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Communications Businesses Wireless Networking Apple Hardware

Verizon PCMCIA Card Just Works 99

Apple God writes "I was a friend's house and he showed me his Verizion PCMCIA card for internet access. On a whim, I put it in my PowerBook, and it recognized the card and prompted me for authorization to configure the system for use with the card. I entered my password, and was surprised to see an icon in the menu bar for it. I clicked on this icon and selected connect, it worked! I had internet access. Here is a picture of the card that I used. When we checked Verizon's page, they only listed Windows compatibility. To make matters sweeter, my friend was shocked that it 'just worked' because he had to install drivers in XP before it would work."
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Verizon PCMCIA Card Just Works

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  • by RalphBNumbers ( 655475 ) on Saturday September 11, 2004 @11:25PM (#10224820)
    Apple provides some pretty versatile generic drivers with the OS. If your hardware is somewhat standards based, there's a pretty decent chance it will just work weather it's officially supported or not.
    I know my USB card, my mouse, and 2 of my ethernet cards are not officially mac-compatible, but that didn't stop them from working beautifully as soon as I pluged them in and powered on.
    • Apple provides some pretty versatile generic drivers with the OS. If your hardware is somewhat standards based, there's a pretty decent chance it will just work weather it's officially supported or not.

      I don't think you can get more standard than prism2-based 802.11b cards, but no prism2-based pcmcia card I've tried "just works" in OSX. You need to go purchase (that's right, purchase) the Aerocard drivers.
    • Same when I plugged a Sony BA1 USB Bluetooth dongle into my iBook...

      On Windows you need to start an install CD which copies half a dozen drivers (BT interface, several VCOM ports and lots of crap), 2 Windows hotfixes and a BT front-end application. Of course you also need to restart your PC. Overall, installing this thing on Windows takes about 10 minutes.

      On OSX, the dongle is recognized instantly. No questions asked. Plug it in, it works. Fire up the Bluetooth Assistant, pair devices, that's it. :)
      • Does it "just work" on a version of OS X dating from 2001 ?
        • I don't know, and I doubt it. But the point is that it does Just Work(tm) on the up-to-date version of OSX. It does not Just Work on the up-to-date version of Windows. It pays off that Apple releases a new version of its OS every year or so and significant updates for free every few month, while MS takes 2-3+ years for each new OS release.
  • Drivers (Score:5, Informative)

    by bsharitt ( 580506 ) <bridget@sharit[ ]om ['t.c' in gap]> on Saturday September 11, 2004 @11:30PM (#10224849) Journal
    I've found that I rarely have to actually install a drive on OS X, but it's not imediatly recognized I usually have a hard timefinding one. Same thing for Linux
    • Re:Drivers (Score:2, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Usually same here. I almost never have to install drivers. Anything I plug in isn't found straight away, and I can never find a driver for it.
    • Re:Drivers (Score:2, Interesting)

      by zygote ( 134175 )
      I must be doing something wrong because we've had quite a bit of difficulty getting USB data cables (one for a nokia, one for a moto) to work with OS X (10.3.4)

      I've had to resort to using Quicklink Mobile from Smith-Micro to get our staff's cell phones to transmit data. Mind you, QLM works very well and is worth the cost, but I don't like being dependent upon them for cables -- especially if one dies and I can't just hit the Verizon store or other retailer to buy a replacement.

      The problem, as I've been to
      • Well, it sort of depends, but the cable I have for my siemens phone has a Prolific data chip in it. It seems to be the most common for data cables. The Prolific site is down, but try this to download the drivers for OS X. I know that's not a cell cable in the picture, but it's the same controller chip. http://www.ramelectronics.net/download/BF-810/OSX/
  • anyone tried this with SprintPCS CDMA cards?
    • Re:So, has (Score:3, Informative)

      by hattmoward ( 695554 )
      Can't say I have any apple hardware, but I know that those cards show up as two serial devices to the PC, it uses a Hayes AT command set.

      In windows, they'll be hidden by the software package. When it connects, it opens the first serial port and dials an access number. That will answer with a PPP handshake. Authentication is CHAP. Once connected, the second port is opened, and AT commands are sent to poll the current signal quality.

      On Linux, I need only plug the card in, and punch in the proper informat
    • Re:So, has (Score:5, Informative)

      by mroch ( 715318 ) on Sunday September 12, 2004 @10:43AM (#10227831)
      You're better off getting a data cable for the Vision phone you probably already have. The cable for my Sanyo 8100 was $20 (plus mandatory $20 for the shitty SnapSync software). When I plugged the phone into my iBook, it detected it and Internet Connect asked for all of the authorization info and I was up and running at 250 kbps in less than 5 minutes. I'd like to see Windows do that!
      • Re:So, has (Score:1, Informative)

        by billbaird ( 166492 )
        Just so everyone knows...SprintPCS although the vision plan is unlimited will charge you for using your phone like this. I have a Samsung VM-680 and I did this and they charged me $0.40/min. Just a warning to everyone!
  • by infonography ( 566403 ) on Saturday September 11, 2004 @11:36PM (#10224892) Homepage
    I don't have an Apple. (Sadly, I already run too many systems Sparc,Linux,windoze) But rebuilding a 2000 era Dell system for my Sister it identified the monitor right off were my recent Gigabyte P4 board still would not. Same OS same method of install same installer (me).

    When that box was designed, it was by someone who gave a damn about quality of the parts. I am not suprised that Apple worked. They really are better built boxes.

    • I don't have an Apple. (Sadly, I already run too many systems Sparc,Linux,windoze)

      I've heard a fair few excuses in my time but that one is pretty bad.

      The fact that you've got so many sounds to me like you're looking for one that is a good one. Give the Apple a shot, you may find that afterwards you're not running nearly as many systems as you are now... :)

      -- james
    • by swillden ( 191260 ) * <shawn-ds@willden.org> on Sunday September 12, 2004 @09:57AM (#10227611) Journal

      But rebuilding a 2000 era Dell system for my Sister it identified the monitor right off were my recent Gigabyte P4 board still would not. Same OS same method of install same installer (me).

      That's not the least bit surprising to me, and it doesn't have anything to do with the quality of the components, it has to do with the age of the components and the age of the operating system. If you install an operating system released in 2003, it's pretty reasonable that it won't recognize/have drivers for a component first released in 2004.

      Of course, this does show up what I think is a weakness in Windows' driver model the "must have a specific driver for every piece of hardware regardless of the fact that one generic driver can frequently handle lots of devices" problem. What probably happened here was that XP didn't have a good built-in driver for your video card, so it didn't know how to ask your monitor for the EDID data. Either that or maybe Windows has to have some sort of "driver" for each monitor? I hope not, because that's just insane. The system only needs a few bits of information about your monitor (hsync, vsync, max dot clock and name should do it, I think -- maybe some gamma stuff?).

      So, I don't think this is an issue of quality hardware (though Apple's is), but quality software. An OS *should* just be able to use a device which complies to relevant standards, or is sufficiently similar to another device for which it has drivers (of course it has to know that the devices are similar, which may be a problem. That's why in Linux you see a lot of questions about which driver should be used with a piece of hardware).

      • Windows makes use of many generic drivers. When I plug my Archos jukebox into the USB2 port in my Windows computer, it uses all generic drivers. The USB2 controller in my nForce2 south bridge is seen as a "Standard Enhanced PCI to USB Host Contoller" that uses usbehci.sys, usbhub.sys, usbport.sys, hccoin.dll, usbui.dll. On top of that, the USB root hub uses usbd.sys, usbhub.sys. Then the USB mass storage device uses usbstor.sys. At the end is the volume which uses disk.sys and partmgr.sys. All of those drivers are generic drivers written by Microsoft; there is nothing from nVidia, Archos or Hitatchi (the hardware manufacturers). Below the USB controller, a standard PCI bus from pci.sys, an ACPI bus enumerator from acpi.sys, also all generic MS drivers.

        I have 6 devices that don't use all generic drivers: the ATA controller, network card, sound, AGP bridge and video card all from nVidia, and the Realtek NIC. Of those, I could use generic drivers for 3 of them, albeit with some loss of speed or functionaility.

        NT has always had a layered architecture [osr.com] of class and port drivers; class drivers, provided my MS, implement the common functions for similar devices while port drivers handle communication with a specific device. A third-party video driver still depends on the generic video port [microsoft.com] driver. AFAIK, video cards support the VGA standard and that's about it; a standard VGA driver is the only generic video driver.

        There are two ways to figure out which drivers go to which devices: the old way of loading possible drivers and asking each one if it sees any devices it supports, and plug and play which uses device IDs and .inf files. inf files match drivers to device IDs. If a new product comes out, even if it is supported by a generic driver, the .inf files won't know about it; some driver disks just provide a new .inf file. Anyways, you are right that Windows may have the binaries to support a new device but doesn't know it. That's why you can force installation of a driver over an unknown device ;)
        • by Anonymous Coward
          "A third-party video driver still depends on the generic video port driver."

          Bad example. Both the video driver and video miniport are card specific. In fact, the first line of your link is:
          "NT-based operating system video miniport drivers are adapter-specific, kernel-mode drivers."

          You've also got it neatly backwards, miniports are card specific, drivers are often not. SCSI host adaptors have a card-specific miniport, but the driver is generic and provided by microsoft.

          The real reason for the miniport/
          • Miniport != port.
            There are three parts to a video driver: the video port driver, the video miniport driver and the display driver.
            The video port [microsoft.com] driver is always videoprt.sys. It handles the functions common to all video devices; it is provided by Microsoft.
            The video miniport [microsoft.com] driver handles communication specific to the device; the video miniport for my GF3 is nv4_mini.sys.
            The display driver [microsoft.com] handles all rendering specific to a device. The display driver for my GF3 is nv4_disp.dll.
            Only the display driver us
        • No Name Bluetooth dongle, D-Link Bluetooth chicklet, and Microsoft Bluetooth dongle, all use the same driver in OSX, I get to choose ONE on my windows box..... Explain that one for generic drivers. Plus, I know of other USB ethernet controllers, like my belkin 10/100 that need a specific driver, when one is already available. The bluetooth one really ticks me off. Works on Mac and Linux with the same driver, windows, OHH NO, you have to install each companies stack, and only use their dongle.
  • GPRS networks also (Score:5, Informative)

    by BrookHarty ( 9119 ) on Saturday September 11, 2004 @11:39PM (#10224914) Journal
    If you don't use the cdma carriers, one of the gsm ones also have cards for OSX, and apple drivers included.

    http://www.whateversclever.net/sereview.php

    Its nice when you can have a choice on Apple, you dont have to be locked down to 1 carrier and hardware.
  • I assume it's 10.something, but 10.what?
  • by Chuqmystr ( 126045 ) on Sunday September 12, 2004 @12:16AM (#10225247) Homepage
    I work in cellular and have both Mac and Linux boxen. I've installed quite afew solutions for myself and many a customer. XP in general has been tweaky. Even Linux has been more straight forward and could be called easier depending on your POV. OS X at first was hit and miss but with each update it just gets better and better at mobile data in general and that's without even mixing in the open communities great additions like the Ross Barkman scripts.

    Good to hear about the VZW cards. I use one on my Windoze lappy (my work made me take THAT computer!) and have also played with it on Linux. As for OS X I love the fact that most handsets, CDMA or GSM, seem to work over bluetooth or data cables right out of the box. They do a really good job on the seamless syncing too. Now if they will just get on the ball with SyncML then all will be well. Hell, world peace may even ensue, starvation and poverty could become a thing of the past and, um, ok perhaps not. But it would be nice ;-)

  • possible reason... (Score:5, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday September 12, 2004 @12:24AM (#10225306)
    http://www.apple.com/support/downloads/verizonbroa dbandaccesssupport.html [apple.com]

    Were you running 10.3.5? Since those drivers were released a month before 10.3.5, I suspect they were included in it, and that would explain the card "just work"ing.

    FWIW
    • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday September 12, 2004 @01:26AM (#10225736)
      (replying to myself...)

      Yep, my install of 10.3.5 includes AppleVerizonSupport.kext 1.0.0 and AppleVerizonSupportKicker.kext 1.0.0 (which are probably what's included in the linked download). So there you have it--Apple wrote a special driver for that VZW card.

      But it's still pretty cool that it Just Worked(TM). :-)
  • Drivers and USB (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday September 12, 2004 @12:45AM (#10225457)
    Every USB interface includes a class, subclass and protocol. There are several well defined combinations such as USB modem, printer, audio and all the HID stuff (joystick, keyboard, mouse etc).

    Windows provides HID drivers, but does not provide drivers for any of the other stuff even though it could, which is why it needs drivers for almost any USB peripheral you plug in.

    Mac and Linux have default drivers for a lot of the protocols which is why you can just plug things in and have them work.

    And the relevance for this topic is that 5220 card is actually a USB controller with a USB modem and some other device (I forget which now) attached. Fortunately there are standard ways of talking to USB controllers as well.

    So the real issue isn't being amazed at Mac/Linux not requiring drivers for this card, but why Windows is so damn broken by design that it does require them.
    • So the real issue isn't being amazed at Mac/Linux not requiring drivers for this card, but why Windows is so damn broken by design that it does require them.

      Anyone who is amazed by Windows being broken needs to get out more often, and is also most likely to be surprised by Mac/Linux working easily.
  • Big deal (Score:3, Informative)

    by mnmn ( 145599 ) on Sunday September 12, 2004 @01:35AM (#10225785) Homepage
    I've used unsupported ATM, SCSI and video cards in sun and rs/6000 workstations, and some driver in there made things work. Was also impressed when my SuSE install detected and setup a tokenring card that wasnt listed anywhere in Linux docs as supported.

    Heres how it goes. Acme the semiconductor company as an ethernet design in its IP, and sells the design, or wafers to other places which integrate it into their own chips and boards. They name it different. They sell their stuff, make specific drivers, sometimes change PCI IDs, and hope everyone depends on THEIR drivers. Some hacker realizes the two chips are the same, and adds the PCI IDs of one in the other to make a unified driver in Linux/BSD/whatever.

    Joe Schmoe plugs card it, is impressed and posts a slashdot story.

    Really makes me wanna post a slashdot story on how I ran Windows 2000 on a 21164 CPU.
    • Re:Big deal (Score:3, Funny)

      by klez23 ( 524506 )
      I've used unsupported ATM, SCSI and video cards in sun and rs/6000 workstations

      I wish my ATM card would work in my powerbook. Just think of all the free money!

  • by jabex ( 320163 ) on Sunday September 12, 2004 @04:34AM (#10226532) Homepage
    I think much of the "Not supported on OS X" talk is related to companies not wanting to pay for a cross-platform support staff.

    Sprint does this. With their cell service you can get PCS Vision. You're not supposed to use it to go online with your computer (official response is that it's an unofficial feature), but you can. On top of that, it's not supposed to work for Mac, but it does. There's even a PCS Vision modem script built into OS X that ends all the hassle.

    The ever ellusive, unsupported feature within an unsupported feature! I imagine companies save some money by just saying "not supported" instead of training a Mac Support team (or rather, hiring one), but I'd be surprised to learn exactly what works on a Mac that isn't supposed to. Makes you wonder...
  • the apple is sweet (Score:5, Interesting)

    by dankelley ( 573611 ) on Sunday September 12, 2004 @07:18AM (#10226968)
    After many years in the solaris world, and then a few years in the linux world, I got a mac. I didn't like that dopey single-button mouse, so I unplugged it WITH THE POWER ON and then plugged in a well-worn scrollmouse.

    Jeeze, the thing just worked, to quote the key phrase of this thread. At that moment, I knew I'd not be going back to solaris or linux anytime soon. After a year with the box, I've yet to plug in anything and find it not working right away.

    Apple wants you to think that the GUI is the best thing about their OS, but that's wrong. The GUI is OK, mind you, but it's more awkward than GNOME in some respects. But the hardware support, that's the jewel.

    • by Anonymous Coward
      The funny thing is that people modded you interesting.
    • After a year with the box, I've yet to plug in anything and find it not working right away.

      yeah, and it's starting to piss me off! i mean, it used to be i'd get to spend hours figuring this stuff out. it was a fun mental exercise. now, that's all gone! networking equipment used to be the best, but we recently got an Airport Extreme at the office, and i'm crushed! we plugged it in, and i went to configure it, but it was detected before i could even find the admin tool. i figured getting the iTunes thing to w

  • lemonade from lemons (Score:3, Informative)

    by jeif1k ( 809151 ) on Sunday September 12, 2004 @07:20AM (#10226972)
    A lot of hardware also "just works" with Linux and BSD. In fact, I suspect a lot more hardware "just works" with Linux than with Macintosh because Linux includes so many drivers out of the box.

    The reason for why hardware "just works" on all those non-Windows platfoms is simple: if OS vendors don't ship drivers with the hardware, you have to ship drivers with the OS.

    Note that a lot of "driver CDs" contain a lot more than drivers: they contain documentation, setup utilities, etc. So, built-in support, whether on Macintosh or Linux or BSD, is often not as good as what you get from vendors. (OTOH, vendor CDs often install lots of garbage in addition to what you need.)

    In the long run, we need more standard hardware interfaces, so that the low-level suff works for all hardware out of the box, but we also need to get vendors to support non-Windows platforms more.
    • This is an old argument, and is true for windoze, but notice how Verizon only suported windoze systems. i.e. Mac is in the same boat as Linux in many cases--they have to write their own driver. Not as often, but often.

      Having run a linux system for a while and having my graphics card not 'just work' with RH's default version of X, my experience is that the stuff that I want to use 'just works' with the Mac and is less likely to work with RH. That's not a complete story, but it is tell tale.

      • Having run a linux system for a while and having my graphics card not 'just work' with RH's default version of X, my experience is that the stuff that I want to use 'just works' with the Mac and is less likely to work with RH. That's not a complete story, but it is tell tale.

        Of course, Apple's graphics cards work with Apple's operating system--they ship together. Duh. When you buy a Linux machine from a Linux vendor, the graphics card also "just works".
        • I did buy the linux machine from a linux vendor. I had to reinstall RH after the HD failed. When I did, 'startx' didn't work and boot failed...

          On the Mac, I've had the same problem with the HD, but I didn't get shunted to some TUI to download the latest version before I could use the GUI.

  • You know, I'm sure all the Apple fans are really thrilled and enjoying this article and all that, given how nice this sounds on the surface...but seriously, consider what is being implied by the fact that this is on Slashdot. The article says: "Particular Piece of Hardware Easier To Use On Mac OS than Windows". The fact that this is newsworthy isn't a particularly cheery fact, y'know?
    • by TydalForce ( 569880 ) on Sunday September 12, 2004 @09:21AM (#10227455)
      Actually I think the nature of this article is a bit different. More like "this rather expensive piece of hardware that has no official Mac support actually *works* with no hassle. So you can go buy it with little risk of it not working". I've been looking at these cards myself for a while, but none of them have Mac compatability listed on their websites. Its nice to know I could go get one, pop it in, and not worry about having wasted $300. (c:
  • I noticed this too.. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by MikeSweetser ( 163852 ) * on Sunday September 12, 2004 @09:51AM (#10227575) Homepage
    I noticed this a lot with my new Mac. After eight years of using Microsoft products, I buckled down and bought a dual 1.8Ghz G5 a few weeks ago.

    Every time I plug something into it, it just works. I bought a Formac TVR video capture unit, and plugged it in. No drivers, it recognized it just fine and Toast even let me capture off it. My new mouse worked perfectly. I plugged in my USB printer, and it didn't even bother prompting me about it - I was simply suddenly able to print documents from anywhere.

    I love this thing :)

    Mike
  • A similar story (Score:2, Informative)

    by ack154 ( 591432 )
    My old digital camera worked out like that... It was a Fuji FinePix 1400. Not fantastic, but it got the job done.

    Anyways, it always seemed to have issues with my XP machine. I'd have to install drivers to begin with, but every once in a while it just decided to not work at all when I plugged it in. It ended up becoming a chore to get pictures off of the damn thing.

    Then I tried plugging it into my iBook. I saw a "no name" drive instantly show up on my desktop, iPhoto opened and everything was perfect. I di
  • what? (Score:1, Insightful)

    by pittnat ( 675880 )
    yeah, i agree that it is really cool that our beloved mac os has so many drivers preinstalled, but come on, is this really a /. worthy story?
  • How fast is it? (Score:2, Interesting)

    by waffffffle ( 740489 )
    How fast is this service? I've used my T-Mobile phone with my PowerBook over bluetooth (irda a few years back) and it has always been dirt slow. Is this card faster than modem speeds?
    • Re:How fast is it? (Score:4, Informative)

      by ttroutma ( 552162 ) on Sunday September 12, 2004 @02:52PM (#10229067) Homepage
      Verizon. Two different service levels, nation wide right now, 80-133kbps inbound 44kbps outbound. EV-DO service in DC, Vegas and San Diego, 300-500kbps inbound unsure on the outbound. '05 national for EV-DO Performance is much enhanced with a good 800/1900 dual band antenna and 3 watt amp like the digital antenna DA4000. Using this setup I've done some long drives while listening to stream audio (voice programs not music) in the car , like Austin to Dallas, nonstop audio streaming. It's cool. Latency on these connections SUCKS though, it's all over the map from 400 to 800ms. So forget out getting the $80 unlimited plan and making unlimited calls. And it is no shocker that this just works on the Mac. It just works BETTER on a Mac than on my PC's supported or not. I much prefer this kind of connectivity to Wifi because it does not tie me down to one location. Using a crank up 3' mount on my camper with a yagi on top I get the most insane coverage area you've ever seen. 40 miles outside of the regular VZ coverage area is easy. Haven't even had a chance to try a mountain top location yet but I bet it's going to have signal.
  • I bought a playstation 2 adapter to USB for my G5. It said it was only compatable with Windows XP. It also came with a floppy disk full of drivers.

    I plug it into my Mac.... And it worked. *shrug*
  • by XO ( 250276 )
    1XEVDO rocks. That's about it.

    Any idea who makes the card?
  • I'm a Verizon subscriber and I got curious a couple of weeks ago as to how to connect my TiPB to the 'net through my Nokia cell phone. The solution seemed to be a $50 cable and some modem scripts. Best speed would be 14.4K. This looks way better. The card pictured by the original poster is an Audiovox PC 5220 card. Here's the Verizon page for it:

    Verizon Audiovox PC 5220 [verizonwireless.com]

    The card is currently available (to Verizon customers) for $99 with a 2 year contract ($15 activation fee). If you choose to keep your

    • I didn't even bother trying to find/create scripts for it. When I was poking around the net trying to find information on the cable, I found that the script built-in (To at least 10.3.3) for Sprint PCS worked fine with it. It was indeed pretty slow, but on the other hand I didn't see any extra charges for it on the next bill, so it was all good. :)
  • why is this news ? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by babbage ( 61057 ) <cdevers@NoSPaM.cis.usouthal.edu> on Sunday September 12, 2004 @08:26PM (#10231462) Homepage Journal

    What's so impressive with this article? "Guy buys computer where things Just Work, tries it out, learns that things do indeed Just Work. Film at 11."

    At my job, we have two managers with Powerbooks and these Verizon cards, and have been using them to little fanfare for perhaps a year now, maybe longer. The only glitch I can think of was that the cards didn't work with when 10.3.3 came out, but they worked fine again with 10.3.4.

    Things usually just work with Macs. Why bother making a headline out of what should be obvious to anyone that uses these computers ?

    • "Things usually just work with Macs. Why bother making a headline out of what should be obvious to anyone that uses these computers ? " Perhaps to let those who don't know?
    • you are an idiot.

      Verizon is NOTORIOUS for sticking ONLY to the windows compatiblity world.

      Most of their phones don't even have bluetooth.
      They just came out with one, but they disabled most of the bluetooth features. (I think they posted that on slashdot.)

      The fact that a Verizon card "just works" is thus very un-expected. had you shared the fact that these cards worked with us when your 2 managers first found out a year ago, this story would be yours and all the fanfare that goes with it.

      be faster next t
  • Why is it news when an article of hardware works in a non-Microsoft system? It's not even a news article when hardware works under Linux!
  • My powerbook doesn't have a pcmcia slot. Is this using some kind of usb to pcmcia adapter?

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