Tesla Model 3 Test Drive: Car Has Bite and Simple Interior (wsj.com) 192
An anonymous reader shares a WSJ article: A first peek inside Tesla's new Model 3 compact car revealed a starker, cozier interior than the more spacious and luxurious Model S. But as the sedan sped off, the experience felt similar. On Friday, the Silicon Valley auto maker showed off details of the all-electric sedan's interior for the first time (Editor's note: the link could be paywalled; alternative source), allowing brief test rides with a roughly 10-minute spin around the factory. The Model 3 represents a milestone for Chief Executive Elon Musk, who has long wanted to create an electric car for the masses. He's betting the new vehicle can help fuel massive growth for his 14-year-old company, projecting Tesla will produce a half-million cars next year, after delivering about 76,000 Model S sedans and Model X sport-utility vehicles last year. The Model 3's exterior was revealed in March last year, but details about the interior have been scarce. The $35,000 sedan is noticeably bare bones inside -- gone are the displays and instrument panel behind the steering wheel and the numerous switches and buttons found in the cockpit of traditional cars. Instead, the Model 3 makes greater use of a video screen in the center dash that controls most of the car's functions.
Model 3 is a complete styling miss (Score:2)
The front fascia's lack of anything resembling a grille opening makes the whole thing look like a cheap plastic Chinese R/C car.
That dashboard looks like it was stolen from a 80s-era concept car and Elon velcro'd a giant iPad to it, made more starkly out of place by the complete lack of gauge cluster.
Re:Model 3 is a complete styling miss (Score:5, Interesting)
Why would you have a grille opening in a car that doesn't need an air intake? Besides, these wannabe-mouths are usually ugly. I miss the 80ies, back then they tried to hide these for aerodynamic reasons.
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Why would you have a grille opening in a car that doesn't need an air intake?
That black area underneath where the grille opening would be looks like an air intake.
Either way, the front looks ugly. For a minimalist design, it has unnecessary curves.
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Why would you have a grille opening in a car that doesn't need an air intake?
Looks like a front spoiler to me. Personally I like the styling, and that's just it. It's a personal thing. Otherwise there wouldn't be different styling options on the market from different companies.
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I can't find really good close up photos, but the black grid pattern suggests an air intake rather than a spoiler.
https://www.indiacarnews.com/w... [indiacarnews.com]
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You can't say any of the curves are unnecessary, since you haven't taken it through a wind tunnel. (Real or virtual). Tesla have, and lowering the air resistance is a high priority.
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As long as it's at least 0F, just go without heat. You can simply wear more clothes to keep you warm.
In Minnesnowta-like conditions, however, I'd say it's a bad idea. At those temperatures you'll get frostbite sitting for long without heat.
But the battery range problem is a big one: batteries typically have much poorer output in very cold weather. But these EVs are supposed to have battery heaters to help with that (of course, that takes more power...).
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Speed has more of an influence than temperature. Low temperature may cut your range ~20% on a Model 3, but you can increase or decrease it by 3x by changing how fast you drive.
Also, worth mentioning: you can preheat an EV (with the app) on mains power.
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Indeed. A quarter of Norway's new vehicle sales are EVs.
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No, they aren't. Skinny wheels are what's best in the snow, regardless of diameter. Skinny wheels means a smaller contact patch and more pressure. Wide tires float on the snow.
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That's regardless of the width of the wheels. Skinny wheels have better traction in snow than wide ones.
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The radiators on Tesla vehicles are located on the front, using air ducted underneath the vehicle. They're most active when the vehicle is stationary: when supercharging. Tesla uses a somewhat complex but very efficient system for balancing the varying heating and cooling needs between different parts of the vehicle. Heat can be shunted into or out of the battery pack, motor/inverter heat is captured, heat can be shunted into or out of the cabin, etc.
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I miss the 80ies, back then they tried to hide these for aerodynamic reasons.
Were you in an alternate universe then? The 80s cars in my universe were ugly boxes, with grills. It was the 90s when they tried to hide them.
They've brought them back because the highly-sloped hoods were horrible for pedestrian safety: when you hit a person, they'd bounce up onto (or through) the windshield. Somehow, modern grills are safer (probably are made of somewhat easily-crushed plastic) and don't scoop up pedestrians th
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LOL US drivers still addicted to grilles. Why not buy a Rolls Royce then?
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Before looking at TF Pictures I thought you were just trolling. I assumed it was just an issue of adjusting to elimination of a number of stupid automobile conventions and aesthetics would adjust.
Now I don't.
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I also think the front is a styling miss (but not the rest of the car). My misgivings go the other way though:
I think the front still looks too much like that of a car with a grille opening. If you don't need a grille, why cling to the traditional form instead of making it even more sleek?
The front area of the General Motors EV 1 does look better IMHO.
If you still need a small air inlet, it could go left and right of the license plate. Imagine something like the GM Impact, with the two central air inlets
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I also think the front is a styling miss
Yep it looks dated already. Reminds me of an mix between and old 90's Ford Laser and an early 2000's Mazda 3
https://upload.wikimedia.org/w... [wikimedia.org]
http://carphotos.cardomain.com... [cardomain.com]
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No doubt you would have complained about the first cats that didn't have chrome bumpers (fenders).
Form follows function. EVs don't need grills. You can expect that no car in the future will have a grill. And that doesn't mean they'll be less attractive. It just means you are conservative in your taste. Your idea or what looks good is something that looks not very different from what you've seen before.
Re: Model 3 is a complete styling miss (Score:2)
Re:Model 3 is a complete styling miss (Score:4, Funny)
Lol, it's you! I was wondering what sort of idiot must be out there (but which I had never encountered before) who automakers were catering to when putting fake grilles on cars that didn't need them.
Interior design still terrible (Score:3, Insightful)
The interior designer they poached from Volvo clearly hasn't had time to improve anything yet. Since he was only hired 6 months ago, this design pre-dates him, and you can tell. It's terrible.
All the display is to the side - so you have to look sidways and down to find out anything about the vehicle, even its speed. That means you are not looking at the road for longer.
The display is high gloss - so you have to look through reflections and highlights to read the screen, it is not shaded from outside light at all. That means you are not looking at the road for longer and get more eyestrain.
Trying to adjust any functions of the car without tactile feedback means you have to not only look to find what to press, but look to confirm the action happened correctly - so you spend longer looking at the controls and less at the road.
It looks like an ergonomic failure and an unpleasant car to drive which reduces safety by increasing driver distraction.
I don't even know if the seats are any good; the Model S seats certainly aren't.
Then there is "unlock via app". So, what happens if your phone and the car are not online to the Internet? The Model S app-unlock is via the Internet, not any short range connection like Bluetooth. Let alone if your phone gets r00ted and the app key is stolen. There's a backup physical key - but if I have to remember to carry the physical key all the time what is the point of app-unlock anyway? They might as well implement having a key you have to have near the car for more reliable unlocking and better security - like every other car manufacturer. This is just more Internet of Shit Things (that spy on you).
Re:Interior design still terrible (Score:5, Interesting)
The interior is well designed, spacious like a Japanese car and with lots of storage spaces. The videos people are posting show it's well made, better than the S and X. It's clean and simple, easy to maintain and attractive.
The display is a daylight readable anti-reflection coated. The screens in the S and X don't have issues with readability.
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The only thing it really lacks is the speedo in front of the driver. Other cars are similar, like the Mini with the speedo in the centre. With an EV you get much less feedback about your speed though, due to having no engine noise or big variation in torque as you move up and down the gear ranges. The design of the Leaf speedo is brilliant in that respect.
Re:Interior design still terrible (Score:4, Interesting)
It's at steering wheel height, even slightly higher than a typical console sits, so it's probably not that bad. The center gauge layout isn't unique... the Nissan X-Trail (and probably some other models) used to have that layout and you do get used to it rather quickly.
The bigger concern I'd have is that screen is freaking busy with a lot of small details... Unless that's just a secondary mode and the real driving screen is more like a typical gauge layout I have a feeling the eye will linger on it a lot longer than is safe.
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That too. There's little contrast in the relevant commands.
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Every time I see people agitating for only voice control, I wonder if they have ever tried it in anything other than perfect conditions.
Hey guys stop talking so I can change the temperature.
Sorry guys, stop talking again I want to change the radio station.
Oh, sorry, everyone stop again so $passenger can change the seat settings.
"Hey $car, what's our speed" is so much more ... useful than glancing at a dial or digital readout. Speaking at the car is so much better and faster than twisting a volume knob.
Can't
No dashboard (Score:2)
I'm pretty blind on my right eye. If this thing doesn't have heads up display, finding out my current speed would probably be less than ideal for safety.
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I'm not blind in that eye, but there's a damned good reason why important gauges are put right in front of the driver...
Re:No dashboard (Score:4, Insightful)
I'm not blind in that eye, but there's a damned good reason why important gauges are put right in front of the driver...
It's a car for people who hate driving. You can tell whether a car is for people who like driving by where they put the tachometer. If it's centered in the cluster, it's a driver's car. If it's off center, but still behind the wheel, it's a sporty car. If it's smaller than the speedometer, it's probably a diesel pickup. If it's hard to find, it's irrelevant. And if it's missing, then the car was designed for your grandmother. Of course, EVs don't really need tachos, do they? But they should have one anyway.
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It's a car for people who want to take as little part in the driving as possible. It's designed as a car that drives itself most of the time. Even though the Tesla autonomy is not up to delivering on that yet.
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A tacho wouldn't really make sense on an EV. It would just show a linear increase with speed, as most just have a fixed reduction gear. Effectively it's a speedo with a different scale.
Maybe the closest equivalent in an EV is the power meter.
Re:No dashboard (Score:4, Informative)
Of course, EVs don't really need tachos, do they? But they should have one anyway.
A tachometer doesn't make any sense on an EV. But the equivalent, a kW meter, does. I rather like having one on my Model S. (I also like having a gauge cluster right behind the steering wheel, and the center screen being in an enclosed mount. Worried that the "detached" screen on the Model 3 is going to break too easily.)
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There will be a new kind of enthusiast driver for electric cars, eventually. It's weird, when gas cars were new and primitive, enthusiasts and "modders" were most of the market, but electric cars as a whole do nothing for drivers yet. They're for an odd sort of tech enthusiast who doesn't want to tinker - perhaps "geek posers"? Well, it's a sizable market, whatever it is.
Cars with the tach front and center, but an automatic transmission are the most humorous, of course. We'll never see the end of "sedan
Re: No dashboard (Score:2)
Yes, tradition. When you look down, your eyes need to refocus to a radically different distance than basically infinity. It takes time for that to occur. It then takes time to shift back.
Moving the cluster to the middle reduces that shift, making it faster. It also puts more of the road into your peripheral vision.
Now whether it actually makes enough of a difference is debatable, but that's the theory behind it.
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Moving the cluster to the middle reduces that shift, making it faster. It also puts more of the road into your peripheral vision.
When it's in the center, I keep my eyes on the road, and my peripheral vision tells me if the speedometer dial is approximately where it should be.
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Minis have always had their speedo in the centre of the car. It's never harmed their sales.
http://www.seriouswheels.com/p... [seriouswheels.com]
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It's still crap. And you can't compare the contrast in both displays.
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I've seen many videos of people driving Model S and Model X cars. And never once has the screen been unreadable, no matter what the light conditions or direction of the sun. Nor have I heard any owners complain about it.
It's almost as if Tesla knew the panel was going to be installed in a car and specced it appropriately and adjust brightness on the fly as required.
But hey, you go on coming up with the first objecti0on that enters your head, regardless of whether it's an actual problem with Tesla cars or no
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Yes, I'm only a guy with human factors engineering experience. So please ignore my comments.
And the best part (Score:2)
So this is the best part of the Model 3, a car that costs at least $35.000? Are you kidding me?
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There is. A credit card like device.
Touchscreens!!! (Score:2)
Everything operated by the touchscreen is the #1 reason why I hate Tesla and will never buy one. From a usability perspective, it's the dumbest possible thing you can do and the very definition of everything wrong with getting Silicon Valley to design anything.
I sat in a Model S, and I thought just that was a disaster. Operating anything other than the wheel and pedals is ridiculous. I was hoping the Model 3 would have a more traditional interior because the vehicle was designed to be a bit more mainstre
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Does anyone else find it ironic that the most popular car on Slashdot is also the most difficult to hot rod?
It really is the Apple of automobiles.
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I'm not surprised that the most high tech, all electric, legacy free car is the most popular on a tech news site.
Re:Cancelling order (Score:4, Insightful)
Does anyone else find it ironic that the most popular car on Slashdot is also the most difficult to hot rod?
Not at all. Many people even engineers and tinkered sometimes just prefer something well made that does not need to be touched or modified.
Mind you there are plenty of people hacking at Telsas. It's just a different skill set.
Re:Cancelling order (Score:4, Insightful)
> created by a nerd
Elon Musk is a cult leader like Steve Jobs, not a nerd. Please turn over your geek card.
Stick yours up your ass & light it on fire.
Musk programmed & sold a video game when he was 12 & has a B. Sc. degree in Physics. Jobs needed Wozniak to build him a circuit board that could play Pong so he could get a job at Atari.
Re: Cancelling order (Score:2)
What The Actual Fuck (Score:2, Insightful)
This interior is a joke, right? Right??? Am I looking at a fucking iPad glued to an almost empty dashboard? WHAT? NO INSTRUMENT CLUSTER? IS THIS A FEVER DREAM?
Do they not have a human factors engineering dept? Or did they hire all millennial Google rejects to fill their staff?
This thing looks like a fucking engineering disaster in the making. People are going to die from distracted driving staring at this tablet in the center of the dash. Do people not realize that the Fords & GMs of the world spend $$
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This thing looks like a fucking engineering disaster in the making. People are going to die from distracted driving staring at this tablet in the center of the dash.
I agree. Having to look to the side to see your speed or a warning seems like an unnecessary heightened risk.
"Keep your eyes on the road and your hands upon the wheel."
-- The Doors
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Toyota have had speedometers in the center for years now. It's no different than them.
There's a reason the GT86 is better than other Toy (Score:2)
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In a modern car you're less concerned with speedometer speed. It used to be that you had to constantly adjust your driving to stay under the limit. Now there's either adaptive cruise control, where you set the speed limit for the road, and then you don't care again.Or there's autonomous capability that knows the speed limit via the navigation system and/or computer recognition of a speed limit sign you passed.
OK, none of this stuff is perfect yet, and there are times when you need to consult the speedo. Bu
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Oh BS. My car has radar adaptive cruise control. It's really nice on flat freeways and some other places, but you aren't always driving on those. When you're not using it, you still need to see the speed to avoid a speeding ticket.
I also don't use my ACC when I'm on rolling hills like we have here in VA: it wastes gas because it'll mash the gas going uphill and slow down when going downhill; it's better for me to speed up on the downhill slopes a bit so I let it coast a bit going uphill. The interstates
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Gas? How quaint. With EVs those slowdowns on the downslopes regenerate, so there's not much in it. And provided you have the range, the electricity itself is cheap.
The places where you can't let the car either drive itself or at least control the speed are shrinking.
Personally, I have my ACC on the vast majority of the time. Just flicking the speed limit up or down when the limit changes.
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Yes, gas, quaint... it only powers 99.9% of all the cars in the world and will continue to so for a very long time...
But don't let facts and logic get in your way...
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Well not so long. Governments are already setting the dates when Gas powered cars will no longer be allowed to be sold.
Norway and Netherlands, 2025. India 2030. UK 2040.
And the fact that governments are going to be banning sales in the coming years, means that no car company is going to spend any time creating new ICE designs. They're going to be finishing some existing developments, but pretty much all new car developments will be EVs.
ICE vehicles are on their way out I'm very happy to say.
Those are the fa
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You suck at math and politics... really, not joking...
Those dates mean nothing, learn how politics works. Then learn math on how many cars exit in the world and how many are made each year.
Try again sunshine...
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Well that was a contentless answer.
Nothing wrong with my maths or political knowledge, sunshine.
Those dates mean everything. No car manufacturer is going to design a car that increasingly will be banned in various countries. The early year of 2025 is only 8 years away. Car manufacturers want a longer life than that for a new car design. They'll do the odd quick makeover on existing designs, but there will be pretty much no new ICE cars designed now.
What you are going to see is similar to what happened to CR
Re: What The Actual Fuck (Score:2)
Actually, while it may feel weird at first, it's actually safer. Putting the cluster in the middle puts it further away from you, which means you don't need to refocus your eyes as much. Thus, it's faster to look down, and faster to return your eyes to the road. We're talking about fractions of a second here, but it is measurable in the lab.
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Actually, while it may feel weird at first, it's actually safer. Putting the cluster in the middle puts it further away from you, which means you don't need to refocus your eyes as much. Thus, it's faster to look down, and faster to return your eyes to the road. We're talking about fractions of a second here, but it is measurable in the lab.
Wasn't there a study a few years ago that showed that looking to the side caused people to steer that way too? Which was the rationale for car manufacturers putting much of the center console functionality on the steering wheel instead.
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Perhaps it's not a big deal. There's no engine speed, assorted temperatures and turbo pressures to go on gauges, so maybe it's fine to just have navigation taking most of the big screen, with a speed reading somewhere. Maybe even a HUD for speed and warning icons would be nice, but between voice warnings and a large font speed reading right in the centre of the screen, it probably is unnecessary.
Everything else is really not for eye-level dashboard. Climate control should be automated, entertainment should
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$20 LCDs dont grow on trees you know.
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This thing looks like a fucking engineering disaster in the making.
Small correction: this could be an engineering masterpiece for all we know, it's a human factors and design disaster in the making.
Engineers aren't the ones who come up with the idea of eliminating tactile controls and having everything on a stupid touchscreen. They just implement what the designers tell them to.
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It's still a bad idea. If they wanted to remove the screen they should have added a HUD.
I want to know the speed, battery reserves, consumption, which lights are turned on, and which of the doors are open without spraining my neck.
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I have spinal cord injury in my neck, from a car accident actually, whiplash. So no I can't turn my head easily and prefer to avoid it if possible.
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Which you have to use only when you change directions! Which is not something you need to do nearly quite as often! You also typically have a center mirror. Ever wondered why that is located there? Fucking Tesla sycophants. You're getting to be as bad as Apple fanatics.
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In Tesla's ideal world, they'll soon be offering fully autonomous driving, and people will want that full screen for watching movies and the like while the car drives itself.
Honestly, I think they're too optimistic on fully autonomous driving, but hey, I've got no complaints about getting a large screen :)
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That means you know fuck all about EVs. There are no EVs with this range for $17K.
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No, that is indeed true... and the problem, gas cars are cheaper to buy and cheaper to run for the first 3-5 years which is all new car buyers care about.
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But they are getting cheaper. The trend is for price parity in 2020. From then on EVs are cheaper.
Meanwhile, EVs are close enough in price that people that prefer them will pay extra to get one.
But really saying that the Model 3 ought to be $17K when at $35K they have a 2 year waiting list of people that all paid a deposit. It's moronic.
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It isn't moronic... it is logic, but which do you know about that?
Remind me how many TOTAL cars Tesla has EVER sold? Ford sells that in a month...
A 2 year waiting list isn't hard when you are such a small company and can't make very many cars...
As for the price dropping, anything is possible, but that is highly unlikely, it would stomp all over the Model 3... but then I did say that the price was the primary problem, if they indeed get a Model 3 down to $17K (or even $20K) in 3 years, then fair enough, t
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Not that hard? Show me another manufacturer that makes thousands of cars per month and has a 2 year waiting list of people that have paid deposits.
Of course Ford are bigger. But Ford isn't growing like Tesla. There was a time when IBM was bigger than Microsoft and Apple. Things change. And it's obvious to anyone that's paying attention than things are changing big time in the car industry.
Again your price target of $17,000 for a car like the Model 3 is moronic. The Model 3 will continue to sell like hot cak
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If you buy a Tesla 3, you are kinda making a bet that Tesla will be providing Level 4 autonomous capabilities very soon. Musk is claiming you will be sleeping in the driver seat by the end of 2019. I don't have much confidence in that figure but it doesn't sound outlandish. By that time the dashboard screen is just for watching the morning news on the way to work.
If you don't believe Level 4 autonomy is coming any time soon, then the design decisions behind the Tesla 3 are certainly less than ideal.
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It's plain bullshit. I'll give you one example. I live close to a major city an it has a one-way street, recently changed, which Google Maps claims is a two-way street for at least two months. Autonomize that.
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Almost like you'd want the car to be able to read signs...wonder if anyone is working on putting cameras in cars that can recognize signs. Maybe someone will get on that.
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Then the sign is dirty, or covered by snow/ice/graffiti, or just knocked down... or placed wrong...
Self-driving will happen soon, but not completely self-driving... you'll still have to pay attention and it will only work in 80-90% of places, the last 10-20% is where major changes to the roads, construction areas, etc. will have to happen.
Those can all happen, and probably will, but not in the useful life of this car...
Re: Ugly Dashboard (Score:2)
Re: Ugly Dashboard (Score:2)
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Fusions don't sell for anything close to MSRP, Tessa has to due to a lack of dealer network.
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Unlimited technology from the whole universe, and you cruise 'round in a Ford P.O.S.
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Says the person who hasn't driven one recently... Your loss, but they really are nice cars now...
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Yeah, I have actually, my aunt happens to own a Ford Fusion. Hers is a 2015, and my Camry is 2013. I got my car the same year she got hers (I paid $10k cash for mine, salvaged.) Hers drives ok from my experience, but it's already having transmission problems. The only problem mine technically had was the result of its previous owner being involved in a wreck that damaged the front right wheel well, which was easily fixed, but that wasn't inherent in its build quality at all.
Every mechanic I know (and there
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Go on then. Show us a deal where you can get a new Ford Fusion for $17,000.
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Note: If you doubt the $17K price, you haven't driven a Ford Fusion lately. What they sell for $17K is impressive.
Based on the price you gave I assume you mean the Ford Focus, and Tesla is clearly targeting a more fun to drive car than a Focus. The Focus RS compares favorably to the Tesla, but it is a $37k car ($55k if you add the extra cost in fuel vs electricity between it and the Tesla).
It is very possible Tesla will eventually create a 9s 0-60 car which is closer to $20k, but that if probably a decade from now.
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No, the Fusion... an overlooked gem of a car. You can usually find mid level trim Fusions for $17k, or $250 a month on lease with nothing due at signing.
After buying gas, the Fusion is still cheaper to own.
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Well duh, they're cheap because they don't last for shit. If you want a decent car of that class, get a Toyota Camry; it's usually priced lower and you don't have to throw it away after 5 years.
BTW you sound just like car dealer. Honestly, fuck buying new cars, otherwise you're just throwing away lots of money, just like one does when they buy a Ford (except maybe Ford trucks.)
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Ahh, someone who has a badly outdated view of such things...
Toyota isn't what it once was, Ford isn't either... give Consumer Reports try, they talk about this in recent auto reviews, that the gap has closed and the old issues are largely gone...
Either way, the Model 3 is stupid over priced for $35K in terms of the actual car, putting aside the power plant. Its cost to own over 3-5 years is much higher than a similar gas car.
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Toyota isn't what it once was, Ford isn't either... give Consumer Reports try, they talk about this in recent auto reviews, that the gap has closed and the old issues are largely gone...
I'll just leave this here.
https://www.consumerreports.or... [consumerreports.org]
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Ah yes, I remember when they started shipping the $17k Ford Fusion standard with 7 cameras, radar and 12 ultrasound sensors to implement automatic crash avoidance, with an optional upgrade to self driving. I remember it like yesterday: I had just told the car to preheat using an app on my phone, put my bags into the frunk, and after staring through the panoramic glass roof, I peeled out with a 5,6 second 0-60 with instantaneous torque using energy that I could refill cleanly at miniscule cost using a batter
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Ahh yes, the features that turn it into a $55K car...
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Actually, all the features he mentioned are in the $35,000 base model.
You're not very informed are you.
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"How many hours until the phone app is hacked?
What about those of us who despise cell phones and don't own one?"
Those buy a Ford 150.
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Well, that was weird. I was reading the article about taxes, hit the post button, and it landed here. WTF, Slashdot?
It's been a problem for years now. Yay for buggy, unmaintained web "code".
Re: b*****s (Score:2)
You've never done time in the Q...