibility upfront.
- Similarly, they want to check your details against any no-fly lists, including airline-specific ban lists if you misbehaved in the past.
- Many countries require advanced passanger information to be submitted by the airline. This is to screen incoming passangers for offences, connections to criminal acvitiy, prior convictions or simply being a person of interest for any reason.
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-In case of an accident, they need to be able to identify the deceased/missing.
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They want to make sure that you have the right to travel to your destination. If you cannot enter the country of your destination, it is on them to return you to your origin
Nope. They drop you off and you're on your own. Heck, even with valid credentials, the destination country can still reject you. Even if I buy your argument that they want to verify that you're allowed to enter the destination country, they can ask you to show credentials just before you board the plane. No need for them to store *any* information about you.
Re: The real solution (Score:3)
Not the way laws in most countries are written. Typically the airline is responsible for transporting you back if they didnâ(TM)t validate your identity prior to departure.
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It is lengthly regulated by ICAO and IATA that it is the company that brought you in that takes you back. They will probably seek reimbursement of their expenses from you after that.
IATA/CONTROL Authorities Working Group GUIDELINES FOR THE REMOVAL OF INADMISSIBLE PERSONS Version 3.0 12 May 2011
3.NOTIFICATION CONCERNING FINDINGS OF INADMISSIBILITY
3.2 When a person is found inadmissible, the State should notify the aircraft operator [...]
3.4 When requiring the responsible Aircraft Operator to effect the remov
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Nope. They drop you off and you're on your own.
That is wrong. They have carry you home. Unless they can prove they have no free seats in a reasonable time frame.
Then the national carrier of the country you "offended" will bring you back where you came from.
You can be happy if they make no fun about you, and fly you first class.
they can ask you to show credentials just before you board the plane That is what they are doing.
that is downright false/wrong (Score:1)
Airline can be heavily fined if they transport somebody which is ineligible for transport. That is somebody on no fly list for example. it isn't just a "drop off". They have to check against the no fly list, and IIRC they have to check for visa if there is no waiver with the country.
it is not "want to" it is *forced to* (Score:1)
Now granted, in shithole 3rd world country with tin pot dictator like the US, where you have zero privacy right to your data (except california), maybe the
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That's how it used to be.
Then, assholes.
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Indeed. Stroy of the human races since forever: Too many assholes. And it reauitres only a relatively small number of them (and a lot of clueless sheep) to mess things up.
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The surveillance-fascists do not want that. Even train travel in Europe gets more difficult if you do not want to provide your identity. The airlines go along with this, because it allows them to sell some extra tickets.
You just need a second burner phone ... (Score:1)
So you'll have to have a smart phone to fly, that U.S. Border Control can search (or seize) for whatever reason, and surrender biometric/facial data and have even less privacy -- which, yes, I understand is reduced in this setting anyway.
No. You just need a second burner phone, One for whoever you are cheating with. And a second for customs.
Which is sort of inline with computer security. You don't travel with your real work/personal computer. You have something recently wiped with only the info you need. Maybe just a Chromebook you log into the "border patrol" account. Sort of the same thing with the phone.
Bad news for the trade in market.
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I've never had my phone or computer searched by a border patrol and neither have you.
I've been ordered to pull out my laptop and turn it on. I can't remember if they made me log in, or just wanted to see "something" displayed on the screen.
My phone used to be carried in checked luggage, turned off, so I don't know if that was searched. Now it's frowned upon to put anything with a battery in your checked luggage, so if you have a phone, it *must* be carried with you. Cellular roaming costs a fortune with my provider, so it's usually easier to just buy a cheap dumbphone when I land, especial
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Because everyone knows you can't pack a working computer with C4 [wikipedia.org].
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>I've been ordered to pull out my laptop and turn it on. I can't remember if they made me log in, or just wanted to see "something" displayed on the screen.
Because everyone knows you can't pack a working computer with C4 [wikipedia.org].
Airport security has been bullshit since September 12, 2001. Do not try to make sense of the stupid, hypocritical, inconsistent rules that are different in each airport, or even the same airport the next time you fly. That way lies madness.
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And of course, relevant XKCD: https://xkcd.com/651/ [xkcd.com]
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Then you, he, and I are all lucky, white, or both. Many people, including citizens get their phones searched at the US border. It's well documented. The Canadian government recently advised Canadians that searches of phones at the border is on the increase. Interestingly I don't think US border agents can legally search phones at airports in Canada, although I'm sure they can ask, and can deny entrance to anyone who says no.
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I've never had my phone or computer searched by a border patrol and neither have you.
True, but that is because my employer instructed me not to take my work laptop on an international flight.
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I've never had my phone or computer searched by a border patrol and neither have you.
Try posting some anti-Israel messages on social media and this will quickly change.
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I've never had my phone or computer searched by a border patrol and neither have you.
I have. An Israeli border guard asked me to open my laptop and show documents that substantiate my claim that I work for the company I was visiting in Israel.
What if you don't have a phone (Score:2)
Is a phone mandatory to take a flight? Is that the big plan?
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Sounds like it. One tracking and listening device per person. I cannot see how this can be brought into alignment with EU law though. They will probably have to keep a paper-option for the time being.
Re: What if you don't have a phone (Score:2)
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Is a phone mandatory to take a flight? Is that the big plan?
It's also lucky their batteries never go flat, and that international data roaming is always so easy! /s
Every flight I've boarded, the paper boarding passes scan first time. The people trying to display the pass on their phone seem to have a lot more trouble - you see them waving their phone under the scanner, turning it around, wiping the screen etc.
The carbon footprint of a boarding pass is peanuts compared to the fuel burned by the plane. "Paper boarding passes" is not a real problem that needs solving,
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Sounds very fragile (Score:4, Insightful)
Yes, I get it, it saves a few cents per passenger. But it makes the whole so much more fragile and dependent on complex technology. Not a good idea at all. Yes, eventually,t his will be the way to go, but this move is several decades premature. I mean,w e do not even have very high reliability phones or secure phones at this time. And they want the whole system to rely on these? Bad idea.
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Fortunately, my phone is not. Nothing ebodies "insecuriety by security products" as well as CrowdStrike does. Did teach me a lesson on hos abysmally dysfunctional organizations can get though. After that incident, some things in the world and in human hostry make more sense to me. I did adjust my lower bar for human competence when acting in organizations quite a bit downward as a result.
Been to a concert lately? (Score:2)
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Nope (Score:2)
>"Passengers will store passport data on their phones and use facial recognition to move through airports, while airlines will automatically detect arrivals via biometric scanning."
No thanks
>"who noted passenger data will be deleted within 15 seconds at each checkpoint to address privacy concerns."
Yeah, right
It's the UN and the start of a global digital ID (Score:2)
The UN and the elites want all of the minions using a CCP type digital ID and then onto CBDCs.
Big Brother Keeps Us Safe (Score:2)
Thanks for Big Brother, we won't have to sit next to anyone accused for terrorism.
But... (Score:2)
What if you don't have a mobile phone? I know it's pretty rare nowadays, but I know two people who don't.
Meanwhile in reality (Score:2)
The TSA can't even anticipate people who have pre-booked tickets arriving at the airport to join their flights, as witnessed by the people they employ to inform passengers that it is the passengers' fault there is a huge queue.
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And that constitution decides what happens in your country.
Do you want to travel abroad? Show me your digital ID, comrade.
I hope there is an alternative (Score:2)
For people who don't use smartphones
Who benefits from this? (Score:2)
Who benefits? the travellers certainly won't because the boarding passes could be obtained via e-checkin anyway and you would still need to go through the luggage checkin process.
How will e-passports save time? you will still need to go through the immigration clearance. Why not just print a QR code or a barcode on the visas such that the immigration clearance system can easily pickup the details about the visa from their database?
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Shouldn't this be in ... (Score:1)
"what-could-possibly-go-wrong" instead?
This is dead on arrival (Score:2)
NOPE (Score:2)
battery (Score:2)
Better make sure your phone battery is fully charged. And bring a battery pack just to be safe. Too bad it might start on fire on board the plane.
Facial Regonition (Score:2)
I entered the US yesterday YYZ-DEN without showing any credential. I went in the global entry line, a camera took my photo and I went on my way.
If you sign up for that, that's fine. I did. It's convenient to skip the passport line and I travel often.
I still print my boarding pass every time. If I'm returning from a trip so don't have access to a printer, I'll get the machine or the staff to print one at the airport.
I'm as techy as they come, but phones are not reliable and I'm not relying on them for a boar