Microsoft Says It Is Winning Its New War Against Macs (cultofmac.com) 313
Windows PCs are starting to chip away at Apple's strong grip of the high-end computer market, Microsoft CFO Amy Hood said on an earnings call Thursday. From a report: Microsofts licensing business, which sells Windows to third-party PC makers, was up 5 percent last quarter, confirmed CFO Amy Hood during an earnings call on Thursday. The "non-pro" (consumer) market grew 5 percent, beating the overall decline of the PC industry. "Our partner ecosystem continued to see growth and share gains in the Windows premium device category," Hood continued. Those gains would have eaten into Apple's share of that market, which has been dominated by Macs until recently. There are other things that could have contributed to this, of course. Many long-time Mac users have been somewhat disappointed with Apple's most recent releases, which come with big changes that not everyone is willing to embrace.
Nope (Score:5, Insightful)
Apple is self destructing. Minor difference, but it makes it sound like Microsoft is all of a sudden making better products. That would be a first, and probably not far off.
Had a mac since '84 and I think my current macbook is the last I'll buy.
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So, are you going to go Windows or Linux?
Because while having to use a dongle to access your SD card is a slight nuisance, I guess, the alternatives are for shit.
Re:Nope (Score:5, Interesting)
From my point of view or from Microsoft's?
From their point of view, I'm going to Windows, because I'll probably go with a Dell XPS 13. From my point of view, it will be Linux. The "problem" is that Microsoft still gets my money, and they still add it to their stats, despite me not wanting their product and not wanting to pay for it.
I have been a MBP user for a decade. My MBPs have been my main workhorses, and I loved them. I've been waiting 2-3 years for a refresh worth replacing my 2012 MBP with, and it's clear that it's not going to happen.
Apple has now merged the MBP and the Air, which I don't understand. I don't want an Air. I want a fucking MBP. 3/4" thick, a battery that goes a day, all my ports, and hardware that's not 5 years behind. 256gb solid state drive, 8gb of ram, and an i5 is the base configuration? Really? For $1500? Really? $1800 on the XPS 13 gives you double everything and an i7 in an aluminum body and all the ports.
I used to love OS X, but even that's starting to wear on me. For example, I'm required to sign into iCloud with the latest OS X update. I have not figured out how to turn this off. I have disabled everything syncing to iCloud, but every hour or so I get a popup telling me to log in. No way to turn it off. Why? See the tiny little hard drives that Apple now ships with, and the inability to upgrade them or add another. (I've got a 1Tb drive in my 2012 MBP for comparison.)
Two or three years ago, the alternatives were definitely shit. Now, I don't think so. The alternatives are better, and the current line of MBPs (and OS X) are so fucking terrible that I'm inclined to say that the pendulum has shifted to the alternatives.
Re:Nope (Score:5, Informative)
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Thank you! I didn't see that option. I may be pulling the trigger on a new laptop much earlier than I had thought I would be....
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The problem w/ buying 'business editions' from Dell (dunno about others) is that when you select 'business' as the reason for buying, they ask you all sorts of intrusive questions, like the name of your business, and so on. If you are an employee working for someone and don't have your business, your choice is either to lie, and invite spam going forward, or enter your employer's name - not sure about the repercussions there, or just not do it.
Better alternative would be to check out companies that mak
Re:Nope (Score:5, Interesting)
What's wrong with lying to a corporation like Dell? Other than the nuisance to lose 10 seconds entering the information, I don't see any problem.
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I've definitely had my eye on System 76. The problem is that, while a couple hundred dollars less, the equivalent hardware of what I see in something like the XPS 13 comes in a big, clunky, plastic body machine. The XPS line is starting to look and feel like the older MBPs do - a little thinner, a little sleeker, overall just a little more polished than the System 76 laptops. The XPS 13 is 0.6" tall at the highest, compared to 0.9" for a Lemur. Lemur clocks in at 3.6 lbs vs the 2.7 of the XPS. It's really a
in the same boat (Score:3)
I am in the same boat; i use OSX and have been looking for a replacement for my 2011 MBP. I think this is the closest i'll come to getting an upgrade without switching to a windows platform. still having a hard time with soldered ram and ssds though. maybe apple will come to their senses in the near future, and think about prioritizing function over form in the future.
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If you don't need to run Adobe software, or some other specialized thing, and you have the ability to figure things out for yourself, seriously, it's the way to go.
Probably less than 1% of the population need to run Adobe software. You can read PDF and even run flash just fine on Linux.
Re: Nope (Score:2, Funny)
However, you can't build iOS apps.
Apple: you need to do something about this: port your iOS build environment to linux before you kill the mac.
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Macs aren't perfect, and Windows has gotten much better, but man -- their UI just makes me want to claw my eyes out! I have a Windows 10 x64 box with a nice 28" Viewsonic connected to a nice Radeon card, and typing in a browser doesn't look much better than it did 15 years ago! I've never understood why in all the years of good video cards and GUI development that Microsoft couldn't get font rendering looking good. And you'll never get me off Time Machine backups! It made deploying this new iMac or my wife's new MacBook Pro that her boss bought her last Fall so easy. My wife is an astronomer and all of their data center is Linux, so Macs are a very smooth fit for the staff.
Remember we are in post truth days, alternative facts, and we elected it, so this is what America wants.
We have a nation where for some reason Popularity equals everything.So Kim Kardashian is the most beautiful woman in the world, VHS is the best video system, and the cheapest laptop that you can buy at Walmart is incredibly superior to a 30 K Mac Pro.
Toyota Corolla is the biggest selling car, so it is also the best car in the world.
Oh - and Honey Boo Boo's mother who recently re-hooked up with a re
Re: Nope (Score:3)
Re:Nope (Score:4, Informative)
Their software on the other hand doesn't seem better, at least from the consumer side. I guess Azure is fairly popular and they've probably got other stuff I'm not overly familiar with that gets used by businesses. However, if Microsoft hadn't started making better products, people would have jumped ship from Apple for something else like HP, Dell, Lenovo, etc. instead of buying Microsoft hardware.
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It Is Impressive! (Score:5, Funny)
Yes, I think Microsoft's OS is better, but they both seem to be trying to get the golden raspberry.
Re: It Is Impressive! (Score:2, Funny)
So you recommend Raspbian then?
Re:It Is Impressive! (Score:5, Interesting)
MacOS is better. It's a unix derivative. I have my programs (in python & C mostly) on a network drive and they compile and run the same on Linux and MacOS. I use Latex and gnuplot a lot. They both run the same on Linux and MacOS.
Windows is not like that. It's it's own thing and I have to jump through hoops to make programs and documents work across all three. So I don't. I use a Mac and I use Linux. Work give me a windows laptop and I use it to ssh into Linux to do work.
Other people's priorities are generally very different to mine, but I don't give a crap about the minutiae of UI elements (unless it's truly horrible like Gnome). I care about the programming environment.
Re:It Is Impressive! (Score:5, Insightful)
I care about the hardware too and there still isn't a real improvement out there to the 2012 15 inch macbook pro I already have. I'm still waiting on an actual hardware upgrade after 5 years.
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No it isnt.
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I have my programs (in python & C mostly) on a network drive and they compile and run the same on Linux and MacOS.
Only if the program either is command-line or uses the GNUstep toolkit, a partial reimplementation of the GUI API now known as Cocoa. Otherwise, the user has to install XQuartz to make graphical programs designed for GNU/Linux work on macOS. Or what am I missing?
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I have my programs (in python & C mostly) on a network drive and they compile and run the same on Linux and MacOS.
Only if the program either is command-line or uses the GNUstep toolkit, a partial reimplementation of the GUI API now known as Cocoa. Otherwise, the user has to install XQuartz to make graphical programs designed for GNU/Linux work on macOS. Or what am I missing?
It's all command line. Statistics, data processing, plotting graphs to files that drop into latex documents.
I can do UI things in python with the same code, but I don't because it's of no use to me.
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" I don't give a crap about the minutiae of UI elements (unless it's truly horrible like Gnome)"
So I gather from this you use Macs because it supports your programming/working environment and you don't have to deal with the UI disaster known as Gnome3.
Interestingly I maintain a set of Linux workstations and most of the scientist/engineer guest users of these workstations are otherwise Mac users. I have installed Gnome/Mate and they sit down and are immediately able to do work with little to no training and
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>So I gather from this you use Macs because it supports your programming/working environment and you don't have to deal with the UI disaster known as Gnome3.
The machine I sit on my lap is a mac. I have other machines that are Linux. I use Linux at work (for chip development). To be fair I was using and Apple ][+ when it was new and current and that was way before Gnome-anything.
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But the people of importance are now saying Windows 10 is as good as or in some ways better than OSX.
People of importance from Microsoft, no doubt.
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Thus demonstrating that people of importance can afford the better recreational pharmaceuticals.
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MacOS is better. It's a unix derivative. I have my programs (in python & C mostly) on a network drive and they compile and run the same on Linux and MacOS. I use Latex and gnuplot a lot. They both run the same on Linux and MacOS.
Windows is not like that. It's it's own thing and I have to jump through hoops to make programs and documents work across all three. So I don't. I use a Mac and I use Linux. Work give me a windows laptop and I use it to ssh into Linux to do work.
Other people's priorities are generally very different to mine, but I don't give a crap about the minutiae of UI elements (unless it's truly horrible like Gnome). I care about the programming environment.
I understand that technically, OS X is better. However, for me, it would have been a step down from NEXTSTEP, which I used years ago. Initial versions of OS X were similar, but in recent years, they've made the OS more like iOS. Which I like on my iPad, but not on a laptop
The main issue about the OP's post is that the only way one can get OS X is by sinking a ton of cash on a Mac. Yeah, Hackintosh is there, but you are on your own. One way around it would be to buy a Linux configuration of your choi
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Meanwhile I need to get on and get stuff done, so I went to the Apple store and got me a macbook pro.
The bash shell looks pretty much the same regardless of what you run it on. The macbook hardware is nice. I tried the new keyboard on the new mac and hated it, so it might be the end of the line for me and macs when this one dies. I'll be replacing the battery soon instead of upgrading to a new macbook.
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I was with you until the last sentence. Frankly, it's been a while that I've looked at MacOS, but it was always ways superior to Windows since I can remember. And paradoxically Apple used to always make their profits with hardware (which has now become meh, I suppose). Has any of this changed so much? Did I miss something?
No it has not changed. You missed nothing.
The hardware is great, with year-over-year improvements on just the MacBook Pro, and soon to be coming to the Desktop line, now that Intel has gotten their thumb out of their asses on their CPUs a little bit.
UNIQUE features, found in NO OTHER LAPTOP for the 2016 MacBook Pros (esp. the 15"):
1. 80 Gbps of raw, multifunctional I/O bandwidth. Nearly TWICE that of any other Laptop, regardless of brand, regardless of price.
2. 5k Internal Display on 15" model (I thi
Re:It Is Impressive! (Score:4, Informative)
you're a retarded fanboi.
1, 2, 4) shit you can't use because there are no TB3 docks
3) LOL. Samsung 960 pro is almost twice as fast.
5) LOL, my sides, you can put that smiley face there on the touchpads
6) smaller is actually better
7) Thinkpad from fucking 2005 had that
Re:It Is Impressive! (Score:5, Informative)
1. 80 Gbps of raw, multifunctional I/O bandwidth. Nearly TWICE that of any other Laptop, regardless of brand, regardless of price.
If it had a port to check my car's tire pressure that would also be a feature that no other laptop has, at any price. In other words: so what?
This falls into the category of shit I don't need and can't use with any equipment i own or am likely to own this year. The multifunctional i/o bandwidth available in other laptops is fine. Apple going to 11 on this feature is all fine and dandy but it lacks the features users actually need and want.
2. 5k Internal Display on 15" model (I think the 13" is 4k?) I believe that is UNIQUE relative to any other Laptop, regardless of brand, regardless of price.
UNIQUE yes. UNIQUELY pointless. Its just more "Innovation" nobody cares about. Do you have 5k content? No? So who cares? At 15" will it look any better than 4k display? No? So who cares?
3. UNIQUE, Custom, Apple-Designed SSD Controller with the highest Read/Write performance in the industry.
I'd far rather a COTS module I can replace in 2 years for $200 for with a 4TB one. I'm willing to give up a few % points of performance for that. My 2011 Macbook pro is still useful to me (my family at least) because I was able to upgrade the RAM and SSD. This new one? Sure its a few points faster ... but its stupidly overrpiced for the marginal improvement in speed, and you're stuck with whatever capacity you get today forever. I don't object to the existence of this tech as an option for people who want it... but does apple give you the option? Nope. If you want an MBP you have to have this overpriced tech whether you want it or not, whether you need it or not, whether you'd be happier with COTS SSD or not.
4. Ability to natively drive up to FOUR 4k external displays, plus its internal 5k display, or up to TWO 5k external displays, plus its internal 5k display, more than any other Laptop, regardless of brand, regardless of price.
But no native ability to connect to even one HDMI projector in the customer or hotel meeting rooms without carrying a bag of accessories. Swing and a miss.
5. UNIQUE, multitouch, multifunctional Touch Bar interface, that not only replaces the Function keys, but also allows Applications and the OS to present the user with unique, custom controls that do not take up screen real-estate.
Replacing keys i can touch type with a bar i can't is not progress. It's 2 steps backward 1 step forward. Cool feature, maybe, definitely wasn't worth giving up function keys I can touch type with for, and the escape key. What's the next innovation to replace the number key row too? Then you can have numbers or even more application controls. Better still just get rid of the keyboard and staple two ipads together as the new macbook pro.
6. The largest Trackpad in the known universe ;-)
There is too small. And there is big enough. "Largest in the known universe" isn't worth anything once the others are 'big enough'.
7. TouchID, with ApplePay and App Store Support, as well as several other OS and Application-Level functions.
So, as you can see, Apple has HARDLY "abandoned the Mac".
I kind of recall Top Gear covering a lot of cars over the years that are just like the mac book pro... you know the ones... the cars with 1500 horsepower but no trunk or glove box. $50,000 for custom brake system that shaves 6 ft off a stop from 60 to 0... but well... $50,000 and when they fail you have to fly an engineer from Italy to service them. And you need a truck following you around with spare tires because it rips through a pair as often as a regular car needs to fill up with gas. A tour de force of technology... but completley useless as a daily driver.
That's the macbook pro...sure its got support for up to four 4k screens but you need to carry around a bag of dongles to attach a USB flashdrive. 80Gbps of io but we're not allowed to have more than 16GB RAM? Its utterly ridiculous.
Re:It Is Impressive! (Score:5, Insightful)
"You, sir, are an unmitigated moron."
Funny. I feel the same way about you. You are spouting absolute nonsense. We're both modded +5. Neat.
5k is irrelevant. its irrelevant today and it will still be irrelevant in 5 years. if anything, we'll move to 8k before 5k gets any real traction.
Go to Amazon. No need to carry "a bag of accessories". Just buy something like THIS, or THIS, or even THIS or THIS, and you're all set for "Legacy Ports".
Yeah... buy a laptop missing a bunch of features, and then attach another smaller box to it to make it an actual pro laptop. That's brilliant. Pro users want a workhorse like a truck and you think they should just buy a car and trailer, and that that it is just as good? You know any contractors who drive a civic and pull a trailer around? Ever wonder why not? BECAUSE THEY CAN BUY A FUCKING TRUCK.
That shit on amazon wouldn't be necessary if you could buy a proper laptop in the first place.
Once again, "My Use Case MUST be EVERYONE'S Use Case. WTF is wrong with you???
The difference between my examples and your is the users I am representing is the *actual majority of users*, and the use-cases you are campaigning for are the tiny niches. Which use case is more common?
a) A pro user who needs to attach a flash drive to their computer, or an HDMI projector in a board room?
b) A pro user who needs 5k screen and 4 4k screens all attached to his laptop; because he doesn't already have a desktop?
Catering to b) is perfectly fine, but claiming a) is not the far more common and important feature to support is just rectal cranial inversion.
If you look at the TrackPad on the MBP 2016, it is nearly the size of an iPhone screen. Next stop for that TrackPad will be to work with the Apple Pencil. Mark my words. THEN, it will make sense...
And if that happens in 2019 I'll give a shit THEN. But your wrong. Nobody wants to draw on the track pad. If anything Dell's convertibles have it right... flip it over and draw right on the goddamned screen.
This is hardly a Bugatti. This is a Laptop for PROs, that has an "Eye to the Future". But still practical today.
If it were there would not be a million articles taking a shit on it for not having the features people want TODAY.
That's why you can buy miniDP to ??? Adapters at WALMART these days, FFS!
I can buy tire irons at walmart too -- so what?
Doesn't mean my car shouldn't have one included in the tire change kit. Even my 911 has a collapsible tire change kit with everything needed to change a tire as standard equipment. Why? Because when I need to change a fucking tire i am not likely to be parked at a fucking walmwart where i can just buy a tire iron.
Likewise when I need to plug my laptop into a customers projector... that is not going to happen in the cable aisle at a walmart, where i can just reach over and grab the adapter i need. No. Instead it usually means NOT using the projector and having everyone gather around the tiny laptop, because in the real world you don't pause a meeting for 20 minutes to make a fucking trip to walmart.
And guess what? There are PLENTY of Non-Apple Laptops that have nothing but a miniDisplayPort Port. You'll be whipping out that "Bag Of Accessories" for them, too.
I can easily shop around bad design choices them when I'm buying Non-apple laptops. There are several vendors, with dozens of products lines that cater to pro-users. If apple is going to be the only vendor of OSX then it's under more pressure to get its one-size-fits-most to actually fit most.
If you are Pining for the USB-A, go to frickin' Amazon, and pick up a few of these $2.50 USB-C to USB-A adapters. They are cheap enough ($7 for 3) and small enough, that you can simply clip them onto your USB-A cables and LEAVE THEM THERE.
Yeah. I al
Keeping up with the Macs (Score:2, Insightful)
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RTFA
Re:Keeping up with the Macs (Score:5, Interesting)
What kind of trouble do *you* think they're in? I sure don't see it. For sure, I don't see them growing much any time soon, because the PC market is so mature, but I sure don't see them as being in any kind of "trouble" either.
PCs aren't going anywhere. You need them to do real work, which can't be done on phones or with phone OSes which are horribly limited (by design). Obviously, you (and many others) believe that Apple seems to be dropping the ball here, and sales numbers do seem to support that currently. However, there's no evidence that people are flocking to anything else either, in sufficient numbers to matter. As much as I'd like everyone to switch to desktop Linux, and have been hoping for that for 15+ years now, I've given up on it because I just don't see it happening. Luckily, desktop Linux is IMO completely usable and in fact superior, but that doesn't equate to mass adoption. People (and companies) are just too married to the Windows platform and its "ecosystem".
So AFAICT, MS can just sit back and milk the Windows/Office cash cow indefinitely. Again, this is not a company you should invest in if you're looking for a "growth" stock, but it absolutely should have reliable revenues.
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If Microsoft give Apple a kicking with it's surface products, we can look forward to Apple pulling out it's finger and doing a good job on the laptops and desktops the following year.
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As long as Apple keeps App Store submission exclusive to Xcode and Xcode in turn exclusive to macOS, I don't see "Microsoft giv[ing] Apple a kicking with it[s] [S]urface products" any time soon.
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Linux biggest problem is that they (Distro makers) were never willing to raise some serious money and actually try. They kept appealing to philosophy instead of things that are known to work when done properly assuming you have a half decent product in the first place, marketing and promotion.
Problem #2 is that developers have failed to modernize their applications, and a LOT of stuff looks like it is from 2000. Flat, high contrast UI is what's "in," get with it.
I'll stop here as I could list about 10 serio
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Linux biggest problem is that they (Distro makers) were never willing to raise some serious money and actually try.
Yeah, it's a little hard to "sell" something for free and compete with the $$ marketing campaigns of major closed-source companies. Want to tell us about how easy it is for you to raise some "serious money"? I mean, whenever you decide you're willing to raise it.
Flat, high contrast UI is what's "in," get with it.
I'll stop here as I could list about 10 serious issues such as these.
Um, yeah. If you think adopting the latest gee-whiz, touch screen-obsessed, desktop-crippling, dumbed-down UI on a desktop OS is a "serious" issue, I'm pretty sure I don't care to hear about your other 8 "serious" issues.
Once in a rare while I insta
Apple has been complacent (Score:3, Insightful)
I wonder if Microsoft realizes how much trouble Windows is in.
Microsoft is making tens of billions in profit from Windows every year with no end in sight. If that's trouble then give me some of that. PCs might not be the dominant force they once were but they aren't going away any time soon and there is nothing that is likely to displace Windows as the dominant operating system in PCs either. Furthermore Microsoft is the only ones doing anything even kind of innovative in traditional PCs these days. Their work in merging tablets and laptops is actually working in
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Windows 10 tablet mode still sucks badly.
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Apple's biggest problem is that they see Ives as the second coming of Jobs and keep letting him focus on nothing but thinness and lightness. Professionals don't care if their machine has to be a little heavier and thicker if it can accomplish the job they need it to, but Apple's modus operandi is telling people what they need rather than actually fulfilling the market need.
The new MBP is evidence of this. It's thinner and lighter and had to make hardware compromises for it. Less ports. 16GB of RAM cap. Battery life that's okay but not even at the same level as the previous machine from years ago.
Further they're screwing up in the release cycle. Professionals often can't wait multiple years between upgrades, and without a proper release cadence a professional needs to guess (and potentially bet the farm) on when to upgrade. That doesn't leave them with confidence. Couple that with a bad cycle and you have a lot of very legitimately spooked people.
Bullshit [slashdot.org].
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I wonder if Microsoft realizes how much trouble Windows is in.
I think they have some clue with their frantic efforts to re-image and re-invent Windows, that however mostly just piss people off and makes Win10 a complete no-go for large enterprises (no stable UI). They now have botched 2 Windows versions. My take is that unless they urgently stabilize Win10 and remove spying and forced updates, Windows is history.
Re: Keeping up with the Macs (Score:4, Insightful)
The PC market is hardly a major growth industry, so while it's increased its sales gap with the Mac platform, so what?
Re: Keeping up with the Macs (Score:4, Insightful)
Have you looked at Apple's cash reserves? 237.6 billion versus around 113 billion. Apple could buy Microsoft's liquid assets and still have over 100 billion to spare.
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It can mean that, or it can mean a company is making so much money that they simply have no real means of re-investing all of it. The fact is that Apple's management is dividend-prudent, and has literally been raking in boatloads of money for several years now. It doesn't represent stagnation, it represents the fact that Apple is the most successful technology company on the planet right now.
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I don't even own any Apple products. I gave my iPhone to my daughter three years ago and never looked back. But facts are facts. Apple is the most successful technology company history, and right now it is hands down the biggest.
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That is the great thing about a healthy economy. More than one company can be winning at the same time. Anyone who thinks either Microsoft or Apple is in a bad position is either trolling or stupid. They are both huge companies with huge cash reserves and great products.They also both make mistakes, but not mistakes which create any existential threats to either company (so far anyway).
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It's Microsoft that's running around shouting "WINNING!" Yes, they're doing well, but Apple is the predominant technology company on the planet, and the fact that it's losing a bit of market share in a market where it hasn't had a dominant position for longer than my kids who are in their mid-20s have been alive is an idiotic metric.
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Have you looked at Apple's cash reserves? 'Cause winning. More.
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Only Apple is making real money on hardware, MS has seen this, and that's why they have gone service heavy. Even Apple will eventually have their hardware profits dry up, I think the better question is what will they do about that when it happens, MS already has a plan.
Not so much winning as simply not failing as hard (Score:5, Insightful)
Microsoft is only shooting itself in the foot while its opponents over at apple have somehow lodged their guns into their own rectums. Its not so much that microsoft is winning the battle, as apple is just failing worse.
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Microsoft is only shooting itself in the foot while its opponents over at apple have somehow lodged their guns into their own rectums. Its not so much that microsoft is winning the battle, as apple is just failing worse.
Oh, are they now [slashdot.org]?
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Indeed.
Yeah right (Score:4, Informative)
All my friends have ditched Windows 10 and gone to MacOS.
Several have lost work due to updates and reboots. These aren't IT people.
The spying and constant messing around with the system were enough for them.
OSX/MacOS isn't perfect but for them it is a whole lot better for average users than W10.
Re:Yeah right (Score:4, Interesting)
When Chrome starts running Android Apps, Microsoft will be dead, except for platform specific products, at which case, most of those could probably be wound up in a custom appliance. I'm simply surprised why anyone would need to build on top of Windows any longer.
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The same apps that I see complaints all over the web about not being "tablet ready" are going to do this? do tell.
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When Chrome starts running Android Apps, Microsoft will be dead
Which OS will the majority of developers be using to develop these Android apps, particularly if they're not ports of iOS apps?
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All my friends have ditched Windows 10 and gone to MacOS. Several have lost work due to updates and reboots. These aren't IT people. The spying and constant messing around with the system were enough for them. OSX/MacOS isn't perfect but for them it is a whole lot better for average users than W10.
Yep.
Is Apple even trying anymore? (Score:5, Interesting)
...Windows PCs are starting to chip away at Apple's strong grip of the high-end computer market...
From my viewpoint, it looks as if Apple has abandoned the high-end computer market. The product line has been stagnating.
.
Of course, leave it to Microsoft to declare itself winning over a competitor that has all but abandoned the particular marketspace.
Re:Is Apple even trying anymore? (Score:5, Interesting)
My brother makes motion graphics for various tv/web advertising firms - he said one trend that Apple totally dropped the ball on was using devices like the Surface Pro to paint and draw with using Adobe Photoshop (which Adobe worked with Microsoft directly on).
He told me there were people in his circle who decided that the capability was worth the price of the entire device.
So yes the high end exists, and yes it still depends on the killer app ;) - and yes in this one case Microsoft (working with Adobe) nailed it.
One of the reason's you won't see this sort of thing happening on iOS/iPad anytime soon is they still really don't have the computational power or - more specifically the memory requirements to manipulate or work with large print images, video and animations - something that big desktops and laptops are still king at.
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From my viewpoint, it looks as if Apple has abandoned the high-end computer market. The product line has been stagnating.
Which is really, really strange. I could see Apple execs having problems justifying a lower-end product line, since the margins are trickier and they have to be careful not to tarnish their own image, but for higher end stuff easily they could stuff high end parts in an Apple chassis, charge 20% more than the PC equivalent and call it a day.
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Missing 'Pro' features (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Missing 'Pro' features (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Missing 'Pro' features (Score:4, Insightful)
Couldn't agree more, with the addition of built in ethernet for network admins. Thinness means nothing if I've got to carry around a bag full of dongles. And 'Pro' means user upgradeable/repairable components, at least memory and HD. Dropping magsafe was a huge mistake, they could still allow charging thru USB C/thunderbolt.
For a desktop, bring back the cheese grater tower, with current spec ports and SATA 3, perhaps M2/PCI for SSD connectivity.
They have the sexiest designs, but seem to have forgotten that form follows function. Having no user serviceable/upgradable parts on entry level machines is fine if really necessary and helps lower the price point, as 99% of consumer level users never crack the case, but Pro's should have upgrade options besides thunderbolt.
No... no it's not. (Score:2, Insightful)
Sorry but uptake of Win10 is still dismal. even with giving it away for free.
If you count the latest macbook? yes, as it's more of a netbook.
Microsoft needs to fire all it's marketing department and executives and get some people in there that have a clue. They botched a lot of the 10 rollout that made people distrust them more.... They need to desperately change that and the only way is to clean house at the top.
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You misspelled "it's not really free if you already need a recent Windows license".
I suppose (Score:5, Funny)
If your enemy shoots themselves in the foot, that doesn't mean your aim has improved. Microsoft products still suck; they just suck a lot less relative to how much worse Apple products have become.
It may well be... (Score:5, Insightful)
It may well be, but it's not because of anything Microsoft is doing.
Virtually every professional I know have all but given up on Apple thanks to the idiocy they've been pulling in recent years. At this point, it is so beyond glaringly obvious that they're now just taking the piss out of their customer base, that people no longer feel that that apple tax is worth it.
I just priced out a 13" MBP for myself. The MINIMUM viable product for my use is almost $3000. And this is minimum viable for my CURRENT needs, never mind what I might need a couple years from now. And of course, Apple forces me to plan ahead cause they solder everything onto the main board with no option for future upgrades. And this price doesn't count the bajillion dongles I'll have to buy (since the bajillion I already own are now useless), nor apple care.
The part that pisses me off the most is that they are very obviously gimping their lower priced products to force people to buy the more expensive stuff. For example, the base 13" MBP with a memory and storage bump would have been good enough for me.... EXCEPT IT ONLY HAS TWO TB3 PORTS AND ONE GETS USED FOR POWER. So you have literally ONE whole port to do *everything*.
And as of right now, there is literally NOT ONE single TB3 port replicator or hub available on the market to purchase (Yes, I've looked. Even OWC won't be available for at least a couple months from now at the soonest), so my options are to cobble together some ridiculous spaghetti mess of dongles, USB hubs and other nonsense just so I can use an external monitor and ethernet at the same time, or I spend the extra $700 to get their highest end model that graciously allows me to upgrade both ram and storage, AND has 4 TB-3 ports to use. (Their mid-range specifically does NOT give you the option to upgrade storage. You can have any size you want as long as it 256GB)
The currently generation of macbooks are flat out inexcusable.
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If that helps make the base MBP work for you though, then perhaps that will alleviate your overall issue though.
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Thank you. I hadn't seen that particular model. However, I'll point out that it's only available for pre-order, so it too isn't shipping yet.
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One thing that has characterized Apple as a business over the decades is that it doesn't stay in businesses where it can't charge a premium for design qualities that other companies can't match. It has no interest in engaging in price competition with other companies providing similar products.
This drives a mania for novelty and differentiation which is great when it works out, but it also means you can't count on Apple in the long term. They're like a boxer with a massive punch and a glass jaw.
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I just priced out a 13" MBP for myself. The MINIMUM viable product for my use is almost $3000. And this is minimum viable for my CURRENT needs, never mind what I might need a couple years from now. And of course, Apple forces me to plan ahead cause they solder everything onto the main board with no option for future upgrades
This is hardly new behavior out of Apple. Every product of theirs since Woz quit designing them has been unupgradable, and overly expensive for what you get. With a 35 year track-record like that, why would anyone ever expect anything else from them?
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That's not entirely true. During the golden 2000's, basically when Steve Jobs came back, they started putting out machines that you could actually do something with. They switched to intel. They started using standardized PC parts. And strangely enough, this is why Apple's sales started ballooning.
At home I currently have a 2011 macbook pro where I was able to upgrade the ram to 16GB. I replaced the hard drive with a 1TB SSD. With the exception of the battery now being borderline unusable, the machine
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Agreed. They care more about making it thinner than giving people a product that is actually meaningful to them.
I'm in the same boat. At home I have a 2011 MBP that you can pry from my cold dead hands. The last model to have a built in ethernet port, and nearly the last that let me upgrade the ram and HD myself. I boosted it up to 16GB and added a 1TB SSD, and it's still doing well as long as I don't try to play 2016 AAA games.
The only reason I'm looking for a new MBP now is cause my current work machin
Apples hardware sucks! HP Z marketing is right! (Score:4, Interesting)
Apples hardware sucks! HP Z marketing is right!
http://www8.hp.com/us/en/campa... [hp.com]
This is where desktops / workstations are not going away anytime soon.
Also apple does not have anything the works good in server room other then running mac os in VM on non apple hardware that works but the license does not let you do that.
Weighing Options (Score:4, Interesting)
Work just provided me with a new laptop. It was my choice and I selected a new MBP 15 inch. My reasons are longevity - my last MBP, which I own, lasted more than 4 years, and I am still using it. OSX is an excellent operating system. I sometimes go months without rebooting and I use the machine 8+ hours each day. I can also run Windows on my MBP. I prefer VMWare Fusion for my virtual machines but Parallels is fine too.
Had I selected a Windows laptop, I would have only a Windows laptop. Having the MBP allows me to test and develop against both platforms. It also provides me with a way to run the less expensive versions of any commercial software, should there be a difference in cost.
So, while Windows licensing sales may be up, there is no way to know where those OS's are running. Heck, it could be that folks are buying licenses to run on their Macs.
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Work just provided me with a new laptop. It was my choice and I selected a new MBP 15 inch. My reasons are longevity - my last MBP, which I own, lasted more than 4 years, and I am still using it. OSX is an excellent operating system. I sometimes go months without rebooting and I use the machine 8+ hours each day. I can also run Windows on my MBP. I prefer VMWare Fusion for my virtual machines but Parallels is fine too. Had I selected a Windows laptop, I would have only a Windows laptop. Having the MBP allows me to test and develop against both platforms. It also provides me with a way to run the less expensive versions of any commercial software, should there be a difference in cost. So, while Windows licensing sales may be up, there is no way to know where those OS's are running. Heck, it could be that folks are buying licenses to run on their Macs.
Exactly.
Now watch as you get Punish-Modded down into the dirt by the Apple-Haters.
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soldered storage is an no go for pro work.! (Score:2)
soldered storage is an no go for pro work.!
I might jump to the next Surface (Score:2)
It's gotten good; the pencil on the iPad Pro is something I've waited a very long time for, if Microsoft can get it's performance close I'll probably go. I need a real computer and iOS is horribly handicapped (no xcode). The surface has a real keyboard, the iPad pro is a silicone joke.
OS wise,it matters less than it used to; I don't care, and I always have to have a windows machine for any type of 3D work,modelling, or VR.
This is how the system is supposed to work.. competition.
Here's hoping Apple gets it t
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It's gotten good; the pencil on the iPad Pro is something I've waited a very long time for, if Microsoft can get it's performance close I'll probably go. I need a real computer and iOS is horribly handicapped (no xcode). The surface has a real keyboard, the iPad pro is a silicone joke.
OS wise,it matters less than it used to; I don't care, and I always have to have a windows machine for any type of 3D work,modelling, or VR.
This is how the system is supposed to work.. competition.
Here's hoping Apple gets it together. I love my phone, but it seems Apple is now a phone company and not a computer company. They don't have a single computer that can even pretend to run a virtual reality setup.
Dumb. Apple the Phone Company. That's what has happened. Sad.
Bullshit [slashdot.org].
Stacking up the wins (Score:2)
They're also stomping the shit out of Amiga.
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One crucial difference (Score:2)
Apple being retarded != MS superiority (Score:2)
Apple's biggest issues IMHO....
1.) Assuming pro users would buy a souped-up Macbook Air with no ability to upgrade RAM or storage.
2.) Assuming pro users will only want pen and touch support in a locked-down consumer appliance that's not suited for content creation. We want a Macbook tablet/2-in-1.... preferably with SO-DIMM slots and replaceable SSD. The iOS and Mac teams should not worry about "competing" with each other.
3.) Assuming pro users are OK with dated CPU and weaker GPU's compared to cheaper Wi
Win by playing until nobody else cares (Score:2)
Yeah, but the PC market is shrinking, and Apple doesn't even get most of their own revenue from it anymore.
I'm picturing a jock finally getting his last opponent out after the most epic dodgeball game ever, not noticing the guy wasn't even really trying. He proceeds to go through the elaborate victory celebration, complete with rehearsed descriptions of how awesome he is, and what losers everyone else is, only to turn around and realize everyone else has already gone on to Algebra next class. He sucks at
Can't even find Refurbs anymore (Score:4, Informative)
As another datapoint to how badly Apple is pissing people off... I periodically look at the refurb lists that Apple offers. For the first time ever, almost their entire stock of refurbs is gone. Literally nothing left except for a couple of base model 11" Airs.
It isn't rocket science when people preferentially buy last years refurbs to "superior" current gen products, to conclude that the current gen products are crap.
Apple forgetting what good design is (Score:2)
Don't forget about removing the key on laptops to delete the character in front of the cursor. (you have to press 2 keys to do this super common function)
Don't forget about removing older style USB ports from their "pro" laptop that are almost in ubiquitous use.
Don't forget about how IOS and OS X still for some bizarre reason don't cooperate especially well and they don't provide a cable for their smartphone to plug into their "pro" laptop out of the box.
Apple seems to have forgotten that good design is ab
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Either that, or it's product placement. You reckon Apple might have a few bucks to throw at marketing?
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How well does Numbers run complex macros, such as the validation macros in the spreadsheets that Amazon Seller Central encourages sellers to use? And what instead of Microsoft Access to run commercial off the shelf VBA apps?