US Aims to Give Cold War Plutonium to Startups For Nuclear Fuel (nytimes.com) 100
The Trump administration is planning to provide Cold War-era plutonium from dismantled nuclear warheads to nuclear startups that want to convert it into reactor fuel, arguing it could help address a looming fuel shortage for advanced reactors. Critics warn the idea raises serious nonproliferation, security, cost, and technical concerns. The New York Times reports: The plan has generated debate and some unease among nonproliferation experts. If finalized, it would mark the first time the U.S. government has made weapons-grade plutonium available to private companies. The Energy Department has more than 50 tons of surplus plutonium left over from nuclear weapons programs, and the agency had previously been planning to dilute much of that material and bury it. Some of the nuclear start-ups trying to obtain that plutonium say that transforming the waste into fuel is a better way to dispose of it.
On Tuesday, the Energy Department said that it had selected five companies to enter into "advanced negotiations" to potentially receive some surplus plutonium. That includes Oklo, a California-based nuclear power company, which plans to partner with Newcleo, a European developer of advanced nuclear reactors. Using plutonium for fuel, Oklo and Newcleo said, could solve a looming problem: Energy firms want to build a new wave of nuclear reactors, but the United States can't yet make enough conventional fuel from uranium to supply the plants. Harvesting old plutonium stockpiles could provide a short-term fix. "A lack of fuel is one of the biggest choke points in expanding nuclear power right now," said Jacob DeWitte, the chief executive of Oklo, which is developing a novel type of small reactor intended to run on plutonium. "This will help us get more nuclear power online faster."
[...] The plan is not yet final, and companies will still have to negotiate with the federal government over how to secure and transfer the plutonium. In addition to Oklo, the Energy Department said it had also selected four other companies -- Standard Nuclear, Exodys Energy, SHINE Technologies and Flibe Energy -- to enter into advanced negotiations to receive the material under its Surplus Plutonium Utilization Program, which was established last year. The program "is anticipated to help companies unlock the next level of private funding to broaden domestic nuclear fuel supplies, spur innovation on American recycling technologies, and unlock private sector funding to fuel the nation's nuclear renaissance," said Michael Goff, the principal deputy assistant secretary of nuclear energy, in a statement.
On Tuesday, the Energy Department said that it had selected five companies to enter into "advanced negotiations" to potentially receive some surplus plutonium. That includes Oklo, a California-based nuclear power company, which plans to partner with Newcleo, a European developer of advanced nuclear reactors. Using plutonium for fuel, Oklo and Newcleo said, could solve a looming problem: Energy firms want to build a new wave of nuclear reactors, but the United States can't yet make enough conventional fuel from uranium to supply the plants. Harvesting old plutonium stockpiles could provide a short-term fix. "A lack of fuel is one of the biggest choke points in expanding nuclear power right now," said Jacob DeWitte, the chief executive of Oklo, which is developing a novel type of small reactor intended to run on plutonium. "This will help us get more nuclear power online faster."
[...] The plan is not yet final, and companies will still have to negotiate with the federal government over how to secure and transfer the plutonium. In addition to Oklo, the Energy Department said it had also selected four other companies -- Standard Nuclear, Exodys Energy, SHINE Technologies and Flibe Energy -- to enter into advanced negotiations to receive the material under its Surplus Plutonium Utilization Program, which was established last year. The program "is anticipated to help companies unlock the next level of private funding to broaden domestic nuclear fuel supplies, spur innovation on American recycling technologies, and unlock private sector funding to fuel the nation's nuclear renaissance," said Michael Goff, the principal deputy assistant secretary of nuclear energy, in a statement.
I'll get the popcorn... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re: I'll get the popcorn... (Score:2)
Not much - everything that could've gone wrong allready has!
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Not much - everything that could've gone wrong allready has!
Oh summer child,, if you think this is peak wrong, you are not going to like the effects of selling weapons grade plutonium to random countries.
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Oh summer child,, if you think this is peak wrong, you are not going to like the effects of selling weapons grade plutonium to random countries.
Sudden peace might descend, as various countries would become able to defend themselves against U.S. invasions?
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Oh summer child,, if you think this is peak wrong, you are not going to like the effects of selling weapons grade plutonium to random countries.
Sudden peace might descend, as various countries would become able to defend themselves against U.S. invasions?
What color is the sky in you imaginary world?
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Oh summer child,, if you think this is peak wrong, you are not going to like the effects of selling weapons grade plutonium to random countries.
Sudden peace might descend, as various countries would become able to defend themselves against U.S. invasions?
Cool - The entire world is peaceful other than the USA. Really really good to know!
God you USA haters are pretty naive. Who do you want taking over when you get your wish?
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Has nothing to do with US hate.
Good to know. Perhaps it doesn't - Perhaps that no posts can be commented on without you or someone else spouting words that sound exactly like hate.
Or anyone "taking over"
No one is taking over. It would simple be more peaceful.
Exactly - it is well proven that no country was ever running things in evil fashion before the USA. Humans lived in peace, no one invading or taking over another country. All killing was accidental, and there was plenty for all humanity.
Look homie, if you think that once you gain your wish, that no country will come to dominate You really are embarrassing yourself.
Empires. There have been mandy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
I take a little exception to the very short lived ones, but empires have existed pretty much since humans have. Some became particularly significant. Ottoman and Roman and British empires come to mind.
So unless humanity has completely changed, when you get your wish (and you will eventually, no empire stands forever, some country simply will take over. History shows that whoever takes over will impose their will by force.
>How many peopled died in WWII? Why is it actually called a world war?
When you started the war, it was not called WW2. And the US at that time was isolationist. Ironic, Japan forced our entry, and Germany felt the need to declare war against us as well. But we didn't start the war.
Now we have a war again, in Iran. And for what reason would a "normal person" applaud you for that?
Not looking for applause, Perhaps I touched a nerve. I am not normal, and the Trump war was ill advised, ill thought out, poorly executed, and truly an embarrassing loss for the USA to be frank. Nothing to be proud of. It has turned a large part of the world against us.
The few people who were ready to fight against the Ayatollas: now joined them, and are defending THEIR COUNTRY against YOU IDIOTS.
Ahh, I see, All Americans are idiots, and you went cap locks loaded and ready to Rumble! U mad Bro?
Relax, have an adult beverage or herb of your liking. I think you need it.
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Canada, New Zealand and Australia did not see fighting? Right?
Darwin was bombed by the Japanese in WW2, so that takes Australia off your list. Canada was also hit by Japanese balloon attacks, so Canada comes off too. NZ didn't get bombed, but it did have an Axis-laid mine sink an Allied ship in its coastal waters, so borderline.
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And as far as South America goes, the U-Boats were ordered to "punish" Brazil for cooperating with the USN, and did such a good jo
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Thanx for the info!
I never heard about Germany versus Brasil.
I guess if one digs deeper, you find everywhere a WWII spot where something bad happened :(
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Thanx for the info.
If you say "axis" does that imply it is unknown who placed it? Considering the war with Japan in that area, that is most likely from a Japanese boat. On the other hand considering that German U-boats where nearly everywhere (mostly single boat missions) could be German, but also Italian.
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Countries? I read this as giving Pu to startups, for-profit entities. By USA standards (!), the risks are unbounded: countries, people, individual bad-actors would sell/steal/abandon it eventually. What a total mess.
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Countries? I read this as giving Pu to startups, for-profit entities. By USA standards (!), the risks are unbounded: countries, people, individual bad-actors would sell/steal/abandon it eventually. What a total mess.
Yup, it won't stay confined to US borders for long.
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Without doubt, some Trump flunky will sell a hundred kilos to IBM.
Only to find out it's not the business machine people, it's Iranian Boom Makers.
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Without doubt, some Trump flunky will sell a hundred kilos to IBM.
Only to find out it's not the business machine people, it's Iranian Boom Makers.
And the Trump administration will blame it on O'Blama.
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I'm sorry but that's just simply a failure of imagination.
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Re: I'll get the popcorn... (Score:1)
Do not worry. I promise to save an extra rod for the flux capacitor I built in my SUV, just in case some crazy person misuses theirs.
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The new owners might have a warm future :D
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Just get corn-on-the-cob, it will self-pop after this mess.
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Mod parent funny. Too obvious and low-hanging for insight, if'n I ever had a mod point to give.
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Not much. Plutonium isn't like uranium, it's effectively safe for human contact outside its fissioned form. This has been pretty well documented.
This is a step forward which is a long time overdue. It should've happened 30 years ago, and we'd have averted having to depend on China for our electricity production (wind + solar) without the net-zero production problems those two 'sources' introduce.
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No, it definitely isn't. Between the radiation, tendency to accumulate in bone, and shedding pyrophoric flakes, it's really not safe to handle.
In other words.... (Score:1)
The US aims to have some cold war era plutonium go missing due to accounting errors....
Re: In other words.... (Score:2)
Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.
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Does the t-shirt glow in the dark?
Re:The same people ... (Score:5, Insightful)
... who wanted to let freakin' Iran keep their actual weapons program, will claim to be worried about this.
That's because we "same people" have zero trust in Agent Orange as he threatens his country's own allies and invades other countries just for fun, while he simultaneously shits the bed over and over and over and over again.
We do, however, have at least some trust in the inspectors who, until the Great Trumpster Fire came along, were ensuring that Iran wasn't building nukes.
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I do not know what is worse, having THIS government hand out plutonium or THIS government's "inspectors" ride shotgun over the operation.
"Gee, I see you wants some plutonium for your "startup". That would be wrong!! But for the "correct" contribution to the "proper" fund, we can make it right."
Re:The same people ... (Score:4, Insightful)
... who wanted to let freakin' Iran keep their actual weapons program, will claim to be worried about this.
So no one outside of the fantasy in your head?
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An Anonymous Coward are not people. You're nothing more than words on the internet, probably a bot, probably paid for without an opinion on the matter.
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so stupid we assume you do it on purpose.
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No i don't even know what guy you're talking about ninny-face!
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(blinks) So the guy who replied to me ten minutes before you is just in my head? Who knew?
The guy who replied to you in under 10 minutes didn't say Iran should keep their weapons program. Quite the opposite. Your head is so full of fantasy it lacks basic English comprehension.
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What will be very funny is when Trump eventually cuts a deal the best case scenario is for... drum roll... inspectors. Except this time Iran will get even more money and sanctions relief than they did in 2015. Art of the deal baby.
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oh shut up
i hope you get paid for being so pathetic.
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Can't argue with that, er, logic .
No debate my ideas respectfully so they don't sound stupid!
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Well Mr empire builder is forcing others to take the Ukrainian lesson, and showing a good defense against it is to have the bomb. That and demonstrating guarantees are worth nothing.
Re: Iranians are very peaceful just like China (Score:2)
Maybe.
Now we know (Score:2)
Just how insane he is.
Re:Now we know (Score:4, Insightful)
It makes sense. These companies could really use a shiny nugget of plutonium to parade around to investors. Not just to show they're making progress, but the bauble also shows they have obtained the king's blessing. In this world where the government picks winners and losers, His blessing is a license to print money. At least until the scam collapses.
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Just how insane he is.
Not insane at all, just uninterested in the well-being of anyone other than himself.
If this happens, Trump will end up being in charge of deciding which companies get the plutonium, and those that do the best job of making Trump feel, er, appreciated, will get the nod. Also, I expect Trump to address safety concerns by setting up a multi-billion dollar fund of taxpayer money to address any necessary cleanups or other issues, a fund that is under his sole ultimate control, without congressional or any oth
Just in time! (Score:1)
This is not a new idea (Score:4, Informative)
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Yes it's an old idea and they should have done it years ago. If you don't trust the civilians then let the Navy have it. They can tweak the reactor design to use it safely.
Dilute and bury it is the dumbest idea yet. We can't decide where to bury ordinary spent reactor fuel,
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Yes it's an old idea and they should have done it years ago. If you don't trust the civilians then let the Navy have it. They can tweak the reactor design to use it safely.
I doubt that is viable, given Navy reactors used highly enriched fuel and core design to get the needed power density; MOX fuel would not meet those requirements.
Re: This is not a new idea (Score:3)
Use it to power your MOON BASE!
Space 1999 happening in 3...2...
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You do realize this is for NEW reactors right?
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You do realize this is for NEW reactors right?
I do, but I seriously doubt they have the money and capability to refine it for fuel, even if they have the plants are likely a long way off. Given the current administration desire to bring large nukes online quickly, the Pu plan is not a solution for that goal. If the Pu plan is a stopgap to get rid of the excess Pu in US stockpiles, then designing a plant to use it as a fuel component makes little long term sense. The key driver seems to be a desire to lessen the US dependence on imported uranium to f
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then designing a plant to use it as a fuel component makes little long term sense.
It makes sense.
As it is the only way to "destroy" the plutonium, or in other words: get rid of it.
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then designing a plant to use it as a fuel component makes little long term sense. It makes sense. As it is the only way to "destroy" the plutonium, or in other words: get rid of it.
However, the question is not is it a good way to dispose of it, but is it a commercially viable way. Building the plant to reprocess it into fuel. will no doubt be capital intensive and expensive to run, so unless there is enough demand to make it profitable or at least break even it makes no sense to go down that road. The other question is, if there is enough demand for it, what is the projections for how long existing supplies will last. It's strictly a simple cost/benefit/ROI question for commercial c
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You do not need to "re"-process it into fuel. It is already weapon grade plutonium, what would there to reprocess? It is basically as clean and pure as semiconductor silicon.
You just make fuel from it. Which in best case means: you do nothing.
Re:This is not a new idea (Score:4, Insightful)
You can't build a new reactor in under a decade and under 150% of budget.
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Fixed that for you.
PS I'm technically totally in favour of nuclear energy, but there are some realities around it that we have to face...
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US reactors are not designed
They aren't proposing to run this in existing reactors. They are proposing a new type of reactor design - you know - the usual grift. You missing this point doesn't make the rest of your point wrong though, this is stupid for so many reasons.
Original idea (Score:2)
Reads like the beginning of a Tom Clancy novel. (Score:2)
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A molten salt nuclear reactor runs at atmospheric pressure and is much safer.
Molten Salt has it's own issues, from corrosion challenges since it is highly corrosive as well as proliferation issues since the radiological signature is different from uranium fuels; which will require a new set of tools to track the radioactive materials through its life cycle. They were tried and abandoned, it will be interesting to see if a new generation can be made a viable option.
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The alloys to contain molten salts, of what ever composition, got developed in the 1950s.
As we have right now 2026, I consider that a solved problem.
The umbrella term is CRA ... google it.
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The alloys to contain molten salts, of what ever composition, got developed in the 1950s.
As we have right now 2026, I consider that a solved problem.
The umbrella term is CRA ... google it.
From what I know, they have certainly made progress but there is a lot of things needed to be verified to ensure metals can withstand thorium salts and the radiation associated with it in a reactor environment. I would not consider it a solved problem, although it may be solvable.
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As I said: google it.
And it is not "Thorium Salts".
It is natrium salt with Thorium as a fission material. At least in general it is natrium, but lets google that :D
Oh, they are actually mixtures of sodium and flurite salts .... why do you call Natrium Sodium, makes no sense ...
Sorry, you have to google it your self "what salt is used in molten salt fission reactors".
The answer is not easy to copy/paste here.
Sooo, the "advanced" reactors already lack fuel? (Score:2)
How does it make sense to invest in that tech?
Infrastructure (Score:2)
Context/Priorities (Score:2)
They want to give it to private industry, yet NASA has issues getting enough for its missions [spacenews.com], and somehow the war hawks also want to make more nuclear weapons [ucs.org]. These do not seem to be mutually coherent goals... (subsidizing the power industry, providing NASA with adequate resources, and potentially restarting the nuclear arms race)
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These do not seem to be mutually coherent goals... (subsidizing the power industry, providing NASA with adequate resources, and potentially restarting the nuclear arms race)
Of course it makes sense. Giving it to the power industry means we need to make more, and he can award the contract on a bribery basis.
Plutonium (Score:3)
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True, but their production is linked. Maybe, as drinkypoo suggests, that's the idea: artificial "demand"/synergies.
OTOH, wikipedia suggests that warhead plutonium pits are far richer than is typically used for power generation, making it a rather wasteful end use. Seems like it would be best to repurify the existing high-purity material to create replacement pits.
I expect you will just try and safe guard (Score:2)
pest control inc. (Score:2)
We from pest control want to test new ways to do pest control. Because you listen! Good pest control would make America glorious nation!
We need plutonium to build the ultimate pest destruction weap... product. We noticed that democrats keep flourishin in great country that is US. With pest control, this will be fixed and nothing will stop us from becoming rich!
Your's faithfully,
Pest control Large Embassy lane 5 Washington DC
Uranium (Score:2)
It would be great if we could use weapons grade fuel in reactors. It was such a waste to turn so much of it into warheads. But n
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It would be great if we could use weapons grade fuel in reactors. It was such a waste to turn so much of it into warheads. But no one has been able to do it yet.
That really doesn't make sense. All one would have to do with HEU is to dilute it with depleted uranium. A relatively simple process compared to enrichment. Plutonium is a somewhat different issue. But the concept wold be similar. Mix it to below weapons grade concentrations before releasing it for commercial/utility use. Nobody is suggesting selling a bunch of surplus demon cores as-is to utilities.
As soon as the rich wanted more power for AI (Score:3)
Nuclear power done cheaply with limited oversight is incredibly dangerous. Yes nuclear power plants can be done very safely and very great expense. So much so that you would never build a nuclear power plant in 2026 unless you had major space constraints and couldn't build a wind or solar farm for some reason. That's basically Japan and nobody else. Maybe a few places in France. But even then that's highly debatable.
This means that if you're firing up a new nuclear power plant in 2026 and you're not doing it for research or military purposes that you are probably looking to do it with the lowest bidder and the least maintenance. You better hope you're not living next to that.
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Maybe a few places in France.
All current proposed reactors in France are EPR2. Despite being called GenIII+ share more in common with GenII and GenIII designs for safety than any of the other modern GenIII+ or GenIV designs. It seems even France can't justify building safe reactors.
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If you walk away from a solar farm because the money is not there anymore no harm no foul. There are some ecological impacts for building them out but that's it and honestly the land will reclaim given time.
That is not the case for nuclear power. There's a bunch of stuff you can do to make it so that it's basically impossible to have Fukushima happen but if we could guarantee those things got done Fukushima would
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The idea behind SMR. Mass production comes to nuclear plants.
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Japan easily could build wind plants.
It is probably one of the wind richest places n the planet.
And solar plants on all roofs, parking lots and so on ... no problem either.
Is is just me (Score:2)
or does this administration seem to treat the periodic table like the first monolith in 2001?
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or does this administration seem to treat the periodic table like the first monolith in 2001?
As if anyone in this Administration even knows what the Periodic Table is, much less what's on it.
New company registered (Score:2)
Oh look at that... a new company has been registered. The "Bin Laden Totally Peaceful Nuclear Energy Company". They just need to pay off Trump and then they can participate in the Totally Peaceful Nuclear Energy program.
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Bin Laden? He never got close to having a nuke, the terrorist you're looking for is Ben Gvir.
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*whoosh*
What... (Score:2)
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Iran raises hand ... (Score:2)
US Aims to Give Cold War Plutonium to Startups For Nuclear Fuel
How about us? We're going to restarting a bunch of things pretty soon.
Ship it over and we'll even waive the Strait of Hormuz shipping fee.